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Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1944
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Posted - 2015.12.24 11:21:39 -
[1] - Quote
When thinking about complains regarding crappy loot drops in missions and what the two events made successful (e.g. competition), what if shifting ISK rewards much more to lootable stuff? So instead of bounties, have tags and instead of mission rewards, increase the loot/salvage drop ... the balance could be 1/3 each (mission ISK rewards, tags, regular loot/salvage) for lvl4 and much more ISK in lower level missions (to ease competition for newbies), and loot/salvage/tags only in lvl5s.
This would end blitzing, foster looting/salvaging as a (ninja) profession, and increase competition with PvP opportunities in highsec. What do you think?
A side effect would be less taxable income, but I'm not sure if this would become an issue.
I'm my own NPC alt.
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
2926
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Posted - 2015.12.24 13:53:08 -
[2] - Quote
If no one is looting, how is there such a large supply of meta items pushing down prices? Is blitzing a problem? Why not let people run missions how they want? How do you ensure the prices of loot are balanced to be a third of a missions worth when its players that dictate the prices of items?
Looting is still worthwhile if you have the patience for trade and industry. Its still worth roughly the same as bounties at the time of looting, only its quicker to gather than running a mission with a certain mobile structure and salvage ship.
Blitzing is more for LP, the value of which is already determined by players. if you nerf LP income, you just raise isk/LP.
Forcing people to loot to get their bounties is perhaps the only part of this i like, but its a tedious task and i expect an unpopular change.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
3276
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Posted - 2015.12.24 16:05:13 -
[3] - Quote
There have been several ideas in the past on how to make PVE more interesting and challenging. Adjusting mission loot and rat bounties were in these also, in the end they have all been shot down because of Isk/HR tears.
If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
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Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
9871
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Posted - 2015.12.24 17:06:28 -
[4] - Quote
How on earth will this increase PVP opportunities? Bears who run missions will still be as risk-averse as ever; PVPers will continue to use whatever mechanisms they already have to do what they are already doing.
Also, why would you want to eliminate blitzing? There already is an opportunity cost for blitzing as opposed to full completion, so what's the point?
Why is any of this necessary?
Got a HoleySheet1 corpse? I'll buy it for 200m!
Bumble's Space Log
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Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1948
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Posted - 2015.12.24 19:06:18 -
[5] - Quote
With 2/3 or more of the mission value in loot and salvage, you have to put some effort in its protection from thieves; that's the main point. The removal of blitzing is more a side effect than a goal. But it may open up for more complex, randomized mission design, if players got used to a more holistic approach.
To make the loot/salvage worth something, drop rates need to be reduced significantly, but I admit it's a dufficult thing as we see with data site balancing ...
I'm my own NPC alt.
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Solecist Project
The Scope Gallente Federation
28581
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Posted - 2015.12.24 19:08:56 -
[6] - Quote
You have to consider the massive influence of loot on the mineral market as well as the module market.
Loot has been nerfed significantly over the last years, they won't turn that around.
Umar Umarhabib > The bad thing is, every time I die with a juicy Deadspace set up, it becomes harder to fly solo.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2828
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Posted - 2015.12.24 22:38:44 -
[7] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote: Is blitzing a problem? Why not let people run missions how they want?
This is the only part that needs an answer. And the answer to this is yes, Blitzing is a problem, especially burner blitzing. But blitzing can be solved in many other ways. This is just a straight nerf missions suggestion as the Op has it standing. Since even when doing a full complete you can't loot everything in a single mission while fighting through it with a marauder. thus forcing looting on people will increase even full complete times.
I often even ask in local for anyone keen to follow and salvage/loot when I mission run, great for a new player with a salvage destroyer to make money that way.
Blitzing can be solved three ways. 1. Reduce the frequency of burner missions. Officer level rats should be rare anyway, not 20 per day for the same player from the same agent (per type of rat even). 2. Increase penalties for declining missions. You could at the same time decrease time down to something like 2h between declines instead of 4h even, since that will still stop blitzers, but won't impact as much on full complete missioners. 3. Require killing all rats in a mission, change triggers from a specific ship to needing the entire wave to be killed, and you can no longer shoot the rats that EVE Survival says to and run out leaving 20 BS behind.
While I'll defend high sec income rates from anyone who wants to outright nerf payouts across the board, the turn over that can be done in very specific cases by blitzing missions is excessive and it currently can be done in a sustainable manner or close enough to. If the burner missions become rarer then you can't sustainably decline all normal missions. And if declining missions costs a little more standing it becomes much harder to be sustainable doing normal blitzing. Requiring killing all rats obviously solves blitzing also, 1 & 3 above in combination being my preferred options. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
2091
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Posted - 2015.12.24 23:33:53 -
[8] - Quote
I fully agree that all rats - like Empire faction rats - should drop tags instead of paying out bounties. Making people have things - whether ships or MTU's - in space for longer is a good thing. Other people can then interact with them and make for a more interesting game for everyone.
CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
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Paul Pohl
blue media poetry
95
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Posted - 2015.12.25 00:01:06 -
[9] - Quote
Missions are fine as they are.
If people want to ignore loot and salvage - that's up to them - I'd say more fool them |
Atomeon
The Scope Gallente Federation
63
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Posted - 2015.12.25 01:28:13 -
[10] - Quote
Well if you want ppl to loot/salvage give on Noctis MWD and cap use Role bonus, so ppl end way faster with it |
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Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
245
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Posted - 2015.12.25 09:48:20 -
[11] - Quote
Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not. |
Paul Pohl
blue media poetry
99
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Posted - 2015.12.26 01:07:52 -
[12] - Quote
Max Deveron wrote:Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not.
Or you could just leave things as they are, since there is not a problem
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
990
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Posted - 2015.12.26 02:34:33 -
[13] - Quote
Max Deveron wrote:Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not.
You can always move into unknown space, just probe one down and do dat.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
990
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Posted - 2015.12.26 02:46:26 -
[14] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:...-is just above, only shortened for reading purposes-.
Agreed.
And Tipa, if you don't like to run missions, don't. If you wanna change things, I would like you to consider Nevyn's points.
In all fairness, all things should be equal. I don't like blitzing myself and since we are brainstorming I would you to consider changing anomaly behavior too.
Once an anomaly is done, all others in that sytem get redistributed between one and seven systems further away. Say no to ratting carriers and titans.
In addition to that the leader of the Sansha is getting tired of piracy and has a family crisis, so he needs to spend more time with his family and is retiring - no more incursions.
The Borg- errm, Drifters become sad that they no longer get bodies from the Sansha and return to their homeworld - anywhen.
Now we have fixed EVE and are having fun again.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
248
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Posted - 2015.12.26 07:35:12 -
[15] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:Max Deveron wrote:Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not. You can always move into unknown space, just probe one down and do dat.
I can not believe you comprehended anything i wrote there, or even implied in what i wrote. Your statement has no relevance what so ever to anything i did write. So if you are not attempting poorly to troll.....would you care to explain?
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Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
248
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Posted - 2015.12.26 07:36:55 -
[16] - Quote
Paul Pohl wrote:Max Deveron wrote:Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not. Or you could just leave things as they are, since there is not a problem
Never said there was a problem. Whats wrong with trying to shake things up a bit? I did say add a level of more interaction. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2840
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Posted - 2015.12.26 09:01:41 -
[17] - Quote
Max Deveron wrote:
Never said there was a problem. Whats wrong with trying to shake things up a bit? I did say add a level of more interaction.
Because adding make work and forcing people to take longer and more effort to achieve the same income is not 'shaking things up'. It's an outright nerf for no reason. |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6581
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Posted - 2015.12.26 09:39:36 -
[18] - Quote
Max Deveron wrote:Changing the way ISK is rewarded....while adding a level of more interaction.
As to bounties, i can think of only 1 thing for this... Instead of receiving the ISK directly, make the bounty appear as a tag in the loot wreck...so if a BS is worth like 800,000 make the tag be worth that.
Now you have a reason to go into other peoples missions and they can engage you or not if your stealing their ISK tags... Im sure others with more dedication than I can come up with a list of scenarios(examples) of how active game play and such would change/be more involved with this simple change.
Oh and also make it that you have to turn the tags into a Concor station....it is them paying out the bounties...sorry nullsec guess you would have to start making trips to the nearest station....hmm reasons more for gate camping/escorting a ship or what not.
The work around for this would be our really, really, really, ridiculously rich dudes buying the tags for 97% cost & mass selling them to a lowsec concord station once every couple of months. This wouldn't affect us in the slightest. Mind you that nullsec income has already effectively been nerfed with that really stupid ESS implementation that no one bothers using anymore.
This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
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Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6581
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Posted - 2015.12.26 09:40:56 -
[19] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Max Deveron wrote:
Never said there was a problem. Whats wrong with trying to shake things up a bit? I did say add a level of more interaction.
Because adding make work and forcing people to take longer and more effort to achieve the same income is not 'shaking things up'. It's an outright nerf for no reason.
I would personally love to see a little bit of a shake up within reason, however I would like to see a shake up for things that have not been touched since 2003. Mining comes to mind.
This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
990
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Posted - 2015.12.26 10:43:12 -
[20] - Quote
Max Deveron wrote:...whispers in the dark...
I can not believe you comprehended anything i wrote there, or even implied in what i wrote. Your statement has no relevance what so ever to anything i did write. So if you are not attempting poorly to troll.....would you care to explain?
Translation:
I has incredible unbright idea and wanna gank people everywhere so that nobody can make a living anymore. I also have no idea what unknown space is since it is unknown. Someone told me to not talk to strangers and my horizon has a radius of exactly zero and I call it point of view.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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