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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Codchar2
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Posted - 2007.02.03 00:36:00 -
[1]
I was trying to do some stuff with a particular salvage item (contaminated nanite), but every time I tried to buy out a certain order, it was immediately replaced by one of the same price (offering one of the item each time). By immediately I mean instantly, leading me to believe that this was done by a bot. There's no in-game mechanism that would let you do this right?
This is interfering with my efforts to make money. Is there anything I can do about it- somewhere I could report him or something?
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Ray McCormack
BIG
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Posted - 2007.02.03 00:48:00 -
[2]
Check the length on the order. If it's 365 days then it's an NPC corp and hence built into the game by CCP.
| How To Afford A Tech II BPO | the all mighty BIG industrial corp from hell with a slong the size of a walrus. |
Codebreak
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Posted - 2007.02.03 00:53:00 -
[3]
If you think it's a bot, then absolutely petition it.
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.03 01:52:00 -
[4]
Are you sure you aren't placing an immediate buy order that's being filled by another, lower order?
Like this: price|qty 5.00|5,000 5.10|1 5.13|8,000
If you try to buy out the 5.10 one, you'll just end up buying 1 unit from the 5.00 seller, but you'll pay him 5.10 isk for it.
MP
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ChickenOfDoom
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Posted - 2007.02.03 02:48:00 -
[5]
^^Yeah, pretty sure. I bought about ten of them, all of them from the same guy, all of them the exact same price. I had previously bought about 300, again from that same guy.
Yep, just double checked it; next lowest price was 172000. Pops up immediately. Though strangely it was a different guy this time...
Ugh, I'm going to lose 10 mil on this.
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mechtech
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Posted - 2007.02.03 02:53:00 -
[6]
*tinfoil hats on* I have a conspiracy theory:
There was a post a while back by Paper Pusher, the guy who monopolizes the +1 implant market where he blackmailed everyone and said something along the lines of; "pay me or I'll ruin the market for a few weeks". (he's like that, hehe, try putting up buy orders for +1s sometime!)
Maybe this is what we are seeing?
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Codchar2
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Posted - 2007.02.03 07:26:00 -
[7]
Ok, I sent a petition. Hopefully it will be dealt with soon.
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Pirlouit
Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2007.02.03 17:21:00 -
[8]
Dear All, If you do suspect with lot of careful evidences that there is a market bot at work please do fill a petition and CCP will investigate it. If it is a very reactive player you may want to contact him first in order to check wether you are dealing with a bot or not.
I hate bots since it does ruin the fun of market trading.
forum rules | email |
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Barbicane
The Gun Club
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Posted - 2007.02.04 08:36:00 -
[9]
This is a mail I got on one of my sales accounts. The linked web page advertises a program which is said to automate price cutting by hooking into the Eve client and adjusting your sell orders by a configurable amount (typically .01 isk) every couple of minutes if needed. This is of course very much against the EULA and I have filed an exploit petition. Just want to let the rest of you know what you're up against. Be on your guard and keep filing thoe petitions!
2007.02.04 07:29 Hi there! Tired of market wars, lags and bugs??? Here is the ultimate solution for every market trader!!! Market Bot - The program for buy\sell orders managing and market browsing. For more info ***URL removed*** OUT OF GAME BROWSER
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.04 10:13:00 -
[10]
Originally by: some random exploiter Hi there! Tired of market wars, lags and bugs??? Here is the ultimate solution for every market trader!!! Market Bot - The program for buy\sell orders managing and market browsing. For more info ***URL removed*** OUT OF GAME BROWSER
Because, logically, the best way to make your 2b, 20b, or 200b work harder for you is to risk 100% of it, plus your reputation, contacts, etc., etc., etc., for 10% more sales.
Actually, if someone finds someone using one of these, just place a 1-unit sell order for 0.01 isk above the highest buy order (works best with modules with a large spread). Then chuckle malevolently.
MP
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Barbicane
The Gun Club
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Posted - 2007.02.04 11:02:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Motivated Prophet Actually, if someone finds someone using one of these, just place a 1-unit sell order for 0.01 isk above the highest buy order (works best with modules with a large spread). Then chuckle malevolently.
Good plan |
Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.04 16:26:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Barbicane
Originally by: Motivated Prophet Actually, if someone finds someone using one of these, just place a 1-unit sell order for 0.01 isk above the highest buy order (works best with modules with a large spread). Then chuckle malevolently.
Good plan
For bonus points, flood some of the more-expensive buy orders, and then place a buy order yourself!
MP
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Doctor Blue
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Posted - 2007.02.05 02:09:00 -
[13]
I've been trading for a year and a half, and hadn't ever heard of a working trade bot until I got a spam mail this morning. By yesterday though I was convinced in my own mind that somehting was dodgy about a trader in pirate implants. They are very expensive and slow moving with just a few traders. Someone had been cornering the market for at least a week, so I tried to give him a run for his money. About a dozen updates to my buy orders spread out over a 30 hour period (night an d day) he managed to cover every one about 12 or 13 mins later, with the exception of a few that were a bit quicker. At the time I thought is was a corp sharing an account or something like that, but then I get the spam mail this morning.... I've never come accross anything like this in the last year and a half of trading, and it doesn't look good for traders.
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Ramblin Man
Empyreum
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Posted - 2007.02.05 03:46:00 -
[14]
Petition it. I'm sure the dev teams takes very specific and gleeful pride in downloading, figuring out, and countering macros/bots/scripts (e.g. snowballs ).
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Robacz
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.02.05 10:18:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Robacz on 05/02/2007 10:15:54
Originally by: Doctor Blue I've been trading for a year and a half, and hadn't ever heard of a working trade bot until I got a spam mail this morning. By yesterday though I was convinced in my own mind that somehting was dodgy about a trader in pirate implants. They are very expensive and slow moving with just a few traders. Someone had been cornering the market for at least a week, so I tried to give him a run for his money. About a dozen updates to my buy orders spread out over a 30 hour period (night an d day) he managed to cover every one about 12 or 13 mins later, with the exception of a few that were a bit quicker. At the time I thought is was a corp sharing an account or something like that, but then I get the spam mail this morning.... I've never come accross anything like this in the last year and a half of trading, and it doesn't look good for traders.
I am also trading pirate implans on Jita and I noticed same thing. Orders get over/underbidded within minutes any hour any day. And I am not speaking about few orders, its like 90 of them. This market was always very tough, my orders rarely lasted longer than 1-2 hours, but recently its just crazy. Either someone is sitting at his computer 23/7 and updating orders (which would be OK I guess - he invest more time so he wins), or there is a bot working there.
___________ Buying/Selling: Implants & Hardwirings Producing/BPCs: Mining Barges, BCs, Cruisers |
Doctor Blue
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Posted - 2007.02.05 10:45:00 -
[16]
yup but no one can update that fast 23/7, and it's one account because they 'tag' their orders. I seemed to have scared him off from my area for now though. I guess circumstantial evidence was starting to look more like proof with the increased action in the market. I can certainly think of one trader who is crazy obsessive enough to try a stunt like this though.
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Romeq
Caldari Xenobytes Stain Empire
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Posted - 2007.02.05 10:47:00 -
[17]
hope those wordz is not a true about bots, 'cause i have a lot of problems with trade last time even in regions...and i don't know how. i spend several hours a day for those matter< and every morning i found my orders last *(
OMGGG!! psyfish-)
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Romeq
Caldari Xenobytes Stain Empire
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Posted - 2007.02.05 10:48:00 -
[18]
and the even modify order for 1 isk!!!!
OMGGG!! psyfish-)
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.05 15:45:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Robacz I am also trading pirate implans on Jita and I noticed same thing. Orders get over/underbidded within minutes any hour any day. And I am not speaking about few orders, its like 90 of them. This market was always very tough, my orders rarely lasted longer than 1-2 hours, but recently its just crazy. Either someone is sitting at his computer 23/7 and updating orders (which would be OK I guess - he invest more time so he wins), or there is a bot working there.
Rob,
Find one product where you're convinced the bot is at work. Something cheap, and ideally something that doesn't have a lot of volume--if the bot is running LG Talisman Alphas, for instance, that'd be ideal! Put up a buy order for 0.01 isk over the highest buy order, and a sell order for 0.01 isk above THAT. If the guy sells to you, that's pretty concrete proof, in my mind, that he's a bot. To be fair, though, you might lose a few million isk doing this, either because the bot has slightly more intelligence than I'm giving it credit for, or because someone will just happen to wander along and discover your low-priced sell order!
In completely-unrelated news, Robacz is the best pirate implant seller (and buyer!) in the game. I never go to anyone else, and neither should you. (Rob, you should know who my main is, btw.)
MP
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Robacz
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.02.05 19:11:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Motivated Prophet Find one product where you're convinced the bot is at work. Something cheap, and ideally something that doesn't have a lot of volume--if the bot is running LG Talisman Alphas, for instance, that'd be ideal! Put up a buy order for 0.01 isk over the highest buy order, and a sell order for 0.01 isk above THAT. If the guy sells to you, that's pretty concrete proof, in my mind, that he's a bot. To be fair, though, you might lose a few million isk doing this, either because the bot has slightly more intelligence than I'm giving it credit for, or because someone will just happen to wander along and discover your low-priced sell order!
I will try it with some cheaper implant, but I don't think any bot would be that "dumb", it would be too easy to exploit it (heh I wish it worked though, I'd go for some shopping ).
Originally by: Motivated Prophet
In completely-unrelated news, Robacz is the best pirate implant seller (and buyer!) in the game. I never go to anyone else, and neither should you. (Rob, you should know who my main is, btw.)
Lol , thanks for free advertising. I do.
_________ Buying/Selling: Implants & Hardwirings Producing/BPCs: Mining Barges, T2 Components T2 Distribution: 8 regions covered |
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Ren Judgment
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Posted - 2007.02.05 22:14:00 -
[21]
well all this talk makes me angry... about a year ago with the old escrows, i set a bunch of stuff on escrow for my alt and when i put it up apparently i forgot to set it to my alt... so i was like no matter i'll pick it up i mean its 0.0 nobody is gonna steal it within the half second that i put it up, and i check and its gone. I petitioned ccp and they said they couldnt do anything about it. it fell prey to a bot that buys up all escrows with .01isk or lower as its set buy price.
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Doctor Blue
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Posted - 2007.02.06 01:24:00 -
[22]
yup escrow bots were aroud for a while Rens before escrows sad demise, but market bots are something new to me. To the guy sugesting experimenting on alphas, the apparent bot was only being used on high end stuff, and the guy was also trading 'manually' when he was around. Looked like he set it to about 15 minutes for anything up to a week before, (maybe more, i was away for a while before that), then after all the trade updates friday/saturday got scared off using it, then tailed off. That's what it looked like anyway. I mean the really high end stuff is so slow moving there are usually only a few udates in the market a day, who would spend 23 hours checking that within every 15 mins for a few of updates a day. When the 3 or 4 of us in the market were just ticking along, then sure, he can say he clocked our profile, and everything is sweet, but a curveball over a 30 hour period, and still catch every one well within 15 minutes? no way
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Ramblin Man
Empyreum
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Posted - 2007.02.06 07:20:00 -
[23]
Imo, escrow bots and market bots are a bit different - the former capitalizes on player mistakes, while the latter gives a player a fundamental advantage over another player, regardless of the other player's alertness.
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.06 09:19:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ramblin Man Imo, escrow bots and market bots are a bit different - the former capitalizes on player mistakes, while the latter gives a player a fundamental advantage over another player, regardless of the other player's alertness.
In much the same way as there's a difference between robbing a man and leaving him $20 for cab fare, and robbing him and leaving him nothing, you are right.
Of course, that said, in both cases, you've done something wrong.
MP
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Ramblin Man
Empyreum
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Posted - 2007.02.06 19:21:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Motivated Prophet
Originally by: Ramblin Man Imo, escrow bots and market bots are a bit different - the former capitalizes on player mistakes, while the latter gives a player a fundamental advantage over another player, regardless of the other player's alertness.
In much the same way as there's a difference between robbing a man and leaving him $20 for cab fare, and robbing him and leaving him nothing, you are right.
Of course, that said, in both cases, you've done something wrong.
MP
Well I'd go with the difference between robbing a drunk and robbing someone on their way home from work, but to each their own.
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Dawnstar
Gallente Kiroshi Group
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Posted - 2007.02.06 21:06:00 -
[26]
You know... I never thought about it, but that might explain the problems I've been having with my buy orders for salvaged materials down in Tash-Murkon. Someone kept regularly beating mine by .01 isk, and it seemed to happen fairly quickly after I modified my orders - every time. I'll have to take a look at this further. -D |
Resila
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Posted - 2007.02.06 22:23:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Codchar2 I was trying to do some stuff with a particular salvage item (contaminated nanite), but every time I tried to buy out a certain order, it was immediately replaced by one of the same price (offering one of the item each time). By immediately I mean instantly, leading me to believe that this was done by a bot. There's no in-game mechanism that would let you do this right?
This is interfering with my efforts to make money. Is there anything I can do about it- somewhere I could report him or something?
Had exactly the same thing happen to me today when buying EM hardeners. Quantity was 1, I bought what I thought was the last one, and another one was instantly put up. I petitioned it as a possible exploit or bug, but I'm not sure if the GM really understood what had happened. Other sell orders were 1.5-2x the price, so it wouldn't be because you always buy from the cheapest available in said station, as my petition reply suggested - there simply wasn't any other orders at that price showing. Bought 10-15 or more, one by one, before I didn't bother anymore. Didn't bother writing a second petition either.
I was thinking that it might be a bug though, maybe if one person put up a several sell orders with the same item and price, only 1 of them will show up at a time... haven't had time to test it though.
Either way (bot, exploit, bug, whatever) it can ruin trade for us smalltime traders. I see no reason to undercut a quantity 1, very cheap module order, since it will be bought out quickly anyways. But if that order keeps popping up 1 by 1 a hundred times when it's bought, my more "reasonably priced" module take a lot more time to sell and probably expire.
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.02.06 23:27:00 -
[28]
Can someone to whom this occurs please take a screenshot of the market for that item? I'll be able to identify from that if this issue is related to Paper Pusher's post from a while back.
MP
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Merchant Lady
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Posted - 2007.02.07 15:25:00 -
[29]
I also have the feeling that there are market bots active. I can't prove ist, but the feeling is there.
It happens too often, that I place orders on several items and when I check them immediately after, all of them have been undercut in the same manner.
But I also think that these are semi-intelligent bots, which have security features for not being detected too fast. When I adjust the above mentioned orders immediately, they are not undercut a second time directly afterwards but an undercut occurs within the next minutes.
What strengthens this feeling, is that I would program a bot exactly the same way. I would tell it to undercut every order immediately but with a security timer.
It's just a feeling..........but it's a baaaad feeling.
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Romeq
Caldari Xenobytes Stain Empire
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Posted - 2007.02.07 15:58:00 -
[30]
usin' google ;( http://embhome.balder.prohosting.com/
nice.... (((
OMGGG!! psyfish-)
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