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Mabego Tetrimon
Spiritus Draconis Spaceship Bebop
26
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:15:56 -
[1] - Quote
As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
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Aeon Amadii
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
35
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:33:51 -
[2] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
.... why?
(This character is the Eve version of Aeon Amadi since there is no cross-forum support)
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Nauplius
Hoi Andrapodistai
476
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:40:15 -
[3] - Quote
As a long time supporter of total war, I support this message, knowing that total war will mean the defeat and enslavement of both the Federation and Republic.
The Empire outnumbers the Republic 4:1 and the Federation 2:1 and outnumbers the combined force 4:3. That doesn't include Khanid, who would be on the Empire's side in most realistic war scenarios. Amen. Amarr Victor. |
Skyweir Kinnison
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:54:42 -
[4] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
The Empire doesn't look very crumbly to me.
The Federation is not at war with the Amarr Empire. We have some disagreements on policy, that is all. Whereas Nauplius' mathematics are somewhat flawed, there is little doubt that an all out war between us would result in a stalemate and unbearable loss of life.
Anyway, the Federal budget is due in the Senate soon, and our elected officials will be too busy lining up at the pork barrel to get around to passing a resolution for war.
Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country.
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Utari Onzo
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
607
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Posted - 2015.08.16 12:16:36 -
[5] - Quote
I'm rather glad a more sensible mind from the Federation replied here. The Empire is doing fine defending itself against the Drifters and enjoys a large amount of support from loyalist Capsuleers.
As the former Chair of the PPC I'd rather like us all to peacefully co-exist and learn the message of God together, but if in a moment of haste and pure stupidity the Federation and the Republic actually started all out war, well...
My guns are primed and crystals loaded.
"Face the enemy as a solid wall
For faith is your armor
And through it, the enemy will find no breach
Wrap your arms around the enemy
For faith is your fire
And with it, burn away his evil"
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Jandice Ymladris
Aurora Arcology
1461
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Posted - 2015.08.16 14:21:17 -
[6] - Quote
I feel your proposition is an unwise decision and not only because the Amarr navy is such a powerful force. Recently, people reported Drifters skirmishing with Gallente Gate patrols. Seems they took a shining for the Gallente for reasons not yet known. Keep in mind, I'm still collecting data on it, haven't got confirmation that it happens at other places or that it is restricted to the Gallente.
In short: Drifters & Gallente Gate patrols trade shots but then stand down, reason for this behaviour is unknown. I reported on this disturbing behaviour in my latest article: Amarr Navy repels third Drifter Assault
If anyone sees this behaviour, I'm very interested in what you have to say. Providing images of these aggressive exchanges would be greatly appreciated.
Amarr Navy repels third Drifter assault
The 13th Alliance tournament has kicked off!
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Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
1326
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Posted - 2015.08.16 14:56:42 -
[7] - Quote
For what... ? 100 losses ? More ?
That is not even a dent in any respectable navy in the cluster...
Utari Onzo wrote:I'm rather glad a more sensible mind from the Federation replied here. The Empire is doing fine defending itself against the Drifters and enjoys a large amount of support from loyalist Capsuleers.
As the former Chair of the PPC I'd rather like us all to peacefully co-exist and learn the message of God together, but if in a moment of haste and pure stupidity the Federation and the Republic actually started all out war, well...
My guns are primed and crystals loaded.
I am really sorry to say this sir, but... This message does not really look like an exact call for peace to my eyes... |
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
5630
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Posted - 2015.08.16 15:08:16 -
[8] - Quote
Yes! That's a great idea! Let's embroil the Federation in another war with a foreign power while we're doing our level best to get out of one!
You're an idiot and you should feel ashamed.
Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.
Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.
Andreus Ixiris > ...
Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
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Slobodan Hawkwood
Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance
15
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Posted - 2015.08.16 15:31:02 -
[9] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
You can come to Amarr space as enemies if you wish...but you won't be going back. Same goes for those souless creatures known as Drifters.
"I will not hesitate when the test of Faith finds me, for only the strongest conviction will open the gates of paradise. My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
Paladin's Creed
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Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour Sani-Sabik
967
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Posted - 2015.08.16 15:44:13 -
[10] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:The time is NOW. Invade Amarr Space!
You first.
I'm sure the navy will be right behind...
Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
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Utari Onzo
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
614
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Posted - 2015.08.16 17:56:29 -
[11] - Quote
Lyn Farel wrote:Utari Onzo wrote:I'm rather glad a more sensible mind from the Federation replied here. The Empire is doing fine defending itself against the Drifters and enjoys a large amount of support from loyalist Capsuleers.
As the former Chair of the PPC I'd rather like us all to peacefully co-exist and learn the message of God together, but if in a moment of haste and pure stupidity the Federation and the Republic actually started all out war, well...
My guns are primed and crystals loaded. I am really sorry to say this sir, but... This message does not really look like an exact call for peace to my eyes...
Respectfully, it's saying we can have peace if they unclench their fist. But if they don't, And attack first, I'm ready to fight for my Empire. Are you?
"Face the enemy as a solid wall
For faith is your armor
And through it, the enemy will find no breach
Wrap your arms around the enemy
For faith is your fire
And with it, burn away his evil"
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Simon Louvaki
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
681
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Posted - 2015.08.16 18:46:18 -
[12] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
Have you been to Mekhios lately?
-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt;
Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21
--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1024
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Posted - 2015.08.16 18:52:15 -
[13] - Quote
Utari Onzo wrote:Respectfully, it's saying we can have peace if they unclench their fist. But if they don't, And attack first, I'm ready to fight for my Empire. Are you?
Don't be silly. You're a capsuleer. Unless your corp pays off CONCORD, then you two can't fight one another to defend or attack Amarr, because CONCORD will immediately show up to kill whoever fires first. Or you declare it a duel and acknowledge that it's all a personal pissing match.
Face it, CONCORD keeps you from being at all consequential within the Empires' space. |
Utari Onzo
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
615
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Posted - 2015.08.16 19:01:14 -
[14] - Quote
Arrendis wrote:Utari Onzo wrote:Respectfully, it's saying we can have peace if they unclench their fist. But if they don't, And attack first, I'm ready to fight for my Empire. Are you? Don't be silly. You're a capsuleer. Unless your corp pays off CONCORD, then you two can't fight one another to defend or attack Amarr, because CONCORD will immediately show up to kill whoever fires first. Or you declare it a duel and acknowledge that it's all a personal pissing match. Face it, CONCORD keeps you from being at all consequential within the Empires' space.
Please I wasn't talking about the OP and his idiotic personal crusade. I was refering to if the Navies of the Federation and the Republic actually did attack Amarr space proper in an all out war I would fight to protect my home. If all out war occurs, CONCORD would have failed and all the gloves (and rules) would be off.
"Face the enemy as a solid wall
For faith is your armor
And through it, the enemy will find no breach
Wrap your arms around the enemy
For faith is your fire
And with it, burn away his evil"
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Davio Tsutola
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.08.16 19:09:05 -
[15] - Quote
I feel obliged to point that Minmatar Allies you have called upon have remained silent. It seems even they know that such actions would not go well for them. |
Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1024
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Posted - 2015.08.16 19:18:15 -
[16] - Quote
Utari Onzo wrote:If all out war occurs, CONCORD would have failed and all the gloves (and rules) would be off.
You'd think so, but I tend to believe CONCORD would insist that even in the middle of total warfare, they'd maintain the right to shoot capsuleers over any excuse they can invent. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if they use it as an excuse to attempt to expand their mandate and push to reduce the size of the Empires' navies. |
James Syagrius
Reclamation Technologies
1085
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Posted - 2015.08.16 19:22:25 -
[17] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
This is a confusing request.
Why would the tribal entity wish the aid of GÇ£cultural imperialistsGÇ¥?
I thought the reason for dismembering the Republic was to shed yourselves of our corrupting influence.
You will then forgive should your request fall upon deaf ears.
Those in the former republic have repaid our generosity with animosity and violence.
As a humble man of trade and as a Gallentean I see far move value in better relations with the Empire than with the tribal entity.
GÇ£Here also are the heralds of his praise."
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1027
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Posted - 2015.08.16 21:25:08 -
[18] - Quote
James Syagrius wrote:Those in the former republic have repaid our generosity with animosity and violence.
As a humble man of trade and as a Gallentean I see far move value in better relations with the Empire than with the tribal entity.
Yes yes, because joining in your recent war against the Caldari was truly an act of animosity.
Here, let me offer some, so you can properly compare and contrast:
How about you and all your drone-lover friends take your advice about how to form a society, and shove it up the nearest wormhole, along with your twisted automaton fetish. |
Mizhara Del'thul
T.R.I.A.D Ushra'Khan
384
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Posted - 2015.08.16 23:43:23 -
[19] - Quote
For all the greatness of the Tribes and our people, some of them do seem to be overly fond of routing reactor coolant straight to the pod. The Federation just got out of a war and stand their first real chance of peace in a long time. Why would they declare war on the Empire? They couldn't care less about our people there. |
The Leopardess
Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance
31
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Posted - 2015.08.17 00:18:12 -
[20] - Quote
You're wrong about not being at war. the war is currently managed by Concord to reduce baseliner causalities, but it could break out into a very different kind of war quite easily.
http://eve-files.com/dl/274856 |
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Skyweir Kinnison
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2015.08.17 07:33:24 -
[21] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:For all the greatness of the Tribes and our people, some of them do seem to be overly fond of routing reactor coolant straight to the pod. The Federation just got out of a war and stand their first real chance of peace in a long time. Why would they declare war on the Empire? They couldn't care less about our people there.
I think it is harsh to claim that we don't care about the enslaved Minmatar of Amarr. We abhor slavery. Many of our citizens are Matari themselves. No doubt you class them as something less than pure (though you might ask yourselves why they prefer to live in liberty with us, than their own state).
The Federation simply recognises that slavery will only end when the Empire accepts that abolition suits their own interest, and we use trade and diplomacy to help them come to that conclusion. War will solve nothing, and a war that weakens Gallente and strengthens Amarr will bring more slavery, less reformation, and probably a new invasion of Minmatar.
The Federation has provided significant resources to help the tribes achieve some semblance of an independent future. Despite petulant behaviour across the Republic and its militia, we continue to provide the guarantees that dissuade the Empire from folding you up like a cheap suit. I don't think we expect gratitude any longer, but fewer insults might be nice.
Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country.
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1035
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Posted - 2015.08.17 07:52:19 -
[22] - Quote
Skyweir Kinnison wrote: (though you might ask yourselves why they prefer to live in liberty with us, than their own state).
I like banana ice cream. Not everyone does. People make different choices for a large number of reasons and trying to play those choices off as somehow morally superior one way or the other is the most despicable, cowardly, craven little attempt at manipulating people's reactions that I can think of, drone-lover.
No. You don't care about the Minmatar slaves in the Empire. You might care about your precious ideals, your abstract principles, but don't even pretend you care about any of those people as people.
I would sooner trust an Amarr loyalist like Samira Kernher with their well-being than your entire misguided, anarchistic, smug, self-righteous Federation. Last I checked, she hasn't committed genocidal war crimes (she's certainly shot people over things, but genocide... nope) against people for the insufferable offense of wanting self-determination.
You know, that 'freedom' thing you're so keen on. It's all well and good until someone wants to be free of you, isn't it? |
Lord Kailethre
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
228
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Posted - 2015.08.17 08:01:42 -
[23] - Quote
This thread is hilarious and OP gave me a good laugh. Thanks.
But seriously you're an idiot. :) |
Skyweir Kinnison
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2015.08.17 09:02:56 -
[24] - Quote
Arrendis wrote:Skyweir Kinnison wrote: (though you might ask yourselves why they prefer to live in liberty with us, than their own state). I like banana ice cream. Not everyone does. People make different choices for a large number of reasons and trying to play those choices off as somehow morally superior one way or the other is the most despicable, cowardly, craven little attempt at manipulating people's reactions that I can think of, drone-lover. No. You don't care about the Minmatar slaves in the Empire. You might care about your precious ideals, your abstract principles, but don't even pretend you care about any of those people as people. I would sooner trust an Amarr loyalist like Samira Kernher with their well-being than your entire misguided, anarchistic, smug, self-righteous Federation. Last I checked, she hasn't committed genocidal war crimes (she's certainly shot people over things, but genocide... nope) against people for the insufferable offense of wanting self-determination. You know, that 'freedom' thing you're so keen on. It's all well and good until someone wants to be free of you, isn't it?
I appear to have touched a nerve.
The question is legitimate, I'm afraid, not a manipulation. It's not a claim for moral superiority - no doubt the majority like to be economically secure and have their families protected by laws and safeguards, rather than being in any fundamental way committed to the Constitution that ensures those rights. Nonetheless, Matari should consider the question seriously, just as your own choice to abandon your own people for a new order is a legitimate line of self-relflection. How are you going to protect your people and free and feed those enslaved if you don't have friends like us?
And by the by, what's wrong with loving drones? They are often gentle and sensitive lovers.
Of course I don't care about any of those people as people, I don't know them. Principles drive behaviours, and shape policies. There's a fair few within the Federation that would wihdraw all support for Minamatar, republic or otherwise, and let them sink or swim. As someone else wrote, there's far more for us to gain by being pragmatic and being allies with the Empire. Oh, but then there's those principles you have a problem with.
It's a rather false equivalence to compare Lieutenant Kernher's individual record on genocide to an entire civilisation. I'll agree with you that in that narrow comparison, she comes out ahead. Amarr, not so much. Personally, I think we made some serious misjudgements over the Caldari secession, but it wasn't handled well on either side. We each went off the deep-end of extremism.
Humanity has won its battle. Liberty now has a country.
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Mabego Tetrimon
Spiritus Draconis Spaceship Bebop
27
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Posted - 2015.08.17 11:24:06 -
[25] - Quote
Valerie Valate wrote:Mabego Tetrimon wrote:The time is NOW. Invade Amarr Space!
You first. I'm sure the navy will be right behind...
I am right at the front fighting the slavers and their Caldari Minions. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
1553
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Posted - 2015.08.17 11:50:40 -
[26] - Quote
Arrendis wrote:Skyweir Kinnison wrote: (though you might ask yourselves why they prefer to live in liberty with us, than their own state). I like banana ice cream. ... You know, that 'freedom' thing you're so keen on. It's all well and good until someone wants to be free of you, isn't it?
Try a scoop of coconut ice cream next to a scoop of banana ice-cream and maybe add a little sweet chili sauce...
As for freedom I prefer to be free of clothing and 'morally superior' inhibitions. Oddly the ice cream comes in handy then too... |
Akrasjel Lanate
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
1806
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Posted - 2015.08.17 12:46:08 -
[27] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:As the drifters causing heavy losses to the Amarr Empire NOW is the time for the Federation Navy and the Republic Fleet to seize the opportunity and attack the crumbling empire of slavers and free our people! The time is NOW.
Act Navies!
Invade Amarr Space!
Why would anone do that... this is a completely unreasonable proposition.
Akrasjel Lanate
Member of Black Thorne Corporation
Black Thorne Alliance
Citizen of Solitude
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Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
2427
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Posted - 2015.08.17 13:54:31 -
[28] - Quote
Your fundamental point in the above seems to be that principles guide behaviours for nations and individuals. Because of this, the statement you made earlier wasn't a manipulation, but was a statement of principle. I ... hmm. How best to reply to this. I apologize in advance.
First, your thesis that principles guide behaviours. This is flatly wrong. First order human behaviour is driven largely by emotional impulse. Principle influences behaviour only when ethics and principles are explicitly brought to mind immediately beforehand, within short term recall distance from the point of action. Even then, second order rationality typically intervenes to allow the emotional-impulse behaviour to dominate by creating a principled rationalization of the impulse action.
As an example, your text above was a manipulation attempt. By decomposition:
It begins with a dismissal of the opposing viewpoint ("I touched a nerve" implies that the opponent is speaking out of anger, so the statements can be ignored), then claims that it was not proposing moral superiority while denigrating the people who do not support those morals (the majority is implied to have a hypocritical or immoral, opportunistic position). It then implies that those who disagree do not seriously consider the ideals of the Federation instead of having their own stable beliefs coming to their conclusion, and then proposes that Ms Culome has abandoned her kin by choosing to not support the Republic - this latter point is quite clearly a manipulation of the 'guilt trip' variety. Suggesting that she hasn't seriously considered this, and then following with a suggestion that the Federation is required as an ally to save her kin is the conclusion of the first segment.
The second block clarifies that you don't care about people you don't know 'as people', which ... well, I won't analyse the ethical ramifications of this. It stands on its own. Following is your erroneous statement that principle drives behaviour - if anything, behaviour drives principle. The reality is much more complicated. This is followed by a threatening statement that the Federation will withdraw support for the Minmatar people, which nicely mirrors your statement leading this block. It's suggested that only principles bar this from happening, which acts to reinforce the suggestion that these principles are correct and should not be questioned.
I agree with the false equivalence statement in the concluding paragraph; that is in fact a false equivalence. It's interesting that you employ a false equivalence immediately thereafter in declaring that the Caldari reaction to attempted genocide was just as bad as the genocide attempt itself. This is unrelated to the suggestion that the Federal principles should be accepted, however, making it an odd way to conclude the statement.
Nowhere in the above were the Federal principles shown to have any internal support or inherent reason for being adopted; every point used was a manipulation. This is a little odd, given that the discussion itself is about principled behaviour, so these things should have been primed by recency effect. I might gently suggest that the author re-examine what statement he is trying to make, and why he's trying to make it.
Skyweir Kinnison wrote:And by the by, what's wrong with loving drones? They are often gentle and sensitive lovers.
P.S.: Drones don't feel things the way people do. If you care about your drones, help them accomplish their utility functions - not yours.
Ew. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
1557
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Posted - 2015.08.17 14:15:33 -
[29] - Quote
Scherezad wrote:...
P.S.: Drones don't feel things the way people do...
Depends on what appendages you equip them with
On a side note I got attacked by a bunch of drones wearing smart brown shoes....must have been brogue drones.... |
Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
2432
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Posted - 2015.08.17 14:27:55 -
[30] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Scherezad wrote:...
P.S.: Drones don't feel things the way people do... Depends on what appendages you equip them with
uh...
n-no..... |
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