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Fleshbits R'Sticky
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2016.12.17 21:50:34 -
[1] - Quote
Is there no ship above a frigate that I can get the skills to fly in less than 22 days? I looked at Prospect, then I looked at Buzzard....
Holy crap progress is slow. Then I learned I can't train 2 characters simultaneously without paying another $14.95 or buying plex with in game currency.
This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead!
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JEDIJane
Laissez Faire Industries
1
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:00:17 -
[2] - Quote
With an alpha clone i was in a destroyer in about 2-3 days, cruiser in under 2 weeks that's with tech 1 guns and tank, eve is not the game where you can get end game in a week, you will have to work at the game, master each class, understand how each one works and yes you will need to plan what your doing months down the line.
Welcome to eve |
Matthias Ancaladron
Wrath of Angels
31
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:05:38 -
[3] - Quote
Nyou cqn be in a destroyer or cruiser within hours of making a character. The career agents give a free destroyer too at mission 10 |
Kamala Sakar
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
12
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:07:53 -
[4] - Quote
I think most T1-Combat ships up to atleast Battlecruisers can be trained to a adequate level in under a month if one focus on training only the crucial skills. It should be noted that this is usually a terrible idea since the new player really should focus on training Core Skills that are useful when flying any type of ship.
I'd personally recommend starting with Engineering, Navigation and Shield skills and as a Caldari I'd imagine you need some Missile training right away unless you choose to fly their Hybrid Turret ships.
Also note that the two ships you looked at are both very specialized T2-ships that quite frankly are not a good idea to fly until you have a good understanding of the game due to the heavy ISK cost of buying both the Ships and all T2-modules (which in turn requires additional traning of skills) that should be fitted on them. |
Fleshbits R'Sticky
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:08:05 -
[5] - Quote
Well combat ships aside.... I figure you need a way to make income on top of your main character being able to do combat. It would seem the entire reason for making money is to do combat in the first place.
Yea, I appreciate that I won't get to the end game in a week, but I have ZERO control over the rate of progress. It is predetermined that my skills are going to progress at a rate that takes months and years whether I am a complete idiot or I do things more strategically. I like to be rewarded for being able to fire more brain cells then the next guy. It doesn't seem that is possible with this system, at least as far as my skills go. I am sure it makes a difference on my wallet.
If I go mining to make money then Prospect is the next step up from my Venture, no? If I go exploring to make money then Buzzard is the next step up from my Heron, no? Or are is there some other ships between that I am missing? |
Expendable Unit
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
21
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:10:35 -
[6] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:Is there no ship above a frigate that I can get the skills to fly in less than 22 days? I looked at Prospect, then I looked at Buzzard....
Holy crap progress is slow. Then I learned I can't train 2 characters simultaneously without paying another $14.95 or buying plex with in game currency.
This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead!
You know what they say, "getting old ain't for p....ies" |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
2942
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:10:57 -
[7] - Quote
You're looking at Tech 2 ships, which are advanced, specialized ships.
Destroyers will be a very fast train, and cruisers after that.
Bear in mind, however, that ships in Eve are not really a "level up" type of progression. There is no "end game", and a bigger ship doesn't render a smaller ship obsolete.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Soel Reit
Dambusters 617 Sq
319
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:17:17 -
[8] - Quote
eve is serious business. big ships are serious business. saying you don't have months and years ahead of you to planning a strat or what you want to do.... is just... not eve. just stick to frigates and destroyers then.
.... or that is what used to be....
now just check skill injectors, plex and char bazar and you are ready to undock. oh... btw... obviously it has a cost. as everything in real life.
are you ready to pay? |
Vigirr
216
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:43:55 -
[9] - Quote
T2 ships are not first or a logical progression, if you choose medium term goals it's going to take time. |
Celise Katelo
State War Academy Caldari State
195
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:51:50 -
[10] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:Well combat ships aside.... I figure you need a way to make income on top of your main character being able to do combat. It would seem the entire reason for making money is to do combat in the first place.
Yea, I appreciate that I won't get to the end game in a week, but I have ZERO control over the rate of progress. It is predetermined that my skills are going to progress at a rate that takes months and years whether I am a complete idiot or I do things more strategically. I like to be rewarded for being able to fire more brain cells then the next guy. It doesn't seem that is possible with this system, at least as far as my skills go. I am sure it makes a difference on my wallet.
If I go mining to make money then Prospect is the next step up from my Venture, no? If I go exploring to make money then Buzzard is the next step up from my Heron, no? Or are is there some other ships between that I am missing?
Asking for answers & fire off stuff like "fire more brain cells then the next guy" ...Geez , hehe
EVEBoard ...Just over 50million skill points, each skill was chosen for a reason. I closed my eyes & clicked another skill to train... "BINGO...!!!" ... "This time i got something usefull"
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Princess Adhara
University of Caille Gallente Federation
98
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:56:10 -
[11] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:I have ZERO control over the rate of progress. It is predetermined that my skills are going to progress at a rate that takes months and years whether I am a complete idiot or I do things more strategically. I like to be rewarded for being able to fire more brain cells then the next guy.
If you can really rub 2 brain cells together as you claim, you can come up with a plan to make a lot of isk in no time, buy a lot of skill injectors and get anywhere you want skill wise. |
Major Vivian Francis
KIRSTONE ALLIANCE
0
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Posted - 2016.12.17 22:58:20 -
[12] - Quote
Something about this is extremely wrong.
I'm just an alpha, and I just completed Cash Flow for Capsuleers, from a Career Agent.
I have two Merlins, that were given to me in doing Cash Flow. I also have to frigate mining ships that were also given during the training process. I haven't relied on my corp for assistance yet. They're making me do it all on my own.
I'm picking out the skills that will suit me best at this time. The training time is 1/2 Omegas, terribly slow.
I can train now for Destroyers, and in the Advanced Military training, I will get a Destroyer.
As for some of my other Alpha friends, they were in Cruisers in a few days. There was no rush, and I'm in no rush.
For Alphas, we cannot fly our race's battlecruisers, but we can get into a Gnosis. So, eventually I will get into one too for L3s.
Dude, I don't know what you are doing, but there are other ships you can fly. In Cruisers, you have: Caracal, Moa, Blackbird, and the Osprey, and the Navy versions of a couple of them. There are two destroyers, and all the frigates. What do you want to do in EVE?
So two things, either you really don't have a clue, but I will give you the benefit of a doubt, otherwise you're trolling us.
-Viv |
Miriam Beckstein
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
14
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Posted - 2016.12.17 23:06:12 -
[13] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote: If I go mining to make money then Prospect is the next step up from my Venture, no?
Retriever or the other mining barges, but I don't know how long the training time is. Maybe 2 weeks?
Quote:If I go exploring to make money then Buzzard is the next step up from my Heron, no?
Heron with a cloak is quite cost-effective.
If you are willing to fly more expensive ships, the Astero & Stratios you can get into much quicker (do really want cloaking to 4 as well, which takes a couple of days?). Whether that's a good idea or not may be a different story. First time I played, I started exploring in a Stratios as a 2 week old character. Its inevitable loss taught me plenty about the game.
Quote:I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I think the mining experience is basically the same, you just get more rocks. I know the exploring experience, at least if sticking to hacking sites, is the same. The two things that make significant changes are getting to use a cloak, and then getting to use a covops cloak.
As others have said, all the things you've named are tech2, frigate sized ships. Bigger T1 ships are much quicker to get into than any t2 ship, can easily fly a cheapish cruiser with level 3 skills after a week. |
Yang Aurilen
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1358
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Posted - 2016.12.17 23:12:07 -
[14] - Quote
Miriam Beckstein wrote:Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote: If I go mining to make money then Prospect is the next step up from my Venture, no?
Retriever or the other mining barges, but I don't know how long the training time is. Maybe 2 weeks? Quote:If I go exploring to make money then Buzzard is the next step up from my Heron, no? Heron with a cloak is quite cost-effective. If you are willing to fly more expensive ships, the Astero & Stratios you can get into much quicker (do really want cloaking to 4 as well, which takes a couple of days?). Whether that's a good idea or not may be a different story. First time I played, I started exploring in a Stratios as a 2 week old character. Its inevitable loss taught me plenty about the game. Quote:I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships. I think the mining experience is basically the same, you just get more rocks. I know the exploring experience, at least if sticking to hacking sites, is the same. The two things that make significant changes are getting to use a cloak, and then getting to use a covops cloak. As others have said, all the things you've named are tech2, frigate sized ships. Bigger T1 ships are much quicker to get into than any t2 ship, can easily fly a cheapish cruiser with level 3 skills after a week.
Alphas can't fly the astero/stratios due to dual faction frig/cruiser requirements (Gallente Frig and Amarr Frig/Cruiser).
Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
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Chopper Rollins
Far Beyond Triggered
1706
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Posted - 2016.12.17 23:37:37 -
[15] - Quote
I remember looking at the skill requirements for a wolf and thinking it was forever away. So i went to lowsec in my Thrasher and tried to kill the biggest rats i could. Got distracted after hitting 'approach' and noticed that within 1000 meters he couldn't hit me. Started roaming lowsec looking for battleship rats to orbit at 500 and chew to death. Got instagibbed on an undock by a thrasher with T2 guns, look at requirements for them, oh ho! not that far away! After a few weeks, worked out who were the local muscle, who to avoid. Listened in Help channel, learned about grouped weapons, correct damage types, transversal, sig bloom.
That's why i love this game, you don't burn through it in a few hundred hours, the other players are as significant as any other environmental factor.
Try to enjoy the bit where you are limited, where it's easy to push at the limits. A good pilot can do hisec combat anomalies in a t2 fitted rookie ship.
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
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Miriam Beckstein
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
14
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Posted - 2016.12.17 23:43:08 -
[16] - Quote
Yang Aurilen wrote:Alphas can't fly the astero/stratios due to dual faction frig/cruiser requirements (Gallente Frig and Amarr Frig/Cruiser).
I know. They also can't use cloaks, nor fly the prospect & buzzard that the OP talks about. Which is why I assume he's not an alpha, and get straight into an SOE explorer to make expensive explosions in his first month of play.
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Fleshbits L'Splatter
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2016.12.18 00:02:07 -
[17] - Quote
Major Vivian Francis wrote:Something about this is extremely wrong.
I'm just an alpha, and I just completed Cash Flow for Capsuleers, from a Career Agent.
I have two Merlins, that were given to me in doing Cash Flow. I also have to frigate mining ships that were also given during the training process. I haven't relied on my corp for assistance yet. They're making me do it all on my own.
I'm picking out the skills that will suit me best at this time. The training time is 1/2 Omegas, terribly slow.
I can train now for Destroyers, and in the Advanced Military training, I will get a Destroyer.
As for some of my other Alpha friends, they were in Cruisers in a few days. There was no rush, and I'm in no rush.
For Alphas, we cannot fly our race's battlecruisers, but we can get into a Gnosis. So, eventually I will get into one too for L3s.
Dude, I don't know what you are doing, but there are other ships you can fly. In Cruisers, you have: Caracal, Moa, Blackbird, and the Osprey, and the Navy versions of a couple of them. There are two destroyers, and all the frigates. What do you want to do in EVE?
So two things, either you really don't have a clue, but I will give you the benefit of a doubt, otherwise you're trolling us.
-Viv
You might want to read the bit I put in reply that said, "Non-Combat ships" Spend time reading the thread before replying to one post.
I'll go edit it for the original post. EDIT: Nm it looks like the edit option goes away after some time, on this forum. |
Spawn06
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.12.18 00:07:40 -
[18] - Quote
Wait till you have to train half a year for one skill to lvl 5 (I totally made these figures up), but by then you should have 100mill+ skill points so meh. That is the hook that is EvE, you do not want to leave because you invest so much time. |
Dyllan Ybrex
Sanguis Inceptum
14
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Posted - 2016.12.18 00:17:41 -
[19] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:I have ZERO control over the rate of progress
You have just as much control as the rest of us do.
> "I find it hard to believe that the notoriously incompetent DED investigators managed to solve this 'mystery' in such a short time" ~ Omir Sarikusa
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March rabbit
Mosquito squadron The-Culture
1995
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Posted - 2016.12.18 00:23:11 -
[20] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead! I can be wrong here but i thought that the minimum lifespan today is like 65 years for men? In any case until you have something special you have like 20 years to plan ahead!
The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Escalating Entropy
11158
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Posted - 2016.12.18 00:49:25 -
[21] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships. Yes and no.
You will find that even multi-year veterans will use Tech 1 Frigates because they are either...
- "cost effective" (Tech 2, Tech 3, and Faction ships are an order of magnitude more expensive and effectively have no insurable value) - they are good at what they do (just because something is more expensive and/or a higher tech level, it does not necessarily mean it is a straight upgrade... some specialist ships give up certain traits or stats for higher stats in other areas).
Moreover, just because you can't fly that "sexy" ship right away, it does not mean you can't perform a certain task. More often than not, a simple adaptation to your tactics can make you just as safe and/or effective.
For example: A Venture may not be able to use a cloaking device (well, it can, but it would not be as effective as a Covert-Ops cloak), but you can fit it for extra mobility and be extra vigilant. That vigilance can often save you if you can react quickly enough.
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead! Here's the thing; you are not supposed to be able to train every skill in a short amount of time.
And you do not need to have "max skills" before you try anything.
Why? Because skills generally only grant you a 5% bonus here, 10% bonus there for each level (exceptions apply). And the bulk of a skills training time is from level 4 to level 5.
What this means for you is... If you train all the skills you need to perform a task to level 4, you will be fly at about 80 to 90% of the effectiveness of a person with those same skills maxed out... in only 20 to 25% of the time.
And this is before you take tactics, knowledge, and ship fits into account... which can count for a lot and help any player regardless of what skills they have (or don't have).
I should also add that someone did some napkin math awhile back and found that it would take 20-something years to max out every skill in the game. Hell... I have been playing since 2009 and I have yet to max out every ship and combat related skill.
Why is the system this way? To encourage you to work with people who have those skills.
For example: You may have the skills and aptitude for mining. Another person may have the skills and desire to be a good hauler.
You are both in the ass end of nowhere, you both know there are hostiles hiding behind every corner, and you both find an asteroid that is worth a lot of money.
You can't haul all of that rock back to a trade hub because you do not have all the skills you need to fly a hauler. The other guy can't mine that quickly/efficiently because he does not have the necessary skills or equipment to do so. So a deal is now struck; you mine, he hauls.
Granted, this is an oversimplified situation... but it should convey the gist of the system. Not everyone can do everything effectively by themselves.
Another thing is consider is that larger, more expensive ships generally require more experience (in addition to skillpoints) to fly. Otherwise they become nothing more than expensive lessons in "what not to do."
So the skill system, in a sense, is forcing you to take your time and experiment with the ships and equipment you currently have. It is better to learn your lessons now in cheaper stuff that can be replaced with a few, quick level 2 missions than with stuff you spent a month or so grinding for.
How did you Veterans start?
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Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
604
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Posted - 2016.12.18 04:17:47 -
[22] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:end game
my sweet summer child....
Just Add Water
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Alea
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
237
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Posted - 2016.12.18 04:55:33 -
[23] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:Is there no ship above a frigate that I can get the skills to fly in less than 22 days? I looked at Prospect, then I looked at Buzzard....
Holy crap progress is slow. Then I learned I can't train 2 characters simultaneously without paying another $14.95 or buying plex with in game currency.
This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead!
I'm gonna burn in hell for saying this but if you want to bypass what most all of us long timers had to do just buy Skill injectors..
Before pay to win was introduced EVERYBODY paid with their time to be able to fly nice things, now any dort can throw money at the game and fly what they want to fly, it's sad really but that's progress I guess.
Whomever is making the last couple years decisions on what changes are to be implemented in this game, must hate Eve with all their being.
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Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
604
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Posted - 2016.12.18 05:15:30 -
[24] - Quote
teach me how to win in EvE, lol.
Just Add Water
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Pix Severus
Empty You
5356
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Posted - 2016.12.18 05:53:41 -
[25] - Quote
EVE isn't WoW, there is no direct progression, there is no end-game.
Players have had a significant impact on the game, and made a name for themselves, using T1 ships and low skills. You should be looking at how to make your mark on EVE, or carve-out your own little slice of heaven in this game, by means other than following what you believe to be the closest WoW-like progression the game has to offer.
You can be more than that, better than that.
Age is no barrier. Become what you want to become, until your dying breath, you owe yourself no less.
MTU Hunter: Latest Entry - Dec 11 2016 - Return of an MTU Hunter
MTU Hunting 101: Comprehensive Guide
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Shayla Etherodyne
Delta Laroth Industries Voxis Accord
113
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Posted - 2016.12.18 09:11:09 -
[26] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:
Yea, I appreciate that I won't get to the end game in a week, but I have ZERO control over the rate of progress. It is predetermined that my skills are going to progress at a rate that takes months and years whether I am a complete idiot or I do things more strategically. I like to be rewarded for being able to fire more brain cells then the next guy. It doesn't seem that is possible with this system, at least as far as my skills go. I am sure it makes a difference on my wallet.
You can vary that speed: - remap your characteristics so that they are best suited for the skill you are training; - train cybernetics and buy implants to speed up training, if you live in high sec you can buy 5 implants and put them in your clone, that give a good boost to training speed; - buy skill injectors and inject your clone with skill points. That has decreasing returns, so it is better to do it early on.
Method 2 and 3 cost isk, so yes, your wallet matter.
For method 1 download EVEMoon (there is a safe link in the resources), prepare a training program and see what is the fastest way to get there.
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Shayla Etherodyne
Delta Laroth Industries Voxis Accord
113
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Posted - 2016.12.18 09:46:09 -
[27] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead! I can be wrong here but i thought that the minimum lifespan today is like 65 years for men? In any case until you have something special you have like 20 years to plan ahead!
I have started playing at the age of 47, the friend that signaled the game to me has 39 or 40 years old. After ten years and a hiatus of a couple of years we both are playing again. Plenty of people that I know in game has my ageand has started relatively recently. So starting at 40 is nothing special.
The healthy life expectancy in western Europe is at 70 or above, in the USA 69.1.
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Drago Shouna
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
679
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Posted - 2016.12.18 09:57:03 -
[28] - Quote
Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:Is there no ship above a frigate that I can get the skills to fly in less than 22 days? I looked at Prospect, then I looked at Buzzard....
Holy crap progress is slow. Then I learned I can't train 2 characters simultaneously without paying another $14.95 or buying plex with in game currency.
This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead!
40, lol.
I started at 53, welcome to EvE...pup.
Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..."
" They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."
Welcome to EVE.
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Cutter Isaacson
wiggle Tech. Pandamimic Legion
3162
|
Posted - 2016.12.18 10:45:45 -
[29] - Quote
Soel Reit wrote:eve is serious business. big ships are serious business. saying you don't have months and years ahead of you to planning a strat or what you want to do.... is just... not eve. just stick to frigates and destroyers then. .... or that is what used to be.... now just check skill injectors, plex and char bazar and you are ready to undock. oh... btw... obviously it has a cost. as everything in real life. are you ready to pay?
That's incredibly disingenuous. You've been able to buy ready made characters for years.
"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
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Cutter Isaacson
wiggle Tech. Pandamimic Legion
3162
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Posted - 2016.12.18 10:48:22 -
[30] - Quote
Alea wrote:Fleshbits R'Sticky wrote:Is there no ship above a frigate that I can get the skills to fly in less than 22 days? I looked at Prospect, then I looked at Buzzard....
Holy crap progress is slow. Then I learned I can't train 2 characters simultaneously without paying another $14.95 or buying plex with in game currency.
This kind of sucks as a noob, when you'd like to try some things and see what you want to get into. Sure, you can start doing them with a frigate, but I am sure that the mining or exploring experience is vastly different with better ships.
I'm 40 years old, I don't have that much life left to be making plans for months and years ahead!
I'm gonna burn in hell for saying this but if you want to bypass what most all of us long timers had to do just buy Skill injectors.. Before pay to win was introduced EVERYBODY paid with their time to be able to fly nice things, now any dort can throw money at the game and fly what they want to fly, it's sad really but that's progress I guess.
Two words for you:
Character. Bazaar.
You've been able to throw money at the screen for literally years. So many disingenuous comments on here today. Oh, and it's still not pay to win, since someone actually needs to train up those skills in the first place, whether you buy a whole character, or just skill injectors.
"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
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