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Cathablia Sarain
Eskimo Escort Fanclub
1
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Posted - 2016.01.22 01:42:26 -
[1] - Quote
Does anyone got any ideas how to make this useless worse off module compared to the meta 4 one, better ? |
Paranoid Loyd
8228
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Posted - 2016.01.22 01:46:07 -
[2] - Quote
Wait for it to be teircided.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
1046
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Posted - 2016.01.22 05:38:41 -
[3] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Wait for it to be teircided.
What he said. And it's no empty quote.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Hopelesshobo
Tactical Nuclear Penguin's
537
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Posted - 2016.01.22 05:47:20 -
[4] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Wait for it to be teircided. What he said. And it's no empty quote.
It's important to not empty quote.
Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
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Iain Cariaba
2408
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Posted - 2016.01.22 07:05:45 -
[5] - Quote
Hopelesshobo wrote:elitatwo wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Wait for it to be teircided. What he said. And it's no empty quote. It's important to not empty quote. This, because empty quoting is bad.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
872
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Posted - 2016.01.22 08:34:22 -
[6] - Quote
Wait for it to be tiercided and meta TP's to be made useless.
I just wish CCP would realize that meta modules should still be useful for some things, making t2 the only option is not a solution.
Eve needs diversity on the playing field.
EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
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Iain Cariaba
2408
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Posted - 2016.01.22 08:40:19 -
[7] - Quote
Arya Regnar wrote:Wait for it to be tiercided and meta TP's to be made useless.
I just wish CCP would realize that meta modules should still be useful for some things, making t2 the only option is not a solution.
Eve needs diversity on the playing field. While I agree that the current method of tiericide sucks, the end result isn't much different than before. In a lot of cases, the meta 4 had identical effects as the t2, with lighter fitting requirements. This meant that if price wasn't a deciding factor in your fitting options, the only real option was the meta 4.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Kasia en Tilavine
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
75
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Posted - 2016.01.22 10:38:01 -
[8] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Arya Regnar wrote:Wait for it to be tiercided and meta TP's to be made useless.
I just wish CCP would realize that meta modules should still be useful for some things, making t2 the only option is not a solution.
Eve needs diversity on the playing field. While I agree that the current method of tiericide sucks, the end result isn't much different than before. In a lot of cases, the meta 4 had identical effects as the t2, with lighter fitting requirements. This meant that if price wasn't a deciding factor in your fitting options, the only real option was the meta 4.
While this is a point. Just... From a technical standpoint, it is, in fact "A" point. It's not a particularly true one. The only meta that is better than t2 is the MWD. Every other tiericide affected module group was done pretty well. Meta is 20% less effective give or take, with less cap use and fitting. Then broken down further into specialization a that have maybe only 10% less stat than T2.
Mwd needs to be fixed. CCP ****** it up. Restrained is better in literally every single way barring a negligible 1% increase in speed. Restore the sig bloom of the restrained to 500% and drop the sig bloom on t2 down to the 450%. That way t2 is the best for everything with a hair more speed and less sig bloom. If you can't/don't want to fit it, you can pick enduring for better cap when perma-running for kiting. or restrained so you have better cap when you get a scrammed or turn it off for tackle.
All other tiericide has worked out really well. Just because you prefer x meta module over the t2 on your own fits does not mean that someone else doesn't like y meta module on their fits. |
elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
1046
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Posted - 2016.01.22 10:45:28 -
[9] - Quote
Kasia en Tilavine wrote:...While this is a point. Just... From a technical standpoint, it is, in fact "A" point. It's not a particularly true one. The only meta that is better than t2 is the MWD. Every other tiericide affected module group was done pretty well. Meta is 20% less effective give or take, with less cap use and fitting. Then broken down further into specialization a that have maybe only 10% less stat than T2.
Mwd needs to be fixed. CCP ****** it up. Restrained is better in literally every single way barring a negligible 1% increase in speed. Restore the sig bloom of the restrained to 500% and drop the sig bloom on t2 down to the 450%. That way t2 is the best for everything with a hair more speed and less sig bloom. If you can't/don't want to fit it, you can pick enduring for better cap when perma-running for kiting. or restrained so you have better cap when you get a scrammed or turn it off for tackle.
All other tiericide has worked out really well. Just because you prefer x meta module over the t2 on your own fits does not mean that someone else doesn't like y meta module on their fits.
Oh? I thought they were doing the different - not better approach? At least I thought, they should.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Kasia en Tilavine
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
75
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Posted - 2016.01.22 11:02:48 -
[10] - Quote
When they talked about the tiericide a couple years ago they specified that T2 would be "premium performance" at the cost of cap and or fitting. While meta would be cap/fitting cheaper, you get different sub T2 performance "different but not better" specialization. Since CCP has no idea how MWDs work, they couldn't figure out how to balance their stats. MWDs are the one module in the game that must have the same "performance" 500% speed increase. That's already an over the top premium bonus. The balancing comes from fitting, and the two stats that tricked CCP into ******* it up again. Cap USE and cap PENALTY.
With 1 mod costing less cap to use, but having a higher penalty, and the other costing more cap, with less penalty, those two more shake out to have a negligible active cost difference. While one has a better inactive performance. AND they gave it less sig bloom. So it's the clear choice. Literally all the time.
To be fair to CCP. The fact that it has a single performance stat that is unacceptable to increase. And 2 penalty stats that are VERY important. They set themselves up for that one. |
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1769
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Posted - 2016.01.22 13:58:09 -
[11] - Quote
The meta system has kind of broken down over the years. Let me tell a brief story!
The following is a generalization of how meta stuff used to work. There are/were exceptions to these generalizations - focus on the concept, not that specific module X doesn't conform to the norm.
Pretend there are flashing lights, futuristic sounds and some jostling motions as the way back machine takes you to 2007.
Back in that day the meta modules were scaled both in fitting and/or effect. A higher meta level meant that the module was either better at its function, had lower fitting requirements and sometimes both. Meta 4 modules were relatively rare drops and expensive to purchase.
T2 modules were in the game, but invention was not. A few lucky and rich individuals owned T2 BPO. The lottery monopoly held the prices of T2 modules at an almost evil premium. T2 modules had the best stats functionally, but at the price of having the highest fitting costs.
Faction and Officer modules were very rare, very pricey and had better than T2/meta 4 stats and / or better than T2/meta 4 fitting requirements. Few were available and few folks could afford to use them.
I'll use webbers (just because I recall the numbers). You could get a fleeting webber for 14 mil or a T2 webber for 20 mil. I don't know the prices of faction webs back then - as a frigate flying pvp girl - 14 mil for a web was far enough (isk was a lot harder to get back then - null belt ratting was the high end isk income for the blue collar pilot)
(brilliant flash of light as time leaps forward a bit)
Player outcry crumbled CCP's will and invention was introduced into the game. This was good. It had the following effect. T2 prices came down. A pilot fitting a ship had the following options.
1. meta module because they lacked the skills to fit the T2 module or because of tight PG/CPU. Pay more - get more. 2. if you had the skills you could get T2. You paid less isk but paid more in fitting. 3. faction mods - still for the utra rich and a few niche fitting problems where isk was traded for less PG or CPU requirements.
Ship fitting was in a good place. You had options. Wallet, SP and needs all played into fitting a ship.
Today - There is no such thing as a rare module. CCP has been upping the loot take in null because they were told making it more lucrative to live in null would make null awesome and everyone would flock there and that would make eve awesome. What that has done to modules: Nothing is rare. Nothing is expensive. Even faction modules are affordable by all. There aren't a lot of hard choices when fitting a ship. If you want extra web range - faction. If you have fitting issues - faction. If it's a plain jane pvp ship - T2. If you lack skills - faction. If you're a broke noob - meta. Tieracide can't fix a glut of everything on the market - sure the uniformity appeals to the deep seated OCD that burns within me, but it doesn't do much when I pull out my wallet and go shopping.
Empire missions and most anoms aren't looted. It's just not worth the time. Even w/ mobile tractors - blitz blitz and blitz. There is no value in meta modules. Looting and salvaging are noob professions (which is fine) but to a vet player that stuff is a bunch of worthless junk.
So, back to your target painter issue. The actual balancing of target painters amongst themselves will do wonders for the OCD afflicted (like me) and the math nerds. But when you get to the checkout line in Jita, all that balance and harmony won't really play into which target painter you purchased. T2 is standard. Faction is for fitting or a need for a 'beyond T2' ability. Meta are for the ultra poor an ultra low skilled. There is also a smallish cheap meta module demand from the ganking community (the throw away market). |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2511
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Posted - 2016.01.22 17:43:58 -
[12] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Hopelesshobo wrote:elitatwo wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Wait for it to be teircided.
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Lugh Crow-Slave
1470
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Posted - 2016.01.24 11:52:28 -
[13] - Quote
its the same with all non-prop E-war even the ecm low slots have this issue
Citadel worm hole tax
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