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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:04:44 -
[451] - Quote
Ncc 1709 wrote:Fozzy im not seeing that much variance between the belts... the figures I have in the pic are max possible refine (tier 3 minmatar, max skills, +4 implant) https://www.dropbox.com/s/09f8xcee00ys4ta/ores.jpg?dl=0 as you can see, the variance between mineral per m3 after the small belt is almost identical for every belt. if you were to make it so one belt provided more, the small would stay as it is. the large would need mex to be 200% the xl put nocxium at 20 to 30% the xxl should have the greater highends to make it more valuable, say 8% zydrine and 4% mega. as it is. the belt that everyone is going to mine is the small, because it has the highest % of all the lowends uh, that entirely depends on if the miner wants lowends or highends which largely depends on if this is successful in undoing the highend glut |
Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:07:17 -
[452] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey everyone. After reading through the feedback so far we've made some tweaks to the compositions of the Anoms. Now the ratios between different minerals have more variance from anom type to anom type, so that nullsec groups will be able to take advantage of the choice of different anoms to get slightly different mineral ratios. For instance, under the new numbers the Mediums have extra Mexallon so if you find you're low on Mex you can mine out some mediums.
The OP has been updated.
Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? I mean thats the name of the game now right self sufficiency? No more needing to import/export, no more need to take what your neighbor has and give nothing back?
I can expect to see HS and LS anoms with ABC ore in them ya? I mean, in HS I have no access to Zydrine or Megacyte...why should I have to import from NS, and not vice versa?
Pretty huge difference:
NS: We don't produce much because we DONT mine the material available to us. LS+HS: We don't produce much because we CANT mine the material we need.
Fun fact, NS mining/production has always been more profitable than HS, people don't do it in NS, because they don't want to live in NS....these changes are not going to change anyones mindset about that. Seems really really redundant from that viewpoint...and largely hypocritical to say one region of space should be self sufficient, while others are forced into a greater dependency on that region.
HS+LS ABC anoms please.
*disclaimer I think the changes here are great, and i am all for NS being more self sufficient, but that should also be extended to ALL areas of space, not just NS. |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Shadow of xXDEATHXx
179
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:10:12 -
[453] - Quote
people who say nullsec mining doesn't happen don't live in nullsec.
I updated my previous post with a better pic. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:10:24 -
[454] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? I mean thats the name of the game now right self sufficiency? No more needing to import/export, no more need to take what your neighbor has and give nothing back?
I can expect to see HS and LS anoms with ABC ore in them ya? I mean, in HS I have no access to Zydrine or Megacyte...why should I have to import from NS, and not vice versa?
Pretty huge difference:
NS: We don't produce much because we DONT mine the material available to us. LS+HS: We don't produce much because we CANT mine the material we need.
Fun fact, NS mining/production has always been more profitable than HS, people don't do it in NS, because they don't want to live in NS....these changes are not going to change anyones mindset about that. Seems really really redundant from that viewpoint...and largely hypocritical to say one region of space should be self sufficient, while others are forced into a greater dependency on that region.
HS+LS ABC anoms please.
You've made the fundamental mistake of thinking that Eve is fair.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:13:53 -
[455] - Quote
Querns wrote:Mario Putzo wrote: Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? I mean thats the name of the game now right self sufficiency? No more needing to import/export, no more need to take what your neighbor has and give nothing back?
I can expect to see HS and LS anoms with ABC ore in them ya? I mean, in HS I have no access to Zydrine or Megacyte...why should I have to import from NS, and not vice versa?
Pretty huge difference:
NS: We don't produce much because we DONT mine the material available to us. LS+HS: We don't produce much because we CANT mine the material we need.
Fun fact, NS mining/production has always been more profitable than HS, people don't do it in NS, because they don't want to live in NS....these changes are not going to change anyones mindset about that. Seems really really redundant from that viewpoint...and largely hypocritical to say one region of space should be self sufficient, while others are forced into a greater dependency on that region.
HS+LS ABC anoms please.
You've made the fundamental mistake of thinking that Eve is fair.
And yet here we are in a thread about making EVE more fair for 1 of 4 regions of space. Ironic isn't it. NS complains about lowends , CCP addresses concerns, "YAY BRAVO CCP". HS complains about lack of highend access "SHUT UP PUBBIE EVE ISNT FAIR." |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:14:44 -
[456] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Querns wrote:Mario Putzo wrote: Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? I mean thats the name of the game now right self sufficiency? No more needing to import/export, no more need to take what your neighbor has and give nothing back?
I can expect to see HS and LS anoms with ABC ore in them ya? I mean, in HS I have no access to Zydrine or Megacyte...why should I have to import from NS, and not vice versa?
Pretty huge difference:
NS: We don't produce much because we DONT mine the material available to us. LS+HS: We don't produce much because we CANT mine the material we need.
Fun fact, NS mining/production has always been more profitable than HS, people don't do it in NS, because they don't want to live in NS....these changes are not going to change anyones mindset about that. Seems really really redundant from that viewpoint...and largely hypocritical to say one region of space should be self sufficient, while others are forced into a greater dependency on that region.
HS+LS ABC anoms please.
You've made the fundamental mistake of thinking that Eve is fair. And yet here we are in a thread about making EVE more fair for 1 of 4 regions of space. Ironic isn't it. NS complains about lowends , CCP addresses concerns, "YAY BRAVO CCP". HS complains about lack of highend access "SHUT UP PUBBIE EVE ISNT FAIR." The change doesn't make nullsec more fair, it makes nullsec more self-sufficient.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:16:17 -
[457] - Quote
Querns wrote: The change doesn't make nullsec more fair, it makes nullsec more self-sufficient.
Which is exactly what I just said they should do for HS and LS, and you said "EVE isn't fair." |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:17:57 -
[458] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Querns wrote: The change doesn't make nullsec more fair, it makes nullsec more self-sufficient.
Which is exactly what I just said they should do for HS and LS, and you said "EVE isn't fair." Because it isn't. The change helps nullsec the most, gives a token boost for lowsec, and does nothing to highsec. This is not fair, nor is it intended to be. Regions of space do not exist nor are supposed to exist in perfect balance. If they did, there would be no L4 missions or highsec incursions in highsec.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:17:58 -
[459] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey everyone. After reading through the feedback so far we've made some tweaks to the compositions of the Anoms. Now the ratios between different minerals have more variance from anom type to anom type, so that nullsec groups will be able to take advantage of the choice of different anoms to get slightly different mineral ratios. For instance, under the new numbers the Mediums have extra Mexallon so if you find you're low on Mex you can mine out some mediums.
The OP has been updated. Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? when the highends that go into a battleship take an equal amount of space as trit does
"oh woe is me, my need to import a single blockade runner worth of stuff every year is the same as nullsec needing multiple jump freighters per day for the same production chain" |
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Shadow of xXDEATHXx
179
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:18:23 -
[460] - Quote
Why should the people who work the least to get the anomaly belts get the best yields from it??
https://www.dropbox.com/s/s1pd703om7e9n03/ores2.jpg?dl=0 |
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EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:19:27 -
[461] - Quote
what kind of idiot thinks mineral prices will stay the same given these changes? |
Anhenka
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
1446
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:19:36 -
[462] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: And yet here we are in a thread about making EVE more fair for 1 of 4 regions of space. Ironic isn't it. NS complains about lowends , CCP addresses concerns, "YAY BRAVO CCP". HS complains about lack of highend access "SHUT UP PUBBIE EVE ISNT FAIR."
I might be ever so slightly more sympathetic if CCP had not openly stated that the days of 10LY range of jump freighters are numbered.
Complaining that nullsec should continue to be dependent on highsec for lowends even once CCP makes that impossible is "unlikely" at even my most charitable, and "batshit crazy" on my normal level of concern for your sensitivities. |
Hendrink Collie
Steel Fleet Gentlemen's.Club
15
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:20:09 -
[463] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Querns wrote: The change doesn't make nullsec more fair, it makes nullsec more self-sufficient.
Which is exactly what I just said they should do for HS and LS, and you said "EVE isn't fair."
Wait, why should HS + LS get more lucrative ores even though... espically in high-sec's case, whe there is a lot less risk involved in the process of mining the ore. With risk, there comes reward, and null-sec is a lot more risky than high-sec unless you are hauling 3b+ worth of junk in a charon. CCP wants people to risk more to get more, not the other way around. |
Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:24:13 -
[464] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey everyone. After reading through the feedback so far we've made some tweaks to the compositions of the Anoms. Now the ratios between different minerals have more variance from anom type to anom type, so that nullsec groups will be able to take advantage of the choice of different anoms to get slightly different mineral ratios. For instance, under the new numbers the Mediums have extra Mexallon so if you find you're low on Mex you can mine out some mediums.
The OP has been updated. Sounds good, so when are LS and HS going to be absolved of having to import from NS? when the highends that go into a battleship take an equal amount of space as trit does "oh woe is me, my need to import a single blockade runner worth of stuff every year is the same as nullsec needing multiple jump freighters per day for the same production chain"
But NS has access to tons of trit, its not my fault or CCPs fault people simply DONT mine it. Its easier to just buy in bulk in HS already broken down, compressed yada yada. Still does not change the fact TRIT has always been available in large supply to NS folks...they just don't mine it. (probably because mining is god awful boring).
Main difference, again for the folks who obviously DONT read either, is that HS CANT mine for megacyte in any capacity. The only source for Megacyte in HS and LS is gun mining.
CANT and DONT are two very different words. You should look them up in a dictionary sometime. |
Anhenka
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
1446
|
Posted - 2015.04.21 15:25:43 -
[465] - Quote
Hendrink Collie wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:Querns wrote: The change doesn't make nullsec more fair, it makes nullsec more self-sufficient.
Which is exactly what I just said they should do for HS and LS, and you said "EVE isn't fair." Wait, why should HS + LS get more lucrative ores even though... espically in high-sec's case, whe there is a lot less risk involved in the process of mining the ore. With risk, there comes reward, and null-sec is a lot more risky than high-sec unless you are hauling 3b+ worth of junk in a charon. CCP wants people to risk more to get more, not the other way around.
Didn't you get the memo? It's so safe in nullsec and so lucrative to mine that it's horribly unfair, despite all the effort and isk and time that goes into obtaining, upgrading, and protecting it. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:26:03 -
[466] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: But NS has access to tons of trit
This is incorrect.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:26:06 -
[467] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: But NS has access to tons of trit, its not my fault or CCPs fault people simply DONT mine it. Its easier to just buy in bulk in HS already broken down, compressed yada yada. Still does not change the fact TRIT has always been available in large supply to NS folks...they just don't mine it. (probably because mining is god awful boring).
Main difference, again for the folks who obviously DONT read either, is that HS CANT mine for megacyte in any capacity. The only source for Megacyte in HS and LS is gun mining.
CANT and DONT are two very different words. You should look them up in a dictionary sometime.
this entire post is basically "i know i'm completely wrong and can't support my argument in any sensible way so i'm going to try to debate pointless details in the hope that someone thinks they're relevant" |
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CCP Fozzie
C C P C C P Alliance
12652
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:27:39 -
[468] - Quote
No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they.
Game Designer | Team Five-0
https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie
http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/
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EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:27:49 -
[469] - Quote
"you see, if you ignore all sensible ways of thinking and instead adopt reasoning so stupid even the dimmest of bulbs don't reach for it unless it's literally the only thing that gets you to the result you want, then the situation becomes somewhat ambiguious. let us all debate things according to my obviously pointless approach and hope that people forget how to think"
if an activity is possible in a cosmic sense and pointless, that is irrelevant in a game |
GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
115
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:28:50 -
[470] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they.
NICE REGION, WE'LL TAKE IT!
Upgraded Ore Anomalies are all uniform, however.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:35:55 -
[471] - Quote
GankYou wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. NICE REGION, WE'LL TAKE IT! Upgraded Ore Anomalies are all uniform, however. Nah. Truesec plays a part in giving you boosted anoms with +5% and +10% variants.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1053
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:36:09 -
[472] - Quote
GankYou wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. NICE REGION, WE'LL TAKE IT! Upgraded Ore Anomalies are all uniform, however. they vary based on truesec (better trusec gets +5% or +10% versions) |
Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:38:01 -
[473] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they.
Except they do just that. Assuming of course NS folks actually learns where the undock button is while sitting in Mining vessels.
Might I ask, what is the actual intended purpose of these changes then? If not to make NS more self sufficient, at the obvious cost to LS and HS regions?
edit and if these changes do not make NS fully self sufficient (which they don't) why can we not also have anoms available in HS and LS that have ore with Megacyte and Zydrine? It won't make them fully self sufficient, but it will decrease the dependency on NS importing...which is as far as I can tell the whole point of the changes to NS ore, less requirement to import from HS/LS. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
1102
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:41:59 -
[474] - Quote
These threads on ore and structures are getting a bit hard to keep up with. It could be time to consolidate feedback and unsticky them, with new ones in place based on the current position in development. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:42:29 -
[475] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. Except they do just that. Assuming of course NS folks actually learns where the undock button is while sitting in Mining vessels. Might I ask, what is the actual intended purpose of these changes then? If not to make NS more self sufficient, at the obvious cost to LS and HS regions? "more" does not equal "fully."
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
6048
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:45:14 -
[476] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. Except they do just that. Assuming of course NS folks actually learns where the undock button is while sitting in Mining vessels. Might I ask, what is the actual intended purpose of these changes then? If not to make NS more self sufficient, at the obvious cost to LS and HS regions?
Weren't you just pontificating about the differences between don't and can't? There is also a difference between "More" self-sufficient and "fully" self-sufficient.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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Dersen Lowery
Drinking in Station
1552
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:45:22 -
[477] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:and if these changes do not make NS fully self sufficient (which they don't) why can we not also have anoms available in HS and LS that have ore with Megacyte and Zydrine? It won't make them fully self sufficient, but it will decrease the dependency on NS importing...which is as far as I can tell the whole point of the changes to NS ore, less requirement to import from HS/LS.
Do you have a better idea for weaning nullsec off Jita?
Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.
I voted in CSM X!
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Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:47:02 -
[478] - Quote
Querns wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. Except they do just that. Assuming of course NS folks actually learns where the undock button is while sitting in Mining vessels. Might I ask, what is the actual intended purpose of these changes then? If not to make NS more self sufficient, at the obvious cost to LS and HS regions? "more" does not equal "fully."
No ****?
Its a good thing I never said NS was fully self sufficient then, otherwise Id look like a boob.
All I am asking is, if NS can get changes that reduce their dependency on HS, why can HS also not receive changes that reduce dependency on NS?
Fun fact...some folks just don't want to live and operate in NS, just as some folks don't want to live and operate in HS. If changing ores in NS increases self sufficiency without making them fully self sufficient, then adding Highend mineral sources to HS and LS will result in the exact same, more self sufficiency, but not full self sufficiency. |
Mario Putzo
1197
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:50:57 -
[479] - Quote
Dersen Lowery wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:and if these changes do not make NS fully self sufficient (which they don't) why can we not also have anoms available in HS and LS that have ore with Megacyte and Zydrine? It won't make them fully self sufficient, but it will decrease the dependency on NS importing...which is as far as I can tell the whole point of the changes to NS ore, less requirement to import from HS/LS. Do you have a better idea for weaning nullsec off Jita?
I do actually.
Make LS the primary source for all Low End minerals, and High End moon goos.
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Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1611
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:52:01 -
[480] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Querns wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:No area of space is intended to be fully self sufficient. These changes will not make any area of space fully self sufficient, nor should they. Except they do just that. Assuming of course NS folks actually learns where the undock button is while sitting in Mining vessels. Might I ask, what is the actual intended purpose of these changes then? If not to make NS more self sufficient, at the obvious cost to LS and HS regions? "more" does not equal "fully." No ****? Its a good thing I never said NS was fully self sufficient then, otherwise Id look like a boob. Considering that you said "Except they do just that" to CCP Fozzie's statement "These changes will not make any area of space fully self-sufficient," I can only conclude that you are moving the goalposts.
Also, one can make nullsec more self-sufficient without a commensurate increase of self-sufficiency in other parts of the game. Remember, Eve is not fair.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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