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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Khan Wrenth
Ore Oppression Prevention and Salvation
688
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Posted - 2016.09.27 06:25:55 -
[151] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I think the obvious solution is: If looting makes you suspect, you can't toss it directly into the DST unless the DST is already suspect. If the DST pilot wants to loot it directly, they can do it and go suspect if their safety is off.
Now of course you can pull the loot first into a "throwaway" ship and then put it in the DST, but if only a DST can hold it then what are you using, a throwaway DST? If it's all in small parts, you could put some in the throwaway ship, then transfer to DST, then another load, and so on, trying to get through it before the throwaway ship is popped. Alternatively, you can just fit the DST with warp stabs and a MJD and try to get away before they break your tank. Plenty of options available, but no more circumventing the system. The obvious solution has failed right off the bat.
The already-mentioned workaround for that is simply dropping loot into a cargo pod. Now the DST simply takes the loot from the cargo pod.
Let's suppose for a moment, that you were aiming for "can't transfer loot unless you have sufficient room in your own cargo space to first take the loot, THEN place it in the cargo pod". Fair enough. Ity V can get 40k cargo, which means anything not already in a huge freight container (50k size/capacity) is already subject to looting through this workaround. And guess what...the freighter's workaround for that is...put everything in an enormous freight container...which is already available and viable in-game. And has already been proposed, to boot.
I think that every single idea that has ever come up to make looting more difficult, has been a ****-tornado of needlessly over-complicated rewrites of the code, endless loopholes, and unfeasible tasks (items cannot have an owner). So let me make this really simple for this thread and every other potential thread that will inevitably come along...
STOP TRYING TO TWEAK LOOTING MECHANICS . IT DOES NOT AND CANNOT WORK.
Furthermore, I think there are some individuals that need a quick lesson about this game.
Nothing in this game is yours. You own nothing except the SPs in your head. The items in your cargo hold, hanger, or ship array, ARE NOT YOURS. YOU DO NOT OWN THEM. They are in a container you have control over. But, THEY ARE NOT YOURS. There is a very distinct and important difference there.
That's why there's no such thing as "stealing" in this game. That's why nothing is ever flagged as "yours", and why "stolen item flag" cannot be carried across multiple ships. They haven't stolen a thing, because you possessed nothing to begin with. They're flagged for an act of removal of items from a container, not for possessing items that you used to have in your cargo hold.
Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
2776
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Posted - 2016.09.27 06:33:52 -
[152] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I think the obvious solution is: If looting makes you suspect, you can't toss it directly into the DST unless the DST is already suspect. If the DST pilot wants to loot it directly, they can do it and go suspect if their safety is off.
Now of course you can pull the loot first into a "throwaway" ship and then put it in the DST, but if only a DST can hold it then what are you using, a throwaway DST? If it's all in small parts, you could put some in the throwaway ship, then transfer to DST, then another load, and so on, trying to get through it before the throwaway ship is popped. Alternatively, you can just fit the DST with warp stabs and a MJD and try to get away before they break your tank. Plenty of options available, but no more circumventing the system. Then you 'launder' the loot into a jetcan with the noobship and scoop it with the DST. Or you skip that entirely and put it into a Mobile Depot and come back 15 minutes later. Or as you say you just scoop it into a stabbed DST directly and warp while aligned or MJD away. And even if, by some chance the DST pilot screws up and get pointed, all that happens is another hauler gets destroyed with no chance of escalation or a real fight as Salah pointed out.
I am sure CCP has or will look at it (and they should) but upon examining all angles they will back off and leave it alone until some future time when they are revamping all of Crimewatch. Just like CCP Rise did when his team looked at fixing the Margin Trading scam yet in the end left it alone. Like that issue, there is no simple solution for this that isn't trivially circumvented (or will break something else) and will produce the desired conflict this mechanic is intended to promote. It just isn't worth the energy to fix in isolation.
The 8 Golden Rules of Eve
Why Do They Gank?
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Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
417
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Posted - 2016.09.27 07:56:57 -
[153] - Quote
Teckos Pech wrote:Shallanna Yassavi wrote:CONCORD will burn down whatever touches the freighter in the gank. CONCORD won't burn whatever escort is brought for the flashy yellow hauler with the stolen loot. Edit: that is, if shooting a flashy yellow got a limited engagement with everyone in the flashy yellow guy's fleet. Please tell me how the hauler getting a suspect timer would result in two fleets fighting. Salah's proposal was to create a limited engagement between the members of a fleet and whoever shot their flashy yellow guy.
Throw enough firepower at flashy yellow DST to kill it -> flashy yellow DST needs protection. Protection is allowed to shoot back at the threat(s) because the threat(s) are now flashy green thanks to a limited engagement.
I believe that's what we call the makings of a fleet fight. Or the gank fleet could have a second set of gank alts for that.
A signature :o
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Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
817
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Posted - 2016.09.27 09:34:15 -
[154] - Quote
Shallanna Yassavi wrote:Teckos Pech wrote:Shallanna Yassavi wrote:CONCORD will burn down whatever touches the freighter in the gank. CONCORD won't burn whatever escort is brought for the flashy yellow hauler with the stolen loot. Edit: that is, if shooting a flashy yellow got a limited engagement with everyone in the flashy yellow guy's fleet. Please tell me how the hauler getting a suspect timer would result in two fleets fighting. Salah's proposal was to create a limited engagement between the members of a fleet and whoever shot their flashy yellow guy. Throw enough firepower at flashy yellow DST to kill it -> flashy yellow DST needs protection. Protection is allowed to shoot back at the threat(s) because the threat(s) are now flashy green thanks to a limited engagement. I believe that's what we call the makings of a fleet fight. Or the gank fleet could have a second set of gank alts for that. That'd be bad. We had that once, and turned out more often than not the 'bait suspect' was in fleet with everyone in system ;-) |
elitatwo
Eve Minions O.U.Z.O. Alliance
1421
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Posted - 2016.09.27 13:03:07 -
[155] - Quote
If it looks like bait, smells like bait, moves like bait..
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Salah ad-Din al-Jawahiri
New Order Logistics CODE.
542
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Posted - 2016.09.27 13:04:53 -
[156] - Quote
Shallanna Yassavi wrote:Collateral damage: anything flashy yellow can be bait for a fleet. If shooting the flashy yellow thing is how you turn flashy green to a fleet, people are going to be even less inclined to shoot the flashy yellow thing when flying alone.
It would be nice to make gankers bring shinier things than cats and stealth bombers to a fight. They'd have to if they wanted to defend their flashy yellow prizes. Disposable cats are terribad when the fight runs longer than 10 seconds and there's a possibility of incoming damage.
Pay attention: I didn't write "limited engagement with the fleet". I wrote "limited engagement with the yellow target's corp". Big difference. |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
5278
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Posted - 2016.09.27 17:28:04 -
[157] - Quote
Shallanna Yassavi wrote:Teckos Pech wrote:Shallanna Yassavi wrote:CONCORD will burn down whatever touches the freighter in the gank. CONCORD won't burn whatever escort is brought for the flashy yellow hauler with the stolen loot. Edit: that is, if shooting a flashy yellow got a limited engagement with everyone in the flashy yellow guy's fleet. Please tell me how the hauler getting a suspect timer would result in two fleets fighting. Salah's proposal was to create a limited engagement between the members of a fleet and whoever shot their flashy yellow guy. Throw enough firepower at flashy yellow DST to kill it -> flashy yellow DST needs protection. Protection is allowed to shoot back at the threat(s) because the threat(s) are now flashy green thanks to a limited engagement. I believe that's what we call the makings of a fleet fight. Or the gank fleet could have a second set of gank alts for that.
Yeah, I don't think this could be abused ever.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
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