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Olmecu
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2015.12.13 07:56:01 -
[1] - Quote
hello!
i am a returning player who did and does lvl 4 missions in high sec, for the lai dai protection service.
the rats are not having bounties? maybe i don't recall correctly, but a few years ago they did have. so when taking a mission, i got money from the agent, the bounties on the rats, loot and salvaging. nowadays no more bounties? or at least not for lvl 4 missions?
i have started doing some lvl 1 missions for the gallente federation customs. and the rats do have bounties on them.
so, i don't really understand how it works nowadays. and when it comes to the x millions isk/hour posts i see on the forum, i am even more confused...
hope i was clear about my question and if someone could clarify things for me, i would be grateful! |
Caterpil
Alternative Dynamics
60
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Posted - 2015.12.13 08:58:47 -
[2] - Quote
Bounties work the same way that they always have.
Were you fighting vs Empire factions? If you are fighting vs Empire factions, the rats won't have bounties - The equivalent ISK comes from dropped tags.
Pirate NPCs, Rogue drones and Mercenaries all have bounties as usual. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
53161
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Posted - 2015.12.13 10:59:18 -
[3] - Quote
Just wanted to add this to what Caterpil posted above :
Welcome back to Eve, hope you have a much longer and more rewarding career this time around.
As for the threads boasting X amount of ISK per hr, personally I wouldn't put much stock in what they say. The biggest part of their ISK per hr is based on getting theoretical ISK exchange value for Loyalty Points.
Also those people are either multi-boxing with alt characters or they Min/Max everything by only accepting certain missions which they blitz (only destroy what's needed to complete mission) as well as disregard collecting the loot or salvage.
DMC
'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
4852
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Posted - 2015.12.13 12:25:13 -
[4] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:As for the threads boasting X amount of ISK per hr, personally I wouldn't put much stock in what they say. The biggest part of their ISK per hr is based on getting theoretical ISK exchange value for Loyalty Points. Actually, for me it's bounties and tags (but yes, I am also multi-boxing).
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Chan'aar
State War Academy Caldari State
29
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Posted - 2015.12.13 13:59:58 -
[5] - Quote
A while ago they (CCP) changed how bounties were paid into your wallet.
It used to be that as you killed a npc ship you got the bounty for that ship.
Now bounties are only paid once every 15mins (I think) so if you do a mission then look at your wallet it might appear as if you are not getting bounties. Give it a while and they should appear. |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
698
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Posted - 2015.12.13 16:14:05 -
[6] - Quote
Olmecu wrote:hello!
i am a returning player who did and does lvl 4 missions in high sec, for the lai dai protection service.
the rats are not having bounties? maybe i don't recall correctly, but a few years ago they did have. so when taking a mission, i got money from the agent, the bounties on the rats, loot and salvaging. nowadays no more bounties? or at least not for lvl 4 missions?
i have started doing some lvl 1 missions for the gallente federation customs. and the rats do have bounties on them.
so, i don't really understand how it works nowadays. and when it comes to the x millions isk/hour posts i see on the forum, i am even more confused...
hope i was clear about my question and if someone could clarify things for me, i would be grateful! If you have questions regarding high isk/h have a look at the guide in my sig. Feel free to pm me questions after you've read it.
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier v1.04
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Chainsaw Plankton
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
2199
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Posted - 2015.12.13 23:06:35 -
[7] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Just wanted to add this to what Caterpil posted above :
Welcome back to Eve, hope you have a much longer and more rewarding career this time around.
As for the threads boasting X amount of ISK per hr, personally I wouldn't put much stock in what they say. The biggest part of their ISK per hr is based on getting theoretical ISK exchange value for Loyalty Points.
Also those people are either multi-boxing with alt characters or they Min/Max everything by only accepting certain missions which they blitz (only destroy what's needed to complete mission) as well as disregard collecting the loot or salvage.
DMC I'd put a decent amount of stock in what they say. by comparing what you can do to what is possible allows you to make improvements. Making a few small adjustments can translate to meaningful differences in income. Knowing things like having a stack of reports in station so you don't have to stick around and possibly get scrambled in stop the thief will save you time. Or if you are in a marauder knowing where you position yourself in missions so you can tractor the best wrecks. Going for the max rates isn't something you should immediately start off with as a goal, but constantly improving is something to work towards.
The isk/lp conversion rates have been pretty stable for a long time, (However there has been a slight decline trend) and are pretty easily verifiable. Fuzzworks even calculates it all for you: https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/lpstore/ Note you have to be mindful of things like volume and short term manipulations, a lot of random worthless implants show as being a good isk/lp trade but you will likely never sell one for that price. Also since it calculates it out by region you can have an instance where the jita price is one thing, and someone is selling a few for cheap in some other part of the forge and it can under report the isk/lp you would get by trading in jita.
I did a lot of accept all missions and then blitz as I was going for 9.9 faction standings. and then missions like recon, or the anomaly are great as they count as 3 missions to the next storyline and can be run very quickly in a fast ship. Standings are something that are very easily min maxable and I wish I realized that sooner, I probably never would have even tried for 9.9 caldari standings. I don't even want to estimate the opportunity cost of that. Now I know that I can decline an insane percentage of missions and run only the best, it is a pretty easy decision to make imo. I knew some of that while I was on my quest, but it was also pre burner missions, so at this point I'm guessing the trade off wasn't too huge. I also think the warp speed changes were a huge change in what is possible.
I generally track what I can do but most of it is just mental, like I know my typical time for mission x is n minutes. and that doesn't necessarily directly translate to isk/hour. also since most of it is mental and doesn't include a full picture it is hard to compare my tactics from a while back. would be nice to be able to compare full clear + loot & salvage, to mostly clearing with cherry picking BS wrecks, to blitzing, to declining and only taking the best blitzing, and then burner blitzing.
@ChainsawPlankto
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
4857
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Posted - 2015.12.15 00:06:20 -
[8] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:would be nice to be able to compare full clear + loot & salvage, to mostly clearing with cherry picking BS wrecks, to blitzing, to declining and only taking the best blitzing, and then burner blitzing. Salvaging wrecks ain't what it used to be... There are only a handful of missions that regularly pay to take the time to salvage.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1751
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Posted - 2015.12.15 00:16:08 -
[9] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Chainsaw Plankton wrote:would be nice to be able to compare full clear + loot & salvage, to mostly clearing with cherry picking BS wrecks, to blitzing, to declining and only taking the best blitzing, and then burner blitzing. Salvaging wrecks ain't what it used to be... There are only a handful of missions that regularly pay to take the time to salvage.
My understanding salvage and then a little later reprocessing loot were deliberately nerfed due to some perception that loot and salvage was negatively effecting someone somewhere or other. Part of the motivation may have been an attempt to shutup whining about hisec AFK missioning for loot and bounties and how it needed nerfing. As a direct result looting and salvage became unviable unless you were a new player and as a result blitzing for LP became a thing.
Blitzing SOE specifically was helped along by the introduction of SOE ships which added some needed diversity to the SOE LP market. The burners are clearly another example of CCP introduced easily blitzable content.
HENCE ... despite it being a sandbox - CCP attempting to interfere (probably due to player whining) has resulted in a mission blitz paradigm that other (or maybe the same) players now whine about.
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Caleidascope
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
600
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Posted - 2015.12.15 01:58:59 -
[10] - Quote
Chan'aar wrote:A while ago they (CCP) changed how bounties were paid into your wallet.
It used to be that as you killed a npc ship you got the bounty for that ship.
Now bounties are only paid once every 15mins (I think) so if you do a mission then look at your wallet it might appear as if you are not getting bounties. Give it a while and they should appear. For the past 7? years.
Life is short and dinner time is chancy
Eat dessert first!
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
4857
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Posted - 2015.12.15 02:50:15 -
[11] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:My understanding salvage and then a little later reprocessing loot were deliberately nerfed due to some perception that loot and salvage was negatively effecting someone somewhere or other. Part of the motivation may have been an attempt to shutup whining about hisec AFK missioning for loot and bounties and how it needed nerfing. As a direct result looting and salvage became unviable unless you were a new player and as a result blitzing for LP became a thing. I believe it was to directly or indirectly buff mining, reprocessing in POS and to a lesser extent, the Rorqual (another can of worms, but I digress). I personally don't have a problem with it since I reprocess maybe 10% of my salvage total. I don't think it really effected most high-sec missioners in general, either.
You've always been able to blitz Lv4 missions (and there have been numerous strategy guides), whether it was for LP or standings. Burners and SoE hubs just took it to an entirely new level. I prefer the 'shoot and occasionally loot' strategy myself, although I have resumed the Team Burner missions since I can complete them in a universal Garmur.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Sheeth Athonille
Rabid Dogz Mining The Bastion
61
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Posted - 2015.12.15 03:13:23 -
[12] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote:My understanding salvage and then a little later reprocessing loot were deliberately nerfed due to some perception that loot and salvage was negatively effecting someone somewhere or other. Part of the motivation may have been an attempt to shutup whining about hisec AFK missioning for loot and bounties and how it needed nerfing. As a direct result looting and salvage became unviable unless you were a new player and as a result blitzing for LP became a thing. I believe it was to directly or indirectly buff mining, reprocessing in POS and to a lesser extent, the Rorqual (another can of worms, but I digress). I personally don't have a problem with it since I reprocess maybe 10% of my salvage total. I don't think it really effected most high-sec missioners in general, either. You've always been able to blitz Lv4 missions (and there have been numerous strategy guides), whether it was for LP or standings. Burners and SoE hubs just took it to an entirely new level. I prefer the 'shoot and occasionally loot' strategy myself, although I have resumed the Team Burner missions since I can complete them in a universal Garmur.
I think you're missing the original loot nerf. Loot contents were nerfed a few years back, followed by the reprocessing nerf. The combined effect has been fairly significant (at least from what I've seen) |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
700
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Posted - 2015.12.15 03:22:59 -
[13] - Quote
The original meta 0 loot nerf was to help boost manufacturing.
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier v1.04
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Chainsaw Plankton
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
2207
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Posted - 2015.12.15 03:41:01 -
[14] - Quote
Caleidascope wrote:Chan'aar wrote:A while ago they (CCP) changed how bounties were paid into your wallet.
It used to be that as you killed a npc ship you got the bounty for that ship.
Now bounties are only paid once every 15mins (I think) so if you do a mission then look at your wallet it might appear as if you are not getting bounties. Give it a while and they should appear. For the past 7? years. I think it was included in one of the "need for speed" improvements, I remember most of those hitting sometime in 2007, maybe 2008. So 7 years sounds right. AKA it is easier on the database to cache bounties and pay out 20 mins rather than every npc kill.
Sheeth Athonille wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote:My understanding salvage and then a little later reprocessing loot were deliberately nerfed due to some perception that loot and salvage was negatively effecting someone somewhere or other. Part of the motivation may have been an attempt to shutup whining about hisec AFK missioning for loot and bounties and how it needed nerfing. As a direct result looting and salvage became unviable unless you were a new player and as a result blitzing for LP became a thing. I believe it was to directly or indirectly buff mining, reprocessing in POS and to a lesser extent, the Rorqual (another can of worms, but I digress). I personally don't have a problem with it since I reprocess maybe 10% of my salvage total. I don't think it really effected most high-sec missioners in general, either. You've always been able to blitz Lv4 missions (and there have been numerous strategy guides), whether it was for LP or standings. Burners and SoE hubs just took it to an entirely new level. I prefer the 'shoot and occasionally loot' strategy myself, although I have resumed the Team Burner missions since I can complete them in a universal Garmur. I think you're missing the original loot nerf. Loot contents were nerfed a few years back, followed by the reprocessing nerf. The combined effect has been fairly significant (at least from what I've seen) probably a little bit of all of the above. CCP keeps doing stuff to make mining "better" but I have no idea what they are going for with that. The way people afk mine and just dump ore I'm not sure they really can boost mining long term.
looting/salvaging was great when you could make a few battleships every day from your reprocessed loot, and melted cap/alloyed trit would sell for 500k each. These days a bunch of t2 salvage items aren't above 500k
@ChainsawPlankto
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Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
4858
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Posted - 2015.12.15 03:59:42 -
[15] - Quote
Sheeth Athonille wrote:I think you're missing the original loot nerf. Loot contents were nerfed a few years back, followed by the reprocessing nerf. The combined effect has been fairly significant (at least from what I've seen) There was also a drone loot nerf (or maybe that's the same one). Before my time... In retrospect they don't seem that significant. Then again, the cost of a PLEX was well under 400m ISK at that point too...
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Olmecu
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2015.12.15 08:02:06 -
[16] - Quote
wow, thank you all for the great feedback! :) |
Kaska Iskalar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
34
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Posted - 2015.12.15 10:59:46 -
[17] - Quote
Olmecu wrote:Wow, thank you all for the great feedback! :)
Edit: started doing lvl 2 missions and got a Thorax (just because I like how the ship looks :P), but was quite disappointed with the performance. So, if you could post/ direct me to a nice fit for the Vexor it would be very much appreciated. And maybe a Myrmidon for the lvl 3? And I do have decent drone skills - T2 light + medium, T1 heavy. Gunnery better, but still :) Don't wanna get rich over night, just want to have fun and experiment (without wasting too much time though :) )
Thanks in advance :) My vexor has a rep, 2 energized resistance plates and 2 drone damage upgrades in lows. Cap recharger 2's and an afterburner in mids. Highs are meta 4 dual 150mm railguns because my fitting skills suck. |
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1753
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Posted - 2015.12.15 23:34:02 -
[18] - Quote
I used to run a passive shield tank sentry drone Vexor. A bit unconventional but it had a surprisingly solid tank. |
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