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CTRL Q has become an epidemic, what is going to be done?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Leneerra Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:11:00 - [91] 1. If you try to differenciate between a valid connection loss, and a quit command, then people will simply cause a failed connection . So trying to differentiate between the two simply will not work. 2. If a 'connection loss' offers options that you do not have availeble at that time without that feature then prople will use the 'connection loss' option if it would offer them the best chances or otherwise reduces loss Because people are people they will abuse whatever leniency ccp tries to offer people that do suffer valid 'connection loss' or related technical difficulties. Because people are people they will not accept (in general) any (partial) loss that is caused partly or wholy by circumstances beyond their (direct) controll Judging these on a case by case basis trough petitioons for instance is simply impossible, as is shown by the enless waiting time on open petetions even under the lenient system as is in place now So ccp has to choose wich of the evils is more game breaking and will cost them more subscribers. Who will they dissapoint, not a choise I would like to make. That said I do dispise people that use ctrl+Q to avoid concequnces of their actions, even if I understand why people do it.
Strange Guy	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:11:00 - [92] Originally by: Sertan Deras Griefing sucks. Gate camping is griefing. Go pick a real fight against someone who has a chance to fight back. What am I saying though? You don't want someone who can fight back, you want to push a button and watch their ship explode while they can't do anything to stop you. Does that make you feel cool? Does it make you feel like a real PvP'er? Do you think you have mad skillz because you can put people in a bubble with absolutely no in-game counter available? I may be new to EVE, but I've been PvPing since the pre-Trammel UO days, and before that in MUD's, and 99.99% of all gate/spawn campers are whiny children, and I don't mean in physical age. They enjoy ruining someone else's day, yet whine and cry when someone ruins theirs (aka ctrl + q). They run from a real fight, in favor of setting up these inescapable death traps that they call "fair". In the end, they are all the same, and they will never go away. They will justify their actions as "the way the game was meant to be played", but really they are just bullies and too scared to engage in a fight where they might actually lose. Hmm, how do alliances control their space, ask you to leave nicely?
Sertan Deras	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:15:00 - [93] Originally by: Strange Guy Originally by: Sertan Deras Griefing sucks. Gate camping is griefing. Go pick a real fight against someone who has a chance to fight back. What am I saying though? You don't want someone who can fight back, you want to push a button and watch their ship explode while they can't do anything to stop you. Does that make you feel cool? Does it make you feel like a real PvP'er? Do you think you have mad skillz because you can put people in a bubble with absolutely no in-game counter available? I may be new to EVE, but I've been PvPing since the pre-Trammel UO days, and before that in MUD's, and 99.99% of all gate/spawn campers are whiny children, and I don't mean in physical age. They enjoy ruining someone else's day, yet whine and cry when someone ruins theirs (aka ctrl + q). They run from a real fight, in favor of setting up these inescapable death traps that they call "fair". In the end, they are all the same, and they will never go away. They will justify their actions as "the way the game was meant to be played", but really they are just bullies and too scared to engage in a fight where they might actually lose. Hmm, how do alliances control their space, ask you to leave nicely? Why not? If you jump in to their space, they warn you, and if you don't leave, they attack you and drive you off. Defending ones space does not mean camping a gate and killing helpless ships as they jump in. A pilot or alliance with REAL honor, would tell people to leave first, and enforce that second. Not catch people in bubbles they can't escape from and slaughter them while they are loading in to the system. That's griefing, not defending territory.
Opai McTwist Amarr The Sell Swords	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:15:00 - [94] When I hear of a solution from someone railing against log-offs that takes into account loss of connection or hardware failure, in a practical, engineerable way, I'll jump behind that solution. Caveat: I have logged off before. I haven't logged off in a while, though, because I approach systems that have high numbers of ship kills in low-sec and 0.0 space with a fair amount of caution these days. I'll even back a lot of the suggestions on this thread so far delays before log-off, timer countdowns after log-off, triggering on the keystroke of ctrl-q or what ever. Sure. As long as "Warp Bubble Active in the Last 10 minutes" shows up as a check on the map. That would give someone absolutely zero excuses for logging off in a bubble. Bubbles notation on the map would force people to choose between a noticable detour to get to their desitnation or running the camp. Hell, enterprising organizations could drop bubbles and herd travellers through certain pipes, encourage travellers to pass through specific systems... its a whole new mechanic. But I fully expect campers to come on and moan about the loss of surprise. 6 one way, half a dozen the other.
Angellyne	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:17:00 - [95] "CCP stop this logoffski crap ASAP." "Whiner! I log off because your bubble camp is no fair!" "Whiner! You're just too lazy to avoid them!" All that's missing is the "I'm rubber, you're glue" paradigm. But tbh I haven't tried a search for it, so I could be wrong. Just a year or so ago, you used to see people talking about how mature and helpful these forums were.
Strange Guy	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:19:00 - [96] Edited by: Strange Guy on 25/01/2007 00:17:26 Originally by: Sertan Deras Originally by: Strange Guy Originally by: Sertan Deras Griefing sucks. Gate camping is griefing. Go pick a real fight against someone who has a chance to fight back. What am I saying though? You don't want someone who can fight back, you want to push a button and watch their ship explode while they can't do anything to stop you. Does that make you feel cool? Does it make you feel like a real PvP'er? Do you think you have mad skillz because you can put people in a bubble with absolutely no in-game counter available? I may be new to EVE, but I've been PvPing since the pre-Trammel UO days, and before that in MUD's, and 99.99% of all gate/spawn campers are whiny children, and I don't mean in physical age. They enjoy ruining someone else's day, yet whine and cry when someone ruins theirs (aka ctrl + q). They run from a real fight, in favor of setting up these inescapable death traps that they call "fair". In the end, they are all the same, and they will never go away. They will justify their actions as "the way the game was meant to be played", but really they are just bullies and too scared to engage in a fight where they might actually lose. Hmm, how do alliances control their space, ask you to leave nicely? Why not? If you jump in to their space, they warn you, and if you don't leave, they attack you and drive you off. Defending ones space does not mean camping a gate and killing helpless ships as they jump in. A pilot or alliance with REAL honor, would tell people to leave first, and enforce that second. Not catch people in bubbles they can't escape from and slaughter them while they are loading in to the system. That's griefing, not defending territory. Honor? Do you think the Germans were thinking of honor when they setup ambushes to kill Americans in WW2. Maybe the Americans should have logged off and then when the Germans complained say that the odds weren't fair. Life isn't fair, EVE isn't fair. Honor is from an era long dead.
Hellspawn01 Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:19:00 - [97] I wonder why eve has not such a simple method like another game. Log out while docked, no timer. Log out while outside, wait 20 seconds, gone. No big deal. Ship lovers click here
Khavi Vetali Gallente Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:22:00 - [98] Edited by: Khavi Vetali on 25/01/2007 00:21:56 You know...the lower the system security status gets the more at risk you are. In 0.0 it's supposed to be dangerous. It was setup purposely and intended to be that way. The suggestions by others in this thread are pretty easy to follow and will increase your chances of survival quite a bit. Use your map functions, check for ships destroyed, people in system, etc. If you can go around them, do it. If you can't, dock, grab a shuttle and scout it. Or fly with friends. And really, it's only your own fault for flying blind. Reap the punishment. 0.0 or low-sec space is not meant to be friendly, or even fair. You want friendly, stay in positive sec space, it's that simple. Course, be sure you tank your haulers so concord can deal with the suicide gankers ;p edit: But nope, it's so much easier just to ctrl-q. Can't wait till it's fixed.
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:33:00 - [99] Originally by: Sertan Deras Edited by: Sertan Deras on 25/01/2007 00:06:21 Griefing sucks. Gate camping is griefing. Go pick a real fight against someone who has a chance to fight back. What am I saying though? You don't want someone who can fight back, you want to push a button and watch their ship explode while they can't do anything to stop you. Does that make you feel cool? Does it make you feel like a real PvP'er? Do you think you have mad skillz because you can put people in a bubble with absolutely no in-game counter available? I may be new to EVE, but I've been PvPing since the pre-Trammel UO days, and before that in MUD's, and 99.99% of all gate/spawn campers are whiny children, and I don't mean in physical age. They enjoy ruining someone else's day, yet whine and cry when someone ruins theirs (aka ctrl + q). They run from a real fight, in favor of setting up these inescapable death traps that they call "fair". You sound pretty smart, so all I can really say to this is that you should spend some more time in EVE before you automatically apply your experiences with spawn camping in MUDs, etc. to this game. Perhaps you'll draw the same conclusions anyway, as you also sound rather eager to lump people into simple, detestable categories, but if you have an open mind I doubt it. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Einheriar Ulrich Minmatar FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:38:00 - [100] Edited by: Einheriar Ulrich on 25/01/2007 00:38:18 Edited by: Einheriar Ulrich on 25/01/2007 00:36:36 Originally by: Nanobotter Mk2 sorry also had to chime in that EVE is indeed a SINGLE PLAYER GAME PERIOD END OF STORY YOU ARE WRONG. Show me an agent that offers group missions? We all agree we all get faction we all get loyalty points etc... show me one. Show me on the box where it says in the requirements section that inorder to play eve you need "friends"..... nothing but crickets will I hear. Sorry to quote the BOX A MASSIELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAME, EVE Online. Everytime you travel around in the EVE universe you potentialy could be a target of anyone...who wish to attack and prey on you. Another quote from the BOX CHOOSE A PROFESSION: As DAuntless fleetcommander, or the MOST nefarius pirate ever to terrorize the Galaxy - Be and do anything yo'd never dare imagine I can understand, that you think Gate camps, are boring, and not fair, EVE is not supposed to be fair. Do you homework, when you travel, as soon as you leave "SECURE" space, 0.5 and up, you are prey for anyone.who has a bigger gun, better setup and more gangmates than you. There is even a warning when you leave 0.5 space....so it cannot come as a surprise being shoot at, well for some it does. So my advice is, if you travel away from secure space, come prepared, check the map, tank, and stab your ship, and preferbly bring friends, or take the chance, its all up to you.....its makes perfectly sense to camp a spawn point, its there the prey is.....btw i am no pirat, and im sure the most pirates in EVE take their challenge everywhere, and i assure you there is no IWIN button ship in EVE....there is always a countersetup, there are some flavours that work very very good, but skill, and knowledge is still a very important aspect of this game. EVE is a game of conseqenses, fit your ship poorly, die. Remember you get kill righst on your agressor I once had a sig...it deleted

Hectic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.25 00:57:00 - [101] I hereby claim this thread in the name of the great Chronx! Long live the king ..... of CTRL + Q! Sig removed. Please keep it under the 24,000 byte limit. -Conuion Meow (mods@ccpgames.com) Listen to BoB Radio!! WELCOME BACK MGRL
Blue Pixie	Posted - 2007.01.25 01:10:00 - [102] Anyone else find it ironic the same people arguing that life isn't fair and nor should EVE be fair, are also complaining that Ctrl+Q isn't fair? Honestly, if you don't want a fair game, then Ctrl+Q sounds to me as legitimate a play style as any.
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2007.01.25 01:36:00 - [103] Edited by: Tsanse Kinske on 25/01/2007 01:36:00 Edited by: Tsanse Kinske on 25/01/2007 01:34:00 Originally by: Blue Pixie Anyone else find it ironic the same people arguing that life isn't fair and nor should EVE be fair, are also complaining that Ctrl+Q isn't fair? Honestly, if you don't want a fair game, then Ctrl+Q sounds to me as legitimate a play style as any. There is a some irony there on the surface. But OTOH I think they have a valid point. The game has certain themes, like risk/reward, competition over resources, a stark and violent vision of the future, territorial control, real death penalties, and for lack of a better way to put it that's brief, ganking. I can't really think of Ctrl-Q as a "theme of EVE" even if it seems like it's becoming one on the forums. It certainly doesn't fit well with those other ideas, and in a lot of ways it works against them. There's also the fact that in every other game I can think of where you play against other people, intentionally quitting is a forfeit. In this game that bills itself as being so hardcore, it can force a draw and in some cases makes a kind of victory for the person who did it. If you ask me, that's some real irony right there. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Novemb3r The Splinter Syndicate SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.25 01:41:00 - [104] Originally by: Sertan Deras Edited by: Sertan Deras on 25/01/2007 00:06:21 Griefing sucks. Gate camping is griefing. Go pick a real fight against someone who has a chance to fight back. What am I saying though? You don't want someone who can fight back, you want to push a button and watch their ship explode while they can't do anything to stop you. Does that make you feel cool? Does it make you feel like a real PvP'er? Do you think you have mad skillz because you can put people in a bubble with absolutely no in-game counter available? I may be new to EVE, but I've been PvPing since the pre-Trammel UO days, and before that in MUD's, and 99.99% of all gate/spawn campers are whiny children, and I don't mean in physical age. They enjoy ruining someone else's day, yet whine and cry when someone ruins theirs (aka ctrl + q). They run from a real fight, in favor of setting up these inescapable death traps that they call "fair". In the end, they are all the same, and they will never go away. They will justify their actions as "the way the game was meant to be played", but really they are just bullies and too scared to engage in a fight where they might actually lose. Anyone who disagrees is labeled a "carebear", even if that person is a hardcore PvPer. Is that meant to be a serious comment? We spent months securing our little bit of 0.0 space. Of course we are going to put bubbles up and sit on the gates. When we want a fair fight we go looking for one. But if someone is coming to kill our miners and ratters you're damn right we want the odds stacked in our favour as much as we possibly can. That means bubbles and as many ships as we can get. It's got nothing to do with cheap ganks and everything to do with protecting the space that we fought for.
Gretek Lal Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2007.01.25 02:15:00 - [105] Originally by: Blue Pixie Anyone else find it ironic the same people arguing that life isn't fair and nor should EVE be fair, are also complaining that Ctrl+Q isn't fair? Yes!
Chimu Quien	Posted - 2007.01.25 02:21:00 - [106] Originally by: Novemb3r ...We spent months securing our little bit of 0.0 space. Of course we are going to put bubbles up and sit on the gates. When we want a fair fight we go looking for one. But if someone is coming to kill our miners and ratters you're damn right we want the odds stacked in our favour as much as we possibly can. That means bubbles and as many ships as we can get. It's got nothing to do with cheap ganks and everything to do with protecting the space that we fought for. I have no argument at all with what you're saying. You've claimed your bit of 0.0 space and that's fine. Defend it. If I want to venture into your space, I know that I need to ask first or get attacked. The problem is gate camps in lo-sec. Why don't more people venture into lo-sec? Gate camps. It's that simple. Gate campers in lo-sec don't want real fights. If they did, they would venture down into the space where your corp lives, and try to take your territory. But they don't want real fights. They want easy targets. Some chap looking for plentiful omber. Some noob just looking around. The answer? More lo-sec systems, and many more gates into lo-sec systems.
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2007.01.25 03:02:00 - [107] Mostly because there are no bubbles, it's a rare LowSec gatecamp that's dangerous to anybody willing to take some very basic precautions. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Eudoxus Ars Caelestis	Posted - 2007.01.25 03:32:00 - [108] Well I posted this before I went to bed and was surprised to see so many replies when I got up. It is a shame that there is a heck of a lot of flaming but amongst it all there are some interesting ideas/points of views. I do find it interesting that the people who justify ctrl-q say that the reason it is ffairF is because there is no counter to being in a interdiction sphere (in the case of my solo Sabre last night ) or landing in a camping blob (quite possible with a bubble and/or sphere). I have to say that this is a pretty weak argument on many fronts { the usual being check the map, use a scout, fit wcs or istabs and that you should be expecting it in 0.0. Clearly there are counters then. There are plenty of counters like the ones above or, more importantly, the ones I will tell you below. It is just that people are not willing to use them as it takes planning, skill and yes, a bit of luck. There is a risk though that you might still lose your ship. Well I will give everyone a real tip if you want to travel safe { at some point in your travels (since you seem to want to come and go so often in 0.0) get a fast ship and make peep points above all the gates on your route. 300km is my recommendation. Now every time you come into a system, you have a point above the gate on the far side to warp to that 100% stops you from landing in a camp there and also not landing in a bubble. If hostile, then you know not to continue on your way and hit a safe spot. Better still, safespot and cloak. What you say, this does not help with landing in the camp in the first place as there is no defence. Wrong. The largest addition to your survivability in traveling is to fit a proto cloak. So, you screw up and didnFt use a scout, didnFt check the map, didnFt ask any allies about what might be coming and now you landed in a dictor bubble with 5 buddies looking to pop you. No problem { double click anywhere in space, kick your ab/mwd and then click your protocloak. You now are moving at a decent rate of speed heading for the edge of the bubble and are cloaked. And no one can lock you while you did this since you had some skill and did it in a reasonable amount of time. Now with even a modicum of luck, you get to the edge of bubble and can warp off (after aligning cloaked) at your leisure. And if you donFt believe this works, you clearly have never played the game. I am a trader/hauler as my primary occupation. The ony time I ever died in a camp was back when I was a relative noob and thought a manticore could align and warp quick`.wrong! Aside from that stupidity, I have not once EVER been caught in a gate camp { bubbles/dictor spheres. Never. With the technique I detailed above you are about as secure as you can get for traveling. No it is not as convenient as just warping to zero and being on your merry way but it is pretty dang risk free. I have hauled billions of isk worth of stuff in and out of 0.0 doing precisely this. Gate camps are a non issue for me { they are just the things that make it more interesting to get around. If it were not for camps, travel in 0.0 would be the same as in empire````boring warp to zero over and over. I like gate camps { primarily because it adds fun, adds risk and because I am skilled enough that I can get out of every one of them. So, it seems to me that the tools and skills are definitely there to make for secure travel even vs supposedly uneven odds. The only reason to defend ctrl-q, to me, is simply because pilots donFt have the skill/patience or willingness to do things required to keep themselves safe. It is the feasyF way out and the lame way to avoid getting a ship killed. DonFt get me wrong, I donFt like getting killed either but if the game degenerates to point that everyone just ctrl-qFs everywhere, then there is no fgameF left { it is just carebares in space warping to zero.
Eudoxus Ars Caelestis	Posted - 2007.01.25 03:32:00 - [109] I also donFt buy the fits griefingF to camp a gate. It is entirely valid to guard your front door if you are defending your space from freeloaders/spies. If your capital city is located on a river leading to the ocean (and everyone travels in boats), do you roam around in the fields hoping to come across an enemy or do you put a fort at the entrance to the river to defend against the fleet that is going to sail up to your capital? It is only logical to be at the point where people come and go from. Why is it griefing if I lock my front door, stand behind it with a baseball bat and hit you when you come in - that is where you are going to come in after all. It is only sensible. What are you doing coming in if you are not either 1) hostile 2) freeloading? 0.0 is supposed to be controllable space. That means if you can lock down systems for your allies, why should freeloaders or potential hostiles just get to walk right in? I also donFt buy the ffind a fair fightF or ffind something bigger and it will fightF. Eve is just not ffairF in terms of fights. It is non-consensual pvp space. So people are only going to be consensual when they think/know they can win. That means that the better ship/build/skilled pilot generally is going to win. You never get ffairF fights { if I show up in a cruiser and you in a hac, that aint fair, likewise if you show up in a frig that isnFt fair. Heck, even if you get two cruisers who are willing to fight each other it still wonFt be fair { one guy quite likely has more skills or paid more for modules that are better or all the other variables you can come up with. The only way to have ffairF fights is to say { everyone fly the same ship with the same stats and then fight; except then it is just the luck of the dice vs the game mechanics who wins. If I happen to hit 6 times before you do based on the hit generation engine, I win, if you hit 6 times first you win. Aside from that, it is never a ffairF fight. So the only issue really, is how to handle a genuine ctd as it seems pretty obvious to me that ctrl-q is entirely a lame exploit/tactic for weak players. For ctd, I say tough really. I mean, how many times do you really ctd. I have 3 times in about 18 months. And not every one of those was even in space or with hostiles even around if I was. So in 18 months I might have lost 1 ship to this and I even doubt that. And for solution { I think removing ctrl-q or preventing logging within 100km of gates is the easiest solution. Then people will actually have to play the game as it was meant { controllable space is controllable with risk to all parties. The risk is clearly not one way either as my solo dictor will tell you -when the BC comes in with 3 gyroFs in lows on hearing of me in intel and peels me in half in seconds you know there is risk`.ouch! Thanks for the fun there Caldun!
Goberth Ludwig The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2007.01.25 03:41:00 - [110] Signed !!!!! The tragedy is people think they are justified to log to avoid a gank. - Gob

Malicia Skirj	Posted - 2007.01.25 03:46:00 - [111] Originally by: Eudoxus If I lose 3 ships to that a year it would be preferable to having everyone just using this to avoid combat. No combat, no eve. Only solution I can think of - get bookmarks at the emergency drop off point above every gate - then when you see it you might be able to warp to where the wuss went to and kill his empty ship. Appropriate punishment for *gutless* dogs. Regards, Eudoxus Originally by: Eudoxus And I finally got someone to stick around and fight - unfortunately a 3 gyrostabbed battlecruiser. I had to run to get out of that one! But at least I didn't ctrl-q. Please tell me I'm not the only one that sees the irony in this.
Eudoxus Ars Caelestis	Posted - 2007.01.25 04:03:00 - [112] What is the irony - I clearly said that pvp is never 'fair' above. I know full well what I can and can't kill in my ship - I will shoot at what I can and run from what I can't. And I also know that flying around looking for combat might well put me in a situation where the other guy has a vastly better ship. So I flew out of my own bubble (which is already rather risky to be dropping on unknowns) and warped off almost in structure. I could never kill the guy, I couldn't even dent him. This is entirely rational behavior. If you are fighting a superior force, you cut loses. This is not dueling in the 14th century. This is not a lack of honor, this is sanity. People do not stick around and get popped just for the sake of it. Are you telling me that if you come in and land in my bubble in a frig you are not just going to accept your fate and not run? Eve is always a mismatch. You run if you know you can't win, you try and fight if you know you can. Or if you are lame and have no skills and don't use the tools available, you ctrl-q it seems. I am trying to be realistic and hope that this just doesn't degenerate into the usual flame fest. I put above a very rational argument for how to get about in 0.0 that negates the need for ctrl-q in my eyes. I would love to see an argument in terms of how that is not correct. I suspect there is not one but would be open to seeing it. Otherwise I have to go with my thought that it is just a lame way to not get your ship popped. Oh, and you notice I said I ran - I didn't ctrl-q! If he had been a bit quicker or me a bit slower, he would have got a kill and I would have had no problem with that.
Trinity Faetal 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.01.25 04:09:00 - [113] Originally by: Malicia Skirj Originally by: Eudoxus If I lose 3 ships to that a year it would be preferable to having everyone just using this to avoid combat. No combat, no eve. Only solution I can think of - get bookmarks at the emergency drop off point above every gate - then when you see it you might be able to warp to where the wuss went to and kill his empty ship. Appropriate punishment for *gutless* dogs. Regards, Eudoxus Originally by: Eudoxus And I finally got someone to stick around and fight - unfortunately a 3 gyrostabbed battlecruiser. I had to run to get out of that one! But at least I didn't ctrl-q. Please tell me I'm not the only one that sees the irony in this. yes ur an idiot -- Enjoy The Silence
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.01.25 04:16:00 - [114] Edited by: Dred''Pirate Jesus on 25/01/2007 04:13:36 Remove ctrl-q from the keyboard shortcuts and the X button on top of the windowed client.. Replace it with a new "Exit Game" button buried deep in the esc button menu.. By the time they get to the button to log they will already be locked and scrammed.. Problem solved.. KALI:Revelations.. The **znit.. ( FFS ****znit is blocked?! Quit using Babelfish for a blocked word filter engine CCP.. :-p )
HankMurphy Pelennor Swarm Eternal Rangers of Terror	Posted - 2007.01.25 04:38:00 - [115] I would gladly accept the inconvenient loss of my most expensive ship at that moment i warped into a camp and my ISP crapped the bed in exchange for bubbles to lock down everyone NO MATTER THEIR STATUS! Your in a bubble, you go no where. Not if you loose connection, not if the node is bogged down and ppl get booted, not if your PC locks up, not even during late night talk shows! never, ever, EVER. Maybe CCP will feel bad for teh .000001% of ppl that actually have a REAL connection problem when they clicked the jump button. Well CCP, its one of those cases where you need to accept a little bad for the greater good. We are sick of ppl just pulling the plug or quitting game to get away. There is no room in pvp combat for such an easy out. There are plenty of green systems on the map where ppl can fly like a moron, not use scouts and blindly ignore the player vs player aspect of the game. The ppl in LowSec and 0.0 aren't there to comfort you with fuzzy blankets. They are there to kill you, fair or not. So stop logging and take your floggin
Topaz Skydiver	Posted - 2007.01.25 04:49:00 - [116] Edited by: Topaz Skydiver on 25/01/2007 04:51:06 Edited by: Topaz Skydiver on 25/01/2007 04:47:54 Originally by: Sertan Deras Why not? If you jump in to their space, they warn you, and if you don't leave, they attack you and drive you off. Defending ones space does not mean camping a gate and killing helpless ships as they jump in. A pilot or alliance with REAL honor, would tell people to leave first, and enforce that second. Not catch people in bubbles they can't escape from and slaughter them while they are loading in to the system. That's griefing, not defending territory. EVE pvp is unconsentual and includes the chance to die outnumbered and outgunned. The solution is not to ask other players not to outnumber and outgun you, but to accept that risk and play clever to reduce your chances to get in such situations. You can't avoid every death in 0.0 and low sec. but bring your death rate down to an acceptable value. This whining about how 'unfair' EVE is makes me sick. PvP in 0.0 is sometimes solo fights, more often gang fights and fleet fights, sometimes with similar numbers, more often with huge differences in numbers, sometimes you hunt players, often you get hunted yourself by others. Quite often the hunter gang becomes the hunted. We enjoy it this way. If you play clever, the losses don't ruin you. I won't change my playstyle just, because you don't want to play this little game with me. Then don't come to 0.0. Simple. Tell you something: Usually I gank some people every day in 0.0, because if we get the chance to kill a target, we do it. Nice boom, nice loot, another killmail as a trophy, good chance to motivate some people to send reinforcment and get even more fights. But only three days ago or so I got ganked myself, because I was careless. Then yesterday I lost my BS, when we took a fleet fight heavily outnumbered. Later in the night we won a small gang engangement being outnumbered. Cool lucky fight, but that's really rare. Besides pvp I do ratting in 0.0, low sec mission running or production stuff to finance that fun and during that I just try to stay alive. I love it that way. I don't need some crappy artificial fairness rules. If you can kill me, try to kill me, if I see a chance to kill you, I'll do the same. No more rules needed. My protection against getting ganked is to try to play clever and avoid to get in that situation not too often. I don't need no further help from the ones who try to kill me. It's dog eat dog in 0.0 and often some uncautious rabbits get eaten too. Thousands of people have learned to play in 0.0 and keep their risk low enough to prefer it over empire, even miners, ratters and producers. 0.0 is fine with ganking and all that and perfectly playable for anyone, who puts some effort into it. We are happy there.
Blue Pixie	Posted - 2007.01.25 09:53:00 - [117] Originally by: Eudoxus ...For ctd, I say tough really. I mean, how many times do you really ctd. Pretty freaking often, actually. I've only being playing EVE Online about a month and a half, but I've been bumped off Tranquility a hell of a lot more often than just three occasions... particularly on the days following a patch. But hey, you want to be apathetic? I can be apathetic. Frankly, I care as much about you gatecamping in 0.0 space as I imagine you care about me carebearing my way thru missions in Empire. If solving your "logoffski" problems means I've gotta sacrifice a ship every time CCP's client/server has a hiccup, then I say tough really. I'd rather keep my ship than make you happy.
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2007.01.25 10:14:00 - [118] Yawn please try to come at it with some form of shutzpah. "Sorry to quote the BOX A MASSIELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAME, EVE Online. Everytime you travel around in the EVE universe you potentialy could be a target of anyone...who wish to attack and prey on you. Another quote from the BOX CHOOSE A PROFESSION: As DAuntless fleetcommander, or the MOST nefarius pirate ever to terrorize the Galaxy - Be and do anything yo'd never dare imagine I can understand, that you think Gate camps, are boring, and not fair, EVE is not supposed to be fair." Massively multiplayer doesnt mean YOU MUST PLAY WITH FRIENDS. So you totaly avoided my points way to go. Again show me where it says you must play with friends, and show me the agents for gangs.... then we can talk mkay? Until then stfu EVE is for single players as much as for big group hugging homo coombya singing campers. Gates camps have nothing to do with being "fair" it is about balanced combat something eve should have. Any **** can camp a gate with a half dozen friends, but it doesnt VALIDATE it as an acceptable form of gameplay. The only reason it exists is because CCP lacked the forsight when they designed their game to realize there was no places to pvp because everyone warps to travel, add in the fact they totaly screwed the pooch with set up designs so that peopel can rig up for pvp and be invincible vs people in npc sets ups and then inturn take advantage and REMOVE all form of risk vs reward in thgeir game by preying on people not rigged for pvp. Honest I couldnt give a flying fark about fair, you got no nutz and need 20 friends to kill 1 guy in a shuttle go for it, everyone knows you are a terrible gamer and you suck balls. but the developers shouldnt allow you to camp spawn points. You know it is the same crap as the old days before concord and you had losers camp the noobie stations and they would lock load and pwn every newb who just finished creating their character and undocked for the first time. CCP finally got the sense to fix it after seeing how many losers would camp the stations and drive off all the new players, while being near untouchable by other older players for many reasons, one being they would just dock themselves if trouble came. Gate camping is the same crap different pile and someday CCCP will get the guts and right mechanics to remove such a pathetic excuse for pvp gameplay.
Ishana Minmatar The Black Rabbits Fatal Persuasion	Posted - 2007.01.25 10:31:00 - [119] Edited by: Ishana on 25/01/2007 10:28:15 Why not just make logging off or disconnecting an uncloaking effect. then put a 10-15 seconds window of agression on the logging off, so that any player agression within that window causes you to gain the pvp timer. -crashing in PvE situations would only mean you are vulnerable for 10 seconds more. (could also just be the time you need to align to make the emergency warp or make a emergency warp last at least 10 seconds no matter what ship) -crashing in PvP situations is tough luck and works like it does now when you're already engaged. _________________________________________________________ Please resize your signature to the limits specified in the forum rules, thanks. -wystler (mods@ccpgames.com)
Lagkills Caldari Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.25 10:34:00 - [120] Play the game. If you dont like it, dont play it. Makes me hate all the whiners in here... :/



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