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muhadin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
196
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Posted - 2015.09.16 00:32:36 -
[1] - Quote
Alright so my primary goal with this change is to get more people into wspace, and to keep the people that are in w-space here. Secondary goal is to get people to the content they are interested in doing faster, so they spend less time scanning and more time having fun. Not everyone enjoys scanning, most do it out of necessity.
The main idea would be to decrease the signal strength of wormholes themselves, making them easier to probe down. (Only Wormholes, not all sigs)
Some facts before i get started: -At 25% signal strength a sig gets identified as to whether its a wormhole or not. And the main thing here is distinguishing wormholes from all the other sigs. -Typically people never scan 16au or above, as it is now its easier to just 8au planets with sigs one by one. -When i mention 4-8au or 8-16au, i mean Probe coverage size. I'm not quite famaliar with the math of signature strength vs probe strength so this is the way I'm going to measure, i believe its also easier to understand this way for anyone who has scanned a wormhole.
1. Ideally a t1 magnate with lv2-3 scanning skills should beable to hit 25% strength on a wh at 4-8AU. 1a. This would allow a newer player to relatively easily find a route into and through highsec to roam nullsec or lowsec and really explore eve early on in the game. This would be absolutely amazing if i was a new player and this was possible in a t1 magnate. As it is now, it takes ages to travel through wspace in a t1 magnate, you can spend hours scanning trying to find routes through 3-4 jump wormhole chains. If you don't believe me, go try it.
2. A T2 Anathema with lv4 scanning skills should beable to hit 25% at 8-16AU. 2a. This will allow an intermediate player to scan faster for his small-mid sized corp. For example if he wants to scan for a highsec to do some logistics, but theres no chain. It should only take him 10 minutes, versus upwards of 20-30 minutes to find a high. Getting the player to the content they wish to do faster. The same can be said if his corp wanted to go roam nullsec or lowsec, that single player can scan a decent chain in 10-15 minutes from the current 40minutes, giving his corp a ton of options, and again, getting players to the content they wish to do faster.
3. And a t2 scanner with lv5 skills and a virtue prober should beable to hit 25% at 16-32AU. 3a. This is for the endgame wormhole player. Being able to pretty quickly scan out chains to look for target nullsec or lowsecs to go to specific fights or timers anywhere in eve, or specific heavy ratting regions to hunt carebears. And if the chain ends up being no good you just roll and do it again. Turning a possible 3-4 hour rolling/scanning session looking for good null/lowsecs into a 20-30minute one.
Overall, this will have more people scanning, more wormholes being opened, more connections being made, and the most important thing of all, getting players to the content they wish to do faster.
With the nerf to the nullsec>c5 and null>null, which is partially my fault in helping PL along in that direction, I don't think this will buff that nerf for nullsec people unless they scan down deep wormhole chains, which is usually unlikely because most null dudes are scared of whs. It WILL however buff nullsecs in regards to wormholers looking for content, wormholers are used to going down wh chains, because we will beable to cycle through chains to find the nulls we want more quickly. In the end this is another great part of this change.
In ending i would really like to ask despite who i am affiliated with that you take it on my word that i honestly believe that these changes will benefit all of w-space as a hole, and smaller groups more-so.
"Love the Life you Live, Live the Life you Love"
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MtnDo Me
Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies.
12
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Posted - 2015.09.16 00:52:14 -
[2] - Quote
all i know is **** scanning |
NoobMan
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
184
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:00:29 -
[3] - Quote
+1
Scanning is a deterrent for most people wanting to move into wormholes.
It is a QOL improvement for the whlers that already live there.
Would increase the amount of connections being created and would allow you to cycle through empty chains faster.
And is less radical than giving the whs for free as an anom.
Operations Director of Hard K(n)ocks Inc.
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Franky Saken
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
52
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:04:56 -
[4] - Quote
Scanning becomes a chore after a while and I like my chores to be short. Especially after the fifth time you roll your chain looking for some fun. |
Bella Evensong
Conquering Darkness
0
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:08:45 -
[5] - Quote
Big +1.
Would make wormhole living much more enjoyable and encourage active play. I hope CCP considers these changes! |
Gregor Noobius
The Desolate Order Brave Collective
11
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:40:06 -
[6] - Quote
yes pls |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2732
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:48:06 -
[7] - Quote
TL;DR: scanning for wormholes is boring as ****, and spreadsheets was apparently more occupying and satisfying.
Here's a little anecdote from lasts night attempt to scan some holes down for a good roam or trading opportunities:
I undock in my astero and set a roundabout route to take me through a reasonable amount of space without going to far. I begin trekking and every time I see sigs I drop probes and begin the process.
This happens for about 5-10 jumps before the doldrums settle in. I have my web browser open and am aimlessly perusing when I somehow end up looking at one of my industry spreadsheets.
*readjust probes for another scan*
I'm looking at it and think to myself, "wow this looks like ****".
*re-readjusts probes because the UI is fighting me*
so I begin digging in to figuring out how to optimize it and add some more information. It requires more user input then it really should and is just a glorified calculator at this point.
*its a gas site, moving on*
So I look into figuring out how to use '=VLOOKUP' in order to make a selectable drop down tab (btw VLOOKUP is amazing IF YOU CAN GET THE DAMN THING TO WORK PROPERLY)
*system has quite a few sigs, might save me some travel time if I'm lucky*
So after getting a good ore composition table working, I begin remaking my original info tools around the new set up. It looks pretty good and appears to have no issues with retrieving the info I want properly, so I spend a few minutes making it look pretty and presentable (I have no eye for flair, so it looks like unicorn vomit).
*2 days sites, 1 combat site, and finally a wormhole, let's see where it goes*
With my newfound knowledge of using a query, I begin to analyze my normal procedure when procuring my resources.
*WTF there's nothing here. Sig is sill at 100% am I bugged? Nope, a fellow scanner warps in to confirm a FUBAR hole. Moving on*
So I start to make a modified copy of my primary hauler's pricing tool. I get the basic functionality down and start working on attaching its details and functions to inputs from my ore sheet, to simplify the process.
*oops, forgot about my scanning. Uncloacked on a gate with rats shooting me*
I have to google a few tips on getting IF, AND, OR, and other logic statements flowing properly, and making sure the nested challenges are interacting right.
*found another hole, unfortunately EOL. Won't do me much good since the possible trek back is 60+ jumps and I don't feel like trying to blitz through highsec towing a fleet along with criminal sec status*
So I'm getting into the nitty gritty details on what I want the final results to look like and making sure it's usable to me, when I look to the top right at the clock: it's 5:30 AM (due to weird work hours, going to bed at 3 in the morning is usual but approaching the sunrise is really pushing it.
* last wormhole led to a C2 with a C4(?) static.*
Well I guess it's off to bed then.
I really do like the idea. Wormholes have much better tools of restriction and allow actual limits on how badly they can be used, so a. Uff to finding them would be good. |
BayneNothos
United Electro-Magnetic Federation Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
151
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Posted - 2015.09.16 01:59:27 -
[8] - Quote
+1
Also with this, I think lifetimes on sigs need to be looked at. You can tell a system that's vacant by it having a good 20-30 sigs in it. Shattered have this problem as well. I tend to not even bother checking shattered wh's at all for connections these days, which is the exact opposite of what they're meant to be for.
Give gas sites like 2-3 day lifetimes, data/relics 3-4 so these unwanted sites can move around a bit to other systems. Maybe they'll be done then. |
Dathenar Fandoris
The Desolate Order Brave Collective
0
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Posted - 2015.09.16 02:02:19 -
[9] - Quote
I would absolutely love this change. Anything to get more people into WH space would be great. |
Sporx Utensil
Colossus Enterprises
27
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Posted - 2015.09.16 02:06:05 -
[10] - Quote
"Come into my parlor" said the spider to the fly. |
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Evil's Dawn
Wormbro The Society For Unethical Treatment Of Sleepers
0
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Posted - 2015.09.16 02:29:48 -
[11] - Quote
100% agree. Its almost like "16 sigs in system.... **** that i dont even want to try"
make them easier to find. we look for them anyways. whats the harm with scanning a lil faster? |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
2733
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Posted - 2015.09.16 02:37:31 -
[12] - Quote
Yes.
CCp, you REALLY need to look at this problem for wormholes. Your players are getting older, with more kids, less game time, less spare time, less money and less latitude from spouses to spend 5 hours a day grinding three wormholes down chain to find NOTHING to do because people have looked at the above factors and looked at their killboard and thought "**** wormholes. like, seriously, **** this ****. this isn't a game, this is a ******* job what pays me nothing and i don't even get a ******* kill out of it".
Either make it automatic and skill-point based, or do this. Very least this. for all wormholes, not just K162's.
Like, why the utter living bollocks is a Z060 harder to find than a U574?
Because some deranged icelandic virgin decided.
Great game design, is arbitrary choices based on random numbers and the desire to add "intricacy".
it's not intricacy, it's bad design. it's flavour all right. The flavour of rancid feces.
Doctor Prince Field Marshall of Prolapse. Alliance and Grand Sasquatch of Bob
We take Batphones. Contact us at Hola Batmanuel - Free call 1800-UR-MOMMA
~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
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Rahmiro
Discrete Astrographic Reconnaissance Technologies Wrong Hole.
71
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Posted - 2015.09.16 02:43:06 -
[13] - Quote
I scanned 1412 sigs in June, 1402 July, 1318 August and 503 this month. I'm spent and agree with this Idea/Suggestion.
I never seen these people in my life.
I don't recognize them Your Honor
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Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
1553
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Posted - 2015.09.16 03:32:14 -
[14] - Quote
We used to have this capability when deep space scanner probes existed. A little math was needed but this did help when scanning mass sections of wspace.
Bringing down the threshold of just identifying which dog is a wormhole or not?
No issue there.
Yaay!!!!
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Ben Ishikela
60
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Posted - 2015.09.16 03:47:33 -
[15] - Quote
What about reducing the Threshhold for getting that "wormhole" info at 25% to 10%(or 5%). Would that also work? Thing is you then still have the "difficulty balance barrier" (if there was any) to get the complete lock. But its easier to destingiush between those 20Gassites and the two WHs.
Remove JumpFreighters/CloakHauler/CloakTrick and make a new T2Freighter(mjd+fleethangar+dock+T2resists-JumpDrive). Because we need more opportunities for piracy, escorts and decentralised economy!
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Paul Vashar
Periphery Bound New Signature
69
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Posted - 2015.09.16 03:49:12 -
[16] - Quote
+1 that if you are only looking for connections (Wormholes) then you should be able to find them faster than the **** you don't care about. If we're pushing the idea of no warping to BMs then we should also be able to scan, warp, and get that character on that connection faster anyways. (Hint, Hint, Alliance ops when they don't have the BMs).
I don't expect anyone who lives in W-space to object to this idea. |
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
1554
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:01:17 -
[17] - Quote
You know what, just flip it completely.
You jump into a system, you see sigs, the green sigs and the unidentified ones.
You select and ignore ALL.
Drop probes at 16 au, scan.
All the NEW sigs, are wormholes.
Yes wormholes don't show up on the probe scanner as default anymore unless you drop probes and make it show up.
Basically make people work again.
Yaay!!!!
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muhadin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
220
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:02:51 -
[18] - Quote
Ben Ishikela wrote:What about reducing the Threshhold for getting that "wormhole" info at 25% to 10%(or 5%). Would that also work? Thing is you then still have the "difficulty balance barrier" (if there was any) to get the complete lock. But its easier to destingiush between those 20Gassites and the two WHs.
Possibly, i also want this to be easier for newer and mid level players. With citadels on the horizon i would love to see new player wormhole corps kicking ass and taking names in wspace.
"Love the Life you Live, Live the Life you Love"
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Ben Ishikela
60
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:03:31 -
[19] - Quote
You know, this might get us some power projection problems. It also reduces the size of Wormholespace significantly.
You might want to nerf the stability of WHs also: - Reduce time from 24h to 2h/4h/6h/8h.
What about easy2probe holes that only exist 1h or even less? ----> more randomness and excitement.
Remove JumpFreighters/CloakHauler/CloakTrick and make a new T2Freighter(mjd+fleethangar+dock+T2resists-JumpDrive). Because we need more opportunities for piracy, escorts and decentralised economy!
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Montgomery Black
Exit-Strategy Exit Strategy..
94
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:21:43 -
[20] - Quote
Endorsed.
To many empty WH systems currently. A way to scan down WH chains more quickly to find content would be awesome. |
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Spillrag
Lazerhawks
19
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:52:36 -
[21] - Quote
+1 |
Kalel Nimrott
The Dingus Coalition
1205
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Posted - 2015.09.16 04:59:49 -
[22] - Quote
What in the f@ck are you doing in wspace if you do not enjoy scan in it?
Bob Artis, you will be missed.
O7
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Chitsa Jason
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
1349
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Posted - 2015.09.16 05:13:27 -
[23] - Quote
This is not a terrible idea :)
Burn the land and boil the sea
You can't take the sky from me
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Rek Seven
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
2004
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Posted - 2015.09.16 05:20:29 -
[24] - Quote
I guess I would be ok with this...
You sound like an idiot when you say "create content" when you mean find a fight, gank, etc... Stop it!
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Athanor Ruthoern
13. Enigma Project
27
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Posted - 2015.09.16 05:24:57 -
[25] - Quote
The reaction from people is most interesting. When I suggested soemthing simalar of this half a year agoe I was meet with people cursing me and the idear. The same attitude has been in wormhole space the last min 4 years. Do not change anything. no easy mode. Change is bad. Wormholes aare only for pro players. I am happy to see people gotten a change of heart.
I support this idear |
Bizmarhk
Furnace Thermodynamics
82
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Posted - 2015.09.16 05:31:57 -
[26] - Quote
+1
For every hour I spend looking for PVP, I receive maybe about 1-5 minutes of actual PVP. This ratio is part of what makes PVP so intense, but it's also an issue because that's a lot of wasted time spent trying to enjoy one of the pinnacle events that one can experience in this game. I'm not asking for instant gratification, but reducing some of the tediousness of this game would be welcome. |
Moo Moocow
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
47
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Posted - 2015.09.16 05:56:12 -
[27] - Quote
Big +1
The easiest way of introducing content/people into wh space would be to make scanning easier. |
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1054
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Posted - 2015.09.16 06:00:35 -
[28] - Quote
There's a lot of posting on how scanning is a barrier to get into wormholes. I don't know about you guys, but I believe it's minor compared to committing assets, managing POS, having either trusted friends willing to go into seclusion with you or crapton of alts, defending your stuff...
Compared to that, scanning is a minor barrier. Like, very minor.
For those already there, however, this may become a great convenience.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Jennifer Maxwell
Crimson Serpent Syndicate Heiian Conglomerate
317
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Posted - 2015.09.16 06:04:00 -
[29] - Quote
"YAY! More people can do X activity! Let's make it easier for people to get into. Yay!"
That's what we said about exploration. What we said about mag and radar sites. |
Arcturus Gallow
Lazerhawks
14
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Posted - 2015.09.16 06:33:39 -
[30] - Quote
Wait it doesnt work anymore to get a scan with only one probe at 32 a.u. and be able to discriminate which sig is a wormhole from the differente range of % you get?
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