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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
17
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Posted - 2015.12.09 19:51:46 -
[1] - Quote
Hi!.
I was thinking long lately against what pirate faction's DEDs I should fly in my Tengu. Unfortunately two best options: Guristas and Serpentis are not very attractive because Guristas space is vastly populated by hostiles and Serpentis faction lacks DED 6/10 completely. Therefore I came to conclusion that good idea is to run Sansha and Bloods DEDs because in Amarr space there are large areas of almost empty low-sec where I can find DED 5-6/10 which are relatively easy to do (I do not want to go to null-sec at the moment). However as we know Tengu is not ideal ship against laser weak pirate factions. Yet I was able to create Tengu fit against them:
[Tengu, Combat LSB Sansha]
Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Capacitor Flux Coil II
Gist B-Type Large Shield Booster EM Ward Field II EM Ward Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Range Script 10MN Afterburner II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II Medium Rocket Fuel Cache Partition I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix Tengu Electronics - CPU Efficiency Gate Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
With my present skills and implants this fit offers 600 DPS pure EM gank and about 900dps tank against Sanshas/Bloods and it is cap-stable! Of course some pimping is possible but I tried to be as frugal as possible. So my question is if this fit i enough to run Sanshas/Bloods DED 5-6/10 sites successfully? |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
17
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Posted - 2015.12.09 20:11:01 -
[2] - Quote
DOUBLE POST! |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
53129
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Posted - 2015.12.11 03:58:53 -
[3] - Quote
Since I fly Loki against Angels I can't really give you an answer if the fit will work or not.
It seems ok. Hope it works well and good luck to you.
DMC
'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
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Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
2420
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Posted - 2015.12.11 06:08:28 -
[4] - Quote
It'll work. I'd say it's not ideal, but it will work.
The numbers I look at for 5/10s and 6/10s are maximum damage output, damage output at 50km, and rat-specific unheated tank. On my mostly BR-oriented Tengu that ran 543/543/321, which was enough to get by. 5/10s didn't require a refit to add a suitcase but it sure made things more comfortable.
Tengu for Serpentis runs 679/679/670, which is more than enough there and completes sites much more quickly.
My Legion for BR/Sansha on the same stats runs 737/553/350; I'm much happier with that performance in Amarr space.
A few things to consider.
First, 5/10s are more or less all alike. You just need enough (heated) tank to snipe the overseer and gtfo. Not really a big deal, but be ready to bookmark the wreck and leave. Don't be afraid to overheat. Seriously.
Second, the Sansha 6/10 really benefits from high amounts of pure EM damage. That overseer just plain tanks hard. You might want to carry an extra BCU to make it work.
Third, BR sites don't really neut you that hard. If we're talking 5-6/10 then you just have to mind the Archbishops and Harbingers. Keeping them at 30km or further will mitigate that concern. Various escalations are more troublesome; the end of Powergrid will leave you quite dry.
Finally, despite what everyone says, there actually is an effective Serpentis 6/10. It's just balls-to-the-wall brutal. I find it worth doing but your fit will die. Horribly. You'll want a ship specifically designed to handle that one if you opt to go that route. Serpentis 5/10s, though, are so laughably easy in a Tengu that it's almost worth the lack of a true 6 to go that route instead. |
Daku Otsito
Raptor Navy Whatever.
13
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Posted - 2015.12.11 07:40:49 -
[5] - Quote
Ah the blood raider DED sites
1. you need to apply more than 500 DPS EM to the final overseer in the 6/10 or else you won't break him. (keyword apply, HAMs have a tendency to not do that ) .
2. at 50KM you don't need a big tank at all for both the 5/10 or the 6/10 (expectations should be that you can do your full dps at that range)
3. the 6/10 has a freaking statis tower that you cant kill (or shouldn't anyway) in the second room(Maybe third) and around 12 ish BS
4. Neuting isn't an issue if you don't go near certains BS's (<25 Km) and if you kill those it's brawling time
tengu its a great ship but 600dps with rage HAMs is not that great might as well go for a stratios for almost same dps but at 60Km check this out
this being said i've been EFT-ing my a..off for a better ship and unless you go for a BS nothing projects at that range short of an ishtar but with 4 mids and 0 EM resists and no lasers bonus you still go to the stratios. I hate it cause 560 DPs ish is not that great for a DED but i'm not finding better solution other than the tengu which won't run it faster anyway if you calculate 300 ish dps with javs for the small stuff.
also old but gold |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
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Posted - 2015.12.11 13:24:40 -
[6] - Quote
Well, standard Pilgrim's fit have exactly 600 DPS gank and 900 DPS tank against Sansha/BR and is enough to run DED 5-6/10 sites according to Pilgrim. Of course how fast those DEDs can be finished is another question. Simply speaking Tengu with six HAM launchers does about 150 DPS more damage than Tengu with five HAM launchers but Tengu with five launchers can have much stronger tank what is especially important if one wants to fight Sansha/BR because Tengu's natural resistances are not strong against them. |
Daku Otsito
Raptor Navy Whatever.
14
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Posted - 2015.12.11 15:22:47 -
[7] - Quote
it never was about tank :D im sure you could make due even with this one (i know i did):
[Tengu, panzer] Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Capacitor Flux Coil II
Pith B-Type EM Ward Field Pith B-Type EM Ward Field Pithum B-Type Medium Shield Booster Missile Guidance Computer I, Missile Range Script 10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner Domination Shield Boost Amplifier
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II Medium Rocket Fuel Cache Partition II
Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
point is its still 650 dps and not enough range on those damn hams :) by all means though do use the tengu, it is the best ship for doing these sites ( If its worth to field it though i don't know considering ammo needs, refits to combat and travel fits you still get the same time for finding and clearing a site. |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
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Posted - 2015.12.11 15:29:01 -
[8] - Quote
OK! So let's pinpoint how much DPS tank is needed to run DED 5-6/10 sites? Maybe I overestimate this... |
Daku Otsito
Raptor Navy Whatever.
14
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Posted - 2015.12.11 15:51:17 -
[9] - Quote
what i can give is this:
Depends on range far too much. look at the tank on that stratios its 2 extenders and 2 hardeners + rigs it gets around 70k ehp against blood raiders and its enough to actually tank the whole last room on the 5/10 for the time necessary to kill the overseer and warp out . around 40% shields too so comfortable. The engagement range is 54-60 Km and you will be using curators. If you stick to those ranges you will always be at 70-80% shields. one trcik for the 6/10 is to pull the overseer away from the other dudes as he is the only to aggress and use heavies.
when i ran the site in a the tengu fit i posted it could tank anything if i was at 35 Km from the closest BS but slip once and you might have to find out how fast can you warp when you are cap dead ( the worst experience is on the 3rd room of the 6/10) you will need to wait for the BS to come to you since you want to be out of the sentinel web range (50km) you need speed to tank with my fit.
this being said nothing scrams in those sites so try the fits, one thing i can definitely tell you is that your fit is overtanked though.
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
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Posted - 2015.12.11 16:20:14 -
[10] - Quote
In my case slightly pimped Tengu with six HAM launchers can deal 750 dps (pure EM) @ 40 km / 600 dps @ 70 km and has around 600 dps tank against Sansha while speed-tanking 600 m/s. Enough? |
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
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Posted - 2015.12.11 17:58:15 -
[11] - Quote
BTW, yesterday I scanned down twenty low-sec systems and I found no DED 5/10 ans DED 6/10 sites! |
Daku Otsito
Raptor Navy Whatever.
14
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Posted - 2015.12.12 02:26:47 -
[12] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:In my case slightly pimped Tengu with six HAM launchers can deal 750 dps (pure EM) @ 40 km / 600 dps @ 70 km and has around 600 dps tank against Sansha while speed-tanking 600 m/s. Enough?
More than enough but i wonder how you got that dps (i hope you didn't make the ship a loot pinata) probably implants though :)
also i was trying the gila on the sansha 6/10 it took me f...forever to kill the overseer with 700 dps, and i had to warp out once due to tank (i was flying close to use fury missiles though) anyway just wanted to tell you gila works on sansha well enough but you need HMLs if you want to keep range ( i was using rlmls but they suck )
Edit: it was today so its after nerf gila we are talking about |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2015.12.12 16:37:28 -
[13] - Quote
Yes, thanks to +3% missile implants.
Gila, Stratios...well, I think I trained Tengu to have much better ship than those two so I do not want to back to the past. |
Jamie Stavax
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2016.03.02 07:43:02 -
[14] - Quote
How does one run the final room in a sentry boat anyway?
Drop sentries and sit still, tank whole room, snipe overseer and warp out?
In a tengu it's pretty easy, align, shoot, kill, warp off. |
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
834
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Posted - 2016.03.02 07:59:04 -
[15] - Quote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pgZjMw_wqo
"Tomahawks?"
"----in' A, right?"
"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."
"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
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Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
526
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Posted - 2016.03.09 17:34:50 -
[16] - Quote
https://pilgriminexile.wordpress.com/2014/03/03/sanshas-nation-neural-paralytic-facility-sanshas-510/
Scroll down and you can find some fits linked at the bottom of that page
[Tengu, 5/10 adapted] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Ballistic Control System II
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Pithum A-Type Medium Shield Booster Pith X-Type EM Ward Field Pith X-Type EM Ward Field Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II Medium Rocket Fuel Cache Partition I Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II
Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
is the slightly adapted version I used to use for sansha 5/10s (because I didn't have as good cap skills as the blogger)
but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
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