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Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
14
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Posted - 2015.06.02 16:20:40 -
[1] - Quote
Hi,
I wanted to start a discussion to see if people are remotely interested in something that bugs me whenever I try to gank in certain areas of nullsec. As you may know, there are a lot of "alleged" bots in these regions that operate by pre-aligning to towers and then wait for local to get new unknown people in.
This bugs me, because it essentially gives people free intel with no effort, thus reducing any risk they might have while out in the open. To this end, I am curious what would happen if I suggest the following solution:
Once someone jumps into a system, he/she does not show up on the local chat untill five seconds after breaking his/her gatecloak. This would give PVP groups a few more precious moments to potentially catch people, instead of arriving to a place where the guy per definition has warped off.
Let me know what you think? |
Domino Vyse
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
113
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 16:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
+1
A good way to make bearsec more dangerous without turning it into wormhole space. |
Trajan Unknown
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
30
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 16:43:16 -
[3] - Quote
I am a big supporter of "w-space local" for the simple reason that knowledge is power and the current power is way too strong.
- watchlist every links pilot/scout - watch local to gather most intel you need
Local chat for high-sec is something I don-¦t really care about but low-sec and especially zero-zero should not have such intel for free. I never understood why it was added to zero-zero in the first place and would love to see it removed. Instead there should be some kind of intel structure/module for the PoS-¦s available for players so they can secure their space somewhat. Combine that with delayed local for low-sec and we are fine. Raw intel like the starmap/dotlan provides should be more than enough for everyone to figure out where to find something to shoot at or where you might not want to go without scout. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1037
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 16:48:42 -
[4] - Quote
So, you got 2 guys paying a subscription. 1 guy likes to PvE and the other guy likes to PvP Your proposal gives massive advantage to the PvP guy, and gives a massive disadvantage to the PvE guy. A fleet of interceptors could be in every site in every system. You could probably wipe out all the PvE guys in a week. Then what?
If you want to kill clueless pilots in ships fit for PvE ... go gank newbs in a rookie system. Or, man up and go look for real PvP.
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Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
14
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 16:53:46 -
[5] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:So, you got 2 guys paying a subscription. 1 guy likes to PvE and the other guy likes to PvP Your proposal gives massive advantage to the PvP guy, and gives a massive disadvantage to the PvE guy. A fleet of interceptors could be in every site in every system. You could probably wipe out all the PvE guys in a week. Then what?
If you want to kill clueless pilots in ships fit for PvE ... go gank newbs in a rookie system. Or, man up and go look for real PvP.
I would disagree with this statement, as you sign up for PVP the second you undock. If you don't like PVP, don't undock. Aside of that, you are correct that an interceptor team would get targets relatively fast. The number of the delay in itself is therefore just an indication. That said, if you're in 0.0 and you do not have proper intel set up for your space, you deserve to get ganked.
EVE is a game that's a sandbox in which everyone is able to do whatever they like. But when you're able to get out of jail free because of a local system that betrays any potential risk right off the bat, you're limiting the options of the sandbox.
Right now, the money in 0.0 for those running sites is pretty damn good. Especially when you consider groups such as the Imperium and others. You should get your intel based on proactive information rather than sitting and waiting for +1 in local. Work for your security, just like PVPers work for it to get broken. |
Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
14
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Posted - 2015.06.02 17:16:38 -
[6] - Quote
As an additional consideration:
How long would a delay have to be to be balanced amongst most ships? Would we balance it based on shiptypes or just a flat number? If we do it based on ship types, it would mean that interceptors will have a lower time before showing up to offset their speed. |
Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
618
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 17:37:05 -
[7] - Quote
Its not like the ratter can like, keep an eye on dscan. Or have friends. Or do something more interesting than ratting. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1037
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 18:06:38 -
[8] - Quote
A couple of my opinions:
Yes it's a sandbox, but it's a PUBLIC sandbox. Where people have PAY to play. If you just let the mean guys in the sandbox, you're eventually going to end up with a big, empty sandbox. My point is, you need all the players for it to be fun sandbox.
'Game' is a key word here. A 'game' implies that there is some 'fun' to be had. Your proposal gives an advantage to the PvP pilot and a clear disadvantage to the PvE pilot. He could spend his time D-scanning every 3 seconds to be safer. He could post alts in neighboring systems, but all that really doesn't add any 'fun' factor. There's no good balance for that particular player.
Guys that own space: They have probably worked hard to get it/keep it. They probably want instant local. so they can indeed protect their own space. They do have intel channels, and if they really want a bear out of a system, they got 2 easy options. An afk cloak in that system, or combat probes. Both are highly effective.
To answer your question specifically, any delay is bad for the game. If you want more targets in null, you have to let them get comfortable there first. All PvE pilots are potential PvP pilots, they just need to get there on their own.
Many of the bears you see, don't necessarily like PvE but they might need it to fund their ships and subscriptions. Fast ISK is a good thing for them. (Fixing sec status is another issue) Turning the tide, making that isk a ship losing grind of D-scan and pod express is just not a good thing. We need those players, and we need them to have isk.
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Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
14
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 19:10:17 -
[9] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:A couple of my opinions:
Yes it's a sandbox, but it's a PUBLIC sandbox. Where people have PAY to play. If you just let the mean guys in the sandbox, you're eventually going to end up with a big, empty sandbox. My point is, you need all the players for it to be fun sandbox.
Correct, But it should be balanced enough so that even the most active guys have a chance at missing their window and be vulnerable. You're not in a wellfare program, you're here to get your game on and make your own fortune. If you can't handle risks, you don't live in space that has higher risks attached to them. As it stands today, deep 0.0 is super safe, more so than highsec / lowsec.
Quote:'Game' is a key word here. A 'game' implies that there is some 'fun' to be had. Your proposal gives an advantage to the PvP pilot and a clear disadvantage to the PvE pilot. He could spend his time D-scanning every 3 seconds to be safer. He could post alts in neighboring systems, but all that really doesn't add any 'fun' factor. There's no good balance for that particular player.
I do not agree. Yes, a game should be fun but we should never start cuddling all the PVEbears, as that completely goes against the nature of EVE Online. In EVE, you're ought to put in effort in order to gain benefits. Players who actively put an effort and play proactively, will be able to deal with any kind of PVP. That you need to d-scan or probe scan is something I can only encourage, as it forces people to actually work for their money, and it punishes those who attempt to do things AFK. Thus the sense of reward goes up.
Quote:Guys that own space: They have probably worked hard to get it/keep it. They probably want instant local. so they can indeed protect their own space. They do have intel channels, and if they really want a bear out of a system, they got 2 easy options. An afk cloak in that system, or combat probes. Both are highly effective.
Frankly speaking, if you're in an entity that holds SOV yet is unable to have proper intel channels set up, you are not ready for SOV. You can not expect people to freely get access to all the goodies without putting in the effort to defend their space. The same goes for intel. You might say
Quote: To answer your question specifically, any delay is bad for the game. If you want more targets in null, you have to let them get comfortable there first. All PvE pilots are potential PvP pilots, they just need to get there on their own.
But I disagree. You can't be in 0.0 and feel all safe. That's not how EVE works. The faster people learn this, the better their experience will be. You're never safe, and you will never be. If players can't handle that, they should go back to World of Warcraft (or similar games)
RavenPaine wrote: Many of the bears you see, don't necessarily like PvE but they might need it to fund their ships and subscriptions. Fast ISK is a good thing for them. (Fixing sec status is another issue) Turning the tide, making that isk a ship losing grind of D-scan and pod express is just not a good thing. We need those players, and we need them to have isk.
If they want relative security they should be living in high-sec. Whenever you enter low/null you get warned about the risks, and great rewards should come at great risks. A wormhole C5 group makes a lot of money, but they also risk a major amount of ISK when they are on the field. Does this mean we should make it easy for them? |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1037
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 20:58:17 -
[10] - Quote
C5 guys can collapse holes and keep eyes on the entry point. They generally are in a 'home' system where they can reship if needed. After entry you need to probe them down to get them. They generally have several pilots in system at once. They DO have it fairly easy, once they get established. You can't compare a C5 corp to a loan ratter in null.
If you want to hunt where there's no local chat, EVE has supplied that spot for you. If you want to gank PvE ships, EVE has a place to do that too. You can do 2 or 3 pimp ships a day, then go back to null and fix your sec status.
Nobody said null should be safe. I'm saying that what you're proposing is unbalanced as **** for the ratter. Where is his + side? I will say, the potential for bait kills is huge. But the potential for lost pilots/subscriptions in null is bigger. |
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Moglarr
Operation Meatshield
92
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 21:31:50 -
[11] - Quote
This just sounds to me like you want to more easily gank and blob dudes. And if that is your game, that is cool. I don't particularly like your suggestion because I don't see where the new, interesting and fun game play is with this arbitrary and odd tweak.
Operation Meatshield! GETUP and fight!
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Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
14
|
Posted - 2015.06.02 22:02:46 -
[12] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:C5 guys can collapse holes and keep eyes on the entry point. They generally are in a 'home' system where they can reship if needed. After entry you need to probe them down to get them. They generally have several pilots in system at once. They DO have it fairly easy, once they get established. You can't compare a C5 corp to a loan ratter in null.
If you want to hunt where there's no local chat, EVE has supplied that spot for you. If you want to gank PvE ships, EVE has a place to do that too. You can do 2 or 3 pimp ships a day, then go back to null and fix your sec status.
Nobody said null should be safe. I'm saying that what you're proposing is unbalanced as **** for the ratter. Where is his + side? I will say, the potential for bait kills is huge. But the potential for lost pilots/subscriptions in null is bigger.
Perhaps you're missing the point: Ratting in 0.0 is already too safe unless you're AFK / dumb. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1333
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 12:37:14 -
[13] - Quote
I like it. You're in local before your client has even loaded, it already takes too long to arrive on grid and be able to lock even in a rigged interceptor.
People don't actually appreciate the time it takes to get into warp and land and be lockable, it's a LOT longer than you think. Test it with a friend, an interceptor and a belt perhaps 10AU away. I bet they can get a battleship into warp before you can point them.
Prewarning: 1 (maybe 2) seconds Align: 2 seconds Warp and land: ???? Lock: 1 second Point: 1 second
So you're ALREADY 7-8 seconds down, and that assumes you know exactly where you're to warp to. The AU/s metric is actually a bit of a red herring, it takes a long, long time (several seconds) to decelerate when your distance left to warp is measured in km.
Betting a double plated BS would escape if the pilot is alert, even if it was stationary. Imagine trying to get something like a shield machariel! I suppose bastioned marauders are your best bet, unless the pilot is asleep.
Remember I'm even not allowing the time to dscan the warp area first!!
And yes, you can protect yourself with Dscan, so I don't see an issue tbh. |
erg cz
ErgoDron
285
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 14:25:57 -
[14] - Quote
Posting in stealth "I suck in PvP, CCP fix this for me please" thread.
Null is already so void ! Your suggestion will remove sagnificant part of players out of it. Cause like it or not - this is a sandbox, where ppl want to PvP when they are ready for it. Not when you are losing time looking for easy targets. PvE is just as valid part of eve as PvP. You want less local? go to wormwhole. Wait... It is even more empty, then a null... Hmm, maybe ther is a reason for that. You want PvP = join FW and you will have plenty of fights. You want easy kills = keep posting threads like this. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1334
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 15:44:28 -
[15] - Quote
erg cz wrote:Posting in stealth "CCP fix this game for ME, please" thread.
Null is already so void ! Your suggestion will remove sagnificant part of players out of it. Cause like it or not - this is a sandbox, where ppl want to PvP when they are ready for it. Not when you are losing time looking for easy targets. PvE is just as valid part of eve as PvP. You want less local? go to wormwhole. Wait... It is even more empty, then a null... Hmm, maybe ther is a reason for that. You want PvP = join FW and you will have plenty of fights. You want easy kills = keep posting threads like this.
Alternatively maybe they can take their sorry, carebearing, risk averse arses back to highsec where they belong.
I know, I KNOW it's :effort: to tap dscan and that it's just not fair, you should be able to generate isk risk free with 100% intel. I know, princess, but life isn't fair. Sometimes you just have to HTFU. |
Estella Osoka
Perkone Caldari State
625
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 16:03:13 -
[16] - Quote
You just can't please people who live in nullsec.
1st you hear them whine about not enough people to pvp against in nullsec, then you hear them bleat about an idea that will drive the current nullsec population down even further.
I await the day when nullsec is bereft of targets to shoot at. |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
1418
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 17:27:23 -
[17] - Quote
Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. |
Petre en Thielles
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
127
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 17:50:15 -
[18] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:So, you got 2 guys paying a subscription. 1 guy likes to PvE and the other guy likes to PvP Your proposal gives massive advantage to the PvP guy, and gives a massive disadvantage to the PvE guy. A fleet of interceptors could be in every site in every system. You could probably wipe out all the PvE guys in a week. Then what?
If you want to kill clueless pilots in ships fit for PvE ... go gank newbs in a rookie system. Or, man up and go look for real PvP.
you're talking to someone who admits they like to gank. stop using logic. |
May Arethusa
PillowBrigade Inc
27
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 18:38:42 -
[19] - Quote
Never had a problem catching ratters in null when I was out there, I'm sorry you don't catch stuff in every anomaly you warp to, but that's just how it works.
Either local is there, or it isn't. There's no need for convoluted middle grounds. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1335
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 20:17:28 -
[20] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets.
If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward. |
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Demerius Xenocratus
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
396
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 20:25:06 -
[21] - Quote
Colonel Tosh wrote:Hi,
I wanted to start a discussion to see if people are remotely interested in something that bugs me whenever I try to gank in certain areas of nullsec. As you may know, there are a lot of "alleged" bots in these regions that operate by pre-aligning to towers and then wait for local to get new unknown people in.
This bugs me, because it essentially gives people free intel with no effort, thus reducing any risk they might have while out in the open. To this end, I am curious what would happen if I suggest the following solution:
Once someone jumps into a system, he/she does not show up on the local chat untill five seconds after breaking his/her gatecloak.
This would give PVP groups a few more precious moments to potentially catch people, instead of arriving to a place where the guy per definition has warped off.
Let me know what you think?
Edits:
Points to consider:
How long would a delay have to be to be balanced amongst most ships? Would we balance it based on shiptypes or just a flat number? How else would you recommend people defend themselves against interceptor ganks? If they are pre-aligned and watching local carefully enough to be gone inside 10 seconds, sounds like they're doing it right. We can certainly discuss tweaks that make the funding of multiple neutral scout alts even more of a requirement to succeed than they are already, or maybe if you aren't happy with your current ratting Ishtar kill count you should 1) get better at ganking and/or find a more creative way to go about it or 2) go fight things that shoot back. There are many and they would welcome the content.
You don't have a right to effortless killmails anymore than they have a right to risk free ISK. People who have spent enormous time and effort building empires in null should derive SOME advantage from those efforts. And since you think everyone who does PvE to fund their PvP combat is a worthless "carebear" I'll ask...how do you make YOUR money? Unless you sell PLEX or scam/station trade on a character that never undocks, you're a carebear too. You're no better than anyone else. Get better at ganking. Null and lowsec are already ridiculously empty because of how difficult it is to operate there outside of a major organization. Last thing this game needs is more buffs to non-consensual pvp.
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RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1042
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 21:18:24 -
[22] - Quote
afkalt wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward.
The only person asking for reduced risk, is the OP. Null sec PvE pilots have never asked for reduced risk.
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1336
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 22:01:11 -
[23] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:afkalt wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward. The only person asking for reduced risk, is the OP. Null sec PvE pilots have never asked for reduced risk.
I believe you miss the entire point. Null ratting is safer, if more disruptable as an activity, than highsec.
This proposal changes that slightly thus the nullbears are up in arms that the second most dangerous space is actually potentially dangerous.
I use RR domis in WH that can get out before an inty can tackle....and I don't even have local. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1042
|
Posted - 2015.06.03 23:11:32 -
[24] - Quote
afkalt wrote:RavenPaine wrote:afkalt wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward. The only person asking for reduced risk, is the OP. Null sec PvE pilots have never asked for reduced risk. I believe you miss the entire point. Null ratting is safer, if more disruptable as an activity, than highsec. This proposal changes that slightly thus the nullbears are up in arms that the second most dangerous space is actually potentially dangerous. I use RR domis in WH that can get out before an inty can tackle....and I don't even have local.
I think the "entire point" is that the OP wants easy kills to get even easier. And I think that is all he is concerned with. A better kill ratio for him. Better odds for him. By your own experienced statement, you must agree that it won't help kill the better pilots. They WILL D-scan and they will be aligned. Interceptors are one thing, but the new Recon feature would be a whole 'nother conversation.
The proposal has more than one cause and effect though. There are ripple effects that are greater than his own self centered goals. CCP has added null systems, null regions, and worm holes over the years, so that MORE players would venture out there. They have developed Nullified T3's and changed interceptors so that MORE players could have reasonable access. They have revamped SOV mechanics many times to help populate null. If the OP thinks kills are thin now, it would only take a month and they would be thinner.
TBH, the only reason thousands of pilots go to null is the isk. Big blocks go to take moons and make billions of isk. They offer null isk as an incentive to keep pilots there. If you want PvP, you can go to somebodies home system and **** on their gates. Or you set up a gate camp and wait till the word gets out. Hunting ratters shouldn't even be part of the fleets agenda... other than maybe a scout warps to a couple sites while passing through.
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Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
4006
|
Posted - 2015.06.04 07:25:27 -
[25] - Quote
I think the real problem lies in the PVE-ship gank gameplay.
It all boils down to catching PVE ships. Once they're pointed, they go down in seconds. Not much fighting involved.
So what about an invulnerability mode added to all industrial ships?
When activated, you're invulnerable for a fixed period of time, say 1 minute, but you can't move, target anything or warp. You can light a cyno though.
If help arrives in that minute, there can be a fight. Or maybe the attackers gtfo because they're pussies.
If not, you're dead.
Then your defense could be friends in PVP ships, not just running away ASAP. Also psychological warfare: is that lone barge a juicy target or bait?
Make space glamorous!
Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1336
|
Posted - 2015.06.04 09:36:58 -
[26] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:I think the real problem lies in the PVE-ship gank gameplay.
It all boils down to catching PVE ships. Once they're pointed, they go down in seconds.
Thing is though, there's nothing stopping folks sticking a hull tanked cyno baitmobile in an anomaly and waiting on the would be gankers.
Folks have the tools available, they just don't use them much. It's just much easier to run and hide, especially since getting caught requires failure on the part of the prey. |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
1421
|
Posted - 2015.06.04 11:00:46 -
[27] - Quote
afkalt wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward.
You imply no bear has ever died in nullsec.
And as far as rewards go, doing anoms in null is one of the lesser rewarded pve in the game. Perhaps it should be buffed to encourage people to fight for them rather than the proposed change of making it easy for bads to get one sided kills. |
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
203
|
Posted - 2015.06.04 12:48:07 -
[28] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:afkalt wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Posting in a 'PVP'ers who like to shoot things that cannot fight back' thread.
If you want to pvp, its simple. Get better at ganking, or find more appropriate targets. If you want safety, highsec is thataway>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want the reduced risk, take the reduced reward. You imply no bear has ever died in nullsec. And as far as rewards go, doing anoms in null is one of the lesser rewarded pve in the game. Perhaps it should be buffed to encourage people to fight for them rather than the proposed change of making it easier for bads to get one sided kills.
This has an interesting seed of innovation to it Crosi.
Not only should they buff null-sec rewards so that they are significantly greater (active PvE) than those in high sec but perhaps they should also put in a penalty for leaving them half done.
Anom's that reward you only at completion. Exit the anom and it despawns. If you want to hold the most lucrative rewards, you must hold them (just as you have to do with Moons).
Who knows.
From an old mans POV, I think null sec does need a re-population (as does FW) with some further tweeks. We have yet to see what effect Fozzie Sov has on the status quo so this is all a bit premature. However, making rewards the (2nd) greatest per hour in null sec (2nd to Wormholes) but at the (2nd) greatest price of lost time if they flee and highest risk of engagement makes sense to me.
It would help if PvE content promoted use of fittings that are PvP capable (omg wtf I must maximise my isk/hr). Perhaps by more Omni tank / Omni damage NPC's which flee if not scram/webbed ?????
"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
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Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
30
|
Posted - 2015.06.04 16:32:30 -
[29] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:I think the "entire point" is that the OP wants easy kills to get even easier. And I think that is all he is concerned with. A better kill ratio for him. Better odds for him.
My concern is that the space in 0.0 security has too much free information which plays into people's hands, both offensively and defensively. That one support fleet coming to bail the guy out? They would have the same benefits, thus making it also harder for the aggressor to decide when to bail.
RavenPaine wrote: By your own experienced statement, you must agree that it won't help kill the better pilots. They WILL D-scan and they will be aligned. Interceptors are one thing, but the new Recon feature would be a whole 'nother conversation.
Correct. It will not harm alert players that actively play, which is exactly the point that needs to be addressed. We have way too many bots and AFK-ing players, while the actual genuine players have to "battle" against it. By using something like this, people who aren't actively playing (and thus accept the risks of dying) will be a little more vulnerable. That would potentially open up the area to more lucrative changes in the future, based on your activity and such.
RavenPaine wrote: The proposal has more than one cause and effect though. There are ripple effects that are greater than his own self centered goals. CCP has added null systems, null regions, and worm holes over the years, so that MORE players would venture out there. They have developed Nullified T3's and changed interceptors so that MORE players could have reasonable access. They have revamped SOV mechanics many times to help populate null. If the OP thinks kills are thin now, it would only take a month and they would be thinner.
The problem is that people who are actively engaged in their space, will not earn a dime more than the semi-AFK players that plant their Ishtar onto grid, drop sentries and start AFK shooting. You're saying people need incentive to get to 0.0 sec, but in the meantime you support and condone the dillution of value by inactives / AFK / bots. Make the space worthwhile for players to actively do it, and add a slight delay on information sharing.
RavenPaine wrote: TBH, the only reason thousands of pilots go to null is the isk. Big blocks go to take moons and make billions of isk. They offer null isk as an incentive to keep pilots there. If you want PvP, you can go to somebodies home system and **** on their gates. Or you set up a gate camp and wait till the word gets out. Hunting ratters shouldn't even be part of the fleets agenda... other than maybe a scout warps to a couple sites while passing through.
The whole game is highly inflated on ISK because of faulty systems including the insane amount of income from moon mining. As a player, I'd love to see occupancy-based rewards so that you have to be actually active to make that insane amount of money. 0.0 security space is the only place in the game where you literally can sit on your arse, open intel channels and just go semi-AFK while watching netflix, all while raking in billions of ISK for virtually no risk.
If you're a proactive player, you wouldn't be hurt with the system because you have information and teamwork. But I do not believe that it's justified and acceptable that being AFK can yield you the same amount of ISK as the active player, but no elevated risks.
Changing how the intel works is also logical. The further you delve into the deep nullsec regions, the less the empires have control over that area. This is logical from both technical and lore perspectives. So why are we still having this "perfect" system that works the same as highsec, in a space that's neither controlled or owned by an Empire faction. This change would also be cool to integrate into the suggested Observatory Arrays, which could potentially affect things like gatecloak and such, as well as the delay of showing up in local.
People always get free information in 0.0, and I think the space does not benefit from that risk-averse mechanic. It still takes me a while to find your ship, so if you worry about being ganked then I can't help but wonder if you're either AFK, or just not very prepared to actually put effort into EVE. |
Colonel Tosh
Swamphole Inc. Swamphole
30
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Posted - 2015.06.04 16:40:27 -
[30] - Quote
Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Last thing this game needs is more buffs to non-consensual pvp.
For you especially: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Golden_Rules
Quote:You consent to PvP when you click "undock".
As for how I make money? I am a wormhole player on a few characters, with which I do sites in space that has no pre-given intel. It's rare to get ganked because I am a proactive player and I actually put some basic effort into EVE. Which is the whole point of this discussion. If you're an active player you should not have any issues with this. The only people that complain are the guys that get more risk to their AFK alts that rat in silence with no effort. |
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