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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
82
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Posted - 2016.04.07 11:19:48 -
[1] - Quote
Hey guys,
We've noticed that a bunch of players are trying to go through kill data, especially now during the war. This can be very tedious to scrape and stitch together from the killboards, so we're looking into ways to accommodate. Provided below is a link to all PVP kills made in the period Mar 1 to Apr 4, with the condition that the victim is a player character and the final blow is made by a player character. Keep in mind that the isk lost / destroyed values for supers are lower than the killboard ones since they dont have any market prices behind them for the hulls and some "exotic" modules, only base costs. You will have to adjust for that.
http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/quant/WWB_killdump.zip
I've denormalized the data for you quite extensively, e.g. added solarSystemName, regionName, type names, and so forth. This might not be necessary but it allows people to make analysis on the data as-is without the need to join in other eve datasets. characterIDs are also not included at this point, since we're not comfortable with including them at this point.
If this turns out successful, and only good things come out of this, we are more likely to move into a direction where we can provide kill data in bulk, be it through CSV dumps like this one (e.g. in the monthly economic report data dump) or through CREST.
Happy crunching! |
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woooooooooooo
CLOUD TEMPLE Test Alliance Please Ignore
5
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Posted - 2016.04.07 11:23:20 -
[2] - Quote
Thanks! |
Zappity
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
2812
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Posted - 2016.04.07 11:25:27 -
[3] - Quote
Thank you. It will be interesting to see how accurate the killboards are compared to this. I think the time has come for crest kills.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
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Dreamer Targaryen
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.04.07 12:59:20 -
[4] - Quote
Thank you, especially for already joining the data with names for corps, alliances and systems.
For my fellow analysts: Keep in mind, that the column "victimCoalition" is not an ingame-attribute and as such has to be treated as corrupted data. An example is the following line, which lists "Circle-Of-Two" as a member of "The Imperium" in april, where in reality they left the glorious empire a week prior to that: 98261786,The Clown Shoe Crew,Circle-Of-Two,The Imperium,98343305,Run and Gun Mercenary Corps,FETID,,670,Capsule,Capsule,2016-04-03 03:06:16,30002719,Miroitem,10000032,Sinq Laison,1022826005.05,1022826005.05,204565201.01 |
Anthar Thebess
1488
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Posted - 2016.04.07 13:27:39 -
[5] - Quote
Can we get this kind of information auto-generated at the end of each month? This will save every one server time and bandwidth.
Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists
Show your support to The Cause!
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
86
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Posted - 2016.04.07 13:49:40 -
[6] - Quote
Dreamer Targaryen wrote:Thank you, especially for already joining the data with names for corps, alliances and systems.
For my fellow analysts: Keep in mind, that the column "victimCoalition" is not an ingame-attribute and as such has to be treated as corrupted data. An example is the following line, which lists "Circle-Of-Two" as a member of "The Imperium" in april, where in reality they left the glorious empire a week prior to that: 98261786,The Clown Shoe Crew,Circle-Of-Two,The Imperium,98343305,Run and Gun Mercenary Corps,FETID,,670,Capsule,Capsule,2016-04-03 03:06:16,30002719,Miroitem,10000032,Sinq Laison,1022826005.05,1022826005.05,204565201.01
Good point I forgot to mention, it uses http://rischwa.net/api/coalitions/current to assign coalitions. I might try to get that into our ETL processes so that we can report coalitions more accurately, given that this provider is reliable |
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DiceyQ
Black Omega Security The OSS
1
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Posted - 2016.04.07 17:00:13 -
[7] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Hey guys, We've noticed that a bunch of players are trying to go through kill data, especially now during the war. This can be very tedious to scrape and stitch together from the killboards, so we're looking into ways to accommodate. Provided below is a link to all PVP kills made in the period Mar 1 to Apr 4, with the condition that the victim is a player character and the final blow is made by a player character. Keep in mind that the isk lost / destroyed values for supers are lower than the killboard ones since they dont have any market prices behind them for the hulls and some "exotic" modules, only base costs. You will have to adjust for that. http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/quant/WWB_killdump.zipI've denormalized the data for you quite extensively, e.g. added solarSystemName, regionName, type names, and so forth. This might not be necessary but it allows people to make analysis on the data as-is without the need to join in other eve datasets. characterIDs are also not included at this point, since we're not comfortable with including them at this point. If this turns out successful, and only good things come out of this, we are more likely to move into a direction where we can provide kill data in bulk, be it through CSV dumps like this one (e.g. in the monthly economic report data dump) or through CREST. Happy crunching!
nice, can we have a csv dump of POS mod contents that died beween mar 1 and april 7? |
Zappity
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
2812
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Posted - 2016.04.07 19:27:00 -
[8] - Quote
DiceyQ wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Hey guys, We've noticed that a bunch of players are trying to go through kill data, especially now during the war. This can be very tedious to scrape and stitch together from the killboards, so we're looking into ways to accommodate. Provided below is a link to all PVP kills made in the period Mar 1 to Apr 4, with the condition that the victim is a player character and the final blow is made by a player character. Keep in mind that the isk lost / destroyed values for supers are lower than the killboard ones since they dont have any market prices behind them for the hulls and some "exotic" modules, only base costs. You will have to adjust for that. http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/quant/WWB_killdump.zipI've denormalized the data for you quite extensively, e.g. added solarSystemName, regionName, type names, and so forth. This might not be necessary but it allows people to make analysis on the data as-is without the need to join in other eve datasets. characterIDs are also not included at this point, since we're not comfortable with including them at this point. If this turns out successful, and only good things come out of this, we are more likely to move into a direction where we can provide kill data in bulk, be it through CSV dumps like this one (e.g. in the monthly economic report data dump) or through CREST. Happy crunching! nice, can we have a csv dump of POS mod contents that died between mar 1 and april 7? Didn't you know that they were all empty?
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
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Masao Kurata
Many Much Mechanics
442
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Posted - 2016.04.07 20:02:23 -
[9] - Quote
Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
100
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Posted - 2016.04.07 21:26:42 -
[10] - Quote
Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy.
We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character. |
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Hugh Jorgan
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
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Posted - 2016.04.08 01:02:28 -
[11] - Quote
Thanks, this is awesome! Already used for this: https://pay.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/4du3im/slopes_for_the_slope_throne_isk_lost_in_pvp_per/
Might have to put it in R and see what falls out. |
Stamin Primer
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
4
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Posted - 2016.04.08 01:48:07 -
[12] - Quote
I think this is going to be a fantastic tool going forward, especially during this massive war and the fights around New Eden. It is better than going through battle reports/kill reports which can be tedious to open multiple links. I honestly think that most pilots would be more comfortable not having their character name released in relation to the reports. Thanks for compiling! |
Robbert Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.04.08 02:40:23 -
[13] - Quote
Great stuff. Thanks for posting.
Personally, I think it needs something to identify individual pilots. That way we can tell how many individual pilots are involved. I think it would be very enlightening. The identifying ID needn't be the characterID available from the API, it could just be random and uniquely identifying. Admittedly, you could probably match those IDs up with a public killboard.
But, as CCP Quant mentioned, there are no fits, so people can just suck it up.
On the other hand, I could see a good argument for excluding wormhole systems. |
Masao Kurata
Many Much Mechanics
442
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Posted - 2016.04.08 05:01:45 -
[14] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character.
Okay, that was a knee jerk reaction. Upon actually reviewing the columns included and considering the matter, this level of data is.... mostly fine? It is possible in some cases to trivially get the kill hash from the data (when both the victim and killers are in one or two man corporations), and getting a range of possible kill ids based on the timestamp is easy, providing enough information to query public CREST for the full kill details. I imagine that if one were to run a script over the kills querying on the assumption that a CEO killed a CEO, that alone would yield many killmails previously not pushed to any killboards. |
Masao Kurata
Many Much Mechanics
442
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Posted - 2016.04.08 05:03:29 -
[15] - Quote
Robbert Smith wrote:Personally, I think it needs something to identify individual pilots. That way we can tell how many individual pilots are involved. I think it would be very enlightening. The identifying ID needn't be the characterID available from the API, it could just be random and uniquely identifying. Admittedly, you could probably match those IDs up with a public killboard.
Unfortunately that would actually make getting kill hashes very easy simply by comparing timestamps to published kills to deobfuscate the non-characterid unique identifiers for anyone who has any published kills or losses. |
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
366
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Posted - 2016.04.08 05:06:22 -
[16] - Quote
Very nice. Thank you for the data compilation. Looking forward to seeing if this becomes a normal practice.
Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.
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Rattman
Van Diemen's Demise Pandemic Legion
38
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Posted - 2016.04.08 07:41:06 -
[17] - Quote
No pos mods.
Any reason for that would like to know how many SCAA have died in the north |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
105
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Posted - 2016.04.08 09:01:42 -
[18] - Quote
Masao Kurata wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character. Okay, that was a knee jerk reaction. .
I didn't want to dance around the subject no knee jerk reaction intended! I'm biased here as If this were completely up to me I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands.
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ChromeStriker
Out of Focus Odin's Call
1032
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Posted - 2016.04.08 09:10:03 -
[19] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character. Okay, that was a knee jerk reaction. . I didn't want to dance around the subject no knee jerk reaction intended! I'm biased here as If this were completely up to me I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands.
I would argue the benifits outway the cons... get it up on crest so we can really get our teeth into it... its like your catering to the 0.1% people still running "windows 95" ...
No Worries
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Lokyar Brightmane
EVE University Ivy League
0
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Posted - 2016.04.08 09:27:00 -
[20] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character. Okay, that was a knee jerk reaction. . I didn't want to dance around the subject no knee jerk reaction intended! I'm biased here as If this were completely up to me I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands. As I understand the conversation, he meant that he made a knee jerk reaction and actually thinks it's a good idea, now he's had time to review it further. |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
106
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Posted - 2016.04.08 09:56:09 -
[21] - Quote
Lokyar Brightmane wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Masao Kurata wrote:Excuse me? Some people like to keep certain kills and losses secret, this is a big change in policy. We excluded characterID for that purpose. If that is still giving away too much info we could move(from corporationID as the lowest identifier) up to allianceID, but yeah this sentiment is the reason kills aren't accessible in bulk through CREST. However, one of the biggest arguments for hiding kills has been to hide fitting, these kill logs don't show fitting. Also, it's only PVP kills where a player character kills a player character. Okay, that was a knee jerk reaction. . I didn't want to dance around the subject no knee jerk reaction intended! I'm biased here as If this were completely up to me I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands. As I understand the conversation, he meant that he made a knee jerk reaction and actually thinks it's a good idea, now he's had time to review it further.
Ah, well it's not often that I suffer from not being a native English speaker :) |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
4274
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Posted - 2016.04.08 10:33:13 -
[22] - Quote
God I would love to just open up all killmails... /me dreams
@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co
Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
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Geronimo McVain
McVain's Minning and Exploration Inc
23
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Posted - 2016.04.08 10:36:10 -
[23] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:I'm biased here as If this were completely up to me I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands. I like it this way. IMHO there is no real reason to show the name of the victim in stats. I thinks accurate stats are totally okay but only if you can't catch the individual. And I would really like to have these reports each month. They are also very good business infos as you see which ships people loose so..... |
ChromeStriker
Out of Focus Odin's Call
1033
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Posted - 2016.04.08 11:18:42 -
[24] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:God I would love to just open up all killmails... /me dreams
Do it.... or ask the question at least, make it a discussion with pro's and cons. I dont know the in's and out's of this but i find it hard to think of a non-technical reason why we cant have access to all Pvp kills
I CAN imagine the sweet apps cleaver peeps could makes with graphs and ratios and stats.... ugh that would be sweet
No Worries
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SerratedX
Fistful of Finns Paisti Syndicate
36
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Posted - 2016.04.08 12:31:22 -
[25] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:God I would love to just open up all killmails... /me dreams
DO IT! |
Talon White
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
38
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Posted - 2016.04.08 13:57:26 -
[26] - Quote
Would I be correct in assuming
victimCorp = lost a ship? finalCorp = killed a ship?
If so, one can calculate/rank which corps killed the most over the period?
Red vs Blue - The eternal highsec war
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Robbert Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2016.04.08 14:12:56 -
[27] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:I'd say we open up the killfeed in crest and the 0.1% of pilots who don't want kills shown will just have to suck it up However, and luckily for the 0.1% the decision is not solely in my hands.
What if you did this, but made a very obvious way how to opt out? For example, there could be an option on the character sheet combat log. If you opt out, the data is available, but the victimCharacter is missing.
Obviously there is some development time involved there, but think of the graphs man, the graphs! |
Circumstantial Evidence
277
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Posted - 2016.04.08 15:07:39 -
[28] - Quote
I know some older characters who would like to review their personal kills and losses from the first year that EVE was "online." I'm told the info was first sent in eve-mails, thus the phrase "killmails." But eve-mail limits (compressible text!) storage allowed per character means that old mails are removed to make room for new ones.
Are the first kills and loss mails stored somewhere? Could the personally lost info be retrieved on player request, perhaps by support ticket? |
Masao Kurata
Many Much Mechanics
442
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Posted - 2016.04.08 16:26:31 -
[29] - Quote
So people complain about "free intel" when it's as vague as "this guy's online" but not when it's a complete combat history? |
Eretria Amberle
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2016.04.08 16:48:35 -
[30] - Quote
From what i have read, from this,is that your giving out more info than what is already provided.Yeah,about that.lets see how this has evolved.
Api's
legacy api's? --oh yeah those got updated,outdated,ancient(alot of problems that are still recorded from abuse of information) Battleclinic -who didnt use this? (Now we have a few options for fittings)(Battleclinic you will be missed) Crest API - guess battle clinic and the beta killboard was getting it wrong still .
ok so we have came up to this time and moment where you are wanting to do what?So now there is more info than what is here on zkillboard.I dont see this as being any more useful as eve central,something else you have to look up out of game to get anything useful from it.
just looking at zkillboard,what questions are not really being answered that says hey lets dump more infomation.
from a kill we get,ship type,owner of said ship,attackers ,ship fit ,and what dropped fairly simple.
your not going to be able to answer all of your pvp problems sifting through information that is already there(no way thats impossible).Sounds like to me you need to look at what you did wrong ,if you found more info that is useful,add it to what you got,here your just going to dump info like no oneelse care about their priviacy.Maybe someone is too big headed to realize his orbit was wrong when he lost his ship {cause that can never happen}
you want ships lost per month,just bring it up by searching ship type.
Maybe your baffled cause you went to look up info on someone and couldnt find them cause their using a character born right after the new eden incident so their records are lost.
If your killboard is not collecting killmails so why use it....adding this compile monthly killmail report is just another mess that might be sorted through next year.
i think CCP/Eve needs to look at what its got and build from there,not another killboard site, not another asset because 1% dont care and the other 99 wants info kept with a sense of decentancy(not that it will help)
build something that is going to help new players,(help channels were great).maybe a widget or window that shows recents kills in a small window,or an broadcast that says "There was currently 3 ships and 3 pods destroyed in the last 20 minutes within 5 jumps of this gate" something that gives immediate info that can be used for deciding if they want to go through the gate. or something bigger like a huge cloaking veil that hides like a group of BS 200km off the gate,perhaps limited to distance and angle,so if it is facing towards the gate only ships behind the veil and out to a said distance is "cloaked",till you start flying to the side of it and see said BS sitting there behind the veil.
My thing is really make the game more fun,not more serious,your bringing in more personal info and dropping it for the vultures to feed upon.Perhaps take all Identifiable info and input random variables for it to be recorded to.If i kill a ship with something that normally isnt seen,it is not my problem if they cant figure out how it was done.They dont "need" my ship fittings.CCP can make info avaiable simply by bringing up ships lost .They can also provide info to you safer than this compiled info they are stuck with so they throw the heap at you and tell you to do something with it .I havent really seen any request that was justified to give out personal info.
In my opinion(s),This effort is useless especially if this has led us to to this Crest API. CCP is getting paid(in case you havent looked at plexes and stuff,they have well made bank) to sit,feed you scraps that are half thought of.If you were to go and say hey make a list of ships killed in whatever time period,this is easy for them to do as they have all the info.but it doesnt take away from the fact that there is tools already here for that.
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