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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Goati
State War Academy Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:06:26 -
[31] - Quote
3 things important things.
1. The mining drone bonuses are to yield, meaning they are useless for ice mining drones. Is this intentional or an oversight? I am guessing intentional, as the Orca has a drone yield bonus and a drone ice cycling bonus.
2. I'm dissapointed by the low number of slots. 2 low slots and 4 mid for a battlecruiser is a joke. This ship will be too easily suicide ganked.
3. If the yield is as good as a barge, why would anyone mine in a barge when they can just use a porpoise with it's mega size 50k m3 ore hold? Better to use a porpoise and go afk. |
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
1823
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:10:58 -
[32] - Quote
Wow, this ship will replace the Mackinaw. Bigger ore hangar, ice harvester drones... perfect |
Allan 'Gopher' Green
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:13:08 -
[33] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Allan 'Gopher' Green wrote:Fleet Hangar: 5000m3
I feel this is a bit small, as even the smallest barge hold can hold 12,000m3. it will be a continuous chore to keep moving ore out of the fleet hangar, with the fleet queuing up trying to dump their ore( only 2 barges will stress the 5,000 limit). I think 20,000m3 would be more suited, without over doing it ( still 50% of pre update Orca). If you are running a significant number of barges the orca is actually the tool you want. The Porpoise is more suited to working with a small fleet of ventures.
for newer players training the skills for an Orca takes a long time so i think the porpoise will see action with barges ( also a lot cheaper to loose a porpoise). However I do accept the point you make although even two ventures hold double the Fleet hangar capacity. cargo hold and ore hold capacity I have no issue with, its just the fleet hangar for logistic purposes. |
Elenahina
agony unleashed Agony Empire
1277
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:13:58 -
[34] - Quote
Goati wrote:
3. If the yield is as good as a barge, why would anyone mine in a barge when they can just use a porpoise with it's mega size 50k m3 ore hold? Better to use a porpoise and go afk.
Personally, I am looking forward to the gleeful laughing of CORE agents as they pop AFK porpoise pilots left right and center.
Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you.
Also, iderno
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Knitram Relik
Atomic Amish
63
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:24:46 -
[35] - Quote
Am I missing something? I thought strip miners could only be fit on barges/exhumers. Why does everyone think they can mine with this?
[WTS] - Signature. 500 mil ISK
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Allan 'Gopher' Green
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:30:08 -
[36] - Quote
Knitram Relik wrote:Am I missing something? I thought strip miners could only be fit on barges/exhumers. Why does everyone think they can mine with this?
New and improved mining drones.
Max Mining Yield: ~980m3 per minute + drone travel time |
Blastil
Aideron Robotics
121
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:36:40 -
[37] - Quote
looking at this right off the bat, I'm going to say I'm excited for the porpoise and I'm not even an industrialist.
A logi ship with slightly reduced range, but an extra 400 ish DPS from drones? Ill allow it. I'm seeing it now: Gila fleets backed by porpoises. |
Aliana Heartborne
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
26
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:43:49 -
[38] - Quote
Allan 'Gopher' Green wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Allan 'Gopher' Green wrote:Fleet Hangar: 5000m3
I feel this is a bit small, as even the smallest barge hold can hold 12,000m3. it will be a continuous chore to keep moving ore out of the fleet hangar, with the fleet queuing up trying to dump their ore( only 2 barges will stress the 5,000 limit). I think 20,000m3 would be more suited, without over doing it ( still 50% of pre update Orca). If you are running a significant number of barges the orca is actually the tool you want. The Porpoise is more suited to working with a small fleet of ventures. for newer players training the skills for an Orca takes a long time so i think the porpoise will see action with barges ( also a lot cheaper to loose a porpoise). However I do accept the point you make although even two ventures hold double the Fleet hangar capacity. cargo hold and ore hold capacity I have no issue with, its just the fleet hangar for logistic purposes.
Except porpoise has the same 18 day skilltime, because industrial command ships. It's just a cheap alternative, not entrylevel in terms of skill |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3231
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Posted - 2016.10.04 20:51:27 -
[39] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Bienator II wrote:what is the reason you would use a barge over this ship? Volume mined.
according to the blog its barley 2m/s less than a proc so not that much :/
BLOPS Hauler
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XxUltradmbxX
Girl Friends Please Ignore League of Unaligned Master Pilots
14
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:00:22 -
[40] - Quote
is Max Mining Yield with rigs and harvester drones ? or empty max skilled hull with t2 drones? |
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3627
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:00:29 -
[41] - Quote
Aliana Heartborne wrote: Except porpoise has the same 18 day skilltime, because industrial command ships. It's just a cheap alternative, not entrylevel in terms of skill
18 days is pretty entry level, lets be serious here. That's also 18 days from a brand new clone, not from the point they start training towards it. Sure it's not a day 1 ship, but 18 days is entry level to an advanced profession. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3627
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:01:19 -
[42] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: according to the blog its barley 2m/s less than a proc so not that much :/
Did you fit your Proc out with Faction mining gear for literal max yield regardless of cost? Including using mining drones? Because I'm pretty sure CCP's figures need the new Faction mining drones to get that yield. Not simply the T2's. |
13kr1d1
Hedion University Amarr Empire
176
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:03:23 -
[43] - Quote
The benefits of being in groups should always come from character trained skills and a fleet booster. That'd make it more intuitive, as it'd reflect real life to a large degree.
Industrial command ships hould never have been given bonuses to improve people's mining abilities. So what good are they then, you ask? They need, and often do have, other, unique bonuses that can improve the operation without being a drag.
In fact, isn't the one of the Orca's strong suits the tractor nonsense? The porpoise isn't needed. People need to start using the noctis to tractor jetcans of bunches of people in a belt into one spot for a hauler to have easy pickup. A lot of the things the orca can do can be filled by other things, like you buy a simple MTU and stick it somewhere on the hauler flight plan, and it does the can grabbing from those covetors or hulks, etc.
We don't need the porpoise, it doesn't have a purpose. People just need to stop being scared and go out there and mine with a fleet booster in regular ships. Either the orca or the pose will be redundant.
Invulnerability on a timer is crazy dumb. That's NOT the right way to deal with the 5 minute Transformers! time.
Nothing wrong with a sizable group of people unhappy with content letting their sub lapse for a week to demonstrate this. I think it is in everyone's interest to send a message, rather than let enough straws build up to break the camel for good.
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13kr1d1
Hedion University Amarr Empire
176
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:14:55 -
[44] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: according to the blog its barley 2m/s less than a proc so not that much :/
Did you fit your Proc out with Faction mining gear for literal max yield regardless of cost? Including using mining drones? Because I'm pretty sure CCP's figures need the new Faction mining drones to get that yield. Not simply the T2's.
That's one of my points: People need to stop crying that they can't fit all the mining rigs and modules they can get to max their yield. If you're having a problem with being attacked, put a tank or some dps mods on for god's sake.
As for the Orca, that ship model looks more like a specialized gas hauler, maybe for hauling highly compressed, and thus dangerous, gas around. It doesn't look like a mining op command ship.
Rorq does, and noctis/porp does, but orca... nah.
Nothing wrong with a sizable group of people unhappy with content letting their sub lapse for a week to demonstrate this. I think it is in everyone's interest to send a message, rather than let enough straws build up to break the camel for good.
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PopeUrban
El Expedicion Flames of Exile
119
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:17:25 -
[45] - Quote
I really like everything about this guy. We just picked up brand new EVE players, and three of them just want to mine for a living. Being able to tell them I can afford to buy them a boosting ship, and that one of them can start using it inside of a month feels good man.
I like that as a command platform it mines by proxy via drones, just thematically, and the name makes me giggle. The mining drones changes as a whole are just great in terms of options even on existing ships.
Probably the most excited I've been about an industry ship since the venture. Having interesting options makes it much easier to get people excited to do all that rock huffing that needs done. |
Aliana Heartborne
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
26
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Posted - 2016.10.04 21:52:09 -
[46] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Aliana Heartborne wrote: Except porpoise has the same 18 day skilltime, because industrial command ships. It's just a cheap alternative, not entrylevel in terms of skill
18 days is pretty entry level, lets be serious here. That's also 18 days from a brand new clone, not from the point they start training towards it. Sure it's not a day 1 ship, but 18 days is entry level to an advanced profession.
Well Orca is exactly the same skilltime to fly, and with its buff unless you do shenanigans i dont see why you would choose the porpoise over it:P |
PopeUrban
El Expedicion Flames of Exile
119
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Posted - 2016.10.04 22:10:24 -
[47] - Quote
Aliana Heartborne wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Aliana Heartborne wrote: Except porpoise has the same 18 day skilltime, because industrial command ships. It's just a cheap alternative, not entrylevel in terms of skill
18 days is pretty entry level, lets be serious here. That's also 18 days from a brand new clone, not from the point they start training towards it. Sure it's not a day 1 ship, but 18 days is entry level to an advanced profession. Well Orca is exactly the same skilltime to fly, and with its buff unless you do shenanigans i dont see why you would choose the porpoise over it:P
Cost and progression.
The same reason the venture exists even though it does an objectively worse job than barges. It means more people have access to fleet boosts, that there's early game potential for new players to choose roles that can last them throughout their careers.
So, in stead of being forced early on from venture>barge>orca, where your playstyle completely changes at the orca, you can have people go venture>porpoise>orca, where even new broke people learn much earlier how to manage fleets and due to on grid boosting have a lot more incentive to fleet up.
Those kinds of considerations are crucial for the future of EVE and the NPE because having a game in which people feel like their only path to success is joining an established entity turns off a lot of folks. Cheaper versions of ships allow newer players to experiment more, and a cheaper fleet booster encourages those players to start skilling toward EVE's most important ship sooner as well; friendship. |
13kr1d1
Hedion University Amarr Empire
177
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Posted - 2016.10.04 22:11:22 -
[48] - Quote
Aliana Heartborne wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Aliana Heartborne wrote: Except porpoise has the same 18 day skilltime, because industrial command ships. It's just a cheap alternative, not entrylevel in terms of skill
18 days is pretty entry level, lets be serious here. That's also 18 days from a brand new clone, not from the point they start training towards it. Sure it's not a day 1 ship, but 18 days is entry level to an advanced profession. Well Orca is exactly the same skilltime to fly, and with its buff unless you do shenanigans i dont see why you would choose the porpoise over it:P
Only reason I can see is risk vs reward. Don't fly what u cant lose.
Nothing wrong with a sizable group of people unhappy with content letting their sub lapse for a week to demonstrate this. I think it is in everyone's interest to send a message, rather than let enough straws build up to break the camel for good.
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1991
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Posted - 2016.10.04 22:23:41 -
[49] - Quote
13kr1d1 wrote:The benefits of being in groups should always come from character trained skills and a fleet booster. That'd make it more intuitive, as it'd reflect real life to a large degree.
Industrial command ships hould never have been given bonuses to improve people's mining abilities. So what good are they then, you ask? They need, and often do have, other, unique bonuses that can improve the operation without being a drag.
In fact, isn't the one of the Orca's strong suits the tractor nonsense? The porpoise isn't needed. People need to start using the noctis to tractor jetcans of bunches of people in a belt into one spot for a hauler to have easy pickup. A lot of the things the orca can do can be filled by other things, like you buy a simple MTU and stick it somewhere on the hauler flight plan, and it does the can grabbing from those covetors or hulks, etc.
We don't need the porpoise, it doesn't have a purpose. People just need to stop being scared and go out there and mine with a fleet booster in regular ships. Either the orca or the pose will be redundant. Noctis + Hauler = Porpoise. What you stated people should do is pretty much half of what it does. The other half being providing boosts. The Orca is a better version of that sure, but stating one will make the other redundant is like suggesting no one would fly a Thorax because they have the skills for a Deimos. Or for that matter Barge vs Exhumer. Barges get plenty of use despite being inferior Exhumers in part because of functional similarity alongside strong cost difference.
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RainReaper
RRN Assembly INC
44
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Posted - 2016.10.04 23:08:51 -
[50] - Quote
While I like the Porpoise and its stats and the fact that it is allowed into frigate size wh space the one complaint I have is...
Did you really have to reuse the noctis model? I was kinda hoping for a new hull but oh well... |
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FreeBirth
Praetorian Black Guard
0
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Posted - 2016.10.04 23:23:35 -
[51] - Quote
Great yet another wee ship that has a bigger hold than a Hulk Tnx CCP |
Penance Toralen
Compass Fox
11
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Posted - 2016.10.05 00:10:02 -
[52] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Ydnari wrote:How about the industry information, is this an inventable T2 from the Noctis, or a T1 hull with its own BPO? T1 hull with a BPO sold by ORE.
Hello CCP Fozzie
As someone who has actually done the trip to Outer Ring, and survived. I will ask you why ORE is exclusive to null-sec when SOE hulls and modules are available within high-sec?
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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
425
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Posted - 2016.10.05 00:18:59 -
[53] - Quote
I like it. I would prefer a model that looked more fitting, something streamlined like a Porpoise, but I've always liked that hull in general anyways.
Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.
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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
425
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Posted - 2016.10.05 00:25:18 -
[54] - Quote
Penance Toralen wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Ydnari wrote:How about the industry information, is this an inventable T2 from the Noctis, or a T1 hull with its own BPO? T1 hull with a BPO sold by ORE. Hello CCP Fozzie As someone who has actually done the trip to Outer Ring, and survived. I will ask you why ORE is exclusive to null-sec when SOE hulls and modules are available within high-sec?
Maybe since ORE is part of Upwell, more locations for the ORE BPOs will be made available. But considering Every ORE BPO originates from ORE stations in the outer ring, there really does not seem to be any valid reason for them to change the location apart from the association with Upwell.
Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3631
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Posted - 2016.10.05 00:32:37 -
[55] - Quote
Petrified wrote: Maybe since ORE is part of Upwell, more locations for the ORE BPOs will be made available. But considering Every ORE BPO originates from ORE stations in the outer ring, there really does not seem to be any valid reason for them to change the location apart from the association with Upwell.
I believe the original intent was to create fights over who controlled the space around it in order to control the BPO's. But since that obviously didn't work as a fight creator there is no reason to keep ORE so region locked, so they could easily seed a few more ORE (or Upwell) agents around who sell BPO's. |
Kenrailae
Syndicate Enterprise Northern Coalition.
634
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Posted - 2016.10.05 01:23:03 -
[56] - Quote
You forgot to add that you realized the current 1 mid slot barges were a joke and you were giving the reti and covetor the 2nd and third mids they should have had to begin with, right Fozzie?
The Law is a point of View
The NPE IS a big deal
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Applejack Daniel's
Friendship is Murder
0
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Posted - 2016.10.05 01:54:40 -
[57] - Quote
90 scan res? The Naglfar has 85, did you forget a digit there somewhere or is there some reason this ship needs the lock time of a dreadnought?
Oh! The mining operation is under attack, just hold on for 20 seconds while I lock up that frigate. |
Morgan Johnstone
Star Tide Industries Lin Kuei Kokuryukai.
54
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Posted - 2016.10.05 02:07:22 -
[58] - Quote
I'm blind so i might have missed it, what are the skill differences between this ship and the Orca? With such a drastic price difference I believe the skills needed will be much lower as well.
Morgan Johnstone
Disabled Players Union
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3233
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Posted - 2016.10.05 02:49:44 -
[59] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote: according to the blog its barley 2m/s less than a proc so not that much :/
Did you fit your Proc out with Faction mining gear for literal max yield regardless of cost? Including using mining drones? Because I'm pretty sure CCP's figures need the new Faction mining drones to get that yield. Not simply the T2's.
that widens the gap a little but not by much and considering there has been nothing said about mods to buff drones the difference between a faction (harvester) fit and t2 will not be that high making the standard still close to a proc. harvester drones are not all that better than T2 do to them taking 2x the bandwidth.
but i'm not all that worried i'm sure if we start seeing fleets of these it will be nerffed
BLOPS Hauler
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Lugh Crow-Slave
3233
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Posted - 2016.10.05 02:52:00 -
[60] - Quote
Morgan Johnstone wrote: With such a drastic price difference I believe the skills needed will be much lower as well.
lol what do price and skill have to do with each other?
dread is more SP than a t2B but cost about the same
carriers cost the same as a dread but need much more SP
faction ships cost more than T2 but are lower sp
BLOPS Hauler
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