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Blood Retributor
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
29
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Posted - 2016.06.29 18:22:01 -
[1] - Quote
Hi guys (and girls)!
I have been playing this game for a month and a half and still try to understand: are people playing it for fun or for ISK? Or the whole fun of this game is making ISK?
Years ago I played StarWars Fighter (Naboo missions). Had a lot of fun with it. Last several years played a game called Alien Shooter. Good stuff after a stressful day at work! Just shoot countless numbers of monsters and grab better gear for the next level. Last year spent quite some time with Call of Duty. For years wanted to start playing Eve (I am a fan of anything Space) and finally made the leap.
Now back to the topic. Where in the game do you have fun people? Please do not tell me about blitzing level 4 missions at 100mil isk/hour or 25 Hulks leveling an asteroid belt at 300 mil isk/hour.
I am asking about fun, not isk!!! If I will need isk I will buy a Plex and sell it. A simple math calculation will tell you that there are no lvl4 missions that will give you more isk/hour than one hour of work time at McDonalds (if your regular job does not allow you to buy a Plex when you need it ).
For more than a month I was grinding *roids to get isk for my frigates, cruisers and BCs for later PVP while waiting till my Command and Core skills get to a decent level. Got bored out of my mind. Then, last week (I know it took a bit too long), it struck me: What am I doing? If I will need isk for PvP I will just buy a Plex. It will be a much better use of my time. Ran some lvl1-lvl3 missions and a bit of exploration.
This week I am just occasionally opening my client to see where my Skill queue is and adjusting it if I find something interesting on reddit or this forum. BTW, thanks CCP for removing the Recurring Opportunities, now I do not even have to log in every day as soon as it is available. So my subscription money is going for waiting.
So, honestly, I am on the verge of cancelling my subscription. Can you suggest what is fun in this game? Please do not suggest ganking, as it is against my nature (even in a game).
If the common opinion in the replies will be "GTFO" of here, I will take that as an answer to my question. I do not want to get invested (time, effort, money) in a game that is wrong for me.
Any answer will be appreciated, even the "GTFO" .
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
6225
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Posted - 2016.06.29 18:35:08 -
[2] - Quote
If you are not having fun, stop whatever you are doing immediately, and do something else!
EvE is a sandbox. You can do whatever you want.
Fun is not delivered to you. You are just given tools. You have to either generate fun, or seek it out.
It is a LOT easier to do that with the help of friends in a good corp! Laughing with friends can make even the most idle time, or the worst losses, fun. Shared victories are a lot sweeter too, when celebrated with friends.
There are a lot of corps in EvE, including a lot of bad ones. You don't have to stay in a bad one.
I'd personally recommend joining one of the rookie-friendly corps that exist, like Pandemic Horde, Karma Fleet, Dreddit, Signal Cartel, Wingspan Delivery Services, ... , the list goes on and on. Check out the recruitment forum. There are corps for every interest.
EvE is more about the people, both friends and enemies, than about spaceships. |
KaarBaak
Squirrel Team
366
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Posted - 2016.06.29 19:17:12 -
[3] - Quote
[strike]Join a corp. Head out to Null or Lowsec. Get into FW/RvB.
6 weeks in you should have a pilot qualified for PvP adventure.[/strike]
Disregard...I just read your post history. EvE does not appear to be the game for you.
KB
Dum Spiro Spero
Not getting SP for not killing a rat is like not getting ore for not mining an asteroid.
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Escalating Entropy
10134
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Posted - 2016.06.29 19:25:37 -
[4] - Quote
I think the bigger question here is; what do you consider "fun"?
You don't like grinding missions or rocks. Understandable. People generally run those to make money
You don't like ganking because it is "against" your nature. Okay... how do you feel about PvP in general?
Do you want to explore and make money finding deadspace pockets you can loot?
How do you feel about "cat and mouse games" with other players (see: someone is hunting you and you try to avoid them, or vice versa)?
What about moving products between different areas of space?
How do you feel about semi-organized warfare?
Here is the thing about EVE; it is a rat race. You make money to enhance your ability to wage war (or avoid it), you wage war (or avoid it) to make money... all the while making deals and/or sabotaging the efforts of others to do the same.
The people in EVE are the content. Mingle with people and you will start to have some fun.
How did you Veterans start?
The Mustache and Beard Thread
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
16550
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Posted - 2016.06.29 19:34:49 -
[5] - Quote
Make some friends, betyer yet, enemies.
Enemies are in fact considerably better motivation to login and do things than friends are.
Better the Devil you know.
=]|[=
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Roenok Baalnorn
Sadistically Sinister
134
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Posted - 2016.06.29 20:48:01 -
[6] - Quote
In eve you can pretty much do what you want. So if you dont like what your doing do something else. You make money doing most things in eve. Some pay better than others. I do a little bit of everything to a degree its entertaining me. When it stops entertaining me i do something else for awhile. |
Deck Cadelanne
CAStabouts
337
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Posted - 2016.06.29 22:25:14 -
[7] - Quote
OK, so far you know you don't like mining or mission running.
There is so much more to try and to learn!
Start interacting with other players in the game. Join a corp.
What makes this game fun (for me at least) is that interaction with other people.
Personally, I love small gang/fleet PVP, so that's what I try to focus on when I play. I don't bother with stuff I don't enjoy.
And 3 years in there are still things I have not really explored. Wormhole living, incursions, L5 missions...
Good hunting!
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Deck Cadelanne
CAStabouts
337
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Posted - 2016.06.29 22:26:21 -
[8] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Make some friends, betyer yet, enemies.
Enemies are in fact considerably better motivation to login and do things than friends are.
Both. It's the only way to fly :-)
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Vortexo VonBrenner
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
2330
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Posted - 2016.06.29 22:27:57 -
[9] - Quote
Fun is, of course, very subjective. What is fun for one in EvE is agony for others. There is so much you can do in EvE. Do your thing and try new things.
EvE security zones in picture
Space pants! Begin transmission.
Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast.
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Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
403
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Posted - 2016.06.29 23:23:48 -
[10] - Quote
If you like shooting stuff, sounds like you might like either ratting or WH space adventures. The former is pretty easy to do and makes okay ISK. The latter is harder to do and takes decent skills, decent ship, and some patience as you'll die a lot at first. However, you get to tangle with both NPC's AND players on a regular basis. It makes good ISK too depending on what you are doing out there in WH space.
If you like playing White Knight, join one of the anti-ganking groups. You get to save hapless merchants and blow up the occasional ganker that makes a mistake and opens fire. You could also join the CVA and patrol/protect.
Be Positive GÇó Change yourself first, New Eden will come later GÇó EVE is Awesome GÇó CCP isn't the enemy GÇó Players are people too GÇó Where're the clothing blueprints GÇó Yeah, I'm still learning this game
-- Pandora's Rules to EVE by
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Iria Ahrens
Space Perverts and Forum Pirates
966
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Posted - 2016.06.30 00:06:49 -
[11] - Quote
Same people make isk for fun, but the majority make isk to fund other activities. The thing about EVE is, Players are content, the sandbox just gives people a place to play.
We actually do often recommend to new players to just buy a plex for isk instead of grinding for it. Players are content again. People that stay join corps or at least make friends and fly with them. I've come and gone from the game several times, each time I leave, it is usually because I haven't been very social and the game got stale.
My choice of pronouns is based on your avatar. Even if I know what is behind the avatar.
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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1502
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Posted - 2016.06.30 02:24:42 -
[12] - Quote
This game is a PvP sandbox and the PvE is just there to support the PvP.
Where this game shines is in the open world unstructured, unregulated PvP.
What you enjoy doing and how you find your niche in this game is up to you but if you are only shooting at rocks and NPCs then you've seen very little of this game.
Try everything. Do more of what you enjoy and less or none of what you dislike. |
Sinir Henata
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.06.30 03:52:07 -
[13] - Quote
People play different games for different reasons. I enjoyed games like Evochron and Astrox, so I decided to finally try Eve. Right now, in my few days, all I do is mine and go ratting to raise money to buy new ships ... but that's what I personally find to be fun and enjoyable. Am I boring? Possibly, but I think I've found a game that I can play for a long, long time.
That being said, everyone's mileage will vary. |
Tzuke
State War Academy Caldari State
22
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Posted - 2016.06.30 04:52:08 -
[14] - Quote
I can understand where your coming from. Eve is predominately a pvp game. People will tell you otherwise but it's true. Saying that I don't pvp and only pve. For me the fun part is learning new skills and acquiring new ships etc. I mainly run security missions but they can get very tedious as they are repeated time and time again and so far I've generated very little isk. I have bought a plex which I sold to take my mind off how little isk I had heh
If you find Eve isn't for you and still have to give into your space fix may I suggest Elite Dangerous. It's a little complex after the latest update but it can be played solo so you don't have to worry about pvp or play with other players be it friends or just others. It is a more traditional flight sim type of affair without the spreadsheet behind which is what Eve is basically
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Arkoth 24
Phayder
203
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Posted - 2016.06.30 04:58:50 -
[15] - Quote
EvE is pain. No fun allowed.
Evelopedia via Wayback Machine | Open petition against Evelopedia closure
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Vortexo VonBrenner
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
2332
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Posted - 2016.06.30 05:02:18 -
[16] - Quote
Personally I didn't care much for elite:dangerous. Granted I only played it for about two weeks, but I found my first two weeks in EvE much more enjoyable. Each to their own, I suppose.
EvE security zones in pictures
EvE quick reference sheet pdf
Smoke me a Kipper, I'll be back for breakfast.
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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
3541
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Posted - 2016.06.30 05:38:02 -
[17] - Quote
i mean your post was mostly about acquisition of isk and the realization that buying isk via plex is more time efficient. unless you are ferrengi you will need different goals to have fun.
channel your inner klingon for a change
how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
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Solai
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
347
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Posted - 2016.06.30 05:48:03 -
[18] - Quote
I feel like our typical response - 'Eve is a sandbox, do anything, what do you want to do' - is insufficient for this kind of recurring question. I mean, its certainly true. But it doesn't address the confusion that we keep seeing from newcomers. The same confusion I had.
I think a better response might be to ILLUSTRATE things that people do, why they log in, what keeps them coming back. Describe something specific enough that the reader can imagine doing specifically that. It might not encompass the breadth of Eve, but at least it's concrete instead of vague notions of 'do what you want.'
Personally, I like joining the big nullsec wars. We organize into space tribes, create command structures, establish doctrines so that we're all on the same page, we engage in tons of meta-game warfare, and fly in the biggest battles in Eve. Its full of adrenaline, comraderie, and challenge. |
Do Little
Virgin Plc Evictus.
305
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Posted - 2016.06.30 08:15:54 -
[19] - Quote
I approach Eve from a different perspective - I was attracted to the game by the economic simulation. I enjoy the strategic, planning side of the game more than the tactical, execution side - which can get repetitive. I also enjoy competing with other players in the market and cooperating with other players in corp. There is great satisfaction when a plan comes together - doesn't matter if you are a fleet commander or an industrialist. The pain is also real when something goes wrong, choices have consequences.
ISK is a way to keep score for industrialists like me. For PVP players killboards are the score card and ISK is a means - not an end.
There is no single "right" way to play Eve but, as pointed out earlier, unless you're enjoying the game, you're doing it wrong! |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1503
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Posted - 2016.06.30 09:24:49 -
[20] - Quote
Solai wrote:I feel like our typical response - 'Eve is a sandbox, do anything, what do you want to do' - is insufficient for this kind of recurring question. I mean, its certainly true. But it doesn't address the confusion that we keep seeing from newcomers. The same confusion I had.
I think a better response might be to ILLUSTRATE things that people do, why they log in, what keeps them coming back. Describe something specific enough that the reader can imagine doing specifically that. It might not encompass the breadth of Eve, but at least it's concrete instead of vague notions of 'do what you want.'
I am an unusual person in life in general. Even outside this game I can tell you the things that work for me most people could not handle and vice versa. I actually enjoy doing the things that the OP is having problems getting into. So for me to tell him what keeps me coming back would do him no good and probably make him quit.
However this game is deep and it is a sandbox and very enjoyable gameplay is probably out there for him. However he is the only one that is him and he needs to figure that out for himself. Maybe if he gave some kind of idea as to what he likes or is looking for but really he mostly told us about what he does not like which does not help us in directing him. |
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Memphis Baas
1665
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Posted - 2016.06.30 10:35:32 -
[21] - Quote
EVE is a real time strategy (RTS) game that is played from the point of view of a single "unit", with the meat of the game consisting of large alliances building units and gear and going to war to conquer the map. It allows smaller skirmishes too, and all the PVE (including mining and missions) is intended to be a source of money and gear to pay for the wars.
The people who enjoy RTS'es, large scale wars, small skirmishes, etc., are having a blast.
EDIT: I mean, literally, you're picking a single unit in Starcraft or Sins of a Solar Empire or whatever, and you're roleplaying that it has a life and a purpose and friends, and you're controlling that single unit and its interactions. And then you're asking where the fun is, or wondering why everyone else is so focused on conquering the map and killing your unit in the process. |
Blood Retributor
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.06.30 14:28:01 -
[22] - Quote
I greatly appreciate your advice and the time you spent giving it!
I was planning to join RvB for some time but some project at RL work is holding me back, until the end of July.
I was thinking about FW and exploration also. Well, I guess, I will have to be more patient and use your advice to figure things out.
Probably, one day I will re-read my post and laugh at myself.
BTW, Arkoth 24 you made me smile ! Sounded a lot like the "ISIS of Eve" (hint: CODE ) lingo! For me, Eve is anything but pain (after all it's just a game).
Thank you all, for your patience and understanding! |
Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
406
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Posted - 2016.06.30 14:30:46 -
[23] - Quote
I just wish we would stop using the term PvE around newbies. It's not the same term as it is in other MMO's and it's relative only to itself within EVE. If we keep reinforcing the idea that EVE is ALL PvP, then there's no confusion about it. Later on it's okay to introduce the relatively lower ship/ISK risk aspects of the game as being called "PvE".
I think the clearer it is, up front, that this game is not only complex but wide-open and you against the universe from the start is probably about the best antidote we have against losing newcomers from total shock.
Be Positive GÇó Change yourself first, New Eden will come later GÇó EVE is Awesome GÇó CCP isn't the enemy GÇó Players are people too GÇó Where're the clothing blueprints GÇó Yeah, I'm still learning this game
-- Pandora's Rules to EVE by
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Tao Dolcino
EVE University Ivy League
475
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Posted - 2016.06.30 14:56:40 -
[24] - Quote
I like Solai's idea to give some examples of goals/achievements/playstyles :
For my part, I never have enough ISK to lose expensive ships in PvP as i'd love to, because i find grinding alone boring. But flying PvE fleets with nice players is a perfect way to have fun with something otherwise repetitive and to raise funds for my losses.
Find a populated and active corporation in your time zone, who often enough group to do together things you like or need, and you'll have a much more interesting in game experience, whatever goals you find for yourself.
CCP 2015 : "Fluff is good"
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Blood Retributor
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.06.30 15:33:33 -
[25] - Quote
Pandora Carrollon wrote: I think the clearer it is, up front, that this game is not only complex but wide-open and you against the universe from the start is probably about the best antidote we have against losing newcomers from total shock.
As a noob that played anything but MMO, and does not have the "socializing" in a game as a priority, I do not think that "you against the universe" is the "shocker". Most shooting games (if not all) have the same approach.
I just think that in its attempts to market the game to potential new players CCP fails to understand that they do not provide enough of a bait for players like me (no friends in Eve, no MMO experience, not much loyalty and investment into the game, but with some interest in Space stuff). To go through the "pain" of learning the complex world of Eve the modern new player needs to see the "gain".
Most people trying out Eve do not understand why do they have to break their mind with countless spreadsheets in a game when they have enough of it at school, work, well, RL.
If anyone at CCP would listen and care, I would have made a suggestion: 1. create a separate environment (like Singularity) for noob access only for three days (a week maybe) 2. give them access to unlimited fitted ships, with unlimited (trained) skill points 3. give them step by step missions: fights (FW, PvP) with good AIs, encourage them join fleets with FCs that would simulate those of real players from Tranquility 4. Give them step by step missions for exploration. 5. Tell them there are options of mining, manufacture, hauling, etc. and let them know they can try those later on Tranquility if they wish so. (No offense to players who like these, but even these occupations might or will require flying and shooting).
In short, give them access to whatever options a three-five year old active player would have access to. Help them feel what they can achieve if they put in the time and the sub money.
6. Tell them at the very beginning it is a DEMO ONLY and they will not be able to bring anything they achieve here to Tranquility. 7. Tell them at the end that now they are ready to start their rookie training in the Real Eve World where they will have to grind for those skills and ships and had access in the demo. 8. Tell them that in Real Eve World they are easy prey for older players and that they should be expecting to be hunted. 9. Teach them how they can avoid the most foolish rookie mistakes (there is enough statistical info on the forums to identify those). 10. Kick them out of the DEMO at the end of the period telling them that their access to it is blocked and they can use their login info to access their account on Tranquility.
Someone might point out that I (talking about myself) did not have that and am still here. Yes, I am, because I can be stubborn and miss StarTrek too much ! My original post will tell you that even that is barely enough. |
Blood Retributor
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.06.30 16:01:48 -
[26] - Quote
I will use an allegory to show how most new players who leave must feel.
You log into the game and instantly feel stupid, because you have no idea what you are supposed to be doing next. So you know, you feel like you are flat on your face in the mud.
Now, you gather your wits and your courage and undock - trying to get on your knees, on your way to the standing position. If you are not lucky, there is an a**** who just out of amusement (or killboard ***) will gank you, going against the UA. So now you are back on your face in the mud.
Say, you are lucky and you did not get ganked as soon as you undocked. You try different things, make stupid mistakes (you are a noob after all) and lose your ship(s). So now you are back to square one, face in the mud.
As a result, most of those who go through this kind of experience will say f*** this game and never come back, telling their friends and acquaintances what a pain in the *** Eve is. Game Over!
CCP, you do not have to hold the hand of new players for the whole time they are playing the game. However, holding their hand to stand up and get a feel of the real game, would greatly increase the numbers of those who will stay longer and potentially bring new players by telling them what a great newbie experience they had. At least I think so.
Well, I am not CCP and maybe they prefer to stay where they are. It will be sad if one of the most popular space theme MMO will slowly die.
I might be absolutely wrong in everything of the above, I am new to Eve after all. Just sharing my thoughts.
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Tao Dolcino
EVE University Ivy League
476
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Posted - 2016.06.30 16:04:34 -
[27] - Quote
No one is forcing you to play EVE and there are nowadays many offers on the net for the "modern players" You miss other space games you have played before, and you criticize EVE for not being like them. Once again, no one is forcing you to play EVE. The fact that the game is not easy for the newcomers and the fact that the game is different from the mainstream ones are two separate things. If this game becomes like WoW in space, then what's the point to have choice between many games if they all are clones of each others ?
CCP 2015 : "Fluff is good"
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Pandora Carrollon
Kingsman Tailors
406
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Posted - 2016.06.30 16:07:55 -
[28] - Quote
Blood Retributor wrote:As a noob that played anything but MMO, and does not have the "socializing" in a game as a priority, I do not think that "you against the universe" is the "shocker". Most shooting games (if not all) have the same approach.
EVE does not act, and is not marketed, like a First Person Shooter. It is marketed and has more in common with standard MMO's in it's nature than it does an FPS. However, yes, there is a parallel to it in the sense that it's you taking on all comers and survival can depend on your on-line buddies to help you out.
While my own experience with the game biases me as to what my experience was, I think it's a common one. Thus my comment about it being 'you against the universe'. It is PvP at all levels, even the activities more experienced players call PvE are still PvP actions, they just have lower risk and you can opt to avoid making it PvP and only focus on yourself. However, that's the individual players choice to avoid the PvP aspect, not that it doesn't exist, it's just a choice.
Being a sandbox, that's okay, it's valid and acceptable. It's not a play style for everyone, but everyone needs to recognize all legal play styles are valid or risk invalidating their own.
Be Positive GÇó Change yourself first, New Eden will come later GÇó EVE is Awesome GÇó CCP isn't the enemy GÇó Players are people too GÇó Where're the clothing blueprints GÇó Yeah, I'm still learning this game
-- Pandora's Rules to EVE by
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Blood Retributor
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.06.30 16:08:06 -
[29] - Quote
Tao Dolcino wrote: If this game becomes like WoW in space, then what's the point to have choice between many games if they all are clones of each others ?
I did no say CHANGE THE GAME, I suggested a friendlier newbie intro! What/who does not evolve, dies out! It is a rule of life!
Sorry if I did not make that clear enough! |
Brynjard
Virgin Plc Evictus.
23
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Posted - 2016.06.30 16:23:37 -
[30] - Quote
Hi Blood! Hope you find joy and fun as skills get complete and new stuff available for you to both fly and do.
I agree with you about the new player friendly start. The 1.0 sec system is suppose to work as you suggest. But without the skills and ships :)
What happend to you; you where unlucky.
CCP are working on the new player tutorial. |
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