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Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate
257
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Posted - 2015.04.13 02:51:26 -
[91] - Quote
Say your plans go through. Say that the State militia fails to hold the system from your barbarous assault. What effect do you believe that would have on the release of the Jackdaw to the general Capsuleer population? Do you believe that driving people out of their homes will cause anything besides more ire and higher enlistment rates in the Protectorate? This is not some world in the middle of the warzone, this is a border world that has a large population of working people, families. Forcing them from their livelihoods when they've just recently returned is cruel.
I wouldn't expect much besides this from the bloodthirsty Federate militia.
Black Rise was owned by the Caldari first. Back during the closing days of YC 110, the Federation lost all of the support it may have once had in the colonies and on the homeworlds of the people in the Rise when it enacted it's scorched earth policy after being forced from the area by the Caldari Navy.
Don't expect a warm welcome, neither by the Protectorate, nor the civilians. |
Gwen Ikiryo
Alexylva Paradox Low-Class
572
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Posted - 2015.04.13 03:44:58 -
[92] - Quote
Group A engaged in militia war attacks Group B engaged in militia war for engaging in militia war. Group B , in turn, retaliates by insulting Group A for engaging in militia war.
What is it they say in the Federation? +Ç chaque fou pla+«t sa marotte?
You might want to cool yourselves down a little, pilots. |
Makoto Priano
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
6812
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Posted - 2015.04.13 03:56:15 -
[93] - Quote
Ikiryo, you missed the profound announcements with trumpets and drums for Group A, and that Group B is insulting Group A for the trumpets and drums.
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?
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Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
597
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Posted - 2015.04.13 03:59:24 -
[94] - Quote
Yes yes, trumpets and drums only allowed when its for SCIENCE! |
Makoto Priano
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
6812
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Posted - 2015.04.13 04:16:37 -
[95] - Quote
Oh, certainly not, Vero. Soter is far better than most of us at grand pronouncements.
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
4625
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Posted - 2015.04.13 04:34:35 -
[96] - Quote
Rinai Vero wrote:Is it really that hard to grasp? News breaks about Jackdaw development. GMVA leadership starts discussing how we should respond. The idea that we can interfere in research being done in Caldari Hisec is silly.
So, we look at our options for things we can do in range of our operations. Okkamon has Caldari living there who might actually fight if we go there and start causing trouble. So now we are causing trouble.
Not all that much trouble, according to the numbers. If I might make a suggestion try the following plan, next time:
1. Plan the campaign. 2. Launch the campaign. 3. Measure the effects of the campaign. 4. Make a statement about the campaign if you have managed to make an achievement more concrete than a big ass announcement.
The order of the points is important so, no matter how tempted you are, don't skip right to number 4.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
597
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Posted - 2015.04.13 06:03:52 -
[97] - Quote
Jennifer Maxwell wrote:Say your plans go through. Say that the State militia fails to hold the system from your barbarous assault. What effect do you believe that would have on the release of the Jackdaw to the general Capsuleer population? Do you believe that driving people out of their homes will cause anything besides more ire and higher enlistment rates in the Protectorate? This is not some world in the middle of the warzone, this is a border world that has a large population of working people, families. Forcing them from their livelihoods when they've just recently returned is cruel.
I wouldn't expect much besides this from the bloodthirsty Federate militia.
Black Rise was owned by the Caldari first. Back during the closing days of YC 110, the Federation lost all of the support it may have once had in the colonies and on the homeworlds of the people in the Rise when it enacted it's scorched earth policy after being forced from the area by the Caldari Navy.
Don't expect a warm welcome, neither by the Protectorate, nor the civilians.
I appreciate your response, as so far it is one of the few that addresses long term impact of continued hostilities. The question of what we mean to accomplish with this campaign is part of the larger question of why we continue to fight this war at all. Your description of the precarious economic stability of the Okkamon system, and Vikarion's earlier points that the State's economy has recovered over the years of war from its previous malaise, illustrate the danger of the current status quo.
The State is content to see this war drag on, when they should be urgently negotiating its settlement.
Caldari capsuleers set up lucrative resource extraction operations on these "border worlds" and think themselves safe. The "Pendulum War" becomes another datapoint in their profit and loss calculus.
The State itself profits by the illusion that life goes on as normal for its civillian "working people," and "families." They do as all State Citizens do, and devote themselves single mindedly to the greater corporate good, and forget the cost of war.
Well, it is time they remembered. "Bloodthirsty," as you say we are, we aren't waging a Total War against Caldari baseline populations. Nor are we violating the restrictions CONCORD has placed on Capsuleer Militias. Our alliance has long conducted successful commerce interdiction and orbital asset seizure operations throughout the warzone. Now we intend to give the CEP a taste of the focused economic damage that can be inflicted while they refuse to consider an honorable peace.
State scientists will finish their development of the Jackdaw, but that will not shield Okkamon from our retaliation.
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Not all that much trouble, according to the numbers. If I might make a suggestion try the following plan, next time:
Thanks, but no thanks, Pieter. Between your "suggestion" and Evi's "benefit of the doubt," lets drop the pretense that ya'll are pushing anything but your own spin.
I've done the textbook thing. Hell, my operation to retake Ladistier was as by the book as they get. Squid Spin, yours included, on that one was similarly along the lines of "Grr, GalMil. Pendulum! Something something pants." So don't be coy. You're bad at it. |
Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
1681
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Posted - 2015.04.13 08:32:51 -
[98] - Quote
Ria Nieyli wrote: So Okkamon is _JUST NOW_ being declared a warzone.
I... I...
Actually, nevermind.
Major, I guess the most important of this is in this part
Julianus Soter wrote:All civilian vessels and non-combatant capsuleers are hereby ordered to avoid the Okkamon system, as it is now designated a war zone. Any vessel entering the system, regardless of military value, equipment loadout, weapons configuration, or security status, will be targeted and destroyed by GMVA combat patrols.
As declaring a warzone to be a warzone could be silly even for such beings as a gallente (but who knows?), I guess the point of the message is they are going to do pirating in the designated system.
Luckily for our entrepreneurs, gallentean menace is contained at the level that their presence can be considered occasional and insignificant. |
Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
1681
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Posted - 2015.04.13 08:35:57 -
[99] - Quote
Rinai Vero wrote:Is it really that hard to grasp? News breaks about Jackdaw development. GMVA leadership starts discussing how we should respond. The idea that we can interfere in research being done in Caldari Hisec is silly.
So, we look at our options for things we can do in range of our operations. Okkamon has Caldari living there who might actually fight if we go there and start causing trouble. So now we are causing trouble. In other words, you heard news as someone did something in system X, so you decided to go pirating in system Y. I got your "reasoning", Vero. The more I understand you gallenteans, the more I despise beings like you. |
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
920
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Posted - 2015.04.13 11:17:09 -
[100] - Quote
Gwen Ikiryo wrote:+Ç chaque fou pla+«t sa marotte?
Wow... I have not heard that one in ages !
I am quite fond of proverbs. |
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Bourbon Limoges
Maison Ceramique Limoges Chocolatiers
39
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Posted - 2015.04.13 19:04:30 -
[101] - Quote
Rinai Vero wrote:Yes yes, trumpets and drums only allowed when its for SCIENCE!
Trumpets and drums are also allowed for PUPPIES! |
Julianus Soter
Moira. Villore Accords
266
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Posted - 2015.04.13 21:28:39 -
[102] - Quote
Okkamon has risen to 13% contestedness as of this message. Hostile pirate organization pilot Ithica Hawk flew a false-flagged combat Orca through Okkamon, and it was intercepted and destroyed, along with its attendant fleet of weapon-fitted Ventures. Total value of the engagement was roughly 1 billion isk.
Moira. Corporation CEO, Executor, Villore Accords, @Julianus_Soter
https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99001634/
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Luna Hanaya
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
58
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Posted - 2015.04.14 03:00:41 -
[103] - Quote
Julianus Soter wrote:Okkamon has risen to 13% contestedness as of this message. Hostile pirate organization pilot Ithica Hawk flew a false-flagged combat Orca through Okkamon, and it was intercepted and destroyed, along with its attendant fleet of weapon-fitted Ventures. Total value of the engagement was roughly 1 billion isk.
Heathen pirates!!
((
If you are a roleplayer, or want to learn about roleplay, please join "Out of Character" and "Intergalactic Summit" channels in game,
Lets show CCP that there are many roleplayers still here, and we want more Live Events!!
))
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IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome Heiian Conglomerate
1419
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Posted - 2015.04.15 06:33:36 -
[104] - Quote
So.....
Hows it going?
https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
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Feu dAstres
Nox Draconum Holding Corp Nox Draconum
27
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Posted - 2015.04.15 09:51:52 -
[105] - Quote
That's a bit of a change from the old tried-and-true battle iteron. |
Julianus Soter
Moira. Villore Accords
267
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Posted - 2015.04.15 11:25:30 -
[106] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:So.....
Hows it going?
Thank you for asking.
Our initial phase of the campaign has destroyed 175 ships, with a total ISK value of 6.53 billion isk. This is roughly 35 ships destroyed per day, or 1.3 billion isk per day. This comes at a loss of 70 ships over the same period, at a loss of 1.62 billion ISK.
This equates to a combat efficiency of 80.07%.
Villore Accords General Staff wishes to remind civilians and capsuleers alike inside the Okkamon system that this operation is scheduled to escalate. Please evacuate the system or otherwise stay out of the fighting. Our goal here is not to kill innocents; but to harm the megacorporations that are facilitating the ongoing war effort of the Chief Executive Panel and the Caldari State.
Moira. Corporation CEO, Executor, Villore Accords, @Julianus_Soter
https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99001634/
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Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
920
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Posted - 2015.04.15 12:28:55 -
[107] - Quote
I may have understood wrong but shall all non involved people evacuate as stated, or just stay out of the conflict ? Does that mean that Villore Accords are actually not going to operate under NBSI policy in the system ? If so, what are your criterias to engage people ?
It could prove constructive to be clearer on those points, if your goal is really to avoid killing "innocents". |
Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
599
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Posted - 2015.04.15 14:18:24 -
[108] - Quote
GMVA Rules of Engagement give wide latitude to Fleet Commanders. Under normal circumstances I don't order my fleets to engage neutral targets who aren't taking aggressive action. I also tend to ignore neutral industrial ships, despite the fact that most industrials flown by "neutrals" in low security space are probably there to provide logistic support to Pirates or Militias.
However, as my downward trending Security Status indicates, it is often necessary to engage "neutrals" who attempt to interfere with our military operations.
In Okkamon, it is important for all parties to know that GMVA forces have been directed to engage any "neutral" target in the system within the tactical capability of our fleet composition. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
4636
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Posted - 2015.04.15 15:24:09 -
[109] - Quote
Here I have to say that the problem that Rinai describes affects all Militia Capsuleers. Concord does very little in low security space - save tattle on those doing their jobs by engaging pirate ships.
Neutral parties are not and should never consider themselves separate from the militia wars when they are in the warzone. Pirate organisations frequently use a neutral flag as an excuse to engage all comers and, as a result, neutral flagged ships are typically engaged on sight by all savvy commanders.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
920
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Posted - 2015.04.15 19:06:29 -
[110] - Quote
That sounds very ambiguous and carefree to me. |
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Claudia Osyn
Minmatar Confederate Ushra'Khan
1155
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Posted - 2015.04.15 19:30:09 -
[111] - Quote
*yawn* have we won yet?
The lack of money is the root of all evil.
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Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
602
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Posted - 2015.04.15 19:45:22 -
[112] - Quote
Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet?
Not fast enough. |
Claudia Osyn
Minmatar Confederate Ushra'Khan
1155
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Posted - 2015.04.15 20:04:08 -
[113] - Quote
Rinai Vero wrote:Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet? Not fast enough. Ah, well, shoot me a message when you crush that pesky Caldari State into complete and total surrender. I'll spring for some goodies for the victory party.
The lack of money is the root of all evil.
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
4640
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Posted - 2015.04.15 20:15:05 -
[114] - Quote
Lyn Farel wrote:That sounds very ambiguous and carefree to me.
Thank you for noticing, I am enjoying life as a Private Military Contractor, yes.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Julianus Soter
Moira. Villore Accords
267
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Posted - 2015.04.15 21:20:59 -
[115] - Quote
Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet?
Not until all are free.
Moira. Corporation CEO, Executor, Villore Accords, @Julianus_Soter
https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99001634/
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Evi Polevhia
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
877
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Posted - 2015.04.15 22:30:37 -
[116] - Quote
Julianus Soter wrote:Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet? Not until all are free.
I really don't think they want your version of free. Some sort of big civil war thingy happened, I think. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
4640
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Posted - 2015.04.15 22:48:10 -
[117] - Quote
Freedom may vary according to terms and conditions. Statutory conditions may apply. Your mileage may vary. Ask your legislative body if GalFed Freedom (tm) is right for you. Freedom may cause unexplained internal bleeding in conflict with other states of being, if you begin to suffer from majority rule and unexplained oppression, discontinue freedom immediately and see your doctor.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Evi Polevhia
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
877
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Posted - 2015.04.15 22:58:03 -
[118] - Quote
Something something Black Eagles. |
Liam Antolliere
Liberty Vanguard
325
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Posted - 2015.04.15 23:32:24 -
[119] - Quote
Julianus Soter wrote:Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet? Not until all are free.
With all due respect, Monsieur Soter...
Freedom forced upon anyone is merely tyranny wearing a different skin.
"Let it never be said that I have not been true to myself and, in so doing, true to those around me."
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Rhiannon Dellacorte
Repracor Industries
135
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Posted - 2015.04.15 23:37:51 -
[120] - Quote
Julianus Soter wrote:Claudia Osyn wrote:*yawn* have we won yet? Not until all are free.
Anybody else think this sounds like, "We come for our people"?
Its not very nice to reappropriate somebody else's culture for your own political ends, Soter.
Rules of Acquisition #261
A wealthy man can afford anything except a conscience.
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