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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.28 10:01:00 -
[331]
Edited by: Udyr Vulpayne on 28/10/2006 10:03:51 eh what i was trying to post back there was 8/3/7 8 turrets
was a bit late and apparently i having having problems with the 6+1=7 situation :)
also: yes its nice to have 4 meds instead of the usual 3. however as it is right now with the 7 turrets the ship will barely outdamge the hurricane on raw dps while using a lot more cap and being pretty similar in everything else. i would prefer it if it would at least have a serious damage advantage to counter that.
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Rahjadan Shardur
Minmatar Poisoned Heart
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Posted - 2006.10.28 10:01:00 -
[332]
Originally by: Toaster Oven Edited by: Toaster Oven on 27/10/2006 10:33:28
<snip> And as to why Harbinger is not up to par. Compare with Hurricane using some viable setups (using Kali ammo stats)
Harbinger 7x Heavy Pulse II w/ Conflag + 1x Heat Sink II + 5x Valkyrie II = 601.2 DPS Hurricane 7x 220mm II w/ Hail + 1x Gyrostab II + 1x Hammerhead II + 4x Hobgoblin II = 579.8 DPS
So what does the Harbinger sacrifice for that paltry dmg advantage? Hurricane can fit MAR II + 1600mm Tungsten + 10mn MWD II + Med Nos II. Harbinger only has room for MAR II and 10MN AB II. No room for plate or med NOS. So Hurricane tanks better, goes faster, much more cap, much less vulnerable to tracking disruptors, and has smaller sig radius. Tbh why would you choose to fly Harbinger?
And what if Harbinger dropped down to Focused Medium Pulse II? Harbinger 7x Focused Medium Pulse II w/ Conflag + 1x Heat Sink II + 5x Valkyrie II = 536.8 DPS
Now it can fit a 1600mm plate, but it does less DPS than Hurricane. Whether you choose to fit MWD or AB, it still can't fill it's last high slot with a Med NOS. And it still has less cap available compared to Hurricane. Simply outclassed.
Anyone else noticed that the Brutix is doing more damage than Harbinger and Hurricane?
------------------ Life is but a dream... |
keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 10:31:00 -
[333]
No. 3 mids = suck. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.28 10:42:00 -
[334]
Originally by: keepiru No. 3 mids = suck.
the geddon would like to disagree with you there.
i understand that 3 medslots are not all that great. seeing how i fly only amarrian ships i am very well aware of the problems you face with only a few medslots. if the rest of the ship is a good enough it can make up for that though. as i understand it the ship is supposed to be a gank platform somewhere between omen and geddon. 8/3/7 with a serious damage advantage would fit that better than 7/4/7 with better utility. especially considering how very close the harbinger and hurricane are.
anyway either way is fine with me. looking at the ship alone it already seems decent now. its just when you compare it to its obvious counterpart the hurricane that you realize its harsh shortcomings.
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 11:05:00 -
[335]
No, 3 mids are ok on a BS that does around 1000hp damage before the 50% hp boost.
On a BC, in a world with the 50% hp boost, its suck.
If you cant have speed mod + injector + web + scrambler you are far more gimped compared to other BCs than with 7 guns and 4 mids, because if you gave the stuff to hold your enemy and dictate range you will ALWAYS cap out before you kill any other BC. Heck, a prophecy will pwn you.
Simply not viable in Kali. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.28 11:41:00 -
[336]
well its not like laserboats are good at dictating range anyway. in most cases you cant really go for an mwd due to fitting and cap constraints.
anyway like i said earlier 7-4-7 and a serious boost to grid may work as well/maybe even better. actually i would also up the max cap or cap recharge a bit more in this case. i was just trying to show another possibility to overcome its obvious problems.
right now the ship is lacking a lot compared to the hurricane.
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 11:50:00 -
[337]
Meh, 7 Foc. Med. Pulse II, Mwd, Jector and 2 reps fits, that's good enough for me fitting wise.
Sure, you cant fit Heavy pulses mwd dual reps and injector, but then the hurricane has to fit 220s instead of 425s for the same fit.
Heavy Beam IIs fit better than Tach IIs on amarr battleships, so as far as I'm concerned, the PG/CPU right now is fine, but it needs either:
8th high moved to low, for a 7/4/7 setup 8th turret back and the grid/cpu to use it
And a small cap boost, 250 cap over the hurricane don't cut it. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:04:00 -
[338]
Originally by: keepiru Meh, 7 Foc. Med. Pulse II, Mwd, Jector and 2 reps fits, that's good enough for me fitting wise.
Sure, you cant fit Heavy pulses mwd dual reps and injector, but then the hurricane has to fit 220s instead of 425s for the same fit.
yes but if you drop to focused med pulses and 220mm autocannons the harbinger doesnt even get to keep the samll raw dps advantage it has with heavy pulse vs 425mm. and while the mwd helps with keeping range you suffer a hard cap penalty and your guns still use a lot more cap than autocannons while doing less desireable damagetypes.
Originally by: keepiru
it needs either:
8th high moved to low, for a 7/4/7 setup 8th turret back and the grid/cpu to use it
And a small cap boost, 250 cap over the hurricane don't cut it.
agreed again. just not sure if and 8th turret would not be too much if it has 4 meds.
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:13:00 -
[339]
No, I dont think it would be.
Just depends on which direction the devs want to take it, 7 lows means it does comparable DPS to hurricane but with a slightly better tank, 8 guns means more damage but same tank that doesn't last as long.
Considering that DPS comparisons don't count the T2 heavy assault launcher on the Hurricane, I dont think that 14% better DPS from just the guns would be out of line considering you'll still have bigger cap draw and be nos-less by necessity in order to do that damage.
Incidentally, the Brutix needs enough grid to fit full Ions with mwd jector and dual reps or it'll be smashed into oblivion. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Denrace
Amarr Psykotic Dreams
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:15:00 -
[340]
Originally by: madaluap If you want these tier2 bc balanced, than the Myrm needs more dronebay!
Atleast 150m3 so it can field 5 heavy and 5 small, remember it doesnt get bonus to turrets and has the highest sig of all bc.
It gets outdamaged big time by all the new BC.
And its about damn time Gallente got put in their place.
Having most of your ships being solopwn mobile NOS/ECM/Drones spamming monsters, you DESERVE a crap ship for a change.
Let the other 3 races have their cake for once.
Den ________________________________________
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Denrace
Amarr Psykotic Dreams
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:21:00 -
[341]
Also, I dont get why it isnt glaringly obvious to the devs that Tier 1 Battlecruisers and Command Ships now need a complete overhaul.
Whats the point in releasing a new line of T1 ships that makes the upper T2 BC's hopelessly redundant for a fraction of the price (and while being FULLY insurable??)
Seems ludicrous to me.
Den
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:23:00 -
[342]
Awww, Den needs a hug ^_^ ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
MECTO
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:25:00 -
[343]
im too lazy to read whole thread so don't hug me
drake - ok [my alt will fly this and ship is awesome]
hurricane - OK [my personal choice!]
harbringer - ok? i don't know maybe more grid
myrmidon - bull**** need bigger dronebay or its PRETTY freakin' useless
It's Great Being Carebear in Kali - aint it?
Originally by: Tuxford In this picture you might think that Gallente totally pwn. Well they're alright
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Jacob Holland
Gallente FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.10.28 12:37:00 -
[344]
Edited by: Jacob Holland on 28/10/2006 12:39:36 How about this for the Myrmidon:
Keep the dronebay as is, change the drone bonus so that it applies to light and medium drones only (hold your complaints that it's just an oversized Vexor for a moment please)... Then boost the percentage on the bonus. The 10% bonus comes from the old +1 drone per level (Drones [5] gives you five drones, drone interfacing [5] gives you five double effectiveness drones, equivalent to the ten it used to, and then the ship bonus boosts that by 50% to the equivalent of the fifteen drones the Domi used to run). Assuming however that the bonus isn't fixed to allow the drone nerf to be rolled back there is now no reason why it has to be 10%. If the bonus were to be increased to 15%/level then the drone damage would beat that of the Vexor, it wouldn't actually be much but it would be the equivalent of 17.5 drones rather than 15. Even better, boost it to 20%, a 33% boost to drone damage over the Vexor (and if the drone nerf were rolled back you'd have a ship capable of running 20 drones ), you would have five mediums out and five in reserve, better than trying to squeeze four heavies in and gimp your bonuses neh? A 33% damage boost puts it almost equivalent to the Drake (7 launchers with ROF bonus compared to 5 launchers with Kinetic Damage bonus on the Caracal) minus the fact that the Hybrid damage bonus places it equal to the Vexor on that score. Personally I'd use lights, Mediums are too slow and have tracking poor enough (Drone Nav [2], Drone Sharpshooting [4]) that I feel I get more out of lights. It also gives me the option of having yet more in reserve and adding the versatility of a bunch of shield maintenence bots, Damping drones, painting drones or whatever else.
Originally by: cordy
Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
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Jaded
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Posted - 2006.10.28 13:31:00 -
[345]
The harbinger looks great when you only compare it to amarr ships. It doesn't really measure up to the other new bc's, though.
Even with the bonus, lasers drain more cap than hybrids. Its second bonus adds ~30% dps, but at the cost of 25% additional cap use.
If I'm not mistaken, the other bc's offer comparable dps and tanking while being easier to fit and a lot easier to keep running.
I'd like the harbinger (and amarr ships in general, I guess) to get a massive increase in cap size (and thus recharge as well) and a lot more PG, making it the laser platform it's supposed to be.
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Pattern Clarc
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.10.28 14:27:00 -
[346]
Originally by: Jacob Holland Edited by: Jacob Holland on 28/10/2006 12:39:36 How about this for the Myrmidon:
Keep the dronebay as is, change the drone bonus so that it applies to light and medium drones only (hold your complaints that it's just an oversized Vexor for a moment please)... Then boost the percentage on the bonus. The 10% bonus comes from the old +1 drone per level (Drones [5] gives you five drones, drone interfacing [5] gives you five double effectiveness drones, equivalent to the ten it used to, and then the ship bonus boosts that by 50% to the equivalent of the fifteen drones the Domi used to run). Assuming however that the bonus isn't fixed to allow the drone nerf to be rolled back there is now no reason why it has to be 10%. If the bonus were to be increased to 15%/level then the drone damage would beat that of the Vexor, it wouldn't actually be much but it would be the equivalent of 17.5 drones rather than 15. Even better, boost it to 20%, a 33% boost to drone damage over the Vexor (and if the drone nerf were rolled back you'd have a ship capable of running 20 drones ), you would have five mediums out and five in reserve, better than trying to squeeze four heavies in and gimp your bonuses neh? A 33% damage boost puts it almost equivalent to the Drake (7 launchers with ROF bonus compared to 5 launchers with Kinetic Damage bonus on the Caracal) minus the fact that the Hybrid damage bonus places it equal to the Vexor on that score. Personally I'd use lights, Mediums are too slow and have tracking poor enough (Drone Nav [2], Drone Sharpshooting [4]) that I feel I get more out of lights. It also gives me the option of having yet more in reserve and adding the versatility of a bunch of shield maintenence bots, Damping drones, painting drones or whatever else.
against other battlecruisers, light drones would really suck.
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Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.28 15:50:00 -
[347]
Originally by: Denrace Also, I dont get why it isnt glaringly obvious to the devs that Tier 1 Battlecruisers and Command Ships now need a complete overhaul.
Whats the point in releasing a new line of T1 ships that makes the upper T2 BC's hopelessly redundant for a fraction of the price (and while being FULLY insurable??)
you should file a bug report if your absolution doesnt have 2 more bonuses and a lot higher base resists than the harbinger. mine seems to be fine so far.
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Jacob Holland
Gallente FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.10.28 15:53:00 -
[348]
But Mediums at that level wouldn't. I'd use lights - that doesn't mean that lights are the best option
It is agreed that with it's current bonuses it doesn't beat the Vexor with mediums and it seems that the drone bay is limited to avoid heavy drones. So is (the equivalent of) 20 medium drones appropriate compared to the Dominix's fifteen heavies?
Originally by: cordy
Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
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Shodana
Minmatar Red Dwarf Mining Corps Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2006.10.28 16:01:00 -
[349]
Probably been said before, but oh well.
Drake with 7L/3t high slot split, 6 mid, 4 low. 5% shield resistance per level and 5% ROF bonus... OMFG. I just left a stain running from the floor to the ceiling.
Ferox with 5L/5t high slot split, 5 mid, 4 low. 5% shield resistance per level and 10% to optimal range per level. Ferox is going to become extinct. As is, I have never seen a ferox fit with blasters or rails. Always missile spamming with ewar.
So...
Why do the caldari have 2 missile spamming BC? Any plans to make the ferox a 7t/3L high slot split now that the caldari have an uber missile spammer or plans to reconfigure the drake to a full turret boat?
I don't mind. I am a missile ***** to the core of my being and love the drake's configuration, just seems a bit over the top with 7 launchers, 6 mids, and 4 lows. Not to mention renders the ferox useless.
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 16:14:00 -
[350]
The Ferox was never intended to be a missile ship. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
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Calculon
Gallente The Shadow Order The Shadow Ascension
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Posted - 2006.10.28 16:48:00 -
[351]
Originally by: keepiru The Ferox was never intended to be a missile ship.
Correct, people just fit it that way ignoring the bonuses as they prefer EVE on easy mode (missiles). They neglect the fact that a rail/blaster Ferox out damages the missile Ferox by quite a substantial margin.
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Shodana
Minmatar Red Dwarf Mining Corps Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2006.10.28 18:21:00 -
[352]
Originally by: Calculon
Originally by: keepiru The Ferox was never intended to be a missile ship.
Correct, people just fit it that way ignoring the bonuses as they prefer EVE on easy mode (missiles). They neglect the fact that a rail/blaster Ferox out damages the missile Ferox by quite a substantial margin.
So, that's why it's a 5T/5L split. Give someone the option of something that always hits and they'll run with it -either that or be drone mongers :)
If the Drake goes through the with the 7L/3T split, why not give the Ferox 8 highlots in a 7 turret, 3 launcher split, keep the mids and lows as is? Although as you stated, "... they prefer EvE on easy mode... " and will just swap over to the drake.
On a side note... give the field command ships the new chassis. Please.
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial
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Posted - 2006.10.28 18:37:00 -
[353]
Originally by: keepiru Meh, 7 Foc. Med. Pulse II, Mwd, Jector and 2 reps fits, that's good enough for me fitting wise.
Sure, you cant fit Heavy pulses mwd dual reps and injector, but then the hurricane has to fit 220s instead of 425s for the same fit.
Heavy Beam IIs fit better than Tach IIs on amarr battleships, so as far as I'm concerned, the PG/CPU right now is fine, but it needs either:
8th high moved to low, for a 7/4/7 setup 8th turret back and the grid/cpu to use it
And a small cap boost, 250 cap over the hurricane don't cut it.
Its good enough for you, until you realize that now you are going to be out tanked by a hurricane and out gunned, as well as out speeded, and outsized.
As it stands right now, the ship is hundreds of CPU and PG below the Hurricane due to fitting issues with lasers, as well, its lacking in the damage department compared to the hurricane, especialy since the hurricane has the ability to fit gun rigs and the harbinger does not[not on its biggest guns, the Hurricane can fit 3 run rigs depending on calibration on 425's and still beat the Harbinger in terms of overall CPU and PG use at max skills compared to heavy pulses.
At t1 rigs, that is between a an extra 33% DPS boost[at no extra ammo consumption] or a 37.5% DPS boost[with a large extra ammo consumption].
If the Harbinger fits Focused Medium Pulses, the Hurricane can fit Dual 180mm Auto cannons fit, 3 damage mods and be using the same amount of PG. In this situation the Harbinger is actualy up 125 PG after fitting...[.914]. Then again, the Hurricane is doing between 73% and 85% more damage[depending on how rigs and ship bonuses stack with each other] with her guns than the Harbinger.
So go ahead and fit 7 focused medium pulses, a guy in a hurricane will still out damage you and probably out tank you. Heck, with just dual 180mm's he beats you on powergrid by 30 per gun and outdamages you by 40% over focused medium pulses, with the ship bonus and no rigs.[10% with no ship bonus]
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2SecondsTilMidnight
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Posted - 2006.10.28 19:11:00 -
[354]
Originally by: Shodana Probably been said before, but oh well.
Drake with 7L/3t high slot split, 6 mid, 4 low. 5% shield resistance per level and 5% ROF bonus... OMFG. I just left a stain running from the floor to the ceiling.
Ferox with 5L/5t high slot split, 5 mid, 4 low. 5% shield resistance per level and 10% to optimal range per level. Ferox is going to become extinct. As is, I have never seen a ferox fit with blasters or rails. Always missile spamming with ewar.
So...
Why do the caldari have 2 missile spamming BC? Any plans to make the ferox a 7t/3L high slot split now that the caldari have an uber missile spammer or plans to reconfigure the drake to a full turret boat?
I don't mind. I am a missile ***** to the core of my being and love the drake's configuration, just seems a bit over the top with 7 launchers, 6 mids, and 4 lows. Not to mention renders the ferox useless.
Have you actually ever flown a missle ferox before? It's not very strong, it's got pretty horrid dps.
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Lrootrnas
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Posted - 2006.10.28 19:21:00 -
[355]
Edited by: Lrootrnas on 28/10/2006 19:24:46
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.28 19:23:00 -
[356]
Edited by: keepiru on 28/10/2006 19:24:57
Originally by: Shodana So, that's why it's a 5T/5L split. Give someone the option of something that always hits and they'll run with it -either that or be drone mongers :)
If the Drake goes through the with the 7L/3T split, why not give the Ferox 8 highlots in a 7 turret, 3 launcher split, keep the mids and lows as is? Although as you stated, "... they prefer EvE on easy mode... " and will just swap over to the drake.
No. Keep the total slots, give 2 more turret hardpoints and remove 2 launchers, add some grid and remove a little CPU.
Originally by: Goumindong Its good enough for you, until you realize that now you are going to be out tanked by a hurricane and out gunned, as well as out speeded, and outsized.
As it stands right now, the ship is hundreds of CPU and PG below the Hurricane due to fitting issues with lasers, as well, its lacking in the damage department compared to the hurricane, especialy since the hurricane has the ability to fit gun rigs and the harbinger does not[not on its biggest guns, the Hurricane can fit 3 run rigs depending on calibration on 425's and still beat the Harbinger in terms of overall CPU and PG use at max skills compared to heavy pulses.
At t1 rigs, that is between a an extra 33% DPS boost[at no extra ammo consumption] or a 37.5% DPS boost[with a large extra ammo consumption].
If the Harbinger fits Focused Medium Pulses, the Hurricane can fit Dual 180mm Auto cannons fit, 3 damage mods and be using the same amount of PG. In this situation the Harbinger is actualy up 125 PG after fitting...[.914]. Then again, the Hurricane is doing between 73% and 85% more damage[depending on how rigs and ship bonuses stack with each other] with her guns than the Harbinger.
So go ahead and fit 7 focused medium pulses, a guy in a hurricane will still out damage you and probably out tank you. Heck, with just dual 180mm's he beats you on powergrid by 30 per gun and outdamages you by 40% over focused medium pulses, with the ship bonus and no rigs.[10% with no ship bonus]
Some interesting arguments, but I havn't seen your math so I'll have to run it myself and see what I come up with. ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Zeknichov
Amarr Black Avatar Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2006.10.28 21:02:00 -
[357]
Change the myrmidon to a Drone+EW ship.
Take away the armor rep bonus and replace it with a Sensor Dampener strength or range/cap bonus.
Replace two high slots with 2 medium slots and remove another turret.
Increase drone bay to 200.
With 5 heavies + 3 replacements this ship is mathematically on par with the drone capacity for a cruiser done boat. Its DPS is also on par with the DPS of the other new BCs. With sensor dampeners it will take ships a lot longer to lockdown each of the dones and kill them.
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial
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Posted - 2006.10.28 22:01:00 -
[358]
Originally by: keepiru Some interesting arguments, but I havn't seen your math so I'll have to run it myself and see what I come up with.
[i made an error for the damage multiplier of the 180mm, i used the damage bonus from t2 to compare to a t1 pulse, which gives the 180II a 20% damage boost that it shouldnt have.] Here is how I did my math.
I took the weapons damage multiplier then divided by its rate of fire. This, multiplied by the ammo damage gives you your base DPS for each gun. So, I assume equally skilled people, which means that the miltiplier applied to damage is equal and can be set to 1. Then I compare with what i know about how rigs work.
All info so far points to rigs stack penalizing themselves [a mistake above, but since you can spread them out over gun bonuses, isnt a huge issue] but not stack penalizing with modules.
What i dont know is whether or not they penalize with ship bonuses.
So looking at the Dual 180mm autocannon, it has a DPS multiplier of 1.375 and a ROF of 3. For a final damage rating of .4583. A dual 180mm autocannon uses 80 PG
A focused medium pulse has a DPS multiplier of 2 with a ROF of 4.05 for a final damage multiplier of .4938. A focused medium pulse ses 120 PG
So if we apply 2 damage rig, and 1 ROF rigs, all at t1 levels, this means is a 10% damage bonus for each, and a 10% RoF bonus for each. For a total damage multiplier for the gun of around 1.17/.9 = 1.30 and a total PG modifier of 1.331.
So a dual 180mm autocannon will use 106.4 powergrid and have a final DPS multiplier of .5958[better than a Heavy Pulse Laser by a couple percent], and do 20.6% more DPS than a focused medium pulse laser which uses 120 powergrid. So comparing the Hurricane VS the Harbinger, with equal about PG usage[116 total difference in favor of the AC's, 125 total PG higher on the harbinger] before ship bonuses the hurricanes guns do 20.6% more damage than the harbingers.
This gets worse for guns that use more powergrid as you start using heavier guns and tech II guns[and tech II rigs as well] as the powergrid difference between the larger guns get 10% bigger, creating a larger total powergrid difference for each gun.
What happens when we compare roughly equal sized guns? Focused Medium Pulses to 200mm autocannons?
FMP is at .4938 and 120 powergrid.
200mm Autocannons are at .4881 with 100 powergrid.
A 200mm autocannon user can fit two rigs [t1 would give a 21% DPS boost for 1 damage/1 rof for a total DPS mod of .5906] and be just barely over the powergrid usage of the FMP. So with the autocannons you use no cap, instead use ammo, gain 19.6% dps boost and gain CPU fitting versus a FMP.
Comparing the biggest of the guns, the 425's which have a damage of 1.925 and a ROF of 3.75[140 PG] to heavy pulses with a damage of 3 and an rof of 5.25[210 PG].
425 Autocannon base DPS multiplier = .5133
Heavy Pulse Laser base DPS multiplier = .5714
425 PG use with 3 rigs. = 186.34
425 Base DPS multplier with 2 damage/1 rof[to conserve ammo, 1 damage/2 rof is stronger] = .6672 = 16% better than the Heavy Pulse Laser with 20 more PG use[after the PG differences in ships are calculated]
T2 rigs make this worse, T2 guns make this worse.
Now start figuring in the ship bonuses[rof for each is null] and you see why there is an issue with the Hurricane out damaging the Harbinger and out Tanking it.
Now, the big guns would be great if you could fit rigs on to them too, but you cant as effectivly, because of PG issues. A Heavy Pulse Laser with 2 rigs[and an 8 PG rig boost] on the ship to accomidate] will gain 150 PG from the rig at max skills and the HMP's will jump 280 PG use total at AWU 5[for a net loss of 150 PG, you will gain 5% or so damage] you get closer to the damage with T2 rigs, but with T2 guns the PG use difference becomes even larger.
This wouldnt be an issue if ships didnt have limited powergrid, but of course, they do.
It will also make autocannon/hybrid even better on amarr ships with no laser bonus
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Rahjadan Shardur
Minmatar Poisoned Heart
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Posted - 2006.10.28 22:55:00 -
[359]
yes so the hurricane outdamages the harbinger, but you did not factor in the reload time for ACs. reloade time is more importent now that ships have more hp and you need more ammo to kill them.
------------------ Life is but a dream... |
Sniser
4S Corporation Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.10.28 23:22:00 -
[360]
Originally by: Rahjadan Shardur yes so the hurricane outdamages the harbinger, but you did not factor in the reload time for ACs. reloade time is more importent now that ships have more hp and you need more ammo to kill them.
you reload, lasers have SHORT falloff and we need change ammo more times. I usually change my ammo 2 times in each fight one when im far and another when im near but maybe i had to change it again for middle range. How many times do you reload? 1? 2?
It's great being Amarr, ain't it? |
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