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Murkar Omaristos
The Alabaster Albatross Sev3rance
237
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Posted - 2016.03.19 18:05:03 -
[1] - Quote
One of the ship classes not covered by factions is the carrier. There is of course the revenant, a sansha supercarrier, but nothing in between that and the nightmare.
In line with the coming changes to fighter mechanics (which after testing on sisi, I think will make carriers a lot more fun to fly), it would be super cool to have a Sansha carrier to bridge the gap between the Nightmare and the Revenant - which would both add content for PVEers who run incursions (from which the PBCs would presumably drop), and add a cool new ship to the game to go with all the new fighter mechanics that are being introduced.
HP + Fitting: - Same resist profile as the revenant, but base HP roughly equivalent to the Chimera (this is consistent with the Sansha theme, since the revenant has more base shield HP than armor, like a wyvern but with slightly different resists) - 5 High Slots, 7 mids, 5 lows
Role Bonuses: +25% Damage Bonus to all Fighters +30% Bonus to afterburner and microwarp drive velocity (this is in line with the Sansha role bonuses and the release of new capital sized prop modules - but since Sig Radius bloom from MWDs means nothing on an enormous ship, the bonus would apply to MWDs as well instead of just afterburners)
Blueprint copies would drop from hisec and lowsec incursions, with a drop frequency which would put the price point including build cost around 2.5-3 bil. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4313
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Posted - 2016.03.19 21:46:50 -
[2] - Quote
Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed. |
Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
93
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Posted - 2016.03.20 02:06:50 -
[3] - Quote
You're looking for the Revenant, the BPC for which seems to have been left out of the drop tables.
Or maybe it's in one of those never-before-found exploration sites.
A signature :o
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Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 11:30:09 -
[4] - Quote
Shallanna Yassavi wrote:You're looking for the Revenant, the BPC for which seems to have been left out of the drop tables.
Or maybe it's in one of those never-before-found exploration sites.
He said his was to fill the gap of the missing carrier. Revanents are super carriers.
I think it would be worth it for CCP to invest time in faction capitals. Start adding carriers and dreads anyway, maybe supers later.
Sepentis and Angels can get dreads, Guistas a carrier, Sisters and Mordus carriers. |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 11:31:04 -
[5] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed.
Why. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4313
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Posted - 2016.03.20 11:52:41 -
[6] - Quote
Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed. Why.
Because the best ISK making potential should not occur in the safest space. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
1714
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Posted - 2016.03.20 13:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
No new capitals roll we see how the rebalance goes off the carriers are any indication is going well there's not much that up by introducing faction capitals just yet
Citadel worm hole tax
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
1125
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Posted - 2016.03.20 13:09:16 -
[8] - Quote
If anything it should be a Gurista one. With only two drones to rule them all (heavy fighter Geckos). Muahhahahahaha
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 14:05:07 -
[9] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed. Why. Because the best ISK making potential should not occur in the safest space.
Why. |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 14:05:56 -
[10] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:No new capitals roll we see how the rebalance goes off the carriers are any indication is going well there's not much that up by introducing faction capitals just yet
Okay, that's fair enough. But, after that it could happen. |
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4313
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Posted - 2016.03.20 15:12:02 -
[11] - Quote
Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec? |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 15:48:35 -
[12] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec?
What? |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4313
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Posted - 2016.03.20 16:04:04 -
[13] - Quote
Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec? What?
Risk vs reward.
There is no risk in a highsec incursion, yet that is where you get one of if not the best rewards. Why is that good. |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.20 17:02:17 -
[14] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec? What? Risk vs reward. There is no risk in a highsec incursion, yet that is where you get one of if not the best rewards. Why is that good.
What? |
Lucy Callagan
V0LTA WE FORM V0LTA
134
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Posted - 2016.03.20 17:06:46 -
[15] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed. Why. Because the best ISK making potential should not occur in the safest space.
A goon saying that. Lol
Frugu.net
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Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.21 00:06:47 -
[16] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec? What? Risk vs reward. There is no risk in a highsec incursion, yet that is where you get one of if not the best rewards. Why is that good.
I'm just giving you $hit. I know what you're saying and it's a valid point, but incursions aren't a risk free enterprise. The rats are tougher but can be over come easily enough. You need enough of a support fleet to run the sites or else it's pointless. You can be subject to ninja looters, awox'ers (is that spelled right?). I'm mean as far as high sec goes it's not a walk in the park for an occupation. |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2016.03.21 00:13:03 -
[17] - Quote
Back to the point of faction capitals, I don't think it should be a priority, but I think it's a logical addition to the ship line ups and that at some point more need to be added.
How and where can be figured out later. I would say null sec drops would be a logical location though. |
Murkar Omaristos
The Alabaster Albatross Sev3rance
239
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Posted - 2016.03.21 00:57:04 -
[18] - Quote
I agree with the risk vs. reward and nerfing hisec incursions. However incursions are broken because of the LP payout scale, not because of the rare drops. That's a separate issue and doesn't pertain to this thread other than to derail it. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1891
|
Posted - 2016.03.21 07:12:35 -
[19] - Quote
I want a Dark Blood dreadnaught that can fit 3 capital sized neuts and no guns. I would play havoc on the capacitors of capital ships. The trade off would be that it would do no HP damage and everyone would know why it's on the field as soon as it lands. |
Arya Ikahrus
47
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Posted - 2016.03.21 10:04:44 -
[20] - Quote
Would prefer a Sansha dreadnought myself, I'm picturing a spikey Naglfar with lasers and a stupid afterburner bonus. |
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2700
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Posted - 2016.03.21 13:04:07 -
[21] - Quote
Murkar Omaristos wrote:I agree with the risk vs. reward and nerfing hisec incursions. However incursions are broken because of the LP payout scale, not because of the rare drops. That's a separate issue and doesn't pertain to this thread other than to derail it.
Except adding the potential carrier BPC proposed here to HS loot table would boost the income since the super BPC can't drop in HS right now. Even if it's super rare, the potential is still there so the income ratio goes up. |
Ghaustyl Kathix
Quantum Singularities Half Massed
82
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Posted - 2016.03.21 14:16:20 -
[22] - Quote
While in general I like the idea for faction capitals (This faction has a dreadnought, this other faction has a supercarrier, this other faction has a carrier, etc.), it's kind of pointless right now.
What does the Revenant do? Why would someone want to field it besides it being so shiny? What would a Serpentis dreadnought do that the Moros, Naglfar and etc. wouldn't do? They should find specific roles for these ships before they start adding. |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
88
|
Posted - 2016.03.22 13:49:25 -
[23] - Quote
Ghaustyl Kathix wrote:While in general I like the idea for faction capitals (This faction has a dreadnought, this other faction has a supercarrier, this other faction has a carrier, etc.), it's kind of pointless right now.
What does the Revenant do? Why would someone want to field it besides it being so shiny? What would a Serpentis dreadnought do that the Moros, Naglfar and etc. wouldn't do? They should find specific roles for these ships before they start adding.
Also a fair point.
These ships could follow the regular bonus patterns of the faction subcaps, but not in every circumstance can that be effectively achieved. Still I think those are good starting points. These kinds of capital ships should have dedicated roles.
I think balancing drop rates and productions cost will need to be a important factor too. They need to be costly enough to make their employment something to be heavily deliberated on, but also they shouldn't be so rare that only a hand full of players have them.
The fact so few Revanents exist is mostly why they become such big targets when they are spotted. Faction ships shouldn't be collectors items, they need to be utilized, but they also shouldn't water down the pool and have similar if not redundant roles. |
Asuka Solo
Instant Annihilation Affirmative.
3013
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Posted - 2016.03.22 14:56:46 -
[24] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:
Why.
You first. Why should the whole risk vs reward thing be completely upset by totally safe isk firehoses in highsec? What? Risk vs reward. There is no risk in a highsec incursion, yet that is where you get one of if not the best rewards. Why is that good.
1) There is no "totally safe" place in eve. If you believe there is a disturbance in the force (read risk vrs reward) then maybe take some of your totally safe moongoo profits and dec all the incursion communities? Or wont Mittens stand for more drainage on his funds? Maybe start another book deal to finance the campaign?
2) Incursions are hardly safe, try soloing them. If groups of players manage to figure out how to farm PvE content in hisec the same way you farm moons behind your blob, then maybe we should consider the risk vs reward of your favorite playground before we start throwing stones in glass houses?
3) If you still feel your views are "faultless", then what are you doing to make hisec less safe? Are you and your broskies actively trying to disrupt hi-sec incursions gameplay you find so alien and wrong?
No?
Cry some more?
Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
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Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
831
|
Posted - 2016.03.23 06:10:24 -
[25] - Quote
what is so special about Sansha that you want to give them 2 carriers in the line? |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
88
|
Posted - 2016.03.23 11:04:48 -
[26] - Quote
Tiddle Jr wrote:what is so special about Sansha that you want to give them 2 carriers in the line?
The OP said it was illogical for there to be a gap between battleship and supercarrier, so add a carrier to fill it. We then discussed that all factions in general MAY possibly benefit from there own capitals. Also, then discussion followed that faction capitals would need specific roles and be introduced with care to prevent watering down the pool of other empire caps. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
1107
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Posted - 2016.03.23 13:50:39 -
[27] - Quote
A reminder that Sansha ships, in fact, are not bonused for MWDs, only for ABs, and that BS bonus is up from 20% to 30% (unlike the rest of the line), so there's that.
I'm totally for faction capitals, and I think that it won't be that hard to come up with a selling point for them because capitals have more functions than subcaps which aren't yet played with by devs, as well as potential for slight revisions of traditional line bonuses applied to capitals still being there.
Significant siege cycle duration + stront consumption reductions for Angels dread? "Vampiric" Blood Raiders FAX (those dudes do love their flying cathedrals anyway)?
Something along those lines.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Murkar Omaristos
The Alabaster Albatross Sev3rance
240
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Posted - 2016.03.23 17:12:52 -
[28] - Quote
Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Tiddle Jr wrote:what is so special about Sansha that you want to give them 2 carriers in the line? The OP said it was illogical for there to be a gap between battleship and supercarrier, so add a carrier to fill it.
^^ This exactly. Also - it's consistent with the Sansha role and lore.
Just to be clear, I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to it being another faction, that would be reasonable - I'm not saying we shouldn't have a faction dreadnought or anything, but that's not really the focus of this proposal. This goes nicely with the new fighter mechanics; while dreads are being rebalanced, the new guns don't really add a whole new fun mechanic in the same way the carrier mechanics do (and if you haven't already, you should go try the new fighter mechanics out on SISI, it's hilariously fun).
Also, since Sansha already has a supercarrier, it makes sense to have a standard carrier to bridge that gap between the nightmare and the revenant and fits with the role Sansha has had thus far. It just seems like it would fit right in there really nicely; whereas if they were going to add an SOE ship, for example, I'd say it should be a black ops or a cloaky hauler - something to fall in line with the SOE role bonuses and lore. If they were going to add a new Serpentis ship, I'd be more inclined for it to be a web/blaster bonused battlecruiser or something. Etc etc.
As someone pointed out above, I also agree that it should definitely not cost an absurd amount like the revenant does so that they actually get used as a practical combat ship rather than just a shiny.
I'm also not opposed to the idea of a faction dreadnought, but as I mentioned - the dread changes don't have the same feel of "new content" as the fighter mechanics, which actually add seriously new gameplay mechanics (while the dread changes are really just a massive nerf to blap dreads, since the high-DPS guns can no longer his small targets and the high angle guns have basically the DPS of a vindicator). |
Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces
326
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Posted - 2016.03.23 17:30:07 -
[29] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hisec incursion income should be nerfed into the ground, not buffed. Why. Because the best ISK making potential should not occur in the safest space.
usual goons
the incursions pay more in low and null sec and drop the super BUT the runners will not do anything to risk their ships even if 40 1k+ dps ships could slaughter 1 guy coming to use a KR they will not have you run.
they have so many "safeties" they use and because they only do 1 thing day in and day out, you are an idiot if you do anything or even witness. Gankers will never gank a travel fit--->seen travel fit vindis ganked, not believed
and in for the post, anything faction to be used in low and null like a faction capital would only be killed by blues like the revenant. and the only reason why its so rare is it takes running null sec incursions for it to drop
"Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
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Ghaustyl Kathix
Quantum Singularities Half Massed
82
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Posted - 2016.03.23 18:07:09 -
[30] - Quote
Murkar Omaristos wrote:Elyia Suze Nagala wrote:The OP said it was illogical for there to be a gap between battleship and supercarrier, so add a carrier to fill it. ^^ This exactly. Also - it's consistent with the Sansha role and lore. It's actually not consistent with Sansha lore. The only reason they have a supercarrier in the first place is it's the smallest class of ship they could design that could fit their wormhole generator that they use to start the incursion.
Agondray wrote:the only reason why its so rare is it takes running null sec incursions for it to drop Only drops in low-sec, actually, if I recall correctly. Null-sec incursions are actually run because they want to get rid of the cyno-jam in incursion constellations. I think if it dropped in null, it'd get more common and the price would drop. |
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