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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.01.19 01:01:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Mecinia Lua Any major nerf to NPC corporations would negatively impact the consumer base of the game. It would have a negative impact on the game in the future.
As such efforts to nerf things are usually bad. Instead rather than imposing penalties on NPC corps you should look at providing more positives to player run corps so that they are more attractive.
Unless ther is a free package of Quafe sent home after joining a new corp, I see little incentives that can be added. Corps have a lot of toys a single player ina NPC corp can't access (POS for starter).
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2007.01.19 03:54:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
what you propose is to lift concord protection from anyone who is in player corp, which would make wardec absolete.. why do so drastic change all of a sudden?
Uh...not exactly.
Currently, concord protects EVERYONE except if bribed. Even if bribed, concord protects both parties against those who they are not in war with. You propose the concord to only protect those who pay the tax. However you also propose only npc corp members to pay that tax. That would mean that concord will only protect npc corp members. Exactly.
So do you propose as well, but forgot to mention, so that any player corp that wants ANY protection from concord, should pay the same tax to concord npc corps do? In this case it's ok, but in this case there is not much difference between npc corp and player corp in sense of taxes, which voids initial effort put in such change... So please think of smarter solution.
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Thor Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.19 04:59:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
what you propose is to lift concord protection from anyone who is in player corp, which would make wardec absolete.. why do so drastic change all of a sudden?
Uh...not exactly.
Currently, concord protects EVERYONE except if bribed. Even if bribed, concord protects both parties against those who they are not in war with. You propose the concord to only protect those who pay the tax. However you also propose only npc corp members to pay that tax. That would mean that concord will only protect npc corp members. Exactly.
So do you propose as well, but forgot to mention, so that any player corp that wants ANY protection from concord, should pay the same tax to concord npc corps do? In this case it's ok, but in this case there is not much difference between npc corp and player corp in sense of taxes, which voids initial effort put in such change... So please think of smarter solution.
I said all that? I had no idea.
~Thor Xian, Material Defender
"For all your Material Needs, Vertigo One."
Corp/Alliance Services |
Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2007.01.19 05:39:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
that'a what you said.
here is what I say: player corps are protected by concord as well now, against those who they are not in war with. This is FACT, if you disagree then we are playing different games.
But because Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes.
, normal corps should also pay taxes, if they won't concord won't protect them at all so any high-sec becomes no-sec for everyone not paying taxes.
that's it, if you can use basic logic you will get it, if not you're not worth talking to so soryy if I won't reply.
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Thor Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.19 06:15:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
that'a what you said.
here is what I say: player corps are protected by concord as well now, against those who they are not in war with. This is FACT, if you disagree then we are playing different games.
But because Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes.
, normal corps should also pay taxes, if they won't concord won't protect them at all so any high-sec becomes no-sec for everyone not paying taxes.
that's it, if you can use basic logic you will get it, if not you're not worth talking to so soryy if I won't reply.
Do the police stop protecting you just because you are visiting from a different country and don't pay income tax?
Ignoring the obvious game mechanic design flaws (there are tons in Eve) surrounding corps and taxes of course.
~Thor Xian, Material Defender
"For all your Material Needs, Vertigo One."
Corp/Alliance Services |
Viliny
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Posted - 2007.01.19 06:46:00 -
[36]
Testing mah forumpic here, also. Noob corps should be allowed to exist.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.01.19 07:09:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
that'a what you said.
here is what I say: player corps are protected by concord as well now, against those who they are not in war with. This is FACT, if you disagree then we are playing different games.
But because Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes.
, normal corps should also pay taxes, if they won't concord won't protect them at all so any high-sec becomes no-sec for everyone not paying taxes.
that's it, if you can use basic logic you will get it, if not you're not worth talking to so soryy if I won't reply.
Do the police stop protecting you just because you are visiting from a different country and don't pay income tax?
Ignoring the obvious game mechanic design flaws (there are tons in Eve) surrounding corps and taxes of course.
If you make any economic activitiy in a foreign state you pay income tax there.
You will always pay VAT tax when you buy something from a store (for some strange reason in the USA you can circunvent that buying from internet, but the buyer doing that is breacking the law).
And usually there isn't an entry tax in a foreign state only because there are reciprocal treaties between states, where local police protect the foreign because in the people from that nation is protected in the nation of origin of the foreign. (it is a bit more complicated, semplifing)
So unless the local alliance/corporation give people in NPC corporation protection in the territory they control in exchange of getting protection in high sec space, yes, they must pay CONCORD the same tax the other pay.
If you came from a nation shooting on sight the people form (example) the USA, you can't enter the USA unless there are very special circumstances. Even if you are the most armless person alive.
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2007.01.19 07:11:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Mnengli Noiliffe on 19/01/2007 07:08:02
Originally by: Thor Xian Do the police stop protecting you just because you are visiting from a different country and don't pay income tax?
In your country, can you pay police a tenner so that they wouldn't object you killing those guys from the other country you don't like? I mean legalised regular payment, not a bribe to certain cop who happened to witness a crime.
Quote:
Ignoring the obvious game mechanic design flaws (there are tons in Eve) surrounding corps and taxes of course.
If there should be any npc corp tax, it shouldn't be worded as "for concord protection".
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Audri Fisher
Caldari The Keep THE R0CK
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Posted - 2007.01.19 08:03:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
what you propose is to lift concord protection from anyone who is in player corp, which would make wardec absolete.. why do so drastic change all of a sudden?
Uh...not exactly.
actually, you got owned on that one buddy.
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Mecinia Lua
Galactic Express
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Posted - 2007.01.19 09:35:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Mecinia Lua Any major nerf to NPC corporations would negatively impact the consumer base of the game. It would have a negative impact on the game in the future.
As such efforts to nerf things are usually bad. Instead rather than imposing penalties on NPC corps you should look at providing more positives to player run corps so that they are more attractive.
Unless ther is a free package of Quafe sent home after joining a new corp, I see little incentives that can be added. Corps have a lot of toys a single player ina NPC corp can't access (POS for starter).
There are ways.
One way might be some additional corp leadership skills. These would work somewhat like the current leadership skills but would apply to those in the corp. It might be that they only apply when the CEO or Director is online, but it is something that you wouldn't have in a NPC corp.
Galactic Express Recruitment Post
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
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Posted - 2007.01.19 10:31:00 -
[41]
This rant is just silly. Go find another system! Empire is huge with plentiful stations.
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The Slayer
Caldari The Black Rabbits Fatal Persuasion
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Posted - 2007.01.19 10:33:00 -
[42]
As soon as you make it so that mickey mouse alliances like the freelancers cant dec every tom **** and harry corp going for cheap then sure, turf people out of NPC corps. Some people dont want to be at war with the freelancers all the time tho, and currently NPC corps seem to be about the only way to do that.
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Cipher7
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Posted - 2007.01.19 10:45:00 -
[43]
Originally by: The Slayer As soon as you make it so that mickey mouse alliances like the freelancers cant dec every tom **** and harry corp going for cheap then sure, turf people out of NPC corps. Some people dont want to be at war with the freelancers all the time tho, and currently NPC corps seem to be about the only way to do that.
Think he means "The Privateers"
I see nothing wrong with them, wardecs are a regular part of the game.
Use a fast frigate like a probe to haul high quality goods to market. Use heavily tanked haulers with stabs to run minerals, or just use buy/sell orders to get those minerals shipped to you.
This is a pvp game, using pvp tactics ALL the time should be second-nature, not just when you are raiding the domain of another alliance.
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Roshan longshot
Gallente Ordos Humanitas
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Posted - 2007.01.19 12:57:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Mecinia Lua Any major nerf to NPC corporations would negatively impact the consumer base of the game. It would have a negative impact on the game in the future.
As such efforts to nerf things are usually bad. Instead rather than imposing penalties on NPC corps you should look at providing more positives to player run corps so that they are more attractive.
Unless ther is a free package of Quafe sent home after joining a new corp, I see little incentives that can be added. Corps have a lot of toys a single player ina NPC corp can't access (POS for starter).
A single player does not want to be in a corp. And you dont need a corp to run a pos.
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box.
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Roshan longshot
Gallente Ordos Humanitas
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Posted - 2007.01.19 13:01:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Cipher7
Originally by: The Slayer As soon as you make it so that mickey mouse alliances like the freelancers cant dec every tom **** and harry corp going for cheap then sure, turf people out of NPC corps. Some people dont want to be at war with the freelancers all the time tho, and currently NPC corps seem to be about the only way to do that.
Think he means "The Privateers"
I see nothing wrong with them, wardecs are a regular part of the game.
Use a fast frigate like a probe to haul high quality goods to market. Use heavily tanked haulers with stabs to run minerals, or just use buy/sell orders to get those minerals shipped to you.
This is a pvp game, using pvp tactics ALL the time should be second-nature, not just when you are raiding the domain of another alliance.
And that is why 2+ year old characters can stay in a NPC corp.
Eve is far more then a PvP game. It has somthing for all to play, not just get a kill board entry.
When you figure that out you should have more fun. I hate gate camping, mission running, mining, and ratting in belts. But I am still here playing after three years.
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box.
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Kate Nexus
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Posted - 2007.01.19 13:06:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Master Han I am sick of 2+ year old characters mining belts in high security space.
You sit around in high security space belts watching miners? There's your problem right there. Go play your game. If you want people out of npc corps then invite them to yours. If yours too paranoid to do that withuot asking for login screens then its your own fault so many people are in newbie corps.
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Hasek Raines
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Posted - 2007.01.19 14:04:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Kate Nexus
Originally by: Master Han I am sick of 2+ year old characters mining belts in high security space.
You sit around in high security space belts watching miners? There's your problem right there. Go play your game. If you want people out of npc corps then invite them to yours. If yours too paranoid to do that withuot asking for login screens then its your own fault so many people are in newbie corps.
lol no kidding. You know what bothers me? Those Concord billboards because I sit in front of them and stare at them all day so they annoy me. Then I come onto these forums and whine about it.
You also have to wonder how many of these Player Corp members who make these posts are being forced by their alliances to pay a "monthly fee" to stay in the system they are in and these guys come here because they are upset that a NPC corp member pays zero taxes. Either leave your corp or shut up imo. You knew what you were signing up for when you agreed to be a slave to BoB.
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Malicia Skirj
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Posted - 2007.01.19 19:51:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Master Han I am sick of 2+ year old characters mining belts in high security space. I am a relatively new character and try to make ISK for skill books by mining. I think that after a certain period, the tax rate in NPC corps should go up to 20% or more. This would force players out into player corps and allow ****ed off people like me to hire Mercs to slay those belt destroying scum.
I mean they kick a player out of rookie channel after 30 days, so why not increase tax rate for players in NPC corps w/ more than 6 months of time in game.
Many other players say I should do ratting or kill missions but I would rather conserve my time spent training to the area I am interested in: industry. My buddy and me just want to set up a small trade corp and I prefer to mine for my own minerals and not have to buy them from someone using a BOT or something to clear the belts in the beginner areas.
2+ year old characters are likely to have friends in merc corps (and possibly even supply them with minerals), so they may be able to hire a merc corp to slay your merc corp before it slays belt-destroying scum. Then you'd end up in the same position, minus the ISK you paid to hire a merc corp.
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hotgirl933
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Posted - 2007.01.19 21:07:00 -
[49]
and on it goes - all this BS over a fear of loosing ships - it seems to drive the biggest of carebears nearest u
pop a carebear today and feel better for it
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superfuru
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Posted - 2007.01.19 21:40:00 -
[50]
Lol even if u changed the tax for the players that had been in the npc corp for over 2 months or what ever they would just work around this by making a new char... or a buddy account or what ever.. when selling the ore :-P
stop whining it works fine as it is today... there are other things ccp should focus on instead of this
K^thx_bye
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Thor Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.20 08:26:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe Edited by: Mnengli Noiliffe on 19/01/2007 07:08:02
Originally by: Thor Xian Do the police stop protecting you just because you are visiting from a different country and don't pay income tax?
In your country, can you pay police a tenner so that they wouldn't object you killing those guys from the other country you don't like? I mean legalised regular payment, not a bribe to certain cop who happened to witness a crime.
Quote:
Ignoring the obvious game mechanic design flaws (there are tons in Eve) surrounding corps and taxes of course.
If there should be any npc corp tax, it shouldn't be worded as "for concord protection".
I didn't say it was for CONCORD protection...police are only part of 'what you pay taxes for'. Without taxes why would there be CONCORD?
~Thor Xian, Material Defender
"For all your Material Needs, Vertigo One."
Corp/Alliance Services |
Thor Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.20 08:26:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Audri Fisher
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
what you propose is to lift concord protection from anyone who is in player corp, which would make wardec absolete.. why do so drastic change all of a sudden?
Uh...not exactly.
actually, you got owned on that one buddy.
Ok
~Thor Xian, Material Defender
"For all your Material Needs, Vertigo One."
Corp/Alliance Services |
Aphotic Raven
Gallente E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.20 08:37:00 -
[53]
Meh. this needs stickying. Along with the hourly LOGOFFSKI!! thread...
Brings nothing new to the discussion.. just more carebears defending their right to be *****s/completely safe.
I think smart bombs should be allowed near stations again.. that would stop the traffic jams of badger 2's in high sec (omg i went to jita once upon a time.. it made me sick to see all that carebear loot floating around without a care.)
Noob corps do need nerfing, the longer you're in the harder the nerf prefferably...
So anyway, my main point, CCP please make a logoffski, nerf caldari and nerf noob corp thread sticky so that we may all ***** and still keep the forums clean.
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Aphotic Raven
Gallente E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.20 08:41:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian
Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe
Originally by: Thor Xian If you want CONCORD protecting your ass, pay your taxes. NPC corps should have taxes.
what you propose is to lift concord protection from anyone who is in player corp, which would make wardec absolete.. why do so drastic change all of a sudden?
Uh...not exactly.
Currently, concord protects EVERYONE except if bribed. Even if bribed, concord protects both parties against those who they are not in war with. You propose the concord to only protect those who pay the tax. However you also propose only npc corp members to pay that tax. That would mean that concord will only protect npc corp members. Exactly.
So do you propose as well, but forgot to mention, so that any player corp that wants ANY protection from concord, should pay the same tax to concord npc corps do? In this case it's ok, but in this case there is not much difference between npc corp and player corp in sense of taxes, which voids initial effort put in such change... So please think of smarter solution.
You sir... complete asshat.
I am perfectly happy for my corp/alliance to pay taxes in high sec... you know why? because we're not in high sec. We already get taxed whenever we sell/refine/repair/do anything in high sec.... so nerf away dude... do whatever you want to make it even... its going to hurt you and your carebearishness whatever it is and get people the hell out of high sec... (into 0.0 i would hope.. low sec is a dirty place filled with nasty and unclean people)
Have you tried WoW? It might be just the ticket.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.01.20 11:48:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Unless there is a free package of Quafe sent home after joining a new corp, I see little incentives that can be added. Corps have a lot of toys a single player in a NPC corp can't access (POS for starter).
A single player does not want to be in a corp. And you dont need a corp to run a pos.
From Knowledgebase:
Setting up the Control Tower
With any or all of the above items in your cargohold, find a moon in low security space and warp to it.
Right-click the Control Tower in your cargohold and select "launch for corp" .
Unless sometime is changed, it is not possible to launch for corp in a NPC corporation (and the results if it was possible would be ).
So no POS for single players, i.e. players ina NPC corp.
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Master Han
Order of Endruring Marshalls
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Posted - 2007.01.21 05:09:00 -
[56]
Quote: Unless ther is a free package of Quafe sent home after joining a new corp, I see little incentives that can be added. Corps have a lot of toys a single player ina NPC corp can't access (POS for starter).
There are ways.
One way might be some additional corp leadership skills. These would work somewhat like the current leadership skills but would apply to those in the corp. It might be that they only apply when the CEO or Director is online, but it is something that you wouldn't have in a NPC corp.
I like this idea alot! There are fleet leadership bonuses, why not coro leadership bonuses? Mining Director: +1%/lvl to mining laser, strip miner, ice harvestor yields Assault Director: +1%/lvl to all turrect damage Defense Director: +1%/lvl to armor and shield hp Trade Director: Something to do with trade (/me still sells at even -90% of average) Industry Dirctor: -%1/lvl to build and research times
Or if not a skill, then when corporation is made, the CEO can determine a bonus for all corp members that is unchangeable.
P.S. Maybe 20% was a little high. 10% is fine. I have moved to .5 space to mine, thanks for the info!
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Rockmonkey Zwei
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Posted - 2007.01.21 05:28:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Master Han I am sick of 2+ year old characters mining belts in high security space. I am a relatively new character and try to make ISK for skill books by mining. I think that after a certain period, the tax rate in NPC corps should go up to 20% or more. This would force players out into player corps and allow ****ed off people like me to hire Mercs to slay those belt destroying scum.
Tax rate won't get the miners you hate out of NPC corps. Mining isn't taxed, so you could increase the rate to 100% and they wouldn't care.
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Cute SpyGirl
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Posted - 2007.01.21 07:51:00 -
[58]
Since most of you PvPers have been flaming us (carebearers) in forum. My anwser to you is too bad.
If you want a solution, go read my post on "Fundamental Flaws of EvE solved." You really don't have a choice, people will play their own style.
-Cute
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Thor Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.21 08:00:00 -
[59]
Who in Eve doesn't PvP?
~Thor Xian, Material Defender
"For all your Material Needs, Vertigo One."
Corp/Alliance Services |
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