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Sasha Nyemtsov
Systems Administration and Control
133
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Posted - 2015.07.20 12:01:20 -
[1] - Quote
The verdict is in.
The much-trumpeted 'Great Idea' for turning Highsec corps into thriving mini-communities has run into deep trouble. Offering CEO's the opportunity to switch-off intra-corp aggression and thereby thwart the efforts of awoxers, CCP no doubt hoped to increase the enthusiasm of new players for the Highsec-Corp experience, and thereby fill their coffers to overflowing.
O dear.
In chillingly precise fashion, James 315 charts the downfall of 'The Great Idea', and charitably offers CCP some pointers as to where they may have miscalculated.
The original article can be accessed via the MinerBumping website, under the title which heads this post.
The Audio Version, for those inclined to hear it, can be accessed using the link below:
Awox Nerf Fails to Boost EVE Numbers
Peace and Prosperity.
www.minerbumping.com
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1112
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Posted - 2015.07.20 12:34:29 -
[2] - Quote
cant be bothered listening to his voice nor can i be bothered taking the click-bait, cant you just paste the article here? not really hard to copy and paste...
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2796
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Posted - 2015.07.20 12:45:55 -
[3] - Quote
It is terribly surprising that removing a type of gameplay from the game in order to accomplish the all important goal of making highsec safer for carebears has failed to improve the game.
I'm sure we just need to remove more of the interesting things and emergent situations that can happen in highsec. Perhaps when nothing happens in highsec other than AFK mining and solo mission running then the new players will be retained. Nothing helps retention like monotony and predictability. |
Aoife Fraoch
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
95
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Posted - 2015.07.20 12:58:03 -
[4] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:It is terribly surprising that removing a type of gameplay from the game in order to accomplish the all important goal of making highsec safer for carebears has failed to improve the game.
I'm sure we just need to remove more of the interesting things and emergent situations that can happen in highsec. Perhaps when nothing happens in highsec other than AFK mining and solo mission running then the new players will be retained. Nothing helps retention like monotony and predictability.
Because that business plan worked so well for all those games that were going to kill WoW... |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2799
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Posted - 2015.07.20 13:06:07 -
[5] - Quote
I'm sure that once we make it impossible to attack another player in highsec unless they have their PVP flag toggled to on EVE will be able to achieve a similar level of popularity and sustainability to SWTOR or ESO. |
Carrie-Anne Moss
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
329
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Posted - 2015.07.20 13:37:26 -
[6] - Quote
When this patch happened i asked "Why the double standard in corp search? You can 'exclude corps with friendly fore enabled' but not 'exclude corps from search with 'FF-Disabled'"
Dev actually responded and said that it wasnt intentional and wasnt ment to suggest one is better than other.
Then silence No update.
Seriously why cant there be a freaking checkbox in corp search"exclude corps with FF Disabled"???? |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2800
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Posted - 2015.07.20 13:47:25 -
[7] - Quote
I use that check box when looking for people to wardec. If someone has friemdly fire disabled they're pretty much going to be 100% unable to offer any resistance. |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1117
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Posted - 2015.07.20 13:53:38 -
[8] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:I use that check box when looking for people to wardec. If someone has friemdly fire disabled they're pretty much going to be 100% unable to offer any resistance.
how do you mean?
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Valkin Mordirc
1262
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Posted - 2015.07.20 14:03:08 -
[9] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:I use that check box when looking for people to wardec. If someone has friemdly fire disabled they're pretty much going to be 100% unable to offer any resistance. how do you mean?
That Highsec corps that do not allowed FF, will be inherently weaker than those who do, Variables aside. He would be generally correct.
Its not the fact that they don't allow it that makes them weak though. It's the mentality.
My opinion anyways
#DeleteTheWeak
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2800
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Posted - 2015.07.20 14:12:51 -
[10] - Quote
So I use the corp advertisement search function to look for people to declare war on. If a corp has Area of Operation: highsec and friendly fire set to illegal then it's a pretty clear indicator that they aren't going to be able to defend themselves.
Relying on a mechanical switch to make you safe, rather than using good recruitment practices and not presenting an attractive target expresses how little you trust your members and how little effort you're willing to put in to protecting them and also makes it apparent that you have things worth messing with.
It's basically a "I can't protect myself, if you shoot at me I won't shoot back." Flag. |
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Carrie-Anne Moss
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
329
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Posted - 2015.07.20 14:25:53 -
[11] - Quote
Quote:Quote: Shailagh wrote: It says in the corp search, you can filter out all the evil FF-ON corps. Will you be giving us the option to filter out the risk-adverse FF-OFF corps? And only search for FF Enabled corps?? If not, why the disparity?
This was simply done in the same way that the current 'Exclude Corporations in Alliances' checkbox works, and was not intentionally meant to only provide one option and not the other. I agree with you on this, it might be best to give both options, and Ill see if the team agrees and if its feasible for Tiamat. CCP Lebowski | EVE Quality Assurance | Team Five-0
And for over half a year no reply. Guess it wasnt feasible for Tiamat release or ever since lol |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1117
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Posted - 2015.07.20 14:28:44 -
[12] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:So I use the corp advertisement search function to look for people to declare war on. If a corp has Area of Operation: highsec and friendly fire set to illegal then it's a pretty clear indicator that they aren't going to be able to defend themselves.
Relying on a mechanical switch to make you safe, rather than using good recruitment practices and not presenting an attractive target expresses how little you trust your members and how little effort you're willing to put in to protecting them and also makes it apparent that you have things worth messing with.
It's basically a "I can't protect myself, if you shoot at me I won't shoot back." Flag.
Edit: like Valkin said, it indicates a mentality. The type of people who are unwilling to lift a finger in defense of themselves or their corpmates.
thanks for clearing that up, i was just curious, my last corp had friendly fire set to no but they in no way would refuse a fight, thats why i wondered, im not actually sure why they had it set especially with the reputation they have
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1233
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Posted - 2015.07.20 15:28:30 -
[13] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:It is terribly surprising that removing a type of gameplay from the game in order to accomplish the all important goal of making highsec safer for carebears has failed to improve the game.
I'm sure we just need to remove more of the interesting things and emergent situations that can happen in highsec. Perhaps when nothing happens in highsec other than AFK mining and solo mission running then the new players will be retained. Nothing helps retention like monotony and predictability.
I thought this was sarcasm until I saw you kb. Now I'm not sure.
Are you really that awesome or really that risk averse? 1 year of leet HS pvp w/out a loss. Amazing.
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2804
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Posted - 2015.07.20 15:33:15 -
[14] - Quote
Lowsec pirate groups absolutely will refuse a potential fight with a highsec pvp group. Aside from the fact that most lowsec pirate folks can't even enter highsec, the ones that do generally view it as "non-pvp space" and are usually only in highsec to buy stuff or maybe do some carebearing and subsequently harbor a significant aversion to fighting there.
Generally speaking though, you don't declare war on lowsec corps. If you wanted to shoot people who are in lowsec you'd be in lowsec, not 8n highsec declaring wars. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1233
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Posted - 2015.07.20 15:36:28 -
[15] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:So I use the corp advertisement search function to look for people to declare war on. If a corp has Area of Operation: highsec and friendly fire set to illegal then it's a pretty clear indicator that they aren't going to be able to defend themselves.
Relying on a mechanical switch to make you safe, rather than using good recruitment practices and not presenting an attractive target expresses how little you trust your members and how little effort you're willing to put in to protecting them and also makes it apparent that you have things worth messing with.
It's basically a "I can't protect myself, if you shoot at me I won't shoot back." Flag.
Edit: like Valkin said, it indicates a mentality. The type of people who are unwilling to lift a finger in defense of themselves or their corpmates.
I'm somewhat astonished you pretty much came right out and said you specifically target the defensless when you war dec. On one hand I admire your honesty, on the other I just don't understand how you do it.
You're that teenager that can play tic tac toe against 5 year olds and feel good about winning every day for what... several years??
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2804
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Posted - 2015.07.20 16:07:25 -
[16] - Quote
I'm an adult man in his mid twenties playing EVE online with and against other adults of similar age, actually.
I'm really not sure why you're so upset that I win at highsec PVP a lot. If it makes you that butthurt that i haven't lost a ship for a while you're welcome to come and try blowing me up, I live in Nourvukaiken. I somehow doubt you're up to that though. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1233
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Posted - 2015.07.20 16:49:47 -
[17] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:I'm an adult man in his mid twenties playing EVE online with and against other adults of similar age, actually.
With regards to who you declare war on there are two general approaches you can go with. You can target people who look like they'll try and shoot back and potentially there may be an interesting fight, and you can target people who will run around like headless chickens and die in mission ships and mining barges. Both are fine, but the later is much more common.
I'm really not sure why you're so upset that I win at highsec PVP a lot. If it makes you that butthurt that i haven't lost a ship for a while you're welcome to come and try blowing me up, I live in Nourvukaiken. I somehow doubt you're up to that though.
I'll do a 1v1 thunderdome with you. You pick the ship class and any rules you feel you need. Then we'll work out a time and do it.
My only rule is we fleet up so there are no boosting descrepancies. Just 2 folks in fleet - me and you. |
Valkin Mordirc
1264
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:00:38 -
[18] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:I'm an adult man in his mid twenties playing EVE online with and against other adults of similar age, actually.
With regards to who you declare war on there are two general approaches you can go with. You can target people who look like they'll try and shoot back and potentially there may be an interesting fight, and you can target people who will run around like headless chickens and die in mission ships and mining barges. Both are fine, but the later is much more common.
I'm really not sure why you're so upset that I win at highsec PVP a lot. If it makes you that butthurt that i haven't lost a ship for a while you're welcome to come and try blowing me up, I live in Nourvukaiken. I somehow doubt you're up to that though. I'll do a 1v1 thunderdome with you. You pick the ship class and any rules you feel you need. Then we'll work out a time and do it. My only rule is we fleet up so there are no boosting descrepancies. Just 2 folks in fleet - me and you.
I think Vimsy would need Yuller there to be eh.
Moral support.
Wouldn't really feel like BAW without him thrown every insult under the sun. XD
#DeleteTheWeak
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2806
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:25:38 -
[19] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:I'll do a 1v1 thunderdome with you. You pick the ship class and any rules you feel you need. Then we'll work out a time and do it.
My only rule is we fleet up so there are no boosting descrepancies. Just 2 folks in fleet - me and you. Considering that you are the one who is upset with me for not dying I would agree to this why?
And you're stupid for proposing it, you realize I'd cheat, right? |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10872
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:29:31 -
[20] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:So I use the corp advertisement search function to look for people to declare war on. If a corp has Area of Operation: highsec and friendly fire set to illegal then it's a pretty clear indicator that they aren't going to be able to defend themselves.
Relying on a mechanical switch to make you safe, rather than using good recruitment practices and not presenting an attractive target expresses how little you trust your members and how little effort you're willing to put in to protecting them and also makes it apparent that you have things worth messing with.
It's basically a "I can't protect myself, if you shoot at me I won't shoot back." Flag.
Edit: like Valkin said, it indicates a mentality. The type of people who are unwilling to lift a finger in defense of themselves or their corpmates. I'm somewhat astonished you pretty much came right out and said you specifically target the defensless when you war dec. On one hand I admire your honesty, on the other I just don't understand how you do it. You're that teenager that can play tic tac toe against 5 year olds and feel good about winning every day for what... several years?? "LoL"wars to keep everyone entertain when you aren't actively hunting contacted targets/targets are hiding are pretty common, all the high sec mercenary have them and they are just as vimsy described essentially just punching bags.
Sometimes something magical happens though and they form up, fight back and get a taste for it, "Eve Refinery" was one of ours and afterwards they found they quite liked it, they're now with brave.
Sometimes only one or two will stand and fight , these guys can often actually take to the work and make good recruits.
Its not all clubbing baby seals, it's introducing others (at the business end of a blaster) to PvP.
=]|[=
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1233
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:33:25 -
[21] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:Serendipity Lost wrote:I'll do a 1v1 thunderdome with you. You pick the ship class and any rules you feel you need. Then we'll work out a time and do it.
My only rule is we fleet up so there are no boosting descrepancies. Just 2 folks in fleet - me and you. Considering that you are the who is upset with me for not dying I would agree to this why? And you're stupid for proposing it, you realize I'd cheat, right?
I'm neither upset nor stupid.
Are you about to Holysheet1 on me? Is that what I'm feeling here?
Poop just got real Vimsy... what are you going to do? |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2807
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:35:20 -
[22] - Quote
Tbh I love me a good seal clubbing session. Also no, I'm not going to sit in Amarr shaking my fist and yelling like a lunatic in barely comprehensible English , I'm going to reinforce some POCOs and later kill some P I R A T. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1233
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Posted - 2015.07.20 17:40:21 -
[23] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:Tbh I love me a good seal clubbing session. Also no, I'm not going to sit in Amarr shaking my fist and yelling like a lunatic in barely comprehensible English , I'm going to reinforce some POCOs and later kill some P I R A T.
Are you accepting my thunderdome challenge or not? |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
983
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Posted - 2015.07.20 18:10:08 -
[24] - Quote
I don't think that AWOXing is the only impediment to developing thriving corps in hisec., therefore it is not a surprise to me at least that it had zilch effect, therefore to triumphantly make such a post is rather amusing.
In terms of the dreaded tick box CCP ended up being too simplistic, now if they put a friendly fire tick box that you can apply in role management that would make it more useful for those that actually have a brain, why do it properly when you can make it useless, such is life...
Ella's Snack bar. With all the data supplied on API/CREST the game should be renamed to Jabber Online, look something to kill, ping everyone!!!!
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Renegade Heart
Carebear Miners R Us
503
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Posted - 2015.07.20 18:14:49 -
[25] - Quote
I think Vimsy is the kind of PvP'er who cares about his killboard that much that he will only engage when victory is 99.99999% assured. I'm not knocking it if that's what he wants out of the game. Each to their own.
Also on topic, I awoxed some dude in an Orca once, and he told me that it was the most exciting thing that had happened to him in 3 years of EvE. |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2809
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Posted - 2015.07.20 19:12:29 -
[26] - Quote
Renegade Heart wrote:I think Vimsy is the kind of PvP'er who cares about his killboard that much that he will only engage when victory is 99.99999% assured. I'm not knocking it if that's what he wants out of the game. Each to their own. It's more a case of always doing whatever is necessary to assure that you win, regardless of what the stakes are. As a general principle I don't shoot at other people unless my intent is to explode their spaceship by any means I have available.
That's why I declined to participate in the C&P thunderdome. I'd cheat, every single time without fail and that wouldn't be fair on people who're actually interested in participating properly. So no, I'm no going to do honorable space battle with anyone, because you'd be upset when 10 neutral guardians landed. If you would like to see me explode you'll have to arrange for it to happen on your own (protip: I am often suspect flagged 50km off a certain stargate). |
Pur
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2015.07.20 19:51:08 -
[27] - Quote
I'd like a single player version of EVE.
One system, one station, four agents (one at each level to allow for progression), innumerable belts, one permanent ice field and a pre-populated NPC market selling every item imaginable at knock-down prices. I'd also like around 100 bots in system for me to socialize with.
Oh and I want a continuously re-spawning 4/10 which always drops the best loot.
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
2810
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Posted - 2015.07.20 20:13:50 -
[28] - Quote
Pur wrote:I'd like a single player version of EVE.
One system, one station, four agents (one at each level to allow for progression), innumerable belts, one permanent ice field and a pre-populated NPC market selling every item imaginable at knock-down prices. I'd also like around 100 bots in system for me to socialize with.
Oh and I want a continuously re-spawning 4/10 which always drops the best loot.
http://www.egosoft.com/games/x3ap/info_en.php
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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium. CODE.
13742
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Posted - 2015.07.20 21:57:49 -
[29] - Quote
It's like I always said.
If people were supposedly not recruiting newbies because of awoxing, then how was any awoxing happening to complain about? Meanwhile, I was knocking off fifteen corps a month at my prime, and getting into even more that weren't worth it, so clearly people were recruiting.
This was a false flag, to solve a non-problem.
Turns out, people join this game for the conflict that is the game's main selling point, not to chew on rocks in silence until they quit.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
Best Meltdown Ever.
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Tibo Paralian
Pyre Falcon Defence and Security Multicultural F1 Brigade
52
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Posted - 2015.07.20 23:48:43 -
[30] - Quote
When did CCP ever said the changes were to increase new player retention? |
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