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Nafensoriel
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
231
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Posted - 2015.12.21 19:20:55 -
[31] - Quote
To be entirely fair... Virtual drones could be added similar to how carrier drones will be handled. Downside is lack of options in how to use those drones and possibly having them completely wrecked by ECM.
But on a technical level you could reduce drone ships to a single drone representing an entire "swarm" by graphics. Fleet battles would need the option to disable the swarm though or computers would explode around the world. |
Bobman Smith
Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop
0
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Posted - 2015.12.21 21:45:46 -
[32] - Quote
Ah as much as I'd love this idea, unfortunately it would not balance well. More 'guns' does not necessarily make for a better game.
But with that said, It would be nice to have a true drone boat that does not use any high spots to add damage. Maybe add some more high slot mods to improve drone use. Have some high spot mods that increase drone speeds and tank. (And remove drone assist from game)
Little off topic but something that I think would be great is a drone mining ship. Recreate the Harvester Mining Drone so they don't fly back to the ship but drop cargo containers when they are filled and you would have to tractor beam them to the ship. This would counter the afk miner a bit if those cans had say, only 15 mins before they disappear. And by doing it effectively would yield more volume then whats currently in operation. And make it a larger vessel with the Procure philosophy in mind: Strong tank, good DPS for drones for defense. Hell, while were dreaming, make a Capital version of it with Jump Drive! And damn well balance its defenses in such as way that you actually see these things mining! It would be quite the site to have a Rorqual providing on grid boosts and compressing ore while we have a half a dozen or so of these Capital sized drone mining ships in a fleet with a bunch of lesser SP pilots all using the T1/T2 Exhumers! Enough combined DSP/Tank that only a well organized/sizable fleet would consider. Rewards of organizing such an Industrial Operation would be how effective it would be at turning Roids into Compressed Ore! I mean, why cant we have large scale mining operations in Eve that mimic the scale of capitals fights? Awe... I'm starting to ramble... Dreams...
T3 Destroyers should cost aprox 160M. Change 50% to 25% weapons damage bonus.
Remove Insurance from game. Undocking should be risky with no paybacks!
Ban Frigate Pirate Ships from Novice FW Plexs.
Have more then 1 Clone in a station without loss.
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1153
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Posted - 2015.12.23 02:16:08 -
[33] - Quote
Yeah... I still want a pure drone boat.. Sounds entertaining and it's hard to build and efficient boat that focuses purely on drones... Unless you want a carrier or super carrier, which i do not. |
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
247
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Posted - 2015.12.23 02:24:35 -
[34] - Quote
Lyra Gerie wrote:The only reason to dump out more than 5 drones would be to act like how current attack BCs do. It would be a heavy hitter with lighter shield/armor/hull and likely little to no drone bay above its bandwidth.
How about a BS that can carry and launch fighters/bombers and is designed to attack supercaps?
Nafensoriel wrote:Hamsters didn't like it is an understatement... The hamsters caught fire and almost burned down Iceland. They blamed it on a volcano though.
The answer is clearly that CCP needs to upgrade to either gerbils or guinea pigs.
I can has blogging skills!
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1162
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Posted - 2015.12.23 06:55:24 -
[35] - Quote
Linna Excel wrote:Lyra Gerie wrote:The only reason to dump out more than 5 drones would be to act like how current attack BCs do. It would be a heavy hitter with lighter shield/armor/hull and likely little to no drone bay above its bandwidth. How about a BS that can carry and launch fighters/bombers and is designed to attack supercaps? Nafensoriel wrote:Hamsters didn't like it is an understatement... The hamsters caught fire and almost burned down Iceland. They blamed it on a volcano though. The answer is clearly that CCP needs to upgrade to either gerbils or guinea pigs.
I believe they're currently in the process of upgrading to ferrites...
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Iain Cariaba
2245
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Posted - 2015.12.23 07:19:49 -
[36] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Linna Excel wrote:Lyra Gerie wrote:The only reason to dump out more than 5 drones would be to act like how current attack BCs do. It would be a heavy hitter with lighter shield/armor/hull and likely little to no drone bay above its bandwidth. How about a BS that can carry and launch fighters/bombers and is designed to attack supercaps? Nafensoriel wrote:Hamsters didn't like it is an understatement... The hamsters caught fire and almost burned down Iceland. They blamed it on a volcano though. The answer is clearly that CCP needs to upgrade to either gerbils or guinea pigs. I believe they're currently in the process of upgrading to ferrites... Oh gods no! If they upgrade to ferrets, those fuzzy little carpet sharks will steal everything in sight!!! You won't need to worry about losing your battleship, because the ferrets will steal them all and hide them under the couch.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1162
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Posted - 2015.12.23 07:35:52 -
[37] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote: Oh gods no! If they upgrade to ferrets, those fuzzy little carpet sharks will steal everything in sight!!! You won't need to worry about losing your battleship, because the ferrets will steal them all and hide them under the couch.
All will be ok.. You can sniff the stinky little bastards out. |
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
1112
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Posted - 2015.12.23 09:32:12 -
[38] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Yeah... I still want a pure drone boat.. Sounds entertaining and it's hard to build and efficient boat that focuses purely on drones... Unless you want a carrier or super carrier, which i do not.
Dominix is your boat.
It can fit guns, but does not need to. Use the slots for a couple Drone Link Augmentors and some Remote Reps to keep the things topped off, or even some autotargeters to keep your target selection as efficient as possible. Put a Sensor Booster in your mids and snipe all the things with sentries. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2434
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Posted - 2015.12.23 14:34:51 -
[39] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Bumblefck wrote:The thread title is accurate - this is BS, of the classiest order.
Think of the server load! Hey, fun doesn't require a role, niche, or to counter something specific.. As far as the sever load, a thousand ships with 5 drones and all the weapons/effects probably have the same amount of server load...
Problem is, the drones move as opposed to your guns which are bolted on your ship. The drones each have their own movement vector to be handled by the server so their position is updated for their next attack. You can fire up to 8 guns at the same time and not really load the server much because they all use the same information for the hits. They all have the same tracking difficulty because they are all at the same place moving in the same way relatively to their targets. Drones shots don't get to enjoy this. The current 5 all have different firing solution because they all have their own movement relative to the target which can be wildly different. Adding more drones really does add to the server load. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1165
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Posted - 2015.12.23 15:06:58 -
[40] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Problem is, the drones move as opposed to your guns which are bolted on your ship. The drones each have their own movement vector to be handled by the server so their position is updated for their next attack. You can fire up to 8 guns at the same time and not really load the server much because they all use the same information for the hits. They all have the same tracking difficulty because they are all at the same place moving in the same way relatively to their targets. Drones shots don't get to enjoy this. The current 5 all have different firing solution because they all have their own movement relative to the target which can be wildly different. Adding more drones really does add to the server load.
Agreed, but that wasn't my point.
The point I was getting at is that there's already a crap ton of drones out, and a ton of ships firing at different targets. I don't know that adding 5 more drones to the blob would have that much of an effect.
However, if they do start giving problems, just smart bomb them off the field.
That said, 5 fighters with the role bonus of a super carrier is 1k dps. This is a pretty good damage level without adding to the drone count.
However, they'll need to be given a pretty substantial tracking bonus to make up for being dedicated to fighting sub-capitals. |
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Kerandra Newton
The Mental Asylum Ministry of Agressive Destruction
0
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Posted - 2015.12.23 15:18:08 -
[41] - Quote
I agree! I always wanted a drone boat but it looks like there's no better ship (BS) like the Ishtar especially for heavy drones. Sad! Team up, change things.
I want to add something else.
I was trying to figure out on SISI a Drone Boat that can do more damage to be equal to a lot of other ships like the OP mentioned - not the Dominix but a pirate or T2 variant (like a BS Isthar), that said the DNI is 'only' a navy variant and not so good at all.
To compensate and match the new drone balance especially to heavy drones I played around a little and checked all available stuff in game and I figured out several bugs although there is a nice rig which helps applying more DPS - The Scope Chip. But then correcting an old bug could also help with setting up a nice drone BS besides the Domi - which I don't like due to many lacks like align time, CPU, PG, speed an so on.
Summary: Unfortunately drone rigs can not be compared to the broad variety of turret and missile rigs and they obviously do not improve towards a better Drone BS. The wish for a good drone BS is there and to balance ships and playstyle it's in demand.
Please also check my post about an old bug here. Large Drone Speed Augmentor II
OP +1
Large Drone Speed Augmentor II - needs to be fixed
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2434
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Posted - 2015.12.23 15:37:40 -
[42] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:
Problem is, the drones move as opposed to your guns which are bolted on your ship. The drones each have their own movement vector to be handled by the server so their position is updated for their next attack. You can fire up to 8 guns at the same time and not really load the server much because they all use the same information for the hits. They all have the same tracking difficulty because they are all at the same place moving in the same way relatively to their targets. Drones shots don't get to enjoy this. The current 5 all have different firing solution because they all have their own movement relative to the target which can be wildly different. Adding more drones really does add to the server load.
Agreed, but that wasn't my point. The point I was getting at is that there's already a crap ton of drones out, and a ton of ships firing at different targets. I don't know that adding 5 more drones to the blob would have that much of an effect. However, if they do start giving problems, just smart bomb them off the field. That said, 5 fighters with the role bonus of a super carrier is 1k dps. This is a pretty good damage level without adding to the drone count. However, they'll need to be given a pretty substantial tracking bonus to make up for being dedicated to fighting sub-capitals.
Adding 5 more drones to the total pool is indeed not much of an issue. On the other hand, doubling the amount of drones in a large fight because the new ship is better and become main doctrine would add a metric ass ton of server load. Or are CCP supposed to design it so it will never get used in fleet fights to be sure it does not cause problem? |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1165
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Posted - 2015.12.23 16:08:29 -
[43] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Adding 5 more drones to the total pool is indeed not much of an issue. On the other hand, doubling the amount of drones in a large fight because the new ship is better and become main doctrine would add a metric ass ton of server load. Or are CCP supposed to design it so it will never get used in fleet fights to be sure it does not cause problem?
There's no stopping it from being used, as drone focus alone would make it quite popular.
That said, it would be relatively balanced just on the use of drones themselves, as they can be alpha'd of the field, or smartbombed.
Now, my last comment, I did also mention, you can allow it to use fighters as its primary means of damage.
Proposal:
Rogue drone Battleship Gallente/Amarr (because I don't know what else(I would prefer it be a shield boat, but whatever))
Gallente BS % bonus to fighter drone damage per level 4% Bonus to Armor resists per level.
Amarr BS % bonus to all drone HP per level % bonus to Armor repairer cap usage per level
Role Bonus Can Fit Bastion module (just an idea) - Bastion gives 100% bonus to drone control range % bonus to drone velocity in Bastion % bonus to fighter tracking in Bastion
Slot Layout Highs - 2 Mids - 8 (?) Lows - 8 Rigs - 3
So, pretty tanky in Bastion and has a lot of capability in drone and tanking. Small amount of highs and no turret or launcher hard points to reduce high slot utility.
Bastion helps to keep the ship as 'niche' thus keeping it out of large scale battles, as it will be quite weak outside of bastion.
We'll say a 30k drone bay, allowing it to fit 6 fighters to have one spare, or 5 fighters and a versatile amount of other drone types... Note, there is no damage bonus for non-fighter drones. |
Kerandra Newton
The Mental Asylum Ministry of Agressive Destruction
0
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Posted - 2015.12.23 16:15:17 -
[44] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:
That said, it would be relatively balanced just on the use of drones themselves, as they can be alpha'd of the field, or smartbombed.
1. But there's another playstyle, I call it NPC killing which is common in all 3 sec-areas. NPC's don't shoot smartbombs. For those a drone boat would be nice.
2. You're not 100% right there. You can deploy sentries or pimp your ship to give drones a better optimal range to avoid smartbombs and you can add a Durability rig to buff drones HP.
Keep that in mind and don't focus too much to PVP. PVE is also a good choice for a Drone BS.
Large Drone Speed Augmentor II - needs to be fixed
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
1165
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Posted - 2015.12.23 16:31:41 -
[45] - Quote
Kerandra Newton wrote:Joe Risalo wrote:
That said, it would be relatively balanced just on the use of drones themselves, as they can be alpha'd of the field, or smartbombed.
1. But there's another playstyle, I call it NPC killing which is common in all 3 sec-areas. NPC's don't shoot smartbombs. For those a drone boat would be nice. 2. You're not 100% right there. You can deploy sentries or pimp your ship to give drones a better optimal range to avoid smartbombs and you can add a Durability rig to buff drones HP. Keep that in mind and don't focus too much to PVP. PVE is also a good choice for a Drone BS.
Check the proposal above and see how you feel about that. |
Atomeon
The Scope Gallente Federation
63
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Posted - 2015.12.23 23:59:43 -
[46] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:I remember the old beehive domi, you don't want a beehive domi. They want the Guardian Vexor's mama. i think that they asking for ^^ |
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