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davet517
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
146
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Posted - 2015.08.01 23:15:34 -
[1] - Quote
Simple idea. Allow the existing moon minerals to deplete. Replace moon mining with rare mining anomalies that have a small chance of spawning each time a regular mining anomaly is depleted. These can only be mined with the new drilling platform. Make the radius of the spawn such that it's only feasible to anchor one or a small number of platforms to do the mining. The composition of the spawn should include all material types in proportions that closely mirror what is required for T2 production.
These should be big. It should take weeks to deplete them with the number of drilling platforms that are practical to anchor within range of them. If one spawns in your sov space, it's the kind of thing that you'd want to try to keep secret from your neighbors, and anyone else who might try to swoop in and mine it for themselves.
Making it a rare spawn means that the more you mine in your space, the more chances you have to get one. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3661
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Posted - 2015.08.02 00:01:35 -
[2] - Quote
How much do you want T2 ships to cost then?
Got some BPOs you want to make more money off of or something? I mean, why else would you want to spike the price like that? |
davet517
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
149
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Posted - 2015.08.02 00:34:05 -
[3] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:How much do you want T2 ships to cost then?
Got some BPOs you want to make more money off of or something? I mean, why else would you want to spike the price like that?
This wouldn't affect price. It's not about how much spawns, that is something that CCP could control. It's about where it spawns, and changing it from a static resource to a dynamic resource, randomly distributed based on activity.
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3661
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Posted - 2015.08.02 00:38:57 -
[4] - Quote
davet517 wrote:Danika Princip wrote:How much do you want T2 ships to cost then?
Got some BPOs you want to make more money off of or something? I mean, why else would you want to spike the price like that? This wouldn't affect price. It's not about how much spawns. That is something that CCP could control. It's about where it spawns, and changing it from a static resource to a dynamic resource, randomly distributed based on activity.
Which IS going to affect supply. massively.
You go from knowing exactly how much will be made in a given time and place, to having no idea whatsoever. How does that not affect supply? |
davet517
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
149
|
Posted - 2015.08.02 00:44:12 -
[5] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:[quote=davet517]
Which IS going to affect supply. massively.
You go from knowing exactly how much will be made in a given time and place, to having no idea whatsoever. How does that not affect supply?
Well, mostly because of :math:. It's not like you'd have "no idea whatsoever" where it's going to spawn. It's going to have a small chance of spawning in upgraded space where people are mining. CCP could easily adjust the spawn rate if they start to see a glut or scarcity.
What's your concern, exactly, that people who are actively mining in their space are going to decline an enormous windfall if it falls into their lap? |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
407
|
Posted - 2015.08.02 01:42:18 -
[6] - Quote
Allow me to side with Danika here and say no to this lousy idea. More player hours to scan anomalies. More assets in space to mine and transport when they are found. Less stable supply and one that is more subject to destruction in transport. And these are just a few of the problems I see with your idea. An yet you really believe this would have no affect on supply and therefore prices? Whatever you are taking, eating, smoking or drinking I want some of it please my world could use a little rose colored glasses right now.
So there is not doubt where I stand on this idea NO thank you. |
davet517
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
149
|
Posted - 2015.08.02 01:59:48 -
[7] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:Allow me to side with Danika here and say no to this lousy idea. More player hours to scan anomalies. More assets in space to mine and transport when they are found. Less stable supply and one that is more subject to destruction in transport. And these are just a few of the problems I see with your idea. An yet you really believe this would have no affect on supply and therefore prices? Whatever you are taking, eating, smoking or drinking I want some of it please my world could use a little rose colored glasses right now.
So there is not doubt where I stand on this idea NO thank you.
Maybe you should have taken a little time to think that through before posting.
It's t rivial to scan down a mining anom, if you don't know how they work. The hauling involved would be no different from what it is today, you'd just be hauling from a drilling platform at an anom instead of from a moon miner at a POS. The risk of destruction in transport might change some given that they wouldn't be quite as monopolized by major powers as they are today, but that could easily be compensated for through the spawn rate.
The only thing that changes is where they spawn, and why. They would remain a major conflict driver, but they would stop being a static, inexhaustible resource that is easy for a major power to monopolize. As these resources shift around, it'd provide dynamic opportunities for shifting conflicts to develop over them, and it would reward active use of space.
Do you think you can discuss an idea without resorting to childish insults? If not, it's cool. I can ignore them. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Get Off My Lawn
1459
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Posted - 2015.08.02 03:05:10 -
[8] - Quote
Sounds like a better option than we have now. I will laugh, however, when Providence and Imperium control all T2 production.
#neverstopmining
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here?
I'm stubborn.
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FT Diomedes
The Graduates Get Off My Lawn
1459
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Posted - 2015.08.02 03:37:10 -
[9] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:Allow me to side with Danika here and say no to this lousy idea. More player hours to scan anomalies. More assets in space to mine and transport when they are found. Less stable supply and one that is more subject to destruction in transport. And these are just a few of the problems I see with your idea. An yet you really believe this would have no affect on supply and therefore prices? Whatever you are taking, eating, smoking or drinking I want some of it please my world could use a little rose colored glasses right now.
So there is not doubt where I stand on this idea NO thank you.
You do not have to scan anomalies. If you do not know this, you really should not be commenting.
More assets in space to mine and transport these materials is a GOOD thing. That's more opportunity for interdiction operations. That's more opportunity for others to have fun and profit raiding these things.
And making it so that they spawn more often in more densely populated areas (areas where there is higher use), is problematic, but if you want to earn "your fair share" you just have to use some other space.
It really undercuts the "own a bunch of moons, but no space" type empires, which I think is a good thing. Although as far as I can tell, the OP probably belongs to one of the few groups who still fall into this category.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here?
I'm stubborn.
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davet517
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
150
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Posted - 2015.08.02 04:05:01 -
[10] - Quote
FT Diomedes wrote:
It really undercuts the "own a bunch of moons, but no space" type empires, which I think is a good thing. Although as far as I can tell, the OP probably belongs to one of the few groups who still fall into this category.
This is true. While my alliance could probably take space if we chose to, it's not how we choose to play. I'm not proposing this because I think it'd benefit us. I think it'd be good for the game, and further the goal of providing incentives to use space that you claim.
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Amarisen Gream
Divine Demise
95
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Posted - 2015.08.02 07:22:15 -
[11] - Quote
What I could see is this
The mining platforms could be upgraded where they spawn these anomalies. the different sizes would spawn coresponding anomalies by size.
The other option is to making PI and Moongoo purely extraction based. Allow the improvement and upgrading of said items in stations/new structure that relates to it. Both systems need a major rework which could go any of a billion ways. After proposing a few ideas in it, I now feel that pure and simple extraction of goods from the material source is best. Leave development/refining to structures in space.
This would allow say an SOV holder to have a mineral Drilling Platform and one for Moongoo and one for PI, or the player could have his own PI platform
xoxo
Amarisen Gream
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Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
360
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Posted - 2015.08.02 08:55:54 -
[12] - Quote
So basicly, you want another isk faucet in the game? |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Get Off My Lawn
1460
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Posted - 2015.08.02 10:42:54 -
[13] - Quote
Celthric Kanerian wrote:So basicly, you want another isk faucet in the game?
This is not an ISK faucet. It does not add ISK into the game.
Additionally, the OP's idea does not add any new materials to the game. It simply changes the way that moon materials enter the game. Rather than having them enter through static moons, they enter the game through dynamic anomalies.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here?
I'm stubborn.
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Lugburz
SUPER GOOSE SQUAD Sons of Seraphinus
6
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Posted - 2015.08.02 11:33:52 -
[14] - Quote
Moons should be kept as is but the materials and quantities should change, a bit like pi does? Adding comets or some other sort of 'space junk' to the game with other specialised ships/modules to mine them could add more to the game rather than diminish it but no, i wouldnt say changing moon mining completely would be a good idea.. |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
408
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Posted - 2015.08.02 14:42:44 -
[15] - Quote
FT Diomedes wrote:You do not have to scan anomalies. If you do not know this, you really should not be commenting.
More assets in space to mine and transport these materials is a GOOD thing. That's more opportunity for interdiction operations. That's more opportunity for others to have fun and profit raiding these things.
And making it so that they spawn more often in more densely populated areas (areas where there is higher use), is problematic, but if you want to earn "your fair share" you just have to use some other space.
It really undercuts the "own a bunch of moons, but no space" type empires, which I think is a good thing. Although as far as I can tell, the OP probably belongs to one of the few groups who still fall into this category. You do have to scan for anomalies, while they show up on your screen many of them require scanning to lock their position so they can be warped to, at least they do in high and low sec.
But setting that aside if these mining anomalies are static then the OP idea changes nothing, all it does is move resources from fixed position moons to fixed position anomalies. To use you analogy we have this, instead of securing moons instead of space, they would be securing anomalies instead of space. I see no real difference outside of the additional assets and player time needed to hold these and that leads us right back to it will cost more ISK to buy anything and everything that uses these T2 resources.
I am fully aware that more assets in space is a good thing from one point of view. However you missed the point, those additional assets in space and the inevitable loses that will come from it add to the EXPENSE of procuring these T2 resources and that will lead to an increase in costs associated with all items that use thoseT2 resources. Tough you say that is how it should be, and we will have to agree to disagree on that. Higher costs for T2 items just widens the gap between new players and veterans even further than it is now and all by itself that would be a good reason not to go with the OP idea. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Get Off My Lawn
1473
|
Posted - 2015.08.03 04:14:29 -
[16] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:FT Diomedes wrote:You do not have to scan anomalies. If you do not know this, you really should not be commenting.
More assets in space to mine and transport these materials is a GOOD thing. That's more opportunity for interdiction operations. That's more opportunity for others to have fun and profit raiding these things.
And making it so that they spawn more often in more densely populated areas (areas where there is higher use), is problematic, but if you want to earn "your fair share" you just have to use some other space.
It really undercuts the "own a bunch of moons, but no space" type empires, which I think is a good thing. Although as far as I can tell, the OP probably belongs to one of the few groups who still fall into this category. You do have to scan for anomalies, while they show up on your screen many of them require scanning to lock their position so they can be warped to, at least they do in high and low sec. But setting that aside if these mining anomalies are static then the OP idea changes nothing, all it does is move resources from fixed position moons to fixed position anomalies. To use you analogy we have this, instead of securing moons instead of space, they would be securing anomalies instead of space. I see no real difference outside of the additional assets and player time needed to hold these and that leads us right back to it will cost more ISK to buy anything and everything that uses these T2 resources. I am fully aware that more assets in space is a good thing from one point of view. However you missed the point, those additional assets in space and the inevitable loses that will come from it add to the EXPENSE of procuring these T2 resources and that will lead to an increase in costs associated with all items that use thoseT2 resources. Tough you say that is how it should be, and we will have to agree to disagree on that. Higher costs for T2 items just widens the gap between new players and veterans even further than it is now and all by itself that would be a good reason not to go with the OP idea.
You are confusing cosmic anomalies and cosmic signatures. Cosmic anomalies do not require scanning. Cosmic signatures do require scanning.
The POS system is going away anyway. So, moving structures from moons to other locations is kind of a moot point.
More stuff blowing up is good for the economy. If T2 prices go up, that creates more incentive for more groups to get into it. If any low sec or 0.0 space can get access to T2 materials, that wealth being generated can be more evenly distributed.
And please, take your "think of the newbies" argument and flush it. I'm betting with this change that T2 ships and modules would go up by no more than 5-10% max. The barrier to newbies is the skills to fly T2 ships, not the ISK. By the time they have the skills, they'll have the ISK.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here?
I'm stubborn.
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
410
|
Posted - 2015.08.03 13:44:17 -
[17] - Quote
And please, take your "think of the newbies" argument and flush it. I'm betting with this change that T2 ships and modules would go up by no more than 5-10% max. The barrier to newbies is the skills to fly T2 ships, not the ISK. By the time they have the skills, they'll have the ISK.[/quote] Then you play in a different EvE than I do, because in my EvE many new players can easily acquire skills for a T2 ship before they can the ISK required to buyu and properly fit one. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1287
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Posted - 2015.08.03 13:57:30 -
[18] - Quote
You guys don't get it. The ONLY way moon goo will ever work in eve is if 2 major business buddies control it all w/out needing to hold sov to moon mine. If this passive apex fleet protected system were to change.... it would end eve.
Can't you guys understand that?
It's just too important of a resource to be handled by the populace. Markets would crash, prices would spike, catdogs would run wild in stations. If it's not controlled by 8 guys it just won't work right. It needs to be conrolled by only a few so that profits are utilized properly.
You folks wanting to change moon goo from the passive cash cow that it is are just too dumb to understand the end game of eve. CCP needs to keep listening to that small group of guys. 90% of eve will unsub if they aren't ruled by this small group. When they say 'everyone will quit' they mean it. I mean... who wants to log into a game where they have truely free choices on how to direct their playtime? All players need the structure provided by these overlords.
TL/DR: The great isk printers must be maintained by those who understand how to manage great piles of isk and it has to be easy to maintain or .... or.... well bad things will happen. Free choice is too unpredictable.... structure and all. |
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