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Liang Lui
BuYao Corp
0
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Posted - 2015.04.01 00:40:59 -
[1] - Quote
Is there any way of making it more expensive for the high sec gankers?
Looking at all the fits that are coming through on kms, the t1 fit cata costs ~1.5m
That's the current cost of maximum output dps for isk in highsec. zero tank all deeps.
The common jab at miner's and high sec missioners is fitting full dmg/yield mods leaving no tank, and these deserve to die. This is a fair call. However on the more expensive hulls, the hull cost alone makes suicide ganking viable even if tank is fitted, possibly still profitable if enough of the T2 mods drop - we are not even going to think about faction fitting.
The gankers don't have such worries, single fit all purpose and cheap. catas/brutix depending on the job. brutix hulls has a bit of investment in it, so that's less disheartening.
the bloody cheap fit catas...
They do need numbers, but 10x1.5m fit catas can get you quite far in ganking. and that's 10 accounts not necessarily 10 people, not very hard to come by, especially if profits is ensured at no risk.
The cheap fit catas can easily mess up the brutixes!
Ganking is increasingly looking like a choice between make a tidy profit (shoot the tank fits), or super profits(shoot the yield fits or crazy 28billion freighters) + the tears of course, but tears are just bonus.
Suggestion:
- Concord to respond immediately in all empire
- Concord dmg starts low, and then rises exponentially, scales with security.
- Concord jamming should follow the old timers, rather than the immediate timers.
so that in the longer run, the CONCORD damage is about the same, but it can very quickly take out the zero tank fits.
This way, the gankers themselves needs to start thinking a bit more about their fits.
effectively lowering their dps and raising their cost on the cheapest end of the ganking ships. |
Paranoid Loyd
4445
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Posted - 2015.04.01 00:47:05 -
[2] - Quote
Liang Lui wrote:Is there any way of making it more expensive for the high sec gankers? Yes, it's achieved by using the right ship for the job, tanking it properly and not putting stupid amounts of cargo in it.
If 10 people are not hard to come by then gather a group of 10 miners and defend yourselves.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
9271
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Posted - 2015.04.01 00:57:42 -
[3] - Quote
Liang Lui wrote:
effectively lowering their dps and raising their cost on the cheapest end of the ganking ships.
ill take "what is a damage control?" for 500
Lords.Of.Midnight now recruiting
Steamy hot small gang action is waiting for you.
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
20896
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:02:53 -
[4] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Liang Lui wrote:
effectively lowering their dps and raising their cost on the cheapest end of the ganking ships.
ill take "what is a damage control?" for 500
This low slot module is commonly eschewed by pilots in favor of fitting a 'cargo extender' or 'mining laser upgrade'.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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admiral root
Red Galaxy
2586
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:02:59 -
[5] - Quote
Liang Lui wrote:Is there any way of making it more expensive for the high sec gankers?
Yes. You just need to corner the market on catalysts and small neutron blasters. Or you could just have posted "Please, CCP, one more nerf?".
No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff | No-one hates you, none of us care enough for that.
A recent survey of applicants to CODE. corporations showed that 100% accepted James 315 as their saviour. You can't argue with facts.
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Paranoid Loyd
4445
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:04:27 -
[6] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:ill take "what is a damage control?" for 500 He had one fit
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2768
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:06:14 -
[7] - Quote
Gankers are necessary for the profits of miners.
http://youtu.be/SnzzWGcdMqY
Roleplaying Trinkets for Explorers and Collectors
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admiral root
Red Galaxy
2587
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:09:33 -
[8] - Quote
I admire the brazen way the OP asked for Concord protection to be extended to lowsec, though.
No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff | No-one hates you, none of us care enough for that.
A recent survey of applicants to CODE. corporations showed that 100% accepted James 315 as their saviour. You can't argue with facts.
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
20899
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:14:22 -
[9] - Quote
admiral root wrote:I admire the brazen way the OP asked for Concord protection to be extended to lowsec, though.
Also notice how there is no effort required on behalf of the miner, or a complete lack of drawbacks for the one being defended.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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admiral root
Red Galaxy
2588
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:23:34 -
[10] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:admiral root wrote:I admire the brazen way the OP asked for Concord protection to be extended to lowsec, though. Also notice how there is no effort required on behalf of the miner, or a complete lack of drawbacks for the one being defended.
Dammit, Jim, I'm a newbie-protector, not a rational forum poster!
No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff | No-one hates you, none of us care enough for that.
A recent survey of applicants to CODE. corporations showed that 100% accepted James 315 as their saviour. You can't argue with facts.
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Arthur Aihaken
Narada
4261
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Posted - 2015.04.01 01:45:55 -
[11] - Quote
"I don't like miners. Too narrow-minded, no subtlety. And worse, they fight for hopeless causes. Honor? Huh! Honor's killed millions of miners, it hasn't saved a single one."
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
216
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Posted - 2015.04.01 02:56:35 -
[12] - Quote
-1 not liking a lot of the OP, but I do understand the reasons why these topics keep coming up.
Gankers are what they are.
Some are nice people that choose to show their less controlled side in a game and this is definitely not a bad thing.
Others are, well we will not go down that path as I think most of us have had an experience with that type of player, the ones that virtually all of us would agree the game is better off without.
In my mind the current state of ganking needs to be looked at by CCP in a serious way, look at how it affects ALL of the players and the game as a whole and then change those things they think need to be changed.
NO I am not calling for a nerf. NO I am not saying that a nerf is not needed. All I am saying is that it is time for CCP to look at this and make changes as they see fit nothing more and nothing less. And yes if CCP decides to make ganking easier then so be it, I will learn to deal with that as I have had to learn to deal with changes in the past.
Final thought. I am given cause to wonder as we often are about what they future holds for all of us. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
994
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Posted - 2015.04.01 03:03:10 -
[13] - Quote
you want to make ganking more expensive?
mine in procs, don't go afk, and don't mine solo
your drones do a lot of DPS the gankers will need more ships to kill one of you before concord comes and kills the rest of what you haven't
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3?
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Lienzo
Amanuensis
66
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Posted - 2015.04.01 03:05:56 -
[14] - Quote
For mining barges, I think it more a matter of where they are than how they are built. We need better belts, plain and simple. The ones we have aren't up to the task of contemporary engagement mechanics. It's all much too casual, and the logistics are too easy.
It would help to make the collision bubbles on ships a bit smaller. That would help in battles as well. I hate when I try to fly my frigate into a cluster of battleships or dreads and bounce all over the place like a pinball. That's where a frigate is supposed to be! It would also making aiming at a moving target much harder. Bumping has always demonstrated a poor representation of the principle of conservation of mass and conservation of kinetic energy. I have nothing to say about that which hasn't been said already more thoroughly by more learned persons elsewhere.
My DST is tanked to the gills with something ridiculous like 170k ehp and 500hp/s peak regen , however, it can still be burned down by a bumper and a couple of continually replaced gank ships, provided I don't have an escort of course, or perhaps even with if they are sufficiently numerous. I'm still trying to figure out how to phrase that request to any corp mate. Concord spawn in places like Niarja and Uedamage mainly seem to serve to decloak all those pesky industrials plaguing the region. In fact, I'd prefer it if my DST got nerfed. Or more specifically, that core defense field extender rigs or trimark rigs had appropriate stacking penalties. I'd actually think about using the active repper bonuses if that were the case. That would increase vulnerability to tornado fleets, but lessen it to solo actors.
I think I would like to see destroyer and battlecruiser sized industrial ships with similar EHP, build costs, and ship stats like mass and agility. Currently we have ships like the nereus or the wreathe which can be modestly tanked, although still only 1-3 catalysts worth of damage in 0.5 system. Then we have the iteron Vs and the mammoths which appear to have no other purpose other than to fool an inexperienced player into being a pinata for everyone else's amusement. I don't think there is any cargo cheap enough to justify not shooting one of these ships, whether fully loaded or fit with a tank that would be meagre by frigate standards. Perhaps NPC cargo mission loot.
Destroyer sized industrials could be nimble, moving quickly under cloak and carrying 1-2k m3 of loot. They could cost about what T1 indies cost today. Their ship model volumes could be somewhere between destroyer and cruiser sized. BC sized industrials could cost about what battlecruisers cost, could tank about as well as a battlecruiser, and have volumes similar to what we have on today's industrials, perhaps a smidge larger. Perhaps the ratios between them could be similar to those between jump freighters and freighters. This isn't too dissimilar from the current differentiation of blockade runners and deep space transports. |
Auduin Samson
Do not disturb Sanctuary Pact
319
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Posted - 2015.04.01 06:44:53 -
[15] - Quote
1. Mine in a proc
2. Don't fit stupidly expensive modules
3. Fit a proper tank
4. Don't be AFK
Follow these and you won't get ganked. That's all there is too it. If your ship isn't worth the effort to gank it, it won't be unless someone is really bored. This game is all about tradeoffs. You don't get to have the best mining rate and the best tank at the same time. Pick what is important to you and fit for that. The only times I've EVER been ganked is when I wasn't following those rules. |
Mag's
the united
19210
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Posted - 2015.04.01 06:59:21 -
[16] - Quote
Just one more nerf and it will be balanced.
Oh and reported.
**Destination SkillQueue:- **
It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
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Arthur Aihaken
Narada
4270
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Posted - 2015.04.01 07:12:35 -
[17] - Quote
"Tell you what I do like though: a ganker. A dyed-in-the-wool ganker. Cold-blooded, clean, methodical and thorough."
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
5105
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Posted - 2015.04.01 07:39:04 -
[18] - Quote
Quote:Forum rules17. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread. Closed.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
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