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Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2015.08.22 18:00:27 -
[1] - Quote
Will I be flagged a suspect or killed by Concord if i shoot someones MTU in a mission? I see all these shiny mission running Tengus and they seem easy to kill if you suck their capacitors with some ship and use drones. If I shoot their MTU would that be engagement with them? Seems like a fun way to play the game tbh. |
Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc. Low-Class
1330
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Posted - 2015.08.22 18:01:58 -
[2] - Quote
you will be a suspect, but concord wont take any notice of you.
They need to perform some kind of hostile action against you for you to shoot them without concord interference |
Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2015.08.22 18:05:38 -
[3] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:you will be a suspect, but concord wont take any notice of you.
They need to perform some kind of hostile action against you for you to shoot them without concord interference
so its like this can flipping i read about last night? just doing it differently?
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1437
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Posted - 2015.08.22 18:24:21 -
[4] - Quote
Fenris Mars wrote:Tsukino Stareine wrote:you will be a suspect, but concord wont take any notice of you.
They need to perform some kind of hostile action against you for you to shoot them without concord interference so its like this can flipping i read about last night? just doing it differently? Sort of. You go suspect and hope they decide to take a shot at you. You can't do anything until they shoot, but if you keep at it long enough someone will take the bait.
You need to find the balance of annoying or angering enough that they want to shoot yet appear non-threatening enough that they aren't too afraid and just warp away. |
Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
5
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:10:51 -
[5] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Fenris Mars wrote:Tsukino Stareine wrote:you will be a suspect, but concord wont take any notice of you.
They need to perform some kind of hostile action against you for you to shoot them without concord interference so its like this can flipping i read about last night? just doing it differently? Sort of. You go suspect and hope they decide to take a shot at you. You can't do anything until they shoot, but if you keep at it long enough someone will take the bait. You need to find the balance of annoying or angering enough that they want to shoot yet appear non-threatening enough that they aren't too afraid and just warp away.
so picking the right ship to use is very important it seems
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Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc. Low-Class
1330
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:15:52 -
[6] - Quote
yeah you need to have 3 things:
1. Enough DPS to kill target or neuting capability to shut down their tank enough so something like drones can slowly chew away at it. 2. Some way to stop incoming dps, either by mitigating it or repairing it 3. Not something super scary like a T3 cruiser or another battleship, you have to lull the other guy into the thought that he can kill you without any hassle.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11356
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:19:14 -
[7] - Quote
Mission flipping or more accurately "suspect baiting" is the endeavour to attain aggression (and thus the right to murder) from a I'll prepared foe.
Shooting mobile deploables is a fantastic way, it gives a suspect flag and if you can kill the damn thing before they scoope it you get a shiny killmail (yeaaaahy \o/ ).
The whole process is a lot like fishing, from experience I can tell you the likely rate of "bites" will be around 1 in 8 on a good day.
The trick to it is presenting yourself as a vulnerable scavenger/opportunist whilst actually haveing every advantage stacked in your favour.
It's fun if you're the patient sort and exemplary exercise for potential mercenaries as you need strong scanning skills (and get plenty of practice), you get a wide variety of targets to sparr with , You get the hebejebes out of your system as you will likely be fighting thing you have no business fighting (think frigate v battleship) You get some impressive killmails and a massive boost in confidence
Here is an article written by my old martini drinking CEO.
I remember reading this when I started ,long before joining this alliance and it works, I'll mail you some of my success if you're interested.
Edit : on this subject I will almost always make time to chat so if you see me online feel free to poke me or open a convo and I'll happily share what I can.
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Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1282
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:20:02 -
[8] - Quote
Checkout the videos of Jonny Pew.
I'm my own NPC alt.
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Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:40:32 -
[9] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Here is an article written by my old martini drinking CEO. I remember reading this when I started ,long before joining this alliance and it works, I'll mail you some of my success if you're interested. Edit : on this subject I will almost always make time to chat so if you see me online feel free to poke me or open a convo and I'll happily share what I can.
I was laughing at that article. "Convo the bear.. Perhaps you noticed a leak on his warp coils and needed to detonate his ship to ensure it didn't accidentally harm others. "
This is very funny
I'd appreciate some fits, thanks!
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Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:41:20 -
[10] - Quote
Tipa Riot wrote:Checkout the videos of Jonny Pew.
Nice videos! I see he likes to use a Stratios?
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Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc. Low-Class
1331
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:51:37 -
[11] - Quote
probably not for high sec baiting. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11357
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:54:10 -
[12] - Quote
Fenris Mars wrote: I'd appreciate some fits, thanks!
I'm on my phone at the moment but I'll post you some tomorrow when I get back to the pc, Till then you could Click the link in my Sig, go to losses, look at the ishkurs found there, I know it's a t2 ship you likely can't use but it's a good goal for flipping. We have an incurisis fit I'll dig out for you also, one of my alliance mates is a savage in that little hull, I'm pretty sure cara has some good shield fits fit for this also whenever she sees this thread.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11357
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Posted - 2015.08.22 19:55:25 -
[13] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:probably not for high sec baiting. Yeah he does, I'm shocked anyone will bite on it but apparently the bears just aren't afraid of it.
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Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
409
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Posted - 2015.08.22 21:13:30 -
[14] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Tsukino Stareine wrote:probably not for high sec baiting. Yeah he does, I'm shocked anyone will bite on it but apparently the bears just aren't afraid of it.
Is there new generation of fearless bears? |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11359
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Posted - 2015.08.22 21:25:06 -
[15] - Quote
Tiddle Jr wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Tsukino Stareine wrote:probably not for high sec baiting. Yeah he does, I'm shocked anyone will bite on it but apparently the bears just aren't afraid of it. Is there new generation of fearless bears? New generation of idiot I think
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Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc. Low-Class
1334
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Posted - 2015.08.22 22:14:46 -
[16] - Quote
[Nereus, thebait] Damage Control II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Reinforced Bulkheads II Reinforced Bulkheads II
10MN Afterburner II J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 'Umbra' White Noise ECM Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Transverse Bulkhead I Medium Transverse Bulkhead I Medium Transverse Bulkhead I
Hobgoblin II x3
2 spare mods in mid for ecm. Double TD vs turret ship, double ECM vs drone/missile. Won't do much against passive tanked ships though. |
Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2015.08.22 23:35:28 -
[17] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:[Nereus, thebait] Damage Control II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Reinforced Bulkheads II Reinforced Bulkheads II
10MN Afterburner II J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 'Umbra' White Noise ECM Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Script
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Transverse Bulkhead I Medium Transverse Bulkhead I Medium Transverse Bulkhead I
Hobgoblin II x3
2 spare mods in mid for ecm. Double TD vs turret ship, double ECM vs drone/missile. Won't do much against passive tanked ships though.
So you just show up in their mission, and act all noobish and take from their MTU?
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Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc. Low-Class
1335
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Posted - 2015.08.23 13:20:32 -
[18] - Quote
Just send drones on the MTU preferably some crappy T1 ones, even a mixture of types. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11360
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Posted - 2015.08.23 13:55:27 -
[19] - Quote
as promised, downgrade the modules as and when needed [Incursus, Omar Alharazaad's Incursus] Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Small Armor Repairer II Small Armor Repairer II
1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II
Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
456
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Posted - 2015.08.23 14:54:54 -
[20] - Quote
OK good information but they left out a few important items.
Watch out for the wolf in sheep's clothing, there are many who live to lure people like you into their trap so be wary and choose targets carefully a ship that can tank the missions AND is fit to kill you will be a formidable enemy making it a fight you will likely lose.
Pray that you do not find intelligent and seasoned mission runners they will simply laugh at your pathetic attempts to bait them into a fight, complete the mission while you watch and then fly away.
Watch your intended target carefully. Shooting everything in the pocket and then warping out is a common trick mission runners use. If we have full pocket agro it will switch to you the moment we warp out. A mission ship can easily tank full pocket agro can you?
And stay the hell away from structures. Over the years I have had fun with ninja salvagers and players that were trying to bait me into a fight by destroying the structures they were close to. In the process I have been lucky to kill a few this way and seriously damage many others.
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
3074
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Posted - 2015.08.23 19:16:18 -
[21] - Quote
Shoot abandoned MTUs too, sometimes they have an entire dead mission boat in them. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11361
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Posted - 2015.08.23 19:25:01 -
[22] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:Shoot abandoned MTUs too, sometimes they have an entire dead mission boat in them. We have gotten more than a couple of 100+ mill to a billion isk mtu's.
It's not common but it happens enough to warrent checking.
Better the Devil you know.
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Fenris Mars
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
8
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Posted - 2015.08.23 21:50:11 -
[23] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:Shoot abandoned MTUs too, sometimes they have an entire dead mission boat in them. We have gotten more than a couple of 100+ mill to a billion isk mtu's. It's not common but it happens enough to warrent checking.
Wow you can make that much money finding stuff?
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11366
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Posted - 2015.08.23 23:41:55 -
[24] - Quote
Fenris Mars wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:Shoot abandoned MTUs too, sometimes they have an entire dead mission boat in them. We have gotten more than a couple of 100+ mill to a billion isk mtu's. It's not common but it happens enough to warrent checking. Wow you can make that much money finding stuff? Not reliably no.
You can get lucky enough though, if you find abandoned geckos or a mtu that's eaten a mission boat it could set you up for a while but I wouldn't expect it.
Better the Devil you know.
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Demerius Xenocratus
Rapid Withdrawal
595
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Posted - 2015.08.24 03:35:25 -
[25] - Quote
Taking a cheap frigate and looting shiny mods after or during a big null/lowsec battle is a thing. Most of the combatants will be too concerned with following primaries and shooting each other to bother you. You just have to know when/where a fight is going down. |
Fenris Mars
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
8
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Posted - 2015.08.24 05:30:09 -
[26] - Quote
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:Taking a cheap frigate and looting shiny mods after or during a big null/lowsec battle is a thing. Most of the combatants will be too concerned with following primaries and shooting each other to bother you. You just have to know when/where a fight is going down.
Like all the killing going on in Providence right now? There must be so much loot
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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
3078
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Posted - 2015.08.24 14:00:53 -
[27] - Quote
If you ever encounter the rarest of all creatures in eve: a real deal fleet fight in highsec the loot is going to be worth absurd amounts of money, more so if battleships are involved. Green and blue loot everywhere.
Unless of course if one of the parties involved is P I R A T, in that case all their ships will be t2 fit because they are peasants and all their t3s will be max tank dtone proteuses with half the DPS and the same EHP as a regular proteus with faction EANMs because the 25% cost saving is apparently worth a huge drop on functionality and survivability to them.
(Did I mention P I R A T suck?) |
Altony Compagno
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2015.08.24 18:21:48 -
[28] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:as promised, downgrade the modules as and when needed [Incursus, Omar Alharazaad's Incursus] Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Small Armor Repairer II Small Armor Repairer II
1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II
Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Is this a good, general, fit to use to plan a training path with? For space piracy?
I asked in Rookie Help and local and was pointed toward a Catalyst ship with blasters for guns, and the damage modifiers to help increase damage. I've read up on them, and they are for ganking. Right? Would it be worthy of this sort of thing too, or is it pigeon-holed for ganking only?
I guess the question is, can anyone give me hints, tips, or a training plan to engage in space piracy as soon as possible as a new (still on trial right now) character? |
Zoe Athame
Don't Lose Your Way
294
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Posted - 2015.08.24 18:29:36 -
[29] - Quote
Altony Compagno wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:as promised, downgrade the modules as and when needed [Incursus, Omar Alharazaad's Incursus] Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Small Armor Repairer II Small Armor Repairer II
1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II
Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I Is this a good, general, fit to use to plan a training path with? For space piracy? I asked in Rookie Help and local and was pointed toward a Catalyst ship with blasters for guns, and the damage modifiers to help increase damage. I've read up on them, and they are for ganking. Right? Would it be worthy of this sort of thing too, or is it pigeon-holed for ganking only? I guess the question is, can anyone give me hints, tips, or a training plan to engage in space piracy as soon as possible as a new (still on trial right now) character?
Catalysts are used for suicide ganking because they put out the best dps for the lowest cost. They won't do well in an actual fight though since they lack tank and mid slots.
People use frigates for mission flipping because they look easy to kill but are small enough to not get hit by large guns. PVE ships generally aren't prepared to fight frigates so you don't have to worry about scrams and webs. Just focus fire the drones and they are forced to sit there while you slowly peck them to death.
That's the idea anyway. Good luck getting someone to actually fall for the bait. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
11400
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Posted - 2015.08.24 18:41:48 -
[30] - Quote
Altony Compagno wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:as promised, downgrade the modules as and when needed [Incursus, Omar Alharazaad's Incursus] Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Small Armor Repairer II Small Armor Repairer II
1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Small Capacitor Booster II
Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S Light Ion Blaster II,Void S
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I Is this a good, general, fit to use to plan a training path with? For space piracy? I asked in Rookie Help and local and was pointed toward a Catalyst ship with blasters for guns, and the damage modifiers to help increase damage. I've read up on them, and they are for ganking. Right? Would it be worthy of this sort of thing too, or is it pigeon-holed for ganking only? I guess the question is, can anyone give me hints, tips, or a training plan to engage in space piracy as soon as possible as a new (still on trial right now) character? This exact fit is specifically for fighting up ship I.e. ships much bigger than you In protracted solo/small gang engagement like the ones described in the blog post I linked earlier in the thread.
In those circumstances it's fantastic but it's not a particularly versatile fit. For versatility I'd be inclined to point you towards the Tristan and tell you to start training drones, with a mind to eventually get you flying an ishkur and or algos.
Drones are pretty solid choice to put training into as almost all the ships in eve use them to some degree and those with bonuses to them (particularly in the gallente line) are quite versatile and forgiving for lower sp pilots.
Better the Devil you know.
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