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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:24:00 -
[121]
Dual danpen him. Then warp off. Simple.. or if he gets close web him.
Or use a domination web.. and you know there are those nice gang warfare modules that can make a domination reach > 20 km...
or take a huggin with domination alongside a BC and you can web him at 30 km...
or simply use sentries drones and move a bit away from them.. they canb hit a nanoship very well at 30 km...
Use the brain.
There are the extreme nano setup that are indeed overpowered. But these are fault of the Gisty MWD and Snake implants. Not on the nanos or any other thing.
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Brian Ballbag
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:25:00 -
[122]
Originally by: Mang0o
Originally by: Haniblecter Teg Web the ship. That easy.
yeah webb my vagabond.. i orbit at 18km and pwn whatever you fly..
Go back to wow and stroke your lousy little epeen elsewhere.
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:28:00 -
[123]
Originally by: wierchas noobhunter
we are better [ insert your corp/alaince here] we will kill [ insert your name here] we will stay and fight til we win
and i dont fly nano ships if u interested so just stfu
nano setups are only way to fights all those noobs who blob
and stop insulting my corp cos u have no idea who we are ....
So you wanna keep acting like an immature ****, ur choice...
I couldnt care less if u fly nano-setups or not, you're telling ur self that it is very effective vs blobs cause the fact is that you need multiple specialized ships to fight against that... blobs are not always consisted of nublars, what if a group of experienced pvpers blob with nano-setups? yeah right its definetly not overpowered..
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Galen Silas
Gallente Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:31:00 -
[124]
Edited by: Galen Silas on 12/01/2007 14:29:36 Not only do i think a nano setup to be lamer than elton john but also pretty fairylike.
Example... I was in my astarte and i have a full tank in the lows, cap injector (800's), with 6 heavy neutron blasters II's. This Euphoria Unleashed guy in a nanophoon had killed one of my m8's in his stabber then went after me in a belt. As the fight went on he went about 16 to 18 km away from me and had heavy nos and was pelting me with cruise missiles. No way whatsoever was i going to catch him, kinda lame where you can fit a setup where other people can't catch you.
Kinda makes fighting not as much fun as it should be. I know as well that if he was within my range i would have chewed him to pieces.Then just to sound cool they make a post on there killboards about my corp being crap pvp'rs... hehe, personally i think it was a little backwards on that remark seeings how he was the one afraid to get shot.
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:40:00 -
[125]
I can say its lame that you have a setup that can tank my guns!.. yeahh its lame i cant kill you
Or your guns are lame they make too much damage for me to tank.
GROW up! Game is about different tactics!
If the nanophoon is not using Gisty MWD and snakes, a simple MWD II is enough for most command ships to get him or go out of 20 km monetarly to warp away!
Damm i do this all time in my hurricane against vagabons! align to body.. wait he start the oposite direction part of orbit.. and then hit MWD.. I Usually can get out of 20km for a few seconds to warp.
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Rasta Rocketman
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:42:00 -
[126]
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out.
Finally, someone with some common sense in this thread.
Guys, just because you don't like that you are getting killed by these setups, doesn't mean they should be nerfed. Use your head, think about game mechanics, and come up with the best solution you can find.
btw, i think the popularity is largely for solo/small group PvPers and is due to the ability to run freely from the uberblobs that alliances produce when you enter space they inhabit, and the ability to not have to commit 100% to a fight. If local fills up with friends of the guy you are engaging, you can always break off. In other non-nano ship setups, you are committed and will get ganked. _______________________________________________
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Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:44:00 -
[127]
Naming names and flaming gets us nowhere. This is not about "Omg my corp pwns your corp you noobs, blah blah" rhetorical BS.
Also, I'd like to point out that this isn't a theme of just Matari ships being nano'd out, as a lot of people are focusing on the Nanophoon in particular.
There have been a *few* posts in this thread that are actually on topic and mostly not whining/flaming etc, I'd like an actual discussion, not flames or "GROW A PAIR AND STFU".
You look childish if you post like that. Whoops.
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Galen Silas
Gallente Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:45:00 -
[128]
Originally by: Kagura Nikon I can say its lame that you have a setup that can tank my guns!.. yeahh its lame i cant kill you
Or your guns are lame they make too much damage for me to tank.
GROW up! Game is about different tactics!
If the nanophoon is not using Gisty MWD and snakes, a simple MWD II is enough for most command ships to get him or go out of 20 km monetarly to warp away!
Damm i do this all time in my hurricane against vagabons! align to body.. wait he start the oposite direction part of orbit.. and then hit MWD.. I Usually can get out of 20km for a few seconds to warp.
Exactly what kind of a tactic is sticking about 18km from your target and leaving it as just that, not everyone fits a MWD dude, and that was something i tried but due to his agility and the speed he had i couldnt get out of his range.
You say it's a tactic, it's a coward manuever, and thats probably why the devs are going to nerf it because they actually want people fighitng not being a bunch of pansies, and if you think I need to grow up and that i don't have enough brute force then come to Katugumur, Heimatar region, and we will see how much brute force i don't have.
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Reto
The Last Resort
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:53:00 -
[129]
even if this opinion is very disliked by the op and his supporters:
nanosetups, speed over armor and skirmish warfare is the only thing what makes piracy, a very popular playstile, surive these days. pirates in the old days of seafaring used light and fast ships to outmaneuver their prey while having less firepower and durability in confrontations with big warships. since ccp intorduced warp to 0 to releave tranquility from the bm mayhem piracy was hit bigtime. nanosetups and fast raidships are the consequent answer and adaption to this change.
if ccp starts to further degenerate this game into a static "blob a) warps on blob b) and starts shooting primary..." this game will lose all its fun for a lot of ppl. alliances aren't the way to go and so isnt mining for open minded players, that is something i figured a long time ago for myself. players should always have the opportunity to choose between several playstyles without having trouble of convincing other players that it is ok.
i dont believe that the devs easily make decisiions about nerfing of several key aspects of this game and i hope that ppl who are against this sort of playstyle have at least some tolerance towards those who play the dangerous game of "either be fast or getting grilled big time".
I vote: Do not nerf the speed over tank alternative !
Originally by: s4mp3r0r "Hey man, you're mom has a cruise missile".
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Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:57:00 -
[130]
Originally by: Rasta Rocketman
Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Nanos are niche setups and can be countered. While they are a pain to deal with, there is no need to nerf them.
I, for one, am looking forward to trying a nanophoon out.
Finally, someone with some common sense in this thread.
Guys, just because you don't like that you are getting killed by these setups, doesn't mean they should be nerfed. Use your head, think about game mechanics, and come up with the best solution you can find.
btw, i think the popularity is largely for solo/small group PvPers and is due to the ability to run freely from the uberblobs that alliances produce when you enter space they inhabit, and the ability to not have to commit 100% to a fight. If local fills up with friends of the guy you are engaging, you can always break off. In other non-nano ship setups, you are committed and will get ganked.
That's a really good point, it's all about the blobs, really. Hopefully the dev's solutions to blob warfare will nullify the need for these nano setups, or at least in the numbers they're found these days.
I think with a person paying attention, there are few reasons to be caught by a nano ship. For example, if you are in a belt ratting, you should (if you want to survive) be relatively aligned for a Safespot, POS, or station, and have your scanner open @ max distance, 360 degree sweep. Watch local like a hawk. Warpout when local indicates a hostile or when you see an incoming ship on scanner.
Of course if you get stuck at a gate, you're usually done for if you're trying to warp out, but that would be the case many times anyway. The good thing about nano-ships is that they normally don't operate within web range, so at least you can get back to the gate before it's too late, or back to a station.
But that solves nothing aside from surviving to fight another day, it says nothing of catching or removing them from the area. Granted, I fit my Stabbers in a similar way, so that I can get out when I need to, but I am certainly not in an invincible state once I have engaged; I do take damage, and can be ganked. I can't orbit at 3500 km/s at 2500 metres and still hit, and I can't deny my target cap and still kill them efficiently. Neither can a Vagabond, which to me are built to be the speedy, GTFO ships when the situation goes bad.
I've been on the hot end of the guns of a Vagabond on many an occasion, and I know how irritating they can be, but it gets more irritating when a ship with higher DPS and normally much lower speed can do the same thing, relatively risk free if they know what they are doing.
Nano setups should be viable, but on certain ships only, and should not encroach on other racial traits (Minmatar - speed, bad tank) while maximizing their own racial strengths (Gallente - drones / Caldari - missiles).
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Amiable Quinn
Minmatar Lasleinur Production Fimbulwinter
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Posted - 2007.01.12 14:58:00 -
[131]
Well, one obvious counter to a nano-ship isą Another nano ship.
Tbh I would feel a lot more uncomfortable about nano-setups if they were strictly limited to Minimatar, but practically EVERY race has access to a decent nano-setup BS or BC size ship (with the possible exception of the Amarr due to the difficulty of fitting non-tracking based weapon systems, but I would love to see an Amarrian get a nano-geddon to work). When in a group just have one of these ships set up with a cap booster and a web and bam, you have an excellent anti-nano ship that has the advantage of being a nano-ship itself.
I find the Interceptor argument silly as what sane interceptor pilot would try to solo tackle ANY BS? NOS is the I-Win against ceptors, and what folks should be complaining about.
I look at it more globally in the sense of what type of game do I want to be playing. Faster ships are just more fun to fly, more mobile and allow greater tactical diversity. It will result in more specialization (which in my mind is good). Instead of battles where you have blobs sitting at gates, now some of those blobs will need to be fast ships, or you will need to have roaming gangs yourself. Will nano-ships be difficult to kill? Yes. Will they be difficult to drive away? No. Will it be difficult for them to kill you? Most likely.
I think the real problem is people donĘt feel satisfied just driving off their enemy. That is why you see such hostility to setups that are weak on offense but difficult to kill.
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar UK Corp Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:01:00 -
[132]
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 12/01/2007 15:00:41
Originally by: Galen Silas
Exactly what kind of a tactic is sticking about 18km from your target and leaving it as just that, not everyone fits a MWD dude, and that was something i tried but due to his agility and the speed he had i couldnt get out of his range.
You say it's a tactic, it's a coward manuever , rant rant whinge moan etc etc random threats
Consider:
1-Good tactics do NOT equal cowardice 2-Perhaps train MWD/nav skills? 3-EvE encourages team play and adaptation...try it-it works! 4-Forgive me for asking this...but are not Astarte's command-type ships designed to enhance a gang? If I am wrong here..never mind point 4.
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Galen Silas
Gallente Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:06:00 -
[133]
Originally by: Reto even if this opinion is very disliked by the op and his supporters:
nanosetups, speed over armor and skirmish warfare is the only thing what makes piracy, a very popular playstile, surive these days. pirates in the old days of seafaring used light and fast ships to outmaneuver their prey while having less firepower and durability in confrontations with big warships. since ccp intorduced warp to 0 to releave tranquility from the bm mayhem piracy was hit bigtime. nanosetups and fast raidships are the consequent answer and adaption to this change.
if ccp starts to further degenerate this game into a static "blob a) warps on blob b) and starts shooting primary..." this game will lose all its fun for a lot of ppl. alliances aren't the way to go and so isnt mining for open minded players, that is something i figured a long time ago for myself. players should always have the opportunity to choose between several playstyles without having trouble of convincing other players that it is ok.
i dont believe that the devs easily make decisiions about nerfing of several key aspects of this game and i hope that ppl who are against this sort of playstyle have at least some tolerance towards those who play the dangerous game of "either be fast or getting grilled big time".
I vote: Do not nerf the speed over tank alternative !
Guess all i am trying to say is that the devs didn't give every ship an HP increase for nothing, they did it to increase the duration of fights, and make fights more interesting, generally to make the pvp experience more enjoyable. I think they also did it because people complained about ships not having enough HP to begin with. Must be pretty frusterating that the devs work on implementing this into the game and most people then turn there backs and say... "nah, just fit nano's and a mwd with a few nos and you will be fine", kinda like giving a kid a cookie because he whines about not having one then he throws it and down and walks away.
I am a pirate also and i think this whole warp to 0 thing is great, my kill ratio has increased a lot since this, warping into a belt and knowing if the guy is on the complete opposite side of me doesn't really frusterate me anymore, thinking he will be like 35 or 40km away on warp in because of the preset 15km. only thing it affects is gates and stations.
Nano-whatever is not fighting, it's simply just trying to find the easy(lame) way out of a situation, as a player I would rather die in a fight where I at least knew the other person wasn't afraid to get shot and had a little confidence in themselves.
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:12:00 -
[134]
This debate is just the exact same as the "Nerf ECM" one we had not long ago.
Fights in which you cant do anything except sit and watch ur ship die aint fun, thats for facts, then there is the fact that to catch a nano-setup u need another nano-setup.. this disturbingly reminds me of how ECM-hores said fitt ECCM adapt or die, in the end every single setup had at least 1 ECM mod on it.. in the end every single skirmish setup is gonna turn into a nano-rat-race.
I am 110% confident in my arguements and know for sure that CCP is gonna nerf this, and definetly aint gonna spend more breath and efford to convince you "cool kids" who go around "adapt or die, adapt or die, nah na na na nah", since you were saying the same bull**** when it was about ECM or the dmg mod stacking or the RSD BB of doom or dual-MWD ravens or WCS or whatever overpowered combination you find and think its involved alot of tactic and thinking so those who cant beat it are idiots.
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:17:00 -
[135]
Originally by: Galen Silas
Originally by: Kagura Nikon I can say its lame that you have a setup that can tank my guns!.. yeahh its lame i cant kill you
Or your guns are lame they make too much damage for me to tank.
GROW up! Game is about different tactics!
If the nanophoon is not using Gisty MWD and snakes, a simple MWD II is enough for most command ships to get him or go out of 20 km monetarly to warp away!
Damm i do this all time in my hurricane against vagabons! align to body.. wait he start the oposite direction part of orbit.. and then hit MWD.. I Usually can get out of 20km for a few seconds to warp.
Exactly what kind of a tactic is sticking about 18km from your target and leaving it as just that, not everyone fits a MWD dude, and that was something i tried but due to his agility and the speed he had i couldnt get out of his range.
You say it's a tactic, it's a coward manuever, and thats probably why the devs are going to nerf it because they actually want people fighitng not being a bunch of pansies, and if you think I need to grow up and that i don't have enough brute force then come to Katugumur, Heimatar region, and we will see how much brute force i don't have.
I can pretty sure say that devs don want the game to be a pure simple mined game and they want speed to be a viable tactic. Or we would not have minmatar in game and missile explosion velocities would not be that high.
I could say that is cowardice that you use any tank in your ship... yeah its coward. real man use nopthing but high slots for weapons and low slots for damage modifiers... again.. grouw up enough to understand this game is not about a single playstyle! Other popele like to play different.
A minmatar ship can't outtank an equivalent gallente ship or caldari ship. So.. what are we suppsoed to do?
Now try to setup a typhoon to see if its easy to make it go 5 km/s You will need faction MWD or Officer ones and/or implants. If that guy spent 1 billion on his ship he deserves to pwon. You could spend the same 1 billion in a Thanatos and kill him!
And the brute force is my signature if you didn't noticed.. daaaaa
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Galen Silas
Gallente Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:18:00 -
[136]
/signed
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Reto
The Last Resort
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:26:00 -
[137]
Originally by: Galen Silas
Originally by: Reto even if this opinion is very disliked by the op and his supporters:
nanosetups, speed over armor and skirmish warfare is the only thing what makes piracy, a very popular playstile, surive these days. pirates in the old days of seafaring used light and fast ships to outmaneuver their prey while having less firepower and durability in confrontations with big warships. since ccp intorduced warp to 0 to releave tranquility from the bm mayhem piracy was hit bigtime. nanosetups and fast raidships are the consequent answer and adaption to this change.
if ccp starts to further degenerate this game into a static "blob a) warps on blob b) and starts shooting primary..." this game will lose all its fun for a lot of ppl. alliances aren't the way to go and so isnt mining for open minded players, that is something i figured a long time ago for myself. players should always have the opportunity to choose between several playstyles without having trouble of convincing other players that it is ok.
i dont believe that the devs easily make decisiions about nerfing of several key aspects of this game and i hope that ppl who are against this sort of playstyle have at least some tolerance towards those who play the dangerous game of "either be fast or getting grilled big time".
I vote: Do not nerf the speed over tank alternative !
Guess all i am trying to say is that the devs didn't give every ship an HP increase for nothing, they did it to increase the duration of fights, and make fights more interesting, generally to make the pvp experience more enjoyable. I think they also did it because people complained about ships not having enough HP to begin with. Must be pretty frusterating that the devs work on implementing this into the game and most people then turn there backs and say... "nah, just fit nano's and a mwd with a few nos and you will be fine", kinda like giving a kid a cookie because he whines about not having one then he throws it and down and walks away.
I am a pirate also and i think this whole warp to 0 thing is great, my kill ratio has increased a lot since this, warping into a belt and knowing if the guy is on the complete opposite side of me doesn't really frusterate me anymore, thinking he will be like 35 or 40km away on warp in because of the preset 15km. only thing it affects is gates and stations.
Nano-whatever is not fighting, it's simply just trying to find the easy(lame) way out of a situation, as a player I would rather die in a fight where I at least knew the other person wasn't afraid to get shot and had a little confidence in themselves.
did u ever get ganked by 7 ppl while trying to have some fun raiding some belts in 0.0 ? it is not very enjoyable for a pvp experience if u ask me. especially those pvpers who dont fly in 10 man gangs for a gankfest would be hit by a nerf bigtime. there ppl out there who enjoy pvp in a solo way and not always in gangs. if ppl fly in gangs i would rather fit for tank and dmg as for speed. no offence here but no amout of hp or anything else will keep u alive as a pirate if u go 1 vs 1 and the guy u agroing has 20 friends in local. again pirates dont always have huge wallets or the time to fill em up properly and just want some fun. loosing dozens of ships the honorable way by staying even if the fight is going to cost u ur ship is just unreasonable for the pirate profession. again i not intend to offend someone by my opinion and theres ofc nothing better than a good long fair 1vs1 fight but still piracy isnt exactly fair 1vs1. its searching for possibilites. searching for ransom and/or loot by overwhelming prey and not an equal opponent who knows that ur coming for him.
Originally by: s4mp3r0r "Hey man, you're mom has a cruise missile".
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j0sephine
Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:33:00 -
[138]
Edited by: j0sephine on 12/01/2007 15:31:20
"Nanoships are the perfect antiblob weapons..."
It's actually more complicated, and rather silly when you look closer at it... even in this thread. According to people defending this particular tactics:
* nano-setups are blob counters * "want to kill a nano-ship? blob up!"
... if we accept both these comments as true, then you have situation where this kind of tactics is some sort of self-propelling blob catalyst. I.e. the more people use the nanoships the more they force others to blob which makes more people use 'anti-blob' nano-setups which in turn forces people to blob up even more if they want to counter it... in the long run if blobbing is considered harmful, then the nanosetups are having negative effect on the game by encouraging the blobbing... with no real benefit offered in return.
Then you have another aspect -- because the whole "just blob up!" advice is really just nano-pilots blowing smoke up people arses so they can still have their anti-blob fun and the only real counter to nano-setup is another nano-ship, when you get people to actually realize it then it becomes world where ultimately everyone and their dog runs the same flavour of the month (or blob, because they didn't get the memo yet or are still believing the "just blob up!" smokescreen) ... and really, the game where everyone runs the same thing isn't very exciting. We've been there quite enough times already by now --;;
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:38:00 -
[139]
Originally by: j0sephine Edited by: j0sephine on 12/01/2007 15:31:20
"Nanoships are the perfect antiblob weapons..."
It's actually more complicated, and rather silly when you look closer at it... even in this thread. According to people defending this particular tactics:
* nano-setups are blob counters * "want to kill a nano-ship? blob up!"
... if we accept both these comments as true, then you have situation where this kind of tactics is some sort of self-propelling blob catalyst. I.e. the more people use the nanoships the more they force others to blob which makes more people use 'anti-blob' nano-setups which in turn forces people to blob up even more if they want to counter it... in the long run if blobbing is considered harmful, then the nanosetups are having negative effect on the game by encouraging the blobbing... with no real benefit offered in return.
Then you have another aspect -- because the whole "just blob up!" advice is really just nano-pilots blowing smoke up people arses so they can still have their anti-blob fun and the only real counter to nano-setup is another nano-ship, when you get people to actually realize it then it becomes world where ultimately everyone and their dog runs the same flavour of the month (or blob, because they didn't get the memo yet or are still believing the "just blob up!" smokescreen) ... and really, the game where everyone runs the same thing isn't very exciting. We've been there quite enough times already by now --;;
now you reaaaly confused me. If that weird confusion enhancing device the weapon you guys used to kill ASCN Titan?
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:40:00 -
[140]
Originally by: Kunming This debate is just the exact same as the "Nerf ECM" one we had not long ago.
Fights in which you cant do anything except sit and watch ur ship die aint fun, thats for facts, then there is the fact that to catch a nano-setup u need another nano-setup.. this disturbingly reminds me of how ECM-hores said fitt ECCM adapt or die, in the end every single setup had at least 1 ECM mod on it.. in the end every single skirmish setup is gonna turn into a nano-rat-race.
I am 110% confident in my arguements and know for sure that CCP is gonna nerf this, and definetly aint gonna spend more breath and efford to convince you "cool kids" who go around "adapt or die, adapt or die, nah na na na nah", since you were saying the same bull**** when it was about ECM or the dmg mod stacking or the RSD BB of doom or dual-MWD ravens or WCS or whatever overpowered combination you find and think its involved alot of tactic and thinking so those who cant beat it are idiots.
There is a big differrence. You here does not seem to knwo what really makes this setups ubber. Its not the nanos. Its the Officer and Gisty MWD and the Snake implants!!
Try to make a nanaoship that works without those!!
ECM was much more accessible to everyone.
I would agree a lot. in REMOVE snake implants form game! and reduce the Uber Faction MWD.
But leave nanofibers alone!!!
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
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Kiriz Zule
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:41:00 -
[141]
Originally by: j0sephine Edited by: j0sephine on 12/01/2007 15:31:20
"Nanoships are the perfect antiblob weapons..."
It's actually more complicated, and rather silly when you look closer at it... even in this thread. According to people defending this particular tactics:
* nano-setups are blob counters * "want to kill a nano-ship? blob up!"
Blobs are not the counter to NanoShips. Webs are. A Blob without a web is going to be a disappointed blob.
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:45:00 -
[142]
Btw if nano are nerfed.. you will see the biggest havoc ever seen. All minmatar pilots will demand that no dual repair modules can be used, no 2 plates can be used!
How in hell you want someone to use a stabber? Show me any good use for it that is not speed tanking? TRY!!!! Mke me a stabber with no spee dmods that can defeat a Vexor.. please...
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Ashiana
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:45:00 -
[143]
Damps. ECM. Drone Navigation Mods/Rigs (?). 15km web. Sniper ships. Fast tracking ships. Etc...
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:47:00 -
[144]
Aa yes.. You made me remember. Try a celestis. Show me a nanoship that can beat a cellestis with 2 T2 Damp and 1 Web....
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Plymer Ization
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.12 15:50:00 -
[145]
Edited by: Plymer Ization on 12/01/2007 15:48:20 Edit - nm, joke would be lost
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Phelan Lore
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.12 16:03:00 -
[146]
Originally by: Galen Silas
Example... I was in my astarte and i have a full tank in the lows, cap injector (800's), with 6 heavy neutron blasters II's. This Euphoria Unleashed guy in a nanophoon had killed one of my m8's in his stabber then went after me in a belt. As the fight went on he went about 16 to 18 km away from me and had heavy nos and was pelting me with cruise missiles. No way whatsoever was i going to catch him, kinda lame where you can fit a setup where other people can't catch you.
That's your fault for fitting blasters. Nano BS have such a huge sig that any turret except for large long range turrets will track them. If you had rails you would have chased him off.
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.12 16:14:00 -
[147]
Originally by: Kagura Nikon Btw if nano are nerfed.. you will see the biggest havoc ever seen. All minmatar pilots will demand that no dual repair modules can be used, no 2 plates can be used!
How in hell you want someone to use a stabber? Show me any good use for it that is not speed tanking? TRY!!!! Mke me a stabber with no spee dmods that can defeat a Vexor.. please...
Tbh no one is complaining about cruisers or smaller ships here, crow has an awesome speed tank, vagabond, saber, jaguar etc have all been around for awhile. But when BCs and BSs go ceptor speeds its wrong and thats what this thread is about.
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Kunming
Outcasts
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Posted - 2007.01.12 16:14:00 -
[148]
Originally by: Kagura Nikon Btw if nano are nerfed.. you will see the biggest havoc ever seen. All minmatar pilots will demand that no dual repair modules can be used, no 2 plates can be used!
How in hell you want someone to use a stabber? Show me any good use for it that is not speed tanking? TRY!!!! Mke me a stabber with no spee dmods that can defeat a Vexor.. please...
Tbh no one is complaining about cruisers or smaller ships here, crow has an awesome speed tank, vagabond, saber, jaguar etc have all been around for awhile. But when BCs and BSs go ceptor speeds its wrong and thats what this thread is about.
Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.12 16:21:00 -
[149]
Edited by: Kagura Nikon on 12/01/2007 16:20:33 SO Lets restrain to BS? Cause BC cannot achive these speeds without using BS sized modules and these will gimp them completely and they cannot feed it for more than 3 cycles.
Ok so your complaint is basically Typhyoon and Domni?
Now try to make a Typhoon go 4 km/s without any faction stuff or any implant. You won't do it. Now Put that nanophoon attacking a AC tempest and it is TOASTED!!!! My ACpest uses 1 TP and 1 Tracking enhancer. A nanophoon will have a signature of 2000m 30% form TP and its about 2600. Not hard at all to hit it. 2600/4000 is 0.65 200/340 is 0.58. So in fact its EASIER to hit it than to hit a typhoon at its common speed without MWD.
Please learn how game works. Really.
Of course if you fit a full snake set and officer stuff. Then is almost impossible to kill it, unless you use something as expensive as it... like a carrier.
If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!! |
Ranger 1
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.12 16:42:00 -
[150]
I can only speak from personal experience, and no, I do not fly a nano ship.
We found nanophoons and their cousins to be a bit frustrating at first, as it had been a long time since the days of dual MWDing Ravens and the like. Fortunately, todays incarnation of these ships are far, far less dangerous.
We put some thought into how to deal with these ships and frankly we have far more kills on nanoships than we have losses TO nanoships. The ship most at risk to a nanoship is the lone pilot with no backup and only fitting close range weaponry while active tanking. Nanoships don't have the umpfh to take down anything else.
What is really upsetting most people is not the amount of losses to nanoships. The true numbers are probably not that high. What is frustrating people is they are having difficulty destroying the nanoship before it escapes after an attack. To me, even if there were not effective counters, that is not a reason to nerf the tactic completely.
I feel I must clarify a few points.
1: Nanoships, while difficult to catch with ceptors, are not really that difficult to hit. I recently ripped a nanovaga up pretty hard with medium artillary on my Hurrican, I might add that I had no tank on this sniper set up, forcing him to run long before I was in danger. If our tackling Vaga had shown up just a second earlier...
2: Missiles/web combo's are highly effective against them, but you have to develop tactics suited to your prey to apply them in this case. Old tactics leave you with a string of dead ceptors.
3: You really need to realize that the losses you DO have to nanophoons would probably have died even quicker if the ship had been in a more conventional setup. The only difference is that the nanophoon was able to easily escape afterwards.
4: Speed tanking is NOT a sign of cowardice. It is vital component of combat that has been around in one form or another for a very long time in EVE. If sitting there playing the "Who can do the most damage, who can tank the most" game was the only way to go in EVE, you wouldn't have any experienced players in the game at all. We would long ago have gotten bored and left. Heavy damage and heavy tank setups have their place, just as speed tanking does.
Speed tanking could be toned down a "bit" on certain ships, but that's about as far as I will go. Otherwise, I might as well sit home with my game of Battleship on my lap. Conversely, there are other tweaks that could be made to make things more interesting instead of nerfing things.
Missile that have explosion speed as their major bonus, instead of sig radius. Making them very effective against fast ships in their correct size category, but suck against other size vessel. Perhaps these could even be a variety of T2 FOF's.
Faster webbing drones.
Heck, you could even develop a module that affected a ships navigational control when using a MWD, causing the target to travel in virtually a straight line.
Fanciful yes... but still better than nerfing fast ship combat overly much.
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