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Deceiver's Echo
True Resource Acquisition Corporation
38
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Posted - 2015.05.02 20:56:08 -
[1] - Quote
I humbly request all aggression towards Drifter assets cease. All efforts from this point forward should be attempts to communicate.
If Drifter assets are intercepting this communication, I request contact to begin a dialogue. I reside within Yulai.
To the Nations of New Eden, I say this: Drifter assets predate ours. This is their space. We must learn to co-exist.
We observe. We wait. We prepare. As one. |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1454
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Posted - 2015.05.02 21:21:04 -
[2] - Quote
No one is going to listen to the request of a Nation loyalist.
And this is our space, not theirs. If they wish to communicate then they can be the ones to initiate it, after leaving our space. Judging from past experience with these drifters, seekers, sleepers, and so on, communication is not something they will be doing anytime soon.
"Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away."
-- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
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Evi Polevhia
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
966
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Posted - 2015.05.02 22:08:30 -
[3] - Quote
Samira Kernher wrote:No one is going to listen to the request of a Nation loyalist.
What was that? Can't hear you over the noise all of these medals the 24th IC has given me. Speak up.
Samira Kernher wrote:And this is our space, not theirs.
A man walks in to a cave to escape a fierce blizzard outside. The sun has gone and he cannot see. Blindly, he gropes deeper into the cave to escape the cruel winds that bite at his skin. Upon making his way in he discovers a large patch of warm moss and lays down to rest.
And then it moves. It is not moss, but the fur of a bear. The man jumps up and protests this.
"I came in to this cave to escape the wind! I have no where else to go! I did not see you when I came in so I claimed this cave!"
However, the bear was there first and did not care what the newcomer claimed. More importantly, it was a bear. So it simply ate the man. |
Samira Kernher
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1454
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Posted - 2015.05.02 22:22:14 -
[4] - Quote
Quaint, but in our story the bear left the cave long before we found it. We have taken and sculpted that cave, molded and decorated it. It is our cave, and we will not be cowed and flee just because that bear has wandered back.
And the Lord spake, and said, Lo, my people, Witness, for I have made the worlds of Heaven; And these worlds I give to you, My Chosen, So Amarr shall rule the worlds of the Heavens. - Reclaiming 3.19
"Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away."
-- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
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Evi Polevhia
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
967
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Posted - 2015.05.02 22:31:18 -
[5] - Quote
Best of luck, then.
For what it's worth I do think that due to the overly hostile welcome they received that war is inevitable. I am not sure of the scale though and if alliances should be discussed. But if it comes down to it and I am forced to fight the Drifters in the defense of New Eden, don't worry. Like Metropolis, I would be willing to do your job for you so long as it is in the best interests of myself and my brethren. |
Deceiver's Echo
True Resource Acquisition Corporation
41
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Posted - 2015.05.02 22:51:47 -
[6] - Quote
Parables are not the most efficient way to communicate a point.
Look at the data collected from the Observatories. It is as if a lone voice was wishing the world were quiet, when all it's manipulations created only chaos. Every move creating more and more distortion, until one day, it comes crashing down and all it's work has crumbled around it.
We are not looking at the Master, we are looking at the hands of a God whom no longer understands His creation.
We must show that we are willing to listen. We must show that we are willing to learn. We must understand it's words. We must reclaim our rightful place. But we do not need to do so through violence. |
Jade Blackwind
Alexylva Paradox Low-Class
498
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Posted - 2015.05.02 23:40:49 -
[7] - Quote
Drifters are tools, made from salvaged Jovian flesh and scraps of ancient technology. Trying to talk or coexist with them is like trying to talk or coexist with a cruise missile. Or, if we talk biology, they are the immune system, and we are the disease.
If you want to talk or coexist, see through the spirits that are within those puppets. Seek out the source. But I doubt it - whatever it is - will talk to you.
The Talocans once discovered what we now call W-Space. With their static gate technology and nomadic culture, they began to colonize it. Talocan Polestars, think our POS towers. Like the capsuleer alliances are all over the Anoikis now.
Ask the Talocans, how it all turned out. |
Markus Error
Her Majesty's Crown Corporation
33
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Posted - 2015.05.03 01:09:41 -
[8] - Quote
Personally, a fire-if-fired-upon strategy would be lovely.
If, you know, anyone survived the first shot from the Drifters. And scripture aside, I agree with Pilot Kernher; we own New Eden. If the Sleepers want it? They'll have to find a means to remove us first, it would seem.
Pator IV - Moon 6 - School of Hard Knocks
Prof. Markus 'Error' Sierra, Cynicism Deptartment
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Sinjin Mokk
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
79
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Posted - 2015.05.03 02:29:34 -
[9] - Quote
Miss Echo,
We can talk about no-fire policies as soon as your master ends the incursions.
What little communication that has occurred, has happened between the Drifters and people far above our pay-grade. Either they've communicated to Kuvakei and he doesn't think you need to know, or he's not high enough on the pecking order to warrant communication either. Oh I suppose your message could be his attempt at trying to be clever, but subtlety hasn't really been a part of the Nation's programming.
I think you may be in right in that things point to much of HiSec having been their home first. I don't see a future in which any government shrugs and moves out of their own volition.
Oh and Miss Polevhia? Jingle all you want. It's well known that redemption can be bought through a hefty donation of ISK to the Theology Council and CONCORD. It still doesn't make you Amarr. You're not going to be winning any poplularity contests with the rest of the loyalists any time soon.
I'll reserve my "I told you so's" for a later date.
Dark Amarr: Rumors!
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Deceiver's Echo
True Resource Acquisition Corporation
41
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Posted - 2015.05.03 02:39:35 -
[10] - Quote
Sinjin Mokk wrote:We can talk about no-fire policies as soon as your master ends the incursions. Error of assumption. I do not speak for Nation in this regard. I speak for myself, and for potential peace before we are thrust into a war that can be avoided by simply leaving them to their tasks.
Quote:What little communication that has occurred, has happened between the Drifters and people far above our pay-grade. Either they've communicated to Kuvakei and he doesn't think you need to know, or he's not high enough on the pecking order to warrant communication either. Oh I suppose your message could be his attempt at trying to be clever, but subtlety hasn't really been a part of the Nation's programming. I am uncertain of your implied meaning here?
Quote:I think you may be in right in that things point to much of HiSec having been their home first. I don't see a future in which any government shrugs and moves out of their own volition. Thank you for understanding my message. Despite our differences in allegiance it is comforting to know that my words do not fall on wholly deaf ears. |
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Sinjin Mokk
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
80
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Posted - 2015.05.03 02:58:47 -
[11] - Quote
Apologies for the assumption. Not many of your Nation speak freely and those few that do are usually suspect.
What I mean to say is that it seems that some level of communication has already occurred. And we Capsuleers, like most of the baseline population, are not of high enough position to warrant full disclosure of the true state of affairs. Potentially worse, we're on the cutting edge of intel concerning some aspects of the Drifters, which means we know a few more things than the people giving the orders.
I understand your message, but your message has fallen mostly on holy deaf ears.
Dark Amarr: Rumors!
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Claudia Osyn
Minmatar Confederate Ushra'Khan
1188
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Posted - 2015.05.03 04:45:58 -
[12] - Quote
Quote:
A man walks in to a cave to escape a fierce blizzard outside. The sun has gone and he cannot see. Blindly, he gropes deeper into the cave to escape the cruel winds that bite at his skin. Upon making his way in he discovers a large patch of warm moss and lays down to rest.
And then it moves. It is not moss, but the fur of a bear. The man jumps up and protests this.
"I came in to this cave to escape the wind! I have no where else to go! I did not see you when I came in so I claimed this cave!"
However, the bear was there first and did not care what the newcomer claimed. More importantly, it was a bear. So it made a fine coat to protect against the cold, and food to sustain the man when he continued his journey.
The alternate ending.
The lack of money is the root of all evil.
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Evi Polevhia
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
969
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Posted - 2015.05.03 08:06:59 -
[13] - Quote
Sinjin Mokk wrote:...It still doesn't make you Amarr. You're not going to be winning any poplularity contests with the rest of the loyalists any time soon.
And if I cared about what they thought, I would be singing a whole different tune. Their church can rot for all I care. Chanting and praying to an empty altar. No more getting a response than the Matari's spirits. I'm not fighting for the 24th IC out of some attempt to regain status in the eyes of the Amarr. I'm fighting for Pyre because of my duty to them.
Claudia Osyn wrote: The alternate ending.
Killing the bear is certainly possible. Though it's far too early to say how probable it is. If every mind of New Eden set aside their hatreds and worked as one, I think it would be a guaranteed victory. But that's not going to happen. It's just down to a question of how much force are the Drifters going to bring versus how much of a response can New Eden offer up reasonably? |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
4765
|
Posted - 2015.05.03 09:55:54 -
[14] - Quote
Back to the Temple with all of you - Evi just pointed out that we haven't gotten even close to one of the fundamental questions yet and nobody else has really talked about it either.
She mentioned that the Empires are truly terrifying in power when they work together - but that they are willing to allow enemies that could be swatted easily to exist, rather than cooperate with each other. That reminded me of the reason the early State survived in its war against the Federation - because they made their conquest higher than the Federation was willing to pay. And so it goes - Nation, the Blooders, the Guri, Serpentis, the Cartel... All of them survive because their hosts aren't willing to pay the price it would take to truly purge them.
So, look at the Drifters. It's one thing to calculate strength - any idiot can count - but quite another to make guesses about their Will to fight. In order to know that we'd have to know:
1. Why they are fighting. 2. What they are willing to spend for their goals.
And we don't know either. Not even remotely.
"You let one of them go, but that's nothing new is it? Every now and then a little victim is allowed to escape; because she smiled, because he's got freckles, because they begged. And that's how you live with yourself. That's how you slaughter millions."
"Only a killer would know that..."
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Silvox Lunae
EVE University Ivy League
2
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Posted - 2015.05.03 17:58:50 -
[15] - Quote
Deceiver's Echo wrote:I humbly request all aggression towards Drifter assets cease. All efforts from this point forward should be attempts to communicate.
If Drifter assets are intercepting this communication, I request contact to begin a dialogue. I reside within Yulai.
To the Nations of New Eden, I say this: Drifter assets predate ours. This is their space. We must learn to co-exist.
We observe. We wait. We prepare. As one.
While your request is one I already concur with, you cannot presume any authority over other capsuleers and their corporations. Given your background, many will consider your request a conflict of interests.
Capsuleer aggression has already been instigated against the Drifters while no communication attempts from the Drifters have been recorded. I would surmise the Drifters take little notice of us much as the farmer cares not for the insects he treads upon unless they sting him or harm his crops. If this is indeed their space, they operate on cultural paradigms that we have been unable to understand, making co-existence impossible. |
Kybernetes Moros
Achura-Waschi Exchange Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
9
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Posted - 2015.05.03 19:23:13 -
[16] - Quote
I can understand your point of view--or, at least, I think I can. Past experience suggests that thinking I understand and actually understanding really are two very disjunct things.
They were here before us, and yeah, poking and prodding at the mysterious ancient entities with mind-boggling technologies probably isn't the greatest idea ever--hypocritical as that may be--but negotiation is a two-way street. Even we made clear what we were doing and said 'stay back'.
You're not the first to offer up diplomatic avenues, even if you may be one of the better-qualified to do so, and I doubt you'll be the last. If it works, super! If it doesn't, well, life goes on, eh?
As an aside--hello again! |
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
33873
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Posted - 2015.05.04 02:59:00 -
[17] - Quote
It's too late for a cease fire. People kept provoking them, and now they're coming for you.
Why do bad threads happen to good people?
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Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
646
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Posted - 2015.05.04 04:11:31 -
[18] - Quote
Ria Nieyli wrote:It's too late for a cease fire. People kept provoking them, and now they're coming for you. They seem to be coming for something, anyway. |
Tatius Jorgstern
Azimuth Enterprises
1
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Posted - 2015.05.04 05:33:11 -
[19] - Quote
Drifters don't consider us important enough to communicate with on a level footing. They harvest our dead clones to build their own bodies up, that's an act of aggression against us. A single message they've already communicated.
As for it being "their" assets, I strongly disagree with. The observatories aren't theirs as far as we know. And since these clandestine installations were placed to spy on us since before the capsuleer age, it is within our right to find out what information has been gathered.
Check out my EVE Online videos on YouTube [Reload] | Twitter:@ReloadGV
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Katiya Khadiija
The Juice Factory
3
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Posted - 2015.05.05 01:01:17 -
[20] - Quote
Being in the position I am, I'm certainly more interested in the technology than the history. Kill 'em for all I care, just let my engineers get their hands on the debris from time to time.
For what it's worth, there's no sense calling on capsuleers to do anything - we are a wild bunch and all have our own agendas. Show me a cause worth fighting for, or a threat sufficiently frightening, and I'll show you a formidable army of united pilots. As it stands, the Drifters more or less keep to themselves and therefore aren't perceived as the threat they really are yet. Surely over time they will become more aggressive, at which point they will begin showing their true colors, thus allowing capsuleers to mobilize, united. |
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
1129
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Posted - 2015.05.05 01:33:26 -
[21] - Quote
Katiya Khadiija wrote:Being in the position I am, I'm certainly more interested in the technology than the history. Kill 'em for all I care, just let my engineers get their hands on the debris from time to time.
For what it's worth, there's no sense calling on capsuleers to do anything - we are a wild bunch and all have our own agendas. Show me a cause worth fighting for, or a threat sufficiently frightening, and I'll show you a formidable army of united pilots. As it stands, the Drifters more or less keep to themselves and therefore aren't perceived as the threat they really are yet. Surely over time they will become more aggressive, at which point they will begin showing their true colors, thus allowing capsuleers to mobilize, united.
Or fight with them...depends on their motivation. I may fight to protect the citizens of the Empires (even Amarr even though slavery disgusts me), but that doesn't mean that I fight for the Empires themselves... |
Katiya Khadiija
The Juice Factory
3
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Posted - 2015.05.05 01:37:33 -
[22] - Quote
Well I never said anything about empires... they're on their way out, anyway - just look at how much pull all the capsuleer groups have nowadays.
I'm sure if CEOs ponied up some of their corporate cash we'd be able to eradicate them much faster. The problem is it's too early to say which side to dump money into... |
Kerena Alabel
TerminalDogma Stain Confederation
20
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Posted - 2015.05.06 03:18:55 -
[23] - Quote
I think the drifters understand us perfectly...I think that they just dont care. I dont know if they are here to infiltrate, invade, or just replace us...I dont suppose it matters. They have no respect for the sovereignty of any nation or corporation and their attack on Yulai was a clear terrorist act. They had multiple channels to request the body of one of their own back, hell they could have probably bought it back for less effort than it took to attack Yulai. They could have made multiple attempts to communicate, even without vocal chords. They dont communicate because they elect not to. They act the way they do to inspire fear or terror. Well I think they are messing with the wrong people. I have a couple billion isk id be willing to dump in the pot of getting these drifters wiped off the galactic map. Not much, but perhaps it might inspire others to chip in too. Better yet if someone can capture a drifter ship in one piece we can reverse engineer *their* technology, weapons and ships included and then we would be on an even technological footing, with greater numbers. |
Tatius Jorgstern
Azimuth Enterprises
1
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Posted - 2015.05.06 03:41:06 -
[24] - Quote
Kerena Alabel wrote:I think the drifters understand us perfectly...I think that they just dont care. I dont know if they are here to infiltrate, invade, or just replace us...I dont suppose it matters. They have no respect for the sovereignty of any nation or corporation and their attack on Yulai was a clear terrorist act. They had multiple channels to request the body of one of their own back, hell they could have probably bought it back for less effort than it took to attack Yulai. They could have made multiple attempts to communicate, even without vocal chords. They dont communicate because they elect not to. They act the way they do to inspire fear or terror. Well I think they are messing with the wrong people. I have a couple billion isk id be willing to dump in the pot of getting these drifters wiped off the galactic map. Not much, but perhaps it might inspire others to chip in too. Better yet if someone can capture a drifter ship in one piece we can reverse engineer *their* technology, weapons and ships included and then we would be on an even technological footing, with greater numbers.
Hear, hear!
Check out my EVE Online videos on YouTube [Reload] | Twitter:@ReloadGV
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Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Jovian Labs Jovian Enterprises
18143
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Posted - 2015.05.06 04:06:49 -
[25] - Quote
At this time, and despite the great power the Tyrannos wield, I am also in opposition of engaging and destroying them unprovokedly.
We have no indications of their true goal: all we know at this time is that they are coming from somewhere deep in Anoikis, that they are performing Entosis to recover information from the Jove Observatories (just as we have found we are able to do with the Entosis Links), and that they will ruthlessly cut down anyone who stands in their way.
I personally believe the Caroline's Star superluminal event is a result of their action, and that they are in opposition to the Jove Directorate; however, I will not make an enemy of something as capable and powerful as the Tyrannos before first understanding what their end goal is.
A "Shoot first, ask questions later" policy tends to go quite badly for those who have that attitude against a superior adversary.
"A City made of Dreams...is built in heaven" - GÖâ-
GPƒ U-Ç+¬ß¦ç-ƒ's Sߦ¢ß¦Å-Ç-Å
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Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Jovian Labs Jovian Enterprises
18143
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Posted - 2015.05.06 04:12:57 -
[26] - Quote
In addition...
If the Tyrannos lay claim to any area of New Eden, looking back to their seeming inheritance of "the legacy of some of the most ancient Jove", I can only assume it will be the Heaven constellation of Curse, and surrounding areas.
At one time, the Jove were rooted in that area; if the Tyrannos inherit an ancient Jove legacy, I am confident that an area near Heaven will be their future home in New Eden, if anywhere.
"A City made of Dreams...is built in heaven" - GÖâ-
GPƒ U-Ç+¬ß¦ç-ƒ's Sߦ¢ß¦Å-Ç-Å
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Feu dAstres
Nox Draconum Holding Corp Nox Draconum
39
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Posted - 2015.05.06 10:27:49 -
[27] - Quote
And yet, we fail to identify their current home ... as we cannot reach Jovian space to investigate.
What are they lacking, there, that they have returned (?) to what we call "known space"? |
Kerena Alabel
TerminalDogma Stain Confederation
21
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Posted - 2015.05.06 14:24:43 -
[28] - Quote
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:At this time, and despite the great power the Tyrannos wield, I am also in opposition of engaging and destroying them unprovokedly.
We have no indications of their true goal: all we know at this time is that they are coming from somewhere deep in Anoikis, that they are performing Entosis to recover information from the Jove Observatories (just as we have found we are able to do with the Entosis Links), and that they will ruthlessly cut down anyone who stands in their way.
I personally believe the Caroline's Star superluminal event is a result of their action, and that they are in opposition to the Jove Directorate; however, I will not make an enemy of something as capable and powerful as the Tyrannos before first understanding what their end goal is.
A "Shoot first, ask questions later" policy tends to go quite badly for those who have that attitude against a superior adversary.
Whatever their goal is, its not good for us. That much is clear. That alone should be enough to oppose them. Capsuleers have taken down their ships before, they arent invincible and they dont have our numbers. I say strike while we have the numerical advantage. During our attacks we will discover what they are after. Right now they are focusing on salvaging jove tech, each day gaining more and more. I say stop them before we cant. |
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
666
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Posted - 2015.05.06 15:05:29 -
[29] - Quote
Kerena Alabel wrote:Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:At this time, and despite the great power the Tyrannos wield, I am also in opposition of engaging and destroying them unprovokedly.
We have no indications of their true goal: all we know at this time is that they are coming from somewhere deep in Anoikis, that they are performing Entosis to recover information from the Jove Observatories (just as we have found we are able to do with the Entosis Links), and that they will ruthlessly cut down anyone who stands in their way.
I personally believe the Caroline's Star superluminal event is a result of their action, and that they are in opposition to the Jove Directorate; however, I will not make an enemy of something as capable and powerful as the Tyrannos before first understanding what their end goal is.
A "Shoot first, ask questions later" policy tends to go quite badly for those who have that attitude against a superior adversary. Whatever their goal is, its not good for us. That much is clear. That alone should be enough to oppose them. Capsuleers have taken down their ships before, they arent invincible and they dont have our numbers. I say strike while we have the numerical advantage. During our attacks we will discover what they are after. Right now they are focusing on salvaging jove tech, each day gaining more and more. I say stop them before we cant.
Respectfully to ... all concerned, it looks like either view has merit. It's possible that the Drifters find us either impossible or pointless to communicate with directly. It's unlikely that their intentions are wholly peaceful, but they need not be hostile to us all.
I guess it's natural, in many societies, to attack someone who invades your home. It's ... still risky, though, and it's maybe a better idea to avoid a fight against a deadly, unknown enemy if we can.
What tips my opinion, reluctantly, into the "war" camp (I guess) is that there's no way we're going to stop attacking them unless it becomes extremely obvious that it's a bad idea.
That doesn't mean that we all ought to rush out with our biggest guns. A lot of us are probably best off lying low. ... but the fighting will continue, so we should probably make whatever plans we're going to make like we're expecting more fighting. |
Sinjin Mokk
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
81
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Posted - 2015.05.06 15:55:44 -
[30] - Quote
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:In addition...
If the Tyrannos lay claim to any area of New Eden, looking back to their seeming inheritance of "the legacy of some of the most ancient Jove", I can only assume it will be the Heaven constellation of Curse, and surrounding areas.
At one time, the Jove were rooted in that area; if the Tyrannos inherit an ancient Jove legacy, I am confident that an area near Heaven will be their future home in New Eden, if anywhere.
To date I've see zero Drifter presence in Curse.
The Jovian connection to Heaven is so old, it's almost legend. If there is any legacy left behind, it's that this is where the Jove got sick? Maybe the Drifters/Jove wouldn't be so quick to return?
But maybe this explains their ramped up presence in Amarr? If they were looking to settle old scores...
Again, more conjecture, little facts.
Dark Amarr: Rumors!
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