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Lady Zarrina
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
180
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Posted - 2015.04.16 23:12:12 -
[1] - Quote
When are the Amarrian ships going to get some love. On paper they never seem that bad. Their lasers have decent damage projection out farther than most, and they can quickly change their damage projection. But.... the market has spoken. Amarrian ships on the whole are always about 25% less than the average. I'm sure there are a few exceptions, but none that are currently popping to mind ( my alcohol laden mind to be clear).
So I am just wondering, is there any hope for Amarrian ships, or are they just delegated to be eternally worse than timex knock-offs. Actually I wonder how many people nowadays have actually seen a timex :) sorta like I wonder how many people actually see Amarrian ships in use.
EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
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Liam Inkuras
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
1525
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Posted - 2015.04.16 23:20:37 -
[2] - Quote
I see Amarr ships used all the time, and use them extensively myself. Perhaps you should expand your perspective to encompass all activities in eve
I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
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Lady Zarrina
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
180
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Posted - 2015.04.16 23:25:48 -
[3] - Quote
Care to expand a little? What aspects of eve am I missing. Most doctrines I have seen use drones, missiles, rails or projectiles. Sure there are a few that make exceptions for the inclusion of Amarrian ships, but rarely are they the focal point.
EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
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Dato Koppla
Konvict Cartel The Asylum.
796
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Posted - 2015.04.16 23:37:23 -
[4] - Quote
Having your ship be a part of a nullsec doctrine doesn't make it the best, it just makes it good at being a big fleet ship. There are many good Amarr ships and just because they are cheaper on the market doesn't mean they are worse, it's a supply and demand thing. The Rattlesnake is a prime example it's an excellent ship, very popular for L4 missions and extremely powerful for PvP yet it's so cheap, and this is because Guristas null is farmed to hell and back means theres a huge supply.
Here's some solid Amarr ships for PvP that I like and fly: Executioner, Tormentor, Sentinel, Vengeance, Omen, Omen Navy, Augoror Navy, Arbitrator, Curse, Pilgrim, Sacrilege, Armageddon, Prophecy. These are just the ones I like and think are awesome, there are many others too. |
Lady Zarrina
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
180
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Posted - 2015.04.16 23:57:02 -
[5] - Quote
Yup all valid points Dato.
Supply and demand does effect the price. I don't think Amarrian ships are over supplied, but I could be wrong. Well I once I said that, I guess they are over supplied, because if they were under supplied, the price should be at least average. So maybe I am way off base and everyone loves Amarrian ships (or at least producing Amarrian ships?)
I think we need Provi to stand strong and enforce Amarrian only fleets. Plus I might have 1 or 2 extra for sale?
EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
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Paranoid Loyd
4752
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Posted - 2015.04.17 00:01:33 -
[6] - Quote
Liam is talking about small gangs, Navy Omen is arguably the best kiter in the current meta. The videos of them farming Brave are both hilarious and very educational, check them out.
Purifier is the most popular SB, Navy Aug is a ridiculous brick, Slicer is probably the best kiting frig if you know how to fly it, Oracles cover wide range of uses from cheap POS bashers to being able to solo gank fail fit Occators. The Curse and the Pilgrim are both very good for cheapish solo cloaky hunting, Armageddon is a decent alternative if you can't afford a Bhaalgorn. Confessor is pretty damn fun to fly and very popular.
Making an argument that they are not used because they are in fleet doctrines is just silly.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Lady Zarrina
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
180
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Posted - 2015.04.17 00:08:06 -
[7] - Quote
Yup I can't find a whole lot of fault in any reply so far. I guess Amarrian ships are just largely over produced. And the doctrine designers all own non-Amarrian BPO's.
EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
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Paranoid Loyd
4755
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Posted - 2015.04.17 00:37:31 -
[8] - Quote
Lady Zarrina wrote:Plus I might have 1 or 2 extra for sale? Figured this was your motivation, if you have an Omen, Tormentor (for slicer) or Augoror BPO, consider making an FW alt and turn them into Navy versions.
These corps will have the chips you need if you want to run missions to get them: Amarr Constructions, Ardishapur Family, Carthum Conglomerate, Ducia Foundry, Further Foodstuffs, HZO Refinery, Imperial Armaments, Inherent Implants, Joint Harvesting, Noble Appliances, Nurtura, Royal Amarr Institute, Viziam, Zoar and Sons
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2112
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Posted - 2015.04.17 00:51:24 -
[9] - Quote
Amarr ships are great. Particularly when you need something with an enormous armor buffer. |
Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
114
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Posted - 2015.04.17 04:29:07 -
[10] - Quote
First impression after reading was like amarrian ships are bad cause they are cheap. Then was like they are bad cause you don't see them on doctrine listing. And at the end these ships are bad duhe to poor dps comparing with other factions.
I think you have all the feedback provided has cleared your vision of amarr ships. |
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Lan Wang
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
363
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Posted - 2015.04.17 08:41:04 -
[11] - Quote
Lady Zarrina wrote:Care to expand a little? What aspects of eve am I missing. Most doctrines I have seen use drones, missiles, rails or projectiles. Sure there are a few that make exceptions for the inclusion of Amarrian ships, but rarely are they the focal point.
no legions, apoc navy, zealots, purifiers, bhaalgorns, archons, redeemers are all top doctrine ships not to forget guardians
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
578
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Posted - 2015.04.17 10:51:13 -
[12] - Quote
Amarr ships are excellent, but mostly in non-doctrine roles and for solo / small fleet.
The big usage gap is fleet doctrines, which never have anything to do with real balance, they're just trendy FOTM stuff. |
Brea Lafail
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
17
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Posted - 2015.04.17 17:21:32 -
[13] - Quote
Amarr are underused more due to to the popularity of shield tanking on sub-battleship hulls (and the popularity of sub-battleship doctrines). There are some great Amarr ships, but they're probably not being lost in the same numbers as null-doctrine ships, thus the over supply by industrialists that don't do market research.
That's my hunch, anyway. I can't be bothered to pull up actual data, so I'm just going to assume that I'm right. |
SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
285
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Posted - 2015.04.17 19:47:58 -
[14] - Quote
Stop by my Confessor and be absolved of your sins. And your hull. And your pod. |
To mare
Advanced Technology
404
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Posted - 2015.04.18 11:20:51 -
[15] - Quote
Lady Zarrina wrote:When are the Amarrian ships going to get some love. On paper they never seem that bad. Their lasers have decent damage projection out farther than most, and they can quickly change their damage projection. But.... the market has spoken. Amarrian ships on the whole are always about 25% less than the average. I'm sure there are a few exceptions, but none that are currently popping to mind ( my alcohol laden mind to be clear).
So I am just wondering, is there any hope for Amarrian ships, or are they just delegated to be eternally worse than timex knock-offs. Actually I wonder how many people nowadays have actually seen a timex :) sorta like I wonder how many people actually see Amarrian ships in use. as someone who use ships from all the race i have to say i usually buy less amarr ships just because they dont die as often as the other races ships, with the right fleet they are extremely effective and reliable.
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SpyCow
No1. Crazy Firetail Squadron
0
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Posted - 2015.04.22 05:06:42 -
[16] - Quote
Amarr ships are often underrated for some reason.
They are bloody brilliant!!
it's actually getting to the point where I'm thinking of not flying them as they can be borderline OP with the new small beam lasers etc. |
Xequecal
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
280
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Posted - 2015.04.23 12:28:46 -
[17] - Quote
Amarr problems:
1. Amarr ships use a weapon system designed for kiting yet mostly get hulls designed for brawling. It's the exact inverse of the problem Minmatar ships have, namely that they get a weapon system designed for brawling and all their hulls are designed for kiting.
Amarr ships are in general too slow to kite and lasers are simply terrible if your opponent gets into web range. Tracking sucks, high cap use, thermal damage, etc. The few Amarr ships that break this mold and actually can kite, like the Navy Omen, are very, very good.
2. Amarr ships are stupidly skill intensive. Lasers are designed for kiting, and the only way you can kite on ships with 6 or 7 low slots is to run a paper thin active tank or even run no tank at all, active or passive. This means one tiny mistake = instant death. Really good players that know how to exploit the ship can run a Navy Omen 1v20, get six kills, and then get away. Most players will just horribly die even 1v1.
3. Amarr ships are also stupidly SP intensive. The overpowered FOTM Navy Omen fit requires AWU V AND Energy Weapon Rigging V to fit, for example. The same goes for trying to fit tachyons to battleships, AWU V is basically required while you don't need AWU at all to fit rails to a Megathron.
4. The main Amarr advantages, namely that their weapons are great at kiting and sniping, have been completely usurped by sentry drones. Zealot/Guardian fleets used to be a mainline doctrine, today this is an epic joke considering Ishtars do about double the DPS with triple the tracking and triple the range while selecting damage type and using no cap and etc etc etc.
5. Amarr T2 resists are rather ****. Here's a pretty much comprehensive list of the sources of explosive damage that actually get used in the game right now:
- Bombers - Sentry drones - Doomsdays
If you're running a ship with T2 resists, you don't care about bombers or doomsdays anyway. If you're running an Amarr ship (Read: A ship without sentry drones) against a ship using sentry drones, you lose by default since sentry drones are > everything to an absurd degree. |
Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
125
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Posted - 2015.04.23 12:55:14 -
[18] - Quote
Xequecal are you mad bro? |
Solomar Espersei
Quality Assurance
566
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Posted - 2015.04.23 15:23:01 -
[19] - Quote
Yeap, sounds mad, but still made damn good points.
Quality Assurance
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SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
290
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Posted - 2015.04.24 14:54:45 -
[20] - Quote
Yes, he made a very well thought out post, +1 from me. I would heartily agree with everything he said. I would say that perhaps the best 'kiting' amarr ship in the game right now is the sniping confessor...at least for the rest of the week. It's the one exception to the rule where you can have good speed, engagement range (70 optimal), good tracking, and decent dps. If you can keep your distance from blobs, anything that is generally faster than you can usually be killed extremely quickly in sharpshooter mode (or at least driven off). Unless you're being chased by 10mn svipuls. |
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Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
127
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Posted - 2015.04.24 20:36:46 -
[21] - Quote
It's just a lot of words without numbers. His personal opinion. And what he described is mianly related to fitting of certain mods and their stats but not the ships. Sounds like amarr is only good for kiting but in the meantime it's sucks everywhere else. Go back to the first page there are some good examples. |
W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
279
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Posted - 2015.04.24 21:07:29 -
[22] - Quote
Amarr is amazing in small to med scale brawling in groups. Also as said above, kiting in general. |
Grease PaYN
Calibrated Chaos Dead Terrorists
23
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Posted - 2015.04.24 23:26:20 -
[23] - Quote
I agree with Xequecal's point on Amarr T2 resists.
Supposedly T2 resists are geared towards countering the opposing faction's damage types, but what happens when the enemy faction uses selectable damage types? (Phased Plasma says hi)
You can counter talwars pretty good with t2 amarr, I guess
Other than that, I believe Amarr ships and lasers are in a good place right now. |
Xequecal
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
283
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Posted - 2015.04.25 11:53:48 -
[24] - Quote
Grease PaYN wrote:I agree with Xequecal's point on Amarr T2 resists. Supposedly T2 resists are geared towards countering the opposing faction's damage types, but what happens when the enemy faction uses selectable damage types? (Phased Plasma says hi) You can counter talwars pretty good with t2 amarr, I guess Other than that, I believe Amarr ships and lasers are in a good place right now.
The problem isn't actually that Minmatar can select damage types, the problem is that nobody flies Minmatar because they're garbage. Projectiles are just **** even when compared against the other turrets, let alone when you compare them against sentry drones.
You're playing light missiles and sentry drones online, start getting used to it. |
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Dark Nexxus S I L E N T.
148
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Posted - 2015.04.25 13:07:04 -
[25] - Quote
i personally love amarr ships especially the geddon. but wondering something else related, is the baddon still used as i think the apoc, geddon or oracle outshine it so badly |
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