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Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
150
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Posted - 2016.09.05 11:59:08 -
[61] - Quote
Tergola wrote:This is just my opinion and example as an average pve player and a bad/very bad pvp player and also a person with a family and responsibilities. When mission npcs AI was "improved" I already had a few years of EVE, I had my main and an alt in low sec trying to pvp, two accounts for baiting/spying, one account for a logi tune, and a character with a perma-tank dominix to afk lvl4's and SPONSOR ALL OF THE ABOVE. So with the introduction of the improved npc AI my sponsor was useless. I can't see how would the removal of a semi-afk isk farmer benefit the game if it also means the removal of all of the accounts it was sponsoring. At that time I just moved slowly to other games and abandoned EVE.
In short: You left the game because CCP removed your favorite way to earn ISK. And you needed that ISK for your favorite playstyle. No more afk lvl4s = no ISK = no fun for you.
IMHO the real problem was that you were unable to earn enough ISK with your favorite playstyle to keep in running. That made you AFK grind level 4 missions to make up for your PVP loses. But one playerGÇÖs AFK ISK grind is another playerGÇÖs favorite playstyle. BAM - conflict of interests! Better NPC AI is nice for players that actually like to do those missions. Perhaps because they use those NPCs for very patient sparing partners until they feel confident to go against real players. There is a legit demand for better NPC AI while the demand for AFK ISK grind is just a workaround for another problem. They killed your workaround but even if they didnGÇÖt your main problem would have been the same anyway.
Tergola wrote: Now I came back, I want to play but like back then, I still have a life, a job, and I still find some time to be very active in game but what good is that if I need to spend it all on making isk? I used to semi-afk missions even at work a bit, when having dinner, or taking a shower. Now what should I do - give up having a life, give up Facebook / YouTube / films just to have the time to make isk and also pvp?
What kind of PVP are we talking about? Solo, gang, fleet, alliance, highsec gank war or something else? Because I think some ways to PVP are much more expensive than others. And that brings me to the question whether every player should be able to do every playstyle regardless of time and skill involved? Why should I practice and become good in PVP when I could just AFK grind PVE stuff to achieve the same things? Perhaps you should stick to less expensive PVP because you wrote yourself that you were Gǣbad/very badGǥ at PVPGǪ just a thought. What is the point grinding for big ships when you gonna lose them anyway? Practicing your PVP skills should work in most ships.
Tergola wrote: I'm posting this only because ccp looks so pathetic now begging for players when it was them who carefully selected only the active players and mock the semi active ones, and since I know that the average player-age in EVE is high, that means that many players have a life and responsibilities or just other stuff to do then being extremely active and careful at what's going on with their characters in game. But after seeing the ships levelled between races and still vargur and kronos get a useless bonus to the fall-off instead of optimal like the already better in dps paladin, I wonder why do I still bother writing all this... And btw, THAT ab bonus on nightmare...........it would have been better off with a structure hp bonus.. ccp = ignorance
I donGÇÖt think CCP ignore the fact that they are losing some GÇ£semi activeGÇ¥ players. Maybe they just came to the conclusion that AFK grind is the start of a downward spiral and accept some losses in favor of a long-time strategy. GÇ£That game is totally healthy.. it has lots of AFK grindersGÇ¥ doesnGÇÖt have a good ring to it, does it? And I donGÇÖt think they are begging pathetically for new players.. they just adapt to a changing environment. Players come (like myself) and go (like you?) all the time. Can I have your stuff?
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
18002
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Posted - 2016.09.05 12:08:45 -
[62] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Malcanis wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
So you're openly defending someone who is rage-quitting because they can't "semi-AFK" hi-sec missions in a Golem? Nope, just making an observation and I didn't get that impression when I read the OP. Even if they're considering quitting, instead of pushing them to do so, maybe offer some alternative ideas to help make their game play a bit more enjoyable, like first take out all small and medium size hull class NPC's, then launch Drones, sit back and watch them eat up the larger hull class NPC's. Anyway, doesn't matter much, I'm sure ISD will be along soon. DMC
I'll spell it out for you: there is no ship that can more easily "semi-AFK" hi-sec missions than a Golem.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Sarina Aideron
Aideron Corp
28
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Posted - 2016.09.05 12:09:09 -
[63] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
You must be new to EVE forums.
Theres a good reason why EVE forums are only used by like 0,5% of players. |
Serene Repose
2895
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Posted - 2016.09.05 12:39:01 -
[64] - Quote
Sarina Aideron wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
You must be new to EVE forums. Theres a good reason why EVE forums are only used by like 0,5% of players. You must be oblivious. There are other sections of the forum.
*99.7569302% of all internet stats are made up on the spot*
We must accommodate the idiocracy.
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Tergola
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
25
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Posted - 2016.09.05 12:47:53 -
[65] - Quote
This Malcanis guy is so funny |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
2340
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Posted - 2016.09.05 13:30:19 -
[66] - Quote
Sequester Risalo wrote:Tergola wrote:Many of you are missing my point. It's obvious now that semi-aactive playing was a big part of the player community and it's obvious now that those players have either drastically reduced the number of their accounts or have moved completely to doing other stuff than EVE. If you are correct and all afk mission runners plexing 5 other accounts with their activity are gone, why hasn't the price of plex dropped significantly?Are the big traders holding vast amounts of piolot licenses so successful in manipulating the market?
In a word, yes...
The fact is that a lot of more casual players especially in hisec left the game, plex prices are one of the reasons for that reduction, there are other reasons too.
Tergola wrote:This Malcanis guy is so funny
He tries too hard at times Just because you mentioned a bling fitted Golem does not mean that you were using that to semi-AFK rat, but I guess it must have tickled him somewhere.
Anyway the first rule of Eve forums, expect to be trolled if you go against the Eve herd think, which you did. I certainly appreciated your post. All the best for your efforts here
When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
17899
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Posted - 2016.09.05 13:37:19 -
[67] - Quote
G¼å https://youtu.be/cxo0pSNYMXE
=]|[=
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Solecist Project
32954
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Posted - 2016.09.05 13:49:11 -
[68] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote: That is extremely accurate!
We should spread something like this more often: http://www.2knowmyself.com/why_do_some_people_always_disagree_with_others
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
2341
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Posted - 2016.09.05 13:58:30 -
[69] - Quote
I have become very interested in the development of the alt right on the internet, such as 4chan and the like, it is very refreshing to see young people who have shaken off their conditioning and are able to express their opinions without having to conform to group think.
When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.
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Keno Skir
833
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:00:33 -
[70] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
I normally agree with you, but not in this case :)
I think regardless of the age of a player, if they play AFK they are deserving of 0 respect and should be removed.
Gùï> 30 Day Buddy Trial + ISK Bonus & Starting Assistance <Gùï
Feel free to contact me regarding my posts, or my 30 Day EvE Buddy Trials \o/
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Solecist Project
32958
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:02:44 -
[71] - Quote
Gregorius Goldstein wrote:In short: You left the game because CCP removed your favorite way to earn ISK. And you needed that ISK for your favorite playstyle.
Being afk is not a playstyle. One does not play when afk.
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Tergola
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
26
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:02:52 -
[72] - Quote
Oh Malcanis is trolling... Now I understand his semi-afk golem! |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
2341
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:02:59 -
[73] - Quote
Keno Skir wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
I normally agree with you, but not in this case :) I think regardless of the age of a player, if they play AFK they are deserving of 0 respect and should be removed.
AFK cloaky campers? They seem to get a lot of respect from HTFU types...
When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.
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Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
711
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:03:27 -
[74] - Quote
Of course. We've very carefully conditioned our youth to not conform to anything - working as intended. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
17900
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:09:12 -
[75] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:Of course. We've very carefully conditioned our youth to not conform to anything - working as intended. We have a strictly structured non - antidisestablesnentarianism program in our house, it is progressing well, the children are confirming brilliantly.
Side note, you can tell when someone's read too much Joseph Heller.
=]|[=
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Solecist Project
32961
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:12:32 -
[76] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:I have become very interested in the development of the alt right on the internet, such as 4chan and the like, it is very refreshing to see young people who have shaken off their conditioning and are able to express their opinions without having to conform to group think. You should know better than throwing this nonsense at me... ... especially because it could be applied to yourself as well.
Look at yourself. You always step in when the dumb people come out of their holes. Not that you are dumb, no. What you're doing, all the ******* time, is trying to come accross as a good person who supports the weak.
What the rest of the world sees, though, is that you are making yourself look just like them.
No one actually perceives you as what you want to be perceived ... ... except for your social circle and those you pick out through selective bias.
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Tergola
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
26
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:17:13 -
[77] - Quote
Keno Skir wrote:DeMichael Crimson wrote:Wow, this subforum has really gone to crap. Bet CCP really loves all of the indignant self righteous people here showing open hostility, calling the OP a troll and saying quit.
Good job. Hell it's bad enough this game chases off new players, definitely don't need to do the same to older players as well.
DMC
I normally agree with you, but not in this case :) I think regardless of the age of a player, if they play AFK they are deserving of 0 respect and should be removed. Guys, ok, I'm wrong and my play style is wrong and I should be removed unless I play actively. And I actually thought this when I moved to other games and stopped keeping 6-8 accounts active and kept only 2 just to be a spectator. Considering all the above, adding the fact that ccp has improved the game a lot, tell me, why have accounts dropped in numbers in the last few years? I'm not saying that my reason is the only reason accounts have dropped, I'm saying my reason it's surely the reason for many other players and that surely adds up to perhaps some others factor. |
Solecist Project
32970
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Posted - 2016.09.05 14:20:56 -
[78] - Quote
Is this now what's called "moving the goalpost" ?
I'm never sure.
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
1206
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Posted - 2016.09.05 16:02:33 -
[79] - Quote
Tergola wrote:Considering all the above, adding the fact that ccp has improved the game a lot, tell me, why have accounts dropped in numbers in the last few years? There will not be the one reason but rather a whole bunch of them. That's not making it easier for CCP for obvious reasons.
Here are just a couple of them that come to mind:
- Aging playerbase (rl)
- Many changes in playstyle (like the ones you mentioned) and people unable to adapt
- CCPs focus on group play
- Banning of multipexing
Please note that not all changes are neccessarily bad for EVE's gameplay. Just reasons for not logging in anymore.
Remove insurance.
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Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
714
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Posted - 2016.09.05 16:08:45 -
[80] - Quote
Maybe it's just time for a break; I'm sure you'll pick up your favourite video game after a while. Lord knows I still play doom 1, even gave Gods (yes, the bitmap brother's classic) a good rip again and finally finished The Last Starfighter on an Atari 800 emulator.
This just goes to show ... it's possible to burn out, and come back with a vengeance later on.
We'll be seeing ya! |
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Solecist Project
32974
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Posted - 2016.09.05 16:23:56 -
[81] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:Maybe it's just time for a break; I'm sure you'll pick up your favourite video game after a while. Lord knows I still play doom 1, even gave Gods (yes, the bitmap brother's classic) a good rip again and finally finished The Last Starfighter on an Atari 800 emulator.
This just goes to show ... it's possible to burn out, and come back with a vengeance later on.
We'll be seeing ya! I remember playing DOOM 1 ... ... on a nullmodem cable.
Epic experience!
I remember the Bitmap Brothers. A name guaranteeing high quality games. My favourite was magic pockets. Played the **** out of it! :D
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Solecist Project
32974
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Posted - 2016.09.05 16:25:07 -
[82] - Quote
Mara Pahrdi wrote:Tergola wrote:Considering all the above, adding the fact that ccp has improved the game a lot, tell me, why have accounts dropped in numbers in the last few years? There will not be the one reason but rather a whole bunch of them. That's not making it easier for CCP for obvious reasons. Here are just a couple of them that come to mind:
- Aging playerbase (rl)
- Many changes in playstyle (like the ones you mentioned) and people unable to adapt
- CCPs focus on group play
- Banning of multipexing
Please note that not all changes are neccessarily bad for EVE's gameplay. Just reasons for not logging in anymore. Not to forget MCT.
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
715
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Posted - 2016.09.05 16:46:31 -
[83] - Quote
Solecist Project wrote: I remember playing DOOM 1 ... ... on a nullmodem cable.
Epic experience!
I remember the Bitmap Brothers. A name guaranteeing high quality games. My favourite was magic pockets. Played the **** out of it! :D
Yeeap! Never knew about magic pockets (but then again, what I knew came from bulletin board or fishy looking perforated floppies ahahaha)
Now, while I didn't mean to sidetrack the conversation I must confess not only the games themselves, but also the gamers have changed. I intended to play the old classics (not just the way-back-machine Atari arcade but also contemporary titles such as Quake, Starcraft, Tiberium Wars, Mechwarriors or Dark Crusade) - well anyway, I intended to re-play those with my kids, and guess what? They're "too hard".
For a second I feared maybe the graphics might be a downer for them, maybe the fiddling and tweaking required to get them to run, tunneling a fake IPX protocol over UDP or any of that shennanigans; but NO! It wasn't any of that. The games are "too fast", the computer AI is "too hard", the waves come "too soon" and when they make a boo-boo they're quite suckered and have to restart.
The audacity!
Makes me wonder... since when do 10 year olds not like Arcade? I anticipated me being rusty and my reflexes going downhill they'd be making fun of me but I never imagined they'd rather play Minecraft in creative mode?!?
This worries me. I don't know how or why this came to pass but Player expectations are very different these days- even among the young ones who've never been spoilt by smartphone crap. And, taking the point back to EvE- I think this may be what we're experiencing. The problem is not EvE. Times are a-changing, that's all. I'm happy there's still a game out there for me and I don't care if it's not top-ranked or not 'popular' according to the tabloids.
Hm. Now I forgot what I was harping on about. Ah yes! Magic Pockets; never played it, I'll see if I can snag a download. Thanks for the pointer ma'am! |
Solecist Project
32985
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Posted - 2016.09.05 21:50:47 -
[84] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote: Now, while I didn't mean to sidetrack the conversation I must confess not only the games themselves, but also the gamers have changed. I intended to play the old classics (not just the way-back-machine Atari arcade but also contemporary titles such as Quake, Starcraft, Tiberium Wars, Mechwarriors or Dark Crusade) - well anyway, I intended to re-play those with my kids, and guess what? They're "too hard".
For a second I feared maybe the graphics might be a downer for them, maybe the fiddling and tweaking required to get them to run, tunneling a fake IPX protocol over UDP or any of that shennanigans; but NO! It wasn't any of that. The games are "too fast", the computer AI is "too hard", the waves come "too soon" and when they make a boo-boo they're quite suckered and have to restart.
The audacity!
Makes me wonder... since when do 10 year olds not like Arcade? I anticipated me being rusty and my reflexes going downhill they'd be making fun of me but I never imagined they'd rather play Minecraft in creative mode?!?
This worries me. I don't know how or why this came to pass but Player expectations are very different these days- even among the young ones who've never been spoilt by smartphone crap. And, taking the point back to EvE- I think this may be what we're experiencing. The problem is not EvE. Times are a-changing, that's all. I'm happy there's still a game out there for me and I don't care if it's not top-ranked or not 'popular' according to the tabloids.
Hm. Now I forgot what I was harping on about. Ah yes! Magic Pockets; never played it, I'll see if I can snag a download. Thanks for the pointer ma'am!
Are you serious?
Today's "gamers" are a bunch of sissies who need it easy. The industry themselves turned them into a bunch of morons by constantly trying to please them, helping them find the way (notice how seriously linear and boring most games are?) and avoid any actual failures.
Of course they say "too hard", because they're used to easy ****. Teach them that, when they make it, they'll be better than the vast majority of modern gamers. It's people like you and me who can touch any of these modern games and beat them, easily, because they're literally ****. It's not even the modern gamers fault, it's the fault of the industry that manipulates them, tries to address their seriously low self esteem and actually only cares about the money.
Oh and Magic Pocket is one of those "too hard" games. A Jump and Run. It's really fun! Give it to your children and tell them if they reach lvl5 you give them something.
If my memory serves me right, that'll take a good while.
OR EVEN BETTER, LET THEM PLAY COMMANDER KEEN! YOU GET TOUCHED ONCE AND YOU HAVE TO RESTART THE LEVEL!
I loved the **** out of this game.
The absolute BEST you can do is trying to motivate your children away from "LOOK HOW GOOD I AM from playing easy games" to "LOOK! I FINALLY MANAGED TO BEAT IT! from playing actually challenging games". It'll increase their cognitive abilities, their reflexes and their hand-eye coordination.
Maybe we should get together and play some classics! :)
That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
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Keebler Wizard
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
25
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Posted - 2016.09.05 22:08:41 -
[85] - Quote
Tergola wrote:Keebler Wizard wrote:Tergola wrote:Tam Arai wrote:you have a job, buy plex for cash and sell on market- no afk mission running needed I would rather quit the game than pay with real money for sub. And if it was only me thinking this way, then it wouldn't be a big deal at all, but looking at the dropping numbers of paying accounts, it seems that there's a big category of players who think this way. But hey, guess what. Those accounts that are only plexing, arnt "paying" accounts. The only money CCP got was when the original player bought the plex. (Which also means someone with a subbed account gave CCP MORE money for said plex). So your entire statement is backwards. You leaving would actually be a good thing. Less of a leech on the plex system. Are you one of those players who think losing your thorax doesn't cost you anything just because you mined for it?
Dude I make around 5b isk PROFIT a month without touching a single rat or rock. You'd need 10+ miners mining around the clock to supply my operation. Why don't you learn how to play the game before you try and call someone out. |
ISD Buldath
ISD STAR
478
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Posted - 2016.09.05 22:12:38 -
[86] - Quote
EVE is Not Easy. Closed at Op owners Request.
~ISD Buldath
Commander
Support, Training and Resources Division
Interstellar Services Department
I do not respond to EVE-Mails regarding forum moderation.
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