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Blah Zamayid
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2015.08.21 17:57:01 -
[1] - Quote
Like really if anyone can tell me what the reason for someone purposefully bleeding into armour is with an ASB on something like a Sleipnir which has 5625 shields and with heat a set of high grade crystals and Strong Blue pill only boosts 2691 shields per shot of an ASB why are you waiting until armour to boost 1/3 shields would be perfectly sufficient in making sure you don't waste your charges as long as you don't have auto repeat on... Which you shouldn't have auto repeat on.
If it's some trick to do with the heat on the module pleas tell me but I'm just not seeing it, reason for the post is a youtube video where someone in a Sleipnir lets them self's bleed multiple times until he is into 10% hull and then gets them self's alpha'ed for no good reason, and they didn't have high grade crystals and were not using Strong Blue pill think they were using mid grade.
Anyway point is this has gotten ridiculous and people apply the guide line of letting damage bleed into your amour onto ships which it makes absolutely no sense to apply it to, I get it in ships like the Vaga where you can boost basically your hole shield's in one go, Pleas people think before you just rubber stamp something a good idea just because a lot of people are saying it. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22832
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Posted - 2015.08.21 17:58:30 -
[2] - Quote
Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
1445
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:00:18 -
[3] - Quote
bait tanking. because if they think they have a chance to kill you they will keep shooting rather than disengage when you keep your HP full/near full. That said dropping that low does seem a bit foolish as a decent alpha will kill you.
@ChainsawPlankto
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Blah Zamayid
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:03:23 -
[4] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:bait tanking. because if they think they have a chance to kill you they will keep shooting rather than disengage when you keep your HP full/near full. That said dropping that low does seem a bit foolish as a decent alpha will kill you.
No I have heard people in my corp... who I will not mention and will also not mention the corp... who think that you should always do that because it's inefficient to do otherwise and this was on a Golem and I was like that stupid your stupid go away.
I did actually mention in my youtube comment that baiting could be a valid reason for it tbh. |
Sonya Corvinus
Chickenhawk.
100
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:10:50 -
[5] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Not empty quoting, so take this:
http://i.imgur.com/Z7fzE8V.jpg |
Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra Gallente Federation
428
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:14:23 -
[6] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Think he's raging about bait tanking.... |
Paranoid Loyd
6746
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:20:37 -
[7] - Quote
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22833
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:20:49 -
[8] - Quote
Gillia Winddancer wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Think he's raging about bait tanking....
I figured it was something like "we totally had him, but then he repped and we got owned waaaaa", but he came off like a 5 year old who saw the most amazing thing hes ever seen in his life, and he just ran in to tell you all about it, but hes winded and for some reason cant keep the story on point and in the end forgot why he ran in the house in the first place so he runs back outside, then back in because he realized he had to pee but its too late at that point and he peed himself.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Blah Zamayid
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:21:37 -
[9] - Quote
Gillia Winddancer wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Think he's raging about bait tanking....
So I was raging against people like I mentioned in my previous post, as I have said I have heard from actually more than that one person that you should let your self bleed into amour because its inefficient to do otherwise on ships where it was not true, like plenty but it's not like anybody is going to stand up after realizing that they were being dumb and go yeah I thought that was the way it worked. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22833
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:23:35 -
[10] - Quote
Blah Zamayid wrote:Gillia Winddancer wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
Think he's raging about bait tanking.... So I was raging against people like I mentioned in my previous post, as I have said I have heard from actually more than that one person that you should let your self bleed into amour because its inefficient to do otherwise on ships where it was not true, like plenty but it's not like anybody is going to stand up after realizing that they were being dumb and go yeah I thought that was the way it worked.
So... I nailed it the first time with 'What?".
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Cancel Align NOW
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
560
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:23:49 -
[11] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Im sure that I speak for pretty much everyone here in General Discussion when I say.. What?
I think he is referring to asb bs I'm not sure why he is so angry unless he is a local dairy farmer who borrowed 2mil plus to upgrade his rotary shed when Fonterra was paying out $6.85 per kilo of milk solids, and is now staring into a black pit as Fonterra offer him $3.85 for the up coming year, while ASB say "she'll be right just borrow another mil to get you through this year". John Steinbeck would roll in his grave at how stupid humanity can be.
If I am correct the op should have postedin OOPE. |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
394
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pure theory crafting incoming to be separate from bait tanking. A reasonable FC will switch targets if they see a massive jump like that. If there is another viable target.
The reason they do that is to maximize what little regeneration you have.
No matter what, that armor is taking damage. Nothing will change that. So wait until getting armor bleed if not shield comp 5. Then hit the one boost to tap yourself back to max passive regen. If it takes a while to bleed all your armor, that little bit of extra recharge can mean you have taken an additional cycle or more.
Flaw is recharge drops off fast, so would need to find what point the recharge rate on the lowside matched what rate would be highside after cycle to keep yourself in peak passive. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11341
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:30:19 -
[13] - Quote
k bait tanking is a thing because you can always bet on greed and stupidity . that aside , whet the hell are you on about?
=]|[=
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Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
211
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:34:04 -
[14] - Quote
asb bs op plz nrf srsly
Maybe he talks about the moment when the charges ran out and they were being reloaded into the booster, dunno.... Once cycle and shields are back 100%; would explain the rage.
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
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Estella Osoka
Perkone Caldari State
698
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Posted - 2015.08.21 18:50:10 -
[15] - Quote
Translation of OP: People bleed into armor, not to bait tank, but because they believe it is more efficient in terms of not wasting charges. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11342
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:05:17 -
[16] - Quote
Estella Osoka wrote:Translation of OP: People bleed into armor, not to bait tank, but because they believe it is more efficient in terms of not wasting charges. thank you for your sacrifice in reading that hyper 16yold text messages thoroughly enough to understand it.
o7 to those braincells lost
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Carrie-Anne Moss
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
407
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:09:49 -
[17] - Quote
Maybe they dont have Tactical Shild Manipulation V? |
Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
465
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:12:26 -
[18] - Quote
HP is HP, regardless of if its in the armor, shield or hull. Letting armor bleed before repping isnt that absurd, especially with ASB tanks. As you want to use those charges as slowly as possible to have the maximum amount of time for reload. I bled some armor in a dual XLASB ferox just to bait the fight longer, and give plenty of time for reload. But mainly for bait tanking. Especially when you know dps on field cant break you.
Now, if someone says its more efficient to do it that way, id say no. Its all just psychology and letting your opponent make mistakes by making them assume your tank is breaking. Then they swoop in ontop of you, at which point, you can murder them.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role
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Kiandoshia
Applied Anarchy SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2347
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:17:11 -
[19] - Quote
Carrie-Anne Moss wrote:Maybe they dont have Tactical Shild Manipulation V?
Is that actually how it works?
I don't have that skill at 5 and I can't remember ever seeing damage bleed into armour at low shield on my own ships. |
Estella Osoka
Perkone Caldari State
699
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:46:50 -
[20] - Quote
Kiandoshia wrote:Carrie-Anne Moss wrote:Maybe they dont have Tactical Shild Manipulation V? Is that actually how it works? I don't have that skill at 5 and I can't remember ever seeing damage bleed into armour at low shield on my own ships.
TSM at 5 means there is 0 chance of damage to bleed into armor until it has gone through all of your shields. It works like this:
TSM 1 = at 20% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 2 = at 15% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 3 = at 10% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 4 = at 5% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 5 = damage does not bleed into armor until all shield is gone. |
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Kiandoshia
Applied Anarchy SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2347
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:55:06 -
[21] - Quote
Estella Osoka wrote:Kiandoshia wrote:Carrie-Anne Moss wrote:Maybe they dont have Tactical Shild Manipulation V? Is that actually how it works? I don't have that skill at 5 and I can't remember ever seeing damage bleed into armour at low shield on my own ships. TSM at 5 means there is 0 chance of damage to bleed into armor until it has gone through all of your shields. It works like this: TSM 1 = at 20% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 2 = at 15% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 3 = at 10% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 4 = at 5% shield left, damage can bleed into armor. TSM 5 = damage does not bleed into armor until all shield is gone.
How high is the chance of this happening? |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
39545
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Posted - 2015.08.21 19:58:55 -
[22] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:k bait tanking is a thing because you can always bet on greed and stupidity . that aside , whet the hell are you on about?
I think he's maybe talking about this Mr Hyde video and how terribad he must be for dying at the end instead of taking out the rest of the ships and surviving. Never mind the bait tanking that just kept them coming back to make it such an epic encounter to begin with:
http://youtu.be/DyFB03FMc7g
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22845
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Posted - 2015.08.21 20:48:04 -
[23] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:k bait tanking is a thing because you can always bet on greed and stupidity . that aside , whet the hell are you on about?
I think he's maybe talking about this Mr Hyde video and how terribad he must be for dying at the end instead of taking out the rest of the ships and surviving. Never mind the bait tanking that just kept them coming back to make it such an epic encounter to begin with: http://youtu.be/DyFB03FMc7g
Wait... so.. this whole thing with the ASBs.. didn't even happen to the OP himself.. just some knucklehead on youtube?!?!?! Then what the ever living tap dancing **** is the OP so uppity and ranting about?!!??! Is this just he equivalent of some guy flipping out on the world because some favorite professional athlete missed a shot and/or lost a game?!?!??! Wow.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
7024
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Posted - 2015.08.21 20:48:37 -
[24] - Quote
I'm still waiting for an comparable aux module for hull repair.
Hull tanking makes you a sexual tyrannosaurs like Jesse Ventura on chewing tobacco.
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
25721
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Posted - 2015.08.21 20:55:37 -
[25] - Quote
Kiandoshia wrote:How high is the chance of this happening? Small enough that you don't really have to care unless you're in a very drawn-out and evenly matched fight where you (somehow) manage to constantly be below the shield threshold.
There's no tangible benefit to training TSM to V GÇö in fact, it may actually make your tanking ability worse than if you leave it at IV (and even then, it's only for the T2 hardeners).
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Valkin Mordirc
1415
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Posted - 2015.08.21 21:15:54 -
[26] - Quote
Doesn't shield regen peak once lowers past a certain percentage? So boosting at the point would technically be the most optimal time to boost?
I remember hearing about it from somewhere but never really looked into it.
Or is that just a load of hot air?
#DeleteTheWeak
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11345
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Posted - 2015.08.21 21:40:40 -
[27] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Scipio Artelius wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:k bait tanking is a thing because you can always bet on greed and stupidity . that aside , whet the hell are you on about?
I think he's maybe talking about this Mr Hyde video and how terribad he must be for dying at the end instead of taking out the rest of the ships and surviving. Never mind the bait tanking that just kept them coming back to make it such an epic encounter to begin with: http://youtu.be/DyFB03FMc7g Wait... so.. this whole thing with the ASBs.. didn't even happen to the OP himself.. just some knucklehead on youtube?!?!?! Then what the ever living tap dancing **** is the OP so uppity and ranting about?!!??! Is this just he equivalent of some guy flipping out on the world because some favorite professional athlete missed a shot and/or lost a game?!?!??! Wow. Have you watched that vid ? Real time it's a 20(ish) mins of a guy eating local in its entirety solo and going down in a blaze of glory. I don't see where he got **** up from.
=]|[=
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22851
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Posted - 2015.08.21 21:52:19 -
[28] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:Wait... so.. this whole thing with the ASBs.. didn't even happen to the OP himself.. just some knucklehead on youtube?!?!?! Then what the ever living tap dancing **** is the OP so uppity and ranting about?!!??! Is this just he equivalent of some guy flipping out on the world because some favorite professional athlete missed a shot and/or lost a game?!?!??! Wow. Have you watched that vid ? Real time it's a 20(ish) mins of a guy eating local in its entirety solo and going down in a blaze of glory. I don't see where he got **** up from.
Im sorry, but if I had a fight like that, I would be calling my doctor because my erection would definitely last longer than 4 hours.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Hal Morsh
Delusions of Granduer Two Drink Minimum
380
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Posted - 2015.08.21 22:00:02 -
[29] - Quote
The title lead me to believe he was complaining about ancillary shield boosters being OP or something.
After reading I realized he's upset about people dying when they still have plenty of tank. So really he's just upset some people failed at bait tanking. He's probably a CEO or something.
Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
25722
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Posted - 2015.08.22 00:58:32 -
[30] - Quote
Valkin Mordirc wrote:Doesn't shield regen peak once lowers past a certain percentage? So boosting at the point would technically be the most optimal time to boost?
I remember hearing about it from somewhere but never really looked into it.
Or is that just a load of hot air? Yes. The formula (last I heard) was something along the lines of R=(4.8/TGéüGéÇGéÇ) +ù (1-SGéô/SGéüGéÇGéÇ) +ù GêÜ(2+ùSGéô/SGéüGéÇGéÇ-(SGéô/SGéüGéÇGéÇ)-¦), where R is the current regen, TGéüGéÇGéÇ is the total time to regen, SGéô is the current shield value, and SGéüGéÇGéÇ is max shields.
It peaks at 30% shield. Below that, it rapidly drops off to having next to no regen; above it, it also drops off, but not quite as sharply.
That's why having TSM IV is actually better than TSM V: because your current shield stays in a region where it gets some (admittedly very minor) additional regen that it doesn't get at 0%.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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