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SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Northern Coalition.
379
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 13:59:50 -
[151] - Quote
Irony is, jaguar and wolf are both excellent AF counters to Confessors. That EM armor resist is a serious pain to get through. When all is said and done, my preference that 10mn still remain viable for brawling fits stays. I'm happy with snipers not being able to fit them (well, I haven't found a way to decently fit a beam confessor with 10mn and have it not be crap so...).
The eve community just got a nice buff to battlecruisers, and are getting all kinds of new ewar frigs. All these things impact the lifespan of T3's in battle. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16840
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 14:16:02 -
[152] - Quote
Lloyd Roses wrote:baltec1 wrote:All of them need a nerf including the Hecate (a destroyer pumping out high end HAC damage from small guns and you don't see that as overpowered? While you're at it, nerf the catalyst. Like, strip half its guns so it doesn't sit there as a 1mil hull pumping out 650dps.
There is a reason why nobody uses the gank cat to take on anything that can fight back.
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
605
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 14:26:52 -
[153] - Quote
Baltec1 wrote:
All of them need a nerf including the Hecate (a destroyer pumping out high end HAC damage from small guns and you don't see that as overpowered? ), they are simply too powerful for what they are. The should have the stats of t1 destroyers with the adaptability because there is exactly zero chance of a t1 destroyer being anything other than fodder to these ships.
*squints* Harvey.. is that you? Please stop focusing on just the dps of a t3d and take it all in.
Hecate is balanced as its incredibly slow and easy to scram kite that dps. If hecate uses sharpshooter then it sacrifices its tank bonus, which makes it considerably easier to kill. If it stays in tank mode, then it has very poor range. Then that 850dps drops quite quickly. Not to mention its very susceptible to neuts, both in max gank, dual web hull config or single/dual armor rep.
Ive killed every t3d and by far, the one that is the biggest pain in the ass is the svipul, as there is no obvious counter except neuting it to hell with dual webs to hold it. Hecates and jackdaws are easy to kill as well as both are slow with big sigs. The svipul is the main issue with t3d, all 4 dont need to suffer a nerf overhaul.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16840
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 14:46:32 -
[154] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
*squints* Harvey.. is that you? Please stop focusing on just the dps of a t3d and take it all in.
Hecate is balanced as its incredibly slow and easy to scram kite that dps. If hecate uses sharpshooter then it sacrifices its tank bonus, which makes it considerably easier to kill. If it stays in tank mode, then it has very poor range. Then that 850dps drops quite quickly. Not to mention its very susceptible to neuts, both in max gank, dual web hull config or single/dual armor rep.
Ive killed every t3d and by far, the one that is the biggest pain in the ass is the svipul, as there is no obvious counter except neuting it to hell with dual webs to hold it. Hecates and jackdaws are easy to kill as well as both are slow with big sigs. The svipul is the main issue with t3d, all 4 dont need to suffer a nerf overhaul.
I am looking at the whole package which is why I see the need for a nerf. As said, other destroyers can hit 650dps, the problem is that the Hecate doesn't need to make the sacrifices that the other destroyers have to make to get that kind of firepower. A gank catalyst cannot for example also fit a 300hp/s tank and a prop mod (that allows the Hecate to travel faster than said cat) and a cap booster and a neut while sporting 600 dps.
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
605
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 15:00:53 -
[155] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
*squints* Harvey.. is that you? Please stop focusing on just the dps of a t3d and take it all in.
Hecate is balanced as its incredibly slow and easy to scram kite that dps. If hecate uses sharpshooter then it sacrifices its tank bonus, which makes it considerably easier to kill. If it stays in tank mode, then it has very poor range. Then that 850dps drops quite quickly. Not to mention its very susceptible to neuts, both in max gank, dual web hull config or single/dual armor rep.
Ive killed every t3d and by far, the one that is the biggest pain in the ass is the svipul, as there is no obvious counter except neuting it to hell with dual webs to hold it. Hecates and jackdaws are easy to kill as well as both are slow with big sigs. The svipul is the main issue with t3d, all 4 dont need to suffer a nerf overhaul.
I am looking at the whole package which is why I see the need for a nerf. As said, other destroyers can hit 650dps, the problem is that the Hecate doesn't need to make the sacrifices that the other destroyers have to make to get that kind of firepower. A gank catalyst cannot for example also fit a 300hp/s tank and a prop mod (that allows the Hecate to travel faster than said cat) and a cap booster and a neut while sporting 600 dps.
The catalyst has projection baked into the hull and doesnt need a mode switch to project that 650dps. Unlike the hecate which has to sacrifice its speed or tank to project similarly. As mentioned earlier those fits you speak of can be easily countered due to the slow speed, lack of projection and large-ish sig of the hecate.
You are looking at the whole package, but are insinuating all the bonuses are available at the same time. Which is not the case. A rail DD, arty jag, arty thrasher and other scram kite ships (if flown properly) could but a hecate in a bad position. Larger ships are even better at nuking a hecate. Especially if it has a medium neut. I see no major issues here.
And no, i have never flown a hecate, ive just killed quite a few of them. So im not trying to prevent a nerf to my favorite ship. I just think nerfing the hecate will push it into an eft warriors wet dream when all they look at is dps. Then they take it out and realize its a joke.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16840
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 15:31:40 -
[156] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
The catalyst has projection baked into the hull and doesnt need a mode switch to project that 650dps.
That nets it 2km more range, this means nothing with blaster boats.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: You are looking at the whole package, but are insinuating all the bonuses are available at the same time. Which is not the case.
All of what I put was available in defence mode aside from the much faster speed which you only need to catch the target, once you catch it you swap to defence mode.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: A rail DD, arty jag, arty thrasher and other scram kite ships (if flown properly) could but a hecate in a bad position.
Same goes for any other blaster boat.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: And no, i have never flown a hecate, ive just killed quite a few of them. So im not trying to prevent a nerf to my favorite ship. I just think nerfing the hecate will push it into an eft warriors wet dream when all they look at is dps. Then they take it out and realize its a joke.
This is the problem, you don't have to make hard choices with these ships like you do with the other destroyers. You sacrifice nothing for switching modes and the fitting room, slots and cap are all far too forgiving.
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
606
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 16:47:21 -
[157] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
The catalyst has projection baked into the hull and doesnt need a mode switch to project that 650dps.
That nets it 2km more range, this means nothing with blaster boats. Stitch Kaneland wrote: You are looking at the whole package, but are insinuating all the bonuses are available at the same time. Which is not the case.
All of what I put was available in defence mode aside from the much faster speed which you only need to catch the target, once you catch it you swap to defence mode. Stitch Kaneland wrote: A rail DD, arty jag, arty thrasher and other scram kite ships (if flown properly) could but a hecate in a bad position.
Same goes for any other blaster boat. Stitch Kaneland wrote: And no, i have never flown a hecate, ive just killed quite a few of them. So im not trying to prevent a nerf to my favorite ship. I just think nerfing the hecate will push it into an eft warriors wet dream when all they look at is dps. Then they take it out and realize its a joke.
This is the problem, you don't have to make hard choices with these ships like you do with the other destroyers. You sacrifice nothing for switching modes and the fitting room, slots and cap are all far too forgiving.
The difference is closer to 4km with null. Which is huge in a frig fight when scram kiting. The catalyst can shoot about 250-300dps at scram range with null. More than enough to take down most frigs.
Hecate can swap into sharpshooter mode to get similar results (no falloff bonus though) and can hit the edge of scram with null loaded neutrons. To do this it sacrifices its tank bonuses. So id say thats a very reasonable trade off.
Once you "catch" your target. More likely when your target catches you. Dual prop fits are quite common, or just straight AB fits. Once the hecate is scrammed, its prop bonus is useless and can be escaped from assuming you have an AB. Hell ive scram kited hecates with a tornado. Goes like this. Hecate rams target, target scram/webs back and then coasts out of blaster optimal. Now its just a matter of either leaving the fight if you cant break him, or finish the fight.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16843
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 18:04:51 -
[158] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
The difference is closer to 4km with null. Which is huge in a frig fight when scram kiting. The catalyst can shoot about 250-300dps at scram range with null. More than enough to take down most frigs.
It cant fit a prop mod, scram and web like the Hecate can though.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: Hecate can swap into sharpshooter mode to get similar results (no falloff bonus though) and can hit the edge of scram with null loaded neutrons. To do this it sacrifices its tank bonuses. So id say thats a very reasonable trade off.
Why would you do that when you can web it into void range though?
Stitch Kaneland wrote: Once you "catch" your target. More likely when your target catches you. Dual prop fits are quite common, or just straight AB fits. Once the hecate is scrammed, its prop bonus is useless and can be escaped from assuming you have an AB. Hell ive scram kited hecates with a tornado. Goes like this. Hecate rams target, target scram/webs back and then coasts out of blaster optimal. Now its just a matter of either leaving the fight if you cant break him, or finish the fight.
Personally I would always fit an AB but the Hecate has the option of fitting an AB and a MWD, something the catalyst and Eris cannot do. As I said, there are simply not enough drawbacks on this ship for that much firepower.
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W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
383
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 18:29:41 -
[159] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
The difference is closer to 4km with null. Which is huge in a frig fight when scram kiting. The catalyst can shoot about 250-300dps at scram range with null. More than enough to take down most frigs.
It cant fit a prop mod, scram and web like the Hecate can though. Stitch Kaneland wrote: Hecate can swap into sharpshooter mode to get similar results (no falloff bonus though) and can hit the edge of scram with null loaded neutrons. To do this it sacrifices its tank bonuses. So id say thats a very reasonable trade off.
Why would you do that when you can web it into void range though? Stitch Kaneland wrote: Once you "catch" your target. More likely when your target catches you. Dual prop fits are quite common, or just straight AB fits. Once the hecate is scrammed, its prop bonus is useless and can be escaped from assuming you have an AB. Hell ive scram kited hecates with a tornado. Goes like this. Hecate rams target, target scram/webs back and then coasts out of blaster optimal. Now its just a matter of either leaving the fight if you cant break him, or finish the fight.
Personally I would always fit an AB but the Hecate has the option of fitting an AB and a MWD, something the catalyst and Eris cannot do. As I said, there are simply not enough drawbacks on this ship for that much firepower.
You would fit a ab to a hecate? Thanks for showing up in this thread and thanks for making it clear what you know about them. |
W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
383
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 18:30:29 -
[160] - Quote
SFM Hobb3s wrote:Irony is, jaguar and wolf are both excellent AF counters to Confessors. That EM armor resist is a serious pain to get through. When all is said and done, my preference that 10mn still remain viable for brawling fits stays. I'm happy with snipers not being able to fit them (well, I haven't found a way to decently fit a beam confessor with 10mn and have it not be crap so...).
The eve community just got a nice buff to battlecruisers, and are getting all kinds of new ewar frigs. All these things impact the lifespan of T3's in battle.
Both jag and wolf die without a chance vs the confessor (if fit correctly, i.e 10mn beam ktiing fit or 10mn dual pulse brawling fit) |
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
606
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 18:32:37 -
[161] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
The difference is closer to 4km with null. Which is huge in a frig fight when scram kiting. The catalyst can shoot about 250-300dps at scram range with null. More than enough to take down most frigs.
It cant fit a prop mod, scram and web like the Hecate can though. Stitch Kaneland wrote: Hecate can swap into sharpshooter mode to get similar results (no falloff bonus though) and can hit the edge of scram with null loaded neutrons. To do this it sacrifices its tank bonuses. So id say thats a very reasonable trade off.
Why would you do that when you can web it into void range though? Stitch Kaneland wrote: Once you "catch" your target. More likely when your target catches you. Dual prop fits are quite common, or just straight AB fits. Once the hecate is scrammed, its prop bonus is useless and can be escaped from assuming you have an AB. Hell ive scram kited hecates with a tornado. Goes like this. Hecate rams target, target scram/webs back and then coasts out of blaster optimal. Now its just a matter of either leaving the fight if you cant break him, or finish the fight.
Personally I would always fit an AB but the Hecate has the option of fitting an AB and a MWD, something the catalyst and Eris cannot do. As I said, there are simply not enough drawbacks on this ship for that much firepower.
That is correct, because its range bonuses are baked into the hull. Something the hecate lacks. Prop/web catalysts are fairly common and overcome the whole needing 3 mid thing. Since most frigs wont last long against 500-600dps, having no scram is viable.
You do realize other ships have webs too right? A webbed/scrammed hecate vs a frig/dessie/cruiser and even a battlecruiser with an AB is faster than a tackled hecate and can dictate range. So you sticking with void in defense mode will make you an easy kill against someone who scram kites you. Using null and sharpshooter mode will allow you to hit out to scram range, at the cost of your tank bonus. Which allows the scram kiter to kill you faster, but also allows you to apply some damage to the scram kiter to kill him or force him off. Comes down to a dps race at that point.
The hecate can fit an AB/MWD. But that in itself is a drawback since you now dont have room for a cap booster for that cap hungry tank (rep fits anyway). It also makes you highly vulnerable to neuts.. Not to mention the hecate is hilariously slow with an AB (about 550m/s IIRC). A thrasher can do about 750m/s. So assuming both have webs, the thrasher can get out of blaster range and still apply damage, where as you cannot.
Again, this is more about pilot skill to beat a hecate. Which is why its balanced. The svipul on the other hand is completely different and needs a nerf.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16846
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 18:51:40 -
[162] - Quote
W0lf Crendraven wrote:
You would fit a ab to a hecate? Thanks for showing up in this thread and thanks for making it clear what you know about them.
I also shield fit megathrons. Perhaps if you experimented with fittings more and followed the top fits on battleclinic less you would get to know more than one fit per ship.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16846
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 19:03:57 -
[163] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
That is correct, because its range bonuses are baked into the hull. Something the hecate lacks. Prop/web catalysts are fairly common and overcome the whole needing 3 mid thing. Since most frigs wont last long against 500-600dps, having no scram is viable.
Most frigs bug out the second a destroyer lands on them so you aint holding ****, hence why nobody uses a gank cat outside of ganking haulers in highsec.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: You do realize other ships have webs too right?
The two other very high damage destroyers don't though.
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
Again, this is more about pilot skill to beat a hecate. Which is why its balanced..
Tell me why I would use any blaster specialist destroyer over a Hecate.
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
606
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 19:31:11 -
[164] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
That is correct, because its range bonuses are baked into the hull. Something the hecate lacks. Prop/web catalysts are fairly common and overcome the whole needing 3 mid thing. Since most frigs wont last long against 500-600dps, having no scram is viable.
Most frigs bug out the second a destroyer lands on them so you aint holding ****, hence why nobody uses a gank cat outside of ganking haulers in highsec. Stitch Kaneland wrote: You do realize other ships have webs too right?
The two other very high damage destroyers don't though. Stitch Kaneland wrote:
Again, this is more about pilot skill to beat a hecate. Which is why its balanced..
Tell me why I would use any blaster specialist destroyer over a Hecate.
No they dont actually. Many frigs dont realize they arent pointed and fight to the end. Ive flown honor point fits frequently and youd be surprised how many dont realize they arent pointed. Some get away, but if your objective is to hold a location (plex), then its a win-win. Either you kill them, or you make them run.
Who said the web was isolated to a destroyer though? Im talking about scram kiting, which can be done in anything. A hecate can be scram kited by a frig, dessie, cruiser and BC that are AB fitted. Please read the entire point and not snip off the end with the pertinent information.
Ganking or for bait fits. Newbro friendly or you just need a dps powerhouse for cheap and have support ships to cover the tackle aspect. I.E, frigate gang with a few catalysts to kill larger ships. Its fairly common in FW.. i know, i know. Things exist other than ganking in HS and roaming nullsec.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16846
|
Posted - 2015.10.20 19:42:41 -
[165] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
No they dont actually. Many frigs dont realize they arent pointed and fight to the end. Ive flown honor point fits frequently and youd be surprised how many dont realize they arent pointed.
I fly them too, most will run and the inability to shut down a MWD will hurt..
Stitch Kaneland wrote: Who said the web was isolated to a destroyer though?
I did when we started to compare the Hecate with the other very high damage destroyers.
Stitch Kaneland wrote: Ganking or for bait fits. Newbro friendly or you just need a dps powerhouse for cheap and have support ships to cover the tackle aspect. I.E, frigate gang with a few catalysts to kill larger ships. Its fairly common in FW.. i know, i know. Things exist other than ganking in HS and roaming nullsec.
So none then because the Hecate will bring more damage, tank, utility, fitting room, cap, and speed than all of the other options can. This is why it is not balanced, the other destroyers must make hard choices while the Hecate can bring all of the options in one fit. It is also the reason why ships like the enyo and ishkur have been relegated to near uselessness, the Hecate out preforms everything in its level and below, same with the rest of the t3d lineup.
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Leonardo Adami
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
42
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 01:54:19 -
[166] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:
No they dont actually. Many frigs dont realize they arent pointed and fight to the end. Ive flown honor point fits frequently and youd be surprised how many dont realize they arent pointed.
I fly them too, most will run and the inability to shut down a MWD will hurt.. Stitch Kaneland wrote: Who said the web was isolated to a destroyer though?
I did when we started to compare the Hecate with the other very high damage destroyers. Stitch Kaneland wrote: Ganking or for bait fits. Newbro friendly or you just need a dps powerhouse for cheap and have support ships to cover the tackle aspect. I.E, frigate gang with a few catalysts to kill larger ships. Its fairly common in FW.. i know, i know. Things exist other than ganking in HS and roaming nullsec.
So none then because the Hecate will bring more damage, tank, utility, fitting room, cap, and speed than all of the other options can. This is why it is not balanced, the other destroyers must make hard choices while the Hecate can bring all of the options in one fit. It is also the reason why ships like the enyo and ishkur have been relegated to near uselessness, the Hecate out preforms everything in its level and below, same with the rest of the t3d lineup.
Based on your responses it's clear you are only out for blood and have no clue regarding balance of the T3ds. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16846
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 05:36:12 -
[167] - Quote
Leonardo Adami wrote: Based on your responses it's clear you are only out for blood and have no clue regarding balance of the T3ds.
Do you even know how I would balance them? Or is this just another vague attack on someone pointing out how wildly out of whack these ship are compared to the other ships in its class.
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Templar Dane
Amarrian Vengeance Team Amarrica
296
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 05:55:26 -
[168] - Quote
All this talk about scram kiting a hecate is funny. 250 dps at 9km with no range mods. 108 dps @ 11km.
But I guess everybody has faction scrams and links. |
Rek Seven
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
2036
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 10:54:50 -
[169] - Quote
So, for the people in the focus group, is there a consensus that AF should be improved before T3Ds get nerfed into the ground?
Dear eve players, please try and use the word "content" less and instead, be specific. Thanks
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SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Northern Coalition.
380
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 12:19:43 -
[170] - Quote
I don't like speaking on behalf of others but I'll provide some generic input. There are arguments both ways but I believe the consensus is that AF's are not meant to be a solo counter to a T3. Increasing cost of t3 is talked about. Balance-wise we talk a lot about how certain t3d's, namely Svipul, are much....easier to fly. We're mostly all agreed that its OP. The goal is that mode-switching is a critical and tactical choice, and the Svi can usually just do everything from one mode. While the other t3d's can be argued to be just as powerful, they actually do take skillful flying to be successful. This is something we want to keep. We frequently discuss the pros and cons of allowing 10mn AB use on these hulls, and are considering 'alternatives' designed to limit or bar their use without seriously impacting surviveability and versatility of the ship class. |
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Ares Desideratus
Minmatar Brotherhood Ushra'Khan
283
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 12:25:30 -
[171] - Quote
Templar Dane wrote:All this talk about scram kiting a hecate is funny. 250 dps at 9km with no range mods. 108 dps @ 11km.
But I guess everybody has faction scrams and links. 108 dps at 11km pretty much goes to show exactly why someone would want to scram kite the hecate |
Rek Seven
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
2037
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 13:33:24 -
[172] - Quote
SFM Hobb3s wrote:I don't like speaking on behalf of others but I'll provide some generic input. There are arguments both ways but I believe the consensus is that AF's are not meant to be a solo counter to a T3. Increasing cost of t3 is talked about. Balance-wise we talk a lot about how certain t3d's, namely Svipul, are much....easier to fly. We're mostly all agreed that its OP. The goal is that mode-switching is a critical and tactical choice, and the Svi can usually just do everything from one mode. While the other t3d's can be argued to be just as powerful, they actually do take skillful flying to be successful. This is something we want to keep. We frequently discuss the pros and cons of allowing 10mn AB use on these hulls, and are considering 'alternatives' designed to limit or bar their use without seriously impacting surviveability and versatility of the ship class.
Thanks. I agree with he comments regarding the Svipul and the oversized prop mods. I have a reasonably fit confessor and i hope it doesn't get nerfed because of the handful of op fits available.
Has anyone brought up the concept of penalties being applied to depending on the mode a T3D is in? for example, reduced optimal when in sharp propulsion mode or a reduction in speed in defence mode.
Dear eve players, please try and use the word "content" less and instead, be specific. Thanks
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Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
1287
|
Posted - 2015.10.21 15:20:05 -
[173] - Quote
Please keep in mind that there are already two MNRs going into T3D-production each, and the price didn't quite adjust to that rise yet. I'd be all for svipul's optimal bonus shifting to sharpshooter and 5 turrets to fit, but adjusting the price (by upping the production costs) of all because one and a half T3Ds are running amoque sounds shortsighted. |
Leonardo Adami
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
49
|
Posted - 2015.10.25 15:02:04 -
[174] - Quote
So has this focused group fizzled out? |
Mario Putzo
1556
|
Posted - 2015.10.26 19:10:21 -
[175] - Quote
I'm not part of a focus group. But here is what I think needs to happen.
1) AFs should get a role bonus for something like 50% (arbitrary number) resistance to EW effects, put them in line to be Anti- EW Support ships a counter to new Navy Faction EW Frigs, and other T1/T2 EW platforms.
2) T3s need to have mode switch take the cooldown to kick in ie. Speed > Wait > Tank. In stead of Speed > Tank > wait. Also they need to have their fitting values looked at so people need to make a concrete choice about having speed, tank, or gank.
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2350
|
Posted - 2015.10.26 19:37:07 -
[176] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:Also they need to have their fitting values looked at so people need to make a concrete choice about having speed, tank, or gank.
That's mostly an auto-cannon problem. Any ship that can fit artillery will be able to fit autos and tank at the same time because of the fitting on them being so low. |
Iyacia Cyric'ai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
177
|
Posted - 2015.10.27 04:21:04 -
[177] - Quote
Hecate and Jackdaw are fairly well balanced. 10mn AB Confessor is fairly strong but relies on cap for everything it does (armor buffer builds are pretty weak IMO). Svipul is just way too strong. Not just 10mn Svipuls but also mwd fits just because base speed (speed while scrammed) on prop mode is still faster than frigates so it will still dictate range even in most of those scenarios.
The prop mode for the Svipul and Confessor need to changed to a % increase to speed provided by AB or MWD, and not an increase to the base speed. In autocannon fits I practically never switch to sharpshooter mode or defensive mode. The base speed increase on prop mode helps you mitigate more damage when fighting vs cruisers than defensive mode, and allows for more transversal/range dictation for damage application when fighter vs things smaller than cruisers than sharpshooter mode. |
Moac Tor
Cy-Core Industries Stain Confederation
279
|
Posted - 2015.10.27 12:59:53 -
[178] - Quote
When is this focus group happening? I am waiting to see what your going to do to Tac Destroyers.
I hope there isn't much of a nerf as I find these ships interesting and fun to fly. Perhaps just increase their sig radius, and then buff AFs.
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
390
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Posted - 2015.10.27 13:09:36 -
[179] - Quote
Iyacia Cyric'ai wrote:Hecate and Jackdaw are fairly well balanced. 10mn AB Confessor is fairly strong but relies on cap for everything it does (armor buffer builds are pretty weak IMO). Svipul is just way too strong. Not just 10mn Svipuls but also mwd fits just because base speed (speed while scrammed) on prop mode is still faster than frigates so it will still dictate range even in most of those scenarios.
The prop mode for the Svipul and Confessor need to changed to a % increase to speed provided by AB or MWD, and not an increase to the base speed. In autocannon fits I practically never switch to sharpshooter mode or defensive mode. The base speed increase on prop mode helps you mitigate more damage when fighting vs cruisers than defensive mode, and allows for more transversal/range dictation for damage application when fighter vs things smaller than cruisers than sharpshooter mode.
Well balanced in regards to how op the svipul is yes, but not in regards to the other ships out there. Its the best one in terms of balance but while it is by far the worst t3d it isnt a bad ship. |
Moac Tor
Cy-Core Industries Stain Confederation
279
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Posted - 2015.10.27 13:12:27 -
[180] - Quote
W0lf Crendraven wrote:Iyacia Cyric'ai wrote:Hecate and Jackdaw are fairly well balanced. 10mn AB Confessor is fairly strong but relies on cap for everything it does (armor buffer builds are pretty weak IMO). Svipul is just way too strong. Not just 10mn Svipuls but also mwd fits just because base speed (speed while scrammed) on prop mode is still faster than frigates so it will still dictate range even in most of those scenarios.
The prop mode for the Svipul and Confessor need to changed to a % increase to speed provided by AB or MWD, and not an increase to the base speed. In autocannon fits I practically never switch to sharpshooter mode or defensive mode. The base speed increase on prop mode helps you mitigate more damage when fighting vs cruisers than defensive mode, and allows for more transversal/range dictation for damage application when fighter vs things smaller than cruisers than sharpshooter mode. Well balanced in regards to how op the svipul is yes, but not in regards to the other ships out there. Its the best one in terms of balance but while it is by far the worst t3d it isnt a bad ship. Your reply was a little confusing, but I think you mean to say the Svipul is OP. This is why I said increase sig radius across the board above, the Svipul is the one which would be hurt the most by that.
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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