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Leto Aramaus
Spiritus Draconis Spaceship Bebop
122
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Posted - 2015.05.28 11:49:45 -
[31] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Only if I can disable this on every single ship I ever build, buy or fly. I do not want to give free intel out to people.
Then you should be calling for the removal of Local and the non-consensual watchlist.
The UI update we deserve
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3423
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Posted - 2015.05.28 22:20:01 -
[32] - Quote
Varus Vindicti wrote:Danika Princip wrote:
But the builder also owned it?
So did everyone else on that list, why reveal them too?
Why should intel like this be obtainable with no effort whatsoever?
Regardless of who built the ship, the owner would see that data - this way you could possibly uncover intel about who was building ships if you could access one that wasn't yours. It would give people the ability to conduct REAL espionage about production chains. What you would see on the ship's destruction would be its ID and ships it has killed and who piloted it. Like a download of the ship's log after destruction (like a black box). Maybe you could capture the destroyed ship's black box in space after destruction and gain further levels of information. Possibly it would be valuable to someone? Maybe you'd want to kill the ship that picked it up to prevent that information from falling into someone else's hands? Possibly there could be skills to train to access more information about a ship so people could specialize in espionage about production logistics, which could benefit whoever chose to use it? Maybe you could have specialized scanners to get the information if you got close enough to an enemy ship to use it (Covert Ops possibilities!??!?!)
Why. Should. This. Information. Be. Freely. Available. With. Zero. Effort.
Why would I want to hand out this information, how would I stop this information from being handed out, and why do you need to know who my alts are?
Leto Aramaus wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Only if I can disable this on every single ship I ever build, buy or fly. I do not want to give free intel out to people. Then you should be calling for the removal of Local and the non-consensual watchlist.
Neither of which tell you exactly who all of my production, trade and hauling alts are simply by looking at zkill, which this guy wants. |
Jeven HouseBenyo
Baron and Serpent Productions
39
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Posted - 2015.05.28 23:04:45 -
[33] - Quote
Instead of a VIN (SIN? since it is a ship, not a wheeled vehicle) number, I'd rather get 'vanity license plate frames' to stick on ships I've either put up for sale or for personal ship use. Since the details on ships are going up with the possibility of more appearance customization in the near and further out future, why not this left turn?
The supply setup to stamp those 'plate frames' or 'used ship store Corp #xxx bumper sticker' boggles my mind (perhaps only so many 'licenses' can be active at a time, let the throat cutting in Market or Awoxing begin for a mostly useless item!), and would be something I'd giggle over while picking it apart. On the upside, less number crunching for Devs and less for the hamsters to go on strike over.
Other than the text, a generic setup similar to designing a Corporation Logo would keep the frazzle low on the poor Devf that gets to crunch this into being.
And yes, these being removable by the owner (destroyed like removing rigs) to keep on the down low your alt suppliers.
Two wisdom pennies, user mileage will vary.
>Jeven
Full time industrialist, part time pirate, snark cranked to 11 at all times.
Overkill loss magnet. Orphaned drone adopter.
It's not paranoia, it's Eve Online!
Experience: the thing you needed right before you received it.
WTB moar wingy bits!
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Varus Vindicti
Deadly Execution Twilight Federation
2
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Posted - 2015.05.29 21:25:51 -
[34] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:[quote=Varus Vindicti][quote=Danika Princip]
Why. Should. This. Information. Be. Freely. Available. With. Zero. Effort.
Why would I want to hand out this information, how would I stop this information from being handed out, and why do you need to know who my alts are?
Neither of which tell you exactly who all of my production, trade and hauling alts are simply by looking at zkill, which this guy wants.
I could care less about your production, trade and hauling alts.
I build capital/T2 ships also. I think it would be neat to see where they end up. How they are used. It would add content. It would give you market intelligence if you built for random people. Might be easier to target your sales.
And who said this information would be freely available with zero effort? I advocated that certain information would be accessible after a KM.
I indicated other information would be available to the owner.
Local, fits on KMs, there are plenty of examples of information available with "zero effort".
I am not even advocating it be "freely available" I am looking to add some depth to some of the gameplay that could utilize intelligence that players have to work to get in some fashion.
Things that do not involve social engineering, but utilize ships, modules, etc. to gain intelligence.
Maybe this could be through ELINT or SIGNIT, but we currently have under-utilized ships like covert ops that should be able to do more than PVE and bombing. Things that would involve flying into harm's way.
You know, adding content.
I understand that you average Goon hates the thought of anything to upset their apple cart, but it isn't realistic that certain information cannot be obtained in some fashion other than social engineering. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3424
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Posted - 2015.05.29 21:32:43 -
[35] - Quote
Varus Vindicti wrote:
I understand that you average Goon hates the thought of anything to upset their apple cart, but it isn't realistic that certain information cannot be obtained in some fashion other than social engineering.
Explain this statement please.
Why should it be possible to find out someone's alts simply by looking at zkill?
How do you feel this intel, which would be freely available if all you need is a killmail or if you happen to buy a ship, adds content to the game? What kind of content? How is getting one KM or buying one ship considered work?
Do you not feel the metagame, which you dismiss as social engineering, is a part of the game? |
Panty Stocking
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
5
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Posted - 2015.05.30 00:34:23 -
[36] - Quote
you can see where your ships go when you make a sale. afterwards there is right of first sale, that is, you have no "rights" to find out what is done afterwards.
sure, irl i can check my former car's vin to find who owns it now and if they have gotten into accidents etc. but to have everyone be able to see my car's entire history merely because someone hit my car, or even if i just hit a telephone pole is kind of nonsensical.
that would be the equivalent of posting a public descriptiion with vin numbers of every accident that happens in every and all newspaper and social media outlet.
im sure someone could get the info free, but not without a fair bit of legwork if my car has never been sold, but i don't support this "feature" and still wouldn't if it were opt in/out. |
Derath Ellecon
Blue Sun Exploration Situation: Normal
2392
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Posted - 2015.05.30 02:11:41 -
[37] - Quote
None of it matters this will never be implemented. |
Varus Vindicti
Deadly Execution Twilight Federation
2
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Posted - 2015.05.30 13:19:33 -
[38] - Quote
I am glad to see the vocal minority is represented so well here!
CCP - you should definitely listen to these two guys since they post more than everyone else! |
Derath Ellecon
Blue Sun Exploration Situation: Normal
2392
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Posted - 2015.05.30 15:13:35 -
[39] - Quote
Varus Vindicti wrote:I am glad to see the vocal minority is represented so well here!
CCP - you should definitely listen to these two guys since they post more than everyone else!
I'm not saying that because I don't think it is a cool idea. But if you at all understand how the database is setup currently it is pretty easy to understand why it is highly unlikely we would ever see this idea implemented. |
Iain Cariaba
1469
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Posted - 2015.05.30 15:52:33 -
[40] - Quote
Varus Vindicti wrote:I am glad to see the vocal minority is represented so well here!
CCP - you should definitely listen to these two guys since they post more than everyone else! And CCP should listen to the guy that ignores all the reasons why this is a bad idea, simply because he thinks it would be cool to have?
I don't think so.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Will troll for a t-shirt.
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James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
808
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Posted - 2015.05.30 15:57:09 -
[41] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Varus Vindicti wrote:I am glad to see the vocal minority is represented so well here!
CCP - you should definitely listen to these two guys since they post more than everyone else! And CCP should listen to the guy that ignores all the reasons why this is a bad idea, simply because he thinks it would be cool to have? I don't think so. Oooh, can I be the third, to make quorum and report it for 17 again?
Talking more,
Flying crazier,
And drinking more
Making battleships worth the warp
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Valkin Mordirc
1073
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Posted - 2015.05.30 20:19:00 -
[42] - Quote
Varus Vindicti wrote:I am glad to see the vocal minority is represented so well here!
CCP - you should definitely listen to these two guys since they post more than everyone else!
Hey CCP This guy was told his idea was bad, and was given a very good reason to it.
But you should listen to him because he put some legitimate effort into thinking it up.
Because long thought out idea's are never bad. Like the Vietnam War, Or the use of ******* in 1800's.
Joking asides. Your idea would be cool. Like Would like to see what kills I've gotten with certain ships. But with your idea, the amount of blacklash it would cause for thousands of people would be...baaaad mkay?
#DeleteTheWeak
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Derath Ellecon
Blue Sun Exploration Situation: Normal
2392
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Posted - 2015.05.30 20:52:19 -
[43] - Quote
Valkin Mordirc wrote:[quote=Varus Vindicti] Joking asides. Your idea would be cool. Like Would like to see what kills I've gotten with certain ships. But with your idea, the amount of blacklash it would cause for thousands of people would be...baaaad mkay?
Even that misses the point. If you have ever read how the database is setup, all items "packaged" in game don't exist as a unique item. This was done to keep the DB as small and fast as possible.
There are tons of ships built and on the market. Hundreds of thousands? Or more? But a small amount in comparison are assembled and fitted at any given time.
By trying to track the born on date etc of every ship built in EVE would dramatically increase the amount of data stored about each ship, and would likely require lots more power to keep up with queries etc, for honestly not that much gain. |
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
16
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Posted - 2015.05.31 12:42:15 -
[44] - Quote
For those that wonder why you would want unique ID on each ship, look at basicly all your electronics and see if you can find their serial number or mostly anything you own. Some items have batch number instead of serial for each item. With these numbers you can track an item back to where it was made, worldwide. |
Derath Ellecon
Blue Sun Exploration Situation: Normal
2392
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Posted - 2015.05.31 12:54:44 -
[45] - Quote
Haatakan Reppola wrote:For those that wonder why you would want unique ID on each ship, look at basicly all your electronics and see if you can find their serial number or mostly anything you own. Some items have batch number instead of serial for each item. With these numbers you can track an item back to where it was made, worldwide.
Ok, I don't think anyone in this thread is confused as to how a unique ID on a ship would work. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
651
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Posted - 2015.05.31 13:43:48 -
[46] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Haatakan Reppola wrote:For those that wonder why you would want unique ID on each ship, look at basicly all your electronics and see if you can find their serial number or mostly anything you own. Some items have batch number instead of serial for each item. With these numbers you can track an item back to where it was made, worldwide. Ok, I don't think anyone in this thread is confused as to how a unique ID on a ship would work.
This...its the added technical overhead and other implications. That are really not needed really to deal with them
I sense some come from an inventory management background. So do I. I however....like to leave this crap at the office. As well...I am paid decent money to handle this additional duty.
I have to date not taken my ship to the dealer and said I think there is a problem. There is no checking if my ship is in warranty for it. Comparing this to rl is just bad. CISCO gear I know well. They use the batch id a lot as a higher end switch or router is chock full of card and service goodness. CISCO, unlike CCP, however has to deal with this tracking. The benign reason is when service request submitted their engineers can see what is the router to go wrong before they even call for the troubleshooting. Are they troubleshooting a vanilla router or does it have cards x,y and z for more fun. They know this before the first call.
Less benign reasons would be we someone trying to play the system and asking for a replacement card for something never officially installed on the system.
In game....Lai Dai doesn't have this issue. I am not taking my golem in because I think the dilithium crystal chamber needs a recalibration. |
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