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SirMolle
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:44:00 -
[1]
Ascendant Frontier
The Band of Brothers stops today to indulge in short reminiscence. The purpose of this announcement is to transcribe the most general viewpoint shared among our alliance with honesty and clarity.
The Precedent The Band of Brothers war against the Ascendant Frontier has officially ended. Victory has been achieved with the complete dissolution of Ascendant Frontier as a sovereign 0.0 entity. Of the 4800 strong, now remains a lonely few, and in the next week, all stations are secured and new inhabitants in place. We claim, and no one can dispute, a full and complete victory.
The Motive The reasons for war are simple and straightfoward. Months of cold war, stockpiling and building with no end in sight. BoB provoked repeatedly and waited, and waited. For a short while it appeared as if the boiling point had been reached. Instead of explosive all out war, it fizzled into the nothingness known as CODA. The intended backbone of this coalition became too fearful of risking multi-billion ISK capital fleets and exposing their multi-billion ISK outposts on a gamble. Superpowers contented themselves in displaying might with weekend ops and campaigns against those in their backyard.
The reasons for selecting ASCN as the target were stated and restated, and will be once more. ASCN were the biggest and most likely to offer the best challenge, while keeping us occupied the longest. In theory, the unstoppable force versus the unmovable object. D2 almost had it, but morphed itself into a defensive alliance. The choice came down to fighting ASCN or mini-ASCN. All opposing claims were either misinformed, or fictional.
Due Process Initial plans and expectations called for an 8-12 month war, with intervention from multiple outsiders on multiple fronts. No requests to allies made; no mercenaries hired. If there was glory to be had, sharing it was never our intent. Furthermore, no attempts on enemy sovereignty were scheduled before six weeks had passed. The invasion of TPAR-G led to one of the poorest tactical maneuvers of all time, and let us proceed well ahead of schedule. The invasion of Paragon Soul four weeks later was done in high spirits and high confidence. Within two weeks the region was secured, and within three it was cleared out. Following a one week lull of operations, Band of Brothers anchored a single POS in AZN-D2 at the start of December. Capitalizing on two more mistakes, we were able to capture C9N-CC and OOYZ. Following the three failed attempts on removing us (which led to the most epic battle of the war), we laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day (weÆre naughty, not nice). The majority of Feythabolis fell before the end of the year. On Jan 1st, ASCN announced it would make its last stand in RIT after losing the majority of its corporations, assets, and territory. Following a week long blitzkrieg of Prime Orbital space where five more stations were captured, the Alamo reconsidered their options and surrendered.
In conclusion, it took four weeks to break ASCN's will to fight, three weeks to conquer Paragon Soul, and four weeks to conquer Feythabolis. War quickly degraded to POS bashing and ganks as BoB went head to head with Strontium Clathrates, but a few memorable battles were had.
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ElCoCo
KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:45:00 -
[2]
Edited by: ElCoCo on 05/01/2007 17:46:39 So what's next? edit: oops, real sorry I messed it up
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SirMolle
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:45:00 -
[3]
The Evidence Only rough statistical estimates can be offered at this moment, as the true count can only be given once all fighting has ceased. ASCN forces have suffered an estimated 2500 Battleship deaths with equivalent number of poddings, and 17,000 other ship losses for an average of roughly 200 ships downed per day. In addition, over a hundred starbases were destroyed and several attempts to spam them rendered ineffective. Throughout this entire war, we have refrained from using this tactic and deployed only as many as needed. AZN-D2 was secured with two towers (coincidence?). A tentative figure on damages inflicted to both sides in this war stands at 1.5 Trillion ISK - the bloodiest war yet. On home turf, Ascendant Frontier were unable to destroy a single capital ship, down a single starbase, recapture sovereignty, or outperform us a single day. Because of the pillaging, looting and fire sales, that figure remains very one sided.
In conclusion, the dedication and willpower of our pilots in performing the work necessary for dismantling years of foundation and resource stockpiling is unparalleled by any single group EVE. It is evidence that even sovereignty wars favour the bold, not the rich. It is evidence that tactics will always remain superior to number. It is evidence that even the biggest can fall. And it is all the evidence you need to stop whining about game mechanics.
The Witnesses For outsiders, even neutrals, this whole endeavour meant new opportunity. The fall of one Empire may have displaced thousands from their home, but it has also given thousands more a chance to make theirs. Or simply profit from it. It would be against our interests to disturb the net balance, as we firmly believe 0.0 should be populated - even by those with no interests in alliance politics and warfare. To slander our residents and allies with terms like slavery ignores the situation present in most organizations. There is no free lunch; all territorial alliances have taxation and expectation. There is less of either under BoB sovereignty, with arguably far better representation. Corporations and alliances are free to do as much of any activity they wish, without fear of constantly being judged or held accountable by their peers. No token efforts that deceive everyone involved. If you fail out here, the cycle of blame begins and ends with you. This simple segregation of interests promotes self-improvement, instead of the vicious cycle of blame.
The Verdict This concluding era in EVE lends reason only to those willing to move forward and adapt. Size and wealth alone is not power, and must not be perceived as such. One would think the phrase ôPvPers can mine, miners canÆt PvPö was born from experience. ASCN thought if they excelled in areas of industry or economics, it would excuse them from dealing with all others. ASCN thought the image of strength and unity was equivalent to the real thing. ASCN thought building a foundation of structures was more important than building one of friendships. ASCN thought peace, diplomacy and deterrence was the end game of survival.
ASCN thought wrong. If BoB is approaching Empire status, it won't be from updates to the territorial map. It won't be the amount of capital ships in our fleet, or the size of our income. It won't be the number of hardcore PvPers we steal, or iconic leaders we forge. It won't be the tricks we pull, or ones you think we will. It won't be the image we have in EVE, or the image we believe. It won't be the experiences we had in ages past, or achievements held dear.
It will be the brotherhood shared as we keep striving through no cessation of efforts to best everyone - including ourselves - in all conceivable ways.
It will be the fun we have risking everything, and showing you how its done.
Soon, the Pendulum will swing again. Tick Tock.
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XoPhyte
Vanguard Frontiers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:46:00 -
[4]
Edited by: XoPhyte on 05/01/2007 17:48:29 It was a good fight, and was a lot of fun. To bad things didn't go differently. GF Bob, I have a lot of respect for your abilities on the battlefield. Though it may not have been the best or most memorable war, it is one I am glad to have been a part of and I will always remember it.
Good luck to all the ascn pilots that gave it their all during this war. I will miss flying next to you guys on the battlefield.
--- Siggy Starts Here---
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz Most people in eve would rather win than have a good fight
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CallMe 8675309
Gallente Truth In Advertising
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:46:00 -
[5]
oh look another longwinded Sir Molle post about how awesome BoB are
Cue DB Preacher posting about how BoB are omnipotence itself and how nobody could ever possibly defeat them
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Captain Kaizoku
Deniz Mahsulleri Ofisi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:47:00 -
[6]
Will ex-ASCN become BOB pet or join d2 for revenge and combine powers?
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Stavros
Amarr Viziam
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:48:00 -
[7]
*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) --
"DANCE DANCE" |
HolographicEntrypoint
Hybrid Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:50:00 -
[8]
so say we all ---
^ Custom Sigs for ISK
My custom Sigs Gallery |
Joshua Foiritain
Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:52:00 -
[9]
Gotta love Molles (Or his press agents) writings -----
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Harisdrop
Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:52:00 -
[10]
I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance! New NPC NPC Market |
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Har Ganeth
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:53:00 -
[11]
How long did it take 39 dreads to take down the 5-4 POS in AZN? :o
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Fred0
Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:54:00 -
[12]
Congratulations to BOB! Whatever everyone else says. It was a big thing achieved without you guys breaking a sweat. Inspiring stuff indeed!
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Tyrrax Thorrk
Amarr Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:54:00 -
[13]
congrats
I see a marked reduction in Linkin Park lyrics in this press release !
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Rennard
Janissaries
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:54:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Captain Kaizoku Will ex-ASCN become BOB pet or join d2 for revenge and combine powers?
+1
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
...Not playing EvE at the moment, currently hibernating and forum whoring... |
EL TITAN
Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:56:00 -
[15]
Good post Molle.
I just wanted to say good fun to ascn, some of you really layed down everything on the battlefield and made things fun.
o\
_________________________________________________ <3 hi |
Shrike
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:57:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Har Ganeth How long did it take 39 dreads to take down the 5-4 POS in AZN? :o
16 hardners, Minmatar... in one word.. WAY TO EFFING LONG!
[center] |
Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 17:59:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Shrike
Originally by: Har Ganeth How long did it take 39 dreads to take down the 5-4 POS in AZN? :o
16 hardners, Minmatar... in one word.. WAY TO EFFING LONG!
I endorse this statement. ....
Real men use blasters |
Crucifier
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:02:00 -
[18]
First page in a bob thread, im getting better ------
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Arrgs
Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:03:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Arrgs on 05/01/2007 18:13:21 Reguardless of what side you take in this game downing ASCN is something you can't deny or take away from BoB.
Congratulations.
My first video!
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Sgt Blade
Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:05:00 -
[20]
dam thats alot of losses well done bob Hypnotic Pelvic Thrusting Level 5 |
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Atreus Minmatarius
Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:06:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Atreus Minmatarius on 05/01/2007 18:06:23
Originally by: SirMolle . We claim, and no one can dispute, a full and complete victory.
Hey, I've heard that one before... It was from a guy that stood before a banner that said "Mission Acomplished", on a ship .. might not have been a spaceship but still. Too many similarities, is it deja vu? I do believe his victory was kinda disputed, we see what happens with yours...
and yes me too, i'm in a boob thread
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SK Rooster
Team Americas Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:06:00 -
[22]
Well as much as everyone smacks you guys I must say if things went down the way you say that is amazing. Keep up the good work and keep those alliances on their toes :D
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Electric Cucumber
Amarr coracao ardente Sani Khal'Vecna
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:06:00 -
[23]
more wars now please
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TrippyX
Caldari The Syndicate Inc
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:08:00 -
[24]
Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
Anyways, war was fun for most of it.. got boring towards the end for me personally. And as far as I can tell RIT-A7 is still under ASCN sovereignty so BoB isn't completly done yet
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NTRabbit
Caldari Guiding Hand Social Club
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:08:00 -
[25]
Fascinating.
------
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Arrgs
Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:09:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Arrgs on 05/01/2007 18:10:22
Originally by: Atreus Minmatarius Dribble
The diffrence between Iraq and ASCN is the terrorist can still uses various houses (stations) in Iraq (ASCN regions).
My first video!
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Ikvar
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:11:00 -
[27]
However many people post derogatory comments about BOB in this or any other threads, they can't deny that no one consistently (or every arguably) pull out the results or show the skill, teamwork and dedication that BOB do. People may claim that 'BOB only have 3 good pilots' when they gank a lone NPCer in Delve or whatever but when BOB do something as a whole, their opponents get dead real quick.
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
Originally by: Rekindle I was in an empire system when they used their grief tactics to explode everything I own.
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Righteous Fury
Slacker Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:12:00 -
[28]
An impressive performance, as always. Nice write up.
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Ritchler
Gallente EliteCCP.Com
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:12:00 -
[29]
Originally by: CallMe 8675309 oh look another longwinded Sir Molle post about how awesome BoB are
Cue DB Preacher posting about how BoB are omnipotence itself and how nobody could ever possibly defeat them
Oh look, another ASCN member who doesn't have the balls to use his main
omgosh
pwnt
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Soulis
Slacker Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:14:00 -
[30]
good post.
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Lyn Bunnions
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:14:00 -
[31]
*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
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Nez Perces
Amarr Black Spot.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:14:00 -
[32]
Yep GJ BoB, very impressive campaign. Very nice writeup too.
One question remains though.... when is Gonadsak's "last stand" video out?
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CallMe 8675309
Gallente Truth In Advertising
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:15:00 -
[33]
Edited by: CallMe 8675309 on 05/01/2007 18:16:23
Originally by: Ikvar However many people post derogatory comments about BOB in this or any other threads, they can't deny that no one consistently (or every arguably) pull out the results or show the skill, teamwork and dedication that BOB do.
Sure we can. Red Alliance. GoonSwarm. AAA. BoB pick on isolated alliances like everybody else. The only thing that makes them "special" is the incredible amounts of propaganda spewed out on the forums by their leaders, plus the number of slav- I mean pets who buy into the myth that BoB can protect them from the rest of the universe when they're attacked. I think they're in for a pretty rude awakening when BoB are supposed to be protecting FORTY different stations throughout their regions when their leadership has alienated the rest of the game with its bluster.
Well, outside their mercenary pets in MC and their conquered vassals in FIX.
Edit: Oh and can't forget the slavering desperates in LV who will doubtlessly ally with BoB to save their own skin from the Russians soon enough, too.
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xXBeatnikXx
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:19:00 -
[34]
Respect to the few ASCN that stood out to me in Combat (mostly just at the secound half when there were less then 50 of them):
Zungen Daskingtiger
And to all the rest out there that fought, won and lost. I didn't always keep my ship, but I sure took a lot of yours.
GF and may those that deserve it find your way into our fold. There were some great fights, and some great fighters from time to time in the last 4 monthes.
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:22:00 -
[35]
Very impressive work. It went much more quickly and easily than I had thought possible.
It will take a staggering amount of willpower and military force to beat Band of Brothers in a war. Willpower is the key though. One wonders if such exists among those who array themselves against you guys. I fervently hope so, but I do have my doubts.
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Dianabolic
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:23:00 -
[36]
Originally by: CallMe 8675309 ...protecting FORTY different stations
If we didn't have a plan already in place to do exactly that then we wouldn't have even started.
Come take a few off of us, see how long you keep them - and see how much you lose taking them.
Quote: 2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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CallMe 8675309
Gallente Truth In Advertising
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:25:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Dianabolic
Originally by: CallMe 8675309 ...protecting FORTY different stations
If we didn't have a plan already in place to do exactly that then we wouldn't have even started.
Come take a few off of us, see how long you keep them - and see how much you lose taking them.
Hang on, let me get your resident forum hacker to post your Master Plan
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Amthrianius
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:25:00 -
[38]
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems ---------------
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Snow Monkey
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:26:00 -
[39]
Love them or Loathe them, you can't help but admire the fight they brought.
I look forward to seeing where the pendulum swings next.
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Ultrabug
Morne Attitude
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:33:00 -
[40]
Good job brothers.
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Ritchler
Gallente EliteCCP.Com
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:33:00 -
[41]
Originally by: CallMe 8675309 Edited by: CallMe 8675309 on 05/01/2007 18:16:23
Originally by: Ikvar However many people post derogatory comments about BOB in this or any other threads, they can't deny that no one consistently (or every arguably) pull out the results or show the skill, teamwork and dedication that BOB do.
Sure we can. Red Alliance. GoonSwarm. AAA. BoB pick on isolated alliances like everybody else. The only thing that makes them "special" is the incredible amounts of propaganda spewed out on the forums by their leaders, plus the number of slav- I mean pets who buy into the myth that BoB can protect them from the rest of the universe when they're attacked. I think they're in for a pretty rude awakening when BoB are supposed to be protecting FORTY different stations throughout their regions when their leadership has alienated the rest of the game with its bluster.
Well, outside their mercenary pets in MC and their conquered vassals in FIX.
Edit: Oh and can't forget the slavering desperates in LV who will doubtlessly ally with BoB to save their own skin from the Russians soon enough, too.
Hmm where to start
Fix are not *conquered* Mc Are Not BOb Slaves
ASCN was CERTAINLY NOT osolated, AAA hit Axiom, who again was not isolated and had plenty of allies
You have no idea wtf you are on about or what the hell is going on. I suggest you shut up before i embarass you further
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Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:38:00 -
[42]
I'm hoping that you are just a random alt who's stolen a BoB sig. If this is not the case, and you are a BoB pilot, shame on you. You'd better hope I don't find out who you are. Post with your main sir, or not at all. ....
Real men use blasters |
Seleene
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:43:00 -
[43]
Congrats to Band of Brothers. Dianabolic is going to need a secretary soon I imagine... -
Vid - 'Images of War' |
Helganstandt
Finis Lumen
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:43:00 -
[44]
This war, while interesting to read about, has really depressed me about the state of EVE. It's hard to measure exactly how dissappointed I am that this didn't turn into a stalemate. And the reason is, I wanted BoB to be taken down a notch off of their high horse. But now this gives them more justification than ever to be on one. After reading about the goonswarm "war", I considered them to be nothing more than your average schoolyard bully and I eagerly awaited the day when they bit off more than they could chew.
But that didn't happen.
I fully admit I have no rational reason for disliking BoB other than I like rooting for the underdogs, and I dislike elitism. I like seeing big names and big teams in the height of their greatness being destroyed, as it gives me some small satisfaction. There's just something about forcing those on a high horse to have some humility that makes me smile. And I still want to feel as though something can take them down...It's just looking less and less plausible.
So all that being said, I do have a new respect for BoB. They took down the monster of the South single-handedly and no one can take that away from them. I never liked ASCN either, so I guess it was a win-win war. You'll have to excuse me though if I still root for a large coalition of forces to eventually end the Band of Brothers legacy. You can't be on top forever....right?
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Puke Skystalker
Minmatar The Mystical Order
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:43:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Ritchler
Fix are not *conquered*
No they're just good dogs who roll over when you throw them a bone or some left over scraps. Pet them know and again and their harmless.
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Der Pfaffe
KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:44:00 -
[46]
A good read. It will be interesting to see which way the steamroller turns next.
On a side note, those complaining of BOB propaganda need to wake up. It's all part of warfare. Addressing your enemy's rank and file and sewing seeds of doubt in thier leaders' abilities and motives is a classic example.
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Ange1
Gallente The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:45:00 -
[47]
Congratualtions BoB. In all my time, I don't think I've seen such a total demolishing of a super power, even back in the days of CA.
I have a question though, BoB did lose a Carrier to The Establishment when we were working for ASCN. I'm not sure if you count Merc kills against you at all or you were just counting direct ASCN kills (as you state not a single Capital was lost). Just curious.
The Establishment is at your service...
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Dark Horseman
The Older Gamers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:46:00 -
[48]
Definetly had a long hard fight for both sides. Many ASCN pilots made a good showing of themselves in combat and dedication. I have nothing but good things to say about my comrades as well as our opponents. Fly your colors with pride ASCN.
Dark Horseman> My CEO said he'd give me the "Covert Ops Service Medal". Only problem is no one can see it. |
Dianabolic
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:47:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Ange1 Congratualtions BoB. In all my time, I don't think I've seen such a total demolishing of a super power, even back in the days of CA.
I have a question though, BoB did lose a Carrier to The Establishment when we were working for ASCN. I'm not sure if you count Merc kills against you at all or you were just counting direct ASCN kills (as you state not a single Capital was lost). Just curious.
I think we lost one to CELES in that time period, aswell.
I'm not too sure if we have included merc losses (in the great scheme of it they are negligible) but for sake of accuracy I shall find out :)
Quote: 2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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Davlin Lotze
Raging Destruction
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:54:00 -
[50]
Credit is due obviously. Displacing ASCN from Feyth wasn't something that alot thought would be as easy as you made it seem. Well played.
But what I don't get still is why you cheapen your efforts and accomplishments with the Burn Eden-eqse forum spying and the other forms of out-of-game inflitration??? It just makes you look "low rent."
And with the rot from within that was the case with ASCN, the out of game stuff was even more unnecessary. Hell, just find any number of disgruntled current or former ASCN at the outset of this operation and utilize them.
The point here is two-fold, one to congratulate real accomplishment and two, to ask why turnaround and cheap it with stuff that's unnecessary? Wouldn't you come off as even more of a "eve juggernaut" if you eschewed the out of game crap and not inflitrate official alliance forums, TS, etc?
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Dominie Dirtch
Minmatar Revival.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:59:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more. _________ My voice shall tear you asunder and show your vile ways. |
Nuagni
Dark-Rising Fallen Souls
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:59:00 -
[52]
Originally by: xXBeatnikXx Respect to the few ASCN that stood out to me in Combat (mostly just at the secound half when there were less then 50 of them):
Zungen Daskingtiger
And to all the rest out there that fought, won and lost. I didn't always keep my ship, but I sure took a lot of yours.
GF and may those that deserve it find your way into our fold. There were some great fights, and some great fighters from time to time in the last 4 monthes.
That Zungen is something else.
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TRIGGER
Rampage Eternal
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Posted - 2007.01.05 18:59:00 -
[53]
Good one bish May your pendulum swing again .
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:01:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Helganstandt This war, while interesting to read about, has really depressed me about the state of EVE. It's hard to measure exactly how dissappointed I am that this didn't turn into a stalemate. And the reason is, I wanted BoB to be taken down a notch off of their high horse. But now this gives them more justification than ever to be on one. After reading about the goonswarm "war", I considered them to be nothing more than your average schoolyard bully and I eagerly awaited the day when they bit off more than they could chew.
But that didn't happen.
I fully admit I have no rational reason for disliking BoB other than I like rooting for the underdogs, and I dislike elitism. I like seeing big names and big teams in the height of their greatness being destroyed, as it gives me some small satisfaction. There's just something about forcing those on a high horse to have some humility that makes me smile. And I still want to feel as though something can take them down...It's just looking less and less plausible.
So all that being said, I do have a new respect for BoB. They took down the monster of the South single-handedly and no one can take that away from them. I never liked ASCN either, so I guess it was a win-win war. You'll have to excuse me though if I still root for a large coalition of forces to eventually end the Band of Brothers legacy. You can't be on top forever....right?
No excusing necessary, you're free to cheer for anyone you like.
But in this war, BoB was initially outnumbered 4:1 (compare 100-150 in alliance chat to 400-500). Had ASCN pulled together in a proper manner, we would have struggled to find victory for many, many months. Its almost ridiculous to give them underdog status simply of their ignorance, when they had the pilots and resources to do anything. This is why few forces felt the need to jump and assist ASCN in their time of need. They were content in watching us dismantle a bigger force for the same reasons you cite here.
If a coalition of alliances comes to collectively assault our space, it will give us underdog status once more. When that happens, the coalition had better do the job right. Winning fights and taking our space might bring the humility you seek. But if we end up retaking it all and kicking the crap out of every invader, one by one, the dominance BoB has in EVE will never be in doubt ever again. Maybe I've said too much..
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Electric Cucumber
Amarr coracao ardente Sani Khal'Vecna
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:01:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Electric Cucumber on 05/01/2007 19:02:09
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
They always say that , what your implying is that if BOB hadn't attacked, ASCN would still have lost their space and members to internal problems?
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David H'Levi
Sniggerdly
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:03:00 -
[56]
Good work. Now get working on D2.
--ISS Shareholder
We Recruit! |
SlasherD
Gallente Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:04:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
Lol, Still waiting for my evemail to flash
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Herculite
Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:04:00 -
[58]
I think most of us who knew both parties involved knew this outcome was innevitable once the war was clearly a war with conquest in mind, though I dont' think anyone predicted it would be executed almost flawlessly.
Still it took some brass balls to risk such a war, which is something I don't think most people realize. ASCN was the biggest richest alliance in EvE when this started, not BoB, and on paper it should have been BoB who was worried.
Thanks for keeping EvE interesting
(And yes I know this brands me as a BoB fanboi but come on, credit is due where it is due.)
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Hardin
Amarr Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:06:00 -
[59]
Is BoB off to play Pirates of The Burning Sea Now?
------------------------------ AMARR VICTOR |
Darko1107
Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:07:00 -
[60]
Steamrollered.
Praise where it is due, well done, you guys did a good job.
------------------
Sig removed, please keep it under the 24,000 byte limit, if you have any questions please email [email protected] - Xorus |
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Zagum Darkfin
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:07:00 -
[61]
I like to thank all our alliance leaders for their hard work in planning, organizing, and executing this war. Good work everyone!!
/me go back to shooting pos guns.
In response to the person complaining about spies, I will say its part of the game, deal with it.
One word of advice to the other alliances, be honest with your members. If you lie, you will be found out.
Cheers,
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:09:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Davlin Lotze Credit is due obviously. Displacing ASCN from Feyth wasn't something that alot thought would be as easy as you made it seem. Well played.
But what I don't get still is why you cheapen your efforts and accomplishments with the Burn Eden-eqse forum spying and the other forms of out-of-game inflitration??? It just makes you look "low rent."
And with the rot from within that was the case with ASCN, the out of game stuff was even more unnecessary. Hell, just find any number of disgruntled current or former ASCN at the outset of this operation and utilize them.
The point here is two-fold, one to congratulate real accomplishment and two, to ask why turnaround and cheap it with stuff that's unnecessary? Wouldn't you come off as even more of a "eve juggernaut" if you eschewed the out of game crap and not inflitrate official alliance forums, TS, etc?
You think it cheapened the war, I claim otherwise. The spying was not necessary to win battles, but it allowed us to show EVE a massive discrepancy between ASCN's public and private personas. In private, BoB was the devil. In public, false respects and various other forms of pandering were shown.
Had ASCN refrained from making such posts in private, we would not have felt the need to expose and refute them in public. Had they not become so upset over the concept of spying, and accused its legitimacy in EVE, we would not have felt the need to continue doing it.
In the end, it was entertainment at their expense. Didn't have to be that way, but that will be a lesson to inherit.
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Nira Li
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:09:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Dominie Dirtch
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more.
Ofc, it was ONLY internal problems *cough* *cough*
Thx for the war ASCN.
You Will Cry My Name
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Exelsior
Colossus Enterprises
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:10:00 -
[64]
Edited by: Exelsior on 05/01/2007 19:10:53 Nice post, even if it was propoganda.
Now what would really be cool is if you go ahead and fight RA or AAA or someone who has integrity and don't give up. But I guess your next trip is back to fountain for clearing?
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Nostradamu
Clandestia
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:10:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Herculite ASCN was the biggest richest alliance in EvE when this started, not BoB, and on paper it should have been BoB who was worried.
I keep on hearing this but it's not strictly true, the riches were not shared out and the entire "alliance" was not rich per-se, look closely to what the corps do in the future to see where the riches were and still are.
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Davlin Lotze
Raging Destruction
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:12:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Zagum Darkfin
In response to the person complaining about spies, I will say its part of the game, deal with it.
Are you saying "deal with it" as in you did it "because you could?" Or something different?
Doing things "because they could" is part of what rotted ASCN from the inside. And, to borrow from an out of game example, it's why Bill Clinton availed himself of the opportunity to get a blow job in the white house. Few sensible will think better of him because of that, correct? Instead they think of his as a disgrace.
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:12:00 -
[67]
Very good post and very well done.
& LOL @ stavros getting pwned by the mods.
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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Pesadel0
Vagabundos THE H0RDE
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:13:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Darko1107 Steamrollered.
Praise where it is due, well done, you guys did a good job.
Indeed it was a good war ,drama,hate,blood, humiliation,spying.Brave acts,suicide runs :D.
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Kin Hanyerec
TunDraGon
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:14:00 -
[69]
Good job ;)
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:14:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Hardin Is BoB off to play Pirates of The Burning Sea Now?
Temporary solution: -fill feyth with seawater -add 2x more gasoline than you have added water -1 tiny little match -POTBF
-------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
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Benny Hill
Caldari Deceased Inc
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:19:00 -
[71]
Originally by: SirMolle The Evidence
The Witnesses For outsiders, even neutrals, this whole endeavour meant new opportunity. The fall of one Empire may have displaced thousands from their home, but it has also given thousands more a chance to make theirs. Or simply profit from it. It would be against our interests to disturb the net balance, as we firmly believe 0.0 should be populated - even by those with no interests in alliance politics and warfare. To slander our residents and allies with terms like slavery ignores the situation present in most organizations.
The whole endeavour to many witnesses, shows that BoB cannot be trusted, and that it will turn stick a knife in any of its friends and allies. Calling BoB allies or friends slaves would be inaccuate. Calling them stupid would be accurate, because BoB will turn on them like they did ASCN.
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:25:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Benny Hill
The whole endeavour to many witnesses, shows that BoB cannot be trusted, and that it will turn stick a knife in any of its friends and allies. Calling BoB allies or friends slaves would be inaccuate. Calling them stupid would be accurate, because BoB will turn on them like they did ASCN.
[Here goes the complete opposite of everything written above.]
Now what?
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Celticjim
Minmatar The Shadow Order Storm Armada
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:25:00 -
[73]
Just a clarification. This line
"...laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day"
Did you folks actually attack something on Christmas Day?
This isn't a value loaded question, just trying to think some stuff through.
CJ
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Gabba
Species 5618
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:26:00 -
[74]
"No requests to allies made" im not too sure about that. ASCN was occupied by ASCN only, 4800 i doubt it but sure why not, now go see who lives in BoB space and add them all up, add to that the people that moved into Paragon Soul 1 week after GQ2 and H8 fell.
ASCN deserved what it got, but no help, i like to disagree on that
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:27:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Celticjim Just a clarification. This line
"...laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day"
Did you folks actually attack something on Christmas Day?
This isn't a value loaded question, just trying to think some stuff through.
CJ
Yes. Despite popular belief, more people play during the holidays, not less.
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Davlin Lotze
Raging Destruction
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Posted - 2007.01.05 19:27:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Davlin Lotze on 05/01/2007 19:27:39
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Originally by: Davlin Lotze Credit is due obviously. Displacing ASCN from Feyth wasn't something that alot thought would be as easy as you made it seem. Well played.
But what I don't get still is why you cheapen your efforts and accomplishments with the Burn Eden-eqse forum spying and the other forms of out-of-game inflitration??? It just makes you look "low rent."
And with the rot from within that was the case with ASCN, the out of game stuff was even more unnecessary. Hell, just find any number of disgruntled current or former ASCN at the outset of this operation and utilize them.
The point here is two-fold, one to congratulate real accomplishment and two, to ask why turnaround and cheap it with stuff that's unnecessary? Wouldn't you come off as even more of a "eve juggernaut" if you eschewed the out of game crap and not inflitrate official alliance forums, TS, etc?
You think it cheapened the war, I claim otherwise. The spying was not necessary to win battles, but it allowed us to show EVE a massive discrepancy between ASCN's public and private personas. In private, BoB was the devil. In public, false respects and various other forms of pandering were shown.
Had ASCN refrained from making such posts in private, we would not have felt the need to expose and refute them in public. Had they not become so upset over the concept of spying, and accused its legitimacy in EVE, we would not have felt the need to continue doing it.
In the end, it was entertainment at their expense. Didn't have to be that way, but that will be a lesson to inherit.
You may have a point, but what you are not seeing is that there is a cost, tolled against your reputation, for EVEN LOOKING IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And my point is that objectively speaking you have alot to show other alliances in terms of how to maintain an internally strong organization.
Some of that gets lost or is contradicted by under the table, out of game, crap. "Just say no" and don't indulge in that "entertainment." The rotten will rot and fall before you irregardless!
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Tholarim
Amarr Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:29:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Dominie Dirtch How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more.
Actually Aneu,
CA died becus of you trying to join atuk in the first place.
oh the irony.
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Dominie Dirtch
Minmatar Revival.
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:31:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Tholarim
Originally by: Dominie Dirtch How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more.
Actually Aneu,
CA died becus of you trying to join atuk in the first place.
oh the irony.
Just because I'm in the same corp doesn't make me someone, im sure you will see RVV's member count go up quite a bit in the next few weeks. _________ My voice shall tear you asunder and show your vile ways. |
Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:31:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Gabba "No requests to allies made" im not too sure about that. ASCN was occupied by ASCN only, 4800 i doubt it but sure why not, now go see who lives in BoB space and add them all up, add to that the people that moved into Paragon Soul 1 week after GQ2 and H8 fell.
ASCN deserved what it got, but no help, i like to disagree on that
Residents moving in to profit from your fallen territories minutes after they become available does not constitute assistance in war. Even without a token population of NPCers and miners, it was our starbases and your inability to field dreadnaughts which prevented ASCN from retaking them.
You can disagree all you want, but you'd be wrong.
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Celticjim
Minmatar The Shadow Order Storm Armada
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:32:00 -
[80]
Edited by: Celticjim on 05/01/2007 19:32:37
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Originally by: Celticjim Just a clarification. This line
"...laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day"
Did you folks actually attack something on Christmas Day?
This isn't a value loaded question, just trying to think some stuff through.
CJ
Yes. Despite popular belief, more people play during the holidays, not less.
I would agree with you on all days except Christmas day. Unfortunately I can't find the tracker link to check. Regardless, thanks for the response
CJ
(edit - sentence clarification)
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|
Ephemeral Waves
The Nine Gates Executive Outcomes
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:34:00 -
[81]
Originally by: xXBeatnikXx
Daskingtiger
I wasn't involved in the BoB/ASCN fighting but I saw this guy around enough. He was on the KB in every major engagement (usually several times) and kept going back for more regardless. He cruised through our area a couple of times and though he didn't survive the bubbles he put up a good fight and was a good sport about it.
Eph.
Kill Board | Recruiting
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Helganstandt
Finis Lumen
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:35:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
No excusing necessary, you're free to cheer for anyone you like.
But in this war, BoB was initially outnumbered 4:1 (compare 100-150 in alliance chat to 400-500). Had ASCN pulled together in a proper manner, we would have struggled to find victory for many, many months. Its almost ridiculous to give them underdog status simply of their ignorance, when they had the pilots and resources to do anything. This is why few forces felt the need to jump and assist ASCN in their time of need. They were content in watching us dismantle a bigger force for the same reasons you cite here.
If a coalition of alliances comes to collectively assault our space, it will give us underdog status once more. When that happens, the coalition had better do the job right. Winning fights and taking our space might bring the humility you seek. But if we end up retaking it all and kicking the crap out of every invader, one by one, the dominance BoB has in EVE will never be in doubt ever again. Maybe I've said too much..
I wasn't necessarily refering to ASCN as being the underdogs in this particular conflict. I thought you two were fairly evenly matched, hence my dissapointment (can't get dissapointed if an underdog loses really). I was mainly refering to the goonswarm conflict, where I gained my dislike of BoB. You only become an underdog (in my opinion anyway) when you've been beaten and keep coming back for more. Redswarm will be the underdogs for instance when you guys finally clash skulls.
If a coalition comes to kill you, it's more that you're getting what you deserve (again, in my opinion, even if my opinions are irrational) than being underdogs that I can root for. Same as if ASCN had beaten you.
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 19:39:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Davlin Lotze
You may have a point, but what you are not seeing is that there is a cost, tolled against your reputation, for EVEN LOOKING IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And my point is that objectively speaking you have alot to show other alliances in terms of how to maintain an internally strong organization.
Some of that gets lost or is contradicted by under the table, out of game, crap. "Just say no" and don't indulge in that "entertainment." The rotten will rot and fall before you irregardless!
Tolled against our reputation.. really? BoB is a war machine, we make it our business to know everything about our enemies. Good and bad. Then exploit it to the fullest. I take immense pride in the exposure of internal ASCN delusions throughtout this war. For once, in my morally defficient career of infiltration, it was the right thing to do. If you and others don't feel that way, its not our reputation it tolls.
And you're a funny person to assume the monitoring of forums and voice comms through normal means is any less out of character than having them in the first place. You can't proclaim it to be metagaming or cheating only when it suits you. What excuses will be made when both are integrated into the client? You don't want to discuss this here, and now. It lacked merit the last fifty times the subject arose, today will be no different.
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Mahrin Skel
Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:04:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Celticjim Just a clarification. This line
"...laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day"
Did you folks actually attack something on Christmas Day?
This isn't a value loaded question, just trying to think some stuff through.
CJ
When BoB attacked before Christmas, ASCN chose to set all of their POS to come out of reinforced within an hour of each other, just before DT Christmas Day. Presumably this was intended to take advantage of the difficulties of mounting a POS assault against so many POS in such a short period of time. However, BoB maintained a complete lockdown on the system, and ASCN was apparently unable to coordinate a capital hauling operation of sufficient scale to refill the towers with Strontium, with the result that all towers fell that day.
Throughout the war, ASCN consistantly underperformed militarily. Had they been able to maintain a K/D ratio of at least 1 to 3 (losing no more than three ships for each BoB ship they killed) it would have been an entirely different war. But at every major battle, BoB trounced them soundly, leaving the ASCN strategic goals unmet and putting a strain on logistics not even ASCN could overcome.
Strategically, they made some good moves, or at least the start of them. Choosing to take the battle to BoB was a good move, and making Fountain, Pure Blind, and Delve unhospitable to renters certainly had to have cost BoB considerable amounts of income. But trying to use an "island hopping" strategy from the viewpoint of capital ships (using logged-off cyno generator alts to get to PB and Delve) often turned around and bit them, the sheer amount of materiel that had to be moved meant that the movements were often noticed, and the cyno-net was broken at least three times in mid-operation.
Backing Celestial Apocalypse against Xelas in PNQ could have been a brilliant maneuver, except for two problems: It was too far from ASCN space to be taken seriously by BoB as a threat in comparison to the NPC stations in the same region, so it didn't draw BoB into a two-front war, and Celestial Apocalypse had no interest in the placing and maintenance of sufficient POS to secure the system and prevent Xelas from taking it back on their own. So ASCN was fighting a two-front war while BoB was only fighting one, and Paragon Soul fell as a result.
Losing the Titan and subsequently Cyvok seemed to break ASCN. Shortly afterwards, *large* Zydrine and Megacyte sell orders started going up all over Empire, driving the price of both minerals down to an extreme degree. In light of events as they have been related since, it's clear that what may have started as an effort to gain ISK to replace the Avatar and buy more ships soon turned into wholesale looting of the ASCN treasury. Defensive operations became strictly pro-forma, with no real hope of success, and those that heeded the high command's exhortations to keep fighting were merely pawns buying time for the looting.
The lesson of the ASCN/BoB war is that although money may be the sinews of war, without the muscle, bone, and brain to put it to effective use, it cannot win wars. Wars are contests of *will*, and you cannot simply buy determination.
--Dave
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Vince Draken
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:04:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Vince Draken on 05/01/2007 20:04:51
Originally by: Dominie Dirtch
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more.
hi aneu
p.s. save your breath trying to convince anyone that this isn't your latest lame forum alt. Nine day old character with your writing style, who somehow knows about history of two years ago despite playing for nine days. Plus, if your member count goes up, I expect it to be in triplicates.
The above thoughts and statements are IC and should be taken as such. |
Saladin
Minmatar V I R I I Center for Disease Creation
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:07:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
Corrected it for you. Bob was not there for most of the CA wars, and it definitely was not there at the end. ----
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Liu Kaskakka
PAK Shroud Of Darkness
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:08:00 -
[87]
gj
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Will Fireblade
Maza Nostra Euphoria Unleashed
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:11:00 -
[88]
Originally by: SirMolle
Soon, the Pendulum will swing again. Tick Tock.
Hopefully for someone who is worth it not some mining alliance with a few fighters in it.. So yeah if you ask me no big accomplisment there anyone with the logistics and firepower you have could do that. In the end like you said it was another POS war.
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:13:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Originally by: Davlin Lotze
You may have a point, but what you are not seeing is that there is a cost, tolled against your reputation, for EVEN LOOKING IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And my point is that objectively speaking you have alot to show other alliances in terms of how to maintain an internally strong organization.
Some of that gets lost or is contradicted by under the table, out of game, crap. "Just say no" and don't indulge in that "entertainment." The rotten will rot and fall before you irregardless!
Tolled against our reputation.. really? BoB is a war machine, we make it our business to know everything about our enemies. Good and bad. Then exploit it to the fullest. I take immense pride in the exposure of internal ASCN delusions throughtout this war. For once, in my morally defficient career of infiltration, it was the right thing to do. If you and others don't feel that way, its not our reputation it tolls.
And you're a funny person to assume the monitoring of forums and voice comms through normal means is any less out of character than having them in the first place. You can't proclaim it to be metagaming or cheating only when it suits you. What excuses will be made when both are integrated into the client? You don't want to discuss this here, and now. It lacked merit the last fifty times the subject arose, today will be no different.
The reason why most people don't like the fact that BoB spied and posted private forums is that the reason it was done was to HUMILATE ASCN. You even said it yourself. It was Pure Entertainment. Whats even funnier is watching all the /respect from BoB after Gungkiller posted the surrender. Why say one thing when your actions during the war were completely the opposite?
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Moostang
Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier
|
Posted - 2007.01.05 20:19:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
BoB was initially outnumbered 4:1 (compare 100-150 in alliance chat to 400-500). Had ASCN pulled together in a proper manner, we would have struggled to find victory for many, many months.
First of all, Props to BOB, you did what had to and got the job done. The following are my views and opinions as the war started and progressed.
In the begging we were of high spirits and it was easy to get 200+ gangs going to combat Bob. However, everytime I was in a gang of that magnitude we were not able to fight because nodes would crash before I could see any hostiles. For me, this was my biggest discouragement throughout the entire war. (The titan loss was nothing to me. It wasnt utilized like it should have been anyway.) It's pointless to constantly use our strength (our numbers) if we couldnt really use them due to node crashes. "All Hands" call would go out and i'd constantly here "what's the point, node cant handle all of us anyway", which is true, at least for everytime I participated in large gang engagements. I would have gladly continued to fight on a daily basis if the server stability could handle it, but it cant. I can goto Jita and see 800 people in system only to experience mid-ranged lag yet we couldnt field 150+ people in any 0.0 system without the node crashing....it got old...quick. Lag was never a problem for me, just node crashes.
I'd have to say that the most fun I had was in my t1 frig with 5 fighters assigned, along with the other frig pilots and eleventy billion fighters. It was a blast to take H8 station back with only a clusterfudge of fighters (i have a nice screen shot of that).
We had anticipated the Bob attack months in advance (heard about it for that long atleast). We prepared our industrial arses by setting up outposts so that when constellation sovernty came out it would protect us. This of course was postponed by CCP which threw our defense out the window.
From my point of view there is very little to balance the differences of a hard-core pvp alliance such as BOB vs a super-industrial alliance such as ASCN. Before Kali, our t1 fitted bs fleets were obviously no match for Bob's superior t2 fitted sniping bs's. Post Kali t2 nerfs helped but I think our motivation was already dead by then, especially with const. sov. postponed.
It was very sad that BoB, half our size, could field such a large dread fleet, yet the most I ever saw of ours was 7.
Good fight BoB. You've earned your prize.
[CLS] Moostang Celestial Horizon "G" Spot Division Ascendant Frontier |
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Gabba
Species 5618
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:26:00 -
[91]
"Whether or not someone is mining in the next day has zero effect on the war" then why not move all your miners into the BoB alliance, my whole point was that your industrial base is not integrated into your alliance. Many in ASCN didnt want/refuse to fight, their argument was that they would build ships and supply mods etc etc, wether they contributed or not is besides the point. whats important is, they where inside ASCN with the corp ticker next to their name. BoB pets contribute to your war machine in very much the same way, they pay rent and mineral taxes. They contribute to your war effort, wether they fly the BoB ticker or not.
I agree on pretty much everything else SirMolle said, i just dont agree with the 4800 ASCN vs 900 or so BoB statement i kept seeing.
We can keep going at this all day, but ill end with this, during WWII did the people that build the sherman tanks contribute to beating the axis or not?
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Davlin Lotze
Raging Destruction
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:27:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Originally by: Davlin Lotze
You may have a point, but what you are not seeing is that there is a cost, tolled against your reputation, for EVEN LOOKING IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And my point is that objectively speaking you have alot to show other alliances in terms of how to maintain an internally strong organization.
Some of that gets lost or is contradicted by under the table, out of game, crap. "Just say no" and don't indulge in that "entertainment." The rotten will rot and fall before you irregardless!
Tolled against our reputation.. really? BoB is a war machine, we make it our business to know everything about our enemies. Good and bad. Then exploit it to the fullest. I take immense pride in the exposure of internal ASCN delusions throughtout this war. For once, in my morally defficient career of infiltration, it was the right thing to do. If you and others don't feel that way, its not our reputation it tolls.
Well, are you a war machine OR an infiltration society? I would submit that your rep rises with one choice and falls demonstrably with the other. You know, the average Eve person might think the Evol creedo of "just when you thought you were winning" is kind of cool if it means that irregardless Evol will run the table on you when it comes to pvp.
But if infiltration is your shining area of excellence then you won't come out nearly as well thought of by the Eve public who, whilst condemning the victims of the GHSC's heist for being stupid, still see the activity that they perpetrated as scumbag villany.
Choose wisely :) How do you wish to be known?
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Resipsa Loquitor
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:29:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Ma'kai Whats even funnier is watching all the /respect from BoB after Gungkiller posted the surrender. Why say one thing when your actions during the war were completely the opposite?
Easy: because there is no more war.
I liken it to boxing: During the build up and the fight, you try to kill one another and destroy completely. You threaten, you nash teeth, you spit, you pose. The fight occurs and all out hell follows. After the fight, there is no reason to feel or act that way anymore. It is over. The most important aspect that, even though there is a victor selected, is that both sides worked very hard to get there and shared a common experience and emotion for the game. That's why you'll see most of the fighters congratulating each other, even after one takes a crushing loss.
It's the difference between being a professional and not. The war is (mostly) concluded. We are professional. We pay and paid our respects when deserved.
Plus, really, what does it gain at this point? Nothing. Professionals don't waste effort. --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC! |
Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:34:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor
Originally by: Ma'kai Whats even funnier is watching all the /respect from BoB after Gungkiller posted the surrender. Why say one thing when your actions during the war were completely the opposite?
Easy: because there is no more war.
I liken it to boxing: During the build up and the fight, you try to kill one another and destroy completely. You threaten, you nash teeth, you spit, you pose. The fight occurs and all out hell follows. After the fight, there is no reason to feel or act that way anymore. It is over. The most important aspect that, even though there is a victor selected, is that both sides worked very hard to get there and shared a common experience and emotion for the game. That's why you'll see most of the fighters congratulating each other, even after one takes a crushing loss.
It's the difference between being a professional and not. The war is (mostly) concluded. We are professional. We pay and paid our respects when deserved.
Plus, really, what does it gain at this point? Nothing. Professionals don't waste effort.
If I remember, there are rules in boxing. What you did would be considered hitting below the belt.
Heres an appropiate analogy. Last week I played someone in a card game for money. He got up and went to the bathroom in the middle of a hand. Now, a good sportsman wouldn't have picked up his cards and looked at them, even if they were now "available public knowledge". Even if you did pick them up, you then proceeded to announce what a poor hand he had to everyone in the room. Like what you did on eve-o. Thats poor sportsmanship.
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Dark Shikari
Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:35:00 -
[95]
And thus ends this age... the Great Southern War is over.
The question is... where does the pendulum tick next? Perhaps it will swing the other way.
-[23] Member-
Listen to EVE-Trance Radio! (DSTrance channel ingame) |
BobGhengisKhan
Finite Horizon
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:37:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Stavros *snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
lawl. chavros got owned.
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Svett
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:40:00 -
[97]
gg nextmap de_dust2
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:42:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Ma''kai on 05/01/2007 20:45:37
Originally by: Svett gg nextmap de_dust2
thats a Terrorist favored map. De_Inferno is probably more even match for you guys =)
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KIATheClash
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:49:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
Yes esp PA eh after having half of teh even universe against em
You should had a read in teh chat of council leaders back then tbh and yeh ya surely had a serious hand innit no doubt . Alto back then youre corp wasnt exactly anything good at it except dual mwd ceptors with quite a few with stabs on as well ^^
I rememebr a nice trick layed to em , god those were quite a few fun days with a few of PA and no wonder most of them ****ed off to BoB ;)
Anyways well executed job . Mods this is currently my main .
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Phoenixgurl
Amarr Vanguard Frontiers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:49:00 -
[100]
GG --------------------------
When the universe collapses and dies, there will be 3 survivors: Tyr Anasazi, the coc*roaches ... and Dylan Hunt trying to save the coc*roaches. --Tyr (Andromeda) |
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killerco
Gallente Confederation of Red Moon Red Moon Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:52:00 -
[101]
congratulations BOB
Don't be a great man just be a man |
Robert Dobbs
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:54:00 -
[102]
Edited by: Robert Dobbs on 05/01/2007 20:56:04
Originally by: Benny Hill whole endeavour to many witnesses, shows that BoB cannot be trusted, and that it will turn stick a knife in any of its friends and allies. Calling BoB allies or friends slaves would be inaccuate. Calling them stupid would be accurate, because BoB will turn on them like they did ASCN.
When a relationship is beneficial to all parties involved, trust is irrelevant. Many gains can be sought out of any relationship; commodities, friendship, fun, respect, co-operation, to name a few.
In fact, when you look at trust from this angle, it could be said that BoB functions through trust. Trusting our leaders to make the right calls. Trusting our fleets to respond to those calls in ways that only we can. Trusting our corp mates to lend a helping hand, and trusting our friends to be there for us when we need them. A trust which, any BoB member will tell you, is very rarely misplaced.
Politically, trust has very little meaning, so perhaps it's time to take a look closer to home. What will those you trust do when the going gets tough? Nice region..
I'm off for a poo. -
--------- *snip* - no profanity allowed in sigs, even if McCreedy said it - Tirg |
KIATheClash
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.05 20:55:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Vince Draken Edited by: Vince Draken on 05/01/2007 20:04:51
Originally by: Dominie Dirtch
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
How dare you put CA in that list you insignificant bug.
CA was not destroyed by anyone, least of all BoB, CA was destroyed by ego's and nothing more.
hi aneu
p.s. save your breath trying to convince anyone that this isn't your latest lame forum alt. Nine day old character with your writing style, who somehow knows about history of two years ago despite playing for nine days. Plus, if your member count goes up, I expect it to be in triplicates.
CA did not die to ATUK/BoB . Mods this is currently my main .
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:01:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
Truth be told, Amth...and you would know...FA was done in more by ATUK than anything BoB did. BoB just sorta finished the job and made it official. If I recall correctly, FA didn't even resist when BoB showed up. It was over before it started.
What was left when BoB finally came wasn't nearly what we had before the ATUK war. If we were to be truthful, FA began to disintegrate before ATUK came.
I mean, c'mon...we had poor Fluffy (KOTH Fluf) leading FA fleets when we faced you guys and we'd just basically moved to 0.0...heheh. ATUK was the first 0.0 war we'd ever seen.
At least with ASCN, no one can say they weren't at the height of their "power." They were as big and as "bad" as they ever were and were ever going to be. ...and the speed with which they were dispatched was incredible.
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:03:00 -
[105]
Remind me never to play cards with any members of BoB.
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Raid
Caldari Tyrell Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:03:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Stavros *snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
I stopped reading after this post. Stavros got pwned by the mods!
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DoctorGonzo
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:05:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Orree
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
Truth be told, Amth...and you would know...FA was done in more by ATUK than anything BoB did. BoB just sorta finished the job and made it official. If I recall correctly, FA didn't even resist when BoB showed up. It was over before it started.
What was left when BoB finally came wasn't nearly what we had before the ATUK war. If we were to be truthful, FA began to disintegrate before ATUK came.
I mean, c'mon...we had poor Fluffy (KOTH Fluf) leading FA fleets when we faced you guys and we'd just basically moved to 0.0...heheh. ATUK was the first 0.0 war we'd ever seen.
At least with ASCN, no one can say they weren't at the height of their "power." They were as big and as "bad" as they ever were and were ever going to be. ...and the speed with which they were dispatched was incredible.
ATUK were always part of BoB, so it was actually us that did FA in. Also ATUK were heavily involved in the latter days of the SA/CA war - Again BoB being part of that conflict too.
Originally by: Blacklight I think Madeye and CRYVOK have delusions of adequacy!
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Ashis
Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:08:00 -
[108]
We got beat. Pure and simple.
Congratulations on your victory Band of Brothers.
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:08:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Robert Dobbs Edited by: Robert Dobbs on 05/01/2007 20:56:04
Originally by: Benny Hill whole endeavour to many witnesses, shows that BoB cannot be trusted, and that it will turn stick a knife in any of its friends and allies. Calling BoB allies or friends slaves would be inaccuate. Calling them stupid would be accurate, because BoB will turn on them like they did ASCN.
When a relationship is beneficial to all parties involved, trust is irrelevant. Many gains can be sought out of any relationship; commodities, friendship, fun, respect, co-operation, to name a few.
In fact, when you look at trust from this angle, it could be said that BoB functions through trust. Trusting our leaders to make the right calls. Trusting our fleets to respond to those calls in ways that only we can. Trusting our corp mates to lend a helping hand, and trusting our friends to be there for us when we need them. A trust which, any BoB member will tell you, is very rarely misplaced.
Politically, trust has very little meaning, so perhaps it's time to take a look closer to home. What will those you trust do when the going gets tough? Nice region..
I'm off for a poo.
Remember, that Eve is a game. And like I said earlier, just because you can peak at someone's cards doesn't mean you should. Once you gain a reputation such as "we will do whatever it takes to win", you may find people more and more unlikely to play the game with you next time.
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NOCLUE
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:09:00 -
[110]
WELL SO TRUE..YOU DID A GOOD JOB..AS YOU POINT OUT..A PVP ORIENTATED CORP TAKES DOWN A INDUSTRIAL 1..KINDA SOUNDS LIKE WHAN A BS TAKES OUT A BADGER...I CALL THAT PIRACEY...I DONT REALLY CARE HOW YOU TRY TO SUGAR COAT IT...HOW YOU TRY TO JUSTIFY IT WITH YOURE BULL PROPOGANDA...BOB IS NOTHING MORE THEN A BUNCH OF THIEVES WHO CANNOT STAND IT IF SOMEBODY DONT KISS THEIR BACKSIDES...YOU ARE PITIFUL AND DISGRACEFUL TO THE GAME AND I HOPE OTHER ALLIENCES WILL SOON PUT ASIDE THEIR PETTY DIFFERENCES AND GET TOGETHER TO PUT YOU WHERE YOU BELONG..IN THE BIO-RECYCLE BIN HAVE A NICE DAY AND ENJOY T
Originally by: SirMolle Ascendant Frontier
The Band of Brothers stops today to indulge in short reminiscence. The purpose of this announcement is to transcribe the most general viewpoint shared among our alliance with honesty and clarity.
The Precedent The Band of Brothers war against the Ascendant Frontier has officially ended. Victory has been achieved with the complete dissolution of Ascendant Frontier as a sovereign 0.0 entity. Of the 4800 strong, now remains a lonely few, and in the next week, all stations are secured and new inhabitants in place. We claim, and no one can dispute, a full and complete victory.
The Motive The reasons for war are simple and straightfoward. Months of cold war, stockpiling and building with no end in sight. BoB provoked repeatedly and waited, and waited. For a short while it appeared as if the boiling point had been reached. Instead of explosive all out war, it fizzled into the nothingness known as CODA. The intended backbone of this coalition became too fearful of risking multi-billion ISK capital fleets and exposing their multi-billion ISK outposts on a gamble. Superpowers contented themselves in displaying might with weekend ops and campaigns against those in their backyard.
The reasons for selecting ASCN as the target were stated and restated, and will be once more. ASCN were the biggest and most likely to offer the best challenge, while keeping us occupied the longest. In theory, the unstoppable force versus the unmovable object. D2 almost had it, but morphed itself into a defensive alliance. The choice came down to fighting ASCN or mini-ASCN. All opposing claims were either misinformed, or fictional.
Due Process Initial plans and expectations called for an 8-12 month war, with intervention from multiple outsiders on multiple fronts. No requests to allies made; no mercenaries hired. If there was glory to be had, sharing it was never our intent. Furthermore, no attempts on enemy sovereignty were scheduled before six weeks had passed. The invasion of TPAR-G led to one of the poorest tactical maneuvers of all time, and let us proceed well ahead of schedule. The invasion of Paragon Soul four weeks later was done in high spirits and high confidence. Within two weeks the region was secured, and within three it was cleared out. Following a one week lull of operations, Band of Brothers anchored a single POS in AZN-D2 at the start of December. Capitalizing on two more mistakes, we were able to capture C9N-CC and OOYZ. Following the three failed attempts on removing us (which led to the most epic battle of the war), we laid siege to all 14 starbases in AZN-D2 in mid December and cut the heart from ASCN on Christmas Day (weÆre naughty, not nice). The majority of Feythabolis fell before the end of the year. On Jan 1st, ASCN announced it would make its last stand in RIT after losing the majority of its corporations, assets, and territory. Following a week long blitzkrieg of Prime Orbital space where five more stations were captured, the Alamo reconsidered their options and surrendered.
In conclusion, it took four weeks to break ASCN's will to fight, three weeks to conquer Paragon Soul, and four weeks to conquer Feythabolis. War quickly degraded to POS bashing and ganks as BoB went head to head with Strontium Clathrates, but a few memorable battles were had.
[/quot
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Helganstandt
Finis Lumen
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:13:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Irrational indeed. By your logic we'd have to be beaten to become underdogs, but if we get beaten its because we supposedly deserve it. Then if we rise up and win again, we're underdogs.. so will you root for us, even though we deserved it? And how does GS claim underdog status in a BoB vs RAGOON conflict with such a ridiculous numerical advantage on their part? Because they were beaten in the past by D2 and BoB? If you look at it rationally, they deserved it fully in both cases and didn't consider themselves underdogs in either case. Which should make it questionable for you to root for one, but not the other.
Lets simplify. People are tired of consistent winners because it makes them cheaper than your typical flavour of the month organization would. At this point, people are so desperate to see it happen they'll aim for the lowest possible margin with coalitions and gangbangs.
To answer your questions:
-If BoB gets beaten in the future, and gain some humility in the process I very well might be rooting for you if you rise up again. -GS and RA have been underdogs their entire time in eve whether they want to admit it or not. They have been beaten multiple times each and have come back for more...my definition of an underdog. You can argue whether my definition is correct is all you want, I guess that's your perogative.
So on that note, you appear to be confusing what I'm saying as though I think you didn't work hard to achieve your goals. That's not what I think. You guys aren't underdogs though. I find it odd that you're even considering another alliances larger numbers are justification for being so. That's not typical BoB talk at all. And to put it bluntly, yes, part of the reason I want to see BoB get defeated is just to mix things up a bit. However, the main reason is that while I don't like one dominant entity in anything, I like it even less if that dominant entity is arrogant. If you guys weren't so arrogant, I probably wouldn't care half as much what happened to you.
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:14:00 -
[112]
Originally by: DoctorGonzo
Originally by: Orree
Originally by: Amthrianius
Originally by: TrippyX Edited by: TrippyX on 05/01/2007 18:09:09
Originally by: Harisdrop I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
BoB didn't destroy ASCN.. ASCN destroyed itself.
I will point you to our corporations bio, go have a look.
Many alliances have said such to us, whether it be
PA NBSI CA FA Xetic the list goes on
Always Internal problems
Truth be told, Amth...and you would know...FA was done in more by ATUK than anything BoB did. BoB just sorta finished the job and made it official. If I recall correctly, FA didn't even resist when BoB showed up. It was over before it started.
What was left when BoB finally came wasn't nearly what we had before the ATUK war. If we were to be truthful, FA began to disintegrate before ATUK came.
I mean, c'mon...we had poor Fluffy (KOTH Fluf) leading FA fleets when we faced you guys and we'd just basically moved to 0.0...heheh. ATUK was the first 0.0 war we'd ever seen.
At least with ASCN, no one can say they weren't at the height of their "power." They were as big and as "bad" as they ever were and were ever going to be. ...and the speed with which they were dispatched was incredible.
ATUK were always part of BoB, so it was actually us that did FA in. Also ATUK were heavily involved in the latter days of the SA/CA war - Again BoB being part of that conflict too.
Huh?
ATUK was in The Five at the time...how is that BoB? Serious question. I remember fighting ATUK and Shinra...with incursions from Imperium corps and Burn Eden spending some time. Rarely if ever was there a BoB corp in Fountain when (I feel) we (FA) really died.
Maybe The Five and BoB were one-in-the-same, but I have never seen it officially said to be so.
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Robert Oobbs
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:14:00 -
[113]
Edited by: Robert Oobbs on 05/01/2007 21:14:21
Originally by: Ma'kai Remember, that Eve is a game. And like I said earlier, just because you can peak at someone's cards doesn't mean you should. Once you gain a reputation such as "we will do whatever it takes to win", you may find people more and more unlikely to play the game with you next time.
Looking at somebody's cards is cheating. It's not part of the game.
Spying, corp espionage, sabotage, is all part of the game that we play, as much as mining or mission running is. If you only wish to play one part of this game, it's your choice.
Edit: Wrong char, it's pretty obvious who I am ;)
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:18:00 -
[114]
Originally by: NOCLUE WELL SO TRUE..YOU DID A GOOD JOB..AS YOU POINT OUT..A PVP ORIENTATED CORP TAKES DOWN A INDUSTRIAL 1..KINDA SOUNDS LIKE WHAN A BS TAKES OUT A BADGER...I CALL THAT PIRACEY...I DONT REALLY CARE HOW YOU TRY TO SUGAR COAT IT...HOW YOU TRY TO JUSTIFY IT WITH YOURE BULL PROPOGANDA...BOB IS NOTHING MORE THEN A BUNCH OF THIEVES WHO CANNOT STAND IT IF SOMEBODY DONT KISS THEIR BACKSIDES...YOU ARE PITIFUL AND DISGRACEFUL TO THE GAME AND I HOPE OTHER ALLIENCES WILL SOON PUT ASIDE THEIR PETTY DIFFERENCES AND GET TOGETHER TO PUT YOU WHERE YOU BELONG..IN THE BIO-RECYCLE BIN HAVE A NICE DAY AND ENJOY T
No alliance in 0.0 has a right to hide behind the "don't attack us, were industrial and you'll look bad" bull****. Just like that badger, if you can't defend yourself out in 0.0, why the heck are you out there in the first place? ASCN knew BoB was coming. The war should of been about superior numbers vs superior tactics. However, because of poor leadership and communication on ASCN's side, they weren't able to put up any real resistance. BoB won the war because they were the better alliance, plan and simple.
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Coupo
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:18:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Robert Dobbs I'm off for a poo.
me too
I Shoot first, ask questions about your veldspar mining technique later |
Sionn Klorgh
Minmatar Black Lance Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:22:00 -
[116]
ASCN pvpers find new homes.... there will be another time
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Kryztal
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:24:00 -
[117]
<3 BoB members, job well done guys and im proud to fly with you guys
To ex-ASCN members, gf and gl in whatever the future brings.
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Robert Oobbs
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:25:00 -
[118]
Originally by: Sionn Klorgh ASCN pvpers find new homes.... there will be another time
I think we tried to recruit both of them..
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:38:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Robert Oobbs Edited by: Robert Oobbs on 05/01/2007 21:14:21
Originally by: Ma'kai Remember, that Eve is a game. And like I said earlier, just because you can peak at someone's cards doesn't mean you should. Once you gain a reputation such as "we will do whatever it takes to win", you may find people more and more unlikely to play the game with you next time.
Looking at somebody's cards is cheating. It's not part of the game.
Spying, corp espionage, sabotage, is all part of the game that we play, as much as mining or mission running is. If you only wish to play one part of this game, it's your choice.
Edit: Wrong char, it's pretty obvious who I am ;)
What I'm saying is where do you draw the line? The stuff BoB posted from ASCN's private forums was just that, private. If BoB got Cyvok's real life email password, would you guys view his private email?
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Vince Draken
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:39:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Ma'kai
Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor
Originally by: Ma'kai Whats even funnier is watching all the /respect from BoB after Gungkiller posted the surrender. Why say one thing when your actions during the war were completely the opposite?
Easy: because there is no more war.
I liken it to boxing: During the build up and the fight, you try to kill one another and destroy completely. You threaten, you nash teeth, you spit, you pose. The fight occurs and all out hell follows. After the fight, there is no reason to feel or act that way anymore. It is over. The most important aspect that, even though there is a victor selected, is that both sides worked very hard to get there and shared a common experience and emotion for the game. That's why you'll see most of the fighters congratulating each other, even after one takes a crushing loss.
It's the difference between being a professional and not. The war is (mostly) concluded. We are professional. We pay and paid our respects when deserved.
Plus, really, what does it gain at this point? Nothing. Professionals don't waste effort.
If I remember, there are rules in boxing. What you did would be considered hitting below the belt.
Heres an appropiate analogy. Last week I played someone in a card game for money. He got up and went to the bathroom in the middle of a hand. Now, a good sportsman wouldn't have picked up his cards and looked at them, even if they were now "available public knowledge". Even if you did pick them up, you then proceeded to announce what a poor hand he had to everyone in the room. Like what you did on eve-o. Thats poor sportsmanship.
Can you please step down off your pedistil? Your HC went to great lengths to insult bob on your forums. The same HC who ran the forums did such a poor job of policing them you had as many readers as the E-O forums. How do you expect the lies and insults that your HC spewed at BOB not to see the light of day? Your own HC alsop claimed multiple times to have their own bob spies. So please, give it a rest.
The above thoughts and statements are IC and should be taken as such. |
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Serret
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:40:00 -
[121]
Originally by: Ma'kai
What I'm saying is where do you draw the line? The stuff BoB posted from ASCN's private forums was just that, private. If BoB got Cyvok's real life email password, would you guys view his private email?
If we got CYVOK's email password, we might look at it.
However, since there is no such thing as a person named CYVOK in real life, I very much doubt that will ever happen. --
<Coupo`Work> if i die illl gum you to death |
Obidios
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:41:00 -
[122]
Welll done BOB, very well done and quicker than most would suspect. Had fun in that war while I was in BOB, not a classic but one of the better ones. -----------------
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DoctorGonzo
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:42:00 -
[123]
Originally by: Orree Huh?
ATUK was in The Five at the time...how is that BoB? Serious question. I remember fighting ATUK and Shinra...with incursions from Imperium corps and Burn Eden spending some time. Rarely if ever was there a BoB corp in Fountain when (I feel) we (FA) really died.
Maybe The Five and BoB were one-in-the-same, but I have never seen it officially said to be so.
BoB was formed during the GNW and comprised of ATUK, BNC, EVOL, m0o and RKK. We (all the BoB corps) always considered ATUK part of BoB even when they were doing TheFive thing. I'm suprised this is news as we've always said and maintained this position.
If I remember correctly at the time of the ATUK invasion, ShinRa had taken Paragon Soul and RKK & BNC were taking Delve while fighting FIX in Querious.
Hope that's cleared that up
Originally by: Blacklight I think Madeye and CRYVOK have delusions of adequacy!
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Cipher7
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:44:00 -
[124]
You can love these guys or you can hate em.
But you gotta respect em.
They're smart and dedicated.
It shows in everything they do, including their writing.
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:47:00 -
[125]
Originally by: Vince Draken
Originally by: Ma'kai
Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor
Originally by: Ma'kai Whats even funnier is watching all the /respect from BoB after Gungkiller posted the surrender. Why say one thing when your actions during the war were completely the opposite?
Easy: because there is no more war.
I liken it to boxing: During the build up and the fight, you try to kill one another and destroy completely. You threaten, you nash teeth, you spit, you pose. The fight occurs and all out hell follows. After the fight, there is no reason to feel or act that way anymore. It is over. The most important aspect that, even though there is a victor selected, is that both sides worked very hard to get there and shared a common experience and emotion for the game. That's why you'll see most of the fighters congratulating each other, even after one takes a crushing loss.
It's the difference between being a professional and not. The war is (mostly) concluded. We are professional. We pay and paid our respects when deserved.
Plus, really, what does it gain at this point? Nothing. Professionals don't waste effort.
If I remember, there are rules in boxing. What you did would be considered hitting below the belt.
Heres an appropiate analogy. Last week I played someone in a card game for money. He got up and went to the bathroom in the middle of a hand. Now, a good sportsman wouldn't have picked up his cards and looked at them, even if they were now "available public knowledge". Even if you did pick them up, you then proceeded to announce what a poor hand he had to everyone in the room. Like what you did on eve-o. Thats poor sportsmanship.
Can you please step down off your pedistil? Your HC went to great lengths to insult bob on your forums. The same HC who ran the forums did such a poor job of policing them you had as many readers as the E-O forums. How do you expect the lies and insults that your HC spewed at BOB not to see the light of day? Your own HC alsop claimed multiple times to have their own bob spies. So please, give it a rest.
Yes, i'm done. From what I gathered, there is no limit on how far BoB will go if given the chance. Thats all I wanted to hear.
And you know what I ment when I said Cyvok's real life email. Unfortunately I do not know his real name, so thats how i refer to him. But you answered my question by stating you would look at his email, thank you.
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:48:00 -
[126]
Originally by: DoctorGonzo
Originally by: Orree Huh?
ATUK was in The Five at the time...how is that BoB? Serious question. I remember fighting ATUK and Shinra...with incursions from Imperium corps and Burn Eden spending some time. Rarely if ever was there a BoB corp in Fountain when (I feel) we (FA) really died.
Maybe The Five and BoB were one-in-the-same, but I have never seen it officially said to be so.
BoB was formed during the GNW and comprised of ATUK, BNC, EVOL, m0o and RKK. We (all the BoB corps) always considered ATUK part of BoB even when they were doing TheFive thing. I'm suprised this is news as we've always said and maintained this position.
If I remember correctly at the time of the ATUK invasion, ShinRa had taken Paragon Soul and RKK & BNC were taking Delve while fighting FIX in Querious.
Hope that's cleared that up
Perhaps is was common knowledge...lol...just not to me.
I always knew that you may as well have been one in the same because you would never fight each other, always seemed to be on the same page, etc. I still viewed you as two seperate entities, though. Five was Five...BoB was BoB. That's why I said what I said.
Thanks for the edification.
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Comstr
Technology Acquisition Collective Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:52:00 -
[127]
I respect thier militry capabilities. It involves risk, judgement and skill.
Offlineing POS's with a spy has none of these things, and has no honor either. BoB gained no honor from it, no self-profesed enjoyment from combat and only gained shame for doing it. As you well knew then and now, you don't need to do that to win, but you have, and will surly continue to do so in the future.
BoB is one of the few alliences that can CHOOSE to fight with Honor, bravery and skill, and be assured they will come out on top. The face that they do not choose to do so, but prefer to win some fights in easymode, is a shame that will haunt thier victories and glory forever.
Thier victory is a mighty one.
It is also a stained one, not all covered in glittering glory.
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Serret
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:52:00 -
[128]
Edited by: Serret on 05/01/2007 21:54:30
Originally by: Ma'kai
And you know what I ment when I said Cyvok's real life email. Unfortunately I do not know his real name, so thats how i refer to him. But you answered my question by stating you would look at his email, thank you.
And for proving that you are one of the lemmings who insist on conflating real life with a game where no such ambiguity exists, thank you.
Quote: I just wanted to know what it would take to fight BoB on an even level.
You don't have it. --
<Coupo`Work> if i die illl gum you to death |
Resipsa Loquitor
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:53:00 -
[129]
Originally by: Ma'kai poker analogy
Just so no one misunderstands, I am a peon and speak for no one besides myself. This is my own interpretation. You can interpret that statement however you see fit û I can't control what you think.
Hardly appropriate and poorly chosen for your original topic. I selected my analogy for the point in answering your question regarding how we can "rip your soul out" and then "congratulate" you when it is done for the efforts made. However, if we want to shift the analogy for your new topic, ok.
Boxing has something that Eve does not in 0.0 warfare: referees. True, there are GMs, but usually they're floating around solving technical issues - they are not there to ensure one side wins or not (even though some claim they do - tin foil hat please [and why do people say 'tin foil' - it's really aluminum, but I digress])!
There is no ref in 0.0. There is no one to save you if you do something wrong. No one is there to save you when the fighter is on the other side of the gate and you're not ready for the fight. Even if you are ready, you might not win. I've done some very dumb things and I was the one that had to pay for them. My good friend Herculite has told me that when you die you should ask yourself "What did I do wrong?" Sometimes the answer is to fight. Sometimes the answer is to run.
As for the poker player analogy, he's an idiot if he left the table with real money. Sorry, but you don't leave the table once a hand is dealt and in play. You fold if you have to go take a dump or put on some man diapers and "upload to the network" there. The cards are your responsibility once they're dealt. If you let them sit there and someone else looks at them, that's your fault for not managing them. It's your money. Why would you trust someone that is trying to take money from you? True, it takes an affirmative act on the part of the other player, but is it against the rules? Maybe or maybe not û depends on what you agreed to. Why risk it? Would it be unsportsman like to look at the cards? Definitely. And you still lose.
ASCN risked it and left their cards on the table constantly. Expansionist and unrestricted recruiting. Poor TS password management. Pathetic forums management. Best of all: they lied to their members and got caught by the enemy doing so. Wishing something didn't happen doesn't take it away. They did this all to themselves by not taking care of their own business. They have no one to blame except themselves. I don't recall anyone agreeing not to spy on the other. And to expect others to act as "honorable gentlemen", dress up in snazzy red uniforms, and get into lines to shoot one another, this is the wrong game. Do you think people don't try to spy on BoB or D2 or any other forums? Please.
Ethics? Morals? There are no ethics in this game. This is a WAR game - you are allowed to kill. Eve is not poker. Go leave a can of megacyte in Jita and tell everyone in local "Hey, I'm going afk for 5 û I'll get that can in a minute" and see if it's really left there. Not doing it proves my point inherently. Back to your poker analogy, the hand you are dealt is the one that you're fitted with when the overview goes from clear to yellow to red. The only morals are not to betray the vision of the well-fought battle and the path to reach it û to celebrate not only the pinnacle but also the journey to it. The only tactics that are shunned by all (or should be) are technical exploits.
There is one thing that is definitely alive and well in Eve though: Loyalty. Loyalty to your self, your mates, your corporation, and your alliance. The fanacism of BoB members is an expression of this loyalty to each other; it is an extreme loyalty built on a shared vision. As a newer member, even I'm awed by it. --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC! |
Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:54:00 -
[130]
Originally by: Serret Edited by: Serret on 05/01/2007 21:53:13
Originally by: Ma'kai
And you know what I ment when I said Cyvok's real life email. Unfortunately I do not know his real name, so thats how i refer to him. But you answered my question by stating you would look at his email, thank you.
And for proving that you are one of the lemmings who insist on conflating real life with a game where no such ambiguity exists, thank you.
Quote: I just wanted to know what it would take to fight BoB on an even level.
You don't have it.
at least I haven't resorted to name calling.
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Kcel Chim
Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five
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Posted - 2007.01.05 21:58:00 -
[131]
Originally by: Orree Edited by: Orree on 05/01/2007 21:50:11
Originally by: DoctorGonzo
Originally by: Orree Huh?
ATUK was in The Five at the time...how is that BoB? Serious question. I remember fighting ATUK and Shinra...with incursions from Imperium corps and Burn Eden spending some time. Rarely if ever was there a BoB corp in Fountain when (I feel) we (FA) really died.
Maybe The Five and BoB were one-in-the-same, but I have never seen it officially said to be so.
BoB was formed during the GNW and comprised of ATUK, BNC, EVOL, m0o and RKK. We (all the BoB corps) always considered ATUK part of BoB even when they were doing TheFive thing. I'm suprised this is news as we've always said and maintained this position.
If I remember correctly at the time of the ATUK invasion, ShinRa had taken Paragon Soul and RKK & BNC were taking Delve while fighting FIX in Querious.
Hope that's cleared that up
Perhaps is was common knowledge...lol...just not to me.
I always knew that you may as well have been one in the same because you would never fight each other, always seemed to be on the same page, etc. I still viewed you as two seperate entities, though. Five was Five...BoB was BoB. That's why I said what I said.
BTW..I think it was Period Basis for Shinra....and yes, BoB took Delve without a fight, too...heheh.
Thanks for the edification.
Atuk wasnt Five at the time we invaded FA. Five was found after we left Fountain and moved back to Curse/Catch. At that time we were in no alliance. Despite all ingame Alliance tickers we were always part of bob since the GNW till Atuk moathballed and our plays went officially with Dice into the BoB iga.
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Roller
Syn-Packet Security
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:01:00 -
[132]
Originally by: SirMolle
Soon, the Pendulum will swing again. Tick Tock.
Any soverign Alliance (non-pet) that is foolish enough to work with BoB again has been warned.
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Ma'kai
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:13:00 -
[133]
Edited by: Ma''kai on 05/01/2007 22:13:14
Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor
Originally by: Ma'kai poker analogy
The only tactics that are shunned by all (or should be) are technical exploits.
Good Point. This is where I misunderstood. I've hijacked your thread long enough. Thanks for clearing things up Resispa. Grats to BoB on your victory against ASCN. I'm anxious to see what happens in your next war.
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Drake Mezcal
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:16:00 -
[134]
Molle
Now the war is over, can i ask your feelings towards ex-members of ASCN.
I was just hoping, after such a victory would it be possible to show a little respect, maybe remove any offencive sigs etc. No need for the anti-ASCN propaganda anymore. A lot of people have moved on, myself included but we still belive in the dream that was once ASCN, and it would be nice to remember it positivly, rather than offensivly.
Also, you havent commented on CYVOK leaving, just wondering your opinion on the guy. Personally i believe yes he had his faults, but he did his best to run a sucsessfull alliance, but was too easy going, this lead to us being unprepared. That aside, i thought he was an excellent leader and will certainly learn from his mistake.
If your gonna shoot me/us down with insults and critizims, please dont respond, just looking for a bit of sportsmanship.
Thank You Drake
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Fitz Chivalry
eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:18:00 -
[135]
Over? What do you mean over, its barely got started has it!
C'mon guys who is with me? Lets go!!!!!!11
/me looks around to see half a dozen people running off into the distance.
/me runs off into the distance.
It could have been great but it ended up being mostly boring and crap.
Oh well. On the next adventure.
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Buzzmong
Gallente Raptus Regaliter Pride - Honor - Duty
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:19:00 -
[136]
Edited by: Buzzmong on 05/01/2007 22:20:03 Have to admit, the fall of ASCN has been impressive, albeit for the wrong reasons.
--------------------------------- Member of Raptus Regaliter
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Tabaldak
Caldari eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:21:00 -
[137]
Hmm, sportsmanship from bob...please. I've found out many things from the bobbits;
The bobbits are utterly impervious to criticism (constructive or otherwise). You cannot negotiate with them; you cannot cause them to feel shame or compassion; you cannot reason with them. They cannot be made to feel remorse. For some reason, bobbits do not feel they are bound by the rules of courtesy or social responsibility. When you try to reason with a bobbit, he wins. When you insult a bobbit, he wins. When you scream at a bobbit, he wins. The only thing that bobbits can't handle is being ignored."
The only way to deal with bobbits is to limit your reaction to reminding others not to respond to bobs.
p.s. insert "troll" wherever it says bobbit and you get a cookie.
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:22:00 -
[138]
(stopping thw quote chain because it was getting ridiculous...lol)
Thanks, Kcel...it was also my recollection that ATUK was not in an alliance at the time the invasion began, I just couldn't remember for sure.
I definitely appreciate the clarification.
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SirMolle
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:22:00 -
[139]
Edited by: SirMolle on 05/01/2007 22:23:15 meh, forum ate my post.
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Robert Dobbs
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:30:00 -
[140]
Originally by: Drake Mezcal No need for the anti-ASCN propaganda anymore.
The "propaganda" wasn't there to help us win the war. The sigs were made for our amusement. I'm afraid n0rab will feature in my sig for a long time to come, because his act of cowardice deserved it. I don't speak for Molle, but if you are looking for a resolution, some acknowledgement of our mutual respect as enemy alliances, some condoling words to soothe the pain, I doubt you'll find them here. Respect is earned.
-
--------- *snip* - no profanity allowed in sigs, even if McCreedy said it - Tirg |
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Fitz Chivalry
eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:32:00 -
[141]
Edited by: Fitz Chivalry on 05/01/2007 22:29:19
Originally by: Robert Dobbs I'm afraid n0rab will feature in my sig for a long time to come, because his act of cowardice deserved it.
Why was it an act of cowardice to deny you the loot and the satisfaction of the kill?
p.s. that was a quick poo, i bet u never washed your hands.
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Drake Mezcal
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:32:00 -
[142]
Originally by: Robert Dobbs
Originally by: Drake Mezcal No need for the anti-ASCN propaganda anymore.
The "propaganda" wasn't there to help us win the war. The sigs were made for our amusement. I'm afraid n0rab will feature in my sig for a long time to come, because his act of cowardice deserved it. I don't speak for Molle, but if you are looking for a resolution, some acknowledgement of our mutual respect as enemy alliances, some condoling words to soothe the pain, I doubt you'll find them here. Respect is earned.
Thanks for that, Gf
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CamMan
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:35:00 -
[143]
Originally by: God
Originally by: Atreus Minmatarius
Originally by: SirMolle ... We claim, and no one can dispute, a full and complete victory ...
... is it de ja vu? ....
No, you just arent very smart
Arent privateers the biggest nublets in game! For the not so intelligent privateers i must say that yes in the big wide spaces of 0.0 where there is no concord to protect you, alliances can be killed and wars can be won. Perhaps you should stick to empire, 0.0 is far too scary a place for the likes of you empire griefing muppets. Also note how no current or ex-ASCN member is disputing the facts that Molle has said? If you dont know what you are talking about you should STFU and learn.
Again props to the ASCN members who stood up and engaged us in PvP, special note to Zungen who singlehandedly wouldnt give up the fight, even when he ws flying solo towards the end cause his mates wouldnt undock.
Whilst as Molle says there were few epic battles, there was one, maybe it was epic because of the odds against us but any battle where on average a ship dies every 15 seconds, and the fight lasts for over an hour, and ends with wrecks spread out over a 500km battlefield, i think that counts as epic. So props to those pilots who tried to take our AZN-D2 POS. That battle sure was a lot of fun.
Cheers Cam
Originally by: Bender Interesting, no the other one ... tedious
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ItakeItDeep
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:40:00 -
[144]
Edited by: ItakeItDeep on 05/01/2007 22:40:36
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NAFnist
Rage of Angels Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:41:00 -
[145]
BOB is evil - Regards NAFnist |
CamMan
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:43:00 -
[146]
Originally by: Comstr I respect thier militry capabilities. It involves risk, judgement and skill.
Offlineing POS's with a spy has none of these things, and has no honor either. BoB gained no honor from it
OMG i knew that ASCN ate those HC stories like cheese cake, I honstely believed that the rest of the EVE community were smart enough to form an educated opinion.
Let me just catagorically say No BoB's spy has ever turned off an ASCN POS, that whole spin was the ASCN HC's way of saying we dont know what happened so we will blame everyone but ourselves.
Cheers CamMan
Originally by: Bender Interesting, no the other one ... tedious
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Jakkul
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:52:00 -
[147]
Well, it was fun... I'll take my hat off to bob, they rocked from day one and wasn't an entirely unpleasant experience See you round sometime
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HC MasiEEE
V I R I I Center for Disease Creation
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Posted - 2007.01.05 22:56:00 -
[148]
Nice stats there
Curious whose next tho ________________________ HC MasiEEE - V I R I I
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CamMan
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:02:00 -
[149]
Originally by: Will Fireblade
Hopefully for someone who is worth it not some mining alliance with a few fighters in it.. So yeah if you ask me no big accomplisment there anyone with the logistics and firepower you have could do that. In the end like you said it was another POS war.
I believe you have your facts all about face. ASCN was considered the biggest and strongest alliance before the war, many people honestly believed that ASCN could beat BoB. It was rumoured that ASCN had more BS's in stock then most alliances (except Goonies of course) had frigates. Just because they lost there is no reason to tarnish what they once were.
And you say it broke down to a POS war, in saying that you have clearly proven that you do not know what a POS war is. I will clarify for you. A POS war is when both sides spam POS's like no tomorrow and try to take sovereignty through shear number of POS's in system, and not because they actually kill the enemies POS's. As Molle said we deployed the absolute minimum of POS's and instead killed all the ASCN POS's so that our 1 or 2 POS's held sovereignty. This is POS bashing, not a POS war.
Hopefully that clears up your misconceptions.
Cheers CamMan
Originally by: Bender Interesting, no the other one ... tedious
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Dominixa
Shadows of the Dead Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:04:00 -
[150]
Gjob guys! 200 ships a day is alot of pew pew!
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Xeriuz
Caldari The Puppet Masters.
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:06:00 -
[151]
Your press releases are always great and this one is the best one i have read of them all, nice job.
nothing but respect.
______________________________________________ X
You Never Know What You Have Until You Lose It |
Victor Vision
Central Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:14:00 -
[152]
Originally by: NTRabbit Fascinating.
Indeed.
In my business there is no black, nor white. Just a million different shades of grey. |
Bobbeh
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:27:00 -
[153]
Originally by: xXBeatnikXx Respect to the few ASCN that stood out to me in Combat (mostly just at the secound half when there were less then 50 of them):
Zungen Daskingtiger
And to all the rest out there that fought, won and lost. I didn't always keep my ship, but I sure took a lot of yours.
GF and may those that deserve it find your way into our fold. There were some great fights, and some great fighters from time to time in the last 4 monthes.
I agree with this statement.
I'd like to say GF ASCN for what its worth. You were until right at the very end a worthy adversary. GF.
Current standing BOB Lite 6 - ASCN 0 |
Calisto Cody
Minmatar The Black Swan Society
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Posted - 2007.01.05 23:31:00 -
[154]
no tendrils :(
Originally by: Sergio Ling
Originally by: Butter Dog but I'm professional enough to keep my mouth shut about what I know.
i can't imagine that's true
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Trask Kilraen
The Older Gamers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 00:06:00 -
[155]
After all is said and done, you guys were awesome. All whining, complaining and excuise making aside, we were outfought.
Well done!
I learned a ton in this war and experienced what few Eve pilots have... I've flown with a Titan. Shrike tried to kill me with his several times (EM tanking FTW!), and I saw some amazing battles.
Till next time....
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Dr Smythe
Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 00:25:00 -
[156]
Well nice to be on page 100 zillion again :P but here is my two cents
BoB won outright because they are good and had their **** together.
The war was good and fought fair by BoB. There was absolutely no under handed tactics that I saw or heard of that were not played with in the game mechanics.
A war is a war is a war.
ASCN lost not because it's pilots didn't want to fight but because it's leader(s) couldn't motivate the masses to fight and could not give any clear direction.
I took part in many fleet ops but only one noticably did ASCN have the upper hand. There were plenty of skirmishes were ASCN had the upper hand and vice versa. But skirmishes do not win wars.
BoB knows that ASCN had MANY good pilots and a few GOOD/GREAT FC'S but we no clear guidance from the top WHAT SO EVER it was a fore gone conclusion I'm afraid.
We were kept told you have to step up to the plate you have to step up to the plate. And many of us did. We took our own initiative by moving to delve. FC's took their own initiative by leading gangs.
In the Sha Kharn gave up in waiting for command and started working on our own. We knew from an early time the outcome. It was that plain to see. We teamed up with corps like Lynx who wanted to fight and we fought where and how we could with little or no direction.
The only people who failed to step up to the plate in my honest opinion was the ASCN HC from the beginning of the war.
I was so disallusioned by this whole war that I went to Empire once SHA K pulled out and started doing missions. I haven't done missions in years and I remembered quickly why. I hated those 3 weeks so much I almost CTRL + Q EVE completely.
But realistically all that can be said is this. Kudos to BoB you know your stuff and you do it well.
And I am so proud for being in ASCN and fighting with the people of ASCN. But it's HC and leader sucked donkey dong
Help Dr Smythe get a Corvus |
JA RULER
Caldari Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.06 00:59:00 -
[157]
Congratz bob
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Plim
Gallente Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 01:02:00 -
[158]
Originally by: JA RULER Congratz bob
Your sig is incredible beyond words lol -----------------
Originally by: BoB forum PR Toxic sludge is good for you.
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Dr Smythe
Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:06:00 -
[159]
JA that is an awsome awsome siggy :) hahahahahahaha
Help Dr Smythe get a Corvus |
DrakeStone
Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 01:08:00 -
[160]
Edited by: DrakeStone on 06/01/2007 01:06:24
Congratulations, BOB.
Well played, indeed.
/salute
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DoctorGonzo
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:12:00 -
[161]
Originally by: Fi T'Zeh I'm hoping that you are just a random alt who's stolen a BoB sig. If this is not the case, and you are a BoB pilot, shame on you. You'd better hope I don't find out who you are. Post with your main sir, or not at all.
I've seen a number of non BoB using that signature - makes me happy, obvioulsy one of my better creations
Originally by: Blacklight I think Madeye and CRYVOK have delusions of adequacy!
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Xianthar
Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:21:00 -
[162]
well played bob.
-xian
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iiixiii
Caldari Cruor Frater Coalition of Carebear Killers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:22:00 -
[163]
GJ!
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 01:26:00 -
[164]
Originally by: Plim
Originally by: JA RULER Congratz bob
Your sig is incredible beyond words lol
I concur with this statement.
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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R0ot
InNova Tech Inc Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:28:00 -
[165]
Pld BoB, in my noobness atm i can only hope to join your ranks someday =) ___________________________________________________________________
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EluThingol
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 01:31:00 -
[166]
Edited by: EluThingol on 06/01/2007 01:31:11 damn alt delete
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ElweSingollo
Starlancers
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 01:31:00 -
[167]
Edited by: ElweSingollo on 06/01/2007 01:34:04
Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC!
God out of topic really but wth is with the sig Res did they change things after I left EDF as far as I was aware all profits from the high end complexes in D-F went to a central fund your saying you were meant to get paid????
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welsh wizard
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:33:00 -
[168]
Anyone woken up yet? BoB gonna utterly destroy you? No, you sure? Hows that novel you've been writing? Still writing it? Still laying those words down? Yeah? Well you keep that up....
gj bob.
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Dianabolic
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:35:00 -
[169]
Originally by: welsh wizard Anyone woken up yet? BoB gonna utterly destroy you? No, you sure? Hows that novel you've been writing? Still writing it? Still laying those words down? Yeah? Well you keep that up....
gj bob.
Sig *****!!!
Gl in your new corp mr welsh ;)
Quote: 2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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welsh wizard
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:36:00 -
[170]
Thank you Miss Bolic :D
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Arines Shrdlu
Minmatar Celestial Fleet
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:42:00 -
[171]
Originally by: Fi T'Zeh
Originally by: Shrike
Originally by: Har Ganeth How long did it take 39 dreads to take down the 5-4 POS in AZN? :o
16 hardners, Minmatar... in one word.. WAY TO EFFING LONG!
I endorse this statement.
Still got a couple of those POS left to kill
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Metal Dude
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:58:00 -
[172]
Originally by: Dr Smythe Well nice to be on page 100 zillion again :P but here is my two cents
BoB won outright because they are good and had their **** together.
The war was good and fought fair by BoB. There was absolutely no under handed tactics that I saw or heard of that were not played with in the game mechanics.
A war is a war is a war.
ASCN lost not because it's pilots didn't want to fight but because it's leader(s) couldn't motivate the masses to fight and could not give any clear direction.
I took part in many fleet ops but only one noticably did ASCN have the upper hand. There were plenty of skirmishes were ASCN had the upper hand and vice versa. But skirmishes do not win wars.
BoB knows that ASCN had MANY good pilots and a few GOOD/GREAT FC'S but we no clear guidance from the top WHAT SO EVER it was a fore gone conclusion I'm afraid.
We were kept told you have to step up to the plate you have to step up to the plate. And many of us did. We took our own initiative by moving to delve. FC's took their own initiative by leading gangs.
In the Sha Kharn gave up in waiting for command and started working on our own. We knew from an early time the outcome. It was that plain to see. We teamed up with corps like Lynx who wanted to fight and we fought where and how we could with little or no direction.
The only people who failed to step up to the plate in my honest opinion was the ASCN HC from the beginning of the war.
I was so disallusioned by this whole war that I went to Empire once SHA K pulled out and started doing missions. I haven't done missions in years and I remembered quickly why. I hated those 3 weeks so much I almost CTRL + Q EVE completely.
But realistically all that can be said is this. Kudos to BoB you know your stuff and you do it well.
And I am so proud for being in ASCN and fighting with the people of ASCN. But it's HC and leader sucked donkey dong
Well said. We saw the fire in you guys, just no direction like you said. That's why it's important for the leaders to be on the front line leading the fights, earning respect, knowing what an ordinery joe is feeling.
Like I said many times before. Leaders must lead by excemple on the battlefield for ppl will fallow to their deaths without thinking about it. In EVE, Generals rule and Presidents perish.
The truth will set you free
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Jotan Veer
Wings of Turul Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.06 01:59:00 -
[173]
It was most certainly an interesting social experience for me. Kinda shame that I had to stop playing due to RL obligations when we were still dic...I mean POSing around in Paragon Soul.
Anyhow, thanks for teaching a lesson about leadership. For me, the most fascinating part of the whole war was observing other people making good or bad decisions while they were being either filled with purpose or being engulfed by a dark cloud of indecisiveness.
Too bad I could only observe one side of the story.
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Dr Smythe
Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 02:16:00 -
[174]
Originally by: Metal Dude
Like I said many times before. Leaders must lead by excemple on the battlefield for ppl will fallow to their deaths without thinking about it. In EVE, Generals rule and Presidents perish.
Signed/
Help Dr Smythe get a Corvus |
DeadDuck
Omega Enterprises Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.06 02:26:00 -
[175]
It was a nice offensive and very well executed, unfortunately ASCN didnÆt hold as much as I was expecting, the quality gap between BOB and ASCN leaderships was to big, BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy, like it was in the past.
You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
You have destroyed ASCN and with them AXE pulled back, incapable of dealing alone with AAA. You have now AAA as a neighbour. DonÆt know why but I have the feeling that it wasnÆt a good swap ... Even if you put new friendly alliances in the new regions, they will always be weak and will always trust at their landlordÆs strength and not at their own strength, we can take as example the Fountain situation.
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
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Sun Ra
Godspeed You Black Emperor
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 02:27:00 -
[176]
so whos moving in?
Arcane Frankologies - 'plz stop guys it's xmas' |
Dracolich
North Star Networks Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.01.06 02:36:00 -
[177]
Now it was a very short war, but had it been as expected - a profitable one?
Was this war for
a) Profits. b) Keeping the men happy. c) Eliminating future threats. d) Complying fullscale warfare as a test, when(if) a "real" threat arrives. e) Eliminating the buffer-empire, before reaching "the promised land" of DICE. f) To tread the mill;gain land, assimilate, gain wealth from landlording...(before the next expedition). g) Perfect target. h) Some of the above. i) All of the above. j) None of the above.
I am merely speculating, as I know nothing of the world of Eve, as it is, and thus I don't represent my corp nor alliance in doing so.
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Rikeka
Amarr Eye of God
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Posted - 2007.01.06 02:41:00 -
[178]
Honestly, I`m bit tired of the ASCN/BoB threads so I skipped a few pages, but read Molle`s OP, and I liked it, somehow. To ASCN, well done. That alliance will forever remain on EvE history. To it`s members, the same. Now, you are forced to go separate ways, and try to repeat what you did on ASCN. Learn from the successes of ASCN, and from it`s mustakes.
To BOB, congrats on the victory. Personally, I admit I would have preferred you guys retreated (not entirely, as a powerfull force is always needed), but, I too admit, that this events will certainly make things interesting in the far south.
¿Spoils to the victors¿ and all that. I`m certainly curious on who will reside on former-ASCN space, so will keep an eye on this threads, even though I hate them.
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KIATheClash
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.06 02:42:00 -
[179]
Edited by: KIATheClash on 06/01/2007 02:40:57
Originally by: Serret
Originally by: Ma'kai
What I'm saying is where do you draw the line? The stuff BoB posted from ASCN's private forums was just that, private. If BoB got Cyvok's real life email password, would you guys view his private email?
If we got CYVOK's email password, we might look at it.
However, since there is no such thing as a person named CYVOK in real life, I very much doubt that will ever happen.
Mods this is currently my main .
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Athus
Proferon
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 02:56:00 -
[180]
This entire thread has been interesting to me. Although I admit I skipped around the last 3 pages. First I'd like to say Congrats to BoB for a well executed war it would seem. ASCN I am sure worked as hard as they could to defend. I won't deny that I am no fan of BoB for my own reasons however... I see so many crying over spies and forum invasions etc...
What do you people think happens in a real war? Do you think that we don't spy on the enemy to try and gather intel on what they are doing? Do you think the enemy is not doing that in return? War is Dirty. It never will be anything but dirty. all the propaganda is part of it as well.. so what.. BoB is stuck up.. they kicked the crud out of something larger than them.. would you not gloat some too? Sure it is a bit long winded. Ignore it of you don't like it. Or get over it. But if you want to whine about spies and propaganda I suggest you go take a long hard look at things such as WWII and any historical information on how war is conducted or even current. And might I remind you that with the little stunt that was pulled a few years ago by Bin Ladden.. the spy network that was taken apart and tossed to the winds was put back into operation. Granted we have an idiot in office who has no idea how to use it right.. but still.. gimme a break about the spies...
GF to all of you.
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HostageTaker
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 03:04:00 -
[181]
Just wanna say thanks to ASCN, Cyvok and McCreedy.
If it wasn't for the "content" that you provided me with, the StarWars sigs wouldn't be featured in a recent 5 page magazine spread concerning the ASCN - BoB war.
Really enjoyed seeing my sigs in a magazine.
P.S. (3 of the 35+ sigs made throughout the campaign were shown)
>>> EvE-Online Wallpapers <<< |
Feawina
Ducks of DooM
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:05:00 -
[182]
litle note to some: Eventually all empires shall fall like trees... we are the lumberjacks!!
makes you wonder if any BoB fc¦s ever felt the urge to utter in local: We are the borg...
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iceyreloaded
Amarr Sha Kharn Corp
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:07:00 -
[183]
Congrats on crushing victory Bob. I know our corp enjoyed plenty of great skirmishes with you all. There were many frustrating times for us as a Corp. It's been said before, lack of leadership, communication, co-ordination. I'm just repeating so I'll go no further. Personally I felt the turning point moral-wise for ASCN was when CYVOK quit. I was stunned. Now I'll just clarify this is not a personal slight on CYVOK, because I liked the guy from the convo's in TS I had personally, however, the last thing IMO a leader should do is quit when things go wrong. Biggest mistake ever.
Anyway it's all over now, live and learn everyone :) Cya in space o/
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Brunswick2
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.06 03:10:00 -
[184]
See you in fountain!
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Amthrianius
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:12:00 -
[185]
Originally by: DeadDuck You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
We took on what we believed from the onset was the most competent enemy that could give us the hardest fight/challenge. At the time D2 was a non-factor really, severely weakened by the beating they took of a few t1 frigs ganking all their dread fleets over and over. We dont really like picking on weak/decapitated targets and wanted something more of a challenge. God knows how fast D2 would have gone back then. Less stations, less members, less well, everything really.
Considering D2's state back then if we had gone for you we would have been accused of picking on the weak. If we went and picked a side in the Coalition vs RA thing we would have been accused of bandwaggoning and blobbing, and the lag wouldnt have been as much fun. And well the rest of eve, pfft we would just be accused of playing on easy mode :p
Damned if you do and Damned if you don't.
/me starts building Hadrian Wall. ---------------
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Smoking Mirror
Secret Interests Inc.
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:28:00 -
[186]
Originally by: DeadDuck
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
I'm submitting this for the 2007 Internet Awards in the category, "Unintended Irony".
D2, complaining about NAP resets?
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Metal Dude
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:29:00 -
[187]
Edited by: Metal Dude on 06/01/2007 03:30:19
Everyone in BoB can only dreams of massive Titan battles for every single POS that comes out of reinforcement in BoBs space. If we get destroyed, so be it. It will take the whole EVE to do it. Corps in BoB will move on to other, better things. No one will be canceling our subscriptions, thatÆs for sure and most will be looking for targets and Payback (I love that movie). Count on that.
The truth will set you free
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Kcel Chim
Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:44:00 -
[188]
Originally by: DeadDuck It was a nice offensive and very well executed, unfortunately ASCN didnÆt hold as much as I was expecting, the quality gap between BOB and ASCN leaderships was to big, BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy, like it was in the past.
Ascn were never really great allies to start with. Ascn lied, backstabbed and only cared for itself in the past be it in 5. days or now as in the Tribal Souls conflict. Tho i guess for you (d2?) a nap with a bad ally is more important then a good fight and some destruction on the horizon.
Quote:
You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
Ascn provided or was supposed to provide the best competition. Afterall they were labeled as one of the titans of eve. Fun and prestige were to be earned by BoB. I understand that might once again be not that important compared to a solid nap with a bad ally to you (d2?).
Quote:
You have destroyed ASCN and with them AXE pulled back, incapable of dealing alone with AAA. You have now AAA as a neighbour. DonÆt know why but I have the feeling that it wasnÆt a good swap ... Even if you put new friendly alliances in the new regions, they will always be weak and will always trust at their landlordÆs strength and not at their own strength, we can take as example the Fountain situation.
Please dont compare a npc region with an outpost region, 2 different pairs of shoes. AAA are competent but havent declared a war yet, unless u wanna enlighten us ?
Quote:
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
I think you made a good point at the end of your post, D2 is known for its naps, BoB is known for crushing ppl and honouring agreements. Agreements which can be canceled if they arent beneficial anymore to BoB. Sounds smart and better then a stagnant "nap city". Each to their own i guess.
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Eskalin
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 03:44:00 -
[189]
Originally by: Robert Dobbs I'm off for a poo.
thats hot like carl, anyone up for space docking?
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Trich Anosis
Privateers Privateer Alliance
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 03:51:00 -
[190]
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal
Originally by: Davlin Lotze Credit is due obviously. Displacing ASCN from Feyth wasn't something that alot thought would be as easy as you made it seem. Well played.
But what I don't get still is why you cheapen your efforts and accomplishments with the Burn Eden-eqse forum spying and the other forms of out-of-game inflitration??? It just makes you look "low rent."
And with the rot from within that was the case with ASCN, the out of game stuff was even more unnecessary. Hell, just find any number of disgruntled current or former ASCN at the outset of this operation and utilize them.
The point here is two-fold, one to congratulate real accomplishment and two, to ask why turnaround and cheap it with stuff that's unnecessary? Wouldn't you come off as even more of a "eve juggernaut" if you eschewed the out of game crap and not inflitrate official alliance forums, TS, etc?
You think it cheapened the war, I claim otherwise. The spying was not necessary to win battles, but it allowed us to show EVE a massive discrepancy between ASCN's public and private personas. In private, BoB was the devil. In public, false respects and various other forms of pandering were shown.
Had ASCN refrained from making such posts in private, we would not have felt the need to expose and refute them in public. Had they not become so upset over the concept of spying, and accused its legitimacy in EVE, we would not have felt the need to continue doing it.
In the end, it was entertainment at their expense. Didn't have to be that way, but that will be a lesson to inherit.
x about 1,000,000^2
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Shardrael
Caldari AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.01.06 03:55:00 -
[191]
well planned and executed
for what its worth most of the best fights in my eve career thus far were from this war and I am thankful for that experience
regardless of how much I may dislike some of your forum/out of game tactics you have your **** together and not many would dispute that.
heres a toast to whats coming
Originally by: Stamm Some people might have been convinced by the official announcement posted by Steelrat, but not me, I wasn't convinced until some random alt posts a brand new thread.
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Arenis Xemdal
Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 03:56:00 -
[192]
Originally by: DeadDuck
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
Your argument is severely flawed, DeadDuck. Treachery in EVE is when you attack an ally or plot against them under a guise of friendship. There is no treachery in resetting standings when its done the proper way and at the proper time.
Everyone has done it at some point or another. Standings are not the equivalent of friendships. You cannot love or hate thy neighbour based on the color of his ship in space alone. Individuals who take it so literally are the same type to cry when they discover their "allies" are not willing to sacrifice everything. Becoming neutral with ASCN yielded as many benefits to them as it did to us. At the time, it appeared as if the northern alliances would attack in a massive coalition. This would have given ASCN the option of participating or opting out and ignoring any requests for assistance. From that moment in history to the start of ASCN war planning and declaration of hostilities lies many months. Either you are conveniently overlooking this fact, or you have not been in D2 long enough to know details.
Not to derail this wonderful thread, which has absolutely nothing to do with D2.. but your history with ISS and how the change in standings came about to be is closer to "treachery" than anything BoB has ever done. Its quite obvious when your leadership needs to justify this war by claiming ISS is the cashcow of BoB & LV. By all means, destroy them. Our cashcow is in your back yard.
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Scared Mofo
Minmatar Diamonds inc.
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 05:11:00 -
[193]
Originally by: DeadDuck It was a nice offensive and very well executed, unfortunately ASCN didnÆt hold as much as I was expecting, the quality gap between BOB and ASCN leaderships was to big, BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy, like it was in the past.
You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
You have destroyed ASCN and with them AXE pulled back, incapable of dealing alone with AAA. You have now AAA as a neighbour. DonÆt know why but I have the feeling that it wasnÆt a good swap ... Even if you put new friendly alliances in the new regions, they will always be weak and will always trust at their landlordÆs strength and not at their own strength, we can take as example the Fountain situation.
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
Err well, about those thingies that could hurt BoB, I pretty much think that the moment is gone and you were waving and smiling as it passed by. Now ASCN will assist in killing you again; not as an ASCN entity, but as bigger BoB entity ;) Have fun in D3 perhaps...
Nah I'm just rambling nonsense, of course they'll not come after D2. BoB will stop their "Ascendance" now that they had the best fun and when they are blood thirsty, i'm sure they will settle down in feith and have children with the conquered ex-ASCN population and mine to feed their children. Keep chillin' and take it easy
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File
Gallente eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.06 05:42:00 -
[194]
ASCN vs BoB has been my first real PvP experience - and certainly a very interesting one.
I have to admit, that by the end of the war I held far more respect for BoB than I did for most of ASCN. Yeah BoB are arrogant, often unpleasant - but they're also fun to kill and they don't log out of bubbles (which sadly is a lot more than can be said about many other alliances).
It's been a great learning experience overall, and I feel that I am now far better off. Freed from ASCN I went roaming and had more fun in one night than I did during most of my time in ASCN. I think many ex-ASCN PvP focused people and corps will enjoy eve more now that they can do their own thing. I cannot speak for the industrials - my industrial character exists to fund my PvP chars; ASCN as an alliance was the exact opposite.
My only regret is that we didn't get a "last stand in RIT" - I really was looking forward to it. Yeah we'd have lost - horribly so, but you guys just took too long and we tired of waiting.
On a final note; it's been fun seeing more TAOSP in local than ASCN, and I'll certainly miss the TAOSP capital camps. You guys are by far some of the most professional and courteous players I've encountered - I look forward to shooting, and this time actually killing you, again.
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BlackSabbath
Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 06:34:00 -
[195]
molle keep reaching for the " BoB matters" crowd ================================ "i am only here to **** you off" |
WETRAIN
Minmatar ROMANIA Renegades
|
Posted - 2007.01.06 07:30:00 -
[196]
Edited by: WETRAIN on 06/01/2007 07:27:25 Yes indeed good Job BoB.
Just for all you poster up, do you think that ASCN or any other Alliance that BoB destroyed was because they ran out of money or because they didnt have people to fight, i`l tell you guys a secret, when you are a leader ( a lone one) lets say you are a alliance leader and you got 3 ppl that you can count on and 10 fc`s in your alliance... thats 14 people running 4k ppl... stress gets in ... leaders "warp out" , the lack of leaders always kills a alliance quick and swift ----------------------------------------- When People are Ready the Master will come. - Original by Anihilus - -----------------------------------------
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Vince Draken
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 09:42:00 -
[197]
Originally by: DeadDuck It was a nice offensive and very well executed, unfortunately ASCN didnÆt hold as much as I was expecting, the quality gap between BOB and ASCN leaderships was to big, BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy, like it was in the past.
You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
You have destroyed ASCN and with them AXE pulled back, incapable of dealing alone with AAA. You have now AAA as a neighbour. DonÆt know why but I have the feeling that it wasnÆt a good swap ... Even if you put new friendly alliances in the new regions, they will always be weak and will always trust at their landlordÆs strength and not at their own strength, we can take as example the Fountain situation.
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
That about sums up d2, thank you.
The above thoughts and statements are IC and should be taken as such. |
Vince Draken
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 09:51:00 -
[198]
Originally by: File ASCN vs BoB has been my first real PvP experience - and certainly a very interesting one.
I have to admit, that by the end of the war I held far more respect for BoB than I did for most of ASCN. Yeah BoB are arrogant, often unpleasant - but they're also fun to kill and they don't log out of bubbles (which sadly is a lot more than can be said about many other alliances).
It's been a great learning experience overall, and I feel that I am now far better off. Freed from ASCN I went roaming and had more fun in one night than I did during most of my time in ASCN. I think many ex-ASCN PvP focused people and corps will enjoy eve more now that they can do their own thing. I cannot speak for the industrials - my industrial character exists to fund my PvP chars; ASCN as an alliance was the exact opposite.
My only regret is that we didn't get a "last stand in RIT" - I really was looking forward to it. Yeah we'd have lost - horribly so, but you guys just took too long and we tired of waiting.
On a final note; it's been fun seeing more TAOSP in local than ASCN, and I'll certainly miss the TAOSP capital camps. You guys are by far some of the most professional and courteous players I've encountered - I look forward to shooting, and this time actually killing you, again.
Very good post indeed.
The above thoughts and statements are IC and should be taken as such. |
LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 10:58:00 -
[199]
Originally by: DeadDuck It was a nice offensive and very well executed, unfortunately ASCN didnÆt hold as much as I was expecting, the quality gap between BOB and ASCN leaderships was to big, BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy, like it was in the past.
You destroyed ASCN and what have your earn with that, besides fun - and please donÆt say that you could only have fun with ASCN -?
You have destroyed ASCN and with them AXE pulled back, incapable of dealing alone with AAA. You have now AAA as a neighbour. DonÆt know why but I have the feeling that it wasnÆt a good swap ... Even if you put new friendly alliances in the new regions, they will always be weak and will always trust at their landlordÆs strength and not at their own strength, we can take as example the Fountain situation.
Your biggest victory is also your biggest defeat. The "aura" is lost forever, people now know that BOB are not trusty and are capable of twist sides with a single "NAP RESET". Is not easy to keep friends when you use people like you use. You have reached your zenith and in the horizon the first clouds of a big storm are already showing...I will take the words of the Topic Starter and will say:
The higher you are the bigger the fall
Time will tell if you were right and I was wrong. Good luck BOB, I think you will need it.
Just bookmarking this for further date. -------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
King Fury
Caldari New Justice Zenith Affinity
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Posted - 2007.01.06 11:03:00 -
[200]
So have BoB officially beaten ASCN? What happened to the few corps that were making a last stand?
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Sionn Klorgh
Minmatar Black Lance Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.01.06 11:05:00 -
[201]
Quote: BUT in my personal opinion you just hit the wrong target, you choose to destroy what could have been your biggest ally, an ally that according with todayÆs events would have been very handy
and the war is not over for many of us.
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Melkinor T'sbanion
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.01.06 11:06:00 -
[202]
Originally by: Ma'kai
No alliance in 0.0 has a right to hide behind the "don't attack us, were industrial and you'll look bad" bull****. Just like that badger, if you can't defend yourself out in 0.0, why the heck are you out there in the first place? ASCN knew BoB was coming. The war should of been about superior numbers vs superior tactics. However, because of poor leadership and communication on ASCN's side, they weren't able to put up any real resistance. BoB won the war because they were the better alliance, plan and simple.
Read Moostangs post upthread. QFT. We tried to bring our advantage (numbers) to the fight. Lag (for me) and node crashes prevented us from blobbing Bob. Sure we had a some poor leadership, but for chrissakes, it is a game, not a freakin' job. (Perhaps BoB+Dev tinfoil habidashery are true and it IS their job to play, but I digress ... )
I was excited to fight, but soon got tired of dying due to lag. Then there were many nights sitting at POS hoping we could cajole other alliance members into joining the gang. Sorry I could not be on for hours on end, waiting for a chance at action. I have a life.
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ArcticFox
Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.06 12:30:00 -
[203]
Edited by: ArcticFox on 06/01/2007 12:27:34 ASCN destroyed itself, BoB was just a step in that process. Any large PvP alliance with sufficient dedication would have done.
This isn't the fault of everyone in ASCN (I know there were plenty of good people and corps left in there), nor is it the fault of only a few people, but the fact is that well before the BoB attack, it was not the alliance it once had been.
Had ASCN still been even the same alliance that fought G, IRON, and RAZOR in AZN for two months, I beleive you would have gotten your 8-12 month war, and I beleive it would have cost you a fair number of capital ships.
Sadly, the ideals and the shared experience that founded the alliance faded into the background, and ASCN became something else. I beleive the most accurate description I've heard was Xetic 2.0. -------------------------- There is only one +6 sword of WTFPWN in Eve, and only the lag is allowed to equip it. |
Fitz Chivalry
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.06 12:48:00 -
[204]
Originally by: ArcticFox I beleive the most accurate description I've heard was Xetic 2.0.
No, that is not correct. In Xetic the problem was no-one was willing to fight outside of a handful of corps/players.
In ASCN, save for right at the very end, we could always get people willing to fight its just that we were badly outclassed in terms of average pvp skill/experience levels, so that we couldnt find a way to do anything with the numbers to make them count.
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Deidranna
SteelVipers YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.01.06 12:56:00 -
[205]
Originally by: HostageTaker Just wanna say thanks to ASCN, Cyvok and McCreedy.
If it wasn't for the "content" that you provided me with, the StarWars sigs wouldn't be featured in a recent 5 page magazine spread concerning the ASCN - BoB war.
Really enjoyed seeing my sigs in a magazine.
P.S. (3 of the 35+ sigs made throughout the campaign were shown)
any scans or other links?
GM Eldini > Hi, behaving are we?
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Pehova Mindtriq
Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency
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Posted - 2007.01.06 13:00:00 -
[206]
Did you ever salvaged the titan wreck?
Celes/Toxin vs BOB |
ArcticFox
Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.06 13:07:00 -
[207]
Edited by: ArcticFox on 06/01/2007 13:04:33
Originally by: Fitz Chivalry
Originally by: ArcticFox I beleive the most accurate description I've heard was Xetic 2.0.
No, that is not correct. In Xetic the problem was no-one was willing to fight outside of a handful of corps/players.
In ASCN, save for right at the very end, we could always get people willing to fight its just that we were badly outclassed in terms of average pvp skill/experience levels, so that we couldnt find a way to do anything with the numbers to make them count.
I was actually not intending to refer to how ASCN fought. I know it was different from Xetic (hence the 2.0 ), but nonetheless it became (or was rapidly becoming) a bloated industrial alliance, which overextended itself (putting a portion of the capital fleet in Fountain comes to mind, including a number of carriers, which are really the staple for killing enemy dreads these days).
In the G/IRON/RAZOR war we learned a fair few things about stonewalling systems to make the enemy pump as much isk into it as possible before sovreignty even budged, and that was back when sov was daily, by downtime, and small towers counted every bit as much as large in a system with 60 moons. Granted the situation was considerably different by the time the BoB war rolled around, but from the outside it looked like ASCN had decided to neatly forget all of those things. -------------------------- There is only one +6 sword of WTFPWN in Eve, and only the lag is allowed to equip it. |
Lacero Callrisian
Minmatar Solar Storm Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.06 13:15:00 -
[208]
Originally by: Fitz Chivalry
Originally by: ArcticFox I beleive the most accurate description I've heard was Xetic 2.0.
No, that is not correct. In Xetic the problem was no-one was willing to fight outside of a handful of corps/players.
In ASCN, save for right at the very end, we could always get people willing to fight its just that we were badly outclassed in terms of average pvp skill/experience levels, so that we couldnt find a way to do anything with the numbers to make them count.
Wouldn't Xetic have had that problem too if people had fought? If so ASCN solved the first problem of Xetic and found the second, Xetic 2.0
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JA RULER
Caldari Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.06 13:54:00 -
[209]
Originally by: Pehova Mindtriq Did you ever salvaged the titan wreck?
Actually i would like to know that also. Was there any Loot from it also?
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Becham
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Posted - 2007.01.06 15:23:00 -
[210]
Edited by: Becham on 06/01/2007 15:19:36 nice
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 15:39:00 -
[211]
Originally by: JA RULER
Originally by: Pehova Mindtriq Did you ever salvaged the titan wreck?
Actually i would like to know that also. Was there any Loot from it also?
Yes titan was salvaged. Sadly before "salvaging fix". It dropped 1 damaged/burned something (npc frig quality :P)
Loot was taken and i belive judgement is hanged above molle's bed. Fitting was nothing special tbh.
-------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
The Fiddler
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 15:53:00 -
[212]
Originally by: LUKEC ........and i belive judgement is hanged above molle's bed....
No, Judgement is not hanged above his bed.
He's using it as a night lamp on his desk when he is plotting BoB's next moves. Problem is, it only lights up once every hour...
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:18:00 -
[213]
Originally by: The Fiddler
Originally by: LUKEC ........and i belive judgement is hanged above molle's bed....
No, Judgement is not hanged above his bed.
He's using it as a night lamp on his desk when he is plotting BoB's next moves. Problem is, it only lights up once every hour...
Plans forged in darkness... i like it -------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
Riddlock
Minmatar Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:19:00 -
[214]
nice write up , congrats bob :)
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Har Ganeth
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:23:00 -
[215]
Edited by: Har Ganeth on 06/01/2007 16:19:27
Originally by: ArcticFox but nonetheless it became (or was rapidly becoming) a bloated industrial alliance, which overextended itself (putting a portion of the capital fleet in Fountain comes to mind, including a number of carriers, which are really the staple for killing enemy dreads these days).
The move on fountain most certainly was not a mistake.
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Uuve Savisaalo
Umbra Congregatio
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:34:00 -
[216]
Edited by: Uuve Savisaalo on 06/01/2007 16:30:30
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain Gotta love Molles (Or his press agents) writings
its digitalcommunist actually. credit be given where it is due, i guess.
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Ashen Brarn
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:37:00 -
[217]
Edited by: Ashen Brarn on 06/01/2007 16:44:37
Originally by: Will Fireblade
Hopefully for someone who is worth it not some mining alliance with a few fighters in it.. So yeah if you ask me no big accomplishment there anyone with the logistics and firepower you have could do that. In the end like you said it was another POS war.
Oh, thanks so much for the advice Willie. Next time we won't run around in stabbed vagabonds patting ourselves on the back and calling each other UBER because we ganked a few haulers. No sir, we will have raised the bar to actually owning and holding space, and we will not run away when it gets just a little bit too hard. Thanks for your wise words though.
Perhaps you personally will have the honour of making a post if EU manage to ever kill an alliance. You know, take stations, hold it for longer than 5 days. ---
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Astarte Nosferatu
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:48:00 -
[218]
Originally by: Uuve Savisaalo
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain Gotta love Molles (Or his press agents) writings
its digitalcommunist actually. credit be given where it is due, i guess.
Why am I not surprised? The little bugger likes to get involved in everything he sees. If only the smack he spams in Delve from time to time could be a tenth as well written as the OP, I would actually visit Delve more often. Now it's only him trying to give a funny twist to my name, and all the DICE guys are going like "roflmao z0mg hax0r u pwnt him g00d d00d!1!! lool we rawk!".
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Ashen Brarn
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 16:53:00 -
[219]
Originally by: Astarte Nosferatu and all the DICE guys are going like "roflmao z0mg hax0r u pwnt him g00d d00d!1!! lool we rawk!".
The only reason you don't "get" why you're getting pwnt is... well, I don't have the heart to tell you, so I'll let my sock monkey say it:
ollo: "ahahaha get a brain moran!!111onethousandandone"
Sorry, he's a little crude sometimes ---
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UGWidowmaker
Caldari Setenta Corp Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.06 17:07:00 -
[220]
gj bob. as ex paragon soul pilot im very happy to see ascn removed from there. GJ. I will make your wife/mann a widow. |
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Randay
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.06 17:10:00 -
[221]
coo-koo, coo-koo, coo-koo, etc...
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Bigben
Minmatar Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.06 17:43:00 -
[222]
Edited by: Bigben on 06/01/2007 17:42:00 Edited by: Bigben on 06/01/2007 17:41:41 to the OP, well written and a good read, kudos to BoB, always proactive, never saw smacktalk in local, completely different compared to stain these days
but with reference to Dr Smythe's previous post, imo ASCN's demise was not just soley the result of a cack-handed HC, it went through all the levels of hierachy (note: principle of seniority NOT principle of performance), be it the general member not asking for corp support when wanting to fight and thereby idleing in stations/ratting, be it the corp leaderships not fulfilling HC's demands and supporting each member instantaniously when they struggle to fight on, or be it the heads on alliance level, not leading in times of daylong POSsitting but posting "STFU, who are you ? get back on the frontlines" on the alliance board in reply to demotivated member posts (\o SJ, you still got your ****list :P)
unfortunately the citation of Zungen's killing spree didn't make it in the OP, ( i miss your " :P " in corp chat ) ohh, and not to forget, gratz to your superb probing guys, i spent more time ss'ing than pewpewing
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.06 17:46:00 -
[223]
Originally by: Ashen Brarn Edited by: Ashen Brarn on 06/01/2007 16:44:37
Originally by: Will Fireblade
Hopefully for someone who is worth it not some mining alliance with a few fighters in it.. So yeah if you ask me no big accomplishment there anyone with the logistics and firepower you have could do that. In the end like you said it was another POS war.
Oh, thanks so much for the advice Willie. Next time we won't run around in stabbed vagabonds patting ourselves on the back and calling each other UBER because we ganked a few haulers. No sir, we will have raised the bar to actually owning and holding space, and we will not run away when it gets just a little bit too hard. Thanks for your wise words though.
Perhaps you personally will have the honour of making a post if EU manage to ever kill an alliance. You know, take stations, hold it for longer than 5 days.
The stabbed vagabond insult is so pre-kali, frieghters logging in combat is still current though.
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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Ashen Brarn
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:02:00 -
[224]
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
The stabbed vagabond insult is so pre-kali, frieghters logging in combat is still current though.
Must be nice being in an alliance where no single member doesn't break any rules, ever. How's Lunas these days? ---
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:07:00 -
[225]
Edited by: Christopher Multsanti on 06/01/2007 18:14:18
Originally by: Ashen Brarn
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
The stabbed vagabond insult is so pre-kali, frieghters logging in combat is still current though.
Must be nice being in an alliance where no single member doesn't break any rules, ever. How's Lunas these days?
He is pretty inactive, thanks for asking, I don't believe logging in combat is the same as posting on the Eve O forums when your not meant to though.
Edit: I think i'll add that your right, some of our members do break the rules from time to time, that is probably why we are not high and mighty about other corps rule breaking on Eve O, unlike your good self.
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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Ashen Brarn
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:17:00 -
[226]
Edited by: Ashen Brarn on 06/01/2007 18:14:50
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
I don't believe logging in combat is the same as posting on the Eve O forums when your not meant to though.
If you just nod and pretend you got my point, I won't assume you're as stupid as your sig. ---
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:20:00 -
[227]
Originally by: Ashen Brarn Edited by: Ashen Brarn on 06/01/2007 18:14:50
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
I don't believe logging in combat is the same as posting on the Eve O forums when your not meant to though.
If you just nod and pretend you got my point, I won't assume you're as stupid as your sig.
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Firstly, are you roleplaying?
Secondly, I am starting to believe I am stupid
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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Ashen Brarn
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:25:00 -
[228]
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Firstly, are you roleplaying?
Secondly, I am starting to believe I am stupid
Sorry, but your sig is a little dumb. 2nd, you completely missed my point before you edited, but I don't like edits. 3rd. I'll give you a hug if it makes you feel better. I hope you don't take it personally, I am just basing my comments on your reply. ---
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Brunswick2
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:36:00 -
[229]
Quack Quack
I'm going to miss that
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Aero089
Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.06 18:38:00 -
[230]
Hey, no bad words about Chris! He's cool!
BOB, good job on this war with ASCN. Although I'm growing unhappy with having such powerblocks in 0.0 and I'd rather see a lot of powerblocks than just one that ends up becoming dominant over other (smaller) factions.
ASCN and ex-ASCN, I hope you all recover from your personal losses and whatever you all decide to do in the future, I wish you the best of luck with it!
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.06 22:25:00 -
[231]
Originally by: Ashen Brarn
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Firstly, are you roleplaying?
Secondly, I am starting to believe I am stupid
Sorry, but your sig is a little dumb. 2nd, you completely missed my point before you edited, but I don't like edits. 3rd. I'll give you a hug if it makes you feel better. I hope you don't take it personally, I am just basing my comments on your reply.
First. I am glad you like my sig, it's part of a convo that was had with a corp member of ours and a Xelas guy, we basically told him to run hidden plex's and BOB would never know and hence they wouldn't have to pay to use the plex's.
Second. I love edits.
Third. Please don't be so mean in future it hurts my feelings.
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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Hellraiza666
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.07 00:22:00 -
[232]
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Chris your stupid
Originally by: CYVOK ...Very Disappointed, I spent 2 years building a pile of ****. -CYVOK-
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Christopher Multsanti
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.07 00:47:00 -
[233]
Originally by: Hellraiza666 Edited by: Hellraiza666 on 07/01/2007 00:24:28
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Chris your stupid
I am starting to like Dian more than you and thats saying somthing!!
It's great being Amarr that flys Minmintar aint it?
EVIL SYNNs > Bob are the best, we have to pay them to use the plexs...
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kahle
Paralex Research
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Posted - 2007.01.07 01:00:00 -
[234]
Originally by: Ashen Brarn
Originally by: Christopher Multsanti
Your like the second or third BOB member that has called me stupid:
Firstly, are you roleplaying?
Secondly, I am starting to believe I am stupid
Sorry, but your sig is a little dumb. 2nd, you completely missed my point before you edited, but I don't like edits. 3rd. I'll give you a hug if it makes you feel better. I hope you don't take it personally, I am just basing my comments on your reply.
lol at generic bob sig #27, pot-kettle-smack. maybe add 'nice region...' to give it that 100% authentic bob feel
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Plutoinum
German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.01.07 01:14:00 -
[235]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 07/01/2007 01:11:43 Grats to BoB and respect for both sides. For some personal reasons I feel with the ASCN guys now, who tried till the end. It sux to put effort into something and lose it all anyway.
If BoB enters another war within the next months, I'm quite sure that I won't have mixed feelings about it. I doubt that they are after LV and the other parties that are left are the RAGoon block or alliances who are more than willing to go to bed with RAGoon. I cross my fingers for BoB. They are the good guys now !
CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix. |
nightjackel
Vanguard Frontiers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.07 03:19:00 -
[236]
Excellent post Sir molle, I would like to thank BOB for some of the most exciting battles I have had since I've been playing. The best of course was the battle of AZN (Did anyone make a movie?) The tactics and fire power that BOB brought was just too much for most of the corps in ASCN. Granted I was only in ASCN for a short period of time but I saw a lot of looting if not for a better word of their fellow pilots (T2 products). HC was unperpared for and frankly unable to counter BOB's tactics. The propaganda might of BOB was also bewildering to most of ASCN. The paranoia of spies made most of ASCN unable to focus on the problem at hand. Again , congrats to BOB for a fun and a hard fought war.
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saadi
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Posted - 2007.01.07 03:23:00 -
[237]
only a allaince can kill its self no ohter can you can take over there space and station,s but you never can kill a allaince ascn killed its self bob only speed up thing,s for that pat your self on your back it will be just a mahter of time before some one will eat you
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Sentinel Eeex
Caldari Two Brothers Mining Corp.
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Posted - 2007.01.07 03:23:00 -
[238]
BoB won fair and square.
You guys fought damn well, and I hate you for being able to react (+assemble fighting forces) so quickly :)
This war also taught me that many people care more about virtual money/assets than fun. Sadly, many of them ended up in the alliance I was in (that'd be ASCN).
To those ASCNers who *fought* (and didn't just try to put a show to impress future overlords) until the end - I tip my hat to you.
And smack from that "Deathwing" guy was making me laugh out loud every damn time. He's an invaluable entertainment asset :)
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Spartac0
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.07 04:06:00 -
[239]
Edited by: Spartac0 on 07/01/2007 04:06:01 I don't post much on forums cause I suck at it but i have to say a few words and this is not intended to flame anyone so cut me some slack :P
Congratulations to every single pilot of BOB involved in this victory that will be in the books of EVE history and people will talk about it ages from now as probably the biggest "gank" in eve.
I would like to mention a few names that really were a stepstone to our accomplishment here: SirMolle, Tholarim, LadyScarlet (sexy voice), Dianabolic, db preacher, Valora (he found the titan!), farjung, Amthrianius (logistics god), zeus, TWD, blacklight, Red Six, and the list keeps going on and on, I would need a few more pages of forum just for the names of every bob pilot that something.
with a special notation on these two: Tholarim - DICE CEO and imo the best FC in this game SirMolle - Without a doubt the most important link in BOB, our leader, he's very effective when leading a +150 pilot fleet and keeps a cool head all the time (very impressive) Farjung- best overall pilot i've ever had the pleasure to fly with, covert ops, awesome fleet commander (and he looks like mowgli!)
to all bob: congratulations for your discipline on ts, your effectivness in pvp and your greed for killmails.
We have the numbers We have the skills We have the resources We have the brains We have the discipline and most of all we have the balls to take it against anyone and anywhere
but...
we didn't finish off ASCN alone, I have to give credit to CYVOK for him putting his tail between his legs and run away to empire to run missions after losing a 150 billion ship, because that my friends was the break point of ASCN will to fight. "Steve" died on the 11th of December, not even 1 month later all corps either moved out to empire, surrendered, made deals to stay or did whatever but ASCN as an alliance is now dead.
I also found it amusing that one day everyone wanted to burn CYVOK alive for losing the titan (in a very nub way i might add) and when he announces that he's stepping down and leaving to empire everyone started crying and giving him respect for he have done for ascn, you should have thought of that before you insulted him like you did on public and private forums and that's what pretty much made him take that decision.
on the other hand, a lot of people said things about bob leadership that made me laugh, we were accused of hacking, exploiting, RL threatning, RL harassment and god knows what else and when we say: "proof or stfu" silenced presented itself on those that pointed such accusations.
also a big THANKS for the ASCN members that went down on the battlefield and tryed to defend their home you all have my respect, except for a few smacktards that couldn't keep quiet in local but i guess all corps have that.
now that we won the fights, the battles and the war and defeated or enemy it's time for us to enjoy our victory spoils (exotic dancers 4tw)
BOB wins eve
see you in space
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Yazoul Samaiel
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.07 05:21:00 -
[240]
Originally by: SirMolle [ It will be the brotherhood shared as we keep striving through no cessation of efforts to best everyone - including ourselves - in all conceivable ways.
This indeed is the main power of BOB and according to our alliance name it is what holds us togeather and leads us to glory every day in each and every field. It is my greatest pleasure and honor to be part of this brotherhood that realy holds a meaning and not just empty words.
Respect to each and every bob memeber , from leadership to regular memebers who put 100% effort in what they did . Also respect to ASCN memebers who fought us trying to defend their homes with all the hardship they faced mainly their lack of leadeship so kudos to your effrots , as for the delusional and lamers who had fled , well empire is where you are now and will always be for ya. "Lord Samaiel, Rise "
BNC Vs CELES Video
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KingKenny
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Posted - 2007.01.07 05:27:00 -
[241]
Originally by: Spartac0 Edited by: Spartac0 on 07/01/2007 04:06:01 I don't post much on forums cause I suck at it but i have to say a few words and this is not intended to flame anyone so cut me some slack :P
Snip .....
BOB wins eve
see you in space
I don't know much about Bob as I tend to spend most of my time as a carebear empire trader. I do however know they are powerful and rich, very rich. And by the sound of it they can shoot quite well to.
Being in the game as long as I have I worry that 1 single alliance can have so much influence on the game.
The quote about Bob winning Eve, whilst being a very bold statement could become a reality. After all if Bob control 0.0 space or a significant part of it then they control the economy.
Being so powerful could bring peace and stabilty to the Eve Universe. For if they Kill ASCN then who is next. Before we know it they could wipe out most of the major alliances before the Summer. All that will be left will be concord.
Sadly in Eve most of the economy is based on War. Ships, Ammo, Mods etc. There is not much ISK in Grain and Cattle in Eve.
Thus if Peace breaks out there will be a huge downturn in manufacturing output as the mission runners and low sec pirates will struggle to take up the slack.
What will we all do?
Our little corp will struggle for sure as will many others. Bob will control the prices of the Morphite/Mega/Zyd thats if anyone needs it.
If Bob wins Eve, as it may well do. Eve could become a very tedious game indeed.
Whilst Bob deserve a big pat on the back for their destruction of such a large Alliance can we trust the future of the game to them.
In the real world Peace is good and there normally follows a large increase in prosperity following a huge war as people make babies and buy colour TV's.
If Peace breaks out then I fear for Eve, it will be just like real life but without the sex and Colour TV's.
So Bob, for the good of the game, please lose the next war.
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Daelmon
Minmatar Ascent of Ages R i s e
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Posted - 2007.01.07 05:33:00 -
[242]
Great read. Truly impressive.
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USN CVN72
Caldari Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.01.07 06:20:00 -
[243]
hmm awsome work BOB Machine...
Now that the war is over with Ascendant Frontier noone is safe from the BoB Pvp Machine...
2007 will see the beginning of the end of eve as we know it. I predict that by the end of the year Band of Brothers will have dominateded and conquered the entire Eve universe.
Will this happen? Can this happen? Absolutely. Why do i say this? Its because the current state of of conflicts that currently exist has caused Alliances big and small from mobilizing and preparing for true warfare... They are conducting skirmish warfare and waisting valuable assets and time fighting locals or just being greedy for indivisual purposes. Wealth and Outposts and Motherships dont mean crap if you dont have the resources, committment or pvp leadership to lead you to the promise lands of victory...
Band of Brothers have shown us that only the strong survives. They could not have Achieved greatness without an Economic powerhouse to drive their pvp Machine. Bob could not achieved total success without Great PVP Leaders leading thier troops with confidence and resolve.
Do you think there is anyone currently in eve that can stand up to the Band of Brothers? Who knows if there is any one entitly prepared to engage BOB head on...
2007 will be an interesting year indeed. EVE ONLINE one awsome game...
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Bozl1n
Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.07 06:33:00 -
[244]
Edited by: Bozl1n on 07/01/2007 06:33:50 Edited by: Bozl1n on 07/01/2007 06:32:51 By Boz coz he cant type 4 s|-|it
U know sommin mouldy i actuly had respect for the way it was written and the sentiment shown in ur post intill i got to this bit.....
Quote: ASCN thought building a foundation of structures was more important than building one of friendships
LMFAO
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Zafriel
TunDraGon
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Posted - 2007.01.07 23:49:00 -
[245]
Certainly was an interesting read. Well done bob for taking them so fast, tbh I did not think they would have crumbled so easily, but I suppose even the wealthiest highly skilled pvpers will founder without good solid leadership.
What has now happened to the large industrial arm of ASCN? Are they going to stay put and work for bob?
I dont really understand why after beating ASCN that you would want to destroy it, surley it would have better served as a lapdog to mine for your capital ships and farm for your faction modules.
I have a bob sig^^ |
Lowa
Gallente North Star Networks Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.01.08 02:33:00 -
[246]
Realized I havent been in here yet(?).
It was never any doubts, I had hopes to see a challange presented to BoB in more ways than just overtaking a large territory and burning tens of thousands m3 of ice. I dont say ASCN didnt fight back, they did, but without any string of resounding battle victorys it was only a matter of time.
Well played, dedication and teamwork will always win!
Cheers, Lowa
What if the truth was something else? |
Jasmine Dupre
Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.08 08:30:00 -
[247]
Congrats BoB
You deserve respect for pulling this off and you fought well. This War taught me that in EvE what counts for everything is comradeship and I hope that SHA K can one day be a part of, or have a large group of people who know how to work well with each other. To Blacklight o/
I hope that the new recruits you now have from SHA K do well and give you the friendship they gave me.
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DarkFenix
Caldari Pilots From Honour
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Posted - 2007.01.08 09:02:00 -
[248]
I wonder who will be smashed by the pendulum of doom next .
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Earthan
Gallente The Amazing Fire Eaters Breidablik
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Posted - 2007.01.08 09:44:00 -
[249]
Big Kudos to BOB, even tough we are on opposite sides, i didnt think killing ascn so fast was possible.
scary.
The Amazing Fire Eaters webpage
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Vanguard Frontiers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.08 10:18:00 -
[250]
I tip my hat sir, BoB made little in the way of mistakes, and if anything, the lesson is learned that you must fit your army with the best available equipment, and have excellent people leading your fleet to ensure victory over your enemies.
Even though BoB won on the first point alone, they also took the "weather and terrain" into consideration while ASCN did not. This ment they could handle lag and node crashes a lot better, which is very important regardless the size of fleet battles. Only a foolish General blames the gods that he lost a battle due to rain, and BoB has no foolish Generals. BoB also knew how to keep their disciplined troops motivated, which was a major issue for ASCN to do the same.
All fights I have seen and been in have been clean and fair, and in the age of EvE where people do 40man logon traps to catch a cruiser, this is quite refreshing to fight an opponent that does not need to stoop to those tactics. --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE |
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Confessor
Lynx Frontier Inc. Sparta Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 11:22:00 -
[251]
Congratulations BoB for a great and epic war. My best days flying were with the Sha Karn corp, attacking in Delve, Paragon Soul, and finally in Feyth. Sha Karn were hardcore pvpers who did it thier way, and it worked. I will miss flying with you all in the future!
Many of us grunts became FC's in the final weeks of the war and saw through the lies that ASCN high command (pathetic name for themselves) used and were telling us. Most of the "power corps" in the alliance left us trial ascn corps as meatsheilds while they pulled all assets out of 0.0, BUT continued to tell us what to do, etc. I have screen shots of 2 of ASCN's strongest corps running the plexes for days on end while paragon soul fell, then as Feyth was being sieged, you guessed it, They were doing plexes again. I have absolute contempt for them and those corp leaders will be kos in my books from now until the end. Shame on you for what you did to the rest of us while we fought for your wallet, and lost nearly everything we had to support your capital fleet pullout under the ruse that you were fighting bob in fountain.
BoB you tought many of us how to fight, and we'll take our experience and forge it to fight once again. Confessor
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Plutoinum
German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.01.08 11:33:00 -
[252]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 08/01/2007 12:04:05
Originally by: USN CVN72
2007 will see the beginning of the end of eve as we know it. I predict that by the end of the year Band of Brothers will have dominateded and conquered the entire Eve universe.
Will this happen? Can this happen? Absolutely.
I doubt it, because their enemies have x-times their numbers and a lot of them are strong experienced pvp alliances.
But one thing is for sure, if BoB manages somehow to 'win' EVE anyway by beating the rest off, then they deserve it. ... Because if you leave forum warfare and the TS-story aside and just look at BoB's performance, how they accomplish their goals like a clockwork in a timely manner and that most often by their own power, then the only conclusion can be that their alliance works damn well and deserves every success they got so far.
Ok, enough brown nosing, checking skills now.
edit: Well, if BoB ever meets RA+X, it well get interesting. RA follows quite a different style, they are no steam rollers, but you can't steam roll RA either. RA are maybe the best long-term strategists in-game, have lived under war conditions forever and they just refuse to die. They are back with a new plan soon and then it's a good one that seems to work. I respect RA a lot for that somehow and sometimes also 'hate' them for it. They are a pain in the arse.
CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix. |
Lucre
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.08 11:48:00 -
[253]
Originally by: Confessor and lost nearly everything we had to support your capital fleet pullout under the ruse that you were fighting bob in fountain.
I can't speak for other corps, but STK dreads were fighting in Fountain - and indeed we lost a few there. Certainly no "ruse" for us. And there was no pullout of assets from 0.0 on our part until well after AZN had been sieged and abandoned to its fate.
Whether other ASCN corps could reasonably be accused of putting the integrity of their dread force ahead of their commitment to the war is another matter. As indeed is whether this ultimately made any difference except to the scale of BoB's victory - given the "spied" but plausible suggestion that the destruction of ASCN's capital fleet was one of their objectives.
Actually, I think the destruction of 7 out of 10 ASCN dreadnoughts in an early engagement in Paragon may well have been, along with CYVOK's departure, the critical point of the war. The lost ships were replaced, but the lost confidence in their employment wasn't.
- It's great not being ASCN any more, aint it? |
Manfred Sideous
Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.08 11:56:00 -
[254]
To BOB : Kudos my friends!!!
To ASCN: To the pilots that fought to the bitter end hold your head high.
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Rift Scorn
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.08 18:30:00 -
[255]
Edited by: Rift Scorn on 08/01/2007 18:27:08
Originally by: Har Ganeth Edited by: Har Ganeth on 08/01/2007 18:20:10
Originally by: Confessor Shame on you for what you did to the rest of us while we fought for your wallet, and lost nearly everything we had to support your capital fleet pullout under the ruse that you were fighting bob in fountain.
Not sure exactly who you're pointing fingers at here - perhaps you should be more specific with your accusations - as well as making sure they're founded in truth with evidence to back them up rather than believing various BoB posts.
That is the truth and everything DB wrote hit the nail on the head. That's the nearest you're going to get to 'proof' par se. We won't say who it was, because we said we wouldn't. I guess that will have to go straight to the tin-foil hattists out there as to who, but the why has already been explained.
We're always straight forward, no reason we should not be with this. Believe it or not, up to you.
Your friendly clone activation expert, free of service to the eve community since '03 |
Red Six
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.08 18:35:00 -
[256]
Edited by: Red Six on 08/01/2007 18:32:10 Rift - You are getting the two confused. Confessor is talking about ASCN members who did nothing but the 10/10 plexes while PS and Feyth burned, like Nero and Rome. Har Ganeth is telling Confessor to make specifics accusations with proof and not just believe what we say. 0oyz has nothing to do with these just timing in the thread makes them look related.
Oh and log on during US timezone hours again so I can harass you over TS been entirely to long friend.
Originally by: Eridu Fallen
Upon closer inspection, that Caldari BS doesn't even look like it got hit with the ugly stick, it looks like it *is* the ugly stick.
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AKULA UrQuan
Caldari STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.08 23:10:00 -
[257]
Both of you two missed the point I think. Confessor's statement was directed at STK's "Mission Impossible" over in fountian.
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ponieus
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.08 23:13:00 -
[258]
Originally by: AKULA UrQuan Both of you two missed the point I think. Confessor's statement was directed at STK's "Mission Impossible" over in fountian.
well yeah I think they did but they brought into light why you guys failed.
To many doing to many differnt things all at once instead of working together as a team on one thing....
But thats here nor there now.. A new day is on the horizon time to see what it brings. ----------------------------------------------- ok ok
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.08 23:19:00 -
[259]
>>>Confessor is talking about ASCN members who did nothing but the 10/10 plexes while PS and Feyth burned>>>>
Well, all those that I know running the 10/10 complex in D-F (dunno about the other plexes, as I was assigned to this one) did not keep the high-value loot for themselves but it was sold for corp and alliance to finance the war. Which was several hundred billion ISK from plexes in the last months. So yes, ASCN members were running those plexes and (even during the war) defending it against others (primarily RUA and allies, but also BoB wolfpacks). And no, they did not do it for their own profit.
You will find many of those people on the killboards too (losses and kills), so they did their part in fighting at the frontline in between plex respawns too.
Logistics and financing is an important part of any large scale conflict, as important as any fleet engagement.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:10:00 -
[260]
With regards STK...
They told ASCN they had spent weeks setting themselves in place for their attack on Fountain.
Then they got killzored in y-2 the very same week they said that.
Then they said they would be pulling back to assist with AZN.
Then the very same week we killzored azn.
Then they said... actually I have no clue what they said but I'm sure it was something along the lines of "eeek, ruuuuuun".
Which they did!
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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ollobrains
Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:14:00 -
[261]
so um whos running the same plexes these days have they been turned over to bob alts- bob friendly alts or have other hostile parties moved in to take up the slack and hte ISK
How much is exploration influencing usage of these plexes as well ?
All posts made by myself represent my personal opinion only - they do not represent the rest of the privateer alliacne unless they decide to agree with what im saying
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Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:16:00 -
[262]
Earlier this evening, a scotsman was seen acting suspiciously outside a local offlicence. ....
Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003. |
DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:17:00 -
[263]
Originally by: ollobrains so um whos running the same plexes these days have they been turned over to bob alts- bob friendly alts or have other hostile parties moved in to take up the slack and hte ISK
How much is exploration influencing usage of these plexes as well ?
go away Mrs Overlord, you ain't getting nothing from us.
I've said it before and I'll say it again "WE have never worked with m0o, we will never work with m0o"!
/me shakes fist
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Sun Ra
Godspeed You Black Emperor
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:28:00 -
[264]
Originally by: DB Preacher
Originally by: ollobrains so um whos running the same plexes these days have they been turned over to bob alts- bob friendly alts or have other hostile parties moved in to take up the slack and hte ISK
How much is exploration influencing usage of these plexes as well ?
go away Mrs Overlord, you ain't getting nothing from us.
I've said it before and I'll say it again "WE have never worked with m0o, we will never work with m0o"!
/me shakes fist
dbp
Arcane Frankologies - 'plz stop guys it's xmas' |
Nifel
Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 01:29:00 -
[265]
Originally by: DB Preacher
Originally by: ollobrains so um whos running the same plexes these days have they been turned over to bob alts- bob friendly alts or have other hostile parties moved in to take up the slack and hte ISK
How much is exploration influencing usage of these plexes as well ?
go away Mrs Overlord, you ain't getting nothing from us.
I've said it before and I'll say it again "WE have never worked with m0o, we will never work with m0o"!
/me shakes fist
dbp
We have never worked with "The new MOO", we will never with "The new MOO"!
"When I die I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my grandpa. Not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car." RKK Ranking: Sama |
Kayosoni
Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 05:26:00 -
[266]
gratz bob. -----------------------------------
btw, threatening to close 1 account really hurt my eyes. - xaioguai |
Gary Barlow
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Posted - 2007.01.09 06:07:00 -
[267]
Originally by: Kayosoni gratz bob.
asl?
I am a mighty handsome feller .. |
Liu Kaskakka
PAK Shroud Of Darkness
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Posted - 2007.01.09 06:09:00 -
[268]
Originally by: Gary Barlow
Originally by: Kayosoni gratz bob.
asl?
Gary is my special friend.
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Zarin
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Posted - 2007.01.09 06:45:00 -
[269]
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
We know how hard it is to make a bunch of carebears fight, how hard is it to make someone without a sense of honour, loyal to the Horde. I mean, if you build an alliance from fallen enemies, how quickly will they change sides next time?
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Riddlock
Minmatar Sha Kharn Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.09 07:11:00 -
[270]
Originally by: Zarin
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
We know how hard it is to make a bunch of carebears fight, how hard is it to make someone without a sense of honour, loyal to the Horde. I mean, if you build an alliance from fallen enemies, how quickly will they change sides next time?
If bob gets the pvp'ers from ascn , wich tbh are not that many , bob will only get stronger , I personally think that will be very very very very very nice to fly in gangs with ppl who know how to fit a ship , have the isk to fit those pesky tech 2 items and actually perform the complicated things such as align, warp the fk off, activate f1-f8 on primary .
/me trains for dice forum warrioring skill
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Helen
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:37:00 -
[271]
Originally by: DB Preacher With regards STK...
They told ASCN they had spent weeks setting themselves in place for their attack on Fountain.
Then they got killzored in y-2 the very same week they said that.
Then they said they would be pulling back to assist with AZN.
Then the very same week we killzored azn.
Then they said... actually I have no clue what they said but I'm sure it was something along the lines of "eeek, ruuuuuun".
Which they did!
dbp
While your timeline is a little off, I can confirm we had planned a large scale invasion of Fountain which called for many objectives to be pulled off not least the rallying of local anti bob corps. Initially it worked great achieving gangs of 60+ in size however when it came to the crunch we couldn't rely on certain key factors so the invasion couldn't be achieved.
We lost 3 dreads in Y-2ANO no biggie they were easily replacable however at the same time CYVOK's titan was lost which precipated a morale loss alliance wide, naturally when our very first outpost came under attack we felt it pertinant to return home.
Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
We had spent weeks setting up in Fountain the logistics involved weren't easy for a typically 15 man crew also the complete scouting of Fountain was achieved too with every pos mapped and analysied.
Losing AZN and having only 15 men in gang proved that ASCN was no longer a functioning alliance when your fellow alliance mates decide that your home is no longer worth trying to defend its over. We didn't get any offers to relocate to other parts of Feyth so decided to setup in Stain (last bastion of the damned).
So yeah DB when you lose your outposts and you have no alliance support you have to relocate but I'm pretty sure none of us said eeek, ruuuun because if we said that sort of thing we probably would never have tried to defend AZN after all. You also didn't get AZN for xmas but I'm sure your not too sad about that.
http://www.pietermodderman.nl/sleek%20sig%20-%20Helen%204.jpg Please resize your sig so that it is under 400x120. Thanks. -Conuion Meow ([email protected]) |
Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:45:00 -
[272]
Edited by: Fi T''Zeh on 09/01/2007 10:45:29 ú$%ú$^ú$$&*(%^&%^ Forums. ....
Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003. |
Rift Scorn
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:46:00 -
[273]
Originally by: Red Six Oh and log on during US timezone hours again so I can harass you over TS been entirely to long friend.
New year. New Job. New Basement to move into. No more all-nighters for this monkey for a little while.
oh yeah, and err ... stuff about things to stay on topic ......
Your friendly clone activation expert, free of service to the eve community since '03 |
Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:49:00 -
[274]
I got an electric tooth brush for Christmas, and so far I've found it more useful than AZN. ....
Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003. |
Yazoul Samaiel
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:50:00 -
[275]
Originally by: Helen Too little , too late stuff
Going to fountain gazillion jumps away from your homeland to claim silly ganks = Bad. Trying to seige pos that wont hurt the enemy in the slightest and losing your cap ships = Very bad. Arriving very late to AZN after it has fallen to enemy hands and you have no more capital system = Game over.
You dealt a bad hand and you got royaly flushed for it , learn from it and stop trying to make it sound better. "Lord Samaiel, Rise "
BNC Vs CELES Video
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Helen
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:02:00 -
[276]
Edited by: Helen on 09/01/2007 11:02:59 Actually if you check your own killboards you'll see STK has had a hand in trying to defend AZN from when you put a pos in system.
Nothing about trying to sound better I'm giving factual information regarding the timeline. After all this is what people will refer to in future for information on what happened.
Also we never sieged a pos in Y-2ANO when we lost the dreads it was us jumping in dreads to try and take out an Xelas dread that was attacking ours! Please don't comment unless you were there.
http://www.pietermodderman.nl/sleek%20sig%20-%20Helen%204.jpg Please resize your sig so that it is under 400x120. Thanks. -Conuion Meow ([email protected]) |
Yazoul Samaiel
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:11:00 -
[277]
Originally by: Helen Edited by: Helen on 09/01/2007 11:02:59 Please don't comment unless you were there.
I wasnt ?
Yeah right i was prob busy mining veld in empire , get a clue ffs. "Lord Samaiel, Rise "
BNC Vs CELES Video
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Proxay
Gallente Fallen Angel's Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:14:00 -
[278]
Originally by: Helen Edited by: Helen on 09/01/2007 11:02:59 Actually if you check your own killboards you'll see STK has had a hand in trying to defend AZN from when you put a pos in system.
Nothing about trying to sound better I'm giving factual information regarding the timeline. After all this is what people will refer to in future for information on what happened.
Also we never sieged a pos in Y-2ANO when we lost the dreads it was us jumping in dreads to try and take out an Xelas dread that was attacking ours! Please don't comment unless you were there.
tbh general XS view was good that ASCN was in fountain, we saw it as 'ok we'll live with em, but it just means that ASCN is 1 corp short down south to effectively defend themselves, which we saw as a tactical dis-advantage when going head on with bob.
No doubts looking back that ASCN's invasion on fountain was by far and away a horrible move, for only one day in the war did a small portion of bob come to fountain to deal with it (as far as i know), which really says a lot about the effectiveness or planning behind the operations as a whole.
Had some good fights, standout moment for me was 1v1 gallentious in a 4/10 and killed his t2 fitted stabber with my enyo...was very lol.
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:17:00 -
[279]
Edited by: LUKEC on 09/01/2007 11:16:34
Quote:
Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
Yes you failed to reinforce pos that was 20 or so jumps away from any bigger BoB force. 5 more minutes and all your dreads would be self destructing. Also reinforcing pos doesn't really equal killing it. You would have to fight when pos would come out of reinforced mode and we all know how good that went for you.
Also your gang didn't logoff but they pulled standard 101 ascn trick ... run for your (frig) lives again and left the gate. So our gang just run through your camp for your dreads. Sadly you managed to cyno them out. Most of them.
It was ok plan... on paper. -------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
Helen
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:27:00 -
[280]
Originally by: Yazoul Samaiel
Originally by: Helen Edited by: Helen on 09/01/2007 11:02:59 Please don't comment unless you were there.
I wasnt ?
Yeah right i was prob busy mining veld in empire , get a clue ffs.
Oh I'm sorry just when you say stuff like we were sieging a pos when infact we were attacking a Xelas dread attacking our pos then I got the impression you were no where near the place because if you were there attacking those dreads you might of been wondering why the hell the pos was shooting you.
Originally by: LUKEC Edited by: LUKEC on 09/01/2007 11:16:34
Quote:
Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
Yes you failed to reinforce pos that was 20 or so jumps away from any bigger BoB force. 5 more minutes and all your dreads would be self destructing. Also reinforcing pos doesn't really equal killing it. You would have to fight when pos would come out of reinforced mode and we all know how good that went for you.
Also your gang didn't logoff but they pulled standard 101 ascn trick ... run for your (frig) lives again and left the gate. So our gang just run through your camp for your dreads. Sadly you managed to cyno them out. Most of them.
It was ok plan... on paper.
Which is kinda why ASCN failed wasn't it in the end if we can't pop poses when they come out of reinforced there was no hope. And I believe I never said that reinforcing a pos equals killing it. It does however tend to make you guys go very reactive which frees up other places.
As for you Proxay I'm glad you managed to kill Gallentious but how much damage did he alone inflict on your entire alliance?
http://www.pietermodderman.nl/sleek%20sig%20-%20Helen%204.jpg Please resize your sig so that it is under 400x120. Thanks. -Conuion Meow ([email protected]) |
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:46:00 -
[281]
Edited by: DB Preacher on 09/01/2007 11:42:44
Originally by: Helen So yeah DB when you lose your outposts and you have no alliance support you have to relocate but I'm pretty sure none of us said eeek, ruuuun because if we said that sort of thing we probably would never have tried to defend AZN after all. You also didn't get AZN for xmas but I'm sure your not too sad about that.
Hey, I did say I had no clue what you said and was guessing (also I was very drunk when I wrote that post last night) ;p
I was sad that I didn't get AZN for xmas because it meant I missed the end of ASCN coz I was on holiday :,<
STK had a bit of a plan to get stuff done in Fountain but you made some key mistakes in achieving it.
Firstly, anything you took in Fountain, we would have ignored until we could take it back.
At no point would it have slowed down our invasion of Feth, instead it actually gave our attack more venom because as players we had lots of stuff to do. The way we set up RKK was so that we could deal with an attack on multiple regions and truth be told, I actually prefer to be under attack constantly all over the place rather than sieging in one place.
This meant that although STK had heady goals to start with, nothing that occurred in Fountain would have affected us at all. We can happily see the long term plan. What happens if we lose a station for 2 weeks? Absolutely nothing.
PNQ should have shown you the problem with attacking fountain. We ignored it because we knew you could not hold it.
If you are in a war, the last thing you do is stretch your logistical line so far that it's impossible to get new ships.
Secondly, when STK did stay in fountain, I said very quickly that we only needed to kill STK once. I was pretty sure that if you lost your dread fleet that you would pull out regardless of what was happening elsewhere because if you lot them once, you would know that you could lose them again.
I know that dreads are easy to replace in today's game but that doesn't mean that people are happy to do it everyday for no real gain.
Thirdly, we have experience of what you were doing from before. During the GNW, while the rest of PA were fighting on the frontlines in BKG, two corps - CE and KIA, who the PA looked to be some of their best fighters, were off fighting c0d and Fade Union. They were getting loads of kills against the npc'ers and miners of those alliances but this did nothing but cause internal strife within the PA. We were certain this would start to happen with STK as well... and it did. The general populace of ASCN started questioning what STK was actually achieving in Fountain. Although you answered well, you merely delayed the inevitable.
I'm afraid I'm not going to sit and tell you what you should have done, that is for you to try and work out.
Truth be told, STK had some spunk but without the experience, backing and a few other things that I won't mention, you never had a chance.
Either way, at least you aren't bitter like various other corp leaders who we have fought against.
Take STK from here and do something fun with it.
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Confessor
Lynx Frontier Inc. Sparta Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:47:00 -
[282]
Let's actually sum this up from the ASCN FC point of view during the last weeks. only a few carriers participated, and 1 man flew 5 dread accounts to put a pos in reinforced in c9n. Meanwhile, the plex *****s ARE raping the plexes 23/7 making isk for themselves and thier "capital support" corps that of course never materialized on the home front. I dont want to hear anymore bullsh1t from the ascn corps that claimed to be supporting us fools ont he front line fighting tooth and nail for your full retreat while hearing "we'll be right there boys, just one more day, hold tight, fight to the end"
Daskintiger, tasha yor, and a select few others that stepped up with me to fc, You have my best reguards.
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Proxay
Gallente Fallen Angel's Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:51:00 -
[283]
Originally by: Helen
As for you Proxay I'm glad you managed to kill Gallentious but how much damage did he alone inflict on your entire alliance?
oh wasn't bragging, just saying that was fun.
Yeah, that was a mean stabber, good fights, and some skilled pvpers in STK (god tremerlyn needs to turn on his guns when he gets shot) for the most part, certainly an agressive and bold move, especially pnq, but essentially as dbp just outlined, it was fruitless.
Good luck in the future though of course.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:18:00 -
[284]
Originally by: welsh wizard Helen, honestly mate, don't bother. Sense and reason aren't welcome in here.
I take it you didnt actually bother to read my post then
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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welsh wizard
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:19:00 -
[285]
Originally by: DB Preacher
Originally by: welsh wizard Helen, honestly mate, don't bother. Sense and reason aren't welcome in here.
I take it you didnt actually bother to read my post then
dbp
Your post was great, I'm referring to the usual suspects.
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Fuglife
TOUAREGS
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:20:00 -
[286]
Originally by: welsh wizard Helen, honestly mate, don't bother. Sense and reason aren't welcome in here.
BACK TO YOUR BRIDGE TROLL!!!!
And as for you helen, why wont you return my calls _____
Hail Moderator! This be me main character! |
DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:20:00 -
[287]
Originally by: welsh wizard
Originally by: DB Preacher
Originally by: welsh wizard Helen, honestly mate, don't bother. Sense and reason aren't welcome in here.
I take it you didnt actually bother to read my post then
dbp
Your post was great, I'm referring to the usual suspects.
Let you off then
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Helen
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:28:00 -
[288]
Originally by: Fuglife
Originally by: welsh wizard Helen, honestly mate, don't bother. Sense and reason aren't welcome in here.
BACK TO YOUR BRIDGE TROLL!!!!
And as for you helen, why wont you return my calls
Probably because you left me after new years eve feeling alone and used... why didn't you call me sooner.
Also Welsh yeah I know sense and reason get left at the door in this place usually but doesn't mean I like getting kicked around.
my sig was fine you b*astards didn't you notice the shiny MS in it. |
Faramir.
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:28:00 -
[289]
It would seem my timing is off.
Better luck next war
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Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:31:00 -
[290]
Originally by: Faramir. It would seem my timing is off.
Better luck next war
ZOMG IT LIIIIIIIIIVES ....
Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003. |
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WETRAIN
Minmatar ROMANIA Renegades
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:42:00 -
[291]
Originally by: Faramir. It would seem my timing is off.
Better luck next war
Holy Moses ... Faramir .. the name brings pain into my heart sincer the GNW ----------------------------------------- When People are Ready the Master will come. - Original by Anihilus - -----------------------------------------
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Nomore Telindus
Gallente Wings of Turul Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.09 13:05:00 -
[292]
Originally by: Helen Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
For the record: I made the bubbles and we didn't logged off. The BoB gang killed our little force at the gate, that is why we disappeared from the local.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 13:15:00 -
[293]
Originally by: Nomore Telindus
Originally by: Helen Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
For the record: I made the bubbles and we didn't logged off. The BoB gang killed our little force at the gate, that is why we disappeared from the local.
Actually, if the 100 man fleet that ran to AZN had just thrown theirselves infront of us, that would have given you the time to actually put the pos into reinforced.
We were actually split up between that fleet but we outmanouvered them, got together then they legged it back to AZN letting us steamroll down to the pos.
Nothing is more exciting than being in a mob of BoB chasing down a target :D
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Helen
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.01.09 13:15:00 -
[294]
I was told the guys doing it had to log off due to RL mate didn't realise you guys got popped, oh well.
my sig was fine you b*astards didn't you notice the shiny MS in it. |
Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.09 16:11:00 -
[295]
Originally by: Confessor Meanwhile, the plex *****s ARE raping the plexes 23/7 making isk for themselves and thier "capital support" corps that of course never materialized on the home front. I dont want to hear anymore bullsh1t from the ascn corps that claimed to be supporting us fools ont he front line fighting tooth and nail for your full retreat while hearing "we'll be right there boys, just one more day, hold tight, fight to the end"
Greetings, Confessor
would you care to name those people or corps you believe to have "raped the plexes 23/7 making isk for themselves " ?
I can only speak about the team doing the 10/10 plex in D-F. They did not run the plex for themselves. If you want to know where the money from that plex has been used : check killboards for number of EDF and VAF ships (including several capital ships) having been destroyed defending ASCN space (many ! - most ASCN gangs had a high number of EDF pilots). Not to forget the cost for POS parts and POS fuel. Add to that capital ship jump fuel expenses. Add again the amount of money needed for mineral compression in Empire, to make cheap ship replacements programs possible. Plus a certain amount of cash for the Titan building coming from plex revenues. The money did NOT go into the wallets of the individual pilots running the plex.
It is possible that some plexes have been run by certain people or certain corps for their own profit during the war. If this is so, please mention their names and which plex has been abused in your opinion.
At present I think you are making a general statement which is not true.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Kirja
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Posted - 2007.01.09 16:20:00 -
[296]
Edited by: Kirja on 09/01/2007 16:23:51
Originally by: Ariel Durant "A great civilization is not conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within." .
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Kirja
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Posted - 2007.01.09 16:20:00 -
[297]
Edited by: Kirja on 09/01/2007 16:23:51
Originally by: Ariel Durant "A great civilization is not conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within." .
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Castryon Merk
Minmatar SUBLIME L.L.C. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.09 16:35:00 -
[298]
Yeah, GF all... even though it was like taking 10 people with machine guns into a fight with 40 people with knives...
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SARPIDON
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.09 19:05:00 -
[299]
Originally by: Riddlock
Originally by: Zarin
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
We know how hard it is to make a bunch of carebears fight, how hard is it to make someone without a sense of honour, loyal to the Horde. I mean, if you build an alliance from fallen enemies, how quickly will they change sides next time?
If bob gets the pvp'ers from ascn , wich tbh are not that many , bob will only get stronger , I personally think that will be very very very very very nice to fly in gangs with ppl who know how to fit a ship , have the isk to fit those pesky tech 2 items and actually perform the complicated things such as align, warp the fk off, activate f1-f8 on primary .
/me trains for dice forum warrioring skill
You seem to have some brown stuff on your nose and face, would you like a tissue? Oh and if you need to get any higher up that hole, Im sure you know a few guys with ladders...
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Rift Scorn
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 22:02:00 -
[300]
Edited by: Rift Scorn on 09/01/2007 22:01:17
Originally by: SARPIDON
Originally by: Riddlock
Originally by: Zarin
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Rennard
This is very important what they will do. ASCN pvpers who lost, they didnt quit game, their skills still exists, their experience grow a lot more.
What will they do?
Join BOB?
We know how hard it is to make a bunch of carebears fight, how hard is it to make someone without a sense of honour, loyal to the Horde. I mean, if you build an alliance from fallen enemies, how quickly will they change sides next time?
If bob gets the pvp'ers from ascn , wich tbh are not that many , bob will only get stronger , I personally think that will be very very very very very nice to fly in gangs with ppl who know how to fit a ship , have the isk to fit those pesky tech 2 items and actually perform the complicated things such as align, warp the fk off, activate f1-f8 on primary .
/me trains for dice forum warrioring skill
You seem to have some brown stuff on your nose and face, would you like a tissue? Oh and if you need to get any higher up that hole, Im sure you know a few guys with ladders...
Riddlock accused of brown nosing BoB!
There's a first! I see you don't know your ex-Alliance mates very well, he was in lower Delve almost constantly through this war in all fairness.
Your friendly clone activation expert, free of service to the eve community since '03 |
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Divus
Hybrid Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.10 01:18:00 -
[301]
a well written press release as always, sir
\o/ hi moooom
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Brunswick2
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.10 01:40:00 -
[302]
First, GF BoB! You made the past couple months of my EVE life very fun and interesting for me. Looking forward to fighting you guys in the future.
I had a lot of fun memories of this war, and some not so fun, like recharging a large POS in C9N with just 6 ospreys and an augoror.
Second, ex-ASCN guys, I see some people trying to blame everyone in ASCN for what went wrong, except yourself. You need to stop looking at what others did wrong and see what YOU and what your corp did wrong. Suck it up, learn from it, and move on. Become a better player and never make those mistakes again.
And everyone in ASCN, keep in touch! We may no longer be in the same iga, but I've met a lot of people in ASCN who I have a lot of respect for, and I would like to keep in contact with lots of you guys.
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J909
KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.10 02:01:00 -
[303]
Big salute to AZN and BoB, emotions must have been flying on both sides throughout this, read allot about it all.
/bow to all sides involved in big Eve history. ----------------------------------------------- Cash from Chaos |
Frogzuk
Dragonian Freelancers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 02:02:00 -
[304]
good post
The enemies of BOB actually lost what i believe a golden opportunity to actually turn the screws on BOB in this case and actually damage BOB enough to possibly an extent that it would never have been the same alliance again.
The fact is this, as i have learnt in Northern Ireland with the loyalist paramilitaries, and lately with the republican movement, so long as the enemies of BOB are fighting each other then BOB will not have anyone to 'stand up' to them.
A golden opportunity presented itself, early in the IMP / GOON invasion along side RA against KOS/V/LV if only these alliances had stopped shooting each other and put to one side the bad feelings this would had taken the whole of the eve community and BOB in particular by surprise.
BOB could then have been hit from not 1 but 2 fronts with D2 / IRON / RAZOR and friends from the north hitting them from beyond cloud ring and V / LV / RA / GOONS / IMP joining sides with ASCN to hit them from Curse. Personally i dont think BOB would had sustained that kind of onslaught.
Then once the fighting had finish then everyone could go back to bashing each other as they usually do ! Why this didnt happen is simple too many egos and too much pride.
Well,these are my thoughts and i salute BOB for the effectiveness in what you have done, however i do not believe you are 'unbeatable'.. i personally look forward to the day the egos are put to one side who knows what is possible and i know which side i were choose if this were the case and so do my friends :) !
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hothead
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.01.10 02:31:00 -
[305]
Curahee BOB :)
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BlackDog Rackh'am
Minmatar Maza Nostra Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2007.01.10 04:10:00 -
[306]
Originally by: Frogzuk good post
The enemies of BOB actually lost what i believe a golden opportunity to actually turn the screws on BOB in this case and actually damage BOB enough to possibly an extent that it would never have been the same alliance again.
The fact is this, as i have learnt in Northern Ireland with the loyalist paramilitaries, and lately with the republican movement, so long as the enemies of BOB are fighting each other then BOB will not have anyone to 'stand up' to them.
A golden opportunity presented itself, early in the IMP / GOON invasion along side RA against KOS/V/LV if only these alliances had stopped shooting each other and put to one side the bad feelings this would had taken the whole of the eve community and BOB in particular by surprise.
BOB could then have been hit from not 1 but 2 fronts with D2 / IRON / RAZOR and friends from the north hitting them from beyond cloud ring and V / LV / RA / GOONS / IMP joining sides with ASCN to hit them from Curse. Personally i dont think BOB would had sustained that kind of onslaught.
Then once the fighting had finish then everyone could go back to bashing each other as they usually do ! Why this didnt happen is simple too many egos and too much pride.
Well,these are my thoughts and i salute BOB for the effectiveness in what you have done, however i do not believe you are 'unbeatable'.. i personally look forward to the day the egos are put to one side who knows what is possible and i know which side i were choose if this were the case and so do my friends :) !
There is lot of hypothetical talk going around about an anti-BoB bandwagon. As in any war, it will come down to who is the one most able to to bother winning (yes, i don't like sovereignity wars that much )
The way i see such a situation playing out? Well, BoB will abandon their home and go on the offensive. Why? Because they are not easily bored taking down POS and putting up theirs if they need to retake their core regions. NPC stations in Delve and Fountain may cause them problems from time to time, but it also means they can leave their home unattended, go on the offensive and use these NPC regions as a staging point to retake their space later.
They will just identify the weakest link in the enemy coalition, move 90% of their forces there and apply some mean pressure for a month or so. When the weakest link is about to break they will offer them a NAP, either to let them get out of the warzone and install someone else they like there, or to actively use them in the following stages of the conflict (what the 5 did with FE back in the days).
Usually, "weakest link" type of alliances hold small parts of space surrounded by their bigger friends. So if they break, BoB will have a staging point right in the middle of their enemies. The really interesting part here is what will happen if they don't manage to break them in time. With a sufficiently large bandwagon, by the time they have managed it their space could already be overrun and someone else already established and fortified there. Interesting scenario, but we need a badnwagon to emerge so we can test it
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JoeyDee
Minmatar Confederation of Red Moon
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Posted - 2007.01.10 05:33:00 -
[307]
WEll I tell ya the 2 most f%$ked up words in English are
"if" and "Only".
Kiwi
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TWD
TAOSP Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 06:08:00 -
[308]
Originally by: Helen Our return meant a 12 dread attack on a Evol? pos in RIT while bubbles were placed along the AZN>RIT route this tactic slowed down the angry BoB gang for awhile sadly the guys doing it logged off and in that event the dreads had to come out of siege mode to get away, another 5mins and that pos would of been in reinforced.
Hey! It was our capital ship killing TAOSP POS!
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 12:01:00 -
[309]
Originally by: Frogzuk
BOB could then have been hit from not 1 but 2 fronts with D2 / IRON / RAZOR and friends from the north hitting them from beyond cloud ring and V / LV / RA / GOONS / IMP joining sides with ASCN to hit them from Curse. Personally i dont think BOB would had sustained that kind of onslaught.
Then once the fighting had finish then everyone could go back to bashing each other as they usually do ! Why this didnt happen is simple too many egos and too much pride.
Even if we lost every single pos, every single outpost, every single capital ship... what do you think would happen next?
Our corporation's name is Reikoku. It means "Relentless".
We didn't get to the stage we are now, fighting alongside the best pvp corporations in the game by giving up at the first signs of trouble.
As a wise man once said: You come from nothing, you go back to nothing. What you lost? NOTHING.
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Vanguard Frontiers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 12:26:00 -
[310]
Originally by: Ian Novarider
Originally by: Confessor Meanwhile, the plex *****s ARE raping the plexes 23/7 making isk for themselves and thier "capital support" corps that of course never materialized on the home front. I dont want to hear anymore bullsh1t from the ascn corps that claimed to be supporting us fools ont he front line fighting tooth and nail for your full retreat while hearing "we'll be right there boys, just one more day, hold tight, fight to the end"
Greetings, Confessor
would you care to name those people or corps you believe to have "raped the plexes 23/7 making isk for themselves " ?
I can only speak about the team doing the 10/10 plex in D-F. They did not run the plex for themselves. If you want to know where the money from that plex has been used : check killboards for number of EDF and VAF ships (including several capital ships) having been destroyed defending ASCN space (many ! - most ASCN gangs had a high number of EDF pilots). Not to forget the cost for POS parts and POS fuel. Add to that capital ship jump fuel expenses. Add again the amount of money needed for mineral compression in Empire, to make cheap ship replacements programs possible. Plus a certain amount of cash for the Titan building coming from plex revenues. The money did NOT go into the wallets of the individual pilots running the plex.
It is possible that some plexes have been run by certain people or certain corps for their own profit during the war. If this is so, please mention their names and which plex has been abused in your opinion.
At present I think you are making a general statement which is not true.
Have fun
Ian
While the input from the D-F plex is accountable, and those running it did not get anything (some people got up at 4am to help run it for no personal profit) to the best of my knowledge. I beleive Confessor's remarks refer to the ZYDA plex, which was a hot topic which I wont go into. I would be keen to hear for clarification on where it went though
Even on occasion where I would help the guys out in the D-F plex, straight afterwards, we would be down the pipe fighting in the front lines. Plex running is extreamly boring task, contrary to what many think, and most people running it were happy at the chance to finish it quickly and shoot some targets insted. The killboards confirm this as you may have noticed.
There are many alligations, such as dreads gone missing, alliance assets embezeled, dreads built at cost being sold on market etc etc. I dont know the truth of the matter and I guess it is a bit late to find it out now. But at the end of the day, there may be some things we can agree upon, but Confessor, please dont blame the rank in file who flew becide you day to day.
BTW, hows that curse I traded you many months ago holding? --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE |
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Fitz Chivalry
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.10 12:52:00 -
[311]
Originally by: Riddlock nice write up , congrats bob :)
congrats on joining BoB. I hope that they will live up to your expectations.
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Vathar
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 12:56:00 -
[312]
Originally by: Lord WarATron some people got up at 4am to help run it for no personal profit
rooh, and you dared to complain about bob pilots waking at insane hours to engage in pvp ...
I guess hardcore carebears can be as dedicated as hardcore pvpers sometimes, but heh, no big deal, maybe there were some ASCN pilots living in their mom's basement aswell :)
Originally by: Radeberger If you plan to make your alliance combat based, recruit pvpers with mining alts rather than miners with pvp alts
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.10 13:01:00 -
[313]
Originally by: Frogzuk V / LV / RA / GOONS / IMP joining sides with ASCN
Yeah thatll happen. -----
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Ewa Quillam
Caldari mega mining corporation Astral Wolves
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Posted - 2007.01.10 13:11:00 -
[314]
Blah, blah, blah molle and the other leaders Bob leaders... u are good at propaganda as u are at warfare, no doubt about it.
ASCN was an easy target, despite the fact that they were 4800 at the beginning and had lots of 0.0 systems and stations and good rocks in their space.
There were a few amongst ASCN that had the will to fight and defend the space that made them rich. Few were the leaders that knew how to lead.
As u said it yourselves, the campaign ended up much earlier, because there was not much to fight.
But sooner or later, you will get stuck. Enjoy moments like these while you still have them, because everything has ups and downs. I think many people are starting to get tired of this so called BoB supremacy.
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spoon2
Slacker Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.10 13:51:00 -
[315]
Edited by: spoon2 on 10/01/2007 13:48:58 A staggering performance, even if many believe ASCN were an easy target the way you guys went about it was awesome.
I will recall looking at your killboard on a certain day and seeing over 80 BS kills to 0. Not sure on the accuracy but that was impressive.
Out of interest do we know what the final Capital kill count was?
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:05:00 -
[316]
The final Capital Ship Killcount based on the ASCN alliance as defined by the eve database was as follows:
Kills 1 Titan 19 Dreadnoughts 17 Carriers
Losses 1 Carrier
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Sergio Ling
Standard Operations Building Services Maelstrom Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:07:00 -
[317]
Originally by: DB Preacher
As a wise man once said: You come from nothing, you go back to nothing. What you lost? NOTHING.
Eric Idle of Monty Python? _
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Weebear
The Bowrey
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:09:00 -
[318]
Originally by: spoon2 Edited by: spoon2 on 10/01/2007 13:48:58 A staggering performance, even if many believe ASCN were an easy target the way you guys went about it was awesome.
I will recall looking at your killboard on a certain day and seeing over 80 BS kills to 0. Not sure on the accuracy but that was impressive.
Out of interest do we know what the final Capital kill count was?
One thing I did notice which would be quite clever if the daily stats in the war were a bit closer was that quite a few pilots would wait up to 48 hours after a loss before posting it, but kills from the same battle and pilots were posted almost instantly.
Most people when browsing kill boards only check the current day and sometimes the day before so only see the 80:0. Then a few days later you get the correct ratio. In this case probably something like 80:2 :P
Since the stat totals add up at the end of the week, no one really notices it.
Just one of many subtle things which were very effective.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:26:00 -
[319]
Greetings,
keep in mind that high kill ratios in the early weeks of the war were usually the result of a node crash followed by people logging in and being killed while logging in (with no chance to fight back, as they were basically staring at a black screen).
It took some time for pilots that are not primarily PvP pilots to optimize their EVE clients and settings to a point where they were able to log in after a node crash fast enough without getting slaughtered.
Important lessons learned the hard way.
So if people want to learn something from the BoB-ASCN war, i strongly recommend that they look into the ways to optimize their EVE client and settings for a fleet battle situation (and then send it out to the pilots of their alliance, for use whenever necessary).
Have fun
Ian
.
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Buxaroo
Constructive Influence
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:53:00 -
[320]
Originally by: Ewa Quillam Blah, blah, blah molle and the other leaders Bob leaders... u are good at propaganda as u are at warfare, no doubt about it.
ASCN was an easy target, despite the fact that they were 4800 at the beginning and had lots of 0.0 systems and stations and good rocks in their space.
There were a few amongst ASCN that had the will to fight and defend the space that made them rich. Few were the leaders that knew how to lead.
As u said it yourselves, the campaign ended up much earlier, because there was not much to fight.
But sooner or later, you will get stuck. Enjoy moments like these while you still have them, because everything has ups and downs. I think many people are starting to get tired of this so called BoB supremacy.
Then why don't you get together with all of your compatriots and armchair generals and actually do something about it then? I used to hear people say that all the time in the past. But I never see anyone get up and start doing it. BoB would LOVE to have a fight like that. But no one has the balls to do it. They are too busy protecting their little ones and zeros instead of actually playing the game.
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Dark Matter
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:57:00 -
[321]
Originally by: Ian Novarider Greetings,
keep in mind that high kill ratios in the early weeks of the war were usually the result of a node crash followed by people logging in and being killed while logging in (with no chance to fight back, as they were basically staring at a black screen).
It took some time for pilots that are not primarily PvP pilots to optimize their EVE clients and settings to a point where they were able to log in after a node crash fast enough without getting slaughtered.
Important lessons learned the hard way.
So if people want to learn something from the BoB-ASCN war, i strongly recommend that they look into the ways to optimize their EVE client and settings for a fleet battle situation (and then send it out to the pilots of their alliance, for use whenever necessary).
Have fun
Ian
.
When the node crashes both sides drop out. So to say that it was only due to node crashes is to buy into the same tired excuses that John and co spoonfed you.
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Ewa Quillam
Caldari mega mining corporation Astral Wolves
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Posted - 2007.01.10 14:59:00 -
[322]
Originally by: DB Preacher The final Capital Ship Killcount based on the ASCN alliance as defined by the eve database was as follows:
Kills 1 Titan 19 Dreadnoughts 17 Carriers
Losses 1 Carrier
dbp
This is nothing for a 4800 member industrial alliance. They've risen 15-20 outposts, 30 bil each...
The titan was foolishly lost because of lack of knowledge as the war was lost due to lack of will.
The war should have taken much more months than it did if the alliance had a purpose and wanted to keep its space.
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Ewa Quillam
Caldari mega mining corporation Astral Wolves
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Posted - 2007.01.10 15:05:00 -
[323]
Originally by: Buxaroo
Originally by: Ewa Quillam Blah, blah, blah molle and the other leaders Bob leaders... u are good at propaganda as u are at warfare, no doubt about it.
ASCN was an easy target, despite the fact that they were 4800 at the beginning and had lots of 0.0 systems and stations and good rocks in their space.
There were a few amongst ASCN that had the will to fight and defend the space that made them rich. Few were the leaders that knew how to lead.
As u said it yourselves, the campaign ended up much earlier, because there was not much to fight.
But sooner or later, you will get stuck. Enjoy moments like these while you still have them, because everything has ups and downs. I think many people are starting to get tired of this so called BoB supremacy.
Then why don't you get together with all of your compatriots and armchair generals and actually do something about it then? I used to hear people say that all the time in the past. But I never see anyone get up and start doing it. BoB would LOVE to have a fight like that. But no one has the balls to do it. They are too busy protecting their little ones and zeros instead of actually playing the game.
Not everyone has the BoB mentality to conquer everything, but fierce defenders are nearly everywhere. BoB hasn't found the most fiercefull yet.
The title of this post is "The bigger they are..." + "the higher they fall". Guess what, BoB is very big now.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 15:14:00 -
[324]
Edited by: Ian Novarider on 10/01/2007 15:14:43 >>> When the node crashes both sides drop out. So to say that it was only due to node crashes is to buy into the same tired excuses that John and co spoonfed you. >>>>
The point from my previous post is ....
when an experienced PvP corp goes into war, they already use EVE clients and settings optimized for fleet combat. This allows them to log in quickly after a node crash. This also allows them a quicker response time in heavy lag situations.
In contrast to that a corp or alliance that is comprised mainly of pilots with little PvP experience will have many of their pilots NOT using such optimized EVE clients at the beginning of the war. They have to learn this the hard way - learning by dying. Often while watching a black screen during log-in.
So yes, when the node dies pilots from both sides have to log in again. Those with optimized clients will log in faster and have the opportunity to act sooner than others.
This was one major (but not the only) reason for heavy losses early in the war at little cost to the other side. If you re-read my previous post, you will see that I did not claim it to be the only reason.
Again ... for the future ... if corps prepare their pilots NOW they can avoid repeating such mistakes in similar situations.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Tundaar
Minmatar Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 15:26:00 -
[325]
Edited by: Tundaar on 10/01/2007 15:24:56
Originally by: Dark Matter
Originally by: Ian Novarider Greetings,
keep in mind that high kill ratios in the early weeks of the war were usually the result of a node crash followed by people logging in and being killed while logging in (with no chance to fight back, as they were basically staring at a black screen).
It took some time for pilots that are not primarily PvP pilots to optimize their EVE clients and settings to a point where they were able to log in after a node crash fast enough without getting slaughtered.
Important lessons learned the hard way.
So if people want to learn something from the BoB-ASCN war, i strongly recommend that they look into the ways to optimize their EVE client and settings for a fleet battle situation (and then send it out to the pilots of their alliance, for use whenever necessary).
Have fun
Ian
.
When the node crashes both sides drop out. So to say that it was only due to node crashes is to buy into the same tired excuses that John and co spoonfed you.
No - not spoon fed - I managed to lose 2 t2 fitted Tempests in TPR/TCAg without even seeing a BoB ship - warp in - lag - crash - log back in at a station in a new clone . . . .BoB managed poor hardware mechanics better than ASCN - Much better - to the extent that hundreds of battleships over a couple of weeks were picked off one by one as they logged in immediately after node crashes. That is how ratios of 80-0 battleships in one batttle were achieved.
Kudos to BoB for learning how to manage Node crashes effectively, but very dissapointing that so many ASCN losses happened due to hardware failures and not understanding how to tweak hardware settings/secondary logins etc rather than a Grand Fleet battle (as the game is supposedly desgned to handle).
Personally I would have found it much easier to handle getting the crap blown out of my ships if a fleet fight where I could see the enemy and have the game work as it was designed to do . . . was a major turning point - people stopped bringing battleships because they were fighting game mechanic flaws rather than BoB.
Had the nodes held up BoB may very well have still slaughtered ASCN at the begining - but morale would not have dropped so quickly.
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Weebear
The Bowrey
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Posted - 2007.01.10 15:57:00 -
[326]
Originally by: Dark Matter
Originally by: Ian Novarider Greetings,
keep in mind that high kill ratios in the early weeks of the war were usually the result of a node crash followed by people logging in and being killed while logging in (with no chance to fight back, as they were basically staring at a black screen).
It took some time for pilots that are not primarily PvP pilots to optimize their EVE clients and settings to a point where they were able to log in after a node crash fast enough without getting slaughtered.
Important lessons learned the hard way.
So if people want to learn something from the BoB-ASCN war, i strongly recommend that they look into the ways to optimize their EVE client and settings for a fleet battle situation (and then send it out to the pilots of their alliance, for use whenever necessary).
Have fun
Ian
.
When the node crashes both sides drop out. So to say that it was only due to node crashes is to buy into the same tired excuses that John and co spoonfed you.
Dark, a lot of the time it tended to be us jumping through a gate when the node crashed. When you log back in you log back in at your last session change. For us that was the gate we had just jumped through, where as the BoB fleets had a lot more knowledge of how to deal with a node crash and would appear somewhere safe when they logged back in as they made sure their last session change was at a SS. Due to the advanced preperation of their clients they were able to get back in first, get organised and then just gank the ASCN fleet 1 by 1 as they logged back in.
CCP were replacing ships lost in such a way, but when people were waiting almost a week for reimbursement, fewer people were appearing for gangs in the meantime. |
Yazoul Samaiel
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 15:59:00 -
[327]
Originally by: Tundaar
I managed to lose 2 t2 fitted Tempests in TPR/TCAg without even seeing a BoB ship - warp in - lag - crash - log back in at a station in a new clone .
Wellcoem to EVE-Online Fleet battels m8 , i have lost loads of battle ships and even interceptor plus pod exactly the same was and that was even 8 months ago when max number of players was 20k . Now it peaks to 30 k and rising in some days , thing is CCP cant do much about it although they are working and keep getting new HW etc to increase performance. How ever sometimes ppl are lucky enough to load by being diciplined and patient and if they lose to lag they just re log and get a new ship while bitting their left nut , no magic or secret behind it realy.
"Lord Samaiel, Rise "
BNC Vs CELES Video
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Vanguard Frontiers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:00:00 -
[328]
Originally by: Tundaar Kudos to BoB for learning how to manage Node crashes effectively, but very dissapointing that so many ASCN losses happened due to hardware failures and not understanding how to tweak hardware settings/secondary logins etc rather than a Grand Fleet battle (as the game is supposedly desgned to handle).
Personally I would have found it much easier to handle getting the crap blown out of my ships if a fleet fight where I could see the enemy and have the game work as it was designed to do . . . was a major turning point - people stopped bringing battleships because they were fighting game mechanic flaws rather than BoB.
Had the nodes held up BoB may very well have still slaughtered ASCN at the begining - but morale would not have dropped so quickly.
At the end of the day, BoB knew how to handle the "Terrain & Weather" whereas ASCN had.... almost refused to accept it. You can seige a castle in the rain, but it is pretty crazy to do so. But yes, at the end of the day, even if the servers are perfect, I think a simaler result would have happened, though it would have been a lot more fun --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE |
Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:07:00 -
[329]
Other things that can be learned from this war IMHO:
a) proper strontium level management in POS is extremely important (so that a reenforced POS comes out of reenforcement in a timezone where your alliance is strongest). Such stront management can and should be done even at the height of the enemy attack (so having a hauler character within POS shields that can log in at more or less any time helps).
b) a "standing" cyno chain network for rapid troop movement is a must
c) a Titan is VERY useful as a flying jump portal, as it allows you to bypass gatecamp blob traps. This gives your fleet many more tactical and strategical options.
d) Ship Replacement programs should be planned BEFORE a war (so this plan can be executed starting at day 1). Every delay in getting cheap replacement ships to your frontline pilots will cost ya.
e) Shared capital ships .... to allow the use of capital ships at ANY time, you might want to consider assigning teams of capital ship pilots (from different time zones) to corp owned capital ships. There are other ways of ensuring capital ship availability, but most of them are not allowed by CCP.
f) Many of your ships will be lost on their way to the frontline, usually to enemy interceptor wolfpacks. Convoys and convoy security (and the proper ships for the job) is an area you can train for before a war starts.
g) You can never have enough covert ops pilots (especially when they have probing experience too) (and whenever one of your gang pilots warps to zero to uncloak your own cov ops pilot, have him watch 200 episodes of "Denver Clan" , because thats the torture he deserves)
h) You can never have enough dictor pilots
Personal opinion, of course.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:16:00 -
[330]
>>><Wellcoem to EVE-Online Fleet battels m8 , i have lost loads of battle ships and even interceptor plus pod exactly the same was and that was even 8 months ago >>>>>
>>>>no magic or secret behind it realy. >>>>
As said before ... PvP and fleet battle experience is an important factor. Someone that has experienced this 8 months ago is better prepared compared to someone that experiences this for the first time.
Its the same reason why military forces worldwide drill their soldiers. You stay cool if the situation is not new to you. Or if you have faced worse in training or previous engagements.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Dianabolic
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:25:00 -
[331]
Originally by: Ian Novarider Other things that can be learned from this war IMHO:
a) proper strontium level management in POS is extremely important (so that a reenforced POS comes out of reenforcement in a timezone where your alliance is strongest). Such stront management can and should be done even at the height of the enemy attack (so having a hauler character within POS shields that can log in at more or less any time helps).
b) a "standing" cyno chain network for rapid troop movement is a must
c) a Titan is VERY useful as a flying jump portal, as it allows you to bypass gatecamp blob traps. This gives your fleet many more tactical and strategical options.
d) Ship Replacement programs should be planned BEFORE a war (so this plan can be executed starting at day 1). Every delay in getting cheap replacement ships to your frontline pilots will cost ya.
e) Shared capital ships .... to allow the use of capital ships at ANY time, you might want to consider assigning teams of capital ship pilots (from different time zones) to corp owned capital ships. There are other ways of ensuring capital ship availability, but most of them are not allowed by CCP.
f) Many of your ships will be lost on their way to the frontline, usually to enemy interceptor wolfpacks. Convoys and convoy security (and the proper ships for the job) is an area you can train for before a war starts.
g) You can never have enough covert ops pilots (especially when they have probing experience too) (and whenever one of your gang pilots warps to zero to uncloak your own cov ops pilot, have him watch 200 episodes of "Denver Clan" , because thats the torture he deserves)
h) You can never have enough dictor pilots
Personal opinion, of course.
Have fun
Ian
Good post, kudos for your analysis of what you did wrong.
Good luck in fixing it :)
Quote: 2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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Dr CapitalShip
Caldari Out Siders Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:39:00 -
[332]
Originally by: Ian Novarider Other things that can be learned from this war IMHO:
a) proper strontium level management in POS is extremely important (so that a reenforced POS comes out of reenforcement in a timezone where your alliance is strongest). Such stront management can and should be done even at the height of the enemy attack (so having a hauler character within POS shields that can log in at more or less any time helps).
b) a "standing" cyno chain network for rapid troop movement is a must
c) a Titan is VERY useful as a flying jump portal, as it allows you to bypass gatecamp blob traps. This gives your fleet many more tactical and strategical options.
d) Ship Replacement programs should be planned BEFORE a war (so this plan can be executed starting at day 1). Every delay in getting cheap replacement ships to your frontline pilots will cost ya.
e) Shared capital ships .... to allow the use of capital ships at ANY time, you might want to consider assigning teams of capital ship pilots (from different time zones) to corp owned capital ships. There are other ways of ensuring capital ship availability, but most of them are not allowed by CCP.
f) Many of your ships will be lost on their way to the frontline, usually to enemy interceptor wolfpacks. Convoys and convoy security (and the proper ships for the job) is an area you can train for before a war starts.
g) You can never have enough covert ops pilots (especially when they have probing experience too) (and whenever one of your gang pilots warps to zero to uncloak your own cov ops pilot, have him watch 200 episodes of "Denver Clan" , because thats the torture he deserves)
h) You can never have enough dictor pilots
Personal opinion, of course.
Have fun
Ian
I would probebly add in cost as well. If it costs your pilots 250-300mil to fit out a ship everyday, there is only so long he can handle that level of financial strain before they run off ratting insted of being in the front lines.
And if you hit a stage where you cannot get fleet pilots in the front lines fully fitted out with the correct gear, then you have lost the fleet battle before you even start.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 16:41:00 -
[333]
>>>> Good post, kudos for your analysis of what you did wrong. >>>>
Its mostly an analysis of what i have seen BoB do better than ASCN.
Hopefully others will train this before they go to war. It will improve their performance IMHO.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 17:21:00 -
[334]
Edited by: LUKEC on 10/01/2007 17:22:01 Edited by: LUKEC on 10/01/2007 17:19:24 Actually never mind. it's not my task to enlighten certain people. -------- The BoB model is bad for business. Incidently the BoB model is more suited for a game such as WoW where as the ASCN model more suited for Eve.
McGreedy |
Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.10 22:32:00 -
[335]
Hmm, some other things that might be worth mentioning IMHO ....
a) POS shield repping ...
alliances might want to train repping shields with carriers (with some carriers running the capital shield reppers and other carriers transferring juice to them). It IS a very efficient to kickstart a POS coming out of reenforcement. Of course, having a couple of med shield repper equipped Ospreys within POS shields also helps. Be sure to train keeping your ships right out of the POS shields, so they can quickly dive back into the protection of the shields if an enemy fleet decides to snipe your reppers. And even if they are webbed by suicide frigs.
b) Squadron, Wing and Fleet Commanders
Them having the right skills, ships and links improves your whole fleet. Its also NOT trivial for a non-PvP non-fleet-battle-experienced team to form up in a proper fleet. Expect some frustrating first tries that seem to take AGES.
c) Teamspeak Discipline
People WILL chat. Find a way to have them chat somewhere where it does not disturb fleet command giving orders. People WILL get excited. Be ready to mute and/or kick those that get too emotional and/or have their mike open and their children singing in the background and/or the occasional spy blasting Iron Maiden into your TS channel.
d) FC down and the pleasure of gang invites
In my experience fleet command does not have time to do gang invites. Too many channels open, information overload comes fast. Dedicated people (which are NOT fleet commanders) checking for people willing to join gang are worth their ships mass in gold.
Engagements can also fall apart fast if the FC of one side gets podded. Chain of command in case officers going down should be clear to everyone. Train it. Have FC stop talking and watch what happens. Consider having your FC in a cloaker (then you MAYBE need another one in a non cloaking ship calling out targets for the FC).
e) Node crashes
Train behaviour in heavy lag situations and after node crashes. Maybe join a large fleet battle somewhere to experience it. Optimize your EVE client and settings for quick relog.
f) The science of the last log in point
There are many tricks learned by experience to control where and how fast you log in after a node crash. It should NOT be at a gate you have just jumped too. Plenty of info about the in various threads here on the forum, but a lot of it in anectodal form, interwoven with rumour and hear-say. Test it.
g) The science of going to warp fast
Study how fast fleets can enter warp. It has a lot to do with the modules you choose for your ships. It has even more to do with training everyone to align to warp out point the very moment they arrive. Every second gained can mean life and death for whole fleets, especially in the Age of Titans.
I learned a lot in the past 5 months about fleet combat. It always amazes me how EVE shows you layer after layer of depth you have not seen or experienced before.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Lone Bear
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.10 23:04:00 -
[336]
Dont wanna sound harsh or seem smacking, but almost all what you wrote comes in mind directly or is available through blogs reading / forum reading. Anyway, nice summup.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.11 08:18:00 -
[337]
Originally by: Lone Bear Dont wanna sound harsh or seem smacking, but almost all what you wrote comes in mind directly or is available through blogs reading / forum reading. Anyway, nice summup.
Yes, thats the irony of it. Most of it is known. Has been known and discussed for quite some time.
But its not known to the mayority of the pilots. It may SOUND obvious, but it isnt to many. And - except for a select "few" with mostly PvP-specialization - it would need some effort within corps and alliances to educate and train their pilots.
Well, my naive self from 6 months ago - a 0.0 virgin - was not aware of 80 % of the things I mentioned in my previous posts. So it was an interesting, educating half year.
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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SARPIDON
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.11 10:00:00 -
[338]
Originally by: Ian Novarider
Originally by: Lone Bear Dont wanna sound harsh or seem smacking, but almost all what you wrote comes in mind directly or is available through blogs reading / forum reading. Anyway, nice summup.
Yes, thats the irony of it. Most of it is known. Has been known and discussed for quite some time.
But its not known to the mayority of the pilots. It may SOUND obvious, but it isnt to many. And - except for a select "few" with mostly PvP-specialization - it would need some effort within corps and alliances to educate and train their pilots.
Well, my naive self from 6 months ago - a 0.0 virgin - was not aware of 80 % of the things I mentioned in my previous posts. So it was an interesting, educating half year.
Have fun
Ian
Spot on Ian, good posts. Its so important to take lessons out of this it cannot be understated, and if others read your posts and let pride tell them we know this its all good, dont let it, learn it practise it and practise it some more. Only then will you stand a chance against the well oiled machine that is a BoB fleet. I walk away from this war having learnt the above the hard way. Those lessons tend to stick in the mind a little harder. To me this is a positive. Time will tell if I'm a better pilot for it, but I know for a fact I'm a wiser pilot now.
Sarp
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BlackRain
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:16:00 -
[339]
There is some rather good analysis in this thread now, and I'd like to add one small thing to the whole "node crash" issue and the underlying reasons why we managed to come on top.
Many times the node crashed and we did the same ol' thing. Immediately logged back in and waited. Some of us made it, some of us didn't. However, many times I saw with my own eyes - or heard through TS - that during this logon phase we actually were severely outnumbered at the "crash site".
This is where the "average joe" of each side gets to show his quality. When there's no FCs around to hold your hand, you get dropped on a fairly laggy battlezone with a bunch of targets and the mission is to clear it, you need to not only be active, but proactive. This is something we did better than ASCN. Our average grunts are able to adapt fast, cope extended periods of time completely on their own, and most importantly, someone always steps up to coordinate. This counts even more than the "mechanical" side of the whole thing, as like I said, we many times were vastly outnumbered while logging in.
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Grainsalt
Free Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:34:00 -
[340]
This may be me just picking up on a rumour, but RE Teamspeak discipline, I heard that Molle/Shrike plays whale song down the TS... Surely not! ---
For T2 Tinfoil Hats, contact Grainsalt ingame.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:36:00 -
[341]
Originally by: Grainsalt This may be me just picking up on a rumour, but RE Teamspeak discipline, I heard that Molle/Shrike plays whale song down the TS... Surely not!
Worse, he plays Abba.
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Echo Falls
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:39:00 -
[342]
Originally by: DB Preacher
Originally by: Grainsalt This may be me just picking up on a rumour, but RE Teamspeak discipline, I heard that Molle/Shrike plays whale song down the TS... Surely not!
Worse, he plays Abba.
dbp
/me puts on his tin foil hat again
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:40:00 -
[343]
>>> Worse, he plays Abba. >>>
MAN, thats just MEAN !
What did he play ? "The winner takes it all" ?!
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 15:48:00 -
[344]
Edited by: DB Preacher on 11/01/2007 15:44:58
Originally by: Ian Novarider >>> Worse, he plays Abba. >>>
MAN, thats just MEAN !
What did he play ? "The winner takes it all" ?!
Have fun
Ian
Lots of abba, however, after we won the first caldari championships that was indeed the tune we requested and was then played on the (then) everadio commentary.
I can't listen to that song now without a small tear coming to my eye and thinking of Alasse's eagle holding on and somehow managing to take down the other two ships.
*sigh* memories!
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:13:00 -
[345]
Well, give us some time to recover and there comes the time when he will play "Waterloo" ;-)
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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Leodeus
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:35:00 -
[346]
Originally by: SirMolle Of the 4800 strong,.....
If ASCN actually had 4800 pilots willing to fight, this war wouldn't be over. Alts and extra accounts greatly exaggerate that figure.
Nonetheless, BoB defeated ASCN whatever the numbers were.
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:38:00 -
[347]
Interesting question :
Is an industrialist alliance more alt heavy than a PvP alliance or is it vice versa ?
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:47:00 -
[348]
Originally by: Ian Novarider Interesting question :
Is an industrialist alliance more alt heavy than a PvP alliance or is it vice versa ?
Have fun
Ian
Check out the recent demographic post I made for an idea of how many alts we have: Demographics post
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Fuglife
TOUAREGS
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:22:00 -
[349]
Edited by: Fuglife on 11/01/2007 17:18:46 Bob themselves as far as im aware had a small army of alts, at least it appeared that way. They would beat you up with their main then come kick you with the alt. Most frustrating ;) _____
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Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.12 00:08:00 -
[350]
Must hurt to get kicked in the alts tbh. ....
Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003. |
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Ian Novarider
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.12 08:08:00 -
[351]
Originally by: DB Preacher
Check out the recent demographic post I made for an idea of how many alts we have: Demographics post
dbp
There was a similar survey on the ASCN forum .... and the numbers sound almost exactly the same. So i think the answer is : "No significant difference."
Have fun
Ian
Quote: Know thy enemy and know thyself and thou will be victorious in all thy battles.
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pershphanie
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.01.12 09:38:00 -
[352]
Originally by: SirMolle
In conclusion, it took four weeks to break ASCN's will to fight, three weeks to conquer Paragon Soul, and four weeks to conquer Feythabolis. War quickly degraded to POS bashing and ganks as BoB went head to head with Strontium Clathrates, but a few memorable battles were had.
So I have to ask..
Does this mean Cyvok is going to let BoB keep Fountain after all? |
Tundaar
Minmatar Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2007.01.12 10:31:00 -
[353]
Other points to consider - these are things that COULD have ben done by ASCN, but there was too much confusion internally and not enough clear commands. "Go Kill Bob" was not enough.
Lock down TS - We had many instances of people coming onto TS and disrupting operations (Warp to Gate, Singing, Yelling abuse so FC couldn't be heard) this took WAY to long to sort out
POS operations - Split POS between Corps to prevent avoid 0oy situations
Weed non-performers early. Whoever is logged in should be operational or their directors/CEO's should have given them permission not to be. If they are not give 'em one warning then kick 'em - a bit harsh but . . . One of the biggest morale failures was seeing 300 in alliance chat and 15 in gang in your home system
Don't play to enemy strengths - ASCN could field very few T2 fitted BS even at the beginning of the war - but we kep getting into engagements where we were consistently outranged. and trying to fighht on BoBs terms
Adapt quickly, Ditch non-working tactics fast, again major morale failures where yet another fleet gets killed using the same tactics that killed the last 3
Avoid Boredom. POS Sitting probably killed ASCN as much as anything. People just got stir crazy. Conflicting instructions from HC led to paralysis at an FC level often as peoeple thought that they couldn't run an OP without HC permission.
Avoid Boredom. DO NOT ORGANISE AN OP FOR A SPECIFIC TIME AND TNE LEAVE EVERYONE HANGING FOR 3 HOURS UNTIL IT KICKS OFF. Sigh - by the time the ops started half our pilots had to log to go to bed
LET PEOPLE LEARN - New people who stepped up to the plate to FC got abused when things went wrong, discouraging others from doing the same. NEWSFLASH: when fighting an elite PvP alliance you are gona lose ships, learn and move on.
Many opportunities for learning in the war - unfortunately we didn't learn or adapt fast enough. . . .and some paid WAY too much atention to these forums
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Touk
Shinra Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.01.12 11:07:00 -
[354]
Originally by: CallMe 8675309 Edited by: CallMe 8675309 on 05/01/2007 18:16:23
Originally by: Ikvar However many people post derogatory comments about BOB in this or any other threads, they can't deny that no one consistently (or every arguably) pull out the results or show the skill, teamwork and dedication that BOB do.
Sure we can. Red Alliance. GoonSwarm. AAA. BoB pick on isolated alliances like everybody else. The only thing that makes them "special" is the incredible amounts of propaganda spewed out on the forums by their leaders, plus the number of slav- I mean pets who buy into the myth that BoB can protect them from the rest of the universe when they're attacked. I think they're in for a pretty rude awakening when BoB are supposed to be protecting FORTY different stations throughout their regions when their leadership has alienated the rest of the game with its bluster.
Well, outside their mercenary pets in MC and their conquered vassals in FIX.
Edit: Oh and can't forget the slavering desperates in LV who will doubtlessly ally with BoB to save their own skin from the Russians soon enough, too.
Wow.....just wow. i mean what can you say to that.....just wow i think.
some people eh?!!! sometimes even i cant believe people as bitter as you obviously are havnt topped themselves.
FreeHugs |
aimez
Shinra Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.01.12 11:54:00 -
[355]
Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn Posted - 2007.01.05 17:52:00 - [8] - Quote I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
That is bolocks :)
Chimaera pact destoyed SBA a long time ago
yes it is true the name is still there
but take a look at this line
" SBA consists of 1 member corporations, 1 pilots reside under its sovereignty."
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aimez
Shinra Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.01.12 11:56:00 -
[356]
Edited by: aimez on 12/01/2007 11:54:20 Anyway, realy nice written and congratz to both sides
Bob won but i have to say i have respect for the Ascendant Frontier peeps who kept fighting to :)
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Boonaki
Caldari Suffoco Noctis
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Posted - 2007.01.12 13:22:00 -
[357]
the forum posts 2-3 years from now asking about ASCN should be fun.
Fear the Ibis of doom!
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ABURITORU
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Posted - 2007.01.13 03:58:00 -
[358]
nice speach...you bloody english:P
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Lyma
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Posted - 2007.01.14 07:17:00 -
[359]
I think the point is being missed when BOB members just doesn't understand why so many people want to see them crash and burn. It's not that we don't like winners or that we envy your "skills" it's just the fact we can't stand to here your smug self stroking comments. If you crushed everyone before you and kept a sliver of humility we'd slap you on the back and smile as we said awesome, just awesome. The funny thing is you end up spending so much time defending yourselves against the "haters" that don't see how you could enjoy your victories.
Of course too late now. Made yourselves the target of so much hate by screaming "we are god" from those soapboxes you carry around, instead of winning then going on about your business with a nod and a wink.
You are your own worst enemies and whether you know it or not there's a tide moving south driven by your own arrogance. Humility has it's own rewards... just a thought, personally have nothing against Bob besides the gooey self absorbed stuff spewed on here.. see ya out there
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Smith
Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.14 09:04:00 -
[360]
Originally by: Lyma I think the point is being missed when BOB members just doesn't understand why so many people want to see them crash and burn. It's not that we don't like winners or that we envy your "skills" it's just the fact we can't stand to here your smug self stroking comments. If you crushed everyone before you and kept a sliver of humility we'd slap you on the back and smile as we said awesome, just awesome. The funny thing is you end up spending so much time defending yourselves against the "haters" that don't see how you could enjoy your victories.
Of course too late now. Made yourselves the target of so much hate by screaming "we are god" from those soapboxes you carry around, instead of winning then going on about your business with a nod and a wink.
You are your own worst enemies and whether you know it or not there's a tide moving south driven by your own arrogance. Humility has it's own rewards... just a thought, personally have nothing against Bob besides the gooey self absorbed stuff spewed on here.. see ya out there
We appreciate the hatred tbh. We at DICE glady receive hate mails and posts. We even hate each other and rejoice when one of our own gets ganked.
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Sinlare
Gallente Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.14 09:16:00 -
[361]
Originally by: Lyma I think the point is being missed when BOB members just doesn't understand why so many people want to see them crash and burn. It's not that we don't like winners or that we envy your "skills" it's just the fact we can't stand to here your smug self stroking comments. If you crushed everyone before you and kept a sliver of humility we'd slap you on the back and smile as we said awesome, just awesome. The funny thing is you end up spending so much time defending yourselves against the "haters" that don't see how you could enjoy your victories.
Of course too late now. Made yourselves the target of so much hate by screaming "we are god" from those soapboxes you carry around, instead of winning then going on about your business with a nod and a wink.
You are your own worst enemies and whether you know it or not there's a tide moving south driven by your own arrogance. Humility has it's own rewards... just a thought, personally have nothing against Bob besides the gooey self absorbed stuff spewed on here.. see ya out there
It's more funny that it seems that only people that hate BoB post stuff like you. They always end with; 'but not me, i dont care for bob, no matter that i have just written six pages of hatemail about them'. |
Mei Han
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.16 09:20:00 -
[362]
The only thing i wonder is "what next?" Having 2 alliances fighting eachother i belive kept the balance. Now it is more like, bob and everybody else.
As a new pilot i expect many when my time comes to join the endgame fight from within a corp and at a larger scale, an alliance. I would hate to see a universe without battles or some kind of Alliance making a stand against BOB.
**I have nothing against BOB, but i would like some power balance**
And finaly, Great Job BOB guys
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Xordus
Beasts of Burden
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Posted - 2007.01.16 17:50:00 -
[363]
It is no doubt BOB is the greatest single alliance in EVE but noone should have that kind of power and control in our world. An 1800 man alliance holds maybe 1/6 of 0.0 with no end in sight to their expansion and subjugation. It would only take a concerted effort of a couple strong alliances to end this cycle and either seclude BOB to Delve again or destroy them completely. It only takes cooperation and dedication.
This should be a goal of all alliances in 0.0 imho. We have a means to rid the cancer, just not the will to do so...
Xordus
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Marcus TheMartin
Gallente Tuxedo.
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Posted - 2007.01.16 18:03:00 -
[364]
Originally by: Xordus It only takes cooperation and dedication.
All things could be ended if every one went against something but I believe you have better odds of getting 6th graders to protest a dress code. Best Dressed Corp of 2006 and 2007! -Marcus TheMartin Marcus Thinks Eve who knew!? |
Ab Initio
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.16 21:07:00 -
[365]
Originally by: Xordus It is no doubt BOB is the greatest single alliance in EVE but noone should have that kind of power and control in our world. An 1800 man alliance holds maybe 1/6 of 0.0 with no end in sight to their expansion and subjugation. It would only take a concerted effort of a couple strong alliances to end this cycle and either seclude BOB to Delve again or destroy them completely. It only takes cooperation and dedication.
This should be a goal of all alliances in 0.0 imho. We have a means to rid the cancer, just not the will to do so...
Xordus
Many alliance in this game have a sense of worth that is closely tied in with their location on the map (eg, ASCN and the Feyth empire). Take away that which gives them "worth" and they crumble.
Now while I am sure there ARE people in BoB who consider the Outposts they have constructed / conquered as part of their "worth", for the most part our outposts are not what makes us BoB. If someone manages to take our space one day, your only accomplishment will be moving us from our home to yours, and we will not be hospitable guests.
As for the comments about being a cancer on EVE.. We are building an empire, and bringing peace and prosperity to a large number of tennants within our walls. People would do well to learn from the "empires", instead of focusing on how to gang bang them all the time. You beat your competition by raising yourself to their level, not lowering them to yours.
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Budz Fergie
Caldari Caldari Deep Space Ventures Caldari Deep Space Industral
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Posted - 2007.01.16 21:52:00 -
[366]
Originally by: aimez Harisdrop Gallente ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn Posted - 2007.01.05 17:52:00 - [8] - Quote I never realized how awesome you must feel. I guess your the first alliance to claim you destroyed an Alliance!
That is bolocks :)
Chimaera pact destoyed SBA a long time ago
yes it is true the name is still there
but take a look at this line
" SBA consists of 1 member corporations, 1 pilots reside under its sovereignty."
Wrong! SBA split apart. One of The corp's that formed it, the 1 with the executor alt, left to join RA while the rest wanted nothing to do with the reds. And they were in negotiations with them while telling the rest of the alliance to stay and fight.You guys just pushed it to happen faster.
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Azrael Bierce
Cult of Lemen
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Posted - 2007.01.16 23:13:00 -
[367]
ASCN's biggest failing, at least from the perspective of someone that joined about a month before the war started, was that they were about as much of an alliance as the residents of Fade. They mostly seemed like a bunch of corporations that all lived in the same space, and the alliance tag was there as a convienient way of setting standings and having a chat channel as much as anything.
There were no alliance wide ship replacement programs, all the corps had to handle their own. Corps that couldn't afford such ended up with pilots ratting/mining to replace ships which lead to a lot of internal strife about why is so-and-so ratting instead of fighting? This really boils down to worrying more about corp/alliance wallets than keeping people in the field.
Few replacement plans in general until, frankly, it was too late to make a difference. People scrambling to get mineral compression in place (and its not like we didn't have warning that an assault was going to happen). General distrust causing building slots to go idle. A variety of troubles.
Alliance leadership was completely inneffectual. Tuundar hit a lot of the high (low?) points.
And something I'll refer to as corporate greed unless someone corrects me. When I joined I was looking for some item or another. I expressed surprise that an alliance the size of ASCN didn't have a BPO. When I asked in corp chat about the item, I was told "Oh, corp X has the BPO, but they don't sell to the alliance anymore." Apparently they were irritated about reselling or somesuch, so it was just easier and more profitable to only sell in empire. This policy didn't change until it was far too late to make a difference in the war.
Basically ASCN died because it didn't fight as an alliance. If fought as a semi-related group of corporations that, frankly, didn't seem to like each other all that much.
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Relevohs
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Posted - 2007.01.26 04:39:00 -
[368]
Who's Bob? ---------------------------------------------- Minmatar News Network (MNN) tm Your news source, covering violence and mayhem with compassion. |
Vadoc Trax
Caldari RABBLE-RABBLE
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Posted - 2007.01.26 05:22:00 -
[369]
Your uncle. -------------------------------------------------- #1. Pillage, THEN burn. #8. Mockery and derision have their place. Usually, it's on the far side of the airlock. |
Sexual Chocolate
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.26 05:23:00 -
[370]
Originally by: Relevohs Who's Bob?
sup
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Forum Troll
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Posted - 2007.01.26 05:34:00 -
[371]
Can't wait to see a thread like about about D2. Three weeks? Lawl.
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SirMolle
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.26 05:50:00 -
[372]
Moderators, lock this thread. It's played out, and trolls necroing it serves no purpose whatsoever.
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Kreul Intentions
Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2007.01.26 14:40:00 -
[373]
Locker per OP request.
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