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Ayallah
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
642
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Posted - 2016.12.12 21:48:00 -
[31] - Quote
We kill a particularly large structure and now everyone pretends to care about baseliners.
How long will this particular indignation last, a week?
As strength goes.
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Pieter Tuulinen
Tyrathlion Interstellar Rote Kapelle
6908
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Posted - 2016.12.12 23:04:08 -
[32] - Quote
Ayallah wrote:We kill a particularly large structure and now everyone pretends to care about baseliners.
How long will this particular indignation last, a week?
I've killed too many structures to possess the hypocrisy to howl and point fingers, Aya. I suspect the indignation will last so long as it takes those making the noise to realise they have too.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
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Jason Galente
Hole Riders
1002
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Posted - 2016.12.13 11:58:47 -
[33] - Quote
Samira Kernher wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Wait... Don't these things take days to go down, from investment to explosive finale?
How did none of the occupants evacuate in all that time? Or did it somehow go immediately down without the preliminary operations that are common to taking down large structures? With large scale evacuation efforts, you can reasonably evac several million per day. Look at the Seyllin evacuation for numbers. 6 days is a long time, but 132 million is a lot of people.
They should've been evacuating this thing since late September.
Mid November at the latest, when the war started shifting against COT. It was clear to most involved parties that if PanFam dedicated, it would win. COT could not contest the super fleets, once the cyno jammer in a system went down, it was effectively impossible for COT to win the fight for the system if PanFam dropped supers.
Only the liberty of the individual assures the prosperity of the whole.
And this foundation must be defended.
At any cost
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Soldarius
O C C U P Y Test Alliance Please Ignore
1548
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Posted - 2016.12.13 21:15:47 -
[34] - Quote
I blame Pandemic Legion.
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
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Pieter Tuulinen
Tyrathlion Interstellar Rote Kapelle
6913
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Posted - 2016.12.13 22:17:41 -
[35] - Quote
Jason Galente wrote:Samira Kernher wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Wait... Don't these things take days to go down, from investment to explosive finale?
How did none of the occupants evacuate in all that time? Or did it somehow go immediately down without the preliminary operations that are common to taking down large structures? With large scale evacuation efforts, you can reasonably evac several million per day. Look at the Seyllin evacuation for numbers. 6 days is a long time, but 132 million is a lot of people. They should've been evacuating this thing since late September. Mid November at the latest, when the war started shifting against COT. It was clear to most involved parties that if PanFam dedicated, it would win. COT could not contest the super fleets, once the cyno jammer in a system went down, it was effectively impossible for COT to win the fight for the system if PanFam dropped supers.
Frankly, if the orbital was at serious risk then staff should have been looking to their own escape plans. This was not like taking a job at the foodcourt in Jita IV-4.
I know that sounds like victim blaming, but taking a job in nullsec is a bit similar to working in a Blooder orbital or a Serpentis drug lab. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
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Jev North
Hyperpredator Rest Home
474
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Posted - 2016.12.13 22:18:28 -
[36] - Quote
For reference, the Scope reports the latest estimate of the death toll is 62,455,000 people.
Das ist schmutzig, falsch und moralisch höchst verwerflich. Bin dabei.
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2660
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Posted - 2016.12.14 00:49:28 -
[37] - Quote
Now ask yourselves how many people were in each of the keepstars that have died during their start-up shield initialization timer. They needed to be staffed for that cycle. They would have already had full hangar crews. They also would have needed to be ready to initialize the combat systems as soon as that cycle ended.
Nobody cried over those deaths. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation Mercenary Coalition
971
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Posted - 2016.12.14 00:53:32 -
[38] - Quote
Don't think anyone cried over these deaths either. My issue is when that sort of loss of life is used for cheap political agendas. I won't weep for people making their own choices, but I will sneer in disgust when they're used so maliciously. |
Morgan Agrivar
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
700
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Posted - 2016.12.14 03:21:42 -
[39] - Quote
I am partly to blame since I made no effort to save those people.
But the capsuleer mindset has been and always will be: What is in it for me? |
Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Arataka Research Consortium
619
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Posted - 2016.12.14 04:26:41 -
[40] - Quote
Arrendis wrote:Now ask yourselves how many people were in each of the keepstars that have died during their start-up shield initialization timer. They needed to be staffed for that cycle. They would have already had full hangar crews. They also would have needed to be ready to initialize the combat systems as soon as that cycle ended.
Each 60 seconds in nullsec a minute passes. There were many. The question is - can you strive to be not part of the problem?
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2660
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Posted - 2016.12.14 04:54:51 -
[41] - Quote
Jaret Victorian wrote:Each 60 seconds in nullsec a minute passes. There were many. The question is - can you strive to be not part of the problem?
Can you? |
Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Arataka Research Consortium
619
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Posted - 2016.12.14 05:25:01 -
[42] - Quote
Good question. I think I can, but that's not really telling much. You should ask others.
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Follow us on GalNet!
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2660
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Posted - 2016.12.14 05:44:31 -
[43] - Quote
And how will you strive to not be an enabler of the economy of mass-slaughter? I'm not trying to be a smartass or anything, either, Jaret, I'm honestly curious: how can any pilot keep their hands clean? My role is attempting to keep people alive, but I readily admit, that the people I'm keeping alive are generally in the process of killing other people when I do it.
And that's ultimately true of every 'non-lethal' part of the capsuleer economy: it all supports the violence. I really don't think it's possible to be a part of the capsuleer economy and not be part of the problem. And I think that will remain true as long as pirate bounties, looted deadspace modules, sporting-event-wars between the empires, and all of the other bloody aspects of the capsuleer economy exist, and are primarily tuned around the idea of producing and marketing the instruments of death. |
Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Arataka Research Consortium
619
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Posted - 2016.12.14 06:15:55 -
[44] - Quote
We live in a crappy world, Arrendis, where economy, education, politics, ambitions, poverty, greed and many other factors contribute to the death toll we see each day.
The solution is to not take things to the extreme and work towards making it better for others. The privileges of being able to come back must be balanced with an equivalent willingness to make sacrifices, but that only works when you never give up fighting for what you believe in. One day we'll probably be able to extend this ability to everyone, probably losing our humanity in the process, but if we don't, conflicts won't matter one bit anymore. That is what I want to work towards to. Until that, the reality is what we have to deal with - and if you don't - don't sit on your butt and put your skills to a better use.
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Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
2989
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Posted - 2016.12.14 11:19:11 -
[45] - Quote
Pathetic.
A captain of a warship should be ready to push the trigger disregarding losses on enemy side. The war is a war, and the loss of life is expected before it starts. If you weep over those, who die under your guns - you are not suited to command a warship. Tear your implants off and step aside for someone more competent to take your place.
On the other hand, disregarding presence of human being aboard of ships and stations is a sign on CDS.
Acknowledge there are people, and respect them, giving them quick and honorable death in combat, like every soldier, including me, deserves.
Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.
In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
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Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Arataka Research Consortium
619
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Posted - 2016.12.14 13:32:57 -
[46] - Quote
One fights in a war for resources to fight in a war.
Other advocates giving everyone honorable deaths.
And I'm just here like... "Is it that hard to turn this energy into something positive?"
I don't even -»\_(pâä)_/-»
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Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation Mercenary Coalition
976
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Posted - 2016.12.14 13:49:41 -
[47] - Quote
There's nothing inherently negative about destruction. Without destruction, all you have is stagnation. You'll have festering problems instead of room for rebuilding something better. Without the bloodshed of war from one side, another side would assuredly tear you down for their own ends. Without aggression towards tyrants, they would rule New Eden.
The tricky bit is leaving enough room for creation, building, peace and safekeeping to offset it all.
While balance is mostly spoken of in spiritual matters among my kind, that principle is just as important for the rest of New Eden. Without destruction, there is no creation. Stars die for worlds to live. Without violence and bloodshed to protect it, peace exists only for the conquerors and warlords in the end.
Strike the balance, rather than living on the edges of the curve. Neither of the extremes can even see morally or ethically defensible standpoints from where they are. |
Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2662
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Posted - 2016.12.14 14:02:31 -
[48] - Quote
Jaret Victorian wrote:The solution is to not take things to the extreme and work towards making it better for others.
Isn't that already what most of us do, though? I hunt Blood Raiders for bounties and salvage in order to make sure I can keep working to save crew lives. Diana fights to keep her people from falling into what she sees as tyranny. Mizhara has worked tirelessly for her people. And on and on. We already work to turn the bloodshed to positive ends, on whatever scale we're able. Sure, you get the occassional Nauplius or Funk, but misguided wretches acting out for attention aren't exactly a capsuleer phenomenon.
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Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd. Arataka Research Consortium
619
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Posted - 2016.12.14 15:38:06 -
[49] - Quote
You try to win every single argument, Arrendis. There's no point in answering because you will go on and on until I either stop talking to you or say "Oh yes, you are right".
I'll just skip ahead and go invest my time somewhere else, if you will excuse me.
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Jason Galente
Hole Riders
1006
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Posted - 2016.12.14 18:46:42 -
[50] - Quote
Jaret Victorian wrote:Arrendis wrote:Now ask yourselves how many people were in each of the keepstars that have died during their start-up shield initialization timer. They needed to be staffed for that cycle. They would have already had full hangar crews. They also would have needed to be ready to initialize the combat systems as soon as that cycle ended.
Each 60 seconds in nullsec a minute passes.
That's highly debatable.
Only the liberty of the individual assures the prosperity of the whole.
And this foundation must be defended.
At any cost
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Arrendis
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2664
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Posted - 2016.12.14 19:52:49 -
[51] - Quote
Jaret Victorian wrote:You try to win every single argument, Arrendis. There's no point in answering because you will go on and on until I either stop talking to you or say "Oh yes, you are right".
This was an argument? I thought it was a discussion, Jaret. You know, where we both talk about things and ask one another questions? Isn't part of the idea of a discussion that we continue, you know, discussing things? If you've got a better way to try to 'work toward making it better for others', I'm all ears. In fact, I specifically asked for one, remember? |
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