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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Nicocat
Caldari New Age Solutions
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:15:00 -
[31]
Nano/i-stab ships are fine. Nerf nos. And I say this as an avid Nanophoon pilot ;) ----------------------------
Originally by: Splagada SEED ME DADDY
WTB: Friggin' portrait |
Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:22:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain
Originally by: Kunming
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out.
No comment
Thats right... And by the way, so can you. Just because you aren't interested in the possibilities, why ruin it for others?
I've seen a nano cerberus wreak total havoc... You can nano everything, these days. The possibilities haven't been fully explored.
I am interested in the possibilities, but only if there is balance.. right now the only ship that can stop a nano-ship is a huginn/rapier, give every race a T1 ship with web range bonus and at least 3-4 mids, and you wouldnt see any nano-setups around at all. It was sorta alright that a T2 ship (vagabond) could only be countered by another T2 ship (huginn/rapier), but now you need a T2 ship to counter every T1 ship, nano setups are exploiting this exact lack of counter in the system.
I will come back to you to ask how much you enjoy these "new possibilities" (which are eventually old, old very old problems) once all small skirmish pvp is made out of nano-setups, just like the dual-MWD ravens back in the day.. though I do have a strong feeling CCP wont allow history to repeat it self this time around...
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Aramendel
Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:41:00 -
[33]
Although at that time there were no minnie recons. Which *are* an effective counter for nanosetups. But they are not enough. As was said, you can nano pretty much everything. The setup/counter relation is not suficcient.
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Blind Man
Kemono.
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Posted - 2007.01.11 19:55:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Kunming give every race a T1 ship with web range bonus and at least 3-4 mids, and you wouldnt see any nano-setups around at all.
as if we need to take away something from minmitar has that other races dont
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Tasty Burger
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:04:00 -
[35]
Web drones work well tbh.
The thing with nano setups is if you get a web on it, it is generally ****** no matter what else it does. Actually thats a problem with all minmatar stuff. But enough of that.
But speed tanking should be viable and effective in pvp. - It's great being Minmatar, ain't it? |
Rivek
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:10:00 -
[36]
Maybe speed setups aren't overpowered... maybe you see alot of them because they are fun to fly and allow for soloing in a blobby environment?
A corpmate of mine got 4 volleyed in a nanophoon by 4-5 bs a few days ago. Was he overpowered?
There are plenty of counters to nanosetups. They are called interceptors with webs. Alternately, high powered gunships with tracking computers and painters. I feel very sorry for the whiners if they can't come up with a single counter. ---------------------------------------------------
Remove Local Chat as the "I Never Lose Button" |
Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:11:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Tasty Burger Web drones work well tbh.
The thing with nano setups is if you get a web on it, it is generally ****** no matter what else it does. Actually thats a problem with all minmatar stuff. But enough of that.
But speed tanking should be viable and effective in pvp.
Don't get me wrong, I totally agree. But I think the glaring issue is at what level does speed tanking seem a bit... much? I fly Stabbers, own a Vagabond, etc, and of course I'm going to speed tank, as that's about the only thing they've got going for them. That, and compared to the DPS of some nano-ships, they hit like pillows. And if they decide to go full Nos they won't kill a shuttle.
Maybe the problem is that speedtanking done by other races steps on Minnie's toes? I'm just trying to throw stuff out there, I don't necessarily think that's true or not. I'm also trying not to turn this into an OMG NERF GALLENTE/DRONES/NOS/NANOS/AMARR thread
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No21
No0b21
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:19:00 -
[38]
Hmm yes, was gonna make a topic about Web drones but might as well post here about it. The problem i find in all of this is that it might make a no brainier ship setups and many starts to fit a load of iStabz and orbit in solo combat. Kill the drones and neglect the slow ones that dont hit you or lightly and finish the target off. Cool. But there should be at least something to counter them with a equal in class ship.
Webbing drones. Right now they are pretty slow and work so-so meh.And there is only heavy ones. Tested them on a Vaga and meh. They seem to be all to fragile(hp) compared to the heavy attack drones and not so rapid on getting in range and webbing them good. And they are a bit silly, the tactic would be if they cant out-speed the target they can stay in the opponents orbit, which they will but will start to come back to you. Because they stop chasing after some time, but in that time the opponent could do some severe damage to them and maybe even pop one(haven't checked =( ) before they stop. But even then, it seems an iStabz vaga could escape with some ease even if five of them starts to get within activation proximity range. And he can just align away from you and mwd out.... as if they stopped webbing . And how many ships have a drone bay size that could fit 5 H web drones? Should it take an Ishtar to take down a Stabber? Or having to be two just to get one? And get them fast before they decide to warp out?
What i want is to be able to have an option that could counter these ships in a effective way that works well. I dont want to just ward them off, i want to get them . It seems that CCP haven't implemented Light/Med weber drones for some reason. Lag? Or that they would make the iStabz coupled with some webbing drones the iWin? Thorax anyone? . Would be nice to have something that could counter these tactics in a broader way than having to have a minm recon, big drone bay, fast tackler(two). Harpoon missiles anyone? Yes, i am a noob, maybe even noob of the year? Donations would be cool. My sig is the best. And its blablabla on the forum...oooho. |
Lumel
Gallente University of Caille
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:23:00 -
[39]
Originally by: thesulei It sure looks like a nerf to the nano-setups is due.
It sure looks like a nerf to the ECM setups are due.
It sure looks like a nerf to the NOS setups are due.
It sure looks like a nerf to missiles are due.
It sure looks like a nerf to drones are due.
It sure looks like a nerf to the (whatever people are complaining about this month) is due.
Whee! This can go on all year and then some. --- Knowledge won't help us understand |
Takahashi Arran
coracao ardente Sani Khal'Vecna
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:26:00 -
[40]
I have a feeling this is going to be a loooong post:
Problem 1: lack of effective countermeasure for speed beyond 10KM
At present without buying expensive faction modules there is reaaly no way to reduce the speed of a ship beyond 10KM, your only option is match speeds with your opponent or fly into an asteroid belt or collidable structure, However under 10KM 1 web will screw the speed of pretty much any ship in game Proposed solution: reduce web range to ~7KM add a falloff for webs of ~5KM, this would increase the max range of a web while helping create a more graduall transistion between stopped and moving while providing a partially effective counter. Also introduce statis web rigs.
Problem 2: NOS pwn all A heavy nos will drain a frigate at the same rate it drains a BS, while always draining at max amount Proposed solution: give Nos a signature radius and tracking like guns so that a single heavy NOs does not destroy a frigate, while making NOS + MWD a less attractive tactic.
Problem 3: MWD gives every ship a massive speed boost, afterburners are generally pretty sucky
Proposed solution, increase the variation in base stats of ships to limit which ships can travel at insane speeds, Also boost afterburner effectivness a to make it a more attractive option for ships, again to give a more varied variety of speeds
Problem 4: Everone can be uber fast, making ceptors less usefull. Proposed solution: give Fast ships a role bonus for MWD speed boost and reduce MWD speed boost by the same amount, see reasoning above. I am sure there are more i've missed but these are the obvious ones
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Borasao
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:33:00 -
[41]
/me dons an asbestos suit.
Give MWD the same penalties for use as a WCS
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Dix Neuf
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:35:00 -
[42]
I don't see a problem with nanosetups. They're expensive as sin, and die painfully if webbed. They also field no tank.
Hrm. What's the minimum acceptable speed for a nanosetup anyway? 2500 m/s? I'm intrigued by nanorokh. :)
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Lexiana Del'Amore
Gallente Equilibrium Society
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:36:00 -
[43]
Rank Stabilizers and Nanofibers like afterburners...
-Small for frigates -Mediums for Cruisers -Large for Battleships
As i would hate to see any nerf slow down smaller ships who need speed to survive
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MrTripps
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:36:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Blind Man as if we need to take away something from minmitar has that other races dont
The ability to PVP without risk? Come on...if they nerf the nannophone you guys might actually have a challenge buzzing around in Vale.
Most people would sooner die than think; in fact, they do so. - Bertrand Russell |
MrTripps
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.01.11 20:56:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Rivek There are plenty of counters to nanosetups. They are called interceptors with webs. Alternately, high powered gunships with tracking computers and painters.
Neither of these work. Again, these are battleships that travel faster then interceptors. Your friend who got popped did not know how to use his ship. A Huginn might slow one down, but that is about it.
Most people would sooner die than think; in fact, they do so. - Bertrand Russell |
Blind Man
Kemono.
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:15:00 -
[46]
Originally by: MrTripps The ability to PVP without risk? Come on...if they nerf the nannophone you guys might actually have a challenge buzzing around in Vale.
lol, just because you cant adapt to certain tactics doesnt give you the right to whine about it.
no risk? yeah, because getting webbed and exploding is not risky at all
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Neon Genesis
Gallente Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:18:00 -
[47]
Nos is a far bigger problem. It's stupidly overpowered and setups without at least 1 raise eyebrows.
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SavageThrash
Angel Deep Corporation
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:24:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Blind Man
no risk? yeah, because getting webbed and exploding is not risky at all
ofc not then you would just log out
*snip* Please do not discuss moderation in your signature -Eldo <-Woah
[h6][center][g |
R'adeh
Gallente Gekidoku
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:24:00 -
[49]
What a stupid thread. Yes nanosetups are a pain to counter, but they drawbacks too. I can fit all nanos/inertias on whatever ships I want, but if I do that on an armor tanking ship, once I get webbed I'm dead. No speakworthy tank, nada, zip...
If I rig for speed I'm behind enemy lines, solo or only in a small gang. Now, 0.0 space isn't "solo-player space". You are supposed to have friends there. Work as a team and suddenly it's easy to kills a nanoship.
Stop asking for nerfs each time you think one ship is hard to kill. Adapt or die ffs!!
Otherwise you can start a gazillion threads like:
- OMGOMGOMG, Drake passive tank...haaaaaaaaxxx!!!!11!!! - Blasterthron's damage is sick!!!!11!!! - I have to fit a sensor booster to counter RSD11!!1!!
Stop whining and play the frickin' game! _______________________________________________
My views are my own and I don't represent my corp. Please show mercy Drakma! |
stummer
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:43:00 -
[50]
jesus stop the bloody whinging , i cant win verus every ship so nerf it now, have you no brain to think of a counter,. and there is more than one ie the huggin.
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Lexor SLice
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:55:00 -
[51]
medium laser boats > nano setups. ____________________________________________
Your signature graphic file size is too large -Zhuge
Sad Panda =( |
CoLe Blackblood
Murder-Death-Kill Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:57:00 -
[52]
Edited by: CoLe Blackblood on 11/01/2007 21:54:09 All fads go away.
CoLe Blackblood |
Karash Amerius
Amarr O.E.C
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Posted - 2007.01.11 21:59:00 -
[53]
My initial thought would be to modify the turning ability of any MWD or Nano setup to prevent a successful orbit. Some sort of math equation would obviously be in order here, but I am no math wiz.
Merc Blog |
Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.11 22:04:00 -
[54]
high speed combat is just more fun than slow speed combat.
Frig squads are tons of fun. But with the lag inherent in eve these days frigs die too easily. So the solution was to make bigger ships go faster.
I think nano-ships are actually good for eve, they encourage people to actually try to fight because they think they can get away.
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Marquis Dean
Repo Industries
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Posted - 2007.01.11 22:19:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Marquis Dean on 11/01/2007 22:16:08 Edited by: Marquis Dean on 11/01/2007 22:15:59
Originally by: CoLe Blackblood Edited by: CoLe Blackblood on 11/01/2007 21:54:09 All fads go away.
Cause they get nerfed? ------ ------
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Ice Breaker2
Kemono.
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Posted - 2007.01.11 22:28:00 -
[56]
Originally by: R'adeh What a stupid thread. Yes nanosetups are a pain to counter, but they drawbacks too. I can fit all nanos/inertias on whatever ships I want, but if I do that on an armor tanking ship, once I get webbed I'm dead. No speakworthy tank, nada, zip...
If I rig for speed I'm behind enemy lines, solo or only in a small gang. Now, 0.0 space isn't "solo-player space". You are supposed to have friends there. Work as a team and suddenly it's easy to kills a nanoship.
Stop asking for nerfs each time you think one ship is hard to kill. Adapt or die ffs!!
Otherwise you can start a gazillion threads like:
- OMGOMGOMG, Drake passive tank...haaaaaaaaxxx!!!!11!!! - Blasterthron's damage is sick!!!!11!!! - I have to fit a sensor booster to counter RSD11!!1!!
Stop whining and play the frickin' game!
the man speaks the truth.
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Dixon
Caldari Hells Donkeys
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Posted - 2007.01.11 22:40:00 -
[57]
I don't mind nano setups but I think everybody with half a brain knows that they'll be nerfed soon - it's just in the air. - - - - - -
Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
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Audri Fisher
Caldari The Keep THE R0CK
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Posted - 2007.01.11 22:57:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Rivek Maybe speed setups aren't overpowered... maybe you see alot of them because they are fun to fly and allow for soloing in a blobby environment?
A corpmate of mine got 4 volleyed in a nanophoon by 4-5 bs a few days ago. Was he overpowered?
There are plenty of counters to nanosetups. They are called interceptors with webs. Alternately, high powered gunships with tracking computers and painters. I feel very sorry for the whiners if they can't come up with a single counter.
Intercepters are not a valid counter. reason being heavy nos. That's the real problem, it is not just the fact that a nanophoone can outrun a gisti-corw, it is the fact that if the gisti crow does some fancy flying and managed to get ahead of it and web it before it turns into a stern chase, the crow either dies, or is nossed dry. nanophoons running around at 7km/s+ is just stupid.
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R'adeh
Gallente Gekidoku
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Posted - 2007.01.11 23:05:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Audri Fisher
Originally by: Rivek Maybe speed setups aren't overpowered... maybe you see alot of them because they are fun to fly and allow for soloing in a blobby environment?
A corpmate of mine got 4 volleyed in a nanophoon by 4-5 bs a few days ago. Was he overpowered?
There are plenty of counters to nanosetups. They are called interceptors with webs. Alternately, high powered gunships with tracking computers and painters. I feel very sorry for the whiners if they can't come up with a single counter.
Intercepters are not a valid counter. reason being heavy nos. That's the real problem, it is not just the fact that a nanophoone can outrun a gisti-corw, it is the fact that if the gisti crow does some fancy flying and managed to get ahead of it and web it before it turns into a stern chase, the crow either dies, or is nossed dry. nanophoons running around at 7km/s+ is just stupid.
In order to go that fast you need a HG Snake set. Those implants cost a small fortune, so I think it's kinda justified that you go that fast.
About NOS, what's wrong with a bigger ship being able to NOS a smaller ship??? Yes, NOS has become an offensive weapon, but just as with speed setups there are counters: Overwhelming damage, passive tank (extenders/plates), cap boosters, range, etc.
Seriously, adaptadaptadaptadaptadaptadapt... _______________________________________________
My views are my own and I don't represent my corp. Please show mercy Drakma! |
thesulei
Syndicate Technologies
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Posted - 2007.01.11 23:19:00 -
[60]
A webbed nanoship still does speeds from anywhere between 200m/s to 700m/s, which is enough to still have a high chance of survival.
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