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Carl Kowalski
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.11.21 10:24:27 -
[1] - Quote
Hi!
This weekend I encountered some rats in a belt, which jammed me. Without being able to target anything, I am not able to shoot. As a Caldari, I assume that I can fight these rats with autotargeting missiles. But since, as an alpha clone, I cannot learn to use these missiles, how can I fight ships using ECM on me?
Fly safe!
Looking for assignment: have missiles, will travel ...
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gfldex
785
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Posted - 2016.11.21 10:52:33 -
[2] - Quote
Fitting a ECCM module may help, if you can use those. What works for sure is to bring a mate. EVE Online is a multiplayer game after all.
If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
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Mornak
Exotic Dancers Union SONS of BANE
90
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Posted - 2016.11.21 11:04:42 -
[3] - Quote
If you fit a sensor booster with an ECCM script, it will increase your ships sensor strength. A higher sensor strength means that it's harder to get jammed. It can still happen, but since jamming is chance based chances are that the NPC will lose jam on you the next cycle.
Another thing would be drones (if your ship has a drone bay). Drones have they're own target lock, so if you manage to send your drones after the jamming ship they don't lose their target lock only because you get jammed.
Jamming/ECM in eve is chance based, meaning that a jam has a certain chance to hit on every cycle of the jammer. So only because the rat jams you once does not mean that you'll stay jammed indefinitely. If you can tank for the jam-cycle then just wait it out. most NPC that jam you are frigates. Shoot them first, they should go down quite fast. |
Taishoku Mayaki
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
5237
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Posted - 2016.11.21 11:18:37 -
[4] - Quote
Hey,
There is an item called a Sensor Booster that fits in the midslot, this by default increases a number of things including targeting strength. It can also be fitted with a script that specializes it in targeting strength. ECCM Script or something like that which will make it harder to jam you.
ECM on low-level missions and rats is tbh something that should be cleansed. It's not a constructive game mechanic.
"Right-O, lets get undocked and see what falls off the ship"
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Carl Kowalski
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.11.21 11:34:55 -
[5] - Quote
I've tried to wait out the jam, but the rats didn't miss a cycle.
Drones are tricky: when I launch them, after I've been targeted, I can't send them to fight (lock missing), when I start them early, they might get target by the rats. I've got the feeling, that drones, even when set to agressive, only start fighting on their own, when they see someone targeting me. When I launch them after I was targeted and jammed, they keep idling. Is drone agression supposed to work like this?
I will try ECCM the next time. I hope the boost to targeting strength will work.
But seriously: every other faction can fight their pirates just fine. Why is it so complicated to do simple ratting in high sec with Caldari?
Looking for assignment: have missiles, will travel ...
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gfldex
785
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Posted - 2016.11.21 11:57:24 -
[6] - Quote
Carl Kowalski wrote:Why is it so complicated to do simple ratting in high sec with Caldari?
You have misphrased that question, If should read: "Why is it so complicated to fight Guristas anywhere." This also provides the 2nd proper solution for your problem.
If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
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Memphis Baas
2303
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Posted - 2016.11.21 12:26:03 -
[7] - Quote
You're seeing why electronic warfare (and ECM in particular) is so hated and effective. Being perma-jammed happens in PVP, too, and the ways to deal with it have been outlined above.
- Kill the offending frigate before it establishes a target lock or turns on its jammers. - Bring a friend to kill the frigate that jams you. - Use ECCM or sensor boosters to increase your ship's sensor strength and decrease the chances of being jammed. - Use bigger ships (stronger sensors). - Use drones on aggressive mode (but you have to have them deployed and set to aggressive BEFORE the enemies start shooting you). - Use FoF missiles (they are actually so ineffective that most people don't bother).
In the case of Guristas and PVE NPCs in general, a few things are happening: - The NPCs cheat (to simplify the load on the server) and have longer ranges and no capacitor issues with their jammers - The devs have not taken the time to improve the NPC AI to make it "somewhat fair" so they stop jamming every now and then
So you're pretty much limited to "bring a friend" and "kill them before they jam you". For the second option, you can spoiler the missions by looking them up on EVE-Survival.org so you know when you're facing ECM jammers, and which ships to kill first. |
Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
177
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Posted - 2016.11.21 14:50:32 -
[8] - Quote
Beware the deadspace Guristas ships like the Dire Pithi Saboteur and Dire Pithi Despoiler.
A couple things not mentioned
If you have to, drop a bookmark, warp out and warp back in. Get your drones out asap. Train your Sensor Compensation skills (Targeting skills). Train the one that matches your ship (ie Gravimetric for Caldari) |
Velarra
543
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Posted - 2016.11.21 14:53:08 -
[9] - Quote
While not strictly suitable in the OP's context, could target breakers be applied to a useful positive effect vs gurista ecm? (Much like eccm) |
Timmy Vortex
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
4
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Posted - 2016.11.21 14:55:55 -
[10] - Quote
You might also want to invest in buying the sensor compensation skills. There's four of them for every ship race.
They are very useful and haven't been mentioned yet i think :) |
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Solonius Rex
F0RCED ENTRY Domestic Disturbance
371
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Posted - 2016.11.21 15:37:28 -
[11] - Quote
Carl Kowalski wrote:I've tried to wait out the jam, but the rats didn't miss a cycle.
Drones are tricky: when I launch them, after I've been targeted, I can't send them to fight (lock missing), when I start them early, they might get target by the rats. I've got the feeling, that drones, even when set to agressive, only start fighting on their own, when they see someone targeting me. When I launch them after I was targeted and jammed, they keep idling. Is drone agression supposed to work like this?
I will try ECCM the next time. I hope the boost to targeting strength will work.
But seriously: every other faction can fight their pirates just fine. Why is it so complicated to do simple ratting in high sec with Caldari?
If you launch drones after the rats target you, they do not engage, because you were targetted before they were launched. I.e. the agression has already occurred. But if they go after your drones, just do some micro managing, and recall the drone that is taking damage, back to your drone bay, and then relaunch it after a few seconds.
And yes, every faction has their annoyances. Try the gallente rats, they decrease your lock range and targetting speed which can be annoying too. Or the tracking disruptors from amar that cause your weapons to miss. Atleast with jamming, theres a chance for it to fail.
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Cara Forelli
Better Off Red Unspoken Alliance.
2134
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Posted - 2016.11.21 15:43:45 -
[12] - Quote
Carl Kowalski wrote:Hi!
This weekend I encountered some rats in a belt, which jammed me. Without being able to target anything, I am not able to shoot. As a Caldari, I assume that I can fight these rats with autotargeting missiles. But since, as an alpha clone, I cannot learn to use these missiles, how can I fight ships using ECM on me?
Fly safe! By yourself it will be difficult and probably not worth it. Alpha clones are basically just an extended trial. This probably just goes on the list of stuff you can't do until you sub.
Want to talk? Join my channel in game: House Forelli
Titan's Lament
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Cara Forelli
Better Off Red Unspoken Alliance.
2134
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Posted - 2016.11.21 15:44:30 -
[13] - Quote
Double post
Want to talk? Join my channel in game: House Forelli
Titan's Lament
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Carl Kowalski
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.11.21 15:53:37 -
[14] - Quote
Many thanks for all the helpful hints!
In this summary, I will group the answers accoording to their usefulness for my fellow Caldari Alpha pilots:
Useful: - do not rat in Gurista space - bring a friend - when jammed, warp out and reenter to break lock (make bookmark if necessary) - launch drones BEFORE being targeted (Caldari Alpha pilots can use only unbonused drones) - equip sensor booster with ECCM skript (to be tested) - kill rat while out of ECM range (possible for frigates/destroyers? ECM module for PC has range > 25 km; range of NPC module?)
Not usable: - training sensor compensation skills (not for alpha clone) - using auto targeting missiles (not for alpha clone) - using target breaker (not for alpha clone)
Looking for assignment: have missiles, will travel ...
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Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
177
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Posted - 2016.11.22 00:33:46 -
[15] - Quote
Signal Amplifier module in the low-slot will also help your sensor strength.
Using a Sensor Booster is probably the best option. It improves your locking time and adds to your sensor strength (without a script).
Larger ships generally have higher signal strength, particularly the T1 hulls. |
Carl Kowalski
State War Academy Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2016.11.22 08:49:47 -
[16] - Quote
@Special1 K: Thanks! Added to list.
Looking for assignment: have missiles, will travel ...
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gfldex
785
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Posted - 2016.11.22 09:05:52 -
[17] - Quote
Carl Kowalski wrote: - when jammed, warp out and reenter to break lock (make bookmark if necessary)
You can warp to a BM on the same grid, as long as it is more then 150km from your current position. You may be able to BM a spot just after warping into the grid in question.
If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
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