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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.06.28 05:07:53 -
[1] - Quote
Hi Yal, I'm trying to decide between which of these weapons system is better for C3 WHs b/t 250mm rails vs 720mm arties. This decision is based on whether to train for the Sleipnir or the Vuture for soloing C3s. Also deciding on which b/t the Loki or Eagle/RailGu my alt trains for. Can anyone please give me some helpful feedback to help me decide which path to take? Any help is greatly appreciated, Thanks. |
elitatwo
Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team
700
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Posted - 2015.06.28 19:15:15 -
[2] - Quote
First, what does b/t mean and secondly, what do you mean by soloing? If you are brave enough to try solo pvp in a c3 I would recommend a command ship and if you mean running annomalies the sleeper cruisers.
Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
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GordonO
Caldari Provisions
126
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Posted - 2015.06.28 20:19:30 -
[3] - Quote
I used rails before in a C3.. wasn't great. Some ships stay at range and the frigs come in close so you need something that works at both ranges. You could keep your toons 20-30km away from each other but its still not going to be super easy. When you launch your drones to hit clsoe orbiting frigs they will get shot at. If you go sliepner, just use AC's. Missiles are still the best choice for this type of activity. Sentry drone boats also work. my 2 isk from experience anyway
... What next ??
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RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1079
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Posted - 2015.06.28 20:46:32 -
[4] - Quote
250's are in a good place right now. they reload fast and have decent range, decent damage, decent rate of fire. ROF keeps rats from regening so much. One issue is neuts. Neuts shut your guns down.
Arties of any kind have good alpha, but poor ROF means rats can regen a lot in between shots. Just seems like a bad way to go.
GordonO is probably spot on about autocannons and missiles. Missiles being capless, damage specific, are the best for solo stuff imo.
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RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1079
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Posted - 2015.06.28 20:55:06 -
[5] - Quote
As for the advice on training an alt:
I always recommend training opposite directions. What you don't want, is two pilots that do the exact same thing. (Unless you're a miner I suppose) Characters that do different things will allow you to experience more from EVE in half the time. And they may compliment each other at some point.
Probe alt + Damage alt Cap alt / subcap alt Guns/armor Missiles/shields Cyno alt Leadership alt Freighter/hauler alt Trade alt for selling your stuff with less cost/taxes/fees.
You see the general idea. |
Iyokus Patrouette
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
537
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Posted - 2015.06.28 22:48:02 -
[6] - Quote
Honestly a Rattlesnake is just easier in every way.
---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.06.29 04:41:13 -
[7] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:First, what does b/t mean and secondly, what do you mean by soloing? If you are brave enough to try solo pvp in a c3 I would recommend a command ship and if you mean running annomalies the sleeper cruisers.
b/t = between. And I would be using a combination of 2 ships to do C3s + salvager/scanner/t2hauler + booster.
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.06.29 04:55:30 -
[8] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:250's are in a good place right now. they reload fast and have decent range, decent damage, decent rate of fire. ROF keeps rats from regening so much. One issue is neuts. Neuts shut your guns down.
Arties of any kind have good alpha, but poor ROF means rats can regen a lot in between shots. Just seems like a bad way to go.
GordonO is probably spot on about autocannons and missiles. Missiles being capless, damage specific, are the best for solo stuff imo.
yea it seems a botched that one (I didn't train missiles). So in case of 250mm rails, would Eagle/Railgu + Vulture be better than the Vaga/Loki + Sleipnir route for doing C3's?
I thought the Sleipnir with 720mm Arty was suppose to be powerful in C3s, have they been nerfed?
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.06.29 04:59:26 -
[9] - Quote
Iyokus Patrouette wrote:Honestly a Rattlesnake is just easier in every way.
How much does insurance pay for losing a Rattlesnake, just curious because I see them a lot on the KBs for some reason.
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Amanda Chan
Error 404 Pod Not Found
25
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Posted - 2015.06.29 06:10:37 -
[10] - Quote
Maradusa Macarthy wrote:Iyokus Patrouette wrote:Honestly a Rattlesnake is just easier in every way. How much does insurance pay for losing a Rattlesnake, just curious because I see them a lot on the KBs for some reason.
Pays for crap like all non t1 faction hulls. Rattlesnake are just amoung the cheapest of the faction BS hulls. I think you can get a hull for under 400 million and pull some beastly dps for ship + fitting running you around 500 million. |
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Iyokus Patrouette
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
540
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Posted - 2015.06.29 06:19:34 -
[11] - Quote
Amanda Chan wrote:Maradusa Macarthy wrote:Iyokus Patrouette wrote:Honestly a Rattlesnake is just easier in every way. How much does insurance pay for losing a Rattlesnake, just curious because I see them a lot on the KBs for some reason. Pays for crap like all non t1 faction hulls. Rattlesnake are just amoung the cheapest of the faction BS hulls. I think you can get a hull for under 400 million and pull some beastly dps for ship + fitting running you around 500 million.
you see them on the killboards a lot because they are popular, we'd still hunt you down in anything you fly.
and yeah insurance might not be great (i don't insure my ships so i don't know the actual value) but they cost like 360mil in Jita at the moment so are dirt cheap considering what you get for your iskies
---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----
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Nyveris NeVonte
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2015.06.29 11:18:39 -
[12] - Quote
Iyokus Patrouette wrote:Amanda Chan wrote:Maradusa Macarthy wrote:Iyokus Patrouette wrote:Honestly a Rattlesnake is just easier in every way. How much does insurance pay for losing a Rattlesnake, just curious because I see them a lot on the KBs for some reason. Pays for crap like all non t1 faction hulls. Rattlesnake are just amoung the cheapest of the faction BS hulls. I think you can get a hull for under 400 million and pull some beastly dps for ship + fitting running you around 500 million. you see them on the killboards a lot because they are popular, we'd still hunt you down in anything you fly. and yeah insurance might not be great (i don't insure my ships so i don't know the actual value) but they cost like 360mil in Jita at the moment so are dirt cheap considering what you get for your iskies
So they're actually are people who go around conducting such trivial activities huh... such a shame.
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.06.29 11:26:42 -
[13] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:As for the advice on training an alt:
I always recommend training opposite directions. What you don't want, is two pilots that do the exact same thing. (Unless you're a miner I suppose) Characters that do different things will allow you to experience more from EVE in half the time. And they may compliment each other at some point.
Probe alt + Damage alt Cap alt / subcap alt Guns/armor Missiles/shields Cyno alt Leadership alt Freighter/hauler alt Trade alt for selling your stuff with less cost/taxes/fees.
You see the general idea.
actually i did just that. I trained 2 pilots in turrets, and 2 in missiles/drones.
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.07.01 11:17:59 -
[14] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:250's are in a good place right now. they reload fast and have decent range, decent damage, decent rate of fire. ROF keeps rats from regening so much. One issue is neuts. Neuts shut your guns down.
Arties of any kind have good alpha, but poor ROF means rats can regen a lot in between shots. Just seems like a bad way to go.
GordonO is probably spot on about autocannons and missiles. Missiles being capless, damage specific, are the best for solo stuff imo.
Which ships between the Railgu vs Rail Proteus utilizes the 250mm Rails for C3 WHs the best?
Also between the rail Vulture vs rail Astarte?
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Xylem Viliana
The Free Worlds League
305
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Posted - 2015.07.01 21:05:07 -
[15] - Quote
rail astarte can be very nasty, but for c3's needs bling, rattler would be my choice too, |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1509
|
Posted - 2015.07.01 21:23:41 -
[16] - Quote
Honestly, don't solo. Dual box RR domis.
Cheap, insurable, can tank ALL C3 stuff without breaking a sweat, are non trivial to engage for gankers (not that they're 'hard' but they're...more than a sole ship), sites melt under their DPS.
There's literally no better option, if you can spare the pilot. |
Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
|
Posted - 2015.07.01 22:21:18 -
[17] - Quote
afkalt wrote:Honestly, don't solo. Dual box RR domis.
Cheap, insurable, can tank ALL C3 stuff without breaking a sweat, are non trivial to engage for gankers (not that they're 'hard' but they're...more than a sole ship), sites melt under their DPS.
There's literally no better option, if you can spare the pilot.
Are they better than Rattlers?
Also how is it best to fit the RR Domis and how do you use them?
Can you give me a rundown of the skills needed to use the RR Domis effectively?
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RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1083
|
Posted - 2015.07.02 01:26:04 -
[18] - Quote
Maradusa Macarthy wrote:RavenPaine wrote:250's are in a good place right now. they reload fast and have decent range, decent damage, decent rate of fire. ROF keeps rats from regening so much. One issue is neuts. Neuts shut your guns down.
Arties of any kind have good alpha, but poor ROF means rats can regen a lot in between shots. Just seems like a bad way to go.
GordonO is probably spot on about autocannons and missiles. Missiles being capless, damage specific, are the best for solo stuff imo.
Which ships between the Railgu vs Rail Proteus utilizes the 250mm Rails for C3 WHs the best? Also between the rail Vulture vs rail Astarte?
I have zero experience in worm holes. similarly I have zero experience with a railGu or a Vulture.
I do fly a Rail Proteus fairly often for null sec sites. Like it a lot and I consider it 'second best' of the null fit T3 type fits. Tengu being #1. I also use a Blaster Astarte on occasion for PvP. It's a DPS machine! and I love it. Rail Astarte might be pretty awesome.
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Maradusa Macarthy
Hedion University Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.07.02 03:24:39 -
[19] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:Maradusa Macarthy wrote:RavenPaine wrote:250's are in a good place right now. they reload fast and have decent range, decent damage, decent rate of fire. ROF keeps rats from regening so much. One issue is neuts. Neuts shut your guns down.
Arties of any kind have good alpha, but poor ROF means rats can regen a lot in between shots. Just seems like a bad way to go.
GordonO is probably spot on about autocannons and missiles. Missiles being capless, damage specific, are the best for solo stuff imo.
Which ships between the Railgu vs Rail Proteus utilizes the 250mm Rails for C3 WHs the best? Also between the rail Vulture vs rail Astarte? I have zero experience in worm holes. similarly I have zero experience with a railGu or a Vulture. I do fly a Rail Proteus fairly often for null sec sites. Like it a lot and I consider it 'second best' of the null fit T3 type fits. Tengu being #1. I also use a Blaster Astarte on occasion for PvP. It's a DPS machine! and I love it. Rail Astarte might be pretty awesome.
Ty RavenPaine for your input. I guess I'll go with the Railgu and Rail Astarte for now, but I'm still a little worried about training for T3Cs because there are lots of whimpers about them getting attack by CCP's nerf bat. You know anything about this? What kind of dps can the Astarte tank per say? |
Riven Varlass
Renegade Armada.
8
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Posted - 2015.07.02 08:06:55 -
[20] - Quote
Maradusa Macarthy wrote:afkalt wrote:Honestly, don't solo. Dual box RR domis.
Cheap, insurable, can tank ALL C3 stuff without breaking a sweat, are non trivial to engage for gankers (not that they're 'hard' but they're...more than a sole ship), sites melt under their DPS.
There's literally no better option, if you can spare the pilot. Are they better than Rattlers? Also how is it best to fit the RR Domis and how do you use them? Can you give me a rundown of the skills needed to use the RR Domis effectively?
Yes they are better than Rattlers when it comes to risk vs reward.
Highs: remote reps, energy transfer, neuts. Meds: Sensor booster, mjd, tp, eccm, point lows: DDA, resistance mods, 1600 plate sentry drones++
Warp into site, align celestial/sleeper, mjd. stop ships. launch mtu. blap sleepers whilst spamming scan button. bookmark mtu. go next site.
C3 in dual domi is a walk in the park. |
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1543
|
Posted - 2015.07.02 08:15:32 -
[21] - Quote
Riven Varlass wrote:Maradusa Macarthy wrote:afkalt wrote:Honestly, don't solo. Dual box RR domis.
Cheap, insurable, can tank ALL C3 stuff without breaking a sweat, are non trivial to engage for gankers (not that they're 'hard' but they're...more than a sole ship), sites melt under their DPS.
There's literally no better option, if you can spare the pilot. Are they better than Rattlers? Also how is it best to fit the RR Domis and how do you use them? Can you give me a rundown of the skills needed to use the RR Domis effectively? Yes they are better than Rattlers when it comes to risk vs reward. Highs: remote reps, energy transfer, neuts. Meds: Sensor booster, mjd, tp, eccm, point lows: DDA, resistance mods, 1600 plate sentry drones++ Warp into site, align celestial/sleeper, mjd. stop ships. launch mtu. blap sleepers whilst spamming scan button. bookmark mtu. go next site. C3 in dual domi is a walk in the park.
I often use this, shameless nicked from a WH thread of old.
[Dominix, WH C4 RR] Damage Control II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Explosive Hardener II
Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script
Large Remote Capacitor Transmitter II Large Remote Capacitor Transmitter II Drone Link Augmentor II Large 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer Large 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer Large 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer
Large Egress Port Maximizer II Large Remote Repair Augmentor I Large Remote Repair Augmentor I
Bouncer II x5 Garde II x5
Can probably ditch a bunch of the rechargers for a C3, you're not under enough pressure. And it's usually tracking speed.
You can shield RR them too, if you like but it's a bit harder. |
Moth Eisig
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.02 16:37:21 -
[22] - Quote
Riven Varlass wrote:Maradusa Macarthy wrote:afkalt wrote:Honestly, don't solo. Dual box RR domis.
Cheap, insurable, can tank ALL C3 stuff without breaking a sweat, are non trivial to engage for gankers (not that they're 'hard' but they're...more than a sole ship), sites melt under their DPS.
There's literally no better option, if you can spare the pilot. Are they better than Rattlers? Also how is it best to fit the RR Domis and how do you use them? Can you give me a rundown of the skills needed to use the RR Domis effectively? Yes they are better than Rattlers when it comes to risk vs reward.
Is that because of the insurance? Or damage application? A Rattlesnake costs about the same and puts out more paper DPS than two drone-only Dominixes and needs only one account for running sites so if you have a second account it can give boosts/watch incoming holes.
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1561
|
Posted - 2015.07.03 11:57:38 -
[23] - Quote
Costs the same as an unfit rattler, perhaps. Costs a hell of a lot more to be fit to tank the 1300 DPS coming out a C3 relic.
Secondary concerns are gankers and the ability to split loot between domis to limit losses. Domis also get bonused lights which help to splashing small ships that make it under sentries as well as deterring covops hobo tackle. They also significantly more "ignorable" than a rattler. |
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
1178
|
Posted - 2015.07.03 12:30:51 -
[24] - Quote
A single rattlesnake also enjoys sleepers agressing drones, damage application issues (goodbye full dps against awakened defenders at 16k wth gardes) to level some of the on-paper advantages gained over domis.
afkalt wrote: Can probably ditch a bunch of the rechargers for a C3, you're not under enough pressure. And it's usually tracking speed.
You can shield RR them too, if you like but it's a bit harder.
Your ISK/hr is down the gutter with only one DLA. That's not a c4-domi fit. Saying because I used to run with one DLA initially and nearly commmited ritual suicide over the clear speed. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1591
|
Posted - 2015.07.04 10:24:47 -
[25] - Quote
I have spares in the cargo, depots, sebos as required.
Mobile depots are the **** :D |
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