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Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
341
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Posted - 2015.04.07 12:09:20 -
[31] - Quote
Noriko its better off this way.
Sure if you don't have a PS4 then getting one would be a minor inconvenience (though not as much as getting any respectable PC rig honestly). But there is nothing stopping them from proper KB/M support other than priorities being ass backwards. It could play pretty much the same exact way, and with the added benefit of virtually no hacking as thats a lot more difficult on a console FPS.
This is probably the ideal scenario, all things considered.
The only real benefit of putting it on PC would be a higher-end graphical experience, and let's be serious here. CCP blueballs us on graphics all the time as it is because they are worried about the low end user being left behind. This would be no different. |
Aralyn Cormallen
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
987
|
Posted - 2015.04.07 12:20:53 -
[32] - Quote
Kalen Pavle wrote:Mizhir wrote:Gorongo Frostfyr wrote: I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden.
There is already a RTS version of EVE. It is called FCing. Except your units don't always follow orders.
I dunno, a pathing error causing a lone unit or two to blunder past the entire enemy base, and a couple of larger units getting wedged in a gap and causing a whole group of units to get stuck away from the fight is not too different to some of the more silly antics of inattentive fleet-members. And don't get me started about focus-firing.
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Noriko Mai
2131
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Posted - 2015.04.07 14:29:59 -
[33] - Quote
Kuronaga wrote:Noriko its better off this way.
Sure if you don't have a PS4 then getting one would be a minor inconvenience (though not as much as getting any respectable PC rig honestly). But there is nothing stopping them from proper KB/M support other than priorities being ass backwards. It could play pretty much the same exact way, and with the added benefit of virtually no hacking as thats a lot more difficult on a console FPS.
This is probably the ideal scenario, all things considered.
Controllers need autoaim to make the game (FPS) fun, because it's impossible to play on even slightly the same level as someone with KB/M. Dust hast KB/M support. But I won't buy a console for one game. I don't even have a freakin TV... You can buy a PC at lower cost as the ps4 and have better performace (see The Potato Masher). I don't play on my couch eating doritos. I freak the _fuck out if I buy a game, play multiplayer and then have to compete with money spend and not with skill. I don't play f2p because of microtransaction hell and constant assrape if you don't pay. It's just a totaly different audience. To each his own, I guess.
Kuronaga wrote: The only real benefit of putting it on PC would be a higher-end graphical experience, and let's be serious here. CCP blueballs us on graphics all the time as it is because they are worried about the low end user being left behind. This would be no different.
Graphics are important if they want to become the next BF/CoD clone that fails. Gameplay is important if they want to survive. And I just don't get it what is so hard go the way UT4 does or even cooperate with them to create a side project with EVE connection. That engine and ambitious vision connected to EVE planetary/station/whatever combat. Imagine fighting over your station just by jumping in your Soldier Clone. No need to rely on someone somewhere on a console with no actual connection to EVE. Fight in space, fight on ground, the choice is yours! You and your friends (EVE player or not doesn't matter) fight together for your _shit. How awesome would that be?!?!
Imagine the potential, imagine the possibilities... dream with me
"Meh.." - Albert Einstein
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Lux Jinks
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2015.04.07 16:45:53 -
[34] - Quote
I def do not understand why they didnt bother to put DUST on PC. i would have played the hell out of that game too.. but alas. |
MidnightWyvern
Night Theifs
84
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Posted - 2015.04.07 16:54:56 -
[35] - Quote
Kalen Pavle wrote:Mizhir wrote:Gorongo Frostfyr wrote: I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden.
There is already a RTS version of EVE. It is called FCing. Except your units don't always follow orders. Also Dust wouldn't have failed so horribly if they'd have just put it on PC. That would have been completely counter to the point of the project.
Also, myself and around 2500-3000 others (average PCU) are still playing the game. Right now I'm trying to organize all the streamers to broadcast the game during the Faction Warfare LP event going on from the 9th to the 16th, and myself and some friends will be streaming Dust while we also stream an Orbital Strike support fleet in EVE so you can see the interaction in real time.
So while the game is hardly what CCP wanted it to be, it's not quite dead yet. The life support is still going strong.
This is my thread, for refence: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=417264&find=unread
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s
An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
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DaReaper
Net 7
1907
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Posted - 2015.04.07 16:59:37 -
[36] - Quote
Lux Jinks wrote:
I def do not understand why they didnt bother to put DUST on PC. i would have played the hell out of that game too.. but alas.
because they say it as a chance to make more money and do soemthing no one else had done. and Reasons.
it doesn't matter, dust is now profitable, ccp will do whatever they want. Either play dust or don;t.
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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MidnightWyvern
Night Theifs
85
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Posted - 2015.04.07 17:08:48 -
[37] - Quote
DaReaper wrote:Lux Jinks wrote:
I def do not understand why they didnt bother to put DUST on PC. i would have played the hell out of that game too.. but alas.
because they say it as a chance to make more money and do soemthing no one else had done. and Reasons. it doesn't matter, dust is now profitable, ccp will do whatever they want. Either play dust or don;t. They wanted to bring a group of players into New Eden that would normally never be able to experience it, and if it weren't for the criminal level of mismanagement it suffered under the old Executive Producer CCP Jian - who no longer works for CCP Shanghai - it would have been far more of a success.
It was further hurt last year by the "Dust 514 Keynote" being an announcement of the game being dropped in favor of a PC title, which is all anyone who watched the stream could see because the Roundtables where topics such as character progress transfer were discussed were not streamed.
I watched many of the well-established Dust Corporations dissolve and vanish overnight. The one I was a part of, composed primarily of players of the old PS3 title M.A.G., was disbanded. My CEO sold all the Districts we owned and all the assets, paid each of us 300 million ISK, and then left the game.
In what seems like a rather cruel twist of fate, rather than some new game coming out and stealing Dust's thunder, it was CCP repeatedly trying to drive the nail into the coffin.
Now CCP Rattati is leading a very small team of developers and releasing regular fixes to the game, and it has actually been improving over the last few months. I recently got back into it and have been having quite a bit of fun.
CCP Hilmar's statement at the start of FanFest 2015 has instilled a sense of hope back into those of us who remain, and you can see it and hear it when you go on the forums or just hop into squads via the Squad Finder. That's part of why I want to organize the dual-stream I mentioned to show people that we're still here and we aren't leaving anytime soon.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s
An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
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Eve Solecist
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
743
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Posted - 2015.04.07 17:13:03 -
[38] - Quote
I don't play DUST (would love to but not worth the money) but I feel happy that the story evolved this way and you all can shoot eachother happily in the face.
With a smile ... ... while it explodes ... ... and brain spread around everywhere. :)
Well ... maybe. ^_^
*snickers xD*
This one is one of my better posts. You should see the others ....
"I've tried to give up making sexual innuendos. But it's hard, so hard." -RoAnnon
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Noriko Mai
2131
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Posted - 2015.04.07 17:20:33 -
[39] - Quote
Lux Jinks wrote: I def do not understand why they didnt bother to put DUST on PC. i would have played the hell out of that game too.. but alas. Back then they had a "EVE Everywehere" strategie. Trying to not touch the PC segment in fear of loosing EVE subs to thier new products. Then they realised it's bullshit and have the new "EVE United" strategie.
https://youtu.be/JKafw3dUT4Y?list=PLldrBIEnJ5hMIXwk_e8-VZb0EldJqXmg_&t=3579 This is actually a really interesting talk from Hilmar!
"Meh.." - Albert Einstein
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MidnightWyvern
Night Theifs
85
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Posted - 2015.04.07 17:24:33 -
[40] - Quote
Noriko Mai wrote:Lux Jinks wrote: I def do not understand why they didnt bother to put DUST on PC. i would have played the hell out of that game too.. but alas. Back then they had a "EVE Everywehere" strategie. Trying to not touch the PC segment in fear of loosing EVE subs to thier new products. Then they realised it's bullshit and have the new "EVE United" strategie. https://youtu.be/JKafw3dUT4Y?list=PLldrBIEnJ5hMIXwk_e8-VZb0EldJqXmg_&t=3579 However, you noticed there was no mention of that this year, and in fact that announcement was referred to as "premature", and part of why CCP had a totally different tone this year.
At this year's FanFest they stuck with the near future instead of far-off ideas. There's also CCP Hilmar stating that there was nothing new to say about Project Legion, and the company announcing that Dust 514 is now profitable on its own.
I believe that trying to bring console players into New Eden was an inspired move that was messed up by gross mismanagement. I personally believe that having the two games on two different platforms with the ability to work together across them is an excellent step toward stuffing this "PC Master Race" nonsense.
We all play games because we like games so let's just play games and stop acting superior.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s
An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
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Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
343
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Posted - 2015.04.08 00:21:16 -
[41] - Quote
Noriko Mai wrote:Kuronaga wrote:Noriko its better off this way.
Sure if you don't have a PS4 then getting one would be a minor inconvenience (though not as much as getting any respectable PC rig honestly). But there is nothing stopping them from proper KB/M support other than priorities being ass backwards. It could play pretty much the same exact way, and with the added benefit of virtually no hacking as thats a lot more difficult on a console FPS.
This is probably the ideal scenario, all things considered. Controllers need autoaim to make the game (FPS) fun, because it's impossible to play on even slightly the same level as someone with KB/M. Dust hast KB/M support. But I won't buy a console for one game. I don't even have a freakin TV... You can buy a PC at lower cost as the ps4 and have better performace (see The Potato Masher). I don't play on my couch eating doritos. I freak the _fuck out if I buy a game, play multiplayer and then have to compete with money spend and not with skill. I don't play f2p because of microtransaction hell and constant assrape if you don't pay. It's just a totaly different audience. To each his own, I guess. Kuronaga wrote: The only real benefit of putting it on PC would be a higher-end graphical experience, and let's be serious here. CCP blueballs us on graphics all the time as it is because they are worried about the low end user being left behind. This would be no different.
The cheating argument is kinda poor. Every freakin console game with online mode is full of cheaters. Graphics are important if they want to become the next BF/CoD clone that fails. Gameplay is important if they want to survive. And I just don't get it what is so hard go the way UT4 does or even cooperate with them to create a side project with EVE connection. That engine and ambitious vision connected to EVE planetary/station/whatever combat. Imagine fighting over your station just by jumping in your Soldier Clone. No need to rely on someone somewhere on a console with no actual connection to EVE. Fight in space, fight on ground, the choice is yours! You and your friends (EVE player or not doesn't matter) fight together for your _shit. How awesome would that be?!?! Imagine the potential, imagine the possibilities... dream with me
The cheating argument is top tier. When I played CS and Battlefield 3 on PC, saw cheaters every day. In my time in Dust I've seen one, back during beta.
Ultimately whether you believe the argument or not comes down to whether you want to believe it or not. It is the purest truthiness that was ever truthed its truth. And if you won't get a console for a single game, all I can tell you is... clearly you're not a real gamer |
MidnightWyvern
Night Theifs
86
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Posted - 2015.04.08 00:23:44 -
[42] - Quote
Kuronaga wrote:Noriko Mai wrote:Kuronaga wrote:Noriko its better off this way.
Sure if you don't have a PS4 then getting one would be a minor inconvenience (though not as much as getting any respectable PC rig honestly). But there is nothing stopping them from proper KB/M support other than priorities being ass backwards. It could play pretty much the same exact way, and with the added benefit of virtually no hacking as thats a lot more difficult on a console FPS.
This is probably the ideal scenario, all things considered. Controllers need autoaim to make the game (FPS) fun, because it's impossible to play on even slightly the same level as someone with KB/M. Dust hast KB/M support. But I won't buy a console for one game. I don't even have a freakin TV... You can buy a PC at lower cost as the ps4 and have better performace (see The Potato Masher). I don't play on my couch eating doritos. I freak the _fuck out if I buy a game, play multiplayer and then have to compete with money spend and not with skill. I don't play f2p because of microtransaction hell and constant assrape if you don't pay. It's just a totaly different audience. To each his own, I guess. Kuronaga wrote: The only real benefit of putting it on PC would be a higher-end graphical experience, and let's be serious here. CCP blueballs us on graphics all the time as it is because they are worried about the low end user being left behind. This would be no different.
The cheating argument is kinda poor. Every freakin console game with online mode is full of cheaters. Graphics are important if they want to become the next BF/CoD clone that fails. Gameplay is important if they want to survive. And I just don't get it what is so hard go the way UT4 does or even cooperate with them to create a side project with EVE connection. That engine and ambitious vision connected to EVE planetary/station/whatever combat. Imagine fighting over your station just by jumping in your Soldier Clone. No need to rely on someone somewhere on a console with no actual connection to EVE. Fight in space, fight on ground, the choice is yours! You and your friends (EVE player or not doesn't matter) fight together for your _shit. How awesome would that be?!?! Imagine the potential, imagine the possibilities... dream with me The cheating argument is top tier. When I played CS and Battlefield 3 on PC, saw cheaters every day. In my time in Dust I've seen one, back during beta. Ultimately whether you believe the argument or not comes down to whether you want to believe it or not. It is the purest truthiness that was ever truthed its truth. And if you won't get a console for a single game, all I can tell you is... clearly you're not a real gamer I don't know if I'd go THAT, far.
My own metric for buying a console is that it has at least 3 games that I want for it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s
An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2015
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Posted - 2015.04.08 00:35:34 -
[43] - Quote
MidnightWyvern wrote: I believe that trying to bring console players into New Eden was an inspired move that was messed up by gross mismanagement. I personally believe that having the two games on two different platforms with the ability to work together across them is an excellent step toward stuffing this "PC Master Race" nonsense.
You badly miss the mark on this. While consoles can be fine games, a game designed for a controller can't have as much depth due to the limited control set relative to a KB/M. The number of secondary abilities, the ease of accessing menu's, navigating starmaps to pick contract regions, things like that all flow easier on KB/M. And that depth is part of what is lacking on Dust currently. You can't create a true 'leader' position who designates objectives freely on the map half the time, because controllers just don't have that level of control. It's why you see so few RTS games on consoles and they don't do well. And Dust should be incorporating some elements of RTS play in order to create more tactics rather than the current, run, gun and die in 2 secs (Unless you use magic strafing that lets you walk through laser beams repeatedly and take no damage) |
MidnightWyvern
Night Theifs
86
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Posted - 2015.04.08 01:45:37 -
[44] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:MidnightWyvern wrote: I believe that trying to bring console players into New Eden was an inspired move that was messed up by gross mismanagement. I personally believe that having the two games on two different platforms with the ability to work together across them is an excellent step toward stuffing this "PC Master Race" nonsense.
You badly miss the mark on this. While consoles can be fine games, a game designed for a controller can't have as much depth due to the limited control set relative to a KB/M. The number of secondary abilities, the ease of accessing menu's, navigating starmaps to pick contract regions, things like that all flow easier on KB/M. And that depth is part of what is lacking on Dust currently. You can't create a true 'leader' position who designates objectives freely on the map half the time, because controllers just don't have that level of control. It's why you see so few RTS games on consoles and they don't do well. And Dust should be incorporating some elements of RTS play in order to create more tactics rather than the current, run, gun and die in 2 secs (Unless you use magic strafing that lets you walk through laser beams repeatedly and take no damage) Dust was originally stated both in 2009 and in 2012 to have a dedicated Commander position that had an RTS interface and controlled the Mobile Command Center, moving it around the map like a Titan in Battlefield 2142.
Again, gross mismanagement by the original project leads meant that this and many other features never came to be.
However, right now a Squad Leader can designate objectives via a contextual menu in first-person, or going into an overview map and placing objectives anywhere on the map.
You don't "need" a keyboard and mouse to have depth in a game. What Dust lacks is the fault of incompetent leadership resulting in sub-par development, not a statement as to the platform not being able to handle it. Use of contextual controls activated by combinations of buttons allows you to assign functions to a controller the same way you can those expensive gaming mice with 11 buttons on them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=eaUaJUhTZfw#t=148s
An excellent example of why pod killmails are the best feature to be implemented in EVE Online since warping at zero.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2015
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Posted - 2015.04.08 02:07:21 -
[45] - Quote
There is a reason squad leaders almost never use those features, even while in first person, because placing them accurately is terrible. Same as that Commander position would have had a terrible time of it on the console.
Consoles simply don't do some things well. Even if they are amazing at other things. |
Gal Udan
Relentless Terrorism Already Disbanded
3
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Posted - 2015.04.08 09:46:36 -
[46] - Quote
Gorongo Frostfyr wrote:would you/would it: prefer it? collide with EVE's design philosophy? be again too niche?
I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden.
Dust wasn't too niche of a game. Dust was a PS3 exclusive. This is why Dust failed.
If it had launched on PC it would have fared MUCH better. |
Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
343
|
Posted - 2015.04.08 11:10:40 -
[47] - Quote
Gal Udan wrote:Gorongo Frostfyr wrote:would you/would it: prefer it? collide with EVE's design philosophy? be again too niche?
I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden. Dust wasn't too niche of a game. Dust was a PS3 exclusive. This is why Dust failed. If it had launched on PC it would have fared MUCH better.
Exclusives do just fine. There is even a good argument that it would do far worse on PC because the PC market is already completely saturated with a far vaster library.
Dust In fact had a lot of interest surrounding it, and there are still people playing it. The problem that drove off the average player was that it ran incredibly poorly. Shanghai did not have developers with a lot of experience using the Cell Processor, and the PS3 has almost no RAM. This leads to the game running at an incredibly poor frame rate as it has to keep track of every potential dropsuit and vehicle fitting on every character on the field, on top of the large environments themselves.
The hardware would be just barely up to the task if you had people who were at the absolute top of the industry for optimization. CCP Shanghai was not.
But the sluggishness of the game is what ultimately drove people away from it. Nobody wants to play a game that "feels" bad. And Dust felt bad. |
Gorongo Frostfyr
117
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Posted - 2015.04.09 04:55:34 -
[48] - Quote
Gal Udan wrote:Gorongo Frostfyr wrote:would you/would it: prefer it? collide with EVE's design philosophy? be again too niche?
I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden. Dust wasn't too niche of a game. Dust was a PS3 exclusive. This is why Dust failed. If it had launched on PC it would have fared MUCH better.
Question was: Dust as MMORTS may be too niche. The again referred to EVE, which is a niche game. |
Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
80
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Posted - 2015.04.09 06:39:22 -
[49] - Quote
Gorongo Frostfyr wrote:would you/would it: prefer it? collide with EVE's design philosophy? be again too niche?
I wonder if CCP ever considered making a RTS or even a turn-based game connected to the worlds of New Eden. RTS like the CoH Online Beta? It was really good game. I played it until they shut it down. I miss it.
http://issuu.com/gregory45/docs/roles role icons for new corporation window
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