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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Sibyyl
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
25416
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Posted - 2015.06.05 02:34:34 -
[61] - Quote
Entity, I don't have a collection like yours. Most people don't, and some of them are probably hating on you for that reason.
This move is akin to putting Max Singularity's outfit on NES store, reusing the graphic assets and putting a new name on it. Unique items should be unique, no matter what the demand for them.
And hilarious that people are arguing utility. It's a video game, folks. All of your space pixels are equally worthless.
All our times have come
Here but now they're gone
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
1170
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Posted - 2015.06.05 03:14:41 -
[62] - Quote
Xtreem wrote:What I can say is i am VERY pleased to have offloaded my scorp ishkone watch ships before skins hit, I made isk, if i had kept past this change i would have lost ALOT, i feel for the people that had rare ships that were turned into skins :-(
I dunno, having a unique ship that probably never leaves the hangar vs a skin you can reuse over and over on any scorp. Although that way you never see it on a killmail. market sell orders are for 20 bil and that is what I remember them selling for. I did buy a rattlesnake victory edition for the skin. although I'm kinda over the SKIN hype and thinking about offloading.
the stratios emergency responder at least has special stats.
@ChainsawPlankto
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37803
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Posted - 2015.06.05 03:20:31 -
[63] - Quote
I totally get where entity is coming from on this.
From CCP's own devblog, part of the reason we can't have any SKIN on any ship is because of visual gameplay implications:
CCP FoxFour wrote:Another concern of allowing any SKIN on any ship is making Tech 1 ships resemble Tech 2 ships which would have visual gameplay implications. While deciding what SKINs to offer in the release of this feature we carefully selected SKINs for ships by making sure that if we offered a SKIN for that ship the same look was not used by its Tech 2 counterpart. This is the reason why for example there is no Sarum SKIN for the Apocalypse, as it would too closely resemble the Paladin.
Yet here, just because the Stratios Emergency Responder is not a T2 variant, it's ok to have the potential for that very same visual gameplay implication.
That seems like a strange decision in my view.
A lot of us in the forum are happy to scream blue murder when we feel an issue affects us personally, but switch very quickly HTFU when it only affects someone else.
In this case, it seems like that is happening here too; which to a degree is a shame, since it would be great if we stuck together as a community to continue to let CCP know that the way they have managed the SKINs implementation has been really quite poor all around. This is another example.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Zeko Rena
ENCOM Industries
3181
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Posted - 2015.06.05 03:39:45 -
[64] - Quote
How am I supposed to feel like a special little snowflake now |
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CCP Darwin
C C P C C P Alliance
1489
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Posted - 2015.06.05 03:41:47 -
[65] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Yet here, just because the Stratios Emergency Responder is not a T2 variant, it's ok to have the potential for that very same visual gameplay implication.
That seems like a strange decision in my view. Note that your chances of encountering a Stratios Emergency Responder in space are extremely close to zero, while T2 ships are very common.
From a graphics development standpoint, there's a maintenance cost associating with keeping the look of a particular hull/faction combination rare, since those ship looks need to be updated from time to time as technologies change. So, Team Size Matters has assessed each ship in the game with a special look, to determine whether its look should be preserved as unique, going forward.
Some ships, such as the Tempest Tribal Issue or Gold Magnate, will have the uniqueness of their looks preserved. Others, such as the Stratios Emergency Responder, may resemble closely a ship with a SKIN applied. It's an assessment that they made on a case-by-case basis.
Note that, while there is value in having certain items remain very rare in the game, CCP has never promised that rare items would remain rare for all time, or hold their value indefinitely.
CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37805
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Posted - 2015.06.05 03:50:10 -
[66] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:Note that your chances of encountering a Stratios Emergency Responder in space are extremely close to zero, while T2 ships are very common. Scammer:
- Apply Stratios skin, screenshot.
- Post contract selling Stratios Emergency Responder and include link to image for extra visual proof.
Visual gameplay implication, surely?
Obviously a trap for the stupid, but it's no different in terms of the principle of visual implication than 2 ships being in space together (what's the chance the players are zoomed in enough to actually see them visually on screen?)
Irrespective of whether you are likely or not to see a Stratios Emergency Responder in space, the principle of visual gameplay implication is still there.
If there are no Vexors in system, what's the visual gameplay implication of an Ishtar skinned the same? Or other T2 variants if no T1 variants are around.
In that case it comes back to potential and while the chance is higher that you will have them in the same system, the principle still holds irrespective.
So whether it makes sense from a development perspective, that's great. Developer issues are obviously important, but so are community issues. On this project they have been somewhat in conflict and remain so.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Rob Kashuken
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
78
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Posted - 2015.06.05 05:29:48 -
[67] - Quote
I think that taking scamming as a reasoning is somewhat shallow, given that there already have been scams invoking the Etana, Guardian Vexor and State Raven already. I guess the combination of the hull and the green corner mark fool some people.
Hell, they don't even have to be remotely similar - I've seen Charon/Carbon and Gnosis/Gneiss scams actually work (people raging in local).
Contract markets can be very entertaining.
--
Given that the special ed ships though generally have different attributes (slot layout, PG/Cap/Dronebay), I'm not entirely convinced that the look of the ship detracts from it being a hanger queen anyway.
However, the approach CCP has taken does appear inconsistent. The Cambion (as an example) visually is very different from a Nugoeihuvi skinned Merlin, whilst both are a red-highlighted version of the same hull.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37806
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Posted - 2015.06.05 05:39:17 -
[68] - Quote
Rob Kashuken wrote:I think that taking scamming as a reasoning is somewhat shallow, given that there already have been scams invoking the Etana, Guardian Vexor and State Raven already. I guess the combination of the hull and the green corner mark fool some people.
... ...
However, the approach CCP has taken does appear inconsistent. The Cambion (as an example) visually is very different from a Nugoeihuvi skinned Merlin, whilst both are a red-highlighted version of the same hull.
Scamming isn't the reasoning. It's just an example.
The reasoning is CCPs own words. No one else's. It's in the devblog.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Avaelica Kuershin
Paper Cats
157
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Posted - 2015.06.05 05:45:17 -
[69] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:I would hope the new sanctuary SKIN and the Statios Emergency responder would look different.
From the linked picture and images of the Stratios Emergency Responder, they really are too similar. Got to look very closely to see any difference. The distinction should be greater. |
Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
209
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Posted - 2015.06.05 05:58:28 -
[70] - Quote
Lena Lazair wrote:Marsha Mallow wrote:Bit harsh. Those 'lucky few' might have worked hard to be awarded or to buy their unique items. I don't set any store in them either, but I can see why some do, and I really don't see any need to sneer at people who have different goals/hobbies. If I won an AT ship or put a lot of effort into acquiring a collectible, I'd go nuts if CCP arbitrarily ruined that just to make some dirty MT money. It is disrespectful, on various levels, and it cripples parts of the market that are actually quite fun. Except that's not what's happening at all. The SER is unique because of its stats, not its skin. I'm pretty sure no one with a Chremoas would care if CCP released a Dramiel skin that looked the same, because the point of a Chremoas isn't how it looks, it's how it flies. If all you wanted to do with an SER was spin the pretty ship in the hangar, you didn't need to own it. You could do that from the ship preview thingy. The release of skins has literally no impact on your ability to continue to spin your SER in the hangar. An SER is unique for its stats alone, which are still just as relevant as ever the moment you undock one.
Very well said. Nothing to add. Does it really matter if The color would be slightly different? Dark blue or deep blue. Vexor's family looks very similar to each other, meanwhile GV does recognize easily. Name and Stats making them uniqe as well as quantity available. |
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Rob Kashuken
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
79
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Posted - 2015.06.05 06:01:40 -
[71] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Rob Kashuken wrote:I think that taking scamming as a reasoning is somewhat shallow, given that there already have been scams invoking the Etana, Guardian Vexor and State Raven already. I guess the combination of the hull and the green corner mark fool some people.
... ...
However, the approach CCP has taken does appear inconsistent. The Cambion (as an example) visually is very different from a Nugoeihuvi skinned Merlin, whilst both are a red-highlighted version of the same hull.
Scamming isn't the reasoning. It's just an example of the same principle (my earlier post explains the reasoning as I see it). The reasoning is CCPs own words. No one else's. It's in the devblog.
Ah, ok. Cheers for the clarification. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2225
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Posted - 2015.06.05 06:08:09 -
[72] - Quote
Entity wrote: There's a monument outside jita 4-4 that would like to have a word with you.
I bet if shooting it made you go suspect, a lot fewer people would go and shoot it over minor things. Thus actually reserving it for major things. Of course, shooting the monument was not what actually changed CCP's mind, it was just a small part of the overall protest that occurred. |
Agata Matahari
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
66
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Posted - 2015.06.05 06:10:05 -
[73] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:[quote=Scipio Artelius]
Note that, while there is value in having certain items remain very rare in the game, CCP has never promised that rare items would remain rare for all time, or hold their value indefinitely. Niiiice! collectors ships for everyone? |
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite CODE.
1110
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Posted - 2015.06.05 06:54:15 -
[74] - Quote
Wasn't that the ship they donated to Somer-Blink?
the Code ALWAYS wins
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Shinzhi Xadi
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
100
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Posted - 2015.06.05 07:14:30 -
[75] - Quote
I'm waiting for Imperial Issue style skins for apocalypse, armageddon, and paladin!
Mac Pro dual 6-core Xeon 3.06ghz, 24gig ecc ram, EVGA GTX 680 Mac Edition, Intel SSD, OS X Yosemite and Windows 8.1 Pro.
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Satan's Spawn
Satan's Enterprises
11
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Posted - 2015.06.05 08:19:07 -
[76] - Quote
Skins are al another waste of EVE time tbh. One of those silly things in game.
Meanwhile, actual bugs remain in game for years - fix the PI graphics so that they don't bork and go all weird for starters. Spend money there instead. |
Swaghetti YoIonese
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2015.06.05 08:55:17 -
[77] - Quote
I have been told entity is the richest guy in eve online with two digit multiples of trillions. ccp, plz, if you make a change on behalf of a single multiple trillion heavy individuum who sheds some tears about some pixels, then I start writing my personal list of changes you should make on my behalf. thank you |
Pelle Wittewoa
University of Caille Gallente Federation
9
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Posted - 2015.06.05 09:31:33 -
[78] - Quote
Entity wrote:Really?So you hand out unique ships as event reward and then just go "lol we'll reuse this skin because only a handful of people have it anyway. We don't care about upsetting customers that obtained those ships, we just care about getting a few more bucks from skins" Thanks, CCP. Thanks a lot. I guess I can look forward to seeing the skins of all the unique ships I have in the NEX store. Seriously though, the visual identity of these ships is part of what makes them unique. I think it's a bad call to reuse those skins. It's not good for the game in the long run.
This is your punishment for generally being a elitist bastard, reseller and a nooby ripoff. Its part of your image that you support: "I'm entity, sell me your rare items for bottumprices, and i might not resell them later for topdallar with alts"
Wtt emergency vs 5 cargo expand II bpos?
Regards/groetjes
Pelle
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37812
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Posted - 2015.06.05 09:35:30 -
[79] - Quote
Swaghetti YoIonese wrote:I have been told entity is the richest guy in eve online with two digit multiples of trillions. ccp, plz, if you make a change on behalf of a single multiple trillion heavy individuum who sheds some tears about some pixels, then I start writing my personal list of changes you should make on my behalf. thank you And if you don't support other players (not entity specifically. What your individual wealth is shouldn't matter), then why should anyone including CCP support you and your list of changes?
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Swaghetti YoIonese
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2015.06.05 10:00:02 -
[80] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Swaghetti YoIonese wrote:I have been told entity is the richest guy in eve online with two digit multiples of trillions. ccp, plz, if you make a change on behalf of a single multiple trillion heavy individuum who sheds some tears about some pixels, then I start writing my personal list of changes you should make on my behalf. thank you And if you don't support other players (not entity specifically. What your individual wealth is shouldn't matter), then why should anyone including CCP support you and your list of changes?
I just wanted to put this whining of a high-flown individuum into relation. I just dont like ppl putting them selves as super special, only because they have unlimited amount of isks. |
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Valkin Mordirc
1091
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Posted - 2015.06.05 10:04:18 -
[81] - Quote
The Stratios ER gets a 125 m/b Bandwidth.
I would assume the SKIN version does not.
So you Ship is still special? Unless of course they took your Strat ER away and gave a normal one. That would make me a little miffed.
#DeleteTheWeak
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
4058
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Posted - 2015.06.05 10:17:56 -
[82] - Quote
Entity wrote:Marsha Mallow wrote:If they put plaques or a unique logo on the older hulls would it help? Not a troll btw, I agree rarity ships skins shouldn't be recycled. Although if they are really good designs and there's huge demand for them the people likely to complain are a tiny minority. Poke them in the feedback thread, you're more likely to get a dev reply there. Unique decals would be acceptable.
Well we are 90% OK then. :D To clarify the Stratios Emergency Responder is a Sanctuary ship and has the Sanctuary logo on it. SKINs are not supposed to change the logo on a ship. If you look at the Paladin with the default SKIN and the Paladin with the Blood Raider SKIN they have the same logo. I went to get a screen shot of this to show you for the Stratios and noticed that with the Sanctuary SKIN the logo does change. This is a defect and we have a defect written up for it internally and it will be fixed later this summer.
@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Size Matters
Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
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BrundleMeth
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
437
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Posted - 2015.06.05 10:40:43 -
[83] - Quote
Well something is not right here. I HAD a Scorpion Ishukone Edition ship. The ship DISAPPEARED from my Hanger and was replaced by a Skin. I can apply that skin to any and every Scorpion I own. That sucks big time. Now it is no longer unique.
I have seen the skin for sale for 25 Billion ISK, so I don't imagine many being sold. But the whole idea is crap. If eventually, I can buy a Raven State Issue Skin for say 100 Billion ISK, how many State Issue Ravens will we see? It was a real stupid idea to take away the Unique Ships... |
TinkerHell
Nocturnal Romance Cynosural Field Theory.
149
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Posted - 2015.06.05 10:52:57 -
[84] - Quote
Dersen Lowery wrote:If the special ships never undock, does it matter? The hull's still rare.
They do undock. |
Castelo Selva
Forcas armadas DARKNESS.
81
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Posted - 2015.06.05 11:21:23 -
[85] - Quote
Entity wrote:I guess I can look forward to seeing the skins of all the unique ships I have in the NEX store.
Seriously though, the visual identity of these ships is part of what makes them unique. I think it's a bad call to reuse those skins. It's not good for the game in the long run.
Well, well, well..
Initially, I have to say that I am very sorry for you mate. I will tell where is the root of this dishonourable action:
GÇ£GREED IS GOODGÇ¥
That it, as I personally say before countless time, the GÇ£greed is goodGÇ¥ mentality DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE PLAYERS OR THE GAME. It only care about the money.
It start with this GÇ£meaninglessGÇ¥ change, the ones that hit only at a few people, but it is spreading and infecting the game faster. The last symptom was the tempted of remove the bypass broken launcher. Now this release of already unique skin is another.
If we, the players, do not fight against that people the game will be sentenced to a slowing die. And do not fool yourself, the greed is good folks are in important position inside the Company (director level and above).
Again, I am very sorry mate. You have my sympathy and I understand your frustration. I hope that CCP do the right thing and do not release this skin. However, I must say, I have very low expectative about they doing the right thing.
The GÇ£greed is goodGÇ¥ force are strong. Unfortunately.
Best post ever!
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
37813
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Posted - 2015.06.05 11:27:07 -
[86] - Quote
BrundleMeth wrote:Well something is not right here. I HAD a Scorpion Ishukone Edition ship. The ship DISAPPEARED from my Hanger and was replaced by a Skin. I can apply that skin to any and every Scorpion I own. That sucks big time. Now it is no longer unique. If you activate the SKIN and then use it, the ship is only skinned while you are in it. If you leave the ship, it goes back to a normal Scorpion.
Activating the SKIN would actually make it more rare in terms of availability for sale, since you can never deactivate it again, so that would effectively be the same as destroying it as far as the rest of the player base is concerned.
The uniqueness doesn't change by activating the SKIN token.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
211
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Posted - 2015.06.05 12:19:38 -
[87] - Quote
All those tears... Just wow ccp gonna release new skins soon... |
The Slayer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
224
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Posted - 2015.06.05 12:20:33 -
[88] - Quote
BrundleMeth wrote:Well something is not right here. I HAD a Scorpion Ishukone Edition ship. The ship DISAPPEARED from my Hanger and was replaced by a Skin. I can apply that skin to any and every Scorpion I own. That sucks big time. Now it is no longer unique.
I have seen the skin for sale for 25 Billion ISK, so I don't imagine many being sold. But the whole idea is crap. If eventually, I can buy a Raven State Issue Skin for say 100 Billion ISK, how many State Issue Ravens will we see? It was a real stupid idea to take away the Unique Ships...
The skins themselves are still "unique", in that they can only ever be applied by the person who activates the skin on their account. |
Hemmo Paskiainen
478
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Posted - 2015.06.05 12:30:30 -
[89] - Quote
This is CCP we are talking about, the skins are just a way to keep the Art department busy. Its probably a mistake for this design. Entity should file a bug petition or a mentally stuck petition
"Relativity equals time plus momentum: if it can be erased by a single click on a button, would it be worth spending your time?"
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Domania
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
66
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Posted - 2015.06.05 14:27:36 -
[90] - Quote
BrundleMeth wrote:Well something is not right here. I HAD a Scorpion Ishukone Edition ship. The ship DISAPPEARED from my Hanger and was replaced by a Skin. I can apply that skin to any and every Scorpion I own. That sucks big time. Now it is no longer unique.
I have seen the skin for sale for 25 Billion ISK, so I don't imagine many being sold. But the whole idea is crap. If eventually, I can buy a Raven State Issue Skin for say 100 Billion ISK, how many State Issue Ravens will we see? It was a real stupid idea to take away the Unique Ships...
Depends on how you look at it. The amount of skins are dependent on the amount of hulls that were in game. Therefore your skin is still a rare and unique item. You should be happy too, the hull was no different than normal Scorpions, but now when people buy that skin and consume it, there is one less skin available on market. $$$$$
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