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Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
97
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Posted - 2016.03.09 22:03:51 -
[181] - Quote
Isaac Armer wrote:Starrakatt wrote:I used to be a merc and do Hisec wardecs, I was a hunter, almost never camped a hub or trade pipe. Specific target hunting (as in contracted targets) can be long and boring, yes. Removal of Watchlist just surmultiplied the dificulties of it. I'd say its pretty much dead as a playstyle.
As for the 'zero risk/95% unprepared' comment... We got hotdropped by a 35 super fleet last week, there was zero risk involved for the hot droppers, yeah.
Nulsec is much of the same most of the time - I was there too.
Pot, kettle, all black.
All playstyles are valid, all playstyles are relevant, not only your's and your opinion. I don't live in nullsec. Sov null is equally risk averse as wardeccers and gankers. LS/WHs are really the only challenging parts of the game, IMO. All playstyles are definitely valid. I never said differently. Wanting risk averse killing like wardeccers do is 100% a valid playstyle, just be honest about why people do it.
As a current HiSec PvE (Resource PvPer) person, while I learn, I can back this up. PvE'ers will not fight back, we just aren't rigged for it. Just because some HiSec, self named 'hunter' says they get bopped every once in a while doesn't mean it's the rule, it's the exception to the rule.
PvE, you have two choices:
If you are in Concord patrolled space, you can try try to hold out with tank long enough to let Concord arrive and solve your problems. You buy the Captain, Commodore and Lieutenants a brewski at the local station and go on about your business. Or you run, either to the nearest gate or friendly dock. GTFO is your response to attack.
If you are in local patrol space, it's pretty much GTFO because the locals don't come to you very well.
By it's very nature, PvP actually favors the attacker, which means PvE ships just have the short end of the stick. So, these folks calling themselves 'hunters' is a little self serving. Occasionally they get their comeuppance but in ratio to what they destroy? I agree with those that say it's a low risk way to operate.
We don't fight back because we don't want to, we just aren't equipped for it and since we are already starting the engagement at a loss, it would be a miracle to win. |
Kamahl Daikun
Back To Basics. Tactical Supremacy
98
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Posted - 2016.03.09 22:04:33 -
[182] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:1) Have to at least have someone in the same system to get said information. WL required nothing except adding a name to a list.
2) You need to be in contact or be yourself a member of said corp/alliance as opposed to adding a bunch of name to a list.
Knowing when someone was online or not was half the battle for anyone who used the WL since you knew if it was worth looking for him or not, hunting him or not, hiding from him or not, ... Saying it didn't provide any details is denying the truth. If it didn't provide anything of use, people would not ***** about it going away.
You're misunderstanding, again. Having someone in the same system is giving you more information than WL. Here, let me break it down for you:
Scout in system: 1) You know if they're online 2) You know which system they're in 3) Infinitely easier access to finding out where in system they are 4) What they're flying 5) etc
Watchlist: 1) They're online
The only argument for supporting the removal of the watchlist seems to be "hurr free intel durr" and yet, I don't see any of you petitioning for the removal of local. It's definitely discussed but I see no formal effort to have the change pushed through. In reality, the WL offered people a means of not wasting their damn time by hunting or hiding from someone that may not even be there.
Tyberius Franklin wrote: 1) A number of people already support this 2) Corp chat is the same as watchlist now. It's a mutual association that both the corp and it's members consent to with an obvious counter: Leave the corp. 3) So what else gives you intel on someone for nothing more than knowing their character name aside from info intended to be public and they can't opt out of?
I'm going to just boil this down to: "Someone knows I'm online, my gameplay is ruined. Of the vast universe that comprises Eve, this information is all a person needs to know everything about me and this is effectively ruining my gameplay experience."
Not gonna lie, I find this ridiculous. Such an outspoken group that was never outspoken before this change was announced. |
Altamont Flashback
Peanut MnMS
6
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Posted - 2016.03.09 22:23:31 -
[183] - Quote
Droidster wrote:I think the main issue here is not really the watch lists, it's that EVE is already too pvp centric as it is and the watch list thing is disturbing the balance even more.
I have a friend that just joined and he is basically terrified all the time and telling me how its "not fun". I try explaining to him that nobody is going to bother to blow up his newbie ship, but it doesn't help. This guy is not a "carebear". He always plays PVP in other games.
Most of the ship destruction in the game is in empire which is not the way it is supposed to be.
If the pvp balance were less extreme, I think people would be concerned about the watchlist issue a lot less, but as things are the let's-kill-every-autopilot and wardec every single 3-player corp in EVE mentality is driving people away from the game. Its at the point where there are more wolves than there are elk.
pvp centric? Easy: We just need karma... Eve could check the behaviour of each pilot and adjust things like skilltime etc... Just an idea.
Watchlist or not... I used to delete ppl after 1 month from watchlist and 1 day later I was shot down by them lol
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1953
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Posted - 2016.03.09 22:29:26 -
[184] - Quote
Kamahl Daikun wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote: 1) A number of people already support this 2) Corp chat is the same as watchlist now. It's a mutual association that both the corp and it's members consent to with an obvious counter: Leave the corp. 3) So what else gives you intel on someone for nothing more than knowing their character name aside from info intended to be public and they can't opt out of?
I'm going to just boil this down to: "Someone knows I'm online, my gameplay is ruined. Of the vast universe that comprises Eve, this information is all a person needs to know everything about me and this is effectively ruining my gameplay experience." You're of course welcome to dismiss it in any way you like, I can't and won't try to stop you from being completely wrong, but I'll gladly continue asking why you think things that other supporters of this mechanic are telling you obviously aren't true (it's only useful for supercap hunting). Further you're suggesting making watchlist consensual somehow means other consensual forms of intel need removed? How does that make sense?
Kamahl Daikun wrote:Not gonna lie, I find this ridiculous. Such an outspoken group that was never outspoken before this change was announced. I too find your reasoning ridiculous, it has nothing to do with being outspoken and everything to do with calling out hyperbolic BS.
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Kamahl Daikun
Back To Basics. Tactical Supremacy
99
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Posted - 2016.03.09 23:19:48 -
[185] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:You're of course welcome to dismiss it in any way you like, I can't and won't try to stop you from being completely wrong, but I'll gladly continue asking why you think things that other supporters of this mechanic are telling you obviously aren't true (it's only useful for supercap hunting). Further you're suggesting making watchlist consensual somehow means other consensual forms of intel need removed? How does that make sense?
The amount of unfounded arguments are baffling. I never said it was only useful for supers. I said it's a very prominent use of the feature. I never suggested making in consensual.
Are you done making **** up or should I just pack my bags and move on from you?
Tyberius Franklin wrote:I too find your reasoning ridiculous, it has nothing to do with being outspoken and everything to do with calling out hyperbolic BS.
Your reasoning: I dislike this feature because it's free intel. However, I am in no way making advancements for the cause of removing other sources of free intel that I'm suddenly passionate about.
My reasoning: It's an integral part of PvP. Straight up removing it with nothing else to pad the wound is bad design. It's a pretty important part of intel gathering. Unless you expect us to sub a dozen accounts and make daily rounds through the entire ******* universe to see if someone's online. |
Norrin Ellis
Venture Racing
318
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Posted - 2016.03.09 23:23:05 -
[186] - Quote
The watchlist was very useful for me when banking poker games for EOH. I kept the high stakes heads-up players on the watchlist. If someone came looking for a game, I could easily see who was online that was likely to accept the challenge and contact them accordingly.
This was one of EVE's best social features. Now it's essentially useless.
In a community that typically mocks people until they quit whenever someone raises a concern about nonconsentual interaction, I'm shocked that people must now consent for others to simply know they're online.
CEO, Venture Racing
Manager, EVE Online Hold'Em
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1953
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Posted - 2016.03.09 23:38:15 -
[187] - Quote
Kamahl Daikun wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote:You're of course welcome to dismiss it in any way you like, I can't and won't try to stop you from being completely wrong, but I'll gladly continue asking why you think things that other supporters of this mechanic are telling you obviously aren't true (it's only useful for supercap hunting). Further you're suggesting making watchlist consensual somehow means other consensual forms of intel need removed? How does that make sense? The amount of unfounded arguments are baffling. I know right? That's why I'm asking you about your baffling argumentsI never said it was only useful for supers. I said it's a very prominent use of the feature. I guess the term "only useful for" as appeared in the statement "As someone mentioned earlier, it's only useful for super pilots since they log off in their ship and typically never leave it." by you doesn't actually mean what it typically means? Maybe I wasn't supposed to take that as it was written, but I don't think I can be faulted for doing so.I never suggested making in consensual. Never said you did, I said you implied a different form of consensual intel be removed, specifically corp chat, and that it was logically consistent with this change, which it's not since it changes watchlist to a consensual form of intel strongly implying there is nothing wrong with those.Are you done making **** up or should I just pack my bags and move on from you? That's the question I have for you, see below:
Kamahl Daikun wrote:Your reasoning: I dislike this feature That's the part you're getting wrong. I never stated a dislike for the current, former or future state of the watchlist. I just found your statements bizarre.
Kamahl Daikun wrote:My reasoning: It's an integral part of PvP. Straight up removing it with nothing else to pad the wound is bad design. It's a pretty important part of intel gathering. Unless you expect us to sub a dozen accounts and make daily rounds through the entire ******* universe to see if someone's online. That conflicts with your prior statements minimizing it's effectivemess. That's what's confusing and inconsistent and what I was pointing out amongst other things.
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3663
|
Posted - 2016.03.10 01:31:22 -
[188] - Quote
So I just checked my various alts, and I have a total of ten killrights among them. Yes, these killrights were wanted. It gives me something to do when wars are slow.
Here's the problem: I now have no practical means by which to hunt down these people. I can run locates on them, but without the ability to know when these individuals are online, it's going to require me to post an alt in the system they logged out in, and THEN I have to be present when they log back in and undock to know whether they've left system or logged out.
This is why I tried to propose that watch lists be considered consensual in the case of war or killrights. because this is a HUGE stealth nerf to killrights.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3663
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Posted - 2016.03.10 01:36:17 -
[189] - Quote
Kamahl Daikun wrote:bad design This sums it up nicely. no thought was put into this. it's not even implemented properly.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Calvari Sertan
Patriarch Of Destruction Fidelas Constans
0
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Posted - 2016.03.10 02:00:36 -
[190] - Quote
Mr Mieyli wrote:People have been asking for watch lists to be removed for aaaaaaaaages, now CCP are actually doing it people are upset.
No, watch lists being removed won't actually hurt you. Instead the "threat" that the scary-bad-man has logged in somewhere in the cluster will be hidden from you. If he's close enough to hurt you, you'll see him in local anyway and at that point you can be worried, before that point just be prepared. Your free intel is disappearing as it should, next up nullsec local chat changes.
What if that scary-bad-man is now using the whatchlist changes, to log out and back in, in belts. Tell me how that is reasonable towards me that he can use log out and log in as part of there pvp technique. At least the whatchlist took that part of the game away. |
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
14649
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Posted - 2016.03.10 02:05:57 -
[191] - Quote
Calvari Sertan wrote:At least the whatchlist took that part of the game away. no it didnt., you would spot the new guy trying it out for the first time but anyone who knows how to actually do one will set it up before you login, or the night before the plan to spring it, hell we have waited days to spring one.
Better the Devil you know.
=]|[=
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Gavascon
need more power inc. Murder By Numbers Alliance
2
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Posted - 2016.03.10 06:45:31 -
[192] - Quote
a very long time ago ship spinning was removed from the game. a short time later, an apology letter was sent to everyone by the CEO of CCP and ship spinning was returned.
same is going to be true with watch lists. this new "change" is for the birds and needs to be undone. |
Ni Neith
Hedion University Amarr Empire
15
|
Posted - 2016.03.10 08:45:51 -
[193] - Quote
Norrin Ellis wrote:The watchlist was very useful for me when banking poker games for EOH. I kept the high stakes heads-up players on the watchlist. If someone came looking for a game, I could easily see who was online that was likely to accept the challenge and contact them accordingly If that is the problem. CCP can probably make the list like a messenger: you have the option to turn your status to online, offline etc. |
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
356
|
Posted - 2016.03.10 08:56:58 -
[194] - Quote
Norrin Ellis wrote:The watchlist was very useful for me when banking poker games for EOH. I kept the high stakes heads-up players on the watchlist. If someone came looking for a game, I could easily see who was online that was likely to accept the challenge and contact them accordingly.
This was one of EVE's best social features. Now it's essentially useless.
In a community that typically mocks people until they quit whenever someone raises a concern about nonconsentual interaction, I'm shocked that people must now consent for others to simply know they're online.
i call BS, how hard it is for your high roller customers to add you up as well, lol?
Just Add Water
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Kuetlzelcoatl
31
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Posted - 2016.03.10 09:41:50 -
[195] - Quote
It is amazing how far players will go to try and keep a crutch they are used to.
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Inopedes
Jove Enterprises
0
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Posted - 2016.03.10 10:02:14 -
[196] - Quote
I can understand the reasoning behind the watch list being changed however it needs to balanced against something else.
We have locator agents for a reason. If watch lists have to go increase the usability of watch lists.
1. Remove the wait time to reuse them. 2. Increase the information they give to include if they are active currently (online)
That way it is not free intel for everyone there will be a cost.
I have seen and heard people say the new system is more realistic. You are playing internet spaceships!
There are more pressing and unbalanced issues in eve than the watch list in my opinion. The ease and regularity of ganking for example. Odd that watch lists would be the priority.
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Icarius
The Wings of Maak
30
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Posted - 2016.03.10 10:08:15 -
[197] - Quote
I tried to "play" with the new WL rules
In fact, now, it is better to use a google spreadsheet and complete remove wl
when a target just leave your system and if you want to locate her later, you have to remember the exact name. Of course you can add her in the contact list. I have 800 targets in my contact list, so fun to search inside that crappy ui
Now, instead of hunting, i spent my time sorting targets name and checking activity on zkillboard ... what a great game At least yesterday i could have a break, i had to check all my broken fitting because of little cpu change, ... really ccp, you think it s fun?
What we have done to you? |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
1102
|
Posted - 2016.03.10 11:07:53 -
[198] - Quote
Oh those long pages about wardecs.
Now there's one more incentive to actually dec for objective and one less incentive to dec just so that you can shoot random people for next to no good reason. Boo hoo.
Instead of complaining about watchlists, you'd better ask CCP to provide more of said objectives and better incentives to actually deploy those vulnerable objectives in space. Carrots, sticks and all that jazz.
If you have spent a few last weeks watching more than just watchlists blinking red and green, you already know that CCP are planning to pressure traders and other station service users (including explorers, miners, industrialists, corp holders and anyone else who use services and markets, so just about everyone) into citadels instead of stations, and that may be just the beginning. I don't see a problem doing that with hisec PvE'rs and whoever else live there.
Services there are supposed to be better, and citadels themselves are supposed to be income source for owners. Those are objectives and targets. And if what we know about them is anything to go by, properly setup citadel is supposed to have potential to be lethal to anyone who thinks it will be funny to grind it AFK. They are also larger investments than POS, and in order to be more useful they rely more on other folks knowing that owner won't just abandon it at first scare, so people may just as well decide to actively defend them.
I hope you understand what I'm getting to.
And who knows, maybe EVE will enter its third decade with such currently unheard of thing as internet spaceship violence that actually f*cking means something.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
356
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Posted - 2016.03.10 12:45:29 -
[199] - Quote
Icarius wrote: What we have done to you?
for staying in hisec.
Just Add Water
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3666
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Posted - 2016.03.10 13:55:41 -
[200] - Quote
Kuetlzelcoatl wrote:It is amazing how far players will go to try and keep a crutch they are used to.
I'd remind you of that whenever CCP removes a years-old tool that enabled an entire gameplay style that you enjoyed, but I doubt I'll remember to do so.
I've already adapted and am preparing to take a new approach to how I choose my targets. The rest will do the same. But we've raised some very important points about how the watch list was used that CCP didn't seem to consider in this decision. I'm especially disappointed that I no have zero tools in game to determine whether a person I have killrights against is a viable target. I now have to spam locates and push scout alts all over the place just to find out if they're even active. It's a huge unintentional nerf to bounty hunting.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Rapscallion Jones
Omnibus Solutions
85
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Posted - 2016.03.10 15:13:08 -
[201] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
I will have exactly zero chances to learn when/if old friends are back to the game.
EXACTLY THIS!
I've never particularly cared about war target tracking, EVE is a big place. If the enemy happens to locate me so be it, it is Everyone Vs Everyone after all! |
Kamahl Daikun
Back To Basics. Tactical Supremacy
100
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Posted - 2016.03.10 15:24:58 -
[202] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:That's the question I have for you, see below:
Bit of important details lost in the lack of context you have there. It's useful for super pilots because you know if they're online, where they are, what they're flying, which alliance to look out for, etc. It's comparatively less useful for others since it only shows if they're online and doesn't give you any more information than that. Although less useful, it's still incredibly important.
Tyberius Franklin wrote:That's the part you're getting wrong. I never stated a dislike for the current, former or future state of the watchlist. I just found your statements bizarre.
So you're arguing for a removal of a source of free intel because you're not against free intel. Neat.
Tyberius Franklin wrote:That conflicts with your prior statements minimizing it's effectivemess. That's what's confusing and inconsistent and what I was pointing out amongst other things.
I never said anything about minimizing its effectiveness. Not sure where you're getting that from. |
Joia Crenca
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
271
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Posted - 2016.03.10 16:25:49 -
[203] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Kuetlzelcoatl wrote:It is amazing how far players will go to try and keep a crutch they are used to. I'd remind you of that whenever CCP removes a years-old tool that enabled an entire gameplay style that you enjoyed, but I doubt I'll remember to do so. I've already adapted and am preparing to take a new approach to how I choose my targets. The rest will do the same. But we've raised some very important points about how the watch list was used that CCP didn't seem to consider in this decision. I'm especially disappointed that I no have zero tools in game to determine whether a person I have killrights against is a viable target. I now have to spam locates and push scout alts all over the place just to find out if they're even active. It's a huge unintentional nerf to bounty hunting.
Did anyone ask the CSM to bring this up? I noticed that CCP is asking people to participate in the elections, so perhaps they'll actually look for player feedback and include the CSM in decisions. |
Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
98
|
Posted - 2016.03.10 16:40:36 -
[204] - Quote
Joia Crenca wrote:FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Kuetlzelcoatl wrote:It is amazing how far players will go to try and keep a crutch they are used to. I'd remind you of that whenever CCP removes a years-old tool that enabled an entire gameplay style that you enjoyed, but I doubt I'll remember to do so. I've already adapted and am preparing to take a new approach to how I choose my targets. The rest will do the same. But we've raised some very important points about how the watch list was used that CCP didn't seem to consider in this decision. I'm especially disappointed that I no have zero tools in game to determine whether a person I have killrights against is a viable target. I now have to spam locates and push scout alts all over the place just to find out if they're even active. It's a huge unintentional nerf to bounty hunting. Did anyone ask the CSM to bring this up? I noticed that CCP is asking people to participate in the elections, so perhaps they'll actually look for player feedback and include the CSM in decisions.
Not sure it's an unintentional nerf at all.
Without being a fly on the wall in the meetings they have to discuss these things, we'll never know what their full intent was.
What I can say in my limited experience with EVE and CCP is that, like most programmers, they are somewhat schizophrenic in nature. They seem to have their internal factions, their pet projects, and blame storming... like about every other corporate/government entity I've dealt with. So you have to see the nature of the beast of the software (EVE) and how it interacts with the nature of the beast of the development company (CCP). They aren't the same and don't interact the same. Even CCP is constrained by their own creation and its player base. A good change management system is key to trying to minimize the issues caused by their internal corporate reality.
So if removing the watchlist ends up being vastly unpopular after a given time of playing without it, they will probably reconsider the move or change it to something else entirely (the latter is commonly done to save face). CCP has faced player wrath before and will continue to do so.
Personally, I think third party tools or mechanisms might be able to be created to handle this loss, but it might take some creative work with CREST or something to make it happen. How that would look/work I'm not entirely certain, but if a real life PI/BH love site like Spokeo can pull together public information on real people and give reasonably accurate pictures of them, it's probably possible with the CREST data process inside of EVE. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1953
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Posted - 2016.03.10 21:16:32 -
[205] - Quote
Kamahl Daikun wrote:Bit of important details lost in the lack of context you have there. It's useful for super pilots because you know if they're online, where they are, what they're flying, which alliance to look out for, etc. It's comparatively less useful for others since it only shows if they're online and doesn't give you any more information than that. Although less useful, it's still incredibly important. The context was someone stating it was intel that was useful enough to not be given for free, and you made a statement with the full intent to counter that assertion. That WAS the context and doesn't make the dismissal any better. Really it only makes it worse considering your later claims of it's usefulness for hunting individual targets even without telling you what they're flying because it tells you if it's even worthwhile to try to find that out.
But you already know that and have posted as much, which is why your earlier dismissal seemed odd.
Kamahl Daikun wrote:So you're arguing for a removal of a source of free intel Again wrong. Where have I ever argued for it's removal?
Kamahl Daikun wrote:I never said anything about minimizing its effectiveness. Not sure where you're getting that from. I quoted where you did so I'm not sure how you're stating you didn't. |
Kuetlzelcoatl
31
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Posted - 2016.03.10 21:58:35 -
[206] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Kuetlzelcoatl wrote:It is amazing how far players will go to try and keep a crutch they are used to. I'd remind you of that whenever CCP removes a years-old tool that enabled an entire gameplay style that you enjoyed, but I doubt I'll remember to do so. I've already adapted and am preparing to take a new approach to how I choose my targets. The rest will do the same. But we've raised some very important points about how the watch list was used that CCP didn't seem to consider in this decision. I'm especially disappointed that I no have zero tools in game to determine whether a person I have killrights against is a viable target. I now have to spam locates and push scout alts all over the place just to find out if they're even active. It's a huge unintentional nerf to bounty hunting.
I use custom chat channels to keep in touch with those who I want to, kind of like a "common friends" channel.
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3673
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Posted - 2016.03.11 01:55:57 -
[207] - Quote
Kuetlzelcoatl wrote:I use custom chat channels to keep in touch with those who I want to, kind of like a "common friends" channel. Good for you. Most of us do that. i'm in several such channels, operated by friends in various parts of the Eve community. that doesn't help bounty hunting and killright execution AT ALL. It also doesn't aid in reconnecting with old friends who might be returning on a different computer or reinstalled client, where they don't automatically rejoin their old channels.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Garwill
DRRUSSEL
19
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Posted - 2016.03.11 08:52:58 -
[208] - Quote
Why was this major change practically hidden under 'Miscellaneous changes' in the patch notes?
Why was there no blog months ago (or ever) discussing it and asking for feedback as there is for all major changes?
This is/was used by everyone in the game, not just the subset you seem to feel the need to pander to CCP.
Yes, there are ways to get the same information, long time-consuming BORING and WORK-LIKE ways.
Thought games were supposed to be fun, not a second job. Maybe that is why Eve never drew truly large numbers and appears to be fading more every year.
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3673
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Posted - 2016.03.11 12:01:54 -
[209] - Quote
Garwill wrote:Why was this major change practically hidden under 'Miscellaneous changes' in the patch notes?
Why was there no blog months ago (or ever) discussing it and asking for feedback as there is for all major changes?
Because they thought this was a little thing that everyone would get behind.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Umbari Kado
Vox Majori
12
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Posted - 2016.03.11 12:09:15 -
[210] - Quote
Very few things pisses me off more than political correctness. And pandering to the wishes of minorities can certainly be classified as such. The whole concept of multiplayer online games is INTERACTING WITH OTHER PLAYERS. And - all of a sudden - pups up the "privacy" issue. People who start playing a game like EVE - lo and behold - want privacy. OK, privacy is a good thing...but what does it have to do with having your online status known ?!
Are we all crazy now ???
Watchlist was good to see whether my enemies are online (this would make me a bit more careful), or whether my friends are online (so I could chat with them immediately) - and as far as I am concerned, this was the main use of watchlist for most people.
The current implementation of buddy list doesn't work - or, if it works - it sucks. I can see a guy next to me in space - and his status is "offline"... He has me blue, I have him blue - but we are both "offline" to each other.
I guess this provides us all with heaps of privacy...and makes the game more of a job than fun it should be. I thought I was in Eve for the long run - but I am reconsidering.
Simply - political correctness is not my kettle of fish.
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