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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Smelt Down
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Posted - 2007.03.12 17:36:00 -
[1]
What happens in the future when one alliance/coalition has more than 5 active titans? I predict it will only be a few months at the most. It makes anything less than a capital ship useless, since they can effectively doomsday at any time, it is not tankable if you don't know what resist to use or they use more than one doomday, and with lag it is not possible to warp out in time in many circumstances. With them being immune to electronic warfare and having officer smartbombs to kill any interdictor bubbles and officer cap rechargers to regen insane amounts of cap, it is literally impossible to kill them using "ingame" circumstances, they can and have only been killed by using out of game mechanics (mainly catching them as they log off).
In a year when there are 30 titans, who will still be playing, if the only ships that can do anything other than sit in a POS are capital ships. My solution:
Make the titan a fleet battle juggernaut type ship. Give it + 500% to tracking per level or whatever missiles use, +5% boost/repair amount, a range bonus, BS level scan resolution ect, give it maybe 10x the hp of a dread, things along that line. Leave it immune to to jammers, tracking and sensor disruptors, but not warp disruptors/webs, and give it an innate +8 or so WCS thing like blockade runners have. This way it is still as deadly as it was with doomsday, but it needs to be in the middle of a fleet battle, instead of sitting at a POS. With 500% tracking it would have no problem hitting ships, but instead of wiping them all out instantly it would just kill stuff one or two at a time very quickly, which also helps mitigate the advantage doomsday has for laggy fights. With enough stuff at a gate and a titan, it is easy to blast a whole fleet before they have even loaded the grid, leaving no time to warp out of bubbles or even fire a shot back in defense. Swatting battleships out of the sky faster than a muninn kills a frigate while shrugging off damage is how I envision the best ship in the game, not something that sits around in a pos hiding 99% of the time. Obviously the numbers or bonuses are not balanced, I just made them up as a general idea.
Other possible solutions are a capital ship interdiction module that prevent both cyno jumps and in system jumps, as well as doing something with DD (either weakening or lengthening the time it takes to fire or removing it it completely). Or maybe just a capital ship module that prevents DD for a set amount of time on the grid when fired, maybe 10 minutes, with a 1 hour cooldown.
For motherships the only thing that needs to be changed is the immune to warp disruption, give them an innate +8 wcs thing like mentioned for the titan.
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fischsemmel
AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.03.12 18:30:00 -
[2]
Now, now.
God didn't sit down with the heads of state from the US and USSR when they developed thermonuclear weapons and say to them "I don't like where this is going; I'm going to have to nerf your nukes."
Why should CCP worry about titans and DDDs?
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Winterblink
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.03.12 18:43:00 -
[3]
Originally by: fischsemmel Now, now.
God didn't sit down with the heads of state from the US and USSR when they developed thermonuclear weapons and say to them "I don't like where this is going; I'm going to have to nerf your nukes."
Why should CCP worry about titans and DDDs?
Maybe She did. :) The USSR's economy went to the pits, and the US is in the fight of its life to prevent the same thing (oil stocks fall too low, country grinds to a halt, Texas takes over the world).
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Krulla
Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.03.12 18:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: fischsemmel Now, now.
God didn't sit down with the heads of state from the US and USSR when they developed thermonuclear weapons and say to them "I don't like where this is going; I'm going to have to nerf your nukes."
Why should CCP worry about titans and DDDs?
God nerfed nukes already.
They're great, yeah, but using them is so not worth it, because of the massive faction hit you get with everyone else. ------------------------- Sigs are for noobs. |
000Hunter000
Gallente Magners Marauders
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Posted - 2007.03.12 18:54:00 -
[5]
The Maker did indeed nerf it, we all use them and presto, we go extinct, problem solved Resized tag... again... hope this pleases the tag ninjas from ccp... again :p
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Banana Torres
The Green Banana Corporation Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.12 19:03:00 -
[6]
How about we get rid off all 0.0 alliances instead. It seems that they cannot play this game without breaking the EULA.
No 0.0 alliances, no sov, no cap ship yards, no Titans, no doomsday device.
And we get a game without the relentless cheating of BoB and the Goons.
Yep, a win/win solution. I vote for this.
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Andargor theWise
Collateral Damage Unlimited Insomnia.
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Posted - 2007.03.12 19:26:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Krulla
God nerfed nukes already.
They're great, yeah, but using them is so not worth it, because of the massive faction hit you get with everyone else.
Actually, with conventional warfare to, um, secure resources, you still get a faction hit. Albeit not all at once. - Got grief?
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Cadela Fria
Amarr Eye of God X-PACT
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Posted - 2007.03.12 19:37:00 -
[8]
Yes, heres the solution:
Don't tamper with the DD's, they're supposed to wipe everything out, now hush!
Knowledge is a priviledge, not a right
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Soporo
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.03.12 19:53:00 -
[9]
Its ironic that a ship thats supposed to help with the blobbing issue tends to create one(or two) by the very rumor of its presence.
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Dark Shikari
Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.03.12 19:57:00 -
[10]
Dreadnoughts can quite easily tank even 5 superweapon blasts. Heck, they can probably tank 20.
--23 Member--
EVE-Trance Radio--The EVE Textboard |
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2007.03.12 20:00:00 -
[11]
They want DDs to stop blob warfare and frankly if you know 6 Titans are waiting out there for you I imagine you'd think twice about flying your 200+ ship blob right at it.
That said I agree they should be able to be warp scrambled and like the idea of giving them a built in 12 (or whatever seems good) warp core strength (like blockage runners).
That and do not allow Titans to fire a DD through a cyno. If they are going to own the battlefield they should at least be on the battlefield.
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David Ryan
New Age Solutions New Age Solutions Amalgamated
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Posted - 2007.03.12 21:29:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Banana Torres How about we get rid off all 0.0 alliances instead. It seems that they cannot play this game without breaking the EULA.
No 0.0 alliances, no sov, no cap ship yards, no Titans, no doomsday device.
And we get a game without the relentless cheating of BoB and the Goons.
Yep, a win/win solution. I vote for this.
you got... 1/5 there. DD's need a nerf imo.
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Laboratus
Gallente BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.03.12 21:35:00 -
[13]
just make the DDD take a flat 90-98% of cap when fired and set all resists and max speed to 0 until cap is up to 25% After that, it will be dead in the water for a couple of minutes... ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats |
Poolpy
dev zero
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Posted - 2007.03.12 21:53:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Dark Shikari Dreadnoughts can quite easily tank even 5 superweapon blasts. Heck, they can probably tank 20.
Welcome to capital ship online, where you are worthless in 0.0 if you don't have capital ship skills (add 1 year to wait) and few billion of isk.
Oh wait.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.12 21:55:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Laboratus just make the DDD take a flat 90-98% of cap when fired and set all resists and max speed to 0 until cap is up to 25% After that, it will be dead in the water for a couple of minutes...
One idea like that might be making DDDs like dropping a cyno- once you fire it, your warp and jump drives are disabled (maybe manoeuvring too, but its not really a biggy) for 10 minutes. If you fire DDD, you've got to have the courage of your convictions to stay stuck to the spot for 10 minutes. If its used right you'll have nothing to worry about (having just nuked the enemy, and no doubt still having a fresh fleet sat with you). Use it wrong and the fleet you fail to pop will pile in and have plenty of time to organise an attack.
It'd stop titan "abuse" (solopwn, nuke-and-runs, whatever) and make them (a bit) easier to kill, while not nerfing their usefulness. Plus it'd reward those who fly in fleets, while punishing those who think that capital ships are for solo work. --------
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ee21k
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Posted - 2007.03.12 21:58:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Smelt Down How to prevent the destruction of eve due to titans+supercap balancing
to quote 'the man' GIANT FLOATING SPACE ****S!.
they are not SUPPOSED to be balanced.
deal with it.
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.03.12 22:08:00 -
[17]
All they need to do is prevent titans/motherships from jumping out of bubbles, and they also need to make bubbles hold ships when they log out.
That would probably be enough to balance them, and if not the other thing that would be huge for balancing titans would be the removal of the remote cyno doomsday.
Shamis
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nickky01
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.03.12 22:13:00 -
[18]
just wait till they logout, duh
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hotgirl933
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Posted - 2007.03.12 22:37:00 -
[19]
if and when this becomes an issue CCP will look at fixing it
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Smelt Down
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Posted - 2007.03.12 22:52:00 -
[20]
Originally by: hotgirl933 if and when this becomes an issue CCP will look at fixing it
So the people who get get titans first get to abuse them, then once other people get them and can start competing, they are changed?
It is already becoming an issue since rumors have it that BoB has 3 on at a time, and the coalition +AAA can probably get 2 or 3. All it takes are 2 and the system is pretty much shut down.
No reason for non capital pilots to continue paying for the game if they cannot do anything.
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Izzy Pol
Fear and Loathing in LoneTrek
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Posted - 2007.03.12 23:23:00 -
[21]
Let supercaps be able to scram other supercaps imo.
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Raivi
Explosion Matrix
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Posted - 2007.03.12 23:40:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Dark Shikari Dreadnoughts can quite easily tank even 5 superweapon blasts. Heck, they can probably tank 20.
Between 20-25 DDs to realistically kill dreads.
----------------------------------------- Explosion Matrix: Our Name Makes No Sense |
umop 3pisdn
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2007.03.13 00:23:00 -
[23]
Originally by: fischsemmel Now, now.
God didn't sit down with the heads of state from the US and USSR when they developed thermonuclear weapons and say to them "I don't like where this is going; I'm going to have to nerf your nukes."
Why should CCP worry about titans and DDDs?
Lol when no ones left alive for CCP to balance eve will be in a great state of nuclear winter
Titans arent that bad... just give us a capital warp scram that is too big to fit on a BS but easy on a dread... how ******* hard is that? it would take all of 15 minutes. But no. We'll have to wait 5 months like everything else.
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Freighter Pilot
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Posted - 2007.03.13 00:25:00 -
[24]
1 battleship = 100-150 million isk, tech 1 fitted. Thats average. People don't take faction fitted navy ravens to the front lines. Or even really expensive tech II fitted tier ones.
500 battleships = 50 billion isk.
1 titan = 120 billion isk. Plus a few billion in fittings.
1 super weapon costs 60 million to use. Once. In fuel.
So, to sum that up, a titan that destroys a 500 battleship fleet, does not even do half its worth in damage. To my knowledge, nothing even near this magnitude has happened.
Anyone who says it is really powerful is right. Anyone who says it's unbalanced, is wrong.
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Aramendel
Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.03.13 00:30:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Aramendel on 13/03/2007 00:39:44
Originally by: Raivi
Originally by: Dark Shikari Dreadnoughts can quite easily tank even 5 superweapon blasts. Heck, they can probably tank 20.
Between 20-25 DDs to realistically kill dreads.
Jepp, I came to the same number.
But the question is: is that in *any* way an unrealistic number of titans per major alliance block in a year?
And once an alliance has this, how would you *ever* be able to kill one of it's POS then? Even if you field a similar force of titans. Once you try to attack a POS their titan swarm jumps in to a POS in system, instapop your dreads and jump out.
Originally by: Freighter Pilot 1 battleship = 100-150 million isk, tech 1 fitted. Thats average. People don't take faction fitted navy ravens to the front lines. Or even really expensive tech II fitted tier ones.
500 battleships = 50 billion isk.
1 titan = 120 billion isk. Plus a few billion in fittings.
1 super weapon costs 60 million to use. Once. In fuel.
So, to sum that up, a titan that destroys a 500 battleship fleet, does not even do half its worth in damage. To my knowledge, nothing even near this magnitude has happened.
Anyone who says it is really powerful is right. Anyone who says it's unbalanced, is wrong.
Hello clueless alt.
First, a fleet fitted BS is about 200 mil. Frontlines are sniper combat. For which you need t2 equipment - the only BS able to achieve sniper ranges with t1 equipment is the rokh. Which costs with t1 equipment almost 200 mil anyway.
Secondly, would you compare a single domi to 200 frigs? No? Because it would be stupid (oh, and the frigs would kill it in literary seconds)? But it costs as much as they do!
Newsflash: costs for bigger ships do not grow lineray, but expotentially. For a ship which has twice the combat effeciency you do not pay twice as much as for the weaker ship, but more around 10 times as much.
And thridly, a superweapon activation costs 75k fuel. One fuel unit is 300. Makes a bit over 20 mil per activation. Learn basic math.
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Auron Shadowbane
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Posted - 2007.03.13 10:49:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Aramendel
- stuff -
First, a fleet fitted BS is about 200 mil.
- stuff -
stop talking if you are too noob to know insurance...
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Viliny
Caldari principle of motion Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.03.13 11:01:00 -
[27]
insurance is overrated
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.13 11:42:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Auron Shadowbane
Originally by: Aramendel
- stuff -
First, a fleet fitted BS is about 200 mil.
- stuff -
stop talking if you are too noob to know insurance...
lol Insurange will help much on the cost of fittings ona Rokh or maesltrom... sure..... or in a machariel.. or vindicator..
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
KIATolon
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.03.13 11:43:00 -
[29]
As someone that's spent a long time fighting titans without one of my own they certainly feel over-powered and I suspect someting will happen to them.
Having titans able to siege seems good to me. Maybe only deply through cyno in siege - and only do small damage if they fire DD without siege... I dont know.
That said if they dont get looked at they wont get looked at however I think the alliances that put the work into getting the ships first should get the chance to enjoy them first. It's not always that new ships are over-powered, I remember dreads being underpowered.
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Aramendel
Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.03.13 12:44:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Auron Shadowbane stop talking if you are too noob to know insurance...
Newflash: titans have an insurance payout, too.
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