Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
corbexx
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1360
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 22:33:08 -
[1] - Quote
there is a new blog here
long story short you wont be able to fleet warp to probe results and bookmarks. I dont like it I think its pretty terrible.
CCP Larrikin is potentially happy to chat to us about it
Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
|
|
CCP Larrikin
C C P C C P Alliance
85
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 22:37:27 -
[2] - Quote
corbexx wrote:there is a new blog herelong story short you wont be able to fleet warp to probe results and bookmarks. I dont like it I think its pretty terrible. CCP Larrikin is potentially happy to chat to us about it Confirming! |
|
Iyokus Patrouette
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
502
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 22:37:40 -
[3] - Quote
I can't seem to open that link, why do CCP feel like this needs to be implemented?
*opens his chest and pulls out his torch and pitchfork*
---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----
|
Neckbeard Nolyfe
Zero Fun Allowed Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
75
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 22:54:06 -
[4] - Quote
corbexx wrote:there is a new blog herelong story short you wont be able to fleet warp to probe results and bookmarks. I dont like it I think its pretty terrible.CCP Larrikin is potentially happy to chat to us about it
Well then, he is probably the only one happy about it.
~lvl 60 paladin~
|
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc. Illusion of Solitude
1729
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 22:55:55 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:corbexx wrote:there is a new blog herelong story short you wont be able to fleet warp to probe results and bookmarks. I dont like it I think its pretty terrible. CCP Larrikin is potentially happy to chat to us about it Confirming!
This is somewhat earthshattering for wormhole space, I imagine Corbexx has explained the various reasons to you. Can I ask, when you are considering feedback, that some of the issues will be greatly helped by ensuring bookmark propogation delay is fixed to allow them to propogate in a reasonable time. I am assuming, you are not goint to allow bookmarks to be fleet warped to, but at least allow us to individually warp to them, because 10 minutes waiting for them to populate, is 9 min 55 seconds too long........
There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
|
corbexx
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1361
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:05:14 -
[6] - Quote
Iyokus Patrouette wrote:I can't seem to open that link, why do CCP feel like this needs to be implemented?
*opens his chest and pulls out his torch and pitchfork*
sorry sorted link now
Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
|
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
1356
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:16:31 -
[7] - Quote
You know what would have addressed it, if fleet warping to bookmarks and prove results were restricted to squad leaders.
You want to warp a fleet to a bookmark, the wing commander and fleet commander can't, the squad commander can.
Small groups grow again, you bring the responsibility back to leaders (but squad leaders of small groups).
So you stop the 1 commander warping an armada at once, and instead permit the squad commanders to be able to warp their squads in, breaking up responsibility and permitting individuals to take that role, vs just the fleet commander.
So instead of a blob, you get several squads.
so basically you can warp yourself, or you can fleet warp your squad. It restricts you to choosing to warping 10 people to a bookmark.
On probing, put it at the squad level also, and even make it a probers job. You probe it, you warp your squad, and the rest of the fleet follows when you land.
The issue currently is that 1 guy controls the entire fleet and dictates all warp ins. Break it down into small groups (squad level) and the playing field changes. You now need multiple leaders trying to get tacticals for your group.
Yaay!!!!
|
Jack Miton
WeebleCORP
4488
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:22:24 -
[8] - Quote
Not really a surprising change, given various other recent-ish changes. I'm still pretty shocked CCP actually had the balls to do it but it IS the direction they've been heading for some time. This is going to make day to day life in wspace a lot more painful but I think we all know better than try to dissuade CCP from making changes that are bad for wspace by now *shrug*. At least you can still fleet warp to a fleet member i guess. Realistically this probably won't affect smaller groups very much so I find it hard to hate it...
I like the above suggestion of allowing squad commanders to fleet warp normally but not wing and fleet commanders. solves the giant blob issue theyre trying to solve but still allows for things like fleet warping hauler alts to WHs or scouts to newly scanned sigs ect.
PS: CCP when it comes to wspace not liking their changes: http://i.imgur.com/JwYMTa9.png
There is no Bob.
Stuck In Here With Me: http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/
Down the Pipe: http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
|
Pritovsky Pootis
Eschelon Directive Universal Consortium
30
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:23:02 -
[9] - Quote
But CCP knows best, right? Despite pretty much breaking WH space, again.
No but seriously no matter what we say, CCP doesn't listen anyway. Especially when it comes to wormhole space. Who cares when there's so many more people in nullsec, right?
"We're listening to feedback" is also known in CCP-land as "Ignore everything that's not our original plan", occasionally posting things such as "Don't worry guy's we're still watching the thread" to let us know they actually aren't. |
Jyn Artan
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:35:45 -
[10] - Quote
Are there plans to allow more things to be broadcast to the fleet as waprins? For example probe results.
Broadcasting a probe results is only slightly different than the prober warping to the location and putting WWWs in fleet.
Broadcasting seems more elegant and still retains the requirement of the pilot flying their own boat. |
|
Jezza McWaffle
Grumpy Bastards No Response
214
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:37:57 -
[11] - Quote
So which thread should we be commenting in, this one or the official one, given the last time major changes were made to wormhole space the unofficial thread got more attention
C6 Wormhole blog
http://holelotofwaffle.wordpress.com/
|
Ab'del Abu
Atlantis Ascendant
291
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:40:38 -
[12] - Quote
This change is absolutely dumb. Just nerf those f'ing bombers for christ's sake. PvP is supposed to be fast paced, so why nerf people's play style into the ground just because you cannot properly balance a single ship class? Ming boggling ... |
Juana Cavin-Guang
Wehnimer's Irregulars Rabbit Wholes
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:42:58 -
[13] - Quote
Quote: The goal of these changes is to encourage more individual fleet member participation and reduce the speed at which fleets can get on top of targets (e.g bombers).
but it doesn't.
it just means public and alliance fleets can no longer contend against corp-only fleets.
This is completely unfair towards the NPSI and other public pvp communities. Want to bring possible recruits on a roam? you must gimp your fleet and become significantly more vulnerable to sniper tactics and other situations where having the bookmark advantage is the difference between a decisive win and a decisive loss.
Somebody in the fleet doesn't have the 450km above gate bookmark? looks like the fleet either warps into the bubble camp or not at all!
For wormholes, it's more of a large thorn in the side, and goes out of the way to inconvenience those who decided to form an alliance instead of assimilate everybody into a single corp with the corp leader to sacrifice 20 some days getting the needed skills up. Generally, the cloaky scouts are much more likely to be used, and it gives an undeserved increase to the safety of ships clearing sigs.
wormholes are profitable, yes, BUT THAT IS NOT REASON TO MAKE THIS CHANGE. MAKING IT SAFER TO CLEAR THE COMBAT SITES DOES SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THE INTENT OF THIS CHANGE. WORMHOLES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE DANGEROUS, AND NOT BECAUSE OF NPC FIGHTS. |
Chesterfield Fancypantz
Radical Astronauts Plundering Eve WormHole Occupation and Resource Exploitation
46
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:56:16 -
[14] - Quote
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK everything to do with this poorly thought out bullshit. |
Malaph
Radical Astronauts Plundering Eve WormHole Occupation and Resource Exploitation
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.11 23:57:53 -
[15] - Quote
Chesterfield Fancypantz wrote:FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK everything to do with this poorly thought out bullshit.
Yup confirmed this is a dumb change.
|
BayneNothos
United Electro-Magnetic Federation Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
138
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:12:34 -
[16] - Quote
TBH we don't use fleet warps too much as is so I'm not too fussed about this at the moment. We generally ask people to warp themselves to targets/cloaky alts in position.
I guess my question is, why not go the whole way and remove fleetwarp all together? |
Borsek
Incertae Sedis
299
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:20:34 -
[17] - Quote
Holy shitballs what a ******** change, which numbskull came up with that?
Either CCP doesn't play eve, or they got dunked on by bombers and this is their edition of bombers OP, kill vital part of game so we can provail.
Honestly? First you go 'small things are great' (they aren't, btw) then you freaking nerf it all to hell, cos yeah, no more fleetwarps seems like a cool idea, right?
This change goes through, I actually am unsubbing, lol. I haven't been active for a while now, and honestly, with such changes even being thought about on ANYTHING but the first of April, I can see the game is going to ****.
Next change is prolly gonna be supercaps only being able to jump and slowboat, not warp, because carriers OP for ratting. ****. |
Eanok
POS Party Low-Class
16
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:33:47 -
[18] - Quote
Reminds me of that South Park episode where the manatees are picking random balls with bit ideas for the writers of Family Guy. CCP must be running out of meaningful ideas so they need useless filler to fatten up the next feature list. Kind of like those new terrible icons. |
Suspicious Tubesteak
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:34:01 -
[19] - Quote
Why not just make wormholes show up on the overview like star gates, apart from entrances to W-space in K. Behavior would be the same, but nobody would have to scan anymore.... and it solves most of the "alliance bookmark" and propagation delay problem! You could take it a step further and make WH ore and combat carebear sites need to be scanned down again to open, but make them warpable to all once open.... makes travel (and contact) easier, and leaves the risk of running sites the same.
....... |
Winthorp
3540
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:36:06 -
[20] - Quote
I just dont understand why they cant leave fleet warp to a bookmark as an option. If all members of fleet have the bookmark propogated then it hasnt been an instant fleet warp from a scan result, it has a time delay attached to it.
This would still allow CCP to keep this balance change they want for nullsec fleets and keep us from rioting.
I am Winthorp, you might remember me from such films as "Winthorp is to blame for permanent signature ID's".
Please note i don't engage in any meaningful discussion with NPC alts, nut up or shut up...
|
|
Valterra Craven
573
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:37:48 -
[21] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:You know what would have addressed it, if fleet warping to bookmarks and prove results were restricted to squad leaders.
You want to warp a fleet to a bookmark, the wing commander and fleet commander can't, the squad commander can.
This. Times a thousand. Gets some of the affect you want without killing the small timers like me who run missions with two accounts.
Also, why not just nerf bomber warp accel and warp speed to get them on grid slower if thats what this change was about? |
Borsek
Incertae Sedis
299
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:44:04 -
[22] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Phoenix Jones wrote:You know what would have addressed it, if fleet warping to bookmarks and prove results were restricted to squad leaders.
You want to warp a fleet to a bookmark, the wing commander and fleet commander can't, the squad commander can.
This. Times a thousand. Gets some of the affect you want without killing the small timers like me who run missions with two accounts. Also, why not just nerf bomber warp accel and warp speed to get them on grid slower if thats what this change was about?
Because, as I once read on tthese very forums, circa 2009:
There is a leaking pipe in the basement.
The sensible solution would be to patch the pipe up, or to replace it.
The CCP solution would be to add a 200hp diesel powered pump to pump the water out.
But worry not, my friend, for this is 2015, and now CCP will let you choose between 3 or more fancy colors for your engine! |
Jack Miton
WeebleCORP
4490
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 00:48:31 -
[23] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:This. Times a thousand. Gets some of the affect you want without killing the small timers like me who run missions with two accounts. Right, because running missions with 2 accounts is what this change is going to affect.... please....
For all that hate this change is getting, it IS being made to address many gameplay aspects that everyone hates. As usual, is it a bit heavy handed but I'm never going to agree with anyone who is hating on this change just cos 'adding difficulty to large fleet fights is bad'.
There is no Bob.
Stuck In Here With Me: http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/
Down the Pipe: http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
|
Borsek
Incertae Sedis
299
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 01:05:05 -
[24] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:This. Times a thousand. Gets some of the affect you want without killing the small timers like me who run missions with two accounts. Right, because running missions with 2 accounts is what this change is going to affect.... please.... For all that hate this change is getting, it IS being made to address many gameplay aspects that everyone hates. As usual, is it a bit heavy handed but I'm never going to agree with anyone who is hating on this change just cos 'adding difficulty to large fleet fights is bad'.
But don't you see? That's exactly the problem, it does make large fleet fights harder, but it also ***** on hundreds of other situations, that's the problem. There are a dozen ways of making large fights different, one of which could easily be to change the warp-in bubble size to 10km radius or nerfing a specific ship class, this change effectively makes multiboxing annoying as hell, having to warp multiple ships one by one.
The charm and fun of eve was never the combat system - keep em in your guns' optimals, be faster, be tankier, whatever, the most advanced techniques of eve combat are doubleclicking in space and overheating properly. It was never about the freaking mechanics, it was about raping the hell out of something the other guy worked hard for. Getting tears, schadenfreude. Now CCP made poeple fly ****-tier inexpensive ships, which they don't care about losing, clones now cost 0 ISK, so now, suddenly no one gives a flying fedo about losing this or that ship or pod, it's all meaningless, and since it's meaningless, everybody suddenly realized the mechanics through which you lose said ships are ****-tier, just like the ships themselves.
Now CCP is trying to make the mechanics 'more interesting' instead of striking at the root of the problem, nerfing the crap out of frigate-**** ships, and getting people to fly shiny **** they don't want to lose, so when they fight in it, they get an adrenaline RUSH, instead of hooray, I just killed a ******* tristan. |
Hippinse
University of Caille Gallente Federation
77
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 01:07:34 -
[25] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:This. Times a thousand. Gets some of the affect you want without killing the small timers like me who run missions with two accounts. Right, because running missions with 2 accounts is what this change is going to affect.... please.... For all that hate this change is getting, it IS being made to address many gameplay aspects that everyone hates. As usual, is it a bit heavy handed but I'm never going to agree with anyone who is hating on this change just cos 'adding difficulty to large fleet fights is bad'.
This is my first post on this topic. This change will affect me, as I use 2 accounts to run class 2 combat sites. The net effect will be that I have to wait for the bookmark system to propagate the corp bookmark to the other client, or I'll have to jump one account in first and tank with 50% dps until the second can warp to the first. Not the end of the world, but less optimal than things are today.
What are the gameplay aspects that are being fixed by this change? Is there a list of examples in the other thread that I missed? |
Darth Bex
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
25
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 01:40:57 -
[26] - Quote
CCP have made some big strides forward with bookmarks in recent times. This is a giant leap backwards.
Console me with Alliance bookmarks and I'll forget we ever spoke of this.
Disciple of Bob
|
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
2411
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 01:47:46 -
[27] - Quote
Well, this is going to probably force me to lay the ultimatum down for one of the corps in my alliance which has been hemming and hawing about merging.
Right now, if a scout in one corp goes 4 holes down the chain and finds, lets say, a rattlesnake, we put a member of his corp in the squad or wing position and they squad or wing warp to the next hole, next hole, etc. Without that ability, this will become uber painful, because the only other way is to swap BM's, which take 10 minutes to propagate. Or, like I said, they're going to merge, bunch of inactive asstards they are anyway.
The NPSI fleets i run on fridays, well, thanks. Herding cats is now 10x harder. Try getting more than 2 people to warp to a ceptor on his ping. No big deal though, everyone will get picked off one by one by small gangs of single-corp people. So the roam will die a death of a dozen papercuts versus everyone welping goriously in one cataclysmic failcascade. I'm sure that will be more fun.
Since you are doing this, can we also look at nerfing public covops fleet behaviour? Can you make it so only corp members can access covert cyno fields? That will kill bombers bar and spectrefleet and nix all bait cyno activity in one fell swoop. This will only destroy terrible FCs running fleets for terrible people playing terrible gameplay, sitting around for 5 hours passively waiting for a bait cyno to go up and then piling through like a herd of mongoloid kittens, slurring their mewling cries in local and falling over in a pathetically cute fashion. That would be sweet. Thanks. more people might actually try and get good at BLOPs versus just work the numbers game of having 40 bombers to kill a tristan.
But for day-to-day...no biggie. We don't really use too much squad and fleet warping to fling gangs at targets. We usually have a scout, or a bait hauler, on field and WWW in fleet. So i guess my guys who seem incapable of having fleet cha window open will have to shape up and keep their ears and eyes open more, since they won't be able to get squad warped.
In fact, you could just take the whole squad warp out of the game entirely in one go. I mean, if it's only going to work on celestials anyway, who cares? Peons can warp themselves.
Doctor Prince Field Marshall of Prolapse. Alliance and Grand Sasquatch of Bob
We take Batphones. Contact us at Hola Batmanuel - Free call 1800-UR-MOMMA
~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
|
Iyokus Patrouette
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
504
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 02:01:59 -
[28] - Quote
Seems like a heavy handed approach to fix what i assume is mostly bomber related problems. but you just go ahead and do whatever makes you happy CCP, people will either adapt or stop playing. Honestly i don't even care anymore.
---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----
|
Jack Miton
WeebleCORP
4491
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 02:32:27 -
[29] - Quote
Borsek wrote:But don't you see? That's exactly the problem, it does make large fleet fights harder, but it also ***** on hundreds of other situations, that's the problem. There are a dozen ways of making large fights different, one of which could easily be to change the warp-in bubble size to 10km radius or nerfing a specific ship class, this change effectively makes multiboxing annoying as hell, having to warp multiple ships one by one. yeah, i agree. like I said, I dont like this change but I do see what they're try to accomplish with it. i think limiting fleet warp abilities (all of them) to squad commanders would solve the entire issue much better than what theyre doing.
There is no Bob.
Stuck In Here With Me: http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/
Down the Pipe: http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
|
Steven Hackett
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
152
|
Posted - 2015.06.12 04:23:04 -
[30] - Quote
With the introduction of frigate wormholes ([font="Sarcastica"]Thank you Fozzie[/font]), scanning in cov-ops has become more used. Cov-ops doesn't like being decloaked with sleeper frigates on grid. With the changes to the scanners way of instantly telling people that a new signature is present ([font="Sarcastica"]Thatks, we so much needed this[/font]), time and speed has become more important than ever.
How do we use warping to bookmarks? - We use bookmarks for everything. Warping to wormholes, warping to wrecks, tractor units etc. We make the bookmark, then we fleetwarp the fleet to the bookmark so they don't have to wait for it to propagate.
How do we use warping to scanned signatures? - When trying to catch targets, combat scanning them becomes a race against time due to the changes to signature spawn(read above). Decloaking a cov-ops on grid with sleeper frigs, lokis etc, is borderline suicidal. Fleetwarp will often be used to warp suicide dictors and similar onto the enemy fleet in order to establise tackle.
So these changes gives us 2 options. We can either suicide a ship/pilot in order to provide a warp in, which will remove that pilot from the fight (Sounds like the definition of a bad game to me?)
Or, we can wait 10 minuts for every pilot to get the bookmark, which will often equal no-fight. And personally I think it is pretty bad game design to have some bad propagation code decide when a player can or can't warp.
My only prayer for CCP: Stop being lazy, start getting better. Recent and coming changes are dominated by you choosing "the easy way" instead of the good way. being lazy is a good way of making bad decissions. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |