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Kirk Long
Celestial Outlaws
0
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Posted - 2016.05.23 18:55:15 -
[1] - Quote
Hello guys i have been playing EVE for about a month now and was looking to start PvP'ing and was looking for some options on what a good first PvP ship/build would be for me. I have PvPed a little bit in the game and actually was able to gank a hulk for my first kill recently other than that i have PvPed a few times in tier 1 destroyers but have not been able to get kill any kills without getting outmatched by other ships. I have a bunch of Amarr tier 1 frigs in my hangar and i just recently got a Hurricane Battleship that i use for Ratting. I guess i could turn the Hurricane into a PvP ship i just dont know how effective it would be since it is very slow. Im currently working on training all tier 2 shield mods and weapons and will have them within a few days. If anyone could recommend a ship that would be useful for be to start using for PvP that would really help. thank you |
Maekchu
Gunpoint Diplomacy
230
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Posted - 2016.05.23 19:02:27 -
[2] - Quote
My first advice is to try and find a corp that does the PvP you want to do. If you want to get into solo PvP, I would not recommend to do that to start with, but instead look at some small gank PvP first. Finding a good corp is the most important thing to do and this is how you will learn the most.
I terms of what ships to fly, I'd say the easiest place to start is T1 frigate EWAR support (like a Maulus). They are extremely useful and easy for newbies to get into (skillwise).
But honestly, get a corp first. |
Soel Reit
Dambusters 617 Sq
3
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Posted - 2016.05.23 19:11:45 -
[3] - Quote
well....... first of all the hurricane is a battlecruiser not a battleship.....
as my dear friend maekchu (he killed me a couple of time ) said getting in a good corp is a top priority for you. they'll teach you all base mechanics and more.
frigates are a good start (cheap and affordable). Training t2 mod for this ships it's another priority. imo you'll learn more from flying a small ship than a big one.
your post on the forum is a good point: you want to learn. now find nice teammates and arrass them with questions! |
Kirk Long
Celestial Outlaws
0
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Posted - 2016.05.23 19:17:25 -
[4] - Quote
Thanks my corp has been helpful.. there is a few of us that like to PvP so sounds like i will fit up a Executioner with tier 2 mods asap and see how it goes. thanks ! |
Mantie Utama
WiNGSPAN Academy for Enterprising Pilots WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
0
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Posted - 2016.05.23 19:22:06 -
[5] - Quote
As a newish player who has done a lot of asking and research around this same topic... Here's my advice
Join a FW corp (I personally didn't like FW but you learn a lot from FW PvP corps) eventually decide if you want to stay or leave
Your first year you shouldn't really go above frig, des, or cruisers . I'd focus on general frigate skilling and deciding after that what you want to skill into. You can do interceptors, stealth bombers, assault frigs, destroyers, T3 destroyer, etc.. Also there are some extremely isk efficient cruisers like the vexor.
Some good frigs to start with: tristan, kestrel, condor
Drones and missiles are good to start with, I would try to move into guns at one point so you learn the mechanics (much more difficult than missiles)
Lastly, find a source of income. You will lose ships and need to replace them. I'd dedicate an alt to this but just my opinion |
Hawke Frost
156
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Posted - 2016.05.23 20:19:26 -
[6] - Quote
Kirk Long wrote:Hello guys i have been playing EVE for about a month now and was looking to start PvP'ing and was looking for some options on what a good first PvP ship/build would be for me. I have PvPed a little bit in the game and actually was able to gank a hulk for my first kill recently other than that i have PvPed a few times in tier 1 destroyers but have not been able to get kill any kills without getting outmatched by other ships. I have a bunch of Amarr tier 1 frigs in my hangar and i just recently got a Hurricane Battleship that i use for Ratting. I guess i could turn the Hurricane into a PvP ship i just dont know how effective it would be since it is very slow. Im currently working on training all tier 2 shield mods and weapons and will have them within a few days. If anyone could recommend a ship that would be useful for be to start using for PvP that would really help. thank you
PVP in EVE is rock, paper, scissors so what you're really saying is "someone give me a really good fit for a rock please". If you look at it like that then I hope you realize how "silly" the question is, as in whatever answer you'll get is probably not going to help you. Fits depend on a scenario: where you fight and what you expect to fight in terms of ship, expected fitting, tactics and piloting.
Case in point: in low sec most solo frigates will be set up to scram kite because of them sitting in plexes and there not being any bubbles, this means that you'd have to set up your ship to deal with that tactic and the range of ships that you'll likely run in to. If you'd use scram kiting as a tactic yourself then it becomes an applied dps/tank war, one which (if you're lower SP) you're probably going to lose. So you need to find a counter to their tactic.
In 0.0 most solo frigates will be kiters or MWD brawlers, a scram kiting setup is a great counter to both of those, if done correctly. If you'd try a kiting fit yourself then you're back to the "who applies the best damage" which you're probably going to lose. On top of that kiting fits require lots and lots of situational awareness and experience.
Stick to frigates, they're awesome and cheap. Search youtube for "eve is easy executioner", you'll find some videos showcasing low SP solo pvp in an Amarr frigate, watch that video a bunch of times, you'll learn new stuff every time you do. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
539
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Posted - 2016.05.23 20:36:51 -
[7] - Quote
If there is any ship that is capable of taking on the majority of fights then it is a HIC; basically eve on easy mode.
Id suggest going for a t3 destroyer first and then HIC due to the SP requirement and cost to replace of a HIC.
This is assuming your looking at solo / small gang, as if you go any bigger then it simply comes down to your corp / alliance doctrine. Don't be that guy that brings a drake.
Also bear in mind the meta is always shifting, and there is likely a t3 rebalance on the horizon and so things will get buffed / nerfed.
(frigates are good to get a feel for PvP but don't expect much as you'll likely be in your pod the majority of the time unless you are one of the few who really know how to fly them well. Even then one wrong move and you'll be turned into a smouldering wreck)
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Kirk Long
Celestial Outlaws
0
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Posted - 2016.05.23 20:56:23 -
[8] - Quote
By kiting in a frigate you mean keeping ur target at a distance while putting the web's and scrams on him not allowing him to get close enough to blow u to bits?? |
Hawke Frost
158
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Posted - 2016.05.23 21:01:10 -
[9] - Quote
Kirk Long wrote:By kiting in a frigate you mean keeping ur target at a distance while putting the web's and scrams on him not allowing him to get close enough to blow u to bits??
For frigates: brawling 500m-4km, scram kiting: 5-8km, kiting 12+km. More or less. Also, I'd probably say that you should ignore the whole "go for a hic lol, frigates suck" help. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
539
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Posted - 2016.05.23 21:27:25 -
[10] - Quote
Hawke Frost wrote:Kirk Long wrote:By kiting in a frigate you mean keeping ur target at a distance while putting the web's and scrams on him not allowing him to get close enough to blow u to bits?? For frigates: brawling 500m-4km, scram kiting: 5-8km, kiting 12+km. More or less. Also, I'd probably say that you should ignore the whole "go for a hic lol, frigates suck" help.
Kitey frigate PvP is one of the most boring types of PvP in the game. I've done PvP from frigates up to capitals, and cruisers are easily the most versatile of all ship types.
What makes you so certain that kitey frigate PvP is the best PvP? ( And I can tell your a FW player by the way as its the only place you can get away flying kitey frigates; I don't expect you have much else in terms of PvP experience )
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Hawke Frost
159
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Posted - 2016.05.23 21:34:54 -
[11] - Quote
Moac Tor wrote:Hawke Frost wrote:Kirk Long wrote:By kiting in a frigate you mean keeping ur target at a distance while putting the web's and scrams on him not allowing him to get close enough to blow u to bits?? For frigates: brawling 500m-4km, scram kiting: 5-8km, kiting 12+km. More or less. Also, I'd probably say that you should ignore the whole "go for a hic lol, frigates suck" help. Kitey frigate PvP is one of the most boring types of PvP in the game. I've done PvP from frigates up to capitals, and cruisers are easily the most versatile of all ship types. What makes you so certain that kitey frigate PvP is the best PvP? ( And I can tell your a FW player by the way as its the only place you can get away flying kitey frigates; I don't expect you have much else in terms of PvP experience )
Where did I say anything about kiting being preferred? And no I don't do FW at all. So far you told a newbie to go for a HIC and it turns out that you can't read. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
539
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Posted - 2016.05.23 21:50:37 -
[12] - Quote
Kirk Long wrote:Where did I say anything about kiting being preferred? And no I don't do FW at all. So far you told a newbie to go for a HIC and it turns out that you can't read. Scram kiting is still a form of kiting; don't be pedantic.
Frigates only have any real survivability in low sec when hiding in plexes or kiting at the edge, in null sec you'll get squished unless you are one of the few who is exceptionally good with frigates (ie well out of the reach of a new player).
A cruiser is a much more solid choice, and HIC is great to aim for as you are learning all the skills required for cruiser PvP culminating in one of the best small gang PvP ships around.
Also please read before spamming us with your elite PvP knowledge and dismissing advice from experienced people.
Moac Tor wrote:I'd suggest going for a t3 destroyer first and then HIC due to the SP requirement and cost to replace of a HIC
Moac Tor wrote:(frigates are good to get a feel for PvP but don't expect much
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Hawke Frost
159
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Posted - 2016.05.23 21:59:03 -
[13] - Quote
Moac Tor wrote:Kirk Long wrote:Where did I say anything about kiting being preferred? And no I don't do FW at all. So far you told a newbie to go for a HIC and it turns out that you can't read. Scram kiting is still a form of kiting; don't be pedantic.
Lol, no it's not. Has nothing to do with me being pedantic but with you being mistaken.
Quote:Frigates only have any real survivability in low sec when hiding in plexes or kiting at the edge, in null sec you'll get squished unless you are one of the few who is exceptionally good with frigates (ie well out of the reach of a new player).
A cruiser is a much more solid choice, and HIC is great to aim for as you are learning all the skills required for cruiser PvP culminating in one of the best small gang PvP ships around.
He's new and he's going to lose a **** ton of ships so what he doesn't need is a ship that requires a whole lot SP (from a newbie pov) to work decently well and costs a ton. He's going to die just as fast in a cruiser as in a frigate and he'll learn more by learning the basics of actual pvp by flying a frigate.
Quote:Also please read before spamming us with your elite PvP knowledge and dismissing advice from experienced people.
Experienced people who don't understand the difference between kiting and scram kiting and who tell a complete newbie to get a T3d and a T2 cruiser. Perhaps not that experienced, then. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
539
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Posted - 2016.05.23 22:05:18 -
[14] - Quote
*chuckles* This discussion reminds me of why I dislike these forums. (arguing with a 3 month old alt who has no KB record to backup his 'elite pvp knowledge')
Just to summarise for the OP.
1. ignore the guy above me.
2. Go ahead and use frigates, just don't be dissapointed that your getting squished constantly, but just get a feel for PvP without much risk.
3. Train for a T3 destroyer ASAP as CCP literally made this ship for newbies like yourself to be competitive in PvP (there is a reason as to why the Svipul is the number 1 ship on zKill)
4. Longer term try and get into cruiser PvP as it will give you access to a whole host of top tier PvP ships such as the HIC and is the most versatile class of ship in the game.
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Hawke Frost
159
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Posted - 2016.05.23 22:14:13 -
[15] - Quote
Ad hominem, the only option for people who ran out of arguments.
Long term, yes cruisers make really good sense for all the obvious reasons. But he's not asking long term is he, he's asking for help RIGHT NOW. And RIGHT NOW he is not helped by going "do nothing till you have your svipul lol" or "frigates suck" (which is mistaken in the first place).
The fact is that a scram kiting frigate in 0.0 is just about the easiest thing to use for a newbie while also having the best chance of success because it counters the most used 0.0 strategy while working great against the 2nd most used strategy. That's not "elite pvp lol", that's pretty basic understanding.
- edit -
It suddenly dawned on me. You're scared of dying and you project that onto this newbie. Newbies learn more from fights where they didn't automatically win due to numbers, gang links or lol ships but where they won (or lost, you learn a lot from losing) because they performed better. I'll take a newbie with 100 losses, assuming they weren't complete **** fit, and only 5 kills all in a T1 frigate over one that was in a fleet, flying faction ships and getting his name on the killmail with almost zero losses and 10 kills. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
539
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Posted - 2016.05.23 22:43:52 -
[16] - Quote
Yes I am giving him medium term goals rather than the standard advice of going for a frigate. (And by the way I agree frigates make excellent training ships which I stated in my first post)
The issue is people get stuck playing frigates online; and with a focused skill plan it actually doesn't take that long to get into a T3 destroyer whilst getting access to excellent t1 destroyers and training lots of useful support skills along the way. And so I am giving the bigger picture, whilst at the same time agreeing with you that frigates are great initially to test the water.
You can become a master frigate pilot too, but that requires a lot of dedication and you need to know what targets you can and cannot engage, and so I wouldn't recommend it for a new player as you'll be missing out on the fun of flying bigger ships.
(and the issue isn't dying, but more that frigates simply don't put out the raw dps to take down most targets quickly enough if at all when using solo)
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
480
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Posted - 2016.05.24 03:33:10 -
[17] - Quote
Moac Tor wrote:*chuckles* This discussion reminds me of why I dislike these forums. (arguing with a 3 month old alt who has no KB record to backup his 'elite pvp knowledge')
pots and kettles, lol.
Just Add Water
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Hawke Frost
160
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Posted - 2016.05.24 03:39:10 -
[18] - Quote
"Getting stuck" would be different yes, although I know some people who've been doing it for years and enjoy it. They enjoy the fact that they're the underdog as it makes a win more hilarious. But to stop people from "getting stuck" it doesn't help if you tell them "frigates suck", they don't suck at all but they're more limited in what they can attack.
On the up side they're cheap to lose, don't require a ton of SP (so it's great to do on alts and for newer players) and they can get out of trouble in case you end up in a situation you can't deal with. This means that they work really well for soloing, TRUE soloing not the "I have 2 scouts, a Falcon, gang links and cyno" soloing. It means they're meant to actively roam for targets, not sit in their own home systems and wait for people to come their way, this is probably why you don't ever see them.
A newbie will learn so much more from losing 100 frigates (and getting a few kills) in solo pvp, if he put in the effort to prepare because head first approaches don't work, than to wait till he can fly a (T2) cruiser and sit in a fleet/gang following orders. It shows initiative, it shows maturity in the way that they're ok with being the underdog and it shows they're willing to lose in order to PVP. There's already too many scardy cats who hide behind friends, funky ships and gang links who lie to themselves about how the increased cost of their ship makes it more risky while in fact they use it to make up for a lack of capability. |
Iain Cariaba
3043
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Posted - 2016.05.24 06:04:43 -
[19] - Quote
OP, ignore both the asshats arguing above. They're both right, and they're both wrong.
Frigates do not suck, provided you're not trying to be stupid with them, like fighting destroyers which are designed to kill frigates. The T3 destroyers are due for a nerf in the not to distant future, though right now they're pretty strong. Cruisers are great for PvP. They have more survivability than frigates, though they're much slower and prone to die to groups of frigates/destroyers.
Start with frigates. You're going to lose a **** ton of them, so the fact that you can fit a decent PvP frigate for less than 5mil ISK is a plus. I recommend training up Amarr, Gallente, and Minmatar frig to 4 each, and finding out which weapon you really like using. Look for Malediction, Atron, and Burst fits, as those three are fairly good PvP boats, even with t1 mods.
Once you've determined which style is you're favorite, then you'll be able to ask the right questions about where you go from there.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Hawke Frost
162
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Posted - 2016.05.24 18:10:25 -
[20] - Quote
So you mean that right now, the OP being one month old, he should NOT focus on larger ships and especially not T2 or T3, but instead pick a frigate, put in the effort to learn and go for it. And NOT to think that frigates "suck", because they can do just fine.
That's what I said. |
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aldhura
Bartledannians The Ascendancy Protocol
43
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Posted - 2016.05.24 19:34:38 -
[21] - Quote
As you consider and want to gank PVP, all you need is a catalyst.
Bartledannians Corporation is recruiting
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Shawn Sukara
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2016.05.24 22:12:51 -
[22] - Quote
Gila
nuff said |
Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
11074
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Posted - 2016.05.25 11:34:00 -
[23] - Quote
Last time I checked solo PvP was in those little faction warfare sites with timer where you check local, directional scanner and wait for someone to warp into it.
As I have been completely fresh I started with kiting fit kestrel. But I considered rather to train the kiting after few loses. It was always nice to complete the site when someone could not catch you orbiting around the site and then leaved. Sorry to dissapoint people that thought they would get some kills. But it was only me training.
( -á° -ƒ-û -í°)/ =ƒÅ¦ - my sandcastle
Every part of a game helps to tell a story. =ƒôò
Planetary Interaction 2.1
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