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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Dominous Nolen
We're Happy In Wormhole Space
183
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Posted - 2016.04.28 17:24:39 -
[181] - Quote
[Redacted]
@dominousnolen
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Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
1622
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Posted - 2016.04.28 17:44:35 -
[182] - Quote
Eh.... stuff was said.
Yaay!!!!
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graves1091
Deathwish Squad The-Culture
1
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Posted - 2016.04.28 18:53:31 -
[183] - Quote
Despite repeated explanations, the devs who proposed these changes simply haven't played the game in w space or don't understand the time/risk/reward aspect of wormholes. First off, yes the current escalation system is broken, can be solod in dreads or bombers often by only a few people. Often what happens is pve groups close off the static wh preventing anybody from coming in, and insulating their caps from danger. This is the real problem, essentially the reward to risk ratio is very high, and it becomes easy and repetitive to make billions. However, the new system wipes out ANY incentive for anybody to bring caps into a wormhole, probe out and collapse wormholes to protect them, commit several characters and billions of isk, for what reward?
Let's just break this down for a second here. It takes approximately 10 billion minimum in caps and mods for a full escalation fleet. Let's say there are 5 sites in the system, about average for a c5.
You run 5 sites in say, 3 hours. In 3 hours, that night, you will make 2 billion total just running the escalation waves and killing the drifters. You split the 2 billion among 3 people, netting you 650m. Okay, thats not too bad. Let's assume, since the blog is kind of ambiguous, that you can run the escalations the next day. So you still have 5 sites, but GUESS WHAT? That really cool drifter thing they added, DOESNT SPAWN the next day. So basically you can run the scalations again, all 5 sites, for a whopping 500m. whooooooo.
I don't trust CCP's mechanic of adding new sites to wh space, I just have a hunch feeling that the system isnt perfect and at most i will end up with about 6 sites to run at a time. It just simply isn't worth the time, investment, or commitment it takes to move characters into a wormhole with billions in ships just tied up capital barely returning investment now. I could triple box incursions and have a steady income stream and make the same isk in 3 hours without committing my characters to unknown space. |
Valorex1
Darkness Consumed The Devils' Rejects
50
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Posted - 2016.04.29 00:05:07 -
[184] - Quote
Just killed our first one. It took quite awhile to kill it prob 5-10 mins. We didn't use any capitals just sub caps. We had to use 4x guardians to keep the subcaps hardners on. Insta capped out every cycle. Not a lot of dps out but a lot of hp. No dd was ever fired by the drifter. 300m in blue loot dropped. I had a 15 man fleet on grid t3's damnation and devoter. It accelerated to 1kms before we landed scrams and focus point. It still died very slowly with 15 1k dps proteus on grid. |
Jessie McPewpew
U2EZ
5
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Posted - 2016.04.29 01:58:43 -
[185] - Quote
Valorex1 wrote:Just killed our first one. It took quite awhile to kill it prob 5-10 mins. We didn't use any capitals just sub caps. We had to use 4x guardians to keep the subcaps hardners on. Insta capped out every cycle. Not a lot of dps out but a lot of hp. No dd was ever fired by the drifter. 300m in blue loot dropped. I had a 15 man fleet on grid t3's damnation and devoter. It accelerated to 1kms before we landed scrams and focus point. It still died very slowly with 15 1k dps proteus on grid. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. GOOD JOB CCP. |
graves1091
Deathwish Squad The-Culture
1
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Posted - 2016.04.29 07:03:34 -
[186] - Quote
Yeah wormholes are ******, as per CCP plan |
Valyn Horn
Boys in Plaid
12
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Posted - 2016.04.30 02:02:31 -
[187] - Quote
We played around with the sites a bit. Two garrisons in our C5. Neither site spawned the escalation wave for our Minokawa. So we got the Dread wave, and the Carrier wave, but no Force Aux wave.
Also, the drifter structure disappeared after 10-15 min or so, while we had eyes on it. I don't know if that's by design or not, but didn't see any mention of a timer on that.
I also don't like how the escalation waves accomplish the full application of damage by bypassing game mechanics. We shot them for full damage with our phoenix, which has an explosion velocity of ~80 m/s and the escalation ships travel around ~300 m/s. So the understood missile damage calculation seems to be bypassed for these ships.
If that's the case, I kinda think that's dumb. If the ships are designed to be fully applied damage, make them behave as they OUGHT to behave. Make them slow, so they obey the known math of the game. Don't just add hidden multipliers and workarounds on random ships, I feel like thats the wrong way to go. |
Rex Tarezi
Kordos Vanguard
0
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Posted - 2016.04.30 05:45:43 -
[188] - Quote
Status update on the viability of d-scan and combat scan? I just had one warp off and cannot seem to find him in system. |
Merena Enderas
Raiders of the Space Brotherhood Of Silent Space
4213
|
Posted - 2016.04.30 09:05:59 -
[189] - Quote
Solo Dread is still possible but i think only with naglfar because of the 2 weapons.
o/
Youtube Wormhole Stuff
Ingame Channel: Spacetwix
Wir rekrutieren! C5 Wurmlochcorp
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Braxus Deninard
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
573
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Posted - 2016.04.30 09:07:43 -
[190] - Quote
graves1091 wrote:Despite repeated explanations, the devs who proposed these changes simply haven't played the game in w space or don't understand the time/risk/reward aspect of wormholes. First off, yes the current escalation system is broken, can be solod in dreads or bombers often by only a few people. Often what happens is pve groups close off the static wh preventing anybody from coming in, and insulating their caps from danger. This is the real problem, essentially the reward to risk ratio is very high, and it becomes easy and repetitive to make billions. However, the new system wipes out ANY incentive for anybody to bring caps into a wormhole, probe out and collapse wormholes to protect them, commit several characters and billions of isk, for what reward?
Let's just break this down for a second here. It takes approximately 10 billion minimum in caps and mods for a full escalation fleet. Let's say there are 5 sites in the system, about average for a c5.
You run 5 sites in say, 3 hours. In 3 hours, that night, you will make 2 billion total just running the escalation waves and killing the drifters. You split the 2 billion among 3 people, netting you 650m. Okay, thats not too bad. Let's assume, since the blog is kind of ambiguous, that you can run the escalations the next day. So you still have 5 sites, but GUESS WHAT? That really cool drifter thing they added, DOESNT SPAWN the next day. So basically you can run the scalations again, all 5 sites, for a whopping 500m. whooooooo.
I don't trust CCP's mechanic of adding new sites to wh space, I just have a hunch feeling that the system isnt perfect and at most i will end up with about 6 sites to run at a time. It just simply isn't worth the time, investment, or commitment it takes to move characters into a wormhole with billions in ships just tied up capital barely returning investment now. I could triple box incursions and have a steady income stream and make the same isk in 3 hours without committing my characters to unknown space.
are you mad because you died to easily killable sleepers with horribly fit caps in povar's personal farm lmao, i logged on and saw your corpses it was pretty great, in fact your mtu is still up, should come scoop your loot
ps these are still easily farmable by a solo dread with some out of the box thinking |
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Maria Madeveda
Space Pioneers Odin's Call
0
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Posted - 2016.04.30 14:51:23 -
[191] - Quote
Valyn Horn wrote:We played around with the sites a bit. Two garrisons in our C5. Neither site spawned the escalation wave for our Minokawa. So we got the Dread wave, and the Carrier wave, but no Force Aux wave.
Also, the drifter structure disappeared after 10-15 min or so, while we had eyes on it. I don't know if that's by design or not, but didn't see any mention of a timer on that.
I also don't like how the escalation waves accomplish the full application of damage by bypassing game mechanics. We shot them for full damage with our phoenix, which has an explosion velocity of ~80 m/s and the escalation ships travel around ~300 m/s. So the understood missile damage calculation seems to be bypassed for these ships.
If that's the case, I kinda think that's dumb. If the ships are designed to be fully applied damage, make them behave as they OUGHT to behave. Make them slow, so they obey the known math of the game. Don't just add hidden multipliers and workarounds on random ships, I feel like thats the wrong way to go.
Just for your info, the formula for missile damage doesn't include explosion velocity vs target velocity only (see : http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_Damage#Analysis_of_the_Equation) but also the signature and explosion radius, so it is very well possible to apply full damage with a lower exposion velocity than target velocity. You begin to apply less damage if v(target) >= signature * (v(explosion)/explosion radius). |
Valyn Horn
Boys in Plaid
14
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Posted - 2016.05.01 00:50:25 -
[192] - Quote
Maria Madeveda wrote:Valyn Horn wrote:We played around with the sites a bit. Two garrisons in our C5. Neither site spawned the escalation wave for our Minokawa. So we got the Dread wave, and the Carrier wave, but no Force Aux wave.
Also, the drifter structure disappeared after 10-15 min or so, while we had eyes on it. I don't know if that's by design or not, but didn't see any mention of a timer on that.
I also don't like how the escalation waves accomplish the full application of damage by bypassing game mechanics. We shot them for full damage with our phoenix, which has an explosion velocity of ~80 m/s and the escalation ships travel around ~300 m/s. So the understood missile damage calculation seems to be bypassed for these ships.
If that's the case, I kinda think that's dumb. If the ships are designed to be fully applied damage, make them behave as they OUGHT to behave. Make them slow, so they obey the known math of the game. Don't just add hidden multipliers and workarounds on random ships, I feel like thats the wrong way to go. Just for your info, the formula for missile damage doesn't include explosion velocity vs target velocity only (see : http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_Damage#Analysis_of_the_Equation) but also the signature and explosion radius, so it is very well possible to apply full damage with a lower exposion velocity than target velocity. You begin to apply less damage if v(target) >= signature * (v(explosion)/explosion radius).
Right you are, I didn't account for the fact that sig radius is still part of the explosion velocity part of the equation, my mistake. |
MD74
Mass Collapse Ember Sands
36
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Posted - 2016.05.01 17:36:58 -
[193] - Quote
So many sweet tears |
Luft Reich
Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies.
139
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Posted - 2016.05.02 15:25:01 -
[194] - Quote
Braxus Deninard wrote:graves1091 wrote:Despite repeated explanations, the devs who proposed these changes simply haven't played the game in w space or don't understand the time/risk/reward aspect of wormholes. First off, yes the current escalation system is broken, can be solod in dreads or bombers often by only a few people. Often what happens is pve groups close off the static wh preventing anybody from coming in, and insulating their caps from danger. This is the real problem, essentially the reward to risk ratio is very high, and it becomes easy and repetitive to make billions. However, the new system wipes out ANY incentive for anybody to bring caps into a wormhole, probe out and collapse wormholes to protect them, commit several characters and billions of isk, for what reward?
Let's just break this down for a second here. It takes approximately 10 billion minimum in caps and mods for a full escalation fleet. Let's say there are 5 sites in the system, about average for a c5.
You run 5 sites in say, 3 hours. In 3 hours, that night, you will make 2 billion total just running the escalation waves and killing the drifters. You split the 2 billion among 3 people, netting you 650m. Okay, thats not too bad. Let's assume, since the blog is kind of ambiguous, that you can run the escalations the next day. So you still have 5 sites, but GUESS WHAT? That really cool drifter thing they added, DOESNT SPAWN the next day. So basically you can run the scalations again, all 5 sites, for a whopping 500m. whooooooo.
I don't trust CCP's mechanic of adding new sites to wh space, I just have a hunch feeling that the system isnt perfect and at most i will end up with about 6 sites to run at a time. It just simply isn't worth the time, investment, or commitment it takes to move characters into a wormhole with billions in ships just tied up capital barely returning investment now. I could triple box incursions and have a steady income stream and make the same isk in 3 hours without committing my characters to unknown space. are you mad because you died to easily killable sleepers with horribly fit caps in povar's personal farm lmao, i logged on and saw your corpses it was pretty great, in fact your mtu is still up, should come scoop your loot ps these are still easily farmable by a solo dread with some out of the box thinking
Spitting fire. These sites are hella easy.
ISD Cyberdyne liked your forum post
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Carrion Crow
Dropship
27
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Posted - 2016.05.03 02:41:29 -
[195] - Quote
Is this mysterious cloaking box meant to have any lore/storyline meaning?
It seems particularly contrived that a box de-cloaks and a drifter pops out.
I have to say the actual drifter NPC is entertaining as hell.
One warped off and we found it attacking a closing Hic on our static.
I think they make great pets! we might keep a few around for lols.
+1 CCP for the latest new fun wormhole accessories ;) |
Valyn Horn
Boys in Plaid
17
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Posted - 2016.05.05 02:22:46 -
[196] - Quote
Carrion Crow wrote:Is this mysterious cloaking box meant to have any lore/storyline meaning?
It seems particularly contrived that a box de-cloaks and a drifter pops out.
I have to say the actual drifter NPC is entertaining as hell.
One warped off and we found it attacking a closing Hic on our static.
I think they make great pets! we might keep a few around for lols.
+1 CCP for the latest new fun wormhole accessories ;)
Really? I thought they didnt know how to find wormholes. |
FeistyOne
13. Enigma Project
9
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Posted - 2016.05.06 17:33:19 -
[197] - Quote
Valyn Horn wrote: Really? I thought they didnt know how to find wormholes.
Can Confirm, found my first one camping a low sec exit i was using. He waited there around 30 minutes before moving on.
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Catelyn Stoneheart
Snuff Box Snuffed Out
10
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Posted - 2016.05.07 18:53:36 -
[198] - Quote
Hi CCP-
I stayed positive on the wh escalation changes and we have had great success running these with 3 dreads + 1 archon. They are pretty fun and have payouts that make it worth the risk/effort involved with running them.
Now, the new mechanic means that the sites don't stick around past downtime. That's fine and all, but would you kindly consider making the data/relic sites also spawn the drifter boss? It would sure be nice to be able to run the data/relic sites with the drifter boss as well. They just ain't worth running without him.
Please Please Please???? |
Luft Reich
Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies.
139
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Posted - 2016.05.08 22:12:06 -
[199] - Quote
Catelyn Stoneheart wrote:Hi CCP-
I stayed positive on the wh escalation changes and we have had great success running these with 3 dreads + 1 archon. They are pretty fun and have payouts that make it worth the risk/effort involved with running them.
Now, the new mechanic means that the sites don't stick around past downtime. That's fine and all, but would you kindly consider making the data/relic sites also spawn the drifter boss? It would sure be nice to be able to run the data/relic sites with the drifter boss as well. They just ain't worth running without him.
Please Please Please????
Yes
ISD Cyberdyne liked your forum post
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Jonesith
Bros Before Holes The Devils' Rejects
1
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Posted - 2016.05.10 19:17:14 -
[200] - Quote
Does anyone know off-hand if the drifter will warp to combat anomalies or relic/data sites? The only times we have encountered them has been by pure chance when they are sitting on a connecting hole. Occasionally we follow them to planets but it is unclear whether or not the will go to combat anoms/sigs. |
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Fairfax Narmolaya
Grupa Operacyjna ZLY CHUJI
1
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Posted - 2016.05.17 12:33:09 -
[201] - Quote
Hi there,
After killing 2nd drifter during a farm, 16 drifters landed at hole we came from.. http://prntscr.com/b4vuej
For safety, we didnt continued farm (subcapital fleet). After about 10 mins, drifters warped off into unknown space. I did try to combat probe them, but no results.
My question is - I saw them on the overview/grid, but never on dscan. Also couldnt probe them later on. Is that allright? How we gonna check before start farming if unleashed drifters are in the system and our fleet is safe? :P
And another question - will they disappear afer a while? Cause I cant see any solution to take them down without a loss :P
Regards, Fairfax Narmolaya |
Nox52
Pterygopalatine
99
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 06:59:40 -
[202] - Quote
bahahha that's just ******! |
Anthar Thebess
1521
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 07:04:48 -
[203] - Quote
Fairfax Narmolaya wrote:Hi there, After killing 2nd drifter during a farm, 16 drifters landed at hole we came from.. http://prntscr.com/b4vuej For safety, we didnt continued farm (subcapital fleet). After about 10 mins, drifters warped off into unknown space. I did try to combat probe them, but no results. My question is - I saw them on the overview/grid, but never on dscan. Also couldnt probe them later on. Is that allright? How we gonna check before start farming if unleashed drifters are in the system and our fleet is safe? :P And another question - will they disappear afer a while? Cause I cant see any solution to take them down without a loss :P Regards, Fairfax Narmolaya This is amazing. WTB similar thing for nullsec anoms.
Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists
Show your support to The Cause!
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AlStorm Prime
Hotline K162 The Clown Car
2
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Posted - 2016.05.27 12:29:17 -
[204] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:
The new Drifter is worth about 350m, mostly in blue loot but including salvage as well. 300m in loot + some salvage. I never got 350 on Tranquility, but once got 150m in salvage on SiSi =\
CCP Fozzie wrote:
This new Drifter is completely independent of the site, and will warp off if not pointed. Our current design gives it 3 points of warp core strength, but that is open to change. The Drifter warps of if there is no target to engage. Or if he has ~20% of armor left and is not tackled. Also, I've been told that it's possible to tackle a Drifter with mobile warp disruptor.
CCP Fozzie wrote: Once it has left the site that spawned it, the Drifter can live in the system for many days, warping between celestial locations just like a normal Drifter. It is not removed by downtimes.
I would say - Drifters can live in system for months,or even longer, by forming fleet of 10+ size. Such fleet keeps warping between planets and wormholes. (A few times I've seen Drifters on the bookmarks for WH that were recently closed)
CCP Fozzie wrote:
We intend the Drifter to be probable with combat scanner probes, as well as visible on d-scan. Full disclosure: we've run into some technical roadblocks with the probing and d-scan part of the feature. We are confident that we can get it working and there's a good chance that it can be ready for the initial expansion release, but it's possible that it might slip to a point release. Is not implemented on Tranquility so far.
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Multiple Drifters can co-exist in the same wormhole system and will come to each other's aid if one gets attacked. In practice they always fly together and don't come into sites when a new Drifter is born and is under attack. It will be a flood of tears if you will fix this before fixing the Drifters lifetime and probe-ability. p.s. I reached the maximum amount of allowed quotes
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ISD Gallifreyan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
353
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Posted - 2016.05.31 02:35:58 -
[205] - Quote
AlStorm Prime wrote: p.s. I reached the maximum amount of allowed quotes
This is by Design to prevent Pyramid Quoting
Quote:14. Pyramid quoting is prohibited.
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. This kind of posting often distorts the layout of the forums and can cause issues with readability for some users.
Since you are quoting the Same previous poster each time you may continue.
ISD Gallifreyan
Lt. Commander
Community Communication Liaisons (CCL)
Interstellar Services Department
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Troubled Basterd
Island Life Capitalist Bastards Chained Reactions
8
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Posted - 2016.05.31 21:43:12 -
[206] - Quote
I cant seem to find aan stats/numerical data on Arithmos Tyrannos. Is it possible to find that info somewhere?
I like to check http://games.chruker.dk/ to EFT warrior a good ship/fit for killing him.
It takes a long time for 10k dps to take him down. But how much bloody HP does it have :P
Thanks,
TB |
Willi Walzwerk
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2016.06.14 22:20:44 -
[207] - Quote
Hello CCP, hello guys,
I have a question about the site respawning algorythm in wormhole space.
I live in a C5 wormhole and we really farmed our sites whenever we could. The point is, I dont really think your respawning system for the sites works, because its now a week we did not get any new sites like one or two in 6 to 7 days.
Its really frustrating because we really tested and tried to fly the new sites and we are now after many testing and praticing good at it but there is no real respawn. We farmed them, because you write in the devblog, that those sites in wh space will respawn faster, if we get more active and farm more of them. This doesnt work for us right now.
Dont know how the other pilots may have experienced this, this isnt a whine or something, i just want to ask you if there is some issues with the respawning code. I heard from some nullsec guys, that if they actively farm a system, they get a constant respawn of sites. Maybe u can make some adaption or check the code for wh space because we are pretty cut off on any income.
We have this problem now since about 2 weeks, but now its really bad for us because there is really no respwaning and we farm like every site actively.. At the moment we have 1 cosmic anomaly, and this is our static wh.
No whine, just a question.
Greetings Willi |
Hipqo
Tyde8
148
|
Posted - 2016.06.15 03:48:54 -
[208] - Quote
Willi Walzwerk wrote:Hello CCP, hello guys,
I have a question about the site respawning algorythm in wormhole space.
I live in a C5 wormhole and we really farmed our sites whenever we could. The point is, I dont really think your respawning system for the sites works, because its now a week we did not get any new sites like one or two in 6 to 7 days.
Its really frustrating because we really tested and tried to fly the new sites and we are now after many testing and praticing good at it but there is no real respawn. We farmed them, because you write in the devblog, that those sites in wh space will respawn faster, if we get more active and farm more of them. This doesnt work for us right now.
Dont know how the other pilots may have experienced this, this isnt a whine or something, i just want to ask you if there is some issues with the respawning code. I heard from some nullsec guys, that if they actively farm a system, they get a constant respawn of sites. Maybe u can make some adaption or check the code for wh space because we are pretty cut off on any income.
We have this problem now since about 2 weeks, but now its really bad for us because there is really no respwaning and we farm like every site actively.. At the moment we have 1 cosmic anomaly, and this is our static wh.
No whine, just a question.
Greetings Willi
It only works if most people in wormholes farm sites and complete them faster. Site spawns are region controlled, as far as i know. But one of the major points of this update was also to encourage static farming more, so that is what ccp wants you to do. Farm in static when there are no home sites :)
A life is best lived, to not step into your grave in a well preserved body. Instead, to slide in side ways, all battered and bruised, screamming, "Holy SH**! What a ride!"
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Tsukino Stareine
Art Of Explosions 404 Hole Not Found
1517
|
Posted - 2016.06.15 09:49:13 -
[209] - Quote
So can we talk about how this change utterly failed to address the biggest problem with the old escalations?
Aka solo hero dread.
This is still extremely doable and all these changes have done is hurt the people who want/have no other choice to run in groups.
"We want you to farm your static more, so we changed the sites to take 5x longer with a very marginally increased payout"
Like right now it's probably more efficient to clear c5 sites without killing the drifter in a group as small as 3. The weight is completely out of balance.
Actually been doing c3s duo in gilas and it's better money than attempting home sites in capitals: this is just wrong and completely polar opposite of the risk = reward mindset.
We are risking multi-billions on field to run home sites in capitals and making less money than in a c3 with less than 1 billion fielded.
This also has the negative connotation of nobody being able to catch people running sites in capitals, something wormhole entities with high-class statics did as a common activity.
I see where you're trying to go by forcing people to go into their static to farm, this potentially creates more player interaction. However the player interaction you get these days with people who want to farm is yacht clubs and citadel spinning.
If you want meaningful player interaction to form you have to have the risk WORTH taking.
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Jessie McPewpew
U2EZ
19
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Posted - 2016.06.19 11:49:32 -
[210] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:So can we talk about how this change utterly failed to address the biggest problem with the old escalations?
Aka solo hero dread.
This is still extremely doable and all these changes have done is hurt the people who want/have no other choice to run in groups.
I just don't understand the design philosophy anymore honestly. Solo dread is not the issue here. It's CCP taking away 3/4 of what the old sites were worth in order to force people into their statics.
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