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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:29:00 -
[1]
I was just reading the forums, like I do every day, and I came across the Nano-Myrm thread. It makes me wonder, what has caused this massive Nano/I-stab trend where every ship that can fit lots of Nos and a MWD suddenly becomes an uber solopwn ship that can't be caught under most circumstances?
The pioneer of the trend in my mind would be the Vagabond (okay, no Nos here really). Then came the nano-Domi, then the Nano-Phoon, and now nano-ships seem to be popping up everywhere. I was ganked on the test server by a Nano-Curse on the test server the other day in a Vagabond
I guess it could be worse, ECM could still be overpowered and then the game would go to hell, but really, are nano-everythings really in the spirit of gameplay? I know the devs have stated that they will be "looking into ships that are going a bit too fast", which leads me to believe this is not where they want the game going, with battleships breaking 3,000 m/s regularly Nos'ing every ship within 25km while orbiting and avoiding tracking weapons.
I have to say, it would be quite funny to watch a fight between a nano-fleet, but I don't beleive for one second that it's in the best interest of the game if the trend continues.
I guess I don't mean this to be a rant, just a musing of sorts on where and why this came about.
Nano/I-stab ships certainly have drawbacks... Paper-thin tanks (aside from maybe a nano-Rohk or nano-Drake/Ferox), insane cap-dependancy, web-vulnerability (Huginn, anyone?), and a host of other issues, but the fact that they are SO good solo makes me raise my eyebrows a bit.
Where does anyone see this going? When will it come to a head? Will we see nano-fleets duking it out between the likes of some of the biggest names in Eve? Conjecture! Paranoia! Tin foil hats! Tux blogs!
I just think all the other races are finally seeing how much fun it is being Minmatar and are trying to compensate
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Zalt O
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:47:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Zalt O on 11/01/2007 16:43:53 As both a drone and turret user, I don't like fighting nano-ships... my drones cant catch them, sometimes even my light t2s wont even catch a battleship... which is sort of sad.
Basically they are invulnerable in a 1v1. Drones cant catch them turrets cant track them torpedoes lack the explosion velocity to do nominal damage, cruises work but still get a big penalty, heavies are generally unaffected (but with the latest HP boost from Kali killing even a tier1 BS with heavy missiles could take awhile), same with lights, and HAMs lack the range webs lack the range to web them (minus domination gear and officer)
Fortunately most dont use webs, so you can just slow boat it to the gate in a 1v1 If your at a belt, eject from you ship, wait for him to try to lock your pod, board your ship again, hopefully you'll have time to warp away
only real strategies Ive found in a 1v1 vs these new nanoships
alternatively, cruisers with MWD and dual webs can *****them, you wait till he is at the peak of his orbit, then double click 180 in the opposite direction, hit your mwd, hit both webs, and hes toast. (requires NOS/cap boosters to power the setup)
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thesulei
Syndicate Technologies
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:49:00 -
[3]
It sure looks like a nerf to the nano-setups is due.
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Johann Jeneau
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:51:00 -
[4]
i agree with the post autor, nothing logical in this ship mechanics
you should only be able to use 1 nano/inertial/overdrive in 1 lowslot now that we have warp to 0
that would be enough to ruin those nano ships even multiple NOS for me is wrong, at least they sould have a way way longer cycle like 3 times more
This may be radical but i would like to see proper space fights not arcade ones
I like my steaks bloody as hell |
Kella DelRae
Freedom United
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Posted - 2007.01.11 16:57:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Zalt O
If your at a belt, eject from you ship, wait for him to try to lock your pod, board your ship again, hopefully you'll have time to warp away
Keeps shooting your ship? I don't know I havent been out in lawless space in a while but this doesnt seem like it would help you at all? Unless locks on ships break when their pilots eject now which i didn't know.
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Zalt O
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:00:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Kella DelRae [Keeps shooting your ship? I don't know I havent been out in lawless space in a while but this doesnt seem like it would help you at all? Unless locks on ships break when their pilots eject now which i didn't know.
doesn't, but most people crave pod kills so they will go after it :P
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Pinky Denmark
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:05:00 -
[7]
nanoships are kind of ruining the gameplay and I hope the nerf they talk about hits soon and hard. I'd also like a max. 2 nos/neut limit on ships without bonus for them.
Regarding the speed nerf I think it's the penalties aren't severe enough, but atm I can°'t think on how they can nerf it enough... Battleships outrunning interceptors is not acceptable (not even if people paid many isk for implants and faction stuff) so I hope ccp gets a good solution.
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Reid Mallenfant
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:18:00 -
[8]
actullay nanophoon has been around along long time
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:35:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Pinky Denmark nanoships are kind of ruining the gameplay and I hope the nerf they talk about hits soon and hard. I'd also like a max. 2 nos/neut limit on ships without bonus for them.
Regarding the speed nerf I think it's the penalties aren't severe enough, but atm I can°'t think on how they can nerf it enough... Battleships outrunning interceptors is not acceptable (not even if people paid many isk for implants and faction stuff) so I hope ccp gets a good solution.
QTF.. naNoS-setups gotta go!
just give curse/pilgrim and other NOS/Neutz ships (the blood raider ones) a build in +1 NOS/Neutz per lvl bonus and add a low slot module that does the same so you have the option of a NOS-ship but it will definetly not be the absolute option to fit a ship like it is now.
ECM, NOS, Nano, I-Stab, pre-castor gank setups... I think there is another problem why we keep seeing these "invulnerability"-setups, the ships and mods are always tested if they perform in their intended role, but I doubt there is a team within CCP that tries to create invulnerability-setup, since their only ambition is to "test" the stuff, if they had a testing team with the ambitions of "Wining" then all these overpowered setups would dissapear instead of being replaced by other overpowered stuff the next patch. BTW when are they finally gonna fire Tuxford?
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Daikaze
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:36:00 -
[10]
I think the problem isn't the nano-ships but rather the lack of a counter balance. There is a lot of sacrifice in this layout but it doesn't seem that people are managing to exploit their weakness.
Webber drones might be a real good choice here. The drones have MWD so they should be able to catch the ship and slow it down a bit.I also have to question whether or not tracking enhancers should have a stacking penalty.
I'd really like to see a solution to this that isn't going to eliminate a play style and that won't result in a nerf to the smaller ships that make use of the nanos.
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Taipan Gedscho
Taipan Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:42:00 -
[11]
*sniff sniff* smells like fotm
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Johann Jeneau
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:43:00 -
[12]
In my previous post i forgot to say that i think this playstyle should be preserved but in only a few specialized T2 ships, and i mean the NOS part because the lowslots speed modules is the thing that really totally messes with physic and those have to be nerfed
I like my steaks bloody as hell |
Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.11 17:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Taipan Gedscho *sniff sniff* smells like fotm
Thus my useage of the word, "fad".
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Blind Man
Kemono.
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:00:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Blind Man on 11/01/2007 17:58:33 HI IM A WHINER AND I AM TOO:
[x] lazy [x] stupid [x] other
to find a solution by:
[x] training for/ganging with a huginn/rapier
and you even have one in you're sig, so use it and get your whinez off ma forumz
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Tammarr
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:07:00 -
[15]
/me pats and hopes some nanopilot or three will think its an easy bellicose they start shooting.
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Alassra Eventide
Veldspar Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:07:00 -
[16]
Gotta be the most ignorant and retarded post I have ever seen.
So everyone has to train for/ gang with a certain ship in order to combat a large group of ships setup the same way? Seems kind of ass-backwards to me.
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Davlin Lotze
Raging Destruction
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:09:00 -
[17]
Originally by: thesulei It sure looks like a nerf to the nano-setups is due.
Why not take this opportunity and finally do something about nos??!!????
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Martyr 01
Shinra Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:33:00 -
[18]
zOMG NERF all nano setups!!!!!!!!!
I mean it's not like there are any modules in eve that reduce a ship's speed or stop it from warping.........
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:34:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Blind Man Edited by: Blind Man on 11/01/2007 17:58:33 HI IM A WHINER AND I AM TOO:
[x] lazy [x] stupid [x] other
to find a solution by:
[x] training for/ganging with a huginn/rapier
and you even have one in you're sig, so use it and get your whinez off ma forumz
HI IM A TROLL AND I AM TOO:
[x] arrogant [x] retarded [x] off-topic
to find a solution by:
[x] stoping to post
and you even have your biased opinion in your sig, so get your trolling off my forumz
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:42:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Martyr 01 zOMG NERF all nano setups!!!!!!!!!
I mean it's not like there are any modules in eve that reduce a ship's speed or stop it from warping.........
Yeah with the 30km range our webifiers and 3km/s speed our web-drones have, not to mention that every race has a specialized webbing ship, I see no point why all ppl fly nano-setups, must be some RP thing.
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Gabriel Karade
Nulli-Secundus
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:47:00 -
[21]
I believe the Devs have acknowledged the problem and are looking into it.
Battleships zipping round at several Km/sec with full manoeuvrability is just plain wrong, the whole combat engine just isnĘt balanced for it. Even if they do get into web range, the momentum just lets them sail on through and out the other side.
Now if all you could do in such a ship was fly in a straight line, well, they wouldnĘt be quite as much of a problem...
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Video - 'War-Machine' |
Aramendel
Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:48:00 -
[22]
Personally I am flying a nanocurse now and, yes, nanosetups are in 1v1 basically unkillable exept by another nanoship or a huggin/rapier.
But saying the minnie recons balance this is like saying ECM was perfectly balanced pre-kali, all you needed to counter it were another ECM ship or a ship with 3 ECCM fitted.
The really important thing is not that there is a counter, but if the counter is common/acessible enough.
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Isonkon Serikain
Gallente Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:50:00 -
[23]
Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out. Pity the fool |
Zelakil
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:58:00 -
[24]
NO NO NO NO NO!!!! They do NOT need to limit nanos or i-stabs, they need to alter another aspect of gameplay in order to allow pilots an alternative to battle these things.
NERFING decreases game dynamics.
WE DO NOT NEED ANOTHER WoW! Please just come up with a solution that does not take yet another thing out of the game!
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 18:59:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out.
No comment
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Isonkon Serikain
Gallente Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:04:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Kunming
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out.
No comment
Thats right... And by the way, so can you. Just because you aren't interested in the possibilities, why ruin it for others?
I've seen a nano cerberus wreak total havoc... You can nano everything, these days. The possibilities haven't been fully explored. Pity the fool |
Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:08:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Zelakil NO NO NO NO NO!!!! They do NOT need to limit nanos or i-stabs, they need to alter another aspect of gameplay in order to allow pilots an alternative to battle these things.
NERFING decreases game dynamics.
WE DO NOT NEED ANOTHER WoW! Please just come up with a solution that does not take yet another thing out of the game!
And while we are banging our heads to "come up with a solution that does not take yet another thing out of the game", the rest of you will enjoy the new overpowered flavour of the month.
I know minmatar pilots feel very emotional about this cause their ships used to suck in pvp not long ago and finally get "the caldari joker" card, but I think you fail to realize that:
NANO-setup = Old DUAL-MWD-RAVEN
the devs and the community decided long, long, long, long ago that they didnt wanted this overpowered POS (and I'm not talking about control towers), so it got nerfed to hell and back (and even hurting gallente more than it hurt caldari, with scars on thorax and deimos), now its back its gotta get nerfed once again.
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:11:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Plymer Ization on 11/01/2007 19:13:37
Originally by: Blind Man Edited by: Blind Man on 11/01/2007 17:58:33 HI IM A WHINER AND I AM TOO:
[x] lazy [x] stupid [x] other
to find a solution by:
[x] training for/ganging with a huginn/rapier
and you even have one in you're sig, so use it and get your whinez off ma forumz
Thank you for not reading my post.
Originally by: Plymer Ization's OP
Nano/I-stab ships certainly have drawbacks... Paper-thin tanks (aside from maybe a nano-Rohk or nano-Drake/Ferox), insane cap-dependancy, web-vulnerability (Huginn, anyone?), and a host of other issues, but the fact that they are SO good solo makes me raise my eyebrows a bit.
Let me reitterate, I did not mean to whine, it's called a DISCUSSION.
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6Bagheera9
Shadows of the Dead Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:12:00 -
[29]
Nano/inertial stab set-up are gonna get nerfed, it would take more work on CCPs part to rework webbers in order to counter them (though I think webbers need it anyway). This will most likely take the form of a stacking penalty.
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Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:14:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain I've seen a nano cerberus wreak total havoc... You can nano everything, these days. The possibilities haven't been fully explored.
Nano-Cerb would be insane... the RoF bonus to HAMs would be just uber... too bad I can't fly Caldari
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