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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Lirt
State War Academy
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Posted - 2006.10.27 13:22:00 -
[31]
If its so bad as you say then quit. Anyway im not here to enter a forum war i just stated my opinion.
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Lirt
State War Academy
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Posted - 2006.10.27 13:26:00 -
[32]
Anyway my last post so you wont say im responsible for locking your beloved topic.
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Eh? lol Well at least you are doing good as typical caldari. Something doesn't go your way you quit...
Well i pass that cause its kinda well weird....anyway
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I prefered to suggest an optional change that will suit both sides. But feel free to flame on. I am sure you will earn us a lock soon.
Point is you all suggested to just remove the whole new map and roll back to the previous one. You didnt suggest some option that will make new map better.
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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.27 13:31:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Lirt Point is you all suggested to just remove the whole new map and roll back to the previous one. You didnt suggest some option that will make new map better.
WTS Reading skillbook
And after training Reading to lvl1, try to apply the skill to the first post again. (and a few others below it). And then say all your gibberish again.
Or maybe you just read ONE post of the thread and decided to throw some flames in? --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Butter Dog
The Dead Miners Society
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Posted - 2006.10.27 13:40:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Lirt If its so bad as you say then quit. Anyway im not here to enter a forum war i just stated my opinion.
Or how about we suggest an option to disable it, making it suitable for everyone?
Oh... we just have... and a Dev is looking into it
honestly, get a grip
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Kalidri Ngyuen
Amarr Decimus Corp
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Posted - 2006.10.27 14:10:00 -
[35]
Personally I like the new map, I think it is much better than the old map, maybe there should be an option in the "generic" part of the menu , but I think it's deffinatly a job well done .
Cookies for all Devs who worked on it !
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Xeliya
Dark-Rising
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Posted - 2006.10.27 14:27:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Xeliya on 27/10/2006 14:28:09 Lirt, you need to do 2 things . . . Not post at all and if you have to do it with you main so we can laugh at you.
If you read the post with any common sense, people don't hate the map, they hate the eye candy zoom out/in part that takes 5-10 seconds which sometimes you don't have. The other complaints like no zoom well alot of people know where their system is on the map so instead of taking 10-20sec to look it up in people and places it takes a few seconds to zoom on the map and add way point.
If I'm looking at the map then I get shot at I don't want to wait 10 seconds for the thing to zoom back in as I will be dead by then.
Reading and thinking before you post ftw . . . ----------
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Naal Morno
ECP Rogues Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2006.10.27 14:34:00 -
[37]
Also....on top of transition complaints...
Since it is "Semaless" map, why there is no (there isn't right?) true seamless zoom?
When I heard "seamless map" for the first time, I thought I would be able to zoom out all the way out from my ship to galaxy level in one (or several) quick scroll wheel turns (or left+right and mouse move)... As it is right now, the map is chopped to three different levels of zoom switchable by buttons only.
Any chance to fix that?
_________________________________________
The cloaky orchestrator |
Andargor theWise
Disbelievers of Fate The SUdden Death Squad
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Posted - 2006.10.27 15:33:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Morfane I am a scan prober. I played with the new map for quite some time a couple days ago, and while I thought the transitions were neat-o, the zomgthatssocool effect wore off pretty fast. I still like it better than the old map though.
My main beef is the lack of an absolute direction. With the old minimap, I knew what north, south, up, down, etc were at all times. This allowed me to do a lot of the 3d spacialization in my head. Now, while transitioning the camera does quite a few rotations about various axes, which totally messes my poor brain up when trying to remember where my prey is in relation to me. Landmarks aren't gonna cut it.
I think the easiest solution is not to have an option for either system, but simply to add a "flatten map" button for the system level. Or stick the system map back on the scanner.
Also, the green scanning cone was extremely helpful. If that could be put into the system level map (either as a 3d cone, or only have it on the flattened version as a triangle as it is now), I would be very very happy.
I have not had the chance to try out Sisi yet, but the suggestions here make sense. I am a scan prober as well, and 3D awareness ranks very high in the skill you must use.
Perhaps the system map would be aligned with the ship as you zoom out? And perhaps directions such as "galactic north/east/west/south", "spinward/coreward", and "above/below" the ecliptic plane could be indicated? With options, of course.
Is it possible to view the system map in a window? Can we place arbitray markers or bookmarks on the system map? Can we free draw lines, arcs or circles? These are all tools that are an explorer's or scanner's friends: to be able to annotate a system map.
Lastly, is it possible to share what we see on the system map/scanner with our gangmate? Ships? Annotations? Great for gang/fleet C&C.
My 0.02 ISK
- Got grief?
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Allna
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Posted - 2006.10.27 15:36:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: keepiru Teh transitions are sekseh. And win.
So are some of the sound effects yet it seems most people turn sound off
Eve has sound??
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Maestro Ulv
Phaze-9
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Posted - 2006.10.27 15:36:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Andargor theWise Perhaps the system map would be aligned with the ship as you zoom out?
The map zooms out directly from your ship so its very easy to align yourself. Least ive found it easy.
I'm not bored, I'm merely in the Queue. |
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BenYGW
Caldari Syncore Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.10.27 16:19:00 -
[41]
The new map is AMAZING Best thing comming in kali imo. (along with real stars in the background :D)
There are a few minor annoyances with the starmap, but there are with everything in kali, so i expect a few of these are gonna be sorted out.
A very simple fix would be just to have the map button on the taskbar open up the old, simple map.. which seems much better for navigation and such, but is nowhere near as cool.
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Trollin
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Posted - 2006.10.30 06:39:00 -
[42]
while we are at it, I want the broken warp sound back... the one from i think 2 patches ago... that was simply a boom once you where sped up.
I hate the one that rattles.
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Thor Xian
Vertigo One
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Posted - 2006.10.30 10:27:00 -
[43]
Maybe there is a reason for the transition? Instant gratification really is getting a bit silly these days.
~Thor Xian, Material Defender |
Butter Dog
The Dead Miners Society
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Posted - 2006.10.30 10:47:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Butter Dog on 30/10/2006 10:47:41
Originally by: Thor Xian Maybe there is a reason for the transition? Instant gratification really is getting a bit silly these days.
The 'reason' is that it looks nice, nothing more.
The map has 3 clearly defined 'states' you can navigate to using tabs above your overview. There is no reason you could not enter one of these states without the graphical fireworks, which only serve to delay things.
Also, I seem to have managed to zoom right out to galaxy view during a fight when I simply tried to wheel the mouse out to have a better look at the battlefield. These kind of annoyances need to be addressed. Its a question of gameplay and not harming it with pointless graphical effects.
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Fortior
STK Scientific Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.10.30 12:20:00 -
[45]
How about we all give CCP some time to optimize the client and stuff? Remember that this is the testing stage after all. They're not bound to make it perfect from the get-go.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.30 12:45:00 -
[46]
I've not tried it yet, but I know how fast you need thigns to work in the heat of things. Would be a shame if an uneccessary delay is thrown in, just for eye-candy. I'd leave it turned on for sexy-ness most of the time, but turn it off at the same times I "ctrl-alt-shift-E , ctrl-alt-shift-T", and out goes the sound........... -----------------------------------------------
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Cosmic Flame
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Posted - 2006.10.30 13:35:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 26/10/2006 18:24:06 Can we please get an option to turn off the seamless stuff and just have our plain old map back? Those transitions are driving me nuts, no purpose except eye-candy, and every one wastes almost 10 secs of my precious time... If I open or close the map, I want to open or close the map asap, not some fancy gfx stunt. Thanks. (If turning the transitions off is already possible, please point me there and chastise me...)
When you load the map on TQ it takes some secs or up to xx minutes depending on the server lag. The difference here is that instead of having 2 separate maps and 1 main view, you now have everything more integrated into one general view that seemlessly zooms out, am i correct? I have yet to actually see it live on SISI, havent been able to log in yet., but at 1st look it seems to be better than the current system which takes you out of the main view and alienates you completely from what is going on. If your in a hot zone with hostiles around, opening up the map could be the last thing you do... SO... unless it just takes way too long zooming out or something, then i don½t see why you would prefer the old system more. |
Sphynx Stormlord
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Posted - 2006.10.30 14:00:00 -
[48]
I would much much prefer to be able to skip the irritating graphical zoom out, and even more so the zoom in and whirling around caused by having a flattened map. It is prety, once. That is enough for me, after that it got irritating real fast. Having an option to go straight to the flattened map, rather than having to go though the 3d version would also be very useful.
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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.30 16:25:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Cosmic Flame
Originally by: Leandro Salazar Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 26/10/2006 18:24:06 Can we please get an option to turn off the seamless stuff and just have our plain old map back? Those transitions are driving me nuts, no purpose except eye-candy, and every one wastes almost 10 secs of my precious time... If I open or close the map, I want to open or close the map asap, not some fancy gfx stunt. Thanks. (If turning the transitions off is already possible, please point me there and chastise me...)
When you load the map on TQ it takes some secs or up to xx minutes depending on the server lag. The difference here is that instead of having 2 separate maps and 1 main view, you now have everything more integrated into one general view that seemlessly zooms out, am i correct? I have yet to actually see it live on SISI, havent been able to log in yet., but at 1st look it seems to be better than the current system which takes you out of the main view and alienates you completely from what is going on. If your in a hot zone with hostiles around, opening up the map could be the last thing you do... SO... unless it just takes way too long zooming out or something, then i don½t see why you would prefer the old system more.
Opening map on TQ just took me about 2-3 secs, with the only effect a shortly frozen ship and then the map view. Maybe slightly more with lag, but I never had any big problems and it didn't harrass my eyes (or my stomach :P). Opening the map on Sisi takes me on a guaranteed 8+ second rollercoaster ride that is extremely annoying when you are forced to watch it for the umpteenth time.
This is why I prefer the old system. Old systems for old farts. Don't mind keeping the transitions for the youngins to enjoy, but please gimme an option to turn them off. Thanks. --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Jacob Holland
Gallente FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.10.30 17:06:00 -
[50]
As I recall, the initial intention was to have the ability to zoom out from your ship, and zoom out further, and zoom out further... To the point that you got to the full galactic map (as per the "power of ten" video which IIRC was linked in the first Dev Blog on the subject). It seems though - and I haven't been able to try it yet - (going on the comments here) that the shortcut jumps between the fifth power and the tenth (let's say) is not actually a shortcut but an automation. I seem to remember something in another devblog that said that making the map truly seamless was proving impossible; the question is then, why not simply keep it seamless as far as possible and make the shortcuts actually shortcuts?
One question for those who've had the chance to try, is the F11 (IIRC) sidebar (Galaxy/Region/Constellation/System) minimap still there?
Originally by: cordy
Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.10.30 17:11:00 -
[51]
Issues at first sight (as much as I could see, that is, before DT): - zooming out/in to the extreme in a certain "view mode" doesn't automatically switch to "next view mode" in logical progression - switching from one view mode to another is accompanied by a "smooth transition" which is nice the first couple of times, then it becomes cumbersome, then annoying - switching view modes defaults to "reset view" in that view mode (i.e. switch to inflight zooms in very close to ship) - clicking an object in system view focuses/zooms to object (please don't)
Will be "going in" a bit later (if at all possible) to check all possible combinations and post behaviour here _____ -sig-
This is my only char. These are my skills
Always question everything, including yourself |
Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.30 17:32:00 -
[52]
I have to /sign up to the transition annoyance camp. /offtopic It's the same as being forced to see pics of players in local./ontopic It just wastes time and resources without adding to actual gameplay. The functionality of the 3 map states is great, just optionalise (word?) the techie oooh-look-what-I-can-show stuff ^^
/offtopic(...including the pics in local!)/ontopic
xx E
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Cosmic Flame
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Posted - 2006.10.30 18:38:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: Cosmic Flame
Originally by: Leandro Salazar Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 26/10/2006 18:24:06 Can we please get an option to turn off the seamless stuff and just have our plain old map back? Those transitions are driving me nuts, no purpose except eye-candy, and every one wastes almost 10 secs of my precious time... If I open or close the map, I want to open or close the map asap, not some fancy gfx stunt. Thanks. (If turning the transitions off is already possible, please point me there and chastise me...)
When you load the map on TQ it takes some secs or up to xx minutes depending on the server lag. The difference here is that instead of having 2 separate maps and 1 main view, you now have everything more integrated into one general view that seemlessly zooms out, am i correct? I have yet to actually see it live on SISI, havent been able to log in yet., but at 1st look it seems to be better than the current system which takes you out of the main view and alienates you completely from what is going on. If your in a hot zone with hostiles around, opening up the map could be the last thing you do... SO... unless it just takes way too long zooming out or something, then i don½t see why you would prefer the old system more.
Opening map on TQ just took me about 2-3 secs, with the only effect a shortly frozen ship and then the map view. Maybe slightly more with lag, but I never had any big problems and it didn't harrass my eyes (or my stomach :P). Opening the map on Sisi takes me on a guaranteed 8+ second rollercoaster ride that is extremely annoying when you are forced to watch it for the umpteenth time.
This is why I prefer the old system. Old systems for old farts. Don't mind keeping the transitions for the youngins to enjoy, but please gimme an option to turn them off. Thanks.
Well, maybe the transition could be faster? I'll get a better opinion if/when i finally get to see it 1st hand. Personally, it "appears" to me that a seemless zoom system is better instead of having the different window/map thingy. Then again, having the map button thingy over the overview open up the map instead of just zooming would almost be the same. Still, i think there are functions which make the seemless zoom better? I know i'm discussing this without not having seen it yet so bear that in mind. If the wait time is the problem then... why not an option to decrease the wait time? OFC we are discussing different opinions here. For example, i much prefered the old robotic voice pre-Cold war edition. This current voice sounds like the damned woman is dying on me or something. Back on topic, is it just the zooming in and out that is annoying you, or is it the waiting time itself? |
Cosmic Flame
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Posted - 2006.10.30 18:39:00 -
[54]
And still can't log in to Sisi |
Cosmic Flame
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Posted - 2006.10.31 16:23:00 -
[55]
OK.
After having been able to test the map a bit, i have more reason to believe that it has way more advantages than disadvantages. The +'s are really easy to understand if you look at it carefully. You don't lose situational awareness while you are "zoomed out" in either the system map or star map as your radar is always visible. You can see your own bookmarks in the system map as well as a myriad of other info, as well as keep warping and jumping while observing the starmap. Something which doesnt happen currently on TQ. All in all, the starmap itself doesn't change all that much. But system scanning and situational awareness of what's going on in the system is WAY better with the new seemless map.
But there are -'s, which seem to me more as merely bugs which (i hope) will be fixed by CCP. Namely:
- Zoom feature in the starmap seems broken. This happens when you are in space. Basically, when you try to zoom in the starmap, you can't. But If you are docked and access the map by pressing F10 the map works ok.
- The "reset camera" option is gone. IMHO this should come back. It's a small but very useful feature. I don't see the need to remove it.
- The "+" and "-" on the interface, which on TQ atm just zoom in/out when in-flight/in-space, in Kali zoom in/out to the system map and to the starmap. IMHO this is NOT a good idea. Those buttons should remain as a zoom function for the current view ONLY. So if you are in the in-flight view then pressing those buttons should zoom in or out within that view. If you are in one of the map views, then they should zoom in or out within the map view. But they should NOT zoom between different views as they do in Kali atm. The 3 buttons over the overview already have that function and are way more useful as you can jump directly to one of the 3 views.
- The F10 button does some wierd thing when you are in space. Sometimes it activates the starmap, sometimes it makes the 3 top map buttons vanish, sometimes it does nothing at all. I'm sure its just a bug.
- When you view the system map the in-flight/in-space backround remains the same. This makes it harder to view and understand the system map with certain backrounds. IMHO it should be the same backround as the starmap so that the system map can be readable.
- The transition between the different views should be a bit faster, even thought it doesn't take 10 secs or whatever it is that someone said. In fact it prolly takes at most 4 or 5 seconds to load up. Still, i think a slightly faster transition would be nicer.
But imho, the bottom line is the new seemless map rocks. It's way better for situational awareness and that little feature which i personally hardly ever used (system map) now has a massive tactical usefulness. Ofc, this is something personal, maybe many other people have always used the current system map, i just never saw a real use for it as is tbh.
If anyone else can think of more stuff to add, please do. |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.11.01 00:08:00 -
[56]
Edited thread title to make the issue more clear. The issue is NOT! the new map, only the transitions. And maybe they are faster on a better comp, but on mine they're awfully slow. --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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The EternitY
Minmatar The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.11.01 03:19:00 -
[57]
Though I have not been on the test server I was wondering if the new "transitions" take a bit of bandwidth to push through? I don't want to have to wait for a minute or two for each transition because I don't have a broadband connection.
Reading that it supposedly slows down the game even on Higher speed connections, meaning more hardware related possibly, this option seems pretty improtant-to me atleast.
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.11.01 03:32:00 -
[58]
Um, no? Its just graphics, all in the client... ----------------
Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
The EternitY
Minmatar The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.11.01 22:08:00 -
[59]
Well it may have client side graphics, but does it force a refresh of the map everytime? That comes from the server.
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Fuujin
HDY Research Labs
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Posted - 2006.11.01 22:13:00 -
[60]
You people have issues. _______________ Sig removed. Please keep sigs to 400x120 pixels, 24000 bytes or less, and related to Eve. -Kaemonn |
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