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Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 03:47:43 -
[1] - Quote
Hello Everyone,
I'm a new Capsuler and I love EVE. EvE is a game based on human interactions. Current Mining and PvE (Except Incursions) is a grinder and not really to develop human interactions. Something I believe could attract and retain more people is the following:
New Combat sites/Missions that require people to apply for them. In other RPGs there is something called instances. Where you do a special dungeon (combat site) with a limited number of people. Lets say 4. Once 4 people apply for it they allow those people to access to a special area in space. Then you have a challenging site that requires to have a logi pilot. Logi is not a requirement but always "logi > self rep". Then only fleet members can access the combat site.
Requirements could be be in a fleet of X number of people as minimum and Y number of people as maximum.
This can create a huge amount of variations and boost player/player interactions, therefore attract more people into it. This can be additional to current PvE mechanics.
Also it doesn't require a huge amount of new code as the key system for combat sites already exists.
What do you guys think?
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3059
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Posted - 2016.09.10 03:49:55 -
[2] - Quote
what do you mean "(except Incursions)" only human interaction that comes out of these is "sub optimal fit/ship gtfo of fleet" all run by players in npc or alt corps safe and snug in hs
Citadel worm hole tax
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Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 04:03:18 -
[3] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:what do you mean "(except Incursions)" only human interaction that comes out of these is "sub optimal fit/ship gtfo of fleet" all run by players in npc or alt corps safe and snug in hs
I thought Incursions where a bit different. I understand the isk on those is about 60 mil/hour, which is not amazing ...
Maybe everything pve needs a slight boost in reward?. but hey!, you didn't comment on my idea. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3059
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Posted - 2016.09.10 04:26:34 -
[4] - Quote
that's because your idea is a joke eve doesn't need queues
Citadel worm hole tax
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Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 04:31:38 -
[5] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:that's because your idea is a joke eve doesn't need queues
why is that?, explain
it's successful in other games. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3059
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Posted - 2016.09.10 04:55:17 -
[6] - Quote
thats because those games are built like a theme park eve is built as an organic sandbox
not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve
Citadel worm hole tax
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Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 05:06:49 -
[7] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:thats because those games are built like a theme park eve is built as an organic sandbox
not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve
I don't see how instance is different from regular combat sites. or how it goes against the sandbox, (organic sandbox just sound stupid). It only promotes player coop, just as incursions requires a team. it's a mission that requires coop. and restricts the access to it if not coop.
This doesn't transform eve into a theme park, just add more variety. Of course this is only my opinion and I appreciate yours.
Thanks
Cheers Eris Republic University |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
824
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Posted - 2016.09.10 06:06:52 -
[8] - Quote
Eris Picornia wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:thats because those games are built like a theme park eve is built as an organic sandbox
not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve I don't see how instance is different from regular combat sites. or how it goes against the sandbox, (organic sandbox just sound stupid). It only promotes player coop, just as incursions requires a team. it's a mission that requires coop. and restricts the access to it if not coop. This doesn't transform eve into a theme park, just add more variety. Of course this is only my opinion and I appreciate yours. Thanks Cheers Eris Republic University
how can people reach you to interact with you in the sometimes non-conseual pvp way. Why no instances...you can't be reached. Player A wants to PVE. Player B wants to PVP. Its now on Player A to want to PVE and not die more than player B wants to pvp and kill player A. Posted a way to be hard to probe...e stalk that thread. Can't be found easily, can't be pvp'd easily. Simple stuff.
Incursions give you this now.
Or...your 4 people can go out, not in pimp marauders and pirate BSs, and run a harder mission. Drop the level of ship, make the level 4 harder in a way and have at it.
example: In the past and I had 2 accounts when the combat char on 0.0 breaks in empire I'd have them dual box missions with the empire mission alt. To spice things up....empire alt would be in a meat shield boat and I'd say well....lets take the hound level 4 running. Fun and interesting times happened, bombers torp spec run level 4 pretty decent all in all. If something else (my meat shield rattler) was there to kill frigates and cruisers.
have 2 people do this, they can coop it.
Other fun ideas.....max gank dps mission boat. Logi backup and something small to run around and kill frigates. 3 people run now. Hell make it 4....recon player blasting paint, webs, etc.
Works for ratting too. You can pimp with expensive gear one BS to run a haven or sanctum and not die. Or 2-4 people with more modest fits can run it. Still pays well....and you cut the cost of the run because your tank only costs 300 million, not 600 mil. I try to be a cheap bear (currently in empire, used to bear in nun 0.0 between ops at times).
If I save say 300 mil on cost of boat, its 300 mil less I have to make back before I can even say the boat makes a profit. Faster paid off...faster I am actually making profit.
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3060
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Posted - 2016.09.10 07:11:34 -
[9] - Quote
Eris Picornia wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:thats because those games are built like a theme park eve is built as an organic sandbox
not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve I don't see how instance is different from regular combat sites.
i can get into your combat site.... that's how. its not a sandbox if i cant trip over your sandcastle
Citadel worm hole tax
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Vincent Pelletier
Pelletier Imports and Exports
7
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Posted - 2016.09.10 07:18:38 -
[10] - Quote
Eris Picornia wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:thats because those games are built like a theme park eve is built as an organic sandbox
not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve I don't see how instance is different from regular combat sites. or how it goes against the sandbox, (organic sandbox just sound stupid). It only promotes player coop, just as incursions requires a team. it's a mission that requires coop. and restricts the access to it if not coop. This doesn't transform eve into a theme park, just add more variety. Of course this is only my opinion and I appreciate yours. Thanks Cheers Eris Republic University
If you don't understand why instances goes against the very idea of EVE then you don't understand EVE. That is fine of course, you're new after all, but trust us when we say it's wrong in so many ways it's not even funny. EVE is an open sandbox where everyone can kick in every one else's castle. Having a castle behind invisible and impenetrable magic doors makes no sense in a sandbox. |
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Tsukino Stareine
Art Of Explosions 404 Hole Not Found
1795
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Posted - 2016.09.10 10:09:20 -
[11] - Quote
No instancing please horrible idea. This isn't wow in space |
Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 10:42:16 -
[12] - Quote
There are already combat sites that you can access only with a key.
this is not new entirely new to eve... and this would take place in high sec... but I see the hole idea seems disliked.
Thanks for the support. I appreciate it. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3065
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Posted - 2016.09.10 10:56:07 -
[13] - Quote
except those keys can be bought and sold so again i can still get to your sand castle
Citadel worm hole tax
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Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
963
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Posted - 2016.09.10 10:58:54 -
[14] - Quote
I kind of like the idea of gate locks being tied to the number of characters, rather than a special item you carry in your cargo.
Finding ways to encourage interaction is all good in my book, though I'd drop the word 'instancing'.
Make it that 2, 3, 4, etc. characters must be withing a certain range before a gate activates and I could see something like that having a positive aspect.
Limit the number of systems, so players can congregate in those systems, both the site runners and the players that would like to shoot them, but in all cases the gate only activates if the required number of ships are within range.
As far as PvE goes, it's at least an idea that encourages group play, even if not perfect.
Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3071
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:05:41 -
[15] - Quote
yeah... more player interaction... *starts logging in alts
Citadel worm hole tax
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3512
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:11:42 -
[16] - Quote
The other thing that promotes player cooperation is the risk that you get ambushed by bad guys.
Just say 'No' to instances.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3071
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:18:51 -
[17] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:The other thing that promotes player cooperation is the risk that you get ambushed by bad guys.
Just say 'No' to instances.
wait wait wait...
are you saying that i could cooperate with other players to help defend ourselves from other players cooperation to harm us?
Citadel worm hole tax
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FT Diomedes
The Graduates
2680
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:26:29 -
[18] - Quote
No, instances have no place in Eve.
CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
17980
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:31:02 -
[19] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:The other thing that promotes player cooperation is the risk that you get ambushed by bad guys.
Just say 'No' to instances. wait wait wait... are you saying that i could cooperate with other players to help defend ourselves from other players cooperation to harm us? MADNESS ! MADNESS , LIE'S AND SLANDER! Don't listen to him, This is an MMO after all, everyone knows you solo those.
Click me
=]|[=
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
26785
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Posted - 2016.09.10 11:50:58 -
[20] - Quote
It's not a new PvE idea by any stretch of the imagination; it's one that's been brought up many many times over the last 13 years.
Civilised behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business.
New Player FAQ
Feyd's Survival Pack
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3071
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Posted - 2016.09.10 12:05:22 -
[21] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:The other thing that promotes player cooperation is the risk that you get ambushed by bad guys.
Just say 'No' to instances. wait wait wait... are you saying that i could cooperate with other players to help defend ourselves from other players cooperation to harm us? MADNESS ! MADNESS , LIE'S AND SLANDER! Don't listen to him, This is an MMO after all, everyone knows you solo those.
oh thank god i was thinking i may actually need to talk to people (the scare me)
BLOPS Hauler
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Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
824
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Posted - 2016.09.10 12:50:19 -
[22] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:yeah... more player interaction... *starts logging in alts
Basically. High sp main and decent leveled alts built to certain specs crew checking in. After this account just came online a month ago from a year break I woke up another account last night. both have chars that fly mean pve ships. It why I woke account last night in fact. Pvp itch grows, that accounts main makes the money when the combat char can't. Just getting her up to speed since I put her on ice like 2.5 to 3 years ago....she needs some reeducation for skill changes
NIce instanced room all to my selves, fun fits, PVE smash, get paid.
OP this is why level 5's which also require teamwork in theory, were moved to low sec. Team work in time became dual boxed rattlesnakes. Passive tanked to ride out neuting from towers till you popped them. This the easy way...active tank freaks had their own issues to work out if they wanted to stay that way lol.
In low sec you need a team, hence the move. |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
983
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Posted - 2016.09.10 13:14:49 -
[23] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve
Zan Shiro wrote:how can people reach you to interact with you in the sometimes non-conseual pvp way. A response to both of these. I do not see anywhere in the posts where the OP wants these sites restricted to the first fleet into them. I see a request for sites that require you to have a fleet to enter, that works for both sides. In reality this idea would do as much to promote group play from the PvP side as it would from the PvE side. Yes, yes I know the whole alts thingy and our friend Lugh leads us into that with this post.
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:yeah... more player interaction... *starts logging in alts Need boosts log in an alt. Need a cyno, log in an alt. Need someone to scout that worm hole log in alt. Need someone to combat scan that fool so you can kill him log in alt. Need someone to bring you more ammo for a tower bash log in alt. Need a little more to run that nul sec anom for ISKies log in alt. Need a little more to run that worm hole for ISKies log in alt. Need a scan character to help keep you safe while running that worm hole site log in alt. Need someone to haul stuff into Jita for you log in an alt. Need a market trader because low sec status log in an alt. Do I need to continue or have I made my point. Even more so in PvP than in PvE EvE is a game of alts. To condemn a PvE idea because "alts" when the game is flooded with PvP alts is well............ better not go there or the ISD may not like my post, so we will just say it is pathetic.
In other words if alts online is bad then we need to remove alts online from ALL aspects of the game. If alts are OK in some areas then they are OK in ALL areas. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3071
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Posted - 2016.09.10 13:19:14 -
[24] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:not to mention the entire idea of an instance goes against a core value of eve Zan Shiro wrote:how can people reach you to interact with you in the sometimes non-conseual pvp way. A response to both of these. I do not see anywhere in the posts where the OP wants these sites restricted to the first fleet into them. I see a request for sites that require you to have a fleet to enter, that works for both sides. In reality this idea would do as much to promote group play from the PvP side as it would from the PvE side. Yes, yes I know the whole alts thingy and our friend Lugh leads us into that with this post.
Quote:In other RPGs there is something called instances. Where you do a special dungeon (combat site) with a limited number of people. Lets say 4. Once 4 people apply for it they allow those people to access to a special area in space.
because thats how instances work in other games not to mention
Quote:and Y number of people as maximum. even if it didn't why should there be an area of space where i can't interact with you just because you have more alts than me?
and you can't just ignore alts because they are not going anywhere things have to be balanced with them in mind
BLOPS Hauler
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Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
824
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Posted - 2016.09.10 14:24:18 -
[25] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote: I do not see anywhere in the posts where the OP wants these sites restricted to the first fleet into them. I see a request for sites that require you to have a fleet to enter, that works for both sides. In reality this idea would do as much to promote group play from the PvP side as it would from the PvE side. Yes, yes I know the whole alts thingy and our friend Lugh leads us into that with this post.
He said 4 players enter and only 4 players. It be analogous to something warhammer online had long ago. They put these instances in the middle of the pvp lakes. All you had to do was make it the dungeon entrance (not hard). In the instance...you were off the grid and in your own world.
He is basing this on combat sites. He covered that. He however seems to be unaware keys to combat sites are available on the market. His idea has no key. 4 man fleet signs up and poof, its a scenario pop. They will be back later sometime. |
Eris Picornia
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2016.09.10 16:25:25 -
[26] - Quote
Zan Shiro wrote:Donnachadh wrote: I do not see anywhere in the posts where the OP wants these sites restricted to the first fleet into them. I see a request for sites that require you to have a fleet to enter, that works for both sides. In reality this idea would do as much to promote group play from the PvP side as it would from the PvE side. Yes, yes I know the whole alts thingy and our friend Lugh leads us into that with this post.
He said 4 players enter and only 4 players. It be analogous to something warhammer online had long ago. They put these instances in the middle of the pvp lakes. All you had to do was make it the dungeon entrance (not hard). In the instance...you were off the grid and in your own world. He is basing this on combat sites. He covered that. He however seems to be unaware keys to combat sites are available on the market. His idea has no key. 4 man fleet signs up and poof, its a scenario/instance pop. They will be back later sometime.
Yes, well ... I'm only saying my thoughts here. I didnt know this subject was brought before. I saw the first couple of pages and didnt saw anything related so I posted about it.
I'm not demanding or advising, just asking for opinions, so this is going great!. The idea is not protect the players inside the combat site, the idea is to stimulate coop mission running, because nowadays there absolutely no benefit on doing so.
I dont care if criminals warp to the site, if it follows FW mechanics, a mission lv2 would be runned by destroyers and only destroyers could enter the complex or combat site.
Also, answering that an alt could do that is not a good answer it's a very lame one... because if that's the argument people use, that applies for every other game and not even that. Bots an be programed to fulfill any role therefore why even bother in playing?... let's just simulate stuff....
I think if that option for coop combat sites exist would not alter current pvp, not alter current pve, just add more options to people explore.... and the programing behind is not that complicated as adding a completely new feature.
All coments here are gold!
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3072
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Posted - 2016.09.10 16:36:36 -
[27] - Quote
Eris Picornia wrote:
(1)Yes, well ... I'm only saying my thoughts here. I didnt know this subject was brought before. I saw the first couple of pages and didnt saw anything related so I posted about it.
(2)I'm not demanding or advising, just asking for opinions, so this is going great!. The idea is not protect the players inside the combat site, the idea is to stimulate coop mission running, because nowadays there absolutely no benefit on doing so.
(3)I dont care if criminals warp to the site, if it follows FW mechanics, a mission lv2 would be runned by destroyers and only destroyers could enter the complex or combat site.
(4)Also, answering that an alt could do that is not a good answer it's a very lame one... because if that's the argument people use, that applies for every other game and not even that. Bots an be programed to fulfill any role therefore why even bother in playing?... let's just simulate stuff....
(5)I think if that option for coop combat sites exist would not alter current pvp, not alter current pve, just add more options to people explore.... and the programing behind is not that complicated as adding a completely new feature.
All coments here are gold!
1 top right of the forums is a search bar for future reference (its crap but can help)
2 in regards to missions not being proffitable in groups i will point you to #4
3 in FW a site that lets in destroyers also lets in everything smaller not only destroyers
4 the reason "alts can do it" is an argument is because you can't ballance to to pay 4 people otherwise one guy will do it and take it all. suddenly isk/hr becomes unbalanced
5 google eve incursion
BLOPS Hauler
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Wimzy Chent-Shi
Unkindness Incorporated Who Dares Wins.
91
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Posted - 2016.09.10 19:54:31 -
[28] - Quote
Incursion communities, let's take HQ for instance: 1)Available within 21 days (wrote a guide on it https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5571020 ) easy at 30 days. 2)Up to 200M isk/hour + LP 3)40+ ppl communicate on teamspeak. 4)If fleet is full there is a queue "waitlist" 5)Have various sizes including newest scout sites which I have no intel on really. 6)Are instanced by single point of entry = acceleration gate (like also most of missions in the game) Go fly incursions.
Make a newbro foundation started @ here
Let us help those newbros that can not PLEX themselves.
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Iain Cariaba
3193
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Posted - 2016.09.10 20:10:50 -
[29] - Quote
@OP: In every MMO where there is any kind of "instanced" content, that content removes you from the general game world and gives you your own little world to play in where you cannot be effected by other players.
Any sort of Instance based game play goes against the grain of the open world sandbox game style that is EvE.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
985
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Posted - 2016.09.11 15:39:28 -
[30] - Quote
Zan Shiro wrote:Donnachadh wrote: I do not see anywhere in the posts where the OP wants these sites restricted to the first fleet into them. I see a request for sites that require you to have a fleet to enter, that works for both sides. In reality this idea would do as much to promote group play from the PvP side as it would from the PvE side. Yes, yes I know the whole alts thingy and our friend Lugh leads us into that with this post.
He said 4 players enter and only 4 players. It be analogous to something warhammer online had long ago. They put these instances in the middle of the pvp lakes. All you had to do was make it the dungeon entrance (not hard). In the instance...you were off the grid and in your own world. He is basing this on combat sites. He covered that. He however seems to be unaware keys to combat sites are available on the market. His idea has no key. 4 man fleet signs up and poof, its a scenario/instance pop. They will be back later sometime. When I read the OP I understood the 4 man fleet simply to be an example used to illustrate the point. Even if we take it literally as you have then all that is needed is a simple change to any fleet that enters must have at least four ships and problem solved, man up with a four ship fleet and in you go to do what ever you want to do.
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:even if it didn't why should there be an area of space where i can't interact with you just because you have more alts than me?
and you can't just ignore alts because they are not going anywhere things have to be balanced with them in mind Lets not pretend that you can go anywhere and everywhere you want to go in this game. Just a quick example there missions that only allow frigates, if you scan me down in your cruiser you cannot get into the site, so how would limits based on fleet size be any different than these based on ship size?
I am not ignoring alts, quite the contrary I am fully aware of alts and the basic need to have them in this game for many reasons. My point was simply that in a game where alts are everywhere to use the potential for alts as a reason to deny a change to the game is well, I still cannot go there so I will stay with pathetic. |
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