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Madrax573
No.1 Crazy Fighter Squadron
38
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Posted - 2016.04.13 22:32:45 -
[61] - Quote
Isn't character name just a string variable in the character database? Every character has a character number.....
which is used for everything pertaining to that character. Searches/Contracts/market traded/eve mails etc There is literally nothing easier to change than a character name in the eve database.
Give that the character name isn't the thing reference for anything then the only reason NOT to allow it to be changed is the stubbornness of CCP or players to think that the name actually 'means' something.
Lets face it if 'consequences' is used as the argument for not being able to change it but you still see the entire history of the character then surely the onus is then upon the corp/alliance to do their background checks on the character and get explanations to any anomalies they find.
It's pretty crazy to think in a world where you are immortal, can change your knowledge in almost an instant not to mention redesign pretty much your entire body that changing a name would be commonplace.
Spewing Fire - my blog
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Kenrailae
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
549
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Posted - 2016.04.14 05:30:57 -
[62] - Quote
well.... I have to contend that slightly:
https://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1501016
Here is my argument. ^
We place value on the name because the name is what we identify with. We don't identify with your serial string. That is the value of names, and the effect of consequence.
The Law is a point of View
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Madrax573
No.1 Crazy Fighter Squadron
38
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Posted - 2016.04.14 09:37:25 -
[63] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:well.... I have to contend that slightly: https://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1501016 Here is my argument. ^ We place value on the name because the name is what we identify with. We don't identify with your serial string. That is the value of names, and the effect of consequence.
Yeah we value names because ultimately the average player is lazy. At the end of the day the name of the character is only a cosmetic thing. And has no real value when the entire history of the character can be traced with very little effort.
And tbh if you get awoxxed then it is you that have failed and can't blame it on 'name changes'
Really this is such a minor thing that people get wound up over.
It's also totally immersion breaking considering you can change everything about yourself but your name has to stay the same?! Hell if I wanted to I could go and change my name for a little bit of cash and checks why would It be even easier in a galaxy where you can actually own the majority of it??
Spewing Fire - my blog
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DeODokktor
Dark Templars The Fonz Presidium
63
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Posted - 2016.07.04 16:54:06 -
[64] - Quote
I think a name change should be possible. No more than once every two years and it should cost 2 plex. I also think they should allow a Sex change too, no more than once and it should cost 4 plex. I think they should also allow you to buy bonus neural remaps, perhaps 2,000 aur for that item.
Here is the thing. Even if you change your name, your character ID will remain the same. Some characters who have managed to get name changes in the past found they were easily tracked. Much like some scammers and resellers got caught by having the exact same itemid on hand.
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elitatwo
Eve Minions O.U.Z.O. Alliance
1288
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Posted - 2016.07.04 20:33:29 -
[65] - Quote
M...m...must change name to Gertrude Kunklesteen just because
Now say that three times in a row on comms in a heated fight. I say no.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
13361
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Posted - 2016.07.05 08:16:58 -
[66] - Quote
Yes. Panta rhei.
I give you ( -á° -ƒ-û -í°)/ Boarding bays Gÿá
Every part of a game helps to tell a story. =ƒôò
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Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
792
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Posted - 2016.07.05 11:41:51 -
[67] - Quote
No.
Why? The simple answer is that people need to live with the consequences that sticks to their name. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
3277
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Posted - 2016.07.05 11:51:40 -
[68] - Quote
I wanna change my name to Lan's Wang so +1 for me
FETID now recruiting pvp pilots & corporations | lowsec pvp & piracy - Join FETID
Loyalist to Angel Cartel & Serpentis
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slumbers
State War Academy Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2016.07.05 12:17:31 -
[69] - Quote
Unless it doesn' cause database issues and there is a way to link the new name to previous alias so that it doesn't wipe the slate clean, a one-off allowance to change a name wouldn't be a terribad idea, you can change avatars clothes and skills, name is just another attribute. Or allow a 1-off name change once a character gets sold, new owner, new name. The database Kykeon this will cause is an obvious problem, but im sure ccp can work it out...maybe. |
Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
13375
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Posted - 2016.07.05 12:56:04 -
[70] - Quote
Celthric Kanerian wrote:No.
Why? The simple answer is that people need to live with the consequences that sticks to their name. Already he rolled an alt.
I give you ( -á° -ƒ-û -í°)/ Boarding bays Gÿá
Every part of a game helps to tell a story. =ƒôò
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Raging Bull Unchained
Signal Lost
1592
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Posted - 2016.07.05 13:11:46 -
[71] - Quote
No because your actions matters.
Like: Stealing 100b then renaming for 1? nah... |
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
167
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Posted - 2016.07.05 14:57:46 -
[72] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:M...m...must change name to Gertrude Kunklesteen just because Now say that three times in a row on comms in a heated fight. I say no.
Gerti...
See. Easy. :)
I've been a very big proponent of paid naming changes in EvE for ages, as long as a few limitations were met.
- The change needs to be documented and easily available in game and in an API report.
- Changing a name is purely cosmetic... it doesn't reset any standings, rankings, positions, notes, etc.
- It isn't free.... there should be a minor but memorable consequence for a minor yet memorable thing: Plex or Arum are the best vehicles for this change IMO.
Other limitations I'm not too fond of. Personally, I believe that if someone wants to waste the cash in trying to hide behind a list of name changes, then more power to them. It might work once. If it does, then that character will be verbed for all of EvE's history (like Awoxing or Ironbanking), but later on people will be more suspect and suspicious. Good! That's EvE!
Some have said that a name change option wouldn't affect gameplay. i think that this is more in the eye of the beholder. This change would enhance game play for the sizable population that is of a more artistic mindset. Yes, this might rankle those that only know how to follow rigid procedures, but it wouldn't actually hinder mechanical game play. For those of us that dip into the yellow spectrum, the hard mechanics aren't the only aspect of 'gameplay'.
Consequences! I've seen this bandied about for far too long. Six years ago, maybe it carried some water. Now, not so much. The character name is the last item that cannot be changed and still retain the same character. Clothes, Resculpts, SKINs, and now even that sacred cow - Skills - can be edited post-creation. That cow was sacrificed last year, along with the 'Consequence' arguement.
Still, I believe that there should be some sort of consequence for changing names, and I see two right out of the gate - Financial and Social. The change shouldn't be free, as stated above. Socially, if someone notices that you've changed your character's name, they're going to start wondering why and inventing scenarios why 'that guy' changed his name... almost always assuming a negative reason.
It's been mentioned by some that there would be an extra step in checking someone's history. Yes, there would be, so what? Assuming that no other changes were made other than just to the name, then a player should first notice the standing (and any notes that you left, right?). Act upon the standing, and when a pause is available, then check the name and history. This is the concept of shoot first and ask questions later -- even if shooting means relocating really, really fast.
Once again, yes this is an extra step, and it might add a tiny amount of time should the pilot be determined to wait for facts rather than act quickly. I say Good! Because, that's meaningful gameplay.
Also, if it causes one pilot to add a few precious seconds to a check (arguably a bad thing), then it gives the other pilot those few seconds in which to act (arguably a good thing). Once again decisions are made at the tactical player lever that could impact the each player's experience (definitely the best thing). Again an example of meaningful gameplay.
+1 for paid name changes
--Gadget
Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist
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Esnaelc Sin'led
The Unchained Club No Handlebars.
84
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Posted - 2016.07.13 12:56:42 -
[73] - Quote
Celthric Kanerian wrote:No.
Why? The simple answer is that people need to live with the consequences that sticks to their name.
Raging Bull Unchained wrote:No because your actions matters.
Like: Stealing 100b then renaming for 1? nah... Those argumetns no longer stand for 2 reasons at least :
1. Each and every part of that game that revolve around "consequences" have been erased. The last one being Skill Training choices. 2. As long as you have no changes with standings, watchlist, history, notes, the "consequences" still exist. You will still be known as "A" that changed his name to "B". And as someone specified that fact, you'll be much more suspected by changing your name than someone evil who has just created a fresh new clone. |
Maria Dragoon
Veilo Six Voxis Accord
113
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Posted - 2016.07.14 01:01:32 -
[74] - Quote
GÇ£What's in a name? that which we call a rose By any other name would smell as sweet.GÇ¥
William Shakespeare.
What in a name? History? Personality trait clues of the player behind that name?
What is a name? The reputation that a person gain from the time they play as that character?
Or maybe a name is what left behind when that character is no longer around?
Currently our names in game is the only real thing that we have left that creates a true legacy for our characters.
People use the excuse that the player will just roll an alt instead, I can't allow that excuse to continue. Just because a player doesn't want to live with the legacy of the character's name, doesn't mean that we should erase the consequence of the name you pick, and the actions tied to that name.
The great thing about this game was the fact that you could create a long lasting impact on not just the game but the people through your character, and your actions through that character.
Plus corps already have enough trust issues as it is, lets not add to the problem.
Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated. Confucius
"A man who talks to people who aren't real is crazy. A man who talks to people who aren't real and writes down what they say is an author."
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Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
204
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Posted - 2016.07.14 12:26:35 -
[75] - Quote
Maria Dragoon wrote: Currently our names in game is the only real thing that we have left that creates a true legacy for our characters.
People use the excuse that the player will just roll an alt instead, I can't allow that excuse to continue. Just because a player doesn't want to live with the legacy of the character's name, doesn't mean that we should erase the consequence of the name you pick, and the actions tied to that name.
The great thing about this game was the fact that you could create a long lasting impact on not just the game but the people through your character, and your actions through that character.
Plus corps already have enough trust issues as it is, lets not add to the problem.
The character and the name are separate things. The character has all the experiences, impacts, and carries the legacy.
Actually, it's the player that should have all these things, but since characters can be traded, that legacy can be bought and worn by someone else.
Creating alts to avoid bad reputations is done. Period. It's not an excuse. If you want to infiltrate a corp, you don't use your actual character that has a beef with said corp. You don't even create an infiltrator toon on that account, because it'll be picked up in a full API check. You go tabula rasa with a new account and have the new character become your main for as long as it takes to do your nefarious deed.
As for creating an long lasting impact... I like to think I've had some impact on the game. Some of that impact will be from ol' gadget, some from my "main", and even more impact from others in my stable of alts.
The impact comes from the PLAYER; The legacy stays with the Character. Neither will be affected by name changing.
As for the corp statement... sour grapes?
--Gadget
Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist
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Sitting Bull Lakota
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
109
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Posted - 2016.07.14 22:04:41 -
[76] - Quote
I don't get the heat. What are you all up in arms about? You can change your face, you can undo months of skill training and remap your character, you can buy your way out of low sec status, you can buy your way into whatever ship you like, you can buy and sell characters to and from other players, and you can strip all of your sp out and start a new character with no corp/kill history already.
In EvE, the choices you make are not permanent, and you can in most cases undo the consequences of your actions. That's the way EvE is now.
Just add name changing and get it over with. |
Esnaelc Sin'led
The Unchained Club No Handlebars.
88
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Posted - 2016.07.16 09:37:42 -
[77] - Quote
@Dragoon.
You obviously know how to read words. Quoting Shakespear is fancy and all. But you could at least read the OP post, and not just read the title......... I'm not Shakespear, but i also know how to write things down ; not in a fancy way though, i'm sorry. |
SASSY
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2016.07.16 22:02:27 -
[78] - Quote
Sitting Bull Lakota wrote:I don't get the heat. What are you all up in arms about? You can change your face, you can undo months of skill training and remap your character, you can buy your way out of low sec status, you can buy your way into whatever ship you like, you can buy and sell characters to and from other players, and you can strip all of your sp out and start a new character with no corp/kill history already.
In EvE, the choices you make are not permanent, and you can in most cases undo the consequences of your actions. That's the way EvE is now.
Just add name changing and get it over with.
1. your Name 2. your Gender 3. your Race
Have always and forever been permanent decisions.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3416
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Posted - 2016.07.16 22:25:13 -
[79] - Quote
People are right when pointing at buying and selling characters and name changes as similar. However buying and selling characters was a needed evil to combat gold sellers and account sellers. Now we have skill extractors and injectors the bazaar should actually be removed so that you can't assume someone else's identity. Since its too easy to do that in an online environment. That or people are amazing a database of people's RL identities and information just to try and prevent awoxing. Which is a slightly excessive level needed, even for eve.
Short version. Don't add name changes, remove the bazaar instead. |
SASSY
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2016.07.16 22:44:18 -
[80] - Quote
I agree with removal of the character bazaar now with injectors extractors availability.
To prevent identity swaps.
Note to the self haters : the tools are available
1. transfer your items 2. tear out your skills 3. biomass 4. rebuild yourself a new 5. make good choices
better yet just love yourself and your name.
Being reborn with new identity for no effort is screaming entitlement.
The easy road and the trashing of tradition and history. |
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slumbers
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.07.17 05:23:52 -
[81] - Quote
The same way you have an employment history per character, you should have an alias history. With a remap once per year, or 5 or 10... If you buy a character and you get to re-sculpture it, you should at least rename it. And wiping the killboard slate clean every now and then isnt really bad :D.
The only problem I see is the database issue, a new table per character to hold extra information. If that isn't a problem for CCP, I dont think it will impact the game negatively. Onomatology is a very important thing. I don't see why you shouldn't at least have 1 attempt to revamp your character. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3417
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Posted - 2016.07.17 12:23:21 -
[82] - Quote
slumbers wrote:The same way you have an employment history per character, you should have an alias history. With a remap once per year, or 5 or 10... If you buy a character and you get to re-sculpture it, you should at least rename it. And wiping the killboard slate clean every now and then isnt really bad :D.
The only problem I see is the database issue, a new table per character to hold extra information. If that isn't a problem for CCP, I dont think it will impact the game negatively. Onomatology is a very important thing. I don't see why you shouldn't at least have 1 attempt to revamp your character. Because local does not show you said alias history, and seeing who is in local with you right now is a very important tool. When people change corp they generally leave the old Red/Blue list behind and pick up the new corps. the same is not true about a name. |
slumbers
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.07.17 13:38:08 -
[83] - Quote
They will add a tab for it and new alias will be linked to old alias killboard. Its not difficult to implement, question is whether CCP wants to bother with it. It would be nice to have that option. There would be a mechanism set in place to make sure it will not be abused.
I mean they touched the holiest of holies, Skillpoints, I don't see why name would be such a big issue. I don't mind people trading Skill points, I don't even mind people trading Loyalty points. Changing a name or regretting onomastics employed 5 years ago to create a character, shouldnt cause concern, unless its a DBase issue. |
Esnaelc Sin'led
The Unchained Club No Handlebars.
88
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Posted - 2016.07.17 22:02:51 -
[84] - Quote
SASSY wrote:I agree with removal of the character bazaar now with injectors extractors availability.
To prevent identity swaps.
Note to the self haters : the tools are available
1. transfer your items 2. tear out your skills 3. biomass 4. rebuild yourself a new 5. make good choices
better yet just love yourself and your name.
Being reborn with new identity for no effort is screaming entitlement.
The easy road and the trashing of tradition and history.
0. a) farm X amount of ISK depending of your SP amount. 0. b) spend X amount of RLM depending of your SP amount. 1. transfer your items 2. tear out your skills 3. biomass 4. rebuild yourself a new 5. make good choices
Fixed it for you.
Can you give me 150b so i can do that please ? Or you may also transfer 3k Euros/Dollars in my bank account ? Is that possible ?
#norich.
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Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS X
568
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Posted - 2016.07.18 06:33:47 -
[85] - Quote
Your name is a major part of who you are and a key component of how others will choose to interact with you, even one name change will seriously compromise someones responsibility for their actions, so NO!
Yawn,-á I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
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slumbers
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.07.18 07:14:33 -
[86] - Quote
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:Your name is a major part of who you are and a key component of how others will choose to interact with you, even one name change will seriously compromise someones responsibility for their actions, so NO!
Your name is merely a semantic, not who you are. People have a name/surname, but when they go into art they choose an artistic alias under which they publish literature or act. They are what they are because of what they do, not because of a name.
The very same way a character gets a remap annually, you could add a timer once per 3 or 5 years. or allow a character name change once a character gets transferred, since plex is necessary to do that.
How others chose to interact with you, also had to do with skills, A high skill recruit with supers would get different treatment than a low skill newer player.
The list of pros and cons for name change can go on indefinitely. It has to do with perception. I perceive name as another attribute a player can change, like new titles people get when they join other corporations. Titles are nicknames they have earned, or deserved :) So yes to name change, but with some limitations to it. You can even go with a once per decade limitation if you want, but not forbid it. Putting a stop sign on everything will not help. Unless its a technical issue that has to do with the server, and historical data can follow the character, I don't see a reason why not allow it. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3392
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Posted - 2016.07.18 10:49:22 -
[87] - Quote
Add my no to this. Identifying people by name is important in eve, where as the only practical reason to change your name is to avoid being identified.
Not liking your name or having a typo in your name (lol wat?) doesn't justify breaking down the the games primary form of identification. And an 'alias list' is too cumbersome to compensate.
I mean christ. If you had a typo in your name why didn't you biomass your char when it was still new and had nothing to lose?
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
3308
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Posted - 2016.07.18 12:34:01 -
[88] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Add my no to this. Identifying people by name is important in eve, where as the only practical reason to change your name is to avoid being identified.
Not liking your name or having a typo in your name (lol wat?) doesn't justify breaking down the the games primary form of identification. And an 'alias list' is too cumbersome to compensate.
I mean christ. If you had a typo in your name why didn't you biomass your char when it was still new and had nothing to lose?
who really cares now, set them red as a contact and thats enough to know if you should shoot him or not
FETID now recruiting pvp pilots & corporations | lowsec pvp & piracy - Join FETID
Loyalist to Angel Cartel & Serpentis
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Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
217
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Posted - 2016.07.18 15:09:12 -
[89] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote: Add my no to this. Identifying people by name is important in eve, where as the only practical reason to change your name is to avoid being identified.
I logged on last night to join over 32,000 people also logged on. I also hang out in the English Help channel (under one guise or another) and attempt to help out... and sometimes snark about within reason.
I recognize maybe 15 or so souls on a nightly basis. The others are just EvE mooks. No offense to other players is meant, but they're extras in the movie that is Gadget's EvE Playtime. Those with noticeable roles are remembered, those without are forgotten.
The extra's names mean little to me, because I can never remember them unless they're part of the main cast.
However, since I also like to move products in EvE, keeping track of self-identified pirates, gankers, and other ne'er-do-wells increases the chances of my shipments making it to their destinations intact.
Since I'm never going to remember the names of every person in game, and a piece of paper (or spreadsheet) with every person I've ever met tends to get ridiculous, I just assign a contact status - along with a note - to the individual. That status stays even if the individual changes corps, makes his or her sec status to +5, or whatever. I believe that the status even stays should the character be sold on the market (need to test that one).
This is what I use to determine someone's identity... not the name for the most part.
I also mark friends and pilots that were cool to work with in the past. Sometimes these people come back online after a year or more break. The notes help when the name doesn't ring a bell.
Quote: Not liking your name or having a typo in your name (lol wat?) doesn't justify breaking down the the games primary form of identification. And an 'alias list' is too cumbersome to compensate.
I mean christ. If you had a typo in your name why didn't you biomass your char when it was still new and had nothing to lose?
The game's primary form of identifying others is a combination of contact status, sec status, corporation/alliance history with individual name coming in way late. That is, until that individual pilot becomes part of your main cast.
Checking the name change history ...actually I like "alias list"... should generally be supplemental to contact status when dealing with the extras in your personal movie. You or your corp/alliance set the status, so act upon that. Do the research legwork after the shooting (or running) has stopped. If someone gets blapped because you didn't recognize their name... that's on them. That is, unless you were ignoring a previously set contact status.
The player's primary form of identifying their own character(s) is by name, and that is totally on an individual basis.
I've been gaming in general for a bit over 30 years in many different types of games. I've observed many different play styles. Some players don't care about the toon's name at all and opt for the random name generator. Some players take forever in choosing the perfect name for their avatar. Most people are somewhere in between. All of these types play EvE. None of these types are playing EvE wrong.
Name changing will be used for many different reasons. Type-o's would probably be the least used. Most changes would likely come from people that were bored with their persona. "Mining Ted" hasn't mined in 10 years, but is tired of explaining the name to his friends and/or enemies. While many play EvE as WoT in Space, and could care less about things like characters or RP, some enjoy that aspect of EvE...which is still an MMORPG. To each their own.
Yes, some will try to pull the wool over the eyes of some players with paid name changes should they ever be implemented. However, if a name change policy were implemented smartly, then while this behavior might catch a few inattentive/lazy players off guard, most would act accordingly. Just like everything else in EvE.
--Gadget
Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist
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Esnaelc Sin'led
The Unchained Club No Handlebars.
88
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Posted - 2016.07.18 18:26:52 -
[90] - Quote
Thanks Gadget .
@ Daichi Yamato & Maldiro Selkurk
Same as the two answers above. Plus : i've taken time to list a series of compensations, would've been kind from you to read them and comment them, instead of only reading the title.
As far as "typo" is concerned, i hope you believe that's an example among a lot other ones. The reasons why a player would change his name are many : Activities / History IG and IRL / Roleplay / Alt became Main or viceversa / etc.... Reducing this act only to correct a typing mistake is not opening yourself to the whole picture. Same if you're reducing this act only to suspect a spy or someone willing to "erase" a dirty history. That can't happen if all the thing i've listed are implemented.
As far as "consequences" ar concerned, a limitation in time can limit that, even though i think that puting notes and standing should be your primary thing before even trying to memorise the character name.. And in my proposal, Standings / Notes / Contact won't be affected by a name change. If [Super Vilain] changed his name to [Carebear] and you had no standings nore notes on him, you would be caught one single time, before you realise that [Carebear] is in fact a super vilain... If you had standings AND notes on that toon, that one single time would've never happened. |
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