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Hades Dark
Perkone Caldari State
28
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Posted - 2016.04.26 21:41:02 -
[1] - Quote
Battlecruisers are the only class that doesnt have pirate faction ships, and there T2 are command ships which no one fly's. Would really like to see pirate factions/ T3 class or another T2 variant for the battlecruisers to come. |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Mercenary Coalition
3021
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Posted - 2016.04.26 21:54:12 -
[2] - Quote
Hades Dark wrote:T2 are command ships which no one flies
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d0cTeR9
Serenity Cartel Rebel Squad
320
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Posted - 2016.04.26 22:04:18 -
[3] - Quote
Hades Dark wrote:Battlecruisers are the only class that doesnt have pirate faction ships, and there T2 are command ships which no one fly's. Would really like to see pirate factions/ T3 class or another T2 variant for the battlecruisers to come.
Tell that to the fleets who are composed of mostly command ships... Yepp... 30-50 (sometimes more) of those fly together picking fights with almost anything.
Been around since the beginning.
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Sustrai Aditua
Irubo Kovu
126
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Posted - 2016.04.26 22:19:53 -
[4] - Quote
Many years ago I begged for a dedicated command ship. The BC response was an attempt to kill two birds with one stone, which always winds up a failure in aircraft design, and this spacecraft design probably holds the same fate, so why try? I thought a BS frame would be more appropriate for a command ship. (A CS should spend most of its time commanding, not trying to survive.)
Another attempt to drag the BC frame into use was the "hey, you can put heavy guns on this baby...sorry, no tank" version, each with its own design. Each becoming a sniper ship, not exactly the traditional BC role. My complaint about it all had to do with the Hurricane. Why not have a full rack of projectile turrets instead of the two launcher highs? A formidable tank and you've got a pretty vicious ship. However, I don't think the Hurricane has ever been seen as vicious.
When they introduced the T3 cruiser instead, I was crushed. I could see this dev team had the glitter in their eyes - their first time to see the brass elephant head. Now we lose SP when we lose our T3 cruiser. That says a little about the elephant in THIS room - and there the BC still languishes, all potential; no realization. Part of this is the confusion between a "heavy cruiser" and a "battle cruiser". For all intents and purposes they're one and the same.
I think we can assume having put all that effort into the modular T3 design and development, the BC was not even on the table. The aftermath makes one feel the BC isn't even in the room anymore. (When you're penalizing using a T3 by withdrawing skill points should it be lost, you're admitting you have a design flaw somewhere, and you're making the user pay the price for your mistake.)
The progression would be frigate - cruiser - battle, or heavy cruiser - battleship. The destroyer class came into play IRL as a means for anti-submarine warfare, a problem we don't have in EVE. I could see a similar concept as a seeker out of stealthed ships...along with its expendable role in launching scram bubbles. (Who'd use a T2 for this? Some NUT?)
I think it's the presence of the destroyer as a standard role vessel that mucks up this line of progression, and so confuses the developers. Couple this with the myth that all gamers want to see new "things" with every update (can we get mounts for our characters in quarters???) and the entire process is off the rails.
IN SHORT (tl;dr) The battle cruiser needs to be made viable even if it means ditching the highly flawed, and overly-convoluted T3 "heavy" cruisers. The DESTROYER needs to be reined in, given a less broad role, and maybe even made more specialized to one role. This will bring the frigate to battle cruiser transition back into relevance the way reality has it. |
Joanna RB
Twenty Questions RAZOR Alliance
28
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Posted - 2016.04.26 22:34:15 -
[5] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Hades Dark wrote:T2 are command ships which no one flies
Older players fly CS's because the requirements used to be a lot less harsh - iirc it was BC V + HAC prereqs for one, and BC V + logi prereqs for the other. Now it has FOUR skills all up to level V, in ADDITION to BC V, and not only that, half the skills are totally irrelevant - for example Armoured and Information Warfare to V for a Sleipnir. To put it another way, if I was to make 2 copies of my main, one would train to sit in a command ship (given I already have all racial BC at V), the other for a Titan, the Titan alt would get trained quicker. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
6002
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Posted - 2016.04.27 00:09:07 -
[6] - Quote
After the introduction of skill injectors, Command Ship popularity soared. |
Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
185
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Posted - 2016.04.27 00:13:17 -
[7] - Quote
I think Command Ships are mission specific, the Aardvark was mission non-specific. It was multi-role.
More on the F-111:
I'm surprised to hear someone call the F-111 Aardvark a "failure in aircraft design". The plane lived on active duty for over 35 years in almost as many configurations as the legendary F4 Phantom. It was a jack of all trades aircraft that while not the best at any of them could do all of them as needed. It pioneered sweep wings for the F-14 Tomcat. It was a serious Electronics Warfare platform and became the benchmark for all that followed. You might want to ask Saddam Hussein's, Khadafi's, and Milosovich's military commanders if they think it was a 'failure'.
It was an usual aircraft that was a high risk design that ended up working well after they got the kinks worked out of it.
Be Positive GÇó Change yourself first, New Eden will come later GÇó EVE is Awesome GÇó CCP isn't the enemy GÇó Players are people too GÇó Where're the clothing blueprints GÇó Yeah, I'm still learning this game
-- Pandora's Rules to EVE by
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Siigari Kitawa
Waking Dreams
412
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Posted - 2016.04.27 01:11:49 -
[8] - Quote
I am not sure you get much more love than a 1250 DPS Astarte. Ugh that ship rocks so hard. It's just slow as a bs lol.
Need stuff moved? Push Industries will handle it.
Serving highsec, lowsec and nullsec - and we do it faster and more reliably than anyone else.
Ingame channel: PUSHX
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3212
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Posted - 2016.04.27 01:17:18 -
[9] - Quote
Joanna RB wrote:
Older players fly CS's because the requirements used to be a lot less harsh - iirc it was BC V + HAC prereqs for one, and BC V + logi prereqs for the other. Now it has FOUR skills all up to level V, in ADDITION to BC V, and not only that, half the skills are totally irrelevant - for example Armoured and Information Warfare to V for a Sleipnir. To put it another way, if I was to make 2 copies of my main, one would train to sit in a command ship (given I already have all racial BC at V), the other for a Titan, the Titan alt would get trained quicker.
Actually they decreased the training time required for CS. You had to have HAC V & Logi V, not just HAC & Logi pre-reqs. And those four skills you are complaining about are only *2 multiplier. People just don't like training them because they aren't perfect on map. & they don't understand what they actually get for those skills and that they do apply to all CS & in fact all ships they fly. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
7556
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Posted - 2016.04.27 01:31:22 -
[10] - Quote
As long as they don't mess with the Cyclone I'm happy.
Things are going to change for CS when OGB is gone and every CS might as well be named "Primary +"
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
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Hades Dark
Perkone Caldari State
29
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Posted - 2016.04.27 02:26:36 -
[11] - Quote
I would just like to see more variety in battlecruisers, didn't say command ships are bad just you rarely see people fly them because the skills needed and the value of the ship. Would be nice to have something else in the battlecruiser class. |
Saralan Valeraara
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2016.04.27 02:52:17 -
[12] - Quote
How about a tech 3 Battlecrusier?
call it Tactical Battlecruiser and it functions similar to the tactical destroyer.
or maybe a battlecruiser THAT IS A WEAPON ITSELF
aka no equipable weapons except a special modual for a special attack each race gets
i cna already imagine and gaus cannon for caldari and some big ass lazer for amarr
i think we need more fun ways to play the game, maybe even a ship at crusier/battlecrusier size that works like mara's and that they become a stationary turrent.
or maybe we can get space pawnies with rainbow ass lazers |
Mephiztopheleze
Republic University Minmatar Republic
668
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Posted - 2016.04.27 04:05:50 -
[13] - Quote
Hades Dark wrote:Battlecruisers are the only class that doesnt have pirate faction ships.......
sweet, where can I get me a Pirate Faction Destroyer?
Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze
This is my Forum Main. My Combat Alt is sambo Inkura
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Saralan Valeraara
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2016.04.27 04:11:13 -
[14] - Quote
Mephiztopheleze wrote:Hades Dark wrote:Battlecruisers are the only class that doesnt have pirate faction ships....... sweet, where can I get me a Pirate Faction Destroyer?
same place you get space pawnies with rainbow ass lazers |
Cypherous
Cypherous Corporation
189
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Posted - 2016.04.27 09:29:25 -
[15] - Quote
Mephiztopheleze wrote:Hades Dark wrote:Battlecruisers are the only class that doesnt have pirate faction ships....... sweet, where can I get me a Pirate Faction Destroyer?
Don't forget the pirate faction mining frigates and barges :P |
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