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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 20 post(s) |
Guillame Herschel
Quantum Cats Syndicate Spaceship Bebop
70
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Posted - 2015.10.13 18:23:12 -
[31] - Quote
Quote:...what could possibly go wrong?!
Beware of vSwitch. |
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CCP Gun Show
C C P C C P Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.10.13 18:23:38 -
[32] - Quote
TheMercenaryKing wrote:l0rd carlos wrote:Quote:What you see here are 2x IBM SAN volume controllers which govern and control 2x IBM V5000 controllers which store all the data with 3x expansion shelves that house 9x800 GB SSD's with a grand total of 83x 1.2TB 10K SAS disks. I don't get this. The sentence make it sound like the SSDs have SAS disks build in :D That can't be right. Likely it is a tiered system with 9 SSDs and 83 10k drives.
yes its tiered so hot data resides on SSD's and SAS takes the cold data
does that answer your question ?
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virm pasuul
FRISKY BUSINESS. No Handlebars.
317
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Posted - 2015.10.13 18:28:49 -
[33] - Quote
One thing to watch out for CCP is default memory interleaving settings in the BIOS. I don't know if this is true for IBM, but for Dell out of the box, memory interleaving is turned off, which drops memory performance by a factor of 3 on quad path interconnect processors ( 3 not 4 because one is processor to processor ). Also Dell default mem config is NOT optimised to use interleaved memory, so you have to be careful how you choose your physical memory config and load the paths. I imagine IBM are much more on the ball than Dell on this front, but it's worth checking. |
l0rd carlos
TURN LEFT The Camel Empire
1255
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Posted - 2015.10.13 18:32:41 -
[34] - Quote
CCP Gun Show wrote:yes its tiered so hot data resides on SSD's and SAS takes the cold data does that answer your question ? Yes, thank you :-*
Youtube Channel about Micro and Small scale PvP with commentary: Fleet Commentary by l0rd carlos
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Alyxportur
From Our Cold Dead Hands
112
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Posted - 2015.10.13 18:51:40 -
[35] - Quote
I take it this means that the lag when making contracts, opening the market/any window, etc. will be reduced/gone, but will this also reduce the number of 'Socket Closed' events?
It would be interesting to see numerical statistics (not a line chart or diagram, please) on the instances and magnitude of each TIDI occurence for (1) a year pre-Phoebe, (2) the time between Phoebe and Aegis, and (3) post-Aegis until now. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3416
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Posted - 2015.10.13 19:08:37 -
[36] - Quote
i send you a floppy disk to backup my char
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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tasman devil
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
54
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Posted - 2015.10.13 19:21:30 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Phantom wrote:The Tranquility server cluster is a powerful machine, enabling you to create the biggest living universe of science fiction with the most massive spaceship battles mankind has ever seen. But you know what is even better than Tranquility? Tranquility Tech III! Our engineers are working hard to fully revamp the server cluster with new hardware, with new storage, with new network connections, with a new location and new software. TQ Tech III will be much better than the already astonishing current TQ server. Read more about this marvel of technology (including tech specs and pictures) in CCP Gun Show's latest blog Tranquility Tech III. And all this is planned for very early 2016! EVE Forever! Many thanks to the folks who wrote this Dev Blog. It is a truly good read!
I do hope it'll be an "OP SUCCESS!" :-)
And do please take pictures.
I don't belive in reincarnation
I've never believed in it in my previous lives either...
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xrev
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
1
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Posted - 2015.10.13 20:16:21 -
[38] - Quote
San storage enthousiast here :)
Keep in mind before upgrading from 4 or 8 Gbps to 16 Gbps to check the available and used buffer credits in combination with the average transmitted package size. Default FC frame size is supposed to be 2112 bytes and uses 1 buffercredit to transmit. With the increased speed, more buffercredits are used to fully utilize the line. When they're used, nothing will be transmitted until buffers are freed up. Had a customer some time ago who had upgraded the linespeed and in combination with synchronous storage replication, production came to a halt because of the switches running out of buffers.
So CCP, please double check the framesizes and buffercredits before upgrading the speed ;) |
Ix Method
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
475
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Posted - 2015.10.13 20:27:07 -
[39] - Quote
Volcano-powered Singularity.
Yes.
Travelling at the speed of love.
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CCP Gun Show
C C P C C P Alliance
5
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Posted - 2015.10.13 20:30:35 -
[40] - Quote
Ix Method wrote:Volcano-powered Singularity.
Yes.
we are thinking about renaming Singularity to Eyjafjallaj+Škull
kidding |
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
5623
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Posted - 2015.10.13 20:34:55 -
[41] - Quote
CCP Gun Show wrote:Ix Method wrote:Volcano-powered Singularity.
Yes. we are thinking about renaming Singularity to Eyjafjallaj+Škull kidding
I'd just like to say: You are a large scary man
Woo! CSM X!
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
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Haffsol
40
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Posted - 2015.10.13 20:59:37 -
[42] - Quote
Quote:[..... bla blah nerdy things....] what could possibly go wrong?! Exactly |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3416
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:10:26 -
[43] - Quote
so you will have fewer solar system nodes but they will have more bandwidth and be better connected?
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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Nafensoriel
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
119
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:29:38 -
[44] - Quote
So... since your engineers have decided to stop purchasing our superior minmatar duct tape...
Well actually that's it.. we're screwed. CCP engineers were 90% of our customer base. I guess we can start making server polish?
Seriously though awesome. Old codes going out the door and now the kludge hardware is going to. This is an awesome day for EVE.
Though seriously.. the engineers convinced you to keep the old cluster so they could play doom on it and have nerdgasams.. admit it. |
virm pasuul
FRISKY BUSINESS. No Handlebars.
318
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:29:48 -
[45] - Quote
Bienator II wrote:so you will have fewer solar system nodes but they will have more bandwidth and be better connected?
Hardware or software? I think the nodes are probably virtualised, so divide the total hardware resources by the number of nodes. Virtual stuff when done properly can be very efficient. e.g. a big gang roaming hops from one node to another, but they are virtual software nodes, if on the same host the net load on the underlying hardware would remain unchanged even though the gang had moved node.
CCP will be able to provision new nodes and drop unused nodes automatically. Also see the load balancing presentation they did a few fanfests ago where they explained their node balancing algorithm in detail. Moving nodes around to do hardware maintenance with virtualisation is a doddle. Nodes can be moved live from hardware host to hardware host whilst still doing active work for clients and not dropping a single packet mid move.
The hardware abstraction from virtualisation, the storage abstraction, along with all the hardware redundancy makes the setup described pretty bulletproof. The only point of failure left now is that little "feature" in the CCP automation system that no one thought could break. Amazon, Google, Microsoft, and pretty much every UK bank have all had unbreakable cloud setups break.
It is an amazing bit of kit that CCP is investing in. There's probably well over seven digits of new hardware there.
Now if only CCP could come up with multi threading server code.... :)
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CCP DeNormalized
C C P C C P Alliance
302
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:40:59 -
[46] - Quote
Master Degree wrote:as a IT pro, from experience i can tell that high IO SQL DB running in M$ Failover cluster @ vmware is not the best choice, rather go SQL always on, more storage needed, agree, but failovers are much easier (and much faster).. and you can replicate more times eg active, replica 1, replica 2 etc, can use one of the replica for reads and dont bother with operations on active writting db .. only thing what can be problem is switching of listener between nodes during sudden HW crash or vmotion (MAC address conflict in vmware 5.0, hope they fix it in 6.0 while running vmotion on loaded hosts)
eventually switch to hyper-v (core preferably due patches), license is cheaper as esx(i), but the downside is, that hyper-v is with features at least two releases behind vmware (if you dont pay huge money for scvmm)
just my 5 cents, i assume you made the math already :-)
PS: really nice HW, just vendor is not one of my favorites :)
thx for the comment and info MD!
I hear you on the VMWare possibly not being the best choice as there is definitely overhead invovled (both in I/O resources as well as licensing costs!). We'll do some testing and see the impact it has, and if we don't get to where we want with it, it's out! :)
In regards to AlwaysOn we'll be using this on top of whatever route we go w/ the cluster. This will be our primary replication method for keeping both our DRS in sync as well as offering live reporting services to internal users.
CCP DeNormalized
DBA
Virtual World Operations
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CCP DeNormalized
C C P C C P Alliance
302
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:49:41 -
[47] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:CCP Gun Show wrote:Ix Method wrote:Volcano-powered Singularity.
Yes. we are thinking about renaming Singularity to Eyjafjallaj+Škull kidding I'd just like to say: You are a large scary man
This doesn't become really really true until you spend 2 days of heavy drinking in the middle of the icelandic wilderness with the man...
"Don't wake the Balrog!" Is a slogan we force all new Operations team members to learn very early on :)
Ops Offsite best offsite!
CCP DeNormalized - Database Administrator
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Gospadin
Bastard Children of Poinen Grumpy Space Bastards
242
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Posted - 2015.10.13 21:52:27 -
[48] - Quote
I'm shocked that a system designed to deploy in 2016 is even using rotating drives. That data must be REALLY cold. |
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
1287
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Posted - 2015.10.13 22:03:50 -
[49] - Quote
No worries people. EVE is still dying on schedule. That's why they are pumping I don't even know how many hundreds of thousands of dollars into new server hardware. Because if it's going to die, it's going to die in style
My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things!
My Website - Blogs, Livestreams & Forums
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xrev
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
1
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Posted - 2015.10.13 22:10:42 -
[50] - Quote
Gospadin wrote:I'm shocked that a system designed to deploy in 2016 is even using rotating drives. That data must be REALLY cold. It's called auto-tiering. The hot storage blocks reside on the fast SSD's or the internal read cache. When blocks of data aren't touched, they move to slower disks that are still more cost effective if you look to volume for your buck. Compared to Ssd's, hard disks suck at random i/o but serial streams will do just fine. |
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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3416
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Posted - 2015.10.13 22:30:22 -
[51] - Quote
virm pasuul wrote:Bienator II wrote:so you will have fewer solar system nodes but they will have more bandwidth and be better connected? Hardware or software? http://i.imgur.com/xCjjFc9.png
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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Cor'len
The Silence of Thunder
10
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Posted - 2015.10.13 23:13:39 -
[52] - Quote
Bienator II wrote: Thats prob why ccp seems to see MT as low priority atm.
Actually, CCP would love to multithread the ~space code~ (can't remember the component name, haha). But it's practically impossible to get a consistent result; operations must be done in sequence, otherwise you get dead ships killing living ships, and other ~exciting~ edge cases.
This is the ultimate limiter on EVE performance. They might conceivably be able to MT the processing of different grids in a single system, but everything that happens on a single grid must execute in a deterministic fashion, and in the correct order.
Plus, even if that wasn't a problem, they run Stackless Python, with the beloved global interpreter lock which effectively prevents multithreading.
tl;dr CCP wants to multithread all the things, but it's so hard it's bordering on impossible. Hence the effort to not have big fights. |
Gospadin
Bastard Children of Poinen Grumpy Space Bastards
242
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Posted - 2015.10.13 23:16:18 -
[53] - Quote
xrev wrote:Gospadin wrote:I'm shocked that a system designed to deploy in 2016 is even using rotating drives. That data must be REALLY cold. It's called auto-tiering. The hot storage blocks reside on the fast SSD's or the internal read cache. When blocks of data aren't touched, they move to slower disks that are still more cost effective if you look to volume for your buck. Compared to Ssd's, hard disks suck at random i/o but serial streams will do just fine.
I know how it works.
It's just interesting to me that TQ's cold data store is satisfied with about 10K IOPS across those disk arrays. (Assuming 200/disk for 10K SAS and about 50% utilization given their expected multipath setup and/or redundancy/parity overhead) |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3416
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Posted - 2015.10.13 23:54:02 -
[54] - Quote
Cor'len wrote:Bienator II wrote: Thats prob why ccp seems to see MT as low priority atm. Actually, CCP would love to multithread the ~space code~ (can't remember the component name, haha). But it's practically impossible to get a consistent result; operations must be done in sequence, otherwise you get dead ships killing living ships, and other ~exciting~ edge cases. splitting tasks up is only one way of parallelism. You can distribute sequential tasks on different compute hardware via pipelining/layering etc.
but the thing is ccp does not have to do that. since they already can reach parallelism by simply running multiple processes on the same node. again: they are running 100+ systems on a single node. All they have to do is to run them in N processes instead of 1. (would not surprise me if they would run every system in its own process tbh)
mustithreading would only help in the worst case scenario: whole eve population is in the same system but according to ccp this is not even certain since the bottleneck seems to be memory bandwidth not computing power.
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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Berahk
Lightweight Dynamics
0
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Posted - 2015.10.14 00:13:40 -
[55] - Quote
So, few questions
How much closer does this server setup bring us to never needing downtime?
Also
How closer to being able to failover a tremendously busy system onto one of the combat nodes without having to wait until the following downtime? (or booking it in advance)
Thanks
/b |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5835
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Posted - 2015.10.14 00:56:01 -
[56] - Quote
Berahk wrote:How much closer does this server setup bring us to never needing downtime?
Most important question in the thread :D
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/death-to-downtimes/
Day 0 Advice for New Players
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Alundil
Isogen 5
1034
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Posted - 2015.10.14 01:45:01 -
[57] - Quote
Raphendyr Nardieu wrote:OMG, amazing blog. Nice that you added so much specifics.
I hope you get the virtualization working. Would provide nice benefits :) Came to say this. Excellent article. Vmotion on terrific hardware is sweet sweet sweet. We use this in our 20000 user environment to great effect.
Kerri up the great work.
I'm right behind you
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Shamwow Hookerbeater
Nine Inch Ninja Corp
0
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Posted - 2015.10.14 03:26:38 -
[58] - Quote
Gospadin wrote:xrev wrote:Gospadin wrote:I'm shocked that a system designed to deploy in 2016 is even using rotating drives. That data must be REALLY cold. It's called auto-tiering. The hot storage blocks reside on the fast SSD's or the internal read cache. When blocks of data aren't touched, they move to slower disks that are still more cost effective if you look to volume for your buck. Compared to Ssd's, hard disks suck at random i/o but serial streams will do just fine. I know how it works. It's just interesting to me that TQ's cold data store is satisfied with about 10K IOPS across those disk arrays. (Assuming 200/disk for 10K SAS and about 50% utilization given their expected multipath setup and/or redundancy/parity overhead)
Kinda funny in a way, at my last company we had some rather beefy 7420 ZFS appliances with ram/ssd/15K disks and we weren't happy when we were only getting approx 50-60K IOPS from pure disk operations across multiple pools. We could hit 200K+ on things that were cached....but we only needed that performance for some edge cases of ours. then we tested an AFF on our extreme edge cases...and were like crap why didn't these things get cheaper faster.
The AFF was incredibly faster than our 7420s in most cases especially anything approaching high levels of random IO (not surprising) it was so bad that a moderately powered vm (4 or 8 vcpus and like 64GB) was beating our 24 core 196GB physical boxes in total transactions when running things like HammerOra |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3416
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Posted - 2015.10.14 04:56:12 -
[59] - Quote
having DT only every second day would be a start :P
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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Raiz Nhell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
431
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Posted - 2015.10.14 05:21:32 -
[60] - Quote
Amazing stuff...
Wish I could convince the boss that we need a 10th of this stuff...
Keep up the good work...
P.S. Would like to see photos of Sisi's Volcano powered lair :)
There is no such thing as a fair fight...
If your fighting fair you have automatically put yourself at a disadvantage.
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