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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 21 post(s) |
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
1552
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Posted - 2016.11.02 00:53:41 -
[61] - Quote
The Economist wrote:Bad Bobby wrote: I also appreciate your apology. But being unprofessional and apologizing for it, is not the same as not being unprofessional in the first place. Maybe a thread such as this one, where paying customers are complaining about your under performance, is not the correct venue for such behaviour?
Maybe it's also not the correct venue for passive aggressive pedantry. Yes, that's what I was saying. |
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
19008
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Posted - 2016.11.04 17:40:54 -
[62] - Quote
Just shoot them in the face, Antiquarian, they are used to it. As for the changes to the graph, i dont see it as so much important. Table is a lot more informative, graph is only for a quick assesment for me.
Every part of a game helps to tell a story. =ƒôò
Where is Angry CONCORD guy when you need him.
GëíGïüGëí GÖÑ
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
203
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Posted - 2016.11.05 11:11:56 -
[63] - Quote
I try to avoid face-shooting whenever possible, Nana. But I do appreciate the advice, and you chiming in on this forum. More voices make a fuller chorus.
I know not everyone uses the price history graph, but it is important that it be useful and functional for those who do.
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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Soltys
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
158
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Posted - 2016.11.06 01:09:45 -
[64] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Soltys, I'll also poke the QAs over there.
Allright, those 3 points posted here.
Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl
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Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
1553
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Posted - 2016.11.06 03:31:08 -
[65] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:I know not everyone uses the price history graph, but it is important that it be useful and functional for those who do. But not important enough that you moved it to TQ before it was functional? |
TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
441
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Posted - 2016.11.06 07:20:50 -
[66] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Quote:2. I want to have for example a 3 month timeframe for every item in market. How? Right now, you'll have to adjust them manually, but the Market should remember your choice for each item.
Please make an option in the settings toggle; "keep same time-frame for all items in market", just like with inventory filters.
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Update:
The slider now adjusts for all items. The default start range is still the last 30 days, but once you extend/reposition it, the graphs for all items will reflect that selection.
The current day is displayed on the graph.
Mmmm, seems you did already
"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X
"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron
-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
206
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Posted - 2016.11.06 13:32:30 -
[67] - Quote
TheSmokingHertog: always good to have more input, so thanks for popping by! Changes are coming for this feature so do get ready to check them out on Singularity. The "jumping" is a result of new/limited history items, but there is a fix underway for that specific bug. Switching between any other items, the graph functions as you would expect.
Soltys: Karkur and I are about to spend 20-some hours together on planes headed for EVE Down Under, so I will take a bit of time to make sure she has seen your input. All bug reports may not be defects, but some of your issues may indicate a need for further iteration/development. EVE is an evolving beast, and you could be the mutagen that leads to a selected trait, analogically speaking.
Bad Bobby: Ping me the specific bug report number for your price history graph being nonfunctional. I will check it out. All of the reports identifying ways that the graph does not work as intended have been elevated to defect status or addressed in feature iteration but it is possible that you have something valuable to contribute.
Everyone: CCP thrives by taking player feedback into account and this is the perfect place for that feedback. Thanks again for chiming in!
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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Soltys
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
158
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Posted - 2016.11.07 01:00:14 -
[68] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Soltys: Karkur and I are about to spend 20-some hours together on planes headed for EVE Down Under, so I will take a bit of time to make sure she has seen your input. All bug reports may not be defects, but some of your issues may indicate a need for further iteration/development. EVE is an evolving beast, and you could be the mutagen that leads to a selected trait, analogically speaking.
TBH, I wouldn't mind using that "opportunity" to smuggle few other (not market related) suggestions along the way =)
Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl
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Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
1554
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Posted - 2016.11.07 03:18:57 -
[69] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Bad Bobby: Ping me the specific bug report number for your price history graph being nonfunctional. I will check it out. All of the reports identifying ways that the graph does not work as intended have been elevated to defect status or addressed in feature iteration but it is possible that you have something valuable to contribute. I think you have misread this. I'm not a volunteer tester. I'm a customer complaining about the shortcomings of your performance and the poor judgement of tone in your posting. Since my complaints are falling on stony ground, I'll waste no more of my time on them.
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
207
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Posted - 2016.11.07 10:11:49 -
[70] - Quote
For anyone reading to catch news or ask questions about the Market Graphs, I will continue to post here as information becomes available. At last update on our internal test environment (pre-pre-Singularity):
- The dynamic y-axis option is functional, but needs a bit more attention.
- The hard coded English labels on the tooltip text for the blue volume bars has been submitted for localization.
- The Min/Max line has been added to the legend (which remains hide-able).
- The "Reset View" button, which appears after zooming or panning, has been moved to the upper left-hand corner.
- Automatic focus slider resizing has been corrected, but requires considerable testing.
Players not seeking to report issues (bugs) with the Market Graphs feature but finding themselves in need of further support and formal interaction with CCP including but not limited to the filing of complaints regarding service may submit support tickets at the language-specific sites listed below. Suspicion of developer misconduct can be reported to Internal Affairs via email or petition. The appropriate email address is [email protected] for such reports.
https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us https://support.eveonline.com/hc/de https://support.eveonline.com/hc/fr https://support.eveonline.com/hc/ja https://support.eveonline.com/hc/ru
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
1578
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Posted - 2016.11.07 10:34:50 -
[71] - Quote
I think that would be a somewhat excessive reaction and I would expect officially reporting you for being uncooperative would (and should) be responded to with limited sympathy.
Maybe a middle ground where you actually answer the questions asked in a straightforward manner would be more reasonable?
After all, my comments were purely an attempt to gain information about the process that led to putting these bugs on the live server.
In any case, I can see we're not going to get anywhere here. |
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
408
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Posted - 2016.11.07 13:42:12 -
[72] - Quote
Dev time is a limited resource. CCP Antiquarian is doing their best to communicate with the players to address critical issues. No matter how well tested something is there will be bugs. Please stop the hostile posting towards the Devs, especially when they are trying to address concerns you my have.
31. Abuse of CCP employees and ISD volunteers is prohibited.
CCP operate a zero tolerance policy on abuse of CCP employees and ISD volunteers. This includes but is not limited to personal attacks, trolling, GÇ£outingGÇ¥ of CCP employee or ISD volunteer player identities, and the use of any former player identities when referring to the aforementioned parties.
Our forums are designed to be a place where players and developers can exchange ideas in a polite and friendly manner for the betterment of EVE Online. Players who attack or abuse employees of CCP, or ISD volunteers, will be permanently banned from the EVE Online forums across all their accounts with no recourse, and may also be subject to action against their game accounts.
ISD Max Trix
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
I do not respond to Evemails.
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Aaril
Interstellar Consulting Group
39
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Posted - 2016.11.07 21:27:25 -
[73] - Quote
The new graphs I find frustrating, as they always reset to the default timescale. Within a single session it remembers my setting, but it is very annoying having to always adjust this.
Why not give us a drop down with the same presets as before for defaults? I like quickly being about to select different exact time frames, and the dragging a window is just not the same.
Also...the colors. PLEASE do something about the dark on dark color scheme. The current contrast between each component is not very good. |
TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
441
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Posted - 2016.11.08 08:34:26 -
[74] - Quote
Aaril wrote:The new graphs I find frustrating, as they always reset to the default timescale. Within a single session it remembers my setting, but it is very annoying having to always adjust this.
Why not give us a drop down with the same presets as before for defaults? I like quickly being about to select different exact time frames, and the dragging a window is just not the same.
Also...the colors. PLEASE do something about the dark on dark color scheme. The current contrast between each component is not very good.
+1
"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X
"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron
-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-
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Vickers Secretary
Weyland Inc.
4
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Posted - 2016.11.11 07:57:06 -
[75] - Quote
The colors are indeed a bit problematic, especially when using the market on cheap monitors or on a laptop in daylight conditions. Besides that, it looks really nice. Just a little bit too dark / not enough contrast.
One thing that bothers me: Sometimes the market graph doesn't shop up at all - it just shows a completely blank market window. It happens on items without a market history in citadels / regions and randomly on other items as well. |
Black Romero
Aviation Professionals for EVE The Ditanian Alliance
17
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Posted - 2016.11.11 19:51:54 -
[76] - Quote
Thanks for the updates CCP Antiquarian! Appreciate the dev hours.
My gripe still though.
1) I can't get the time frame of the graph (X axis) to stay 365 days! What am I doing wrong here? bug? I thought this had been fixed? Can we not have a default for this?
2) How do we set a default also to get rid of Negative ISK values on the Y axis?
3) How do I change the cost slider on the Y axis to millions instead of decimal Billions. Why the change? Millions is so much more in line with the price of things than billions. (i.e. the number of items in game that cost in the millions versus Billions!) It makes no sense! |
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
208
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Posted - 2016.11.12 19:12:29 -
[77] - Quote
Hey, Black Romero. My Saturday nights are your Saturday nights.
All three of your points ("gripes" seems negative) are addressed in the post-Ascension release which will hit Singularity on or around the 22nd of November.
Aaril, Vickers Secretary, and TheSmokingHertog:
I have a conversation planned with the UI programmer about the colors. I don't know how that will ultimately play out, but my hope is to reach a conclusion that satisfies the largest number of players from the most varied distribution of playstyles on the widest range of hardware in the most disparate spread of environments.
As for the items with no graph, that is the case for items with no history, but I've not seen it happen on other items. If you get it again, would you be willing to hit f12 and ping me a bugreport? (you are of course under no obligation to do that, it would just be helpful in isolating and correcting the problem).
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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The Economist
Logically Consistent
47
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Posted - 2016.11.12 21:48:39 -
[78] - Quote
Idea for somewhere down the road:
Would be nice to get separate price history lists and graphs for sell order and buy orders (unless i'm not seeing something) |
virm pasuul
The Congregation No Handlebars.
413
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Posted - 2016.11.17 15:08:57 -
[79] - Quote
Hey thanks CCP both for tackling the issues and also for letting us know that it's being worked on. It's always easier to put up with something annoying when you know a fix is in the works.
Given this is probably an ongoing work in progress I'd like to add some fine detail feedback. I apologise in advance if this is already covered by the work that's been done.
For me there are two distinct issues with the y axis scaling and labeling. This feedback is in the hope that both get fixed.
The first being the size of jump chosen between marks on the y axis. The auto scaler just makes sure they are even - although even this becomes an issue when the digits are also scaled and rounded. I was looking at market charts today where my points were between graph lines chosen at wierd points. Say it fell between mark xx.9 lower and mark yy.6 higher, so now I have to work out in my head that the gap represents a jump of 0.7 and then I have to guess where on a scale of 0.7 the data point lies between the two, which means more maths because my head works in units of 10, but now in my head I have to rescale that by a factor of 0.7. Then I have to take this and add it back to the original xx.9 marker on the graph. That's a whole ton of mental maths. This goes against the whole point of a graph being an easy visualization of data. With a factor of 10 based scaling we can look and instantly know. With random scaling the amount of math required makes a graph less useful than the page of raw data.
Secondly the numbers in the 100s million range are terrible. On the y axis. 0.17B is terrible waste of screen space. The 0 tells me nothing and needs a full stop after. Of 3 1/2 characters used to convey info 1 1/2 are wasted, and do nothing but chew up characters that could be used to pass on information. 166M is 1/2 a character less and give me more information. Also notice that extra character reduces the rounding error too 0.17 became 166 giving higher accuracy with less characters. Please bring this back into the realms of the sensible. Simple solution. If any number starts "0." then drop that range down to the next range before displaying. I have not checked other ranges where it transitions. e.g. 100s of thousands to millions. Every range transition should be sanity checked.
Same for data points on the graph. I can't work out their values because of the scaling and rounding, so I hover over them. One good point - hovering over them brings up info, without needing to click, good stuff thanks :) The date is there and the value beneath. The data point uses exactly the same number/text formatting function as the y axis, so it's practically useless for all the reasons right above. There's a ton of space, as much space as the date takes up, but it is not used. It could be used, it's currently blank. Please give us meaningful data in here. Less rounding, less guessing, more info please. It's not rocket science, well actually........
I do appreciate CCP as a whole, how busy you guys are with the latest release, and all the cool stuff. But I do genuinely wonder how this sort of stuff ends up in game without someone at CCP going "wtf???" when they see it. I can assume the person who did the new market graph doesn't actually use the market graph in game much themselves, because no way someone who uses it regularly would think it was anything less than a giant step backwards. Run stuff past people who use it.
It's clear someone(s) has put a lot of time and effort into the market history revamp, and it's sad that there's so much negative feedback about it someone's effort. I'd be very disheartened if it was me. I feel sad myself for pooping on someone's parade. But this sort of stuff does need checking and review please. This would have been released to a lot of praise if it had been done properly.
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virm pasuul
The Congregation No Handlebars.
414
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Posted - 2016.11.20 22:45:13 -
[80] - Quote
additional feedback
Go to Jita Choose Pyerite or Tritanium - look at the history graph It's a flat line scroll the mouse wheel to try and expand the detail, the straight line just moves up and down the screen, you don't get to see any detail Scroll up a lot and the Y axis scale just goes crazy because the actual price price is so close to zero you just end up looking at random numbers on the Y axis at the moment Tritanium is going for close to 228 ISK per unit according to the graph defaults
The lines are so flat you can see no detail as to how the price is and has been trending. It's just a flat line. All due to the Y axis scaling I assume.
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virm pasuul
The Congregation No Handlebars.
414
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Posted - 2016.11.20 22:47:36 -
[81] - Quote
Zydrine in Jita Try and scroll the graph to see some detail and the line just disappears off the bottom of the graph window.
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
208
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Posted - 2016.12.08 12:04:28 -
[82] - Quote
Anyone had a look on Sisi recently? Tried out the settings and features?
Click and Pan New Y-axis numbers Dynamic scaling Relocated reset button Optimized performance Focus window memory across sessions
I just got back from Australia and am just catching up on all the news, but what's on Sisi right now is hitting TQ on Tuesday, I believe.
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
443
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Posted - 2016.12.08 16:28:24 -
[83] - Quote
How hard would it be to add a field that is letting me set a hard price level in the graph? Like a "red line".
Say I want to monitor Antimatter Charge S market based on 10ISK as price. When I set a red line on 10ISK, I could then see how the market is behaving compared to my 10ISK line.
"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X
"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron
-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-
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CCP Antiquarian
C C P C C P Alliance
209
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Posted - 2016.12.09 14:11:23 -
[84] - Quote
Custom redline, eh?
Adding fields can be a hassle with the limited real estate here, but I'll hit up the programmer and see what he says.
"Singularity pilots are helpful pilots."
@CCP_Antiquarian - for immediate fulfillment of your archaic social media needs.
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Soltys
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
166
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Posted - 2016.12.10 17:09:38 -
[85] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Anyone had a look on Sisi recently? Tried out the settings and features?
Click and Pan New Y-axis numbers Dynamic scaling Relocated reset button Optimized performance Focus window memory across sessions
I just got back from Australia and am just catching up on all the news, but what's on Sisi right now is hitting TQ on Tuesday, I believe.
This is quite an improvement ! Really much better.
Two things though:
- There is no memory. If I carefully scale/pan graph for some item, it's immediately gone if I switch to 'Show Table' and back again to 'Show Graph'. It would be nice for that to persist at least if we don't switch to another item. If it persisted across other items, even better.
- When we move cursor over graph's median dots, it would be nice if it also showed low and high prices as well in tooltips, eg something like:
-date- low - (yellow+bold)med - high
instead of just
-date- med
Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl
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Noene Drops
Deep Chain Diving
23
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Posted - 2016.12.13 12:46:33 -
[86] - Quote
The updates rolled out on TQ look great, the market window works so much smoother now. Awesome!
But there's one problem that still makes it weird to use, and that's Y axis labelling system. I've re-read the thread and it was mentioned one or two times before, but hasn't been addressed yet.
In my opinion, values on Y axis feel weird because of the way we as humans talk about the prices IRL. For example, we don't tell each other "hey i've got a really cheap deal on a Tengu for zero point fifteen bil", yet that's exactly what we see in the market graph: http://i.imgur.com/MLklqhh.png. So generally we talk about billions in price when the price exceeds a billion, and we talk about millions when it's below a bil; same goes for Ks or Ts, or at least that's my impression on how people generally talk about prices.
TL;DR GÇö if only you could change Y axis labelling to something like this http://i.imgur.com/3yJGOBv.png that would make it far more readable than now.
P.S. The volume chart in the bottom doesn't need fractions (because volumes aren't fractional) so you might round them next release :D |
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
645
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Posted - 2016.12.22 20:09:50 -
[87] - Quote
moving this back to the front page
ISD Max Trix
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
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Soltys
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
171
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Posted - 2016.12.22 23:06:02 -
[88] - Quote
One more thing, which was mentioned earlier as well - let it scale initially based on prices in selected period, instead of the whole year (or add an option to select one or the other).
Jita Flipping Inc.: Kovl & Kuvl
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TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
445
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Posted - 2016.12.23 15:45:10 -
[89] - Quote
CCP Antiquarian wrote:Custom redline, eh?
Adding fields can be a hassle with the limited real estate here, but I'll hit up the programmer and see what he says.
How is my custom red line doing? Maybe put the info field in the market quick bar as a label. You can already make a note in the quick bar on an item. I already have the price of each of my sale items on them.
"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X
"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron
-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-
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Caleb Ayrania
TarNec Invisible Exchequer
324
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Posted - 2016.12.28 04:21:48 -
[90] - Quote
I would like to see a right click export as png/jpeg and a copy link to chat..
Ideally the graph should show what, where and when somewhere graphically a bit better for export purposes ofc. Which is also a nice thing for current more clunky screenshot grabbing..
Oh and in a near future would be really nice to be able to have more items showing in ONE graph window, so a detach and drag drop items to add more things in one graph would be pretty amazing..
Its related a lot to my wish for option to open and share market details, without live refresh and link them and have more than one open at the time.. So not with browsing, or live refresh, but just the market "quote"..
This would be a nice step towards adding the same global/universal market benefit that out of game 3rd party tools give, without breaking the servers or the "fog of war".. |
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